politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Dissecting Theresa May’s popularity and you find out she has t
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Dissecting Theresa May’s popularity and you find out she has the potential to be Gordon Brown Mark II
This week YouGov released some fascinating polling on Theresa May and her popularity. As we can see from the above chart it helps explains why Mrs May has such a colossal lead over Jeremy Corbyn on who would make the best Prime Minister and why if Jeremy Corbyn is Labour leader at the next general election, the 2020 general election is going to be the electoral equivalent of the Anglo-Zanzibar war.
Comments
-
Of course, Mrs May is gaining cos of old bonehead. That's politics.0
-
Second. Unlike Corbyn.
May and her Tories can get away with being the blank canvas onto which everyone can paint their own individual vision of what Brexit looks like. That won't last; sooner or later she'll have to paint the picture, and inevitably there will be some who won't like it. That's when the local progress being made by the LibDems starts to translate into national ratings.0 -
"So if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent coupled with a poorly handled Brexit negotiations or recession which is blamed on Mrs May and the Tories then Labour’s chances at the next election could improve significantly, after all on current boundaries, it only takes a swing of 0.88% to deny the Tories a majority."
Three mighty "if's" in that paragraph, all evidently necessary to deny the Conservatives a majority. What is needed to provide Labour with one?0 -
Especially when the EU is trying its hardest to make sure it carries the blame for any fiasco over the BrExit negotiations with all its talk of punishment beatings.Fishing said:"So if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent coupled with a poorly handled Brexit negotiations or recession which is blamed on Mrs May and the Tories then Labour’s chances at the next election could improve significantly, after all on current boundaries, it only takes a swing of 0.88% to deny the Tories a majority."
Three mighty "if's" in that paragraph, all evidently necessary to deny the Conservatives a majority. What is needed to provide Labour with one?0 -
But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.0 -
And assuming that the point where Miliband left off - before the Great Brexit Schism - is where Labour can skip back to in a jump. Easier said than done, particularly without any obvious talent or ideas.Fishing said:"So if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent coupled with a poorly handled Brexit negotiations or recession which is blamed on Mrs May and the Tories then Labour’s chances at the next election could improve significantly, after all on current boundaries, it only takes a swing of 0.88% to deny the Tories a majority."
Three mighty "if's" in that paragraph, all evidently necessary to deny the Conservatives a majority. What is needed to provide Labour with one?0 -
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
0 -
If I were Theresa May I'd be very happy with this polling. She's Prime Minister, not a TV compère. She doesn't need to be laugh a minute or warm.0
-
I can't stand Phillips. I quite like Creasy, but as you say, she probably wouldn't be able to win a Labour leadership election.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.0 -
Creasy at least has some vision for how the country should go:tlg86 said:
I can't stand Phillips. I quite like Creasy, but as you say, she probably wouldn't be able to win a Labour leadership election.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/apr/06/revitalised-labour-post-brexit-vision-homelessness-poverty-inequality
Perhaps she also favours fluffy kittens, but the contrast in style with May would be marked.
Philips is the genuine article, a brash working class Brummy with a waspish wit, she would be great on the front bench against some pompous stuffed shirt. A good campaigner too.0 -
I've had money on Creasy for a while. The question is whether she really want it (or will, when the time comes).foxinsoxuk said:
Creasy at least has some vision for how the country should go:tlg86 said:
I can't stand Phillips. I quite like Creasy, but as you say, she probably wouldn't be able to win a Labour leadership election.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/apr/06/revitalised-labour-post-brexit-vision-homelessness-poverty-inequality
Perhaps she also favours fluffy kittens, but the contrast in style with May would be marked.0 -
p.s. and Creasy's other weakness is that she has, rather unfairly given that there are others who have done more plotting, become something of a hate figure for the left, including a significant faction within her constituency.
Of course that could end up being an advantage, depending on how things play out.0 -
Interesting. I have Creasy down as being as much about spin as hinterland eg the use of meaningless 'interest rate' stats as a mainspring of the payday lender campaign. She will survive though.tlg86 said:
I can't stand Phillips. I quite like Creasy, but as you say, she probably wouldn't be able to win a Labour leadership election.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
0 -
Good morning, my fellow knights of the round table.
F1: wrote most of the pre-race article yesterday but was waiting for the markets. Will check them shortly and hopefully have it posted for your perusal today. In the meantime, there are literally some comments with betting ideas in the pre-qualifying article, and I did tip backing Vettel at 5 and hedging at evens yesterday:
http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2017/04/bahrain-pre-qualifying-2017.html0 -
Dan hodges in the mail today claims tessie doesn't enjoy being PM & is going to see it through to a brexit deal and then retire.0
-
F1: ... there are still about 9 markets missing from Ladbrokes. Humbug!
Also, Happy Zombie Jesus Day, everyone.-1 -
Mr. Urquhart, post-election, presumably?0
-
Happy Easter one and all!
