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  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    Here’s a story to gladden the heart about sports stars at least trying to do the right thing:

    https://es.pn/2R6XTf8
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842

    kinabalu said:

    RobD said:

    How about treating them as normal people. I thought the left were big on equality.

    Of course. But as I said, we just have the 2 words to play with (because of Dominic Cummings) and "Respect Jews" imo works well.

    "Treat Jews as normal people" - that's FIVE words, is it not?

    People can't process that.
    Certainly quite a few people in the Labour party had problems with processing that...
    Too many have drunk the Intersectionality Kool-Aid - and thus delight in a hierarchy of oppression/victimhood. They love to label people, put them into boxes and then talk down to them.

    And if you are deemed insufficiently worthy of support, you are part of the oppressing group and thus to be ignored at best and attacked at worst.

    It is not just political parties on the left that have adopted this warped world view. Many other groups have bought into it.

    And thus you have Pride organisations round the world actively seeking to discourage gay men from participating.

    The whole thing is so depressing.

    And no-one is allowed the speak out in favour of a more balanced approach - because you are denying people 'their truth'
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    kinabalu said:

    RobD said:

    How about treating them as normal people. I thought the left were big on equality.

    Of course. But as I said, we just have the 2 words to play with (because of Dominic Cummings) and "Respect Jews" imo works well.

    "Treat Jews as normal people" - that's FIVE words, is it not?

    People can't process that.
    Three words is perfect acceptable, as 'Get Brexit Done' and 'Take Back Control' demonstrate. So:

    'Stop Hating Jews'? [Simple, to the point]

    'Get Antisemitism Done'? [Whoops, Labour already managed that one!]

    'Accept Reality'? [Nah, never going to happen]
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935

    RobD said:

    The Cabinet should collectively insist the PM takes sick leave.

    And a man well-versed in classical history should remember the example of Alexander.

    That’s a coup d'état.
    The Queen should tell him to take it easy, and that she can keep an eye on things while he's off.
    She has no mandate, so it is still a coup d'état.
    The PM is simply the person who wields the royal prerogative, nothing more. ;)
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935
    alex_ said:

    To be fair until about a month ago the prevailing wisdom was that the PM’s red boxes only contained half a dozen pages of A4 anyway.

    Yeah, I thought Johnson was supposed to be lazy, ineffective etc. etc... yet now he is vital to the continued functioning of government.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    kinabalu said:

    No, treating people the same is racist.

    I realize that is a flip comment but of course it is as false a statement as one could possibly make on this subject.

    There is no racist on earth - and there never has been - who treats people the same regardless of skin colour.
    Unfortunately, there is now also no true leftist on earth who treats people the same regardless of skin colour. Which means they have a lot in common with...
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,148
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    The Cabinet should collectively insist the PM takes sick leave.

    And a man well-versed in classical history should remember the example of Alexander.

    That’s a coup d'état.
    The Queen should tell him to take it easy, and that she can keep an eye on things while he's off.
    She has no mandate, so it is still a coup d'état.
    The PM is simply the person who wields the royal prerogative, nothing more. ;)
    The Queen has a higher net favourable rating with voters than Boris, Raab and Starmer.
    However if Boris abdicates the premiership temporarily she would just appoint who the Cabinet recommended to replace her and who could command a majority in the Commons, not do it herself
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    edited April 2020

    George Galloway was the future....never.

    I used to like him but that stopped long ago. He has talents, no question, but they are devoted to one thing and one thing only - the promotion of George Galloway. Thankfully it's a brand that has waned in recent years. He's not a player now.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,373
    edited April 2020
    kinabalu said:

    No, treating people the same is racist.

    I realize that is a flip comment but of course it is as false a statement as one could possibly make on this subject.

    There is no racist on earth - and there never has been - who treats people the same regardless of skin colour.
    Have you read the various works written on this topic by the modern regressives*

    "Treating people the same" is quite explicitly defined in this world view as racist. The Proper Behaviour is to treat groups according to a complex grid of relative value.

