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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Welcome to the “Nanny State” – Boris style

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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,427

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    China is integral to so many supply chains in so many industries. Huawei is going to be central to our 5G infrastructure. It’s going to be impossible to avoid. But we need to see it for what it is. No-one should think The Chinese government has any interest in mind but its own.
    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    I'm shocked at the number of apologists for China on here this morning.

    I despair.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,952

    The decision to reduce the tube service was terrible. Yes they would have been more or less empty. That’s the point.

    That was strange thinking. The drivers are completely confined anyway, so why not keep them all at work? A Clanger
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309
    Markets seem a bit more resilient this morning, perhaps in anticipation of a resolution to the political impasse over the US rescue package today. The resistance levels of FTSE 5000/Dow 20000 are still exercising a pull.
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    The willingness of the Trump machine to sacrifice the lives of one of his key voting demographics is fascinating. They are all over the place currently.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/24/older-people-would-rather-die-than-let-covid-19-lockdown-harm-us-economy-texas-official-dan-patrick

    Personally I don't want my kids being shot to death in school but Americans keep voting to preserve the rights of the shooter. Not my choice but I sincerely believe in their right to make their own democratic choices. If they want to die of Coronavirus and that's their choice shouldn't we respect that as well?
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    GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,081
    The death of the high street, at least in big cities, is grossly exaggerated in my opinion.

    A vast majority of establishments are already clubs, bars, cafes, and restaurants. They are not going anywhere.
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    malcolmg said:

    Scott_xP said:
    What an absolute donkey that horrible little cretin is.
    For all his brains, he's never learned that saying "I dont know" when you dont know is the right answer, rather than a guess.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937
    Jonathan said:

    Somehow we have to avoid the Trumpian blaming foreigners phase.

    I have seen very little of that here. Farage tried, but failed spectacularly. Immigrants are playing a central role in keeping things together right now. The vast majority of people can see that.

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    OldBasingOldBasing Posts: 168

    The decision to reduce the tube service was terrible. Yes they would have been more or less empty. That’s the point.

    Sadiq Khan has just said on Radio 4 that 20% of Transport for London staff are sick or self isolating. So perhaps can’t run more trains?

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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,749
    I doubt Johnson is happy with those front pages, but he did the right thing here.
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    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670

    The willingness of the Trump machine to sacrifice the lives of one of his key voting demographics is fascinating. They are all over the place currently.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/24/older-people-would-rather-die-than-let-covid-19-lockdown-harm-us-economy-texas-official-dan-patrick

    Like some on here I had started to wonder if a sudden pivot to massive government largesse would save Trump come November but the last 2 days with the ludicrous Senate bill (half a trillion dollars to be handed out by Minchkin with no oversight and not even recipients reported until 6 months later) plus now the stated desire to sacrifice people to pump up the stock market is gob snakcingly dumb.
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    IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    China is integral to so many supply chains in so many industries. Huawei is going to be central to our 5G infrastructure. It’s going to be impossible to avoid. But we need to see it for what it is. No-one should think The Chinese government has any interest in mind but its own.
    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    I'm shocked at the number of apologists for China on here this morning.

    I despair.
    That is a psychological side effect of the shutdown; it says nothing about the real world. You are just seeing pushback against your nationalistically informed misdiagnosis of a problem and prescription of a wholly unworkable cure.
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    The death of the high street, at least in big cities, is grossly exaggerated in my opinion.

    A vast majority of establishments are already clubs, bars, cafes, and restaurants. They are not going anywhere.

    That's social interaction. The key point was made already upthread - the hateful Currys PC World has been closed but Amazon still deliver. If Dixons Hatephone still have Stanley Palms level of business savvy they'll be looking at how they can offload their expensive out of town barn stores and switch to a virtual model. Not something as piratical as Amazon, something with people interaction.
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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,749
    I doubt Johnson is happy with those front pages, but he did the right thing here.

    Edit he would have got more buy in with better communication earlier.

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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309
    rcs1000 said:

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    H1n1 came from the US: https://www.cdc.gov/h1n1flu/information_h1n1_virus_qa.htm
    So beware of casting stones
    The second wave of this will probably come from the US, as well.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,192
    Scott_xP said:
    If only people without a 'fucking clue' would zip it, Govey wouldn't have to make these clarifications.

    https://twitter.com/WestminsterWAG/status/1241072153228910592?s=20
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,857

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a terrible day. It shouldn't have been allowed to get this stage.

    As soon as it became apparent there was a virus epidemic in China and other countries the borders should have been closed completely, with a very strict quarantine regime for people wishing to return to the UK. Other countries should have done the same.