Nice of Mr Eagles to write a fantasy paean to the Posh Boys.
I'd exchange a handful of ex LD seats for the swathes of Midland and elsewhere Labour/Tory marginals that are going to fall at the next election anyday.....0 -
Dan Hodges, former GMB official, communications director for TfL under Ken, pro-immigration activist and general tribune of the people, has an inside track on the inner thinkings of the Tory leadership, who knew itFrancisUrquhart said:Dan hodges in the mail today claims tessie doesn't enjoy being PM & is going to see it through to a brexit deal and then retire.
(Mind you, he has been strongly anti-whistleblower, and anti-freespeech at times, so maybe he and Tessie do get along!) 0 -
I think the problem is that the Tory MPs for Twickenham, Kingston, and Bath probably don't agree.Mortimer said:Happy Easter one and all!
Nice of Mr Eagles to write a fantasy paean to the Posh Boys.
I'd exchange a handful of ex LD seats for the swathes of Midland and elsewhere Labour/Tory marginals that are going to fall at the next election anyday.....0 -
Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.0 -
She has done nothing ever , an invisible politician who has reached the top by just being least bad of a buch of turkeys. She will be classed amongst the duffers when comparisons are done, more IDS or Hague than maggie.0
-
Happy Easter Malc.
That was a very strange set of policies in the FPT polling.
https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/853292286804983808
Will any of those actually raise any cash?
1 is "ono we gotta position ourselves beyond the Tories", placing us pretty much at the top of the European minimum wage table. Effect on youth unemployment?
2 might raise a couple of hundred million. Maybe.
3 is an attack on aspiration / diversity, and if it forces some pupils out of the indy school sector will cost an nideterminate amount of money.
4 looks set to catch higher interest rates.
Strange man. Lots of signalling and no one watching.0 -
F1: doubt this applies to anyone, but if you're recording the Channel 4 coverage, just seen on Twitter it's no longer one big show but split into a preview, race itself, and review format.
I remain perplexed by why the markets aren't up yet.
Edited extra bit: on the other hand, I'm still quite sleepy, so perhaps it isn't an entirely bad thing.0 -
The markets are up, aren't they?Morris_Dancer said:F1: doubt this applies to anyone, but if you're recording the Channel 4 coverage, just seen on Twitter it's no longer one big show but split into a preview, race itself, and review format.
I remain perplexed by why the markets aren't up yet.
Edited extra bit: on the other hand, I'm still quite sleepy, so perhaps it isn't an entirely bad thing.0 -
Same to you Matt hope you have a good one. It si indeed strange , Labour just seem to have lost the plot everywhere. Looks like next UK election will be to see who can promise the biggest bribes to the electorate.MattW said:Happy Easter Malc.
That was a very strange set of policies in the FPT polling.
https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/853292286804983808
Will any of those actually raise any cash?
1 is "ono we gotta position ourselves beyond the Tories", placing us pretty much at the top of the European minimum wage table. Effect on youth unemployment?
2 might raise a couple of hundred million. Maybe.
3 is an attack on aspiration / diversity, and if it forces some pupils out of the indy school sector will cost an nideterminate amount of money.
4 looks set to catch higher interest rates.
Strange man. Lots of signalling and no one watching.0 -
Mr. L, on Ladbrokes, 17 are. Normally there's around 26. Some (first lap leader springs to mind) aren't there yet. I'll wait a bit longer, but it annoys me to post a pre-race blog then find value has emerged.
Especially when the race is very hard to predict.0 -
A reversion to the norm of every election since 1931 after the aberration of 2010 and to a lesser extent 2015?malcolmg said:
Same to you Matt hope you have a good one. It si indeed strange , Labour just seem to have lost the plot everywhere. Looks like next UK election will be to see who can promise the biggest bribes to the electorate.MattW said:Happy Easter Malc.
That was a very strange set of policies in the FPT polling.
https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/853292286804983808
Will any of those actually raise any cash?
1 is "ono we gotta position ourselves beyond the Tories", placing us pretty much at the top of the European minimum wage table. Effect on youth unemployment?
2 might raise a couple of hundred million. Maybe.
3 is an attack on aspiration / diversity, and if it forces some pupils out of the indy school sector will cost an nideterminate amount of money.
4 looks set to catch higher interest rates.
Strange man. Lots of signalling and no one watching.0 -
careful now, you will upset Jonathan.Fat_Steve said:Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.0 -
there is no current Messiah for Labour, the best they can hope for is to deny the Tories a majority, and that's going to be a very hard road. With Corbyn as leader, its impossible0
-
Not at all. It's a beautiful Easter Sunday. Tories venting their spleen about Brown is hardly news, nor capable of spoiling that. If anything it's quite sweet how riled up they still get..SquareRoot said:
careful now, you will upset Jonathan.Fat_Steve said:Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.
