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YangGangAgain? – Betting on the next Mayor of NYC – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 8,489
edited January 16 in General
imageYangGangAgain? – Betting on the next Mayor of NYC – politicalbetting.com

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Comments

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    I think he is a classic front runner in American primary politics.

    The front runner is very, very often, not who gets the candidacy.
  • O/T - I thought the government had sorted this out during the first wave.

    Covid-19: Protect us from unlawful killing charges - medics

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55689388
  • Mary_BattyMary_Batty Posts: 630
    I read the header with some incredulity, and I was about to post a big climbdown on my views of the quality of Smithson's headers. Until I saw the name at the bottom didn't match the one at the top.

    Thanks Quincel, really nice work.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 46,538
    New cases still trending down, deaths & admissions up:


  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 7,229
    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 46,538
    Agree with header - name recognition has probably got him as far as he'll go - I wonder whether he has the guts for NY politics?

    In an interview with the New York Times that went viral on Monday, Yang was asked why he decided to flee the city to his second home in upstate New York, a fact Politico reported Friday: “We live in a two-bedroom apartment in Manhattan,” Yang responded, before asking rhetorically, “Can you imagine trying to have two kids on virtual school in a two-bedroom apartment and then trying to do work yourself?”

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackbrewster/2021/01/11/yang-slammed-after-trying-to-justify-fleeing-new-york-city-during-pandemic/?sh=62bb59343c5c
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 31,863
    FPT
    malcolmg said:

    » show previous quotes
    Were you in an asylum.

    :lol:

    Well even in the asylum I've heard nothing about any of the others - let alone anything good.

    Nice one Lucky :D:D
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 1,378
    "He got so many votes it broke the algorithms of the machines"

    Mmmm, sure Jan.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 38,789
    A couple of terms as Mayor of a big city, then obscurity beckons, obviously.....

    Oh. Well, he could go onwards and upwards then.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 12,156
    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK cases by specimen date

    image
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 7,229
    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

    Blair is an impressive figure: well worth engaging in government in some way IMO. Has led the vaccine debate, and he’s right about this too.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK cases by specimen date and scaled to 100k population

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK local R

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK Case summary

    image
    image
    image
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 9,420

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

    Blair is an impressive figure: well worth engaging in government in some way IMO. Has led the vaccine debate, and he’s right about this too.
    Yes, yes, but who is that old man in the video clip?
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 10,506

    "He got so many votes it broke the algorithms of the machines"

    Mmmm, sure Jan.
    This is seriously psychologically worrying.
    Tens of millions appear to still believe Trump will be President this time next week.
    The guy who predicted the events at the Capitol highlighted it.
    The total certainty of a large slice of his support that he COULDN'T lose.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK hospitals

    image
    image
    image
    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK deaths

    image
    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    UK R

    from case data

    image
    image

    from hospitalisation data

    image
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    Age related stats

    image
    image
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 9,420

    A couple of terms as Mayor of a big city, then obscurity beckons, obviously.....

    Oh. Well, he could go onwards and upwards then.

    Ken Livingstone went "onwards and upwards"? Oh wait, you mean Rudi.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 1,378
    dixiedean said:

    "He got so many votes it broke the algorithms of the machines"

    Mmmm, sure Jan.
    This is seriously psychologically worrying.
    Tens of millions appear to still believe Trump will be President this time next week.
    The guy who predicted the events at the Capitol highlighted it.
    The total certainty of a large slice of his support that he COULDN'T lose.
    It's be funny were it not for the notes he was spotted carrying that made reference to martial law.

    Honestly can't tell whether the whole thing is just shite "social" media bullshit or genuinely the beginnings of something very dark.
  • Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 3,657

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

    Blair is an impressive figure: well worth engaging in government in some way IMO. Has led the vaccine debate, and he’s right about this too.
    Yes, yes, but who is that old man in the video clip?
    I thought Michael Heseltine looked in remarkably fine fettle there.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 9,420

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

    Blair is an impressive figure: well worth engaging in government in some way IMO. Has led the vaccine debate, and he’s right about this too.
    Yes, yes, but who is that old man in the video clip?
    I thought Michael Heseltine looked in remarkably fine fettle there.
    They could certainly interchange each others' speeches these days.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 30,313
    FPT @Foxy
    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 2,320
    As notwf yesterday, government effectively reporting over 100,000 deaths now: in fact 100,700, comprising death certificates up to Jan 1st and hospital reported deaths with date of death after Jan 1st.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 25,866

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    edited January 16
    UK Vaccination data

    deleted - data problems
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 36,294

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

    Blair is an impressive figure: well worth engaging in government in some way IMO. Has led the vaccine debate, and he’s right about this too.
    Yes, yes, but who is that old man in the video clip?
    I thought Michael Heseltine looked in remarkably fine fettle there.
    They could certainly interchange each others' speeches these days.
    Heseltine is too left wing to pass for Blair.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 9,420

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:
    It's an interesting speech (worth listening to the whole thing). How do you deal with a huge strategic error like Brexit when you have no prospect of doing anything about it any time soon ?