    But @Andy_JS if you look back over your own posts from the last few weeks on the subject you will see that there would have been huge resistance to such a move. Governments should lead but ultimately they govern by consent, especially on something like this where the authorities need widespread cooperation. Could the government have moved faster? Yes, but only by a maximum of a week or so. Even that would have been hugely controversial.
    Exactly. There is no way a government could impose measures like this without the public being primed to accept them. Even now some wont and direct enforcement is impossible. The idea it could have happened a lot sooner, and from those objecting to moving too quick to boot, is just plain silly, even if with a slight range.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,758
    Foxy said:

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    Ebola came from West Africa, HIV from Central Africa, MERS from Saudi, Swine Flu from the USA and BSE from the UK. These viruses jump species everywhere that people eat meat.

    As the worlds biggest producer of PPE, I would be very glad of some massive imports from China.
    Or it has nothing to do with eating meat and is simply a function of a globalised world where the more we travel across continents the easier it is for species to establish themselves elsewhere. There are enough examples of species jumping continents eg Asian hornets on shipping to say its just a downside to a smaller world. This is happening to other species on the planet its just they don't get to shout about it.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309

    The death of the high street, at least in big cities, is grossly exaggerated in my opinion.

    A vast majority of establishments are already clubs, bars, cafes, and restaurants. They are not going anywhere.

    Neither are we right now.
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    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,010



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,758
    edited March 2020

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    China is integral to so many supply chains in so many industries. Huawei is going to be central to our 5G infrastructure. It’s going to be impossible to avoid. But we need to see it for what it is. No-one should think The Chinese government has any interest in mind but its own.
    The supply chains will get re configured

    All the Brexit downside is now in the market and companies will pay more attention to supply chain robustness rather than just price. We will shift to more regionalism at the expense of globalism.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,952
    edited March 2020
    kle4 said:

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a terrible day. It shouldn't have been allowed to get this stage.

    As soon as it became apparent there was a virus epidemic in China and other countries the borders should have been closed completely, with a very strict quarantine regime for people wishing to return to the UK. Other countries should have done the same.

    But @Andy_JS if you look back over your own posts from the last few weeks on the subject you will see that there would have been huge resistance to such a move. Governments should lead but ultimately they govern by consent, especially on something like this where the authorities need widespread cooperation. Could the government have moved faster? Yes, but only by a maximum of a week or so. Even that would have been hugely controversial.
    Exactly. There is no way a government could impose measures like this without the public being primed to accept them. Even now some wont and direct enforcement is impossible. The idea it could have happened a lot sooner, and from those objecting to moving too quick to boot, is just plain silly, even if with a slight range.
    Modern life was a car that was continuously breaking the speed limit for a long journey, and now it’s crashed. Unnatural things that destroy the world like flying planes should be expensive rarities, not cheap entitlements.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    China is integral to so many supply chains in so many industries. Huawei is going to be central to our 5G infrastructure. It’s going to be impossible to avoid. But we need to see it for what it is. No-one should think The Chinese government has any interest in mind but its own.
    The supply chains will get re configured

    All the Brexit downside is now in the market and companies will pay more attention to supply chain robustness rather than just price. We will shift to more regionalism at the expense of globalism.
    You know what I’m going to say, don’t you? ;-)

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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,315
    edited March 2020

    Scott_xP said:
    If only people without a 'fucking clue' would zip it, Govey wouldn't have to make these clarifications.

    https://twitter.com/WestminsterWAG/status/1241072153228910592?s=20
    Well, it’s true, because he wouldn’t have cocked up in the first place if he’d kept it zipped.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,758

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    China is integral to so many supply chains in so many industries. Huawei is going to be central to our 5G infrastructure. It’s going to be impossible to avoid. But we need to see it for what it is. No-one should think The Chinese government has any interest in mind but its own.
    The supply chains will get re configured

    All the Brexit downside is now in the market and companies will pay more attention to supply chain robustness rather than just price. We will shift to more regionalism at the expense of globalism.
    You know what I’m going to say, don’t you? ;-)

    Happy Hanukkah ?
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,936
    Full tubes would be ok. No tubes could work. Reduced tubes + no actual lockdown is an absolute fucking disaster
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited March 2020

    Scott_xP said:
    If only people without a 'fucking clue' would zip it, Govey wouldn't have to make these clarifications.

    https://twitter.com/WestminsterWAG/status/1241072153228910592?s=20
    Well said Sarah Vine.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,315
    edited March 2020

    The willingness of the Trump machine to sacrifice the lives of one of his key voting demographics is fascinating. They are all over the place currently.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/24/older-people-would-rather-die-than-let-covid-19-lockdown-harm-us-economy-texas-official-dan-patrick

    Personally I don't want my kids being shot to death in school but Americans keep voting to preserve the rights of the shooter. Not my choice but I sincerely believe in their right to make their own democratic choices. If they want to die of Coronavirus and that's their choice shouldn't we respect that as well?
    We’re unlikely to be hit by stray bullets from a school shooting is the US in this country.