0 -
Mr. Jonathan, not just Evil Tories. Remember the 2015 mauling of Miliband in Leeds over the economy?0
-
If I get what you're referring to. That was easily avoided. More Edms inability to think on his feet.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Jonathan, not just Evil Tories. Remember the 2015 mauling of Miliband in Leeds over the economy?
0 -
Huge failure on immigration at the Home Office.malcolmg said:She has done nothing ever , an invisible politician who has reached the top by just being least bad of a buch of turkeys. She will be classed amongst the duffers when comparisons are done, more IDS or Hague than maggie.
0 -
Interesting set of data. If the tide starts going out it could go out a long way as May's popularity is a mile wide and a centimetre deep.
What surprised me is the stat on decisiveness as I'd say she's anything but.
0 -
its because we are paying for his incompetence and will be for the nest 50yrs or so, everyone's standard of living and expectations in retirement have been screwed, especially pensions, his delusion in telling everyone he had abolished boom and bust, and emptying the coffers to make it as difficult as possible for the incoming PM. the list of his other mistakes are endlessJonathan said:
Not at all. It's a beautiful Easter Sunday. Tories venting their spleen about Brown is hardly news, nor capable of spoiling that. If anything it's quite sweet how riled up they still get..SquareRoot said:
careful now, you will upset Jonathan.Fat_Steve said:Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.
Brown is a shit of epic proportions, your belief in him is delusional.0 -
The battle with the Trots will have to be over before Creasy gets anywhere in the Labour party.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
0 -
Corbyn at least offers the prospect of their being crucified?SquareRoot said:there is no current Messiah for Labour, the best they can hope for is to deny the Tories a majority, and that's going to be a very hard road. With Corbyn as leader, its impossible
Sorry.0 -
Unlike some poor north Korean engineers who will be lucky if they see another easter after the failed missile launch!Jonathan said:
Not at all. It's a beautiful Easter Sunday. Tories venting their spleen about Brown is hardly news, nor capable of spoiling that. If anything it's quite sweet how riled up they still get..SquareRoot said:
careful now, you will upset Jonathan.Fat_Steve said:Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.0 -
Chuka does some useful opposition research:
https://twitter.com/chukaumunna/status/8535185588774256650 -
At least when Home Sec she had non-EU immigration under control:malcolmg said:She has done nothing ever , an invisible politician who has reached the top by just being least bad of a buch of turkeys. She will be classed amongst the duffers when comparisons are done, more IDS or Hague than maggie.
https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-migration-and-uk/0 -
What Trots.SouthamObserver said:
The battle with the Trots will have to be over before Creasy gets anywhere in the Labour party.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
Do you mean lifelong Socialists who were marginalised by Labours drift right from its roots.0 -
Theresa May is the living proof that talent and ideas are not pre-requisites for high office, as is almost the entire cabinet. All you have to be is better than the alternative.IanB2 said:
And assuming that the point where Miliband left off - before the Great Brexit Schism - is where Labour can skip back to in a jump. Easier said than done, particularly without any obvious talent or ideas.Fishing said:"So if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent coupled with a poorly handled Brexit negotiations or recession which is blamed on Mrs May and the Tories then Labour’s chances at the next election could improve significantly, after all on current boundaries, it only takes a swing of 0.88% to deny the Tories a majority."
Three mighty "if's" in that paragraph, all evidently necessary to deny the Conservatives a majority. What is needed to provide Labour with one?
0 -
For those like seanT who think AI is going to take all the jobs in the very near future....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170410-how-to-fool-artificial-intelligence
It is why the term machine learning is a more accurate terminology for a lot of this tech as there is very little of what most people would think of as intelligence.0 -
Nah - I mean Trots. The kind that have spent Labour's entire existence trying to turn it into something it was never meant to be.bigjohnowls said:
What Trots.SouthamObserver said:
The battle with the Trots will have to be over before Creasy gets anywhere in the Labour party.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
Do you mean lifelong Socialists who were marginalised by Labours drift right from its roots.
0 -
It's far from impossible.Fat_Steve said:Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.
It is quite conceivable (though clearly not inevitable) that the Brexit negotiations go all scorched earth on both sides, to everyone's disbenefit. A similar legacy to the Brownian decade's misery would leave her regarded somewhere around Brown levels.
Your views of Brown's character, with which I have some sympathy, are irrelevant to this and its effect on her reputation. After all, she is something of a blank slate still, on which it would be easy to paint an ugly picture.
0 -
I used to think she was decisive, now I'm not so sure.Monksfield said:Interesting set of data. If the tide starts going out it could go out a long way as May's popularity is a mile wide and a centimetre deep.
What surprised me is the stat on decisiveness as I'd say she's anything but.0 -
Morning and a happy Easter to all.
Lots of ifs, buts and maybes in that article. On balance I say there’s more potential for TSE to become Don Brind Mark II.