    Blair's answer appears to be to do the stuff you should be doing anyway. Which is boosting internal cohesion and national well-being, while engaging internationally.

    He doesn't spell out out, but of course Brexit is the antithesis of that kind of national consensus and internationalism. But you should still aim to do it anyway.

    Blair is an impressive figure: well worth engaging in government in some way IMO. Has led the vaccine debate, and he’s right about this too.
    Yes, yes, but who is that old man in the video clip?
    I thought Michael Heseltine looked in remarkably fine fettle there.
    They could certainly interchange each others' speeches these days.
    Heseltine is too left wing to pass for Blair.
    Fair comment.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 9,337

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    The total they announce today is from yesterday. But hopefully today's figures will be a bit higher.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    Andy_JS said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    The total they announce today is from yesterday. But hopefully today's figures will be a bit higher.
    It's greater than 328,260 - that's the number for England and Northern Ireland alone. The Scottish and Welsh numbers are not there.

    This takes the total of all jabs to over 4 million. Which is 6% of the UK population
  • OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 4,820
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    Why were they upset? There's nothing wrong with being gay. It's not illegal any more.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    It is probably 350-360k, when Scottish and Welsh data is added.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 9,337
    edited January 16

    Andy_JS said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    The total they announce today is from yesterday. But hopefully today's figures will be a bit higher.
    It's greater than 328,260 - that's the number for England and Northern Ireland alone. The Scottish and Welsh numbers are not there.

    This takes the total of all jabs to over 4 million. Which is 6% of the UK population
    The interesting thing is that I think this is achieved with only about 10 doctors/nurses giving jabs at any one time at most centres. (That was the case this morning at the one my father attended). We could vaccinate even faster if we could increase that number.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 35,779
    Andy_JS said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    The total they announce today is from yesterday. But hopefully today's figures will be a bit higher.
    I wouldn't be surprised if the weekends saw a little dip, but generally every day should be higher as more vaccine doses are secured and we get better at distribution.

    The data from Israel is also looking encouraging. It appears that it takes around two weeks from vaccination to have an impact, but the rates of infection of those vaccinated drops around 60% relative to other groups after two weeks (and just a single shot).
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 40,118

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 40,118
    On topic, excellent article Pip.

    I like Yang as it happens, and I think he has the X-factor, but I'm not tempted by 2/1 either - except to lay.

    Great tip.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 5,576

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 3,322

    I read the header with some incredulity, and I was about to post a big climbdown on my views of the quality of Smithson's headers. Until I saw the name at the bottom didn't match the one at the top.

    Thanks Quincel, really nice work.

    Very generous of you, though I think you are a bit harsh on OGH.

    A couple of terms as Mayor of a big city, then obscurity beckons, obviously.....

    Oh. Well, he could go onwards and upwards then.

    He's doing it the wrong way around, of course. You're meant to make a doomed Presidential bid after being New York Mayor for a bit.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 21,455
    Andy_JS said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    The total they announce today is from yesterday. But hopefully today's figures will be a bit higher.
    It's greater than 328,260 - that's the number for England and Northern Ireland alone. The Scottish and Welsh numbers are not there.

    This takes the total of all jabs to over 4 million. Which is 6% of the UK population
    The interesting thing is that I think this is achieved with only about 10 doctors/nurses giving jabs at any one time at most centres. (That was the case this morning at the one my father attended). We could vaccinate even faster if we could increase that number.
    There were, I think, only two vaccinators (at any one time) in the centre I attended this morning. However I don't think that there was much more space. One also has to have 'booking in' space and post-vaccination waiting space. All socially distanced. There's also to problem with the Pfizer vaccine that one needs a specialist 'fridge.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
  • Mary_BattyMary_Batty Posts: 630

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    :lol:
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 3,322

    On topic, excellent article Pip.

    I like Yang as it happens, and I think he has the X-factor, but I'm not tempted by 2/1 either - except to lay.

    Great tip.