    However, if the US becomes a major reservoir of this virus, it’s going to be a right bastard to either contain or eradicate it. The effects on the world economy would also be to put it mildly suboptimal.
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    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    Pulpstar said:

    Jonathan said:

    Employees have a role to play. Why drag the workforce in right now? It is not BAU.

    The Govts half baked announcement won't trigger force majeure in contracts as currently stated
    In Spain - those whose jobs can continue or are necessary are still working with appropriate measures in place. This is common sense. The economy is massively disruted as it is without making it worse than necessary.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,952
    Let’s hope that a month or two of strict discipline for individuals makes the country a better place afterwards.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Pulpstar said:

    Full tubes would be ok. No tubes could work. Reduced tubes + no actual lockdown is an absolute fucking disaster

    Bloody moronic of Khan to force people onto fewer tubes in order to encourage social distancing.

    Pictures of Waterloo Station being empty but the trains being full - this is entirely due to what Khan has done, not Londoners.
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    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060

    What a disappointment! Just got back from the Waitrose exclusive OAP shopping hour and I wasn't asked for proof of my age

    I’ve never been asked to prove my age for buying anything either.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,427
    Jonathan said:

    Somehow we have to avoid the Trumpian blaming foreigners phase.

    No-one's blaming foreigners.

    There's also a big risk of a cop out - because people are far too worried about being *seen* to blame foreigners to take any action.

    Chinese sanitary and welfare standards are woeful. There's a pattern of outbreaks there.

    Time to change.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,747

    Pulpstar said:

    Full tubes would be ok. No tubes could work. Reduced tubes + no actual lockdown is an absolute fucking disaster

    Bloody moronic of Khan to force people onto fewer tubes in order to encourage social distancing.

    Pictures of Waterloo Station being empty but the trains being full - this is entirely due to what Khan has done, not Londoners.
    The tube is the one place where I would have welcomed a nanny state approach.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,427
    IshmaelZ said:

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    China must be made to change. Their domestic environmental, sanitary and hygiene regulation is appalling.

    That isn't about revenge; it's about avoiding a future repetition.

    SARS, Bird Flu/H5N1.. Covid-19. There's far too much of a pattern there.

    Enough. I won't be buying anything Made in China unless they change.

    Money will be the only language they understand.
    China is integral to so many supply chains in so many industries. Huawei is going to be central to our 5G infrastructure. It’s going to be impossible to avoid. But we need to see it for what it is. No-one should think The Chinese government has any interest in mind but its own.
    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    I'm shocked at the number of apologists for China on here this morning.

    I despair.
    That is a psychological side effect of the shutdown; it says nothing about the real world. You are just seeing pushback against your nationalistically informed misdiagnosis of a problem and prescription of a wholly unworkable cure.
    Bollocks. You're a shit-stirring twat of a poster this site would be far better off without.

    Alastair Meeks was right about you.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,427
    Dura_Ace said:



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
    Ah, I should have added that this crisis will also be exploited by vegans at the other end.
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    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060

    Dura_Ace said:



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
    Ah, I should have added that this crisis will also be exploited by vegans at the other end.
    Much harder to stock up for several months food if you are vegan I would think.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    Pulpstar said:

    Full tubes would be ok. No tubes could work. Reduced tubes + no actual lockdown is an absolute fucking disaster

    Bloody moronic of Khan to force people onto fewer tubes in order to encourage social distancing.

    Pictures of Waterloo Station being empty but the trains being full - this is entirely due to what Khan has done, not Londoners.
    It’s actually due to a lot of people feeling they have no choice but to go to work. That will include many who are self-employed and on zero hours contracts. Khan and the government both need to look at this as a matter of extreme urgency.

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    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    Sports Direct changes its mind: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52011915
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,315

    What a disappointment! Just got back from the Waitrose exclusive OAP shopping hour and I wasn't asked for proof of my age

    I’ve never been asked to prove my age for buying anything either.
    I haven’t been asked for ID for over a year.

    But I was pretty flattered last time given I was 36 at the time.
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    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    Any way, off to work, or dining room table as it used to be known. Wonder how many of my Year 11s are going to log on to my words of wisdom about revising for an exam they will not have to sit...
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    BannedinnParisBannedinnParis Posts: 1,884

    Pulpstar said:

    Full tubes would be ok. No tubes could work. Reduced tubes + no actual lockdown is an absolute fucking disaster

    Bloody moronic of Khan to force people onto fewer tubes in order to encourage social distancing.