    Hence the reclassification of Jews, Chinese and now British Asian Hindus,

    * self titled progressives.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225
    Dysregulation of lung myeloid cells in COVID-19
    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41577-020-0303-8
    Acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS) and robust cytokine storm are the hallmark of severe COVID-19 cases. Using single-cell RNA sequencing of bronchoalveolar lavage fluid, this preprint study from Liao et al. found that the depletion of tissue-resident alveolar macrophages and the accumulation of monocyte-derived inflammatory macrophages associate with disease severity. Inflammatory macrophages adopted interferon-signalling and monocyte-recruiting chemokine programmes that may drive ARDS. Increased clonal expansion of CD8+ T cells was found in mild cases; this may reflect viral clearance due to the induction of virus-specific cytotoxic T cells, as is seen in influenza virus infection. Overall, these data support therapeutic strategies that target the myeloid cell compartment, such as IL-6 inhibitors, to treat COVID-19-associated inflammation.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    kinabalu said:

    No, treating people the same is racist.

    I realize that is a flip comment but of course it is as false a statement as one could possibly make on this subject.

    There is no racist on earth - and there never has been - who treats people the same regardless of skin colour.
    Unfortunately, there is now also no true leftist on earth who treats people the same regardless of skin colour. Which means they have a lot in common with...
    It’s always rather amused me that people with left wing views are referred to as ‘politically right-on.’
  • Nigel_ForemainNigel_Foremain Posts: 14,313

    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Do you really think there's any purpose to this endless Tweet-whining? [Tweening? Twhining?]
    Spending hours each day for years on end calling someone who has made a massive success of their professional life, who has possibly the best electoral record of any politician in history, ‘Bozo’ on a message board at every opportunity, is possibly the least self aware activity I’ve ever seen.
    Fuck me a genuine fan boy! I thought it was only HYUFD who bought into the crap about the man that is our current PM being some kind of messiah. His real outstanding achievement is that he is one of the biggest ever frauds in our political history. That said I wish the said fraud a speedy recovery. I am looking forward to him being gradually and forensically dismembered by a man who has actually had a successful career outside of politics and journalism, and doesn't seem to need to bolster his self-esteem by hw many women he has cheated on.
    dull what
    Was that a whimsical self assessment, or an attempt to demonstrate your grammatical limitation and ineloquence?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,250
    For all the PB exercise enthusiasts, the challenge doing the rounds of our gym members this morning is the "handstand teeshirt challenge".

    Put a teeshirt on whilst doing a handstand against the wall.

    You know you want to.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    HYUFD said:
    What about schools? Or did they never shut?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935
    MattW said:

    For all the PB exercise enthusiasts, the challenge doing the rounds of our gym members this morning is the "handstand teeshirt challenge".

    Put a teeshirt on whilst doing a handstand against the wall.

    You know you want to.

    We're trying ease the pressure on the NHS, not increase it.

    :D
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Do you really think there's any purpose to this endless Tweet-whining? [Tweening? Twhining?]
    Spending hours each day for years on end calling someone who has made a massive success of their professional life, who has possibly the best electoral record of any politician in history, ‘Bozo’ on a message board at every opportunity, is possibly the least self aware activity I’ve ever seen.
    Fuck me a genuine fan boy! I thought it was only HYUFD who bought into the crap about the man that is our current PM being some kind of messiah. His real outstanding achievement is that he is one of the biggest ever frauds in our political history. That said I wish the said fraud a speedy recovery. I am looking forward to him being gradually and forensically dismembered by a man who has actually had a successful career outside of politics and journalism, and doesn't seem to need to bolster his self-esteem by hw many women he has cheated on.
    dull what
    Was that a whimsical self assessment, or an attempt to demonstrate your grammatical limitation and ineloquence?
    dull what
  • Big_IanBig_Ian Posts: 67
    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:
    What about schools? Or did they never shut?
    Would they be on school holidays at that point anyway?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.