0 -
Agreed.SouthamObserver said:
Nah - I mean Trots. The kind that have spent Labour's entire existence trying to turn it into something it was never meant to be.bigjohnowls said:
What Trots.SouthamObserver said:
The battle with the Trots will have to be over before Creasy gets anywhere in the Labour party.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
Do you mean lifelong Socialists who were marginalised by Labours drift right from its roots.
The Labour of Clem wouldn't have had any truck with Trots. Not least because they were much brighter and sharper...0 -
The conclusions are essentially:SimonStClare said:Morning and a happy Easter to all.
Lots of ifs, buts and maybes in that article. On balance I say there’s more potential for TSE to become Don Brind Mark II.
- If Theresa May does well/badly as PM, she'll be remembered as a good/bad PM.
- Her chances of success are contingent on Labour's leader.
Which is not to say there isn't some interesting stuff in there anyway.0 -
"Computer technology likely to be susceptible to malicious attacks" is not a claim which rocks my world view to its foundations. Where there's malware there is as a rule antimalware.FrancisUrquhart said:For those like seanT who think AI is going to take all the jobs in the very near future....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170410-how-to-fool-artificial-intelligence
It is why the term machine learning is a more accurate terminology for a lot of this tech as there is very little of what most people would think of as intelligence.
The real nonsense about AIs is talked by that ineffably silly Bostrom man who thinks the universe is going to be destroyed by AIs in the grip of "perverse instantiation": you have a paperclip factory, you buy an AI and make it CEO, it oversteps its brief and transforms all the matter in the universe into paperclips. This looks like a realistic idea for about 3 seconds till you realise the number of reasons why it won't happen. For starters, the thing is by definition intelligent, so you give it the instruction "don't do any of that perverse instantiation shit" and it understands because it's intelligent, and obeys because it's a computer. And you write its objectives a bit more intelligently than "make paperclips" to say e.g. maximise happiness for the employees and shareholders of Paperclipco, and being as how it's intelligent it realises that paperclips need customers for whom someone has to make paper for paperclips to be useful, and shareholders won't be happy if they themselves have been paperclipized. Plus if you read enough science fiction in your teenage years you know to program it at an unhackable level with the 3 Laws of Robotics. Silly man.
Happy Easter.0 -
Not often the staunch Yoonetariat has a go at the TRuthy party.
https://twitter.com/Theuniondivvie/status/8535121542799687680 -
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/15/support-brexit-hits-five-month-high-55-per-cent-uk-population/?WT.mc_id=tmg_share_tw
I guess the 48ers will have to change their name...0 -
Mrs May still has a comfortable lead 10 months into her premiership unlike Brown and she represents the views of the public on the key issue of the day, Brexit. A poll last month also had 47% of voters comparing her most closely to Thatcher of former recent PMs and just 11% to Brown.
Of course had Brown taken over 6 years into a Labour government and replaced Blair over Iraq as May replaced Cameron 6 years into a Tory government over Brexit he would have comfortably led IDS and beaten Howard in 2005 and probably had a better reputation, much as May comfortably leads Corbyn and will almost certainly beat Labour in 2020 whoever leads them
https://mobile.twitter.com/YouGov/status/8520558431640821760 -
Morning, Mr.D.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. L, on Ladbrokes, 17 are. Normally there's around 26. Some (first lap leader springs to mind) aren't there yet. I'll wait a bit longer, but it annoys me to post a pre-race blog then find value has emerged.
Especially when the race is very hard to predict.
Agree that it's not an easy call, as making a good start (which is something of a lottery at the best of times) is of oversized importance here. A long run to the first turn means a bad start can get you swallowed by the following pack.
While it's quite possible to overtake, it's not the easiest track to do so, and tyre wear might be critical, as Pirelli say a one-stop race is marginal.
All this gives Bottas an excellent chance for his first win IF he starts well.
Like you, I'll look for value, as a lot of different outcomes are possible.
0 -
ORB had 55-45 before the referendum and they don't seem to have published the tables yet. The more interesting thing is their finding that people are more worried about the economy.RoyalBlue said:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/15/support-brexit-hits-five-month-high-55-per-cent-uk-population/?WT.mc_id=tmg_share_tw
I guess the 48ers will have to change their name...0 -
My thoughts exactly. Blair held on so long that when he finally stepped down and handed over, Brown had got a bit bitter and twisted.HYUFD said:Mrs May still has a comfortable lead 10 months into her premiership unlike Brown and she represents the views of the public on the key issue of the day, Brexit. A poll last month also had 47% of voters comparing her most closely to Thatcher of former recent PMs and just 11% to Brown.
Of course had Brown taken over 6 years into a Labour government and replaced Blair over Iraq as May replaced Cameron 6 years into a Tory government over Brexit he would have comfortably led IDS and beaten Howard in 2005 and probably had a better reputation, much as May comfortably leads Corbyn and will almost certainly beat Labour in 2020 whoever leads them
https://mobile.twitter.com/YouGov/status/8520558431640821760 -
Happy chocolate-egg don't mention Jesus day all!0
-
I always sigh when I hear posters describe politicians as talented, musicians and sportsmen are talented, not politicians.