    Pictures of Waterloo Station being empty but the trains being full - this is entirely due to what Khan has done, not Londoners.
    It’s actually due to a lot of people feeling they have no choice but to go to work. That will include many who are self-employed and on zero hours contracts. Khan and the government both need to look at this as a matter of extreme urgency.

    Personally, at 1805, I, and two colleagues, had two days to get our labs closed down safely. At 0800, everything was shut down - I'm inside the building trying to get a straight answer from someone higher up. Brilliant.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,439

    Pulpstar said:

    Full tubes would be ok. No tubes could work. Reduced tubes + no actual lockdown is an absolute fucking disaster

    Bloody moronic of Khan to force people onto fewer tubes in order to encourage social distancing.

    Pictures of Waterloo Station being empty but the trains being full - this is entirely due to what Khan has done, not Londoners.
    Yes but the corollary of this is HMG's lockdown might have been an overreaction if (and there is a medium-sized assumption that drivers remain healthy) the problem could have been fixed merely by resuming a normal timetable.
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    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060
    ydoethur said:

    What a disappointment! Just got back from the Waitrose exclusive OAP shopping hour and I wasn't asked for proof of my age

    I’ve never been asked to prove my age for buying anything either.
    I haven’t been asked for ID for over a year.

    But I was pretty flattered last time given I was 36 at the time.
    I wasn’t being asked at less than half that...
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    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956
    The Chinese government is probably the most damaging force in the world today - widespread human rights abuses, repression of religious minorities, Hong Kong, Tibet, and now barbaric animal welfare standards causing a viral outbreak and government cover-up delaying a global response. Pointing this out and wanting said government to be held to account is clearly not hating or blaming the ordinary Chinese population and it's daft to claim otherwise.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,991
    Grandpa Smithson, I feel your pain.

    Some time ago I met a friend at a cafe for a chat. It was really hot and normally I'd get myself a coke but they were sold out, so I grabbed any old cold drink. Only when I opened it did I realise it was Kopparberg cider (rather nice, although it's pretty much a fruit drink unlike other ciders I've tried which were lagery). And then I realised the checkout lady hadn't even batted an eye or considered asking me for ID (just as well, I didn't have any).

    It's almost as if baldness and stubble makes a man look old...
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,482

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    Or, Sadiq Khan could reverse his stupid tube timetable as the lady suggests. Your refusal to criticise a favoured politician rather silly.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,315

    Any way, off to work, or dining room table as it used to be known. Wonder how many of my Year 11s are going to log on to my words of wisdom about revising for an exam they will not have to sit...

    For me, the Year 11 figure was 40%. Year 13 was around 30%.

    No idea what Year 12 will be like, but they should be doing coursework anyway.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309

    What a disappointment! Just got back from the Waitrose exclusive OAP shopping hour and I wasn't asked for proof of my age

    I didn't know there was an upper limit? ;)
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,427
    Essexit said:

    The Chinese government is probably the most damaging force in the world today - widespread human rights abuses, repression of religious minorities, Hong Kong, Tibet, and now barbaric animal welfare standards causing a viral outbreak and government cover-up delaying a global response. Pointing this out and wanting said government to be held to account is clearly not hating or blaming the ordinary Chinese population and it's daft to claim otherwise.

    Quite so. Bravo.

    Unfortunately, there are some posters on here who are far more interested in virtue-signalling and condemning others on here than taking any action.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,315

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    Or, Sadiq Khan could reverse his stupid tube timetable as the lady suggests. Your refusal to criticise a favoured politician rather silly.
    Does he have enough drivers?
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901

    Jonathan said:

    Somehow we have to avoid the Trumpian blaming foreigners phase.

    No-one's blaming foreigners.
    Hmmm, if you insist. 🥴
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Yes Mike - these are clearly normal times....
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    Or, Sadiq Khan could reverse his stupid tube timetable as the lady suggests. Your refusal to criticise a favoured politician rather silly.
    If you do not want to engage with the reality of why so many people still feel they have no choice but to work, so be it.

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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,651
    When all this is over, those on the green-left will be thinking that if all this can be done to tackle the virus, surely we can do a hell of a lot more to tackle the climate emergency.

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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,749

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a terrible day. It shouldn't have been allowed to get this stage.

    As soon as it became apparent there was a virus epidemic in China and other countries the borders should have been closed completely, with a very strict quarantine regime for people wishing to return to the UK. Other countries should have done the same.