    Talking of the Middle East, here’s where if the pandemic takes hold it could be truly horrendous:

    Coronavirus: 'Gaza has no resources to fight this virus' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-52161089
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,914

    The man who made the oncoming train run on time.

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1247130744260083712

    Trump is really worried - about himself of course.
    Shouting and bullying, misrepresentation and lying simply don't work on a virus.
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.

    I got to


    "In 2002, a Coptic monk moved his chair from its agreed spot into the shade. This was interpreted as a hostile move by the Ethiopian Christians and eleven people were hospitalised."
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225

    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Do you really think there's any purpose to this endless Tweet-whining? [Tweening? Twhining?]
    Spending hours each day for years on end calling someone who has made a massive success of their professional life, who has possibly the best electoral record of any politician in history, ‘Bozo’ on a message board at every opportunity, is possibly the least self aware activity I’ve ever seen.
    Fuck me a genuine fan boy! I thought it was only HYUFD who bought into the crap about the man that is our current PM being some kind of messiah. His real outstanding achievement is that he is one of the biggest ever frauds in our political history. That said I wish the said fraud a speedy recovery. I am looking forward to him being gradually and forensically dismembered by a man who has actually had a successful career outside of politics and journalism, and doesn't seem to need to bolster his self-esteem by hw many women he has cheated on.
    dull what
    Was that a whimsical self assessment, or an attempt to demonstrate your grammatical limitation and ineloquence?
    dull what
    Percy Blakeney, without punctuation.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,373

    isam said:

    Scott_xP said:
    Do you really think there's any purpose to this endless Tweet-whining? [Tweening? Twhining?]
    Spending hours each day for years on end calling someone who has made a massive success of their professional life, who has possibly the best electoral record of any politician in history, ‘Bozo’ on a message board at every opportunity, is possibly the least self aware activity I’ve ever seen.
    Fuck me a genuine fan boy! I thought it was only HYUFD who bought into the crap about the man that is our current PM being some kind of messiah. His real outstanding achievement is that he is one of the biggest ever frauds in our political history. That said I wish the said fraud a speedy recovery. I am looking forward to him being gradually and forensically dismembered by a man who has actually had a successful career outside of politics and journalism, and doesn't seem to need to bolster his self-esteem by hw many women he has cheated on.
    dull what
    Was that a whimsical self assessment, or an attempt to demonstrate your grammatical limitation and ineloquence?
    dull what
    dull why
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,751
    Am I the only person who finds this from the PM's spokesman distinctly unreassuring?
    "The PM spoke with a doctor and was able to set out that his symptoms remained persistent ..."

    The PM is still in sufficiently good shape to be able to describe his symptoms to a doctor?
  • BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884
    yeah, that chap is just there in his fleece and chinos. Do like that story.
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    RobD said:

    MattW said:

    For all the PB exercise enthusiasts, the challenge doing the rounds of our gym members this morning is the "handstand teeshirt challenge".

    Put a teeshirt on whilst doing a handstand against the wall.

    You know you want to.

    We're trying ease the pressure on the NHS, not increase it.

    :D
    Reminds me of the time I watched two guys arm wrestle. Around 30 seconds into the contest there was a loud pop. The pain came about another 30 seconds later as one of them realised his humerus had twisted until it snapped in half and popped out through his skin.

    Paramedics said they see it all the time and suggested arm wrestling wasn't a very clever thing to relieve boredom. Well, I suppose it does relieve boredom.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    Big_Ian said:

    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:
    What about schools? Or did they never shut?
    Would they be on school holidays at that point anyway?
    I don’t know. I know very little about the Austrian education system.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,751
    ydoethur said:

    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.

    Talking of the Middle East, here’s where if the pandemic takes hold it could be truly horrendous:

    Coronavirus: 'Gaza has no resources to fight this virus' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-52161089
    It can't be any worse than it is in the UK. I mean - having to stay at home and surf the Internet. Not even being allowed to sunbathe. It is nothing short of a LIVING HELL.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    edited April 2020

    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.