    Cheers. I also like his style, and while I don't agree with all his ideas I do like how he is quite a free-thinker open to ideas from anywhere (but not an idiot who accepts any idea thoughtlessly). I actually think he could be well suited to an executive role as opposed to legislative, he might be a decent mayor. Though even an executive needs skill in managing the legislature to some extent.

    If I were a New York Democrat I'd probably vote for a more boring left-wing technocrat, but in an AV world he'd be on my list for sure. And fairly near the top.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 62,950
    Always good to get a closer look at some smaller contests (sorry NY). Good old term limits ensure at least some interest in a race.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 18,696
    edited January 16

    A couple of terms as Mayor of a big city, then obscurity beckons, obviously.....

    Oh. Well, he could go onwards and upwards then.

    Mayor of big city sets you up for doing great things afterwards. Look at Rudi.

    Edit: Sorry. Joke done. Hate it when that happens.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 4,440



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 3,322
    kle4 said:

    Always good to get a closer look at some smaller contests (sorry NY). Good old term limits ensure at least some interest in a race.

    The 2013 election was one of my first betting contests I closely followed. Absolutely wild primary, with Anthony Weiner going from zero to hero and then back again.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 55,965
    edited January 16
    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 62,950
    Quincel said:

    kle4 said:

    Always good to get a closer look at some smaller contests (sorry NY). Good old term limits ensure at least some interest in a race.

    The 2013 election was one of my first betting contests I closely followed. Absolutely wild primary, with Anthony Weiner going from zero to hero and then back again.
    I think you mean Carlos Danger.
  • Mary_BattyMary_Batty Posts: 630
    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Cultural heritage meets cultural marxism. Or something like that. It sometimes hard to know what puts Casino into his sputtering Harold Bishop mode but it's golden every time.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 4,440

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 55,965

    On topic, excellent article Pip.

    I like Yang as it happens, and I think he has the X-factor, but I'm not tempted by 2/1 either - except to lay.

    Great tip.

    The only problem I found with Yang is the longer he speaks the more gaps start to appear. He has correctly identified a real huge problem and perhaps UBI is the answer. He certainly is well drilled when it comes to talking about that. However, once he got past that, things started to get a bit off track.

    However, he certainly is a lot better than so many of the high profile wind bags around in US politics.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 1,349
    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    In general it’s still a fantastic organisation. However certain high profile issues have suggested a direction at the top that not all would agree with. Some serious issues around farming vs rewinding in the Lake District for instance. I am sure there is a place for discussing British historical links to slavery, but sometimes old stuff could do with just being preserved and put on show. Many people are sick and tired of being preached to at every turn.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 55,965
    Portugal has registered a record rise of 10,947 new cases and 166 deaths on Saturday - one day after a new national lockdown began.

    The Observador newspaper reports that three Lisbon area hospitals only had three intensive care beds left on Saturday and queues of ambulances have been reported in places.

    Portugal has the lowest critical care capacity per 100,000 in Europe and experts warn hospital rates are likely to rise over the next week following a surge in cases after Christmas.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
    My legal friend said that the Judge in question - it was some kind of dispute hearing, just the judge - was well known for sticking to formal behaviour. In the face of this, he became... not sarcastic, but some of the legal precedents he mentioned were in that direction, apparently.

    Apparently the RSPCA is the all time champion of bizarre law bending (and breaking) in the charity sector, but the NT is trying very hard to get in there.
  • 350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    Then onto 0.75m a day and get the top 9 groups (30m) done by end March! Only then can we think about significant reopenings.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 25,698
    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Should be renamed the Patriotic Trust obvs.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 1,056
    edited January 16
    Completely OT. The BBC reports that a group of friends have been fined for driving from Manchester to Uttoxeter (68 miles each way) for the sole purpose of visiting a McDonalds.

    They shouldn't have been fined. They should have been given counselling or, failing that, sectioned.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 3,322
    edited January 16

    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    Yes, it's really good news. We're not quite Israel, but even at just 300k per day we'll be in a hugely different place come late February and certainly by the end of March. Basically all the vulnerable groups will be done for one dose by then and (by late March) have had time for that dose to take effect.

    And if we keep speeding up we'll clear those groups even faster.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 9,337

    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    500k shouldn't be that difficult to organise given how well things are already going.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 55,965
    Quincel said:

    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    Yes, it's really good news. We're not quite Israel, but even at just 300k per day we'll be in a hugely different place come late February and certainly by the end of March. Basically all the vulnerable groups will be done for one dose by then and (by late March) have had time for that dose to take effect.

    And if we keep speeding up we'll clear those groups even faster.
    There is one area Israel is struggling with. Oldies that can't travel, because they are using only Pfizer they aren't able to get to many. They are instead vaccinating care givers.