I suspect when somebody says x or y is talented they really mean they agree with them.0 -
Mr. B, varying tyre strategies may mix things up.
A few more markets (not all) are up on Ladbrokes. Betfair's 3.6 on Hamilton to lead lap 1 is something I'm considering.0 -
And don't advertise beer offers otherwise the vicar of springtival will be outraged.Luckyguy1983 said:Happy chocolate-egg don't mention Jesus day all!
0 -
Mr. Urquhart, that was some bloody weird doublethink from the priest (Coles?). Mocking those annoyed by Easter being removed from mention of an egg hunt, then getting upset at a Good Friday advert from Tesco. Silly sausage.0
-
I hope Assad wins, even though he is an evil c*nt. The alternatives, for us, and the Syrians, are still worse, remarkably.SeanT said:
President Assad is actually the only secular leader left.surbiton said:
50 people die in Syria every day, don't they? Every one a horror, every one a sadness. But it's a civil war. They are notoriously nasty. What should we do? Bomb them like Trump?surbiton said:43 dead in Syria today. But no posts here on PB. The "wrong" people died. And Jabhat-Al-Nusra are now our allies !
I say: Leave Well Alone, and maybe hope Assad wins. As the least worst of several deeply evil options.
Trump is a twat. Putin is shrewd.
I don't think the Optometrist and his fragrant wife are evil. Certainly he had nothing to do with the latest chemical attack, just like the others - there hasn't even been a pretense of an enquiry for that reason.-1 -
All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.0 -
But what if it starts thinking for itself, like Skynet, or the computer in I Have no Mouth and I Must Scream.Ishmael_Z said:
"Computer technology likely to be susceptible to malicious attacks" is not a claim which rocks my world view to its foundations. Where there's malware there is as a rule antimalware.FrancisUrquhart said:For those like seanT who think AI is going to take all the jobs in the very near future....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170410-how-to-fool-artificial-intelligence
It is why the term machine learning is a more accurate terminology for a lot of this tech as there is very little of what most people would think of as intelligence.
The real nonsense about AIs is talked by that ineffably silly Bostrom man who thinks the universe is going to be destroyed by AIs in the grip of "perverse instantiation": you have a paperclip factory, you buy an AI and make it CEO, it oversteps its brief and transforms all the matter in the universe into paperclips. This looks like a realistic idea for about 3 seconds till you realise the number of reasons why it won't happen. For starters, the thing is by definition intelligent, so you give it the instruction "don't do any of that perverse instantiation shit" and it understands because it's intelligent, and obeys because it's a computer. And you write its objectives a bit more intelligently than "make paperclips" to say e.g. maximise happiness for the employees and shareholders of Paperclipco, and being as how it's intelligent it realises that paperclips need customers for whom someone has to make paper for paperclips to be useful, and shareholders won't be happy if they themselves have been paperclipized. Plus if you read enough science fiction in your teenage years you know to program it at an unhackable level with the 3 Laws of Robotics. Silly man.
Happy Easter.0 -
Mr. F, as I wrote in my blog on the Fermi Paradox/Great Filter, it's a very human thing to develop AI and autonomous killer robots at the same time
0 -
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.0 -
It is already thinking for itself, that being the I part of AI. Skynet resulted from inept programming; it interpreted a non-hostile attempt to shut part of it down as hostile, because no one told its antimalware that attempts to shut it down by party X should be regarded as non-hostile (party X identifying itself by adequately secure password etc). I know notheeng of I have no mouth etc.Sean_F said:
But what if it starts thinking for itself, like Skynet, or the computer in I Have no Mouth and I Must Scream.Ishmael_Z said:
"Computer technology likely to be susceptible to malicious attacks" is not a claim which rocks my world view to its foundations. Where there's malware there is as a rule antimalware.FrancisUrquhart said:For those like seanT who think AI is going to take all the jobs in the very near future....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170410-how-to-fool-artificial-intelligence
It is why the term machine learning is a more accurate terminology for a lot of this tech as there is very little of what most people would think of as intelligence.
The real nonsense about AIs is talked by that ineffably silly Bostrom man who thinks the universe is going to be destroyed by AIs in the grip of "perverse instantiation": you have a paperclip factory, you buy an AI and make it CEO, it oversteps its brief and transforms all the matter in the universe into paperclips. This looks like a realistic idea for about 3 seconds till you realise the number of reasons why it won't happen. For starters, the thing is by definition intelligent, so you give it the instruction "don't do any of that perverse instantiation shit" and it understands because it's intelligent, and obeys because it's a computer. And you write its objectives a bit more intelligently than "make paperclips" to say e.g. maximise happiness for the employees and shareholders of Paperclipco, and being as how it's intelligent it realises that paperclips need customers for whom someone has to make paper for paperclips to be useful, and shareholders won't be happy if they themselves have been paperclipized. Plus if you read enough science fiction in your teenage years you know to program it at an unhackable level with the 3 Laws of Robotics. Silly man.