    I got to


    "In 2002, a Coptic monk moved his chair from its agreed spot into the shade. This was interpreted as a hostile move by the Ethiopian Christians and eleven people were hospitalised."
    He was disrespecting local culture. They’re all Sunni round there.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,570
    ydoethur said:

    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.

    I got to


    "In 2002, a Coptic monk moved his chair from its agreed spot into the shade. This was interpreted as a hostile move by the Ethiopian Christians and eleven people were hospitalised."
    He was disrespecting local culture. They’re all Sunni round there.
    Coat sir?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    HYUFD said:
    Thanks.

    In theory, if we reopened on the 11th May, exams could still go ahead. In practice they won’t.
  • alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    HYUFD said:
    I can think of other reasons for falling advertising revenues...
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    ydoethur said:

    Amazing story

    https://twitter.com/DavidVidecette/status/1246785553900724224?s=20

    Last time the Church of the Holy Sepulchre shut was 1349 because of The Black Death.

    I got to


    "In 2002, a Coptic monk moved his chair from its agreed spot into the shade. This was interpreted as a hostile move by the Ethiopian Christians and eleven people were hospitalised."
    He was disrespecting local culture. They’re all Sunni round there.
    Coat sir?
    Are you suggesting if I make any more puns I will be in deep Shi’ite?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    Three words is perfect acceptable, as 'Get Brexit Done' and 'Take Back Control' demonstrate. So:

    'Stop Hating Jews'? [Simple, to the point]

    'Get Antisemitism Done'? [Whoops, Labour already managed that one!]

    'Accept Reality'? [Nah, never going to happen]

    People (including now you) are being a bit silly. "Respect Jews" is the equivalent of the "Save Lives" in the tripartite government slogan for the corona crisis. Labour's reboot slogan being -

    Stay Radical. Appeal to Wrinklies. Respect Jews.

    It's surely the first two that are the more controversial.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    MattW said:

    For all the PB exercise enthusiasts, the challenge doing the rounds of our gym members this morning is the "handstand teeshirt challenge".

    Put a teeshirt on whilst doing a handstand against the wall.

    You know you want to.

    No. No I don't (want to headbutt the ground albeit at some way off terminal velocity).
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,601
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225
    ydoethur said:

    Big_Ian said:

    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:
    What about schools? Or did they never shut?
    Would they be on school holidays at that point anyway?
    I don’t know. I know very little about the Austrian education system.
    I believe singing and governesses feature.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935
    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,250
    RobD said:

    MattW said:

    For all the PB exercise enthusiasts, the challenge doing the rounds of our gym members this morning is the "handstand teeshirt challenge".

    Put a teeshirt on whilst doing a handstand against the wall.

    You know you want to.

    We're trying ease the pressure on the NHS, not increase it.

    :D
    As it happens, the person I have just watched doing it on video is an ICU nurse...
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
    Sunday data always seems to be lower
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225
    HYUFD said:
    How's business at Trump Tower these days ?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    MattW said:

    RobD said:

    MattW said:

    For all the PB exercise enthusiasts, the challenge doing the rounds of our gym members this morning is the "handstand teeshirt challenge".

    Put a teeshirt on whilst doing a handstand against the wall.

    You know you want to.

    We're trying ease the pressure on the NHS, not increase it.

    :D
    As it happens, the person I have just watched doing it on video is an ICU nurse...
    Unless you have a slightly obscure taste in porn, that could have been more happily phrased.
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,375
    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
    its always lower at the weekend
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    Nigelb said:

    ydoethur said:

    Big_Ian said:

    ydoethur said:

    HYUFD said:
    What about schools? Or did they never shut?
    Would they be on school holidays at that point anyway?
    I don’t know. I know very little about the Austrian education system.
    I believe singing and governesses feature.
    Doe!
  • AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Lammy??? Lammy????????