    UK should have done all care home residents with first shot in next few days.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 4,440

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
    My legal friend said that the Judge in question - it was some kind of dispute hearing, just the judge - was well known for sticking to formal behaviour. In the face of this, he became... not sarcastic, but some of the legal precedents he mentioned were in that direction, apparently.

    Apparently the RSPCA is the all time champion of bizarre law bending (and breaking) in the charity sector, but the NT is trying very hard to get in there.
    The employee in one of my first ever employment tribunals (this was in 2002) calmly informed the judge that her 28 year old line manager personally imprisoned her father during the Mau Mau uprising in about 1959.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 18,696

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    You need to have a word sharpish with @HYUFD. He's giving them £25 tomorrow to settle our bet but perhaps he could attach a "no wokerie" rider. Insist it goes on unusual but delicious jams for the cafes.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 1,349

    Completely OT. The BBC reports that a group of friends have been fined for driving from Manchester to Uttoxeter (68 miles each way) for the sole purpose of visiting a McDonalds.

    They shouldn't have been fined. They should have been given counselling or, failing that, sectioned.

    Don’t know the details, but surely there must be something more going on there? Met up with someone en route and not admitted it?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 55,965
    edited January 16
    Andy_JS said:

    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    500k shouldn't be that difficult to organise given how well things are already going.
    Again it is all about the supply. We know pfizer will be reduced for a week or two (but have 5m doses of that). The big one is how fast can they bottle 20m doses of AZN (and do they have enough viles). 3-4m batch arrives early next week, but that needs to keep coming.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 15,609
    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Casino's comment sounds encouraging. Perhaps I should join. What other fronts of the culture war am I neglecting?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 46,538
    DougSeal said:
    Great line!

    If it wasn't my job I'd do it for free. It was my absolute pleasure to crush a white nationalist insurrection. I'm glad I was in a position to help. We'll do it as many times as it takes
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 9,337
    "Covid: 'Convalescent plasma no benefit to hospital patients'"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55681051
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
    My legal friend said that the Judge in question - it was some kind of dispute hearing, just the judge - was well known for sticking to formal behaviour. In the face of this, he became... not sarcastic, but some of the legal precedents he mentioned were in that direction, apparently.

    Apparently the RSPCA is the all time champion of bizarre law bending (and breaking) in the charity sector, but the NT is trying very hard to get in there.
    The employee in one of my first ever employment tribunals (this was in 2002) calmly informed the judge that her 28 year old line manager personally imprisoned her father during the Mau Mau uprising in about 1959.
    Magnificent. What was the reaction of the judge?
  • FossFoss Posts: 232

    Completely OT. The BBC reports that a group of friends have been fined for driving from Manchester to Uttoxeter (68 miles each way) for the sole purpose of visiting a McDonalds.

    They shouldn't have been fined. They should have been given counselling or, failing that, sectioned.

    Don’t know the details, but surely there must be something more going on there? Met up with someone en route and not admitted it?
    County lines?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 8,044
    Afternoon all :)

    Encouraging signs on the case numbers suggesting lockdown (possibly aided by the poor weather helping to keep people indoors - it was certainly quiet in a rainy East Ham this morning) is having an impact.

    The numbers of deaths profoundly depressing unfortunately and the numbers in hospital also worrying.

    I had expected the impact of vaccination to be a fall off in the numbers of those dying (with those most at risk of so doing being vaccinated) and a fall in the numbers of those in hospital (for similar reasons) while case numbers might remain high due to transmission among younger and therefore less vulnerable individuals.

    Today's figures suggest something else is going on - are we seeing more younger people being hospitalised or is it the numbers of vaccinations are yet to have an impact for whatever reason.

    For context, in the UK, 3.4 million people over 80, 9 million between 65 and 80 and a further 13 million between 50 and 65.

    In England alone 3 million people have had at least one dose of vaccine since December 8th.

    As to how long it will take, that will depend on how many choose to take up the offer of the vaccine.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    edited January 16
    Quincel said:

    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    Yes, it's really good news. We're not quite Israel, but even at just 300k per day we'll be in a hugely different place come late February and certainly by the end of March. Basically all the vulnerable groups will be done for one dose by then and (by late March) have had time for that dose to take effect.