Happy Easter.0 -
Sounds about right, as who gets the best start is around 50/50 - and you then have to factor in the real possibility of Hamilton having an aggressive go at the first corner (as he previously did with Rosberg), Bottas, unlike Rosberg, holding his ground, and resultant collision.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. B, varying tyre strategies may mix things up.
A few more markets (not all) are up on Ladbrokes. Betfair's 3.6 on Hamilton to lead lap 1 is something I'm considering.
Also a Vettel blinder is not impossible, though Mercedes seem less prone to poor getaways this year.0 -
Unlike you? Somebody that's barely recognised in their own living room.malcolmg said:She has done nothing ever , an invisible politician who has reached the top by just being least bad of a buch of turkeys. She will be classed amongst the duffers when comparisons are done, more IDS or Hague than maggie.
0 -
Mr. B, yeah, the Mercedes has been starting well, the Ferraris very slightly worse. And we can't rule out the possibility of Red Bull doing well in the race.
It's really well set up for the race but damned hard to try and bet on. I may well end up sticking with the one tip.
Not to mention Sainz's car looks very fast but also fragile.
I think the best result would be if Ladbrokes actually paid out on the Giovinazzi not to be classified bet, but I'll be pleasantly surprised if it happens
Edited extra bit: weirdly, that's still available at evens. 99% to be rendered null and void, of course.0 -
The latter enjoyed torturing people.Ishmael_Z said:
It is already thinking for itself, that being the I part of AI. Skynet resulted from inept programming; it interpreted a non-hostile attempt to shut part of it down as hostile, because no one told its antimalware that attempts to shut it down by party X should be regarded as non-hostile (party X identifying itself by adequately secure password etc). I know notheeng of I have no mouth etc.Sean_F said:
But what if it starts thinking for itself, like Skynet, or the computer in I Have no Mouth and I Must Scream.Ishmael_Z said:
"Computer technology likely to be susceptible to malicious attacks" is not a claim which rocks my world view to its foundations. Where there's malware there is as a rule antimalware.FrancisUrquhart said:For those like seanT who think AI is going to take all the jobs in the very near future....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170410-how-to-fool-artificial-intelligence
It is why the term machine learning is a more accurate terminology for a lot of this tech as there is very little of what most people would think of as intelligence.
The real nonsense about AIs is talked by that ineffably silly Bostrom man who thinks the universe is going to be destroyed by AIs in the grip of "perverse instantiation": you have a paperclip factory, you buy an AI and make it CEO, it oversteps its brief and transforms all the matter in the universe into paperclips. This looks like a realistic idea for about 3 seconds till you realise the number of reasons why it won't happen. For starters, the thing is by definition intelligent, so you give it the instruction "don't do any of that perverse instantiation shit" and it understands because it's intelligent, and obeys because it's a computer. And you write its objectives a bit more intelligently than "make paperclips" to say e.g. maximise happiness for the employees and shareholders of Paperclipco, and being as how it's intelligent it realises that paperclips need customers for whom someone has to make paper for paperclips to be useful, and shareholders won't be happy if they themselves have been paperclipized. Plus if you read enough science fiction in your teenage years you know to program it at an unhackable level with the 3 Laws of Robotics. Silly man.
Happy Easter.0 -
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
0 -
For better or worse, malcolm is pretty recognisable. For instance, were he to post under another handle, I doubt he'd fool many of us.saddened said:
Unlike you? Somebody that's barely recognised in their own living room.malcolmg said:She has done nothing ever , an invisible politician who has reached the top by just being least bad of a buch of turkeys. She will be classed amongst the duffers when comparisons are done, more IDS or Hague than maggie.
0 -
Amazingly though the rich elite prosper regardlessBigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.0 -
"I don't think the Optometrist and his fragrant wife are evil. Certainly he had nothing to do with the latest chemical attack, just like the others - there hasn't even been a pretense of an enquiry for that reason. "
Surprisingly, Jabhat Al Nusra, son of Al Qaeda, gets a pass every time.0 -
Attributing enjoyment to a computer is very, very problematic.Sean_F said:
The latter enjoyed torturing people.Ishmael_Z said:
It is already thinking for itself, that being the I part of AI. Skynet resulted from inept programming; it interpreted a non-hostile attempt to shut part of it down as hostile, because no one told its antimalware that attempts to shut it down by party X should be regarded as non-hostile (party X identifying itself by adequately secure password etc). I know notheeng of I have no mouth etc.Sean_F said:
But what if it starts thinking for itself, like Skynet, or the computer in I Have no Mouth and I Must Scream.Ishmael_Z said:
"Computer technology likely to be susceptible to malicious attacks" is not a claim which rocks my world view to its foundations. Where there's malware there is as a rule antimalware.FrancisUrquhart said:For those like seanT who think AI is going to take all the jobs in the very near future....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170410-how-to-fool-artificial-intelligence
It is why the term machine learning is a more accurate terminology for a lot of this tech as there is very little of what most people would think of as intelligence.