    But @Andy_JS if you look back over your own posts from the last few weeks on the subject you will see that there would have been huge resistance to such a move. Governments should lead but ultimately they govern by consent, especially on something like this where the authorities need widespread cooperation. Could the government have moved faster? Yes, but only by a maximum of a week or so. Even that would have been hugely controversial.
    Which is why better preparation and better communication would have afforded this measure more consent. And saved lives in fact. We are where we are. This is the right step to take.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309
    One runner didn't let the French government's order to remain indoors prevent him from training for a marathon amid the coronavirus pandemic.

    Last week, Elisha Nochomovitz, a 32-year-old furloughed restaurant worker, ran the length of a marathon (26.2 miles) -- on his 23-foot long balcony.

    And he did it in six hours and 48 minutes, a personal record nearly double that of his previous finish time.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    Good to see the lockdown has done nothing to poison the usual urbane atmosphere on here.....

    :/
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    I walked the dog - some cars around, no one on foot - I am not tied up in knots over the need to walk him later again.

    Social distancing will be observed by me and the pup at all times
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    Essexit said:

    The Chinese government is probably the most damaging force in the world today - widespread human rights abuses, repression of religious minorities, Hong Kong, Tibet, and now barbaric animal welfare standards causing a viral outbreak and government cover-up delaying a global response. Pointing this out and wanting said government to be held to account is clearly not hating or blaming the ordinary Chinese population and it's daft to claim otherwise.

    Indeed - but at least in Britain it’s lapdogs are confined to the BBC.
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    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    When all this is over, those on the green-left will be thinking that if all this can be done to tackle the virus, surely we can do a hell of a lot more to tackle the climate emergency.

    How much is this costing the economy again?
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,482

    Essexit said:

    The Chinese government is probably the most damaging force in the world today - widespread human rights abuses, repression of religious minorities, Hong Kong, Tibet, and now barbaric animal welfare standards causing a viral outbreak and government cover-up delaying a global response. Pointing this out and wanting said government to be held to account is clearly not hating or blaming the ordinary Chinese population and it's daft to claim otherwise.

    Quite so. Bravo.

    Unfortunately, there are some posters on here who are far more interested in virtue-signalling and condemning others on here than taking any action.
    But we have to live in the real world. China's national pride is HUGE. Taking a public pop is fine, but the commercial consequences on certain industries need to be fully appreciated. It is the same as the 'special relationship' we've had with America for several decades. In case you hadn't noticed, we don't step out of line there much either.

    I would prefer to channel what will be China's obvious underlying guilt about coronavirus in a more positive way, trying to secure benefits for the UK in so doing.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    How do you know they're not all key workers? You can't tell from just their faces what work people are going to, especially if they're getting changed into uniforms on site and not on the commute (as I know some have been told to do to reduce risk of transmission from transport onto clothes).

    If you slash the frequency of trains you will end up cramming the key workers onto a few trains. Not a smart move!
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    Dura_Ace said:



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
    Ah, I should have added that this crisis will also be exploited by vegans at the other end.
    Much harder to stock up for several months food if you are vegan I would think.
    Chickpea shortage is real - a rare source of zinc for vegans.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,780
    This is far from over, as Salmond made clear on the steps of the court. Key evidence he had been prevented from airing in court would be made public, he said: “At some point, that information, facts and evidence will see the light of day.” His rage and clear thirst for revenge will not be deflected.

    https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2020/03/alex-salmond-trial-sexual-assault-acquitted-snp
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    Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,060

    When all this is over, those on the green-left will be thinking that if all this can be done to tackle the virus, surely we can do a hell of a lot more to tackle the climate emergency.

    Some of it will happen anyway with much less flying in the future I expect. Other green objectives may take more of a battering: single use plastics may see a resurgence for instance.
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    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,043

    malcolmg said:

    IanB2 said:

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    We just might have changed shopping for ever. Can't go down to PCWorld for electrical, but can buy them from Amazon (etc). Cafe's, restaurants might re-open but will many shops?
    Working from home, preference for being out of the city, and shopping online will all endure afterwards.
    And the move to a cashless society is being jet-propelled as people prefer to pay contactless.

    I was looking back at my predictions as to what Covid-19 might do to society from what I thought was ages back. Then realised I only wrote this a fortnight ago:

    https://www7.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2020/03/08/dont-fear-the-reaper-how-covid-19-will-change-us/

    It feels like a lifetime now.
    I think you were wrong on working from home though.

    Everyone I work with has already woken up to its limitations and they can't wait to get back to work.