    And if we keep speeding up we'll clear those groups even faster.
    Speaking of Israel - https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/daily-covid-vaccination-doses-per-capita?tab=chart&stackMode=absolute&time=earliest..latest&country=ISR~GBR~USA~BEL~BGR~CAN~CHL~HRV~CYP~CZE~DNK~EST~FIN~FRA~DEU~GRC~HUN~LUX~MLT~NLD~NOR~POL~PRT~ROU~SRB~SVK~SVN~ESP~SWE&region=World

    Why is their effort falling back so fast?

    EDIT - if we are one 500K per day, that would be

    500,000/66,796,807 = 0.00748539

    Which would be *above* the rate that Israel is current reporting.....



  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 4,440

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
    My legal friend said that the Judge in question - it was some kind of dispute hearing, just the judge - was well known for sticking to formal behaviour. In the face of this, he became... not sarcastic, but some of the legal precedents he mentioned were in that direction, apparently.

    Apparently the RSPCA is the all time champion of bizarre law bending (and breaking) in the charity sector, but the NT is trying very hard to get in there.
    The employee in one of my first ever employment tribunals (this was in 2002) calmly informed the judge that her 28 year old line manager personally imprisoned her father during the Mau Mau uprising in about 1959.
    Magnificent. What was the reaction of the judge?
    He felt she had some psychiatric issues. Her counsel by this point agreed.

    Shortly after that I defended the same client against a sales manager claiming unfair dismissal and sisability discrimination fired because he flew to Hong Kong while claiming to be off sick with a very bad back. When he was caught bang to rights in HK he called his GP in SW London who agreed to amend the sick note to include a further diagnosis of "stress at work". Problem was we had both notes. The employee also claimed in his statement that his HK acupuncturist was the only person who could relieve the bad back. When I put it to him that 14 hours in a plane would not be of much assistance to such a condition he said he got "upgraded".
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 38,789

    Andy_JS said:

    350k / day already for UK and with the iffy weather...500k / day should be the target for next week.

    To infinity and beyond.

    500k shouldn't be that difficult to organise given how well things are already going.
    Again it is all about the supply. We know pfizer will be reduced for a week or two (but have 5m doses of that). The big one is how fast can they bottle 20m doses of AZN (and do they have enough viles). 3-4m batch arrives early next week, but that needs to keep coming.
    They might be deeply unpleasant too but they are definitely vials.....
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 25,866
    stodge said:

    Afternoon all :)

    Encouraging signs on the case numbers suggesting lockdown (possibly aided by the poor weather helping to keep people indoors - it was certainly quiet in a rainy East Ham this morning) is having an impact.

    The numbers of deaths profoundly depressing unfortunately and the numbers in hospital also worrying.

    I had expected the impact of vaccination to be a fall off in the numbers of those dying (with those most at risk of so doing being vaccinated) and a fall in the numbers of those in hospital (for similar reasons) while case numbers might remain high due to transmission among younger and therefore less vulnerable individuals.

    Today's figures suggest something else is going on - are we seeing more younger people being hospitalised or is it the numbers of vaccinations are yet to have an impact for whatever reason.

    For context, in the UK, 3.4 million people over 80, 9 million between 65 and 80 and a further 13 million between 50 and 65.

    In England alone 3 million people have had at least one dose of vaccine since December 8th.

    As to how long it will take, that will depend on how many choose to take up the offer of the vaccine.

    Between two and three weeks for the vaccine to become effective to around 70% with a single dose.
  • eekeek Posts: 11,035
    edited January 16
    stodge said:

    Afternoon all :)

    Encouraging signs on the case numbers suggesting lockdown (possibly aided by the poor weather helping to keep people indoors - it was certainly quiet in a rainy East Ham this morning) is having an impact.

    The numbers of deaths profoundly depressing unfortunately and the numbers in hospital also worrying.

    I had expected the impact of vaccination to be a fall off in the numbers of those dying (with those most at risk of so doing being vaccinated) and a fall in the numbers of those in hospital (for similar reasons) while case numbers might remain high due to transmission among younger and therefore less vulnerable individuals.

    Today's figures suggest something else is going on - are we seeing more younger people being hospitalised or is it the numbers of vaccinations are yet to have an impact for whatever reason.

    For context, in the UK, 3.4 million people over 80, 9 million between 65 and 80 and a further 13 million between 50 and 65.

    In England alone 3 million people have had at least one dose of vaccine since December 8th.

    As to how long it will take, that will depend on how many choose to take up the offer of the vaccine.

    Hospital admissions are a trailing indicator - most people are admitted to hospital some time after first showing symptoms.

    Likewise vaccinations also have a lead time - if it is 10 days before the vaccination takes full effect it will be something like 14/17 days from the date of vaccination before it will impact hospital numbers.