    Glad to see Falconer replacing Shami
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,148

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Ed Miliband back in then, could be Hague to Starmer's Cameron
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,729
    TGOHF666 said:

    Nicola has no clue if any other of her ministers were out and about.

    she will.have surely asked after this ?
  • AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900
    ehrmagerd Ed is back
  • RobDRobD Posts: 59,935

    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
    its always lower at the weekend
    Damn. At least it's not going up so fast as to reverse that.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Lammy??? Lammy????????

    Glad to see Falconer replacing Shami
    Shameless out? Oh dear never mind
  • Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Lammy??? Lammy????????

    Glad to see Falconer replacing Shami
    Has Falconer resigned yet?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    edited April 2020

    Have you read the various works written on this topic by the modern regressives*

    "Treating people the same" is quite explicitly defined in this world view as racist. The Proper Behaviour is to treat groups according to a complex grid of relative value.

    Hence the reclassification of Jews, Chinese and now British Asian Hindus,

    * self titled progressives.

    You are over-intellectualizing. And you're doing it on behalf of other people. Suspect some populist para-summarizing of dense sociological tomes.

    Treat people with equal respect but be sensitive to difference and support efforts to reduce barriers to the empowerment of disadvantaged groups.

    I don't need no book-learning to understand that. Especially having just written it.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
    its always lower at the weekend
    it's also ENGLAND only
  • AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    So the latest to be pushed out are

    Tracy Brabin
    Peter Dowd
    Dan Carden
    Dawn Butler
    Rachel Maskell
    Margaret Greenwood
    Baroness Chakrabati
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,773
    Scott_xP said:
    And we will miss absolutely none of them, apart from comedy purposes.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    That’s a very large shadow cabinet,

    Am I right in thinking though that the only shadow minister who served under Blair or Brown (as Shadow Attorney General and Chief Whip are not ministerial) is Ed Miliband, who is a most interesting comeback?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    Scott_xP said:
    And we will miss absolutely none of them, apart from comedy purposes.
    There was a poster yesterday who will be disappointed to have missed Chakrabarti actually being sacked. Can’t remember who it was.

    Lot of dead wood cleared out there.

    The question is whether the replacements will be any better.
  • AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    The Vazs are always there

    Allin-Khan gets a "minor" position in the end.
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    I have this awful foreboding that we're on the verge of emerging from the worst of this but Charon the ferryman will have been paid with Boris.

    I hope the former is right and the latter wrong.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Why an interim Shadow NI secretary? Who is he keeping the place for?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Lammy??? Lammy????????

    Glad to see Falconer replacing Shami
    Has Falconer resigned yet?
    He at least gets another shot at it.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    Unfortunately, there is now also no true leftist on earth who treats people the same regardless of skin colour. Which means they have a lot in common with...

    If you get to define what your opponent believes you can never lose an argument.

    Which is why you don't - get to do that.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,751
    People really shouldn't get the idea that the situation in Austria bears any relation to that in the UK.

    The official figures in the latest WHO report are 11,766 cases and 186 deaths. That is 10 days after the peak in new cases and 5 days after the peak in deaths. Probably not more than 1% of the population has been infected.

    I would guess the percentage infected in the UK is ten times larger, and here neither daily cases nor daily deaths have peaked.

    Another problem that will need to be considered in the next few months is that Italy, Spain, France, the UK and perhaps Germany will have acquired a significant degree of immunity because of the number of people who have been infected, while other countries like Austria will still effectively be virgin territory for any resurgence of the virus.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842
    ydoethur said:

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    That’s a very large shadow cabinet,

    Am I right in thinking though that the only shadow minister who served under Blair or Brown (as Shadow Attorney General and Chief Whip are not ministerial) is Ed Miliband, who is a most interesting comeback?
    It is always strange when you appoint someone as a Shadow minister when there isn't a real minister for them to shadow. Yes, you want to signal your priorities for when you get into power - but we don't have a Department of Employment Rights and Protections, so what is Andy McDonald going to do?
  • AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900

    I have this awful foreboding that we're on the verge of emerging from the worst of this ....