    I reckon it will make working from home 1-2 days a week more common but the rest of the time people will want (choose) to come into the office.
    I love working at home
    Fair enough. I like it 1-2 days a week (breaks up the commute and means I can focus on output) but not every day.

    The novelty of doing so full time wore off very quickly for all of my team.
    A mix is best. 3 out 2 in for me - but depends on the nature of one’s job.
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:
    If only people without a 'fucking clue' would zip it, Govey wouldn't have to make these clarifications.

    https://twitter.com/WestminsterWAG/status/1241072153228910592?s=20
    Well, it’s true, because he wouldn’t have cocked up in the first place if he’d kept it zipped.
    The kids should stay in one home - it’s the safest approach.

    Divorced parents being selfish shock..
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    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981
    Floater said:

    When all this is over, those on the green-left will be thinking that if all this can be done to tackle the virus, surely we can do a hell of a lot more to tackle the climate emergency.

    How much is this costing the economy again?
    How much has the Earth recovered in just a few weeks? A massive reduction in pollution, in garbage in the oceans, etc. It demonstrates that we can save the planet.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309
    Why do people think China doesn't have self interest in reducing the chances of this happening again?
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,014

    ydoethur said:

    What a disappointment! Just got back from the Waitrose exclusive OAP shopping hour and I wasn't asked for proof of my age

    I’ve never been asked to prove my age for buying anything either.
    I haven’t been asked for ID for over a year.

    But I was pretty flattered last time given I was 36 at the time.
    I wasn’t being asked at less than half that...
    I was last asked a couple of years ago. I replied that if I wasn't old enough to buy wine, the lady who sold it certainly wasn't old enough to do so!
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,060
    https://twitter.com/tamcohen/status/1242370166459191296

    FFS

    I got 2 emails from my local car dealer yesterday.

    The first said they were open for repairs.

    The second said they were not open for repairs after BoZo's statement.

    Now Gove says they should be open.
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    CD13CD13 Posts: 6,351
    I remember being asked for proof of age at a bar in San Diego. I was 53 at the time and with my wife. "Do you really think we're under 21?" I asked.

    The barman said "No, but it's the rules. The young people don't like being discriminated against."

    "Shall we ask them?" I said. "I suspect they'll take our word for it in this case."

    He smiled and backed down.

    Happy lock down day to everyone.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 75,936

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    How do you know they're not all key workers? You can't tell from just their faces what work people are going to, especially if they're getting changed into uniforms on site and not on the commute (as I know some have been told to do to reduce risk of transmission from transport onto clothes).

    If you slash the frequency of trains you will end up cramming the key workers onto a few trains. Not a smart move!
    Why would they all be key workers ?
    There is a large economy that exists outside shops and key workers
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    TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052
    IanB2 said:

    Why do people think China doesn't have self interest in reducing the chances of this happening again?

    They didn’t sort it after SARS ?
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901
    Scott_xP said:

    https://twitter.com/tamcohen/status/1242370166459191296

    FFS

    I got 2 emails from my local car dealer yesterday.

    The first said they were open for repairs.

    The second said they were not open for repairs after BoZo's statement.

    Now Gove says they should be open.

    The comms have been consistently inconsistent.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,482
    Scott_xP said:

    https://twitter.com/tamcohen/status/1242370166459191296

    FFS

    I got 2 emails from my local car dealer yesterday.

    The first said they were open for repairs.

    The second said they were not open for repairs after BoZo's statement.

    Now Gove says they should be open.

    OH MY GOODNESS SOMEBODY CALL ALASTAIR CAMPBELL.
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    Is there a worse journalist on the media than Kay Burley

    Full of her own importance, asking idiotic questions including trying to get Gove to admit hundreds of thousands could die
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,014
    TGOHF666 said:

    Dura_Ace said:



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
    Ah, I should have added that this crisis will also be exploited by vegans at the other end.
    Much harder to stock up for several months food if you are vegan I would think.
    Chickpea shortage is real - a rare source of zinc for vegans.
    Are wine etc shops allowed to open? I've got an order coming but we'll run out before it arrives.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309

    TGOHF666 said:

    Dura_Ace said:



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
    Ah, I should have added that this crisis will also be exploited by vegans at the other end.
    Much harder to stock up for several months food if you are vegan I would think.
    Chickpea shortage is real - a rare source of zinc for vegans.
    Are wine etc shops allowed to open? I've got an order coming but we'll run out before it arrives.
    You have started early in the day!
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    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981

    Grandpa Smithson, I feel your pain.
    It's almost as if baldness and stubble makes a man look old...

    Mr Dancer - are you sure you are shaving correctly? My understanding is that the razor scrapes the chin, neck and cheeks. The top of the head should, however, not be touched.