    So I can see why things look how they do at the moment - the number of older (80 plus) patients being hospitalized will start dropping over the next 2 weeks.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
    My legal friend said that the Judge in question - it was some kind of dispute hearing, just the judge - was well known for sticking to formal behaviour. In the face of this, he became... not sarcastic, but some of the legal precedents he mentioned were in that direction, apparently.

    Apparently the RSPCA is the all time champion of bizarre law bending (and breaking) in the charity sector, but the NT is trying very hard to get in there.
    The employee in one of my first ever employment tribunals (this was in 2002) calmly informed the judge that her 28 year old line manager personally imprisoned her father during the Mau Mau uprising in about 1959.
    Magnificent. What was the reaction of the judge?
    He felt she had some psychiatric issues. Her counsel by this point agreed.

    Shortly after that I defended the same client against a sales manager claiming unfair dismissal and sisability discrimination fired because he flew to Hong Kong while claiming to be off sick with a very bad back. When he was caught bang to rights in HK he called his GP in SW London who agreed to amend the sick note to include a further diagnosis of "stress at work". Problem was we had both notes. The employee also claimed in his statement that his HK acupuncturist was the only person who could relieve the bad back. When I put it to him that 14 hours in a plane would not be of much assistance to such a condition he said he got "upgraded".
    I was peripherally involved in a case with a former employer. An employee left, and sued for reason X.

    When clearing out her desk, it turned out that they had left papers behind. These included copies of settlements for suing for X against previous employers. And detailed notes on how fabricating the evidence for this claim was going, referencing the fabrications for the previous lawsuits.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 25,866
    Andy_JS said:

    "Covid: 'Convalescent plasma no benefit to hospital patients'"

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55681051

    That's not great news, but definitely time to stop it given that viral mutations have been linked back to patients receiving convalescent plasma.
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,413

    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Casino's comment sounds encouraging. Perhaps I should join. What other fronts of the culture war am I neglecting?
    All the National Trust properties I have visited seem to be run by ladies of a certain age in tweed skirts and sensible shoes. And the cafes are full of comfortable middle class families in Burberry and wellies having tea and scones. It's all quintessentially English.
  • Mary_BattyMary_Batty Posts: 630
    edited January 16

    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Casino's comment sounds encouraging. Perhaps I should join. What other fronts of the culture war am I neglecting?
    All the National Trust properties I have visited seem to be run by ladies of a certain age in tweed skirts and sensible shoes. And the cafes are full of comfortable middle class families in Burberry and wellies having tea and scones. It's all quintessentially English.
    Yes, but they are being subject to insidious and subliminal socialist propaganda.
    The scones may seem middle class but the jam is always red
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953
    MaxPB said:

    stodge said:

    Afternoon all :)

    Encouraging signs on the case numbers suggesting lockdown (possibly aided by the poor weather helping to keep people indoors - it was certainly quiet in a rainy East Ham this morning) is having an impact.

    The numbers of deaths profoundly depressing unfortunately and the numbers in hospital also worrying.

    I had expected the impact of vaccination to be a fall off in the numbers of those dying (with those most at risk of so doing being vaccinated) and a fall in the numbers of those in hospital (for similar reasons) while case numbers might remain high due to transmission among younger and therefore less vulnerable individuals.

    Today's figures suggest something else is going on - are we seeing more younger people being hospitalised or is it the numbers of vaccinations are yet to have an impact for whatever reason.

    For context, in the UK, 3.4 million people over 80, 9 million between 65 and 80 and a further 13 million between 50 and 65.

    In England alone 3 million people have had at least one dose of vaccine since December 8th.

    As to how long it will take, that will depend on how many choose to take up the offer of the vaccine.

    Between two and three weeks for the vaccine to become effective to around 70% with a single dose.
    The age related stats -

    image
    image

    Looks like falls in the under 65s cases, starting around the 7th. Hospitalisations are still on the rise, because of the lag.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 40,118
    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    Ah, shucks. Apols.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 38,789

    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Casino's comment sounds encouraging. Perhaps I should join. What other fronts of the culture war am I neglecting?
    All the National Trust properties I have visited seem to be run by ladies of a certain age in tweed skirts and sensible shoes. And the cafes are full of comfortable middle class families in Burberry and wellies having tea and scones. It's all quintessentially English.
    You have to be a Gold member to get a tour of their underground weapons factories.....
  • stodgestodge Posts: 8,044
    MaxPB said:



    Between two and three weeks for the vaccine to become effective to around 70% with a single dose.