    Two weeks post-lockdown, should be about peak cases soonish. Maybe a few more days, because our lockdown wasn't as harsh as some others.

    Deaths peak unfortunately probably a week+.
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    Andrew said:

    I have this awful foreboding that we're on the verge of emerging from the worst of this ....

    Two weeks post-lockdown, should be about peak cases soonish. Maybe a few more days, because our lockdown wasn't as harsh as some others.

    Deaths peak unfortunately probably a week+.
    Maybe but I have a good feeling about it (relatively speaking of course).
  • Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Why an interim Shadow NI secretary? Who is he keeping the place for?
    Tony Lloyd who is in hospital with Covid-19.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    kinabalu said:

    Unfortunately, there is now also no true leftist on earth who treats people the same regardless of skin colour. Which means they have a lot in common with...

    If you get to define what your opponent believes you can never lose an argument.

    Which is why you don't - get to do that.
    On the contrary, I'm simply observing how those opponents define themselves. One has only to glance at tomes such as 'Why I'm No Longer Talking to White People About Race', which are not merely tolerated by the Left but lauded and feted as models of their type, to know exactly what they believe.
  • ABZABZ Posts: 441
    Chris said:

    People really shouldn't get the idea that the situation in Austria bears any relation to that in the UK.

    The official figures in the latest WHO report are 11,766 cases and 186 deaths. That is 10 days after the peak in new cases and 5 days after the peak in deaths. Probably not more than 1% of the population has been infected.

    I would guess the percentage infected in the UK is ten times larger, and here neither daily cases nor daily deaths have peaked.

    Another problem that will need to be considered in the next few months is that Italy, Spain, France, the UK and perhaps Germany will have acquired a significant degree of immunity because of the number of people who have been infected, while other countries like Austria will still effectively be virgin territory for any resurgence of the virus.

    This latter point is quite important - it also partially explains the vulnerability, to an extent, of Singapore to a resurgence. It also depends, of course, on what % of the populations in Europe have been infected - there's a big difference between 3% and 30%!
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    Chris said:

    People really shouldn't get the idea that the situation in Austria bears any relation to that in the UK.

    The official figures in the latest WHO report are 11,766 cases and 186 deaths. That is 10 days after the peak in new cases and 5 days after the peak in deaths. Probably not more than 1% of the population has been infected.

    I would guess the percentage infected in the UK is ten times larger, and here neither daily cases nor daily deaths have peaked.

    Another problem that will need to be considered in the next few months is that Italy, Spain, France, the UK and perhaps Germany will have acquired a significant degree of immunity because of the number of people who have been infected, while other countries like Austria will still effectively be virgin territory for any resurgence of the virus.

    You seem very keen for the lockdown to continue for longer than is desirable.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,153

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    Lammy??? Lammy????????

    Glad to see Falconer replacing Shami
    Sold out her principles and now doesnt even have a shadow cabinet gig to show for it. I wonder if it was worth it.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,709
    Chris said:

    People really shouldn't get the idea that the situation in Austria bears any relation to that in the UK.

    The official figures in the latest WHO report are 11,766 cases and 186 deaths. That is 10 days after the peak in new cases and 5 days after the peak in deaths. Probably not more than 1% of the population has been infected.

    I would guess the percentage infected in the UK is ten times larger, and here neither daily cases nor daily deaths have peaked.

    Another problem that will need to be considered in the next few months is that Italy, Spain, France, the UK and perhaps Germany will have acquired a significant degree of immunity because of the number of people who have been infected, while other countries like Austria will still effectively be virgin territory for any resurgence of the virus.