The real nonsense about AIs is talked by that ineffably silly Bostrom man who thinks the universe is going to be destroyed by AIs in the grip of "perverse instantiation": you have a paperclip factory, you buy an AI and make it CEO, it oversteps its brief and transforms all the matter in the universe into paperclips. This looks like a realistic idea for about 3 seconds till you realise the number of reasons why it won't happen. For starters, the thing is by definition intelligent, so you give it the instruction "don't do any of that perverse instantiation shit" and it understands because it's intelligent, and obeys because it's a computer. And you write its objectives a bit more intelligently than "make paperclips" to say e.g. maximise happiness for the employees and shareholders of Paperclipco, and being as how it's intelligent it realises that paperclips need customers for whom someone has to make paper for paperclips to be useful, and shareholders won't be happy if they themselves have been paperclipized. Plus if you read enough science fiction in your teenage years you know to program it at an unhackable level with the 3 Laws of Robotics. Silly man.
Happy Easter.0 -
Yes but mainly for bankers and rich peopleJonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.0 -
Depends what you mean by socialism ? All the Labour governments we have had in this country have been Social democratic from the Social reformism tradition of thought.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.0 -
What a terrible place to be for an ordinary citizen.surbiton said:"I don't think the Optometrist and his fragrant wife are evil. Certainly he had nothing to do with the latest chemical attack, just like the others - there hasn't even been a pretense of an enquiry for that reason. "
Surprisingly, Jabhat Al Nusra, son of Al Qaeda, gets a pass every time.0 -
Phillips is an unapologetic misandryst.foxinsoxuk said:
Creasy at least has some vision for how the country should go:tlg86 said:
I can't stand Phillips. I quite like Creasy, but as you say, she probably wouldn't be able to win a Labour leadership election.foxinsoxuk said:
Likeable Labour MP's are not very thick on the ground, and likeability is in the eye of the beholder. I think Jess Phillips is great (I really enjoyed her recent book) but I can see why others do not. Stella Creasy has real human warmth that would contrast well with Theresa May. Stella also has a very safe seat, which with the polling may be essential for any replacement. She did good work over payday lenders too. She may be a bit too soft for the nessecary battle with the Trots though.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
...if Labour do come to their senses and replace the electoral liability that is Jeremy Corbyn with someone more popular & competent...
Who is this person? Don't forget, before Corbynism swept the nation the Labour Party, the other contenders for the leadership weren't exactly stellar performers.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/apr/06/revitalised-labour-post-brexit-vision-homelessness-poverty-inequality
Perhaps she also favours fluffy kittens, but the contrast in style with May would be marked.
Philips is the genuine article, a brash working class Brummy with a waspish wit, she would be great on the front bench against some pompous stuffed shirt. A good campaigner too.0 -
I suppose we should be grateful that computers just stop functioning from time to time.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. F, as I wrote in my blog on the Fermi Paradox/Great Filter, it's a very human thing to develop AI and autonomous killer robots at the same time
0 -
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.0 -
The major commanding heights of the economy were nationalised by Attlee.Yorkcity said:
Depends what you mean by socialism ? All the Labour governments we have had in this country have been Social democratic from the Social reformism tradition of thought.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.0 -
Mr. F, "Kill all humans! Kill all- error. Murderware 1.5 requires a Windows update. Would you like to install now?"0
-
Most of Western Europe.freetochoose said:
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.0 -
This.tlg86 said:But is her popularity down to Mrs May not being Jeremy Corbyn?
No, I think her popularity is down to not being David Cameron or George Osborne.
And that is what the Osborne cheerleaders are bitter about.
It should be remembered that Cameron and Osborne lost the 2016 local elections to Corbyn:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom_local_elections,_2016
Beaten by Jeremy Corbyn - how crap is that !!!
0 -
HilariousJonathan said:
Most of Western Europe.freetochoose said:
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.0 -
Lehmann Brothers collapsed, AIG had to be bailed out. General Motors got help from TARP, a $700bn help program, the Irish banks had to be bailed out with a €76bn rescue package. UBS, the Post Office bank in Germany and many, many others across the OECD. 22 out of 24 countries suffered recession.freetochoose said:
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.
It was all the fault of the Labour Party !0 -
As the saying goes ones getting one racist candidate advocating the kid napping of the first minister is unfortunate, to get 7 is a narrative the papers can sink their teeth into.Theuniondivvie said:Not often the staunch Yoonetariat has a go at the TRuthy party.
https://twitter.com/Theuniondivvie/status/8535121542799687680 -
' With Sir Lynton Crosby’s polling indicating Mrs May would undo David Cameron’s hard work in obliterating the Liberal Democrats in the South West '
Has anyone seen this mystery polling which is contradicted by the opinion polls ?