    :D
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,014
    malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    IanB2 said:

    The interesting bit is not what happens now, but what happens afterwards. It’s hard to see how we go back to where we were domestically and internationally. How the aftermath is handled is what will truly define this government. We are all going to be paying more tax - but who will pay and how much, will services be cut at the same time? What role will the state have in controlling our infrastructure? Internationally, can we still do business with an increasingly crazed Trump presiding over an increasingly divided US, is China a country we can ever trust, will the EU and UK find common cause as they deal with these two challenges, could that see both sides become more realistic as they negotiate an FTA? And so on and so on.
    Currently, the government has very few choices. It is doing what has to be done. Looking at Trump and the other populists, we should be grateful for that, of course. However, once the crisis has past there are going to be huge calls to make where there are plenty of choices. That’s when we’ll find out more.

    We just might have changed shopping for ever. Can't go down to PCWorld for electrical, but can buy them from Amazon (etc). Cafe's, restaurants might re-open but will many shops?
    Working from home, preference for being out of the city, and shopping online will all endure afterwards.
    And the move to a cashless society is being jet-propelled as people prefer to pay contactless.

    I was looking back at my predictions as to what Covid-19 might do to society from what I thought was ages back. Then realised I only wrote this a fortnight ago:

    https://www7.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2020/03/08/dont-fear-the-reaper-how-covid-19-will-change-us/

    It feels like a lifetime now.
    I think you were wrong on working from home though.

    Everyone I work with has already woken up to its limitations and they can't wait to get back to work.

    I reckon it will make working from home 1-2 days a week more common but the rest of the time people will want (choose) to come into the office.
    I love working at home
    Very difficult to do what I did in an office. And we're a long way off warehouse ;picking remotely being the norm.
    And as for farming.......
    For sure OKC, there are many jobs where it is impossible.
    Still, if you can look after Mrs Malc....... Trust she's still making progress.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,651
    BTW, I just Googled 'medico-authoritarianism' and only had one English language hit.

    I wish to nominate it as word of the year.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,937

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    How do you know they're not all key workers? You can't tell from just their faces what work people are going to, especially if they're getting changed into uniforms on site and not on the commute (as I know some have been told to do to reduce risk of transmission from transport onto clothes).

    If you slash the frequency of trains you will end up cramming the key workers onto a few trains. Not a smart move!
    I don’t know. Neither do you. That’s the point. Right now the self-employed and zero hours workers have no choice but to carry on as normal, while a lot of businesses are not yet sure whether they are essential or not. Until there is clarity on these things, people will continue to travel. It could be that Khan did make a mistake in believing such clarity would be provided. It’s clear now, though, that the government must now get involved - either to order, and subsidise, additional transport, or to be much clearer about what is essential and what help will be available to the self-employed and those on zero hours work.

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    Scott_xP said:
    You revel in bad news and hope in a pervese way this will see us re join the EU

    It is over Scott - we have left
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,439
    Pulpstar said:

    Jonathan said:

    Employees have a role to play. Why drag the workforce in right now? It is not BAU.

    The Govts half baked announcement won't trigger force majeure in contracts as currently stated
    Forget half-baked. The real issue is timing. Scheduling announcements for newspaper deadlines means it is too late for people to react.

    If HMG makes an announcement at 8.30 pm, when does Boris think employers will tell their staff they should not come in? Let's see what things look like tomorrow.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,014
    edited March 2020
    IanB2 said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    Dura_Ace said:



    Yes, it will be a hard road and won't change overnight but the world needs to reduce its dependency on China.

    We can't because they have all the money. It's the carnists not the Chinese that are the problem anyway.
    Ah, I should have added that this crisis will also be exploited by vegans at the other end.
    Much harder to stock up for several months food if you are vegan I would think.
    Chickpea shortage is real - a rare source of zinc for vegans.
    Are wine etc shops allowed to open? I've got an order coming but we'll run out before it arrives.
    You have started early in the day!
    Planning, Mr B2, planning.
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    Sports Direct changes its mind: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52011915

    I'm going to spend a decent of chunk of today with my Head of Marketing hat on looking at social media approaches to this crisis. Some companies will enhance their reputation in this. Others couldn't do themselves more harm if they curled one out live on Facebook.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    Pulpstar said:

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    How do you know they're not all key workers? You can't tell from just their faces what work people are going to, especially if they're getting changed into uniforms on site and not on the commute (as I know some have been told to do to reduce risk of transmission from transport onto clothes).

    If you slash the frequency of trains you will end up cramming the key workers onto a few trains. Not a smart move!
    Why would they all be key workers ?
    There is a large economy that exists outside shops and key workers
    Why wouldn't they all be key workers?