    Even if, say, a million people had immunity in each of the UK, Spain, Italy and Germany, that would still be a drop in the ocean relative to the overall population. I think we'd need to get to much higher numbers before it would influence the ability of the virus to spread when unmitigated by social distancing.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424

    ydoethur said:

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    That’s a very large shadow cabinet,

    Am I right in thinking though that the only shadow minister who served under Blair or Brown (as Shadow Attorney General and Chief Whip are not ministerial) is Ed Miliband, who is a most interesting comeback?
    It is always strange when you appoint someone as a Shadow minister when there isn't a real minister for them to shadow. Yes, you want to signal your priorities for when you get into power - but we don't have a Department of Employment Rights and Protections, so what is Andy McDonald going to do?
    Well, as Sandpit says upthread in response to my earlier post, he might find himself quite busy in the next few months...
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,373
    kinabalu said:

    Have you read the various works written on this topic by the modern regressives*

    "Treating people the same" is quite explicitly defined in this world view as racist. The Proper Behaviour is to treat groups according to a complex grid of relative value.

    Hence the reclassification of Jews, Chinese and now British Asian Hindus,

    * self titled progressives.

    You and @BluestBlue are over-intellectualizing. And you're doing it on behalf of other people. Suspect some populist para-summarizing of dense sociological tomes.

    Treat people with equal respect but be sensitive to difference and support efforts to reduce barriers to the empowerment of disadvantaged groups.

    I don't need no book-learning to understand that. Especially having just written it.
    That is because you are a reasonable, compassionate human being.

    I have personally witnessed the bullshit above and watched as it damaged peoples lives.

    Case in point - as part of Religious Education, visits to places of worship. Certain groups do not visit other groups places of worship. You could make a grid. As is also usual, a stern letter was sent out mandating attendance at the Mosque visit. As was usual, the Hindus and Sikhs didn't attend. One parent was summoned to the school, threatened with sanction etc. This was because she had married into a Hindu family, and converted, but was guilty of being melanin challenged. The school tried the "you can't convert to Hinduism" angle. Which made me laugh... finally they decided for the purposes of this rule (breaking??) she was an honorary Hindu...
  • RandallFlaggRandallFlagg Posts: 1,294
    As I feared, one buffoon (Burgon) at Shadow Justice replaced by another (Lammy).
    Good to see Ed back, and that he'll be the one pushing the Green New Deal.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    So Sir Keir wasn't brave enough to sack Rebecca Long Bailey.

    So much for wanting to be taken seriously then.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821

    Scott_xP said:
    And we will miss absolutely none of them, apart from comedy purposes.
    Fear not, the comedy can continue from the backbenches and on Twitter.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,424
    By the way, with Cat Smith and Long Bailey in there, he hasn’t fully cleared out the Corbynistas.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,225
    The Yougov tracker of "fear of catching" the coronavirus shows very sharp upward moves for Germany and Sweden in the last week or so:
    https://yougov.co.uk/topics/international/articles-reports/2020/03/17/YouGov-international-COVID-19-tracker
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    Scott_xP said:
    And we will miss absolutely none of them, apart from comedy purposes.
    Lost a Butler, gained a Lammy - seems a no score draw.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,751

    I have this awful foreboding that we're on the verge of emerging from the worst of this but Charon the ferryman will have been paid with Boris.

    I hope the former is right and the latter wrong.

    It seems COVID hospital admissions are running at something like 13,000 a day, while deaths are a twentieth of that. Admittedly there is a time lag, but the numbers are on Boris Johnson's side, and I'm convinced he will get adequate care if anyone does.

    I don't think we'll be deprived of the prospect of him trying to wriggle out of his responsiility for the death toll in a few months' time.
  • JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,259
    IanB2 said:

    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
    Sunday data always seems to be lower
    It's a 9% increase rather than 14% last Sunday. But you can't read a lot into 1 day's figures.
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688

    IanB2 said:

    RobD said:

    Andy_JS said:
    That's down quite a bit, isn't it?
    Sunday data always seems to be lower
    It's a 9% increase rather than 14% last Sunday. But you can't read a lot into 1 day's figures.
    Two days. It dropped yesterday as well.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    edited April 2020
    ydoethur said:

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    That’s a very large shadow cabinet,

    Am I right in thinking though that the only shadow minister who served under Blair or Brown (as Shadow Attorney General and Chief Whip are not ministerial) is Ed Miliband, who is a most interesting comeback?
    I am pleased with the way Starmer has axed so many Corbynistas

    Not sure about RLB at education or Lammy at justice.