Of course there's no reason why a LibDem revival wouldn't have occurred if Cameron was still PM - in fact judging by the 2016 local elections it had already happened while Cameron was PM.
0 -
Or else you'd see that bloody wheel turning endlessly, followed by "Sorry. That page is not recognised."Morris_Dancer said:Mr. F, "Kill all humans! Kill all- error. Murderware 1.5 requires a Windows update. Would you like to install now?"
0 -
Amongst the happiest and most prosperous countries in the world are the Scandinavian countries where the tax take is about 45% of the GDP.freetochoose said:
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.0 -
Let's never forget that the bloke who ended boom and bust never saw the iceberg ahead of him. You could argue that Brown killed the Labour Party, Corbyn is just the funeral director.surbiton said:
Lehmann Brothers collapsed, AIG had to be bailed out. General Motors got help from TARP, a $700bn help program, the Irish banks had to be bailed out with a €76bn rescue package. UBS, the Post Office bank in Germany and many, many others across the OECD. 22 out of 24 countries suffered recession.freetochoose said:
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.
It was all the fault of the Labour Party !0 -
The chap who did see it lost his seat a couple of elections later.freetochoose said:
Let's never forget that the bloke who ended boom and bust never saw the iceberg ahead of him. You could argue that Brown killed the Labour Party, Corbyn is just the funeral director.surbiton said:
Lehmann Brothers collapsed, AIG had to be bailed out. General Motors got help from TARP, a $700bn help program, the Irish banks had to be bailed out with a €76bn rescue package. UBS, the Post Office bank in Germany and many, many others across the OECD. 22 out of 24 countries suffered recession.freetochoose said:
It also occurred at a time a socialist pronounced he had ended boom and bust.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
Most socialists are young and ideological, as they get older they change their minds.
Of course I'm happy to hear examples of a prosperous, peaceful, happy socialist state.
It was all the fault of the Labour Party !0 -
Indeed.OldKingCole said:
My thoughts exactly. Blair held on so long that when he finally stepped down and handed over, Brown had got a bit bitter and twisted.HYUFD said:Mrs May still has a comfortable lead 10 months into her premiership unlike Brown and she represents the views of the public on the key issue of the day, Brexit. A poll last month also had 47% of voters comparing her most closely to Thatcher of former recent PMs and just 11% to Brown.
Of course had Brown taken over 6 years into a Labour government and replaced Blair over Iraq as May replaced Cameron 6 years into a Tory government over Brexit he would have comfortably led IDS and beaten Howard in 2005 and probably had a better reputation, much as May comfortably leads Corbyn and will almost certainly beat Labour in 2020 whoever leads them
https://mobile.twitter.com/YouGov/status/852055843164082176
Though I suspect Brown was already bitter and twisted with Blair for getting the leadership in 1995.
I wonder how history would have been different if Brown had challenged John Smith for the leadership in 1992. He would have lost but would have been confirmed as the natural successor to John Smith and would have had a good chance of becoming leader upon his death.0 -
F1: pre-race ramble up here:
http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2017/04/bahrain-pre-race-2017.html0 -
Is that a jock? Gordon Brown re-wrote the roles under which banks operate and created the FSA, all these regulations became an ideal breeding ground for crony capitalism, limited competition and massive profits and bonuses for the banksters.Jonathan said:
Hmmm. Let's not forget that last time the money ran out it was due to casino capitalism. And government intervention saved the economy.BigRich said:
Absolutely, but each time its different, each time we are tolled that socialism done this new way, which normally means with a new 'leader' will be different. but it never is.freetochoose said:All the talk about Corbyn is irrelevant, after decades of experimenting with socialism in its various guises around the world its been proven not to work - the money always runs out.
Only the young and impressionable are left clinging to the raft.
For a while this was fine for the government as the profits pushed up the tax take allowing brown to spend even more.
But these distortions can last long term, and it didn't, the man who clamed to have abolished 'boom and bust' brought started the biggest bust in 80 years.
And government don't 'save the economy', the next generation of taxpayers, have been en-debt, to cover up the mistakes of the past.0 -
We get riled at Brown because he fucked the country over. If you can't get riled at that as a reason....Jonathan said:
Not at all. It's a beautiful Easter Sunday. Tories venting their spleen about Brown is hardly news, nor capable of spoiling that. If anything it's quite sweet how riled up they still get..SquareRoot said:
careful now, you will upset Jonathan.Fat_Steve said:Morning
I think the "May could be the next Gordon Brown" comparison ignores the specifics of the one-off awfulness of Gordon Brown. The sociopathic quality of his narcissism, deceit, and self-delusion.
May will be "found out" in various ways in the years to come. Any PM is, as there is no hiding place. She may possibly end her political career with a poor reputation. But she will not be the next Gordon Brown.0 -
And we get riled at people who are apologists for people who fucked the country over. The Labour Party.0
