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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Starmer looks set for victory but the campaign has told us lit

SystemSystem Posts: 12,170
edited February 2020 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Starmer looks set for victory but the campaign has told us little about what he stands for

Ever since the first YouGov LAB membership poll at the end of December there has been little doubt that Sir Keir Starmer was likely to be the winner. The ballot forms of being distributed and are now being returned and you can expect maybe half of them to have arrived within the next week.

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • First! Like Starmer...
  • thus far the campaign has told us little about where Starmer would like to take Labour

    Well, duh! (as young people say) - why do you think he's going to win.....
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    edited February 2020

    thus far the campaign has told us little about where Starmer would like to take Labour

    Well, duh! (as young people say) - why do you think he's going to win.....

    [Ignore this, I misread your post]
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Please, that betting charting is too painful to look at. Have some respect
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    55% of Scots believe a referendum should be held within the next 5 years. (17% now, 23% after Holyrood election, 15% within the next 5 years)

    https://twitter.com/WhatScotsThink/status/1232314228674969601

    The Right Direction/Wrong Direction question is ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING and totally non-intuitive result on the cross tabs.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,729
    edited February 2020

    First! Like Starmer...

    Corbyn came last at PMQ's. absolutely awful.. I didn't even hear, "I have had a letter from X..". or had I fallen asleep by then?
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,405
    edited February 2020

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    Not an issue - at least that's what my new Tory MP has told me twice...

    Of course one of us had read the rules and the other is too busy to let experts and documents to get in the way of opinion.
  • The coronavirus outbreak spreading across Europe has been linked to two Chinese tourists who fell ill with it in Italy in January after flying from Wuhan, where the epidemic began.

    A senior Italian health official investigating the origin of Italy’s outbreak, which has killed 11 and infected over 300 and is now infecting people across the continent, told The Times there was a “concrete hypothesis” that the Chinese couple were the cause.

    “Right now it’s the only certain piece of hard data we have,” said Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team, which is investigating the outbreak.

    Mr Faccini noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/italy-links-coronavirus-outbreak-to-chinese-tourists-p8002005p
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    Are you suggesting that the deal was half baked rather than oven ready?
  • Foxy said:

    Are you suggesting that the deal was half baked rather than oven ready?

    I'm suggesting it's a turkey!
  • TGOHF666TGOHF666 Posts: 2,052

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

  • TGOHF666 said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

    Eh? That's the date it become relevant.
  • EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,958
    Foxy said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    Are you suggesting that the deal was half baked rather than oven ready?
    Surely 'oven ready' implies not baked at all, so half baked would be a greater state of readiness?
  • GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123

    The coronavirus outbreak spreading across Europe has been linked to two Chinese tourists who fell ill with it in Italy in January after flying from Wuhan, where the epidemic began.

    A senior Italian health official investigating the origin of Italy’s outbreak, which has killed 11 and infected over 300 and is now infecting people across the continent, told The Times there was a “concrete hypothesis” that the Chinese couple were the cause.

    “Right now it’s the only certain piece of hard data we have,” said Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team, which is investigating the outbreak.

    Mr Faccini noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/italy-links-coronavirus-outbreak-to-chinese-tourists-p8002005p

    Those flights bringing people into Italy from Wuhan should have never have been allowed to arrive. It was a common opinion 4-5 weeks ago. So what can we learn from it now?
  • On PMQs, that really was a bizarre line of attack by Corbyn. No-one cares that Boris didn't go around doing photo-ops in flood zones; if anything, if they noticed at all, they are pleased he stayed away.

    It's not as though there isn't plenty of other ammunition to use against Boris.
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,052
    Sir Keir defining Starmerism would probably a bit like Randolph Churchill defining his philosophy, Tory Democracy, when asked by a colleague:

    "To tell you the truth, I don't know myself ... but I believe it is principally opportunism".
  • TGOHF666 said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

    Eh? That's the date it become relevant.
    How would the EU enforce compliance?

    I presume by dragging through the ECJ.

    Maybe the UK is gambling that’d take too long so they have some time to work out its compliant operation beyond day one.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,695

    The coronavirus outbreak spreading across Europe has been linked to two Chinese tourists who fell ill with it in Italy in January after flying from Wuhan, where the epidemic began.

    A senior Italian health official investigating the origin of Italy’s outbreak, which has killed 11 and infected over 300 and is now infecting people across the continent, told The Times there was a “concrete hypothesis” that the Chinese couple were the cause.

    “Right now it’s the only certain piece of hard data we have,” said Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team, which is investigating the outbreak.

    Mr Faccini noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/italy-links-coronavirus-outbreak-to-chinese-tourists-p8002005p

    Seems a little tenuous tbh... This couple flew from Wuhan to Milan and went to Parma. But most of the Italian cases have been in towns close to Milan and Parma but not actually in Milan and Parma.

    Surely the truth is multiple carriers have arrived in Italy. Indeed multiple carriers have probably arrived in most countries but there seems to be a long incubation period before sypmptoms appear.

    Wikipedia has a good summary of the Italian outbreak.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_coronavirus_outbreak_in_Italy
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,127
    edited February 2020

    TGOHF666 said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

    Eh? That's the date it become relevant.
    How would the EU enforce compliance?

    I presume by dragging through the ECJ.