    But the slaying of Corbynism seems like a breath of fresh air and well done to Starmer

    Please can others enlighten me, but is this a very pro EU shadow cabinet and if so who will stand up for brexit as desired by so many in the red wall seats
  • AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    ydoethur said:



    Am I right in thinking though that the only shadow minister who served under Blair or Brown (as Shadow Attorney General and Chief Whip are not ministerial) is Ed Miliband, who is a most interesting comeback?

    John Healey was a junior minister back in the Blair-Brown era. One of the few pre 2005 MPs there.
  • ydoethur said:

    Full Shadow Cabinet

    Keir Starmer, Leader of the Opposition
    Angela Rayner, Deputy Leader and Chair of the Labour Party
    Anneliese Dodds, Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Lisa Nandy, Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Nick Thomas-Symonds, Shadow Home Secretary
    Rachel Reeves, Shadow Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster
    David Lammy, Shadow Justice Secretary
    John Healey, Shadow Defence Secretary
    Ed Miliband, Shadow Business, Energy and Industrial Secretary
    Emily Thornberry, Shadow International Trade Secretary
    Jonathan Reynolds, Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary
    Jonathan Ashworth, Shadow Secretary of State for Health and Social Care
    Rebecca Long-Bailey, Shadow Education Secretary
    Jo Stevens, Shadow Digital, Culture, Media and Sport
    Bridget Philipson, Shadow Chief Secretary to the Treasury
    Luke Pollard, Shadow Environment, Food and Rural Affairs Secretary
    Steve Reed, Shadow Communities and Local Government Secretary
    Thangam Debbonaire, Shadow Housing Secretary
    Jim McMahon, Shadow Transport Secretary
    Preet Kaur Gill, Shadow International Development Secretary
    Louise Haigh, Shadow Northern Ireland Secretary (interim)
    Ian Murray, Shadow Scotland Secretary
    Nia Griffith, Shadow Wales Secretary
    Marsha de Cordova, Shadow Women and Equalities Secretary
    Andy McDonald, Shadow Employment Rights and Protections Secretary
    Rosena Allin-Khan, Shadow Minister for Mental Health
    Cat Smith, Shadow Minister for Young People and Voter Engagement
    Lord Falconer, Shadow Attorney General
    Valerie Vaz, Shadow Leader of the House
    Nick Brown, Opposition Chief Whip
    Baroness Smith, Shadow Leader of the Lords
    Lord McAvoy, Lords’ Opposition Chief Whip

    That’s a very large shadow cabinet,

    Am I right in thinking though that the only shadow minister who served under Blair or Brown (as Shadow Attorney General and Chief Whip are not ministerial) is Ed Miliband, who is a most interesting comeback?
    It is always strange when you appoint someone as a Shadow minister when there isn't a real minister for them to shadow. Yes, you want to signal your priorities for when you get into power - but we don't have a Department of Employment Rights and Protections, so what is Andy McDonald going to do?
    He's there to show the nutters that they still have a stake in the game, "look, we've made up a non-job that you're all obsessed about and put the useless but least crazy one on the job"
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,842

    So Sir Keir wasn't brave enough to sack Rebecca Long Bailey.

    So much for wanting to be taken seriously then.

    He has sidelined her - Education isn't going to be a major topic over the coming months. Yes, there are issues around the exam system and reopening. But it isn't going to dominate the headlines.

    I don't see her surviving many reshuffles - unless she ups her game
  • MysticroseMysticrose Posts: 4,688
    TGOHF666 said:

    Scott_xP said:
    And we will miss absolutely none of them, apart from comedy purposes.
    Lost a Butler, gained a Lammy - seems a no score draw.
    David Lammy is wild but he occasionally hits the bullseye like no one else. I'm glad he's closer in than on the fringes.
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