    What we are saying then is those who were vaccinated have a 14-21 day period where the level of immunity rises gradually to 70% (we know with Pfizer that reaches the mid-90s seven days after the second vaccination). During that period and presumably especially at the beginning of it they are still vulnerable to infection.

    Therefore, in theory, someone can go and get a first vaccination on Monday and get infected with Covid on Tuesday.

    I've no knowledge of this (not that old yet) but are those vaccinated being advised they have to remain very careful and cautious during this initial period as immunity builds?

    The second point is the figures seem to suggest the numbers getting a second vaccination are a very low proportion of the numbers being vaccinated. I don't know enough but it seems odd given all the resource we seem to have in terms of vaccine, those administering it etc that we aren't actively providing the second vaccination?

    Again, I don't know if 70% of immunity is enough but I think I would prefer a second vaccination and 95% immunity so can you request a second vaccination 21 days after your first or has that window been closed in the interest of getting more people an initial vaccination?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 40,118
    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Not cancel them, though. But to get such a politicised organisation to actually listen you need to hit them where it hurts.

    The wallet.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 11,953

    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Casino's comment sounds encouraging. Perhaps I should join. What other fronts of the culture war am I neglecting?
    All the National Trust properties I have visited seem to be run by ladies of a certain age in tweed skirts and sensible shoes. And the cafes are full of comfortable middle class families in Burberry and wellies having tea and scones. It's all quintessentially English.
    The problem is that the HQ is attracting people of a certain type. They appear, from the behaviour, to have previously worked at Trafigura. I suggest checking out their behaviour towards tenant farmers on their properties. Landlordism of a kind that has almost an Irish flavour to it.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 9,337
    edited January 16
    Whoever came up with the idea of using cathedrals as vaccination centres deserves a gong.

    "Salisbury Cathedral has been transformed into a vaccination centre with an RAF veteran being one of the first to receive the Covid-19 jab.
    Former Flight Sergeant Louis Godwin, 95, gave a thumbs-up after being vaccinated in the cathedral, which dates back more than 800 years.
    "I was so pleased to get it, especially in a setting like this," he said.
    Organisers were aiming to vaccinate 1,000 people aged over 80 with the Pfizer/BioNTech jab on Saturday."

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-55689072
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 32,161
    Maybe
  • RH1992RH1992 Posts: 411
    Andy_JS said:

    Whoever came up with the idea of using cathedrals as vaccination centres deserves a gong.

    "Salisbury Cathedral has been transformed into a vaccination centre with an RAF veteran being one of the first to receive the Covid-19 jab.
    Former Flight Sergeant Louis Godwin, 95, gave a thumbs-up after being vaccinated in the cathedral, which dates back more than 800 years.
    "I was so pleased to get it, especially in a setting like this," he said.
    Organisers were aiming to vaccinate 1,000 people aged over 80 with the Pfizer/BioNTech jab on Saturday."

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-55689072

    At least the next Russian spies can use Salisbury Cathedral as an excuse again next time they visit to steal info on how to run a good vaccination programme.

    "We came to see the famous Salisbury vaccination centre, it has the tallest spires of any vaccination centre."
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 3,657
    edited January 16

    DougSeal said:



    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.

    Cancel the National Trust? FFS.
    Casino's comment sounds encouraging. Perhaps I should join. What other fronts of the culture war am I neglecting?
    All the National Trust properties I have visited seem to be run by ladies of a certain age in tweed skirts and sensible shoes. And the cafes are full of comfortable middle class families in Burberry and wellies having tea and scones. It's all quintessentially English.
    Of course the people staffing the properties are; but too many of their bosses are typical anti-nationalists. Charles Moore gently thunders on the topic here:

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-national-trusts-shameful-manifesto
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 4,440

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    DougSeal said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    MaxPB said:

    Do we know today’s UK vaccine total?

    Up about 325,000 👍
    And that's with no reporting from Wales and Scotland, should be another 30k there as well.
    Charles said:

    FPT @Foxy

    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    HYUFD said:

    kinabalu said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Now this is proper big news. The likely new leader of the free world. Who in 1950 would have thought Germany would hold that position in 2020? The times they are a changing, no question about it. On which topic I like the Header and especially the title - Europe's Last American. It's fading fast, the sense of kinship between us and the USA. I can vouch for this personally. I used to feel it, even quite recently, but now I don't. I remain fascinated by America but I look upon it as a strange and exotic land. Much of this is because of Trump but not all of it.
    Germany's leader is not the leader of the free world. Biden will be from Wednesday.

    Germany is not big enough, the EU might be but does not have the will
    Well I look to Berlin not Washington these days for a steer on how I as a citizen of the free world should go about my business.