    There is a large economy that exists within key workers. Train transport numbers are said to be down 80%, the pictures from the train concorses shows them to be empty - yet the trains are packed. Why are the trains packed when passenger numbers are down 80% and concorses are empty? Possibly because the number of trains made available to those key workers have been slashed.

    Put on the number of trains you'd normally have (subject to availability of train drivers) and trains would be largely empty based on the 80% reduction in passengers. It doesn't help reducing passengers by 80% if you reduce trains by 80% too!
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    JonCisBackJonCisBack Posts: 911
    My work is trying to stay open (research labs, engineering type testing facilities). Lot of people who had been OK with that in the last week (with >>50% of us WFH) are now not OK with that. Suspect we will have to close and frankly i sympathise with the workers.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited March 2020

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    How do you know they're not all key workers? You can't tell from just their faces what work people are going to, especially if they're getting changed into uniforms on site and not on the commute (as I know some have been told to do to reduce risk of transmission from transport onto clothes).

    If you slash the frequency of trains you will end up cramming the key workers onto a few trains. Not a smart move!
    I don’t know. Neither do you. That’s the point. Right now the self-employed and zero hours workers have no choice but to carry on as normal, while a lot of businesses are not yet sure whether they are essential or not. Until there is clarity on these things, people will continue to travel. It could be that Khan did make a mistake in believing such clarity would be provided. It’s clear now, though, that the government must now get involved - either to order, and subsidise, additional transport, or to be much clearer about what is essential and what help will be available to the self-employed and those on zero hours work.

    You're right we don't know, but the passenger numbers are down dramatically and train stations and concorses (where you can make comparisons) are empty. So why aren't trains? Probably because they slashed the numbers of trains available.

    Given overall passenger numbers are down 80% I think its safe to say many non-essential businesses are doing the right thing.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,901

    Scott_xP said:
    You revel in bad news and hope in a pervese way this will see us re join the EU

    It is over Scott - we have left
    Odd post, perhaps says more about you than Scott.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,651
    Scott_xP said:

    https://twitter.com/tamcohen/status/1242370166459191296

    FFS

    I got 2 emails from my local car dealer yesterday.

    The first said they were open for repairs.

    The second said they were not open for repairs after BoZo's statement.

    Now Gove says they should be open.

    My MOT is booked for Monday. I'll report back what happens.
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    Beibheirli_CBeibheirli_C Posts: 7,981

    Is there a worse journalist on the media than Kay Burley

    Full of her own importance, asking idiotic questions including trying to get Gove to admit hundreds of thousands could die

    Perhaps it would help things if Mr Gove stated that hundreds of thousands could die... "That is what we are trying to avoid - stay in your homes..." etc.

    It is handing out half-hearted statements and fuzzy guidance that confuses people.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,014

    BTW, I just Googled 'medico-authoritarianism' and only had one English language hit.

    I wish to nominate it as word of the year.

    There was at one time a debate as to whether doctors had replaced priests as people whose authority was unquestionable.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,439

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    Precisely. It's no good the Government pulling its jackboots on and telling people off.

    These people have no choice.
    TfL should be suspending the Oyster cards of anyone not in a vital industry.
    Yes! Although how does it know? In any case, Oyster cards are so passé; cool Londoners use ordinary contactless credit or debit cards now.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,309

    Pulpstar said:

    This is not good. We are going to need more clarity on what essential working is and on what help will be given to the self-employed and zero hours workers. People getting up this early and heading to work are not metropolitan avocado eaters or good time Charlies. They are people who have no choice currently.

    https://twitter.com/nsmith694/status/1242343836262846470?s=21

    How do you know they're not all key workers? You can't tell from just their faces what work people are going to, especially if they're getting changed into uniforms on site and not on the commute (as I know some have been told to do to reduce risk of transmission from transport onto clothes).

    If you slash the frequency of trains you will end up cramming the key workers onto a few trains. Not a smart move!
    Why would they all be key workers ?
    There is a large economy that exists outside shops and key workers
    Why wouldn't they all be key workers?

    There is a large economy that exists within key workers. Train transport numbers are said to be down 80%, the pictures from the train concorses shows them to be empty - yet the trains are packed. Why are the trains packed when passenger numbers are down 80% and concorses are empty? Possibly because the number of trains made available to those key workers have been slashed.

    Put on the number of trains you'd normally have (subject to availability of train drivers) and trains would be largely empty based on the 80% reduction in passengers. It doesn't help reducing passengers by 80% if you reduce trains by 80% too!
    Timpsons will surely be open; they're all key workers.
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