    And while I have you, let's just knock our bet on the head. £25 to a Good Cause. I give you 3 options. Mermaids. Jeremy Corbyn's new Peace & Fellowship project. Or the National Trust.

    No receipt required. I trust you 100%.
    I will make a payment to the NT
    Toby Young said we all had to ragequit the NT. Based patriots complied.
    Yes, apparently explaining the history of their properties was a crime against British history, or something.
    It’s not always a simple as that. A good friend of mine’s cousin was a very private man. His family knew he was gay but he wanted that kept quiet both because it was personal (and because it was illegal at the time).

    The national trust chose to make it public without consulting his family which caused a great deal of upset

    https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4745008/amp/Why-National-Trust-outed-leading-historian-gay.html
    They have developed a proven track record of breaking covenants - no not just allowing fox-hunting on their land.

    A legal friend was involved in one case. A property had been deeded to the National Trust. The NT wanted to break the agreement they had signed with the family in question. The NT argument to the court consisted, essentially, of "We are the National Trust, therefore legal agreements should be varied for us,. Because we want to."
    We need to disavow ourselves of the notion The National Trust is a friendly and benign custodian of our nation's heritage anymore.

    It isn't. It's become an arrogant and highly politicised campaigning organisation that's been successfully captured by the Left, and thinks it's above the law.

    It needs to be put back in its box.

    I wouldn't advise anyone giving them any money until they reform themselves, or are reigned in and told to do so by government.
    Reined in. Please.
    The funniest bit in the case I mentioned was that the NT, when they lost, asked the judge to make the proceedings secret. Their reasoning was their (failed) attempt at breaking a covenant would damage their reputation and make people less likely to deed properties to them.

    The cherry on top was an additional argument - that reporting of the case might cause donors to create more onerous and binding conditions in the covenants.
    I've seen stupider arguments in court - many of them from Her Majesty's Government. Such as Suella Braverman QC's...erm...brave argument that a trial judge was in the wrong because not only was he entitled to depart from a sentencing guideline but he was positively required to do so. Takes all sorts.
    My legal friend said that the Judge in question - it was some kind of dispute hearing, just the judge - was well known for sticking to formal behaviour. In the face of this, he became... not sarcastic, but some of the legal precedents he mentioned were in that direction, apparently.

    Apparently the RSPCA is the all time champion of bizarre law bending (and breaking) in the charity sector, but the NT is trying very hard to get in there.
    The employee in one of my first ever employment tribunals (this was in 2002) calmly informed the judge that her 28 year old line manager personally imprisoned her father during the Mau Mau uprising in about 1959.
    Magnificent. What was the reaction of the judge?
    He felt she had some psychiatric issues. Her counsel by this point agreed.

    Shortly after that I defended the same client against a sales manager claiming unfair dismissal and sisability discrimination fired because he flew to Hong Kong while claiming to be off sick with a very bad back. When he was caught bang to rights in HK he called his GP in SW London who agreed to amend the sick note to include a further diagnosis of "stress at work". Problem was we had both notes. The employee also claimed in his statement that his HK acupuncturist was the only person who could relieve the bad back. When I put it to him that 14 hours in a plane would not be of much assistance to such a condition he said he got "upgraded".
    I was peripherally involved in a case with a former employer. An employee left, and sued for reason X.

    When clearing out her desk, it turned out that they had left papers behind. These included copies of settlements for suing for X against previous employers. And detailed notes on how fabricating the evidence for this claim was going, referencing the fabrications for the previous lawsuits.
    Employment Tribunals are getting very tough about that. Normally in an ET you are not awarded your costs if you win but a few months back a hotel in London got a costs award of (from memory) roughly £350,000 against their former employee because he had secretly recorded dozens of hours of conversations with his colleagues in order to implicate them in a harassment claim. A record costs award from a Tribunal against an employee IIRC. Doubt they will see much of it but still.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 38,789
    Andy_JS said:

    Whoever came up with the idea of using cathedrals as vaccination centres deserves a gong.

    "Salisbury Cathedral has been transformed into a vaccination centre with an RAF veteran being one of the first to receive the Covid-19 jab.
    Former Flight Sergeant Louis Godwin, 95, gave a thumbs-up after being vaccinated in the cathedral, which dates back more than 800 years.
    "I was so pleased to get it, especially in a setting like this," he said.
    Organisers were aiming to vaccinate 1,000 people aged over 80 with the Pfizer/BioNTech jab on Saturday."

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-55689072

    They were also playing the organ too. Brilliant all-round effort.
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