    Maybe the UK is gambling that’d take too long so they have some time to work out its compliant operation beyond day one.
    It would be interesting to see the data, but I suspect that NI 'moves' far more stuff to GB than vice versa.

    This is surely the gamble of the NIP - goods going West matters less to NI economy than goods going East.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,695

    The coronavirus outbreak spreading across Europe has been linked to two Chinese tourists who fell ill with it in Italy in January after flying from Wuhan, where the epidemic began.

    A senior Italian health official investigating the origin of Italy’s outbreak, which has killed 11 and infected over 300 and is now infecting people across the continent, told The Times there was a “concrete hypothesis” that the Chinese couple were the cause.

    “Right now it’s the only certain piece of hard data we have,” said Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team, which is investigating the outbreak.

    Mr Faccini noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/italy-links-coronavirus-outbreak-to-chinese-tourists-p8002005p

    Those flights bringing people into Italy from Wuhan should have never have been allowed to arrive. It was a common opinion 4-5 weeks ago. So what can we learn from it now?
    Curious if not surprising that Italy isn't in the top 20 of destinations of international flights from Wuhan:

    https://academic.oup.com/jtm/advance-article/doi/10.1093/jtm/taaa008/5704418
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 2,752
    Alistair said:

    55% of Scots believe a referendum should be held within the next 5 years. (17% now, 23% after Holyrood election, 15% within the next 5 years)

    https://twitter.com/WhatScotsThink/status/1232314228674969601

    The Right Direction/Wrong Direction question is ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING and totally non-intuitive result on the cross tabs.

    Looks like the much-touted "Indy surge" is receding even before it passed the seaweed zone.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    TGOHF666 said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

    Eh? That's the date it become relevant.
    How would the EU enforce compliance?

    I presume by dragging through the ECJ.

    Maybe the UK is gambling that’d take too long so they have some time to work out its compliant operation beyond day one.
    Surely the damage is mostly to our reputation, as a country that doesn't keep its word is unlikely to be sought out in the future?
  • I see the Guardian is reporting the same report (uncritically) as the BBC did yesterday. I’ve still seen precious little evidence of the causation other than the fact it is “likely” caused by austerity, which is a correlation / causation thing.

    https://amp.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/24/austerity-blamed-for-life-expectancy-stalling-for-first-time-in-century?

    I don’t doubt that it’s possible budget reductions might have had an impact on life expectancy. However, some other factors that this report ignores:

    > Record employment (moving people off benefit should lead to both better mental health and increased incomes)
    > Changed attitudes to mental health over the last ten years (better support and recognition of problems)
    > Dietary changes (more sugar and fats in our food and more convenience food)
    > Sedentary lifestyle changes (people glued to their phones and doing less exercise)
    > Higher numbers of marriages and reduced divorces (which you’d think would lead to greater family stability and resilience)

    As far as I can tell the report barely considers any of these factors, which leads to me to believe they’d already reached their conclusions before they’d started it.
  • BF have put up the Super Tuesday races.
  • Foxy said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

    Eh? That's the date it become relevant.
    How would the EU enforce compliance?

    I presume by dragging through the ECJ.

    Maybe the UK is gambling that’d take too long so they have some time to work out its compliant operation beyond day one.
    Surely the damage is mostly to our reputation, as a country that doesn't keep its word is unlikely to be sought out in the future?
    The Withdrawal Agreement is written into UK law so the entire cabinet could be hauled before Lady Hale in leg-irons and manacles if they fail to implement it.
  • Foxy said:

    TGOHF666 said:

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    An issue that will be irrelevant by 31/12/20

    Eh? That's the date it become relevant.
    How would the EU enforce compliance?

    I presume by dragging through the ECJ.

    Maybe the UK is gambling that’d take too long so they have some time to work out its compliant operation beyond day one.
    Surely the damage is mostly to our reputation, as a country that doesn't keep its word is unlikely to be sought out in the future?
    There is that risk but the UK would argue it has interpreted it fairly and would wait for the judgment of the court on what more it had to do.

    It wouldn’t totally abrogate on it.

    Besides which it’s size and scale is still “TBC” in the full FTA negotiations, so I’d expect there’d be some leeway granted going into 2021 anyway.

    Very few people will be able to get ready in 6-8 weeks at the back end of this year, still less the Government.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868

    The coronavirus outbreak spreading across Europe has been linked to two Chinese tourists who fell ill with it in Italy in January after flying from Wuhan, where the epidemic began.

    A senior Italian health official investigating the origin of Italy’s outbreak, which has killed 11 and infected over 300 and is now infecting people across the continent, told The Times there was a “concrete hypothesis” that the Chinese couple were the cause.

    “Right now it’s the only certain piece of hard data we have,” said Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team, which is investigating the outbreak.

    Mr Faccini noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/italy-links-coronavirus-outbreak-to-chinese-tourists-p8002005p

    Those flights bringing people into Italy from Wuhan should have never have been allowed to arrive. It was a common opinion 4-5 weeks ago. So what can we learn from it now?
    Curious if not surprising that Italy isn't in the top 20 of destinations of international flights from Wuhan:

    https://academic.oup.com/jtm/advance-article/doi/10.1093/jtm/taaa008/5704418
    They appear to have pinned it on one Chinese couple who visited Parma early in the year.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,695
    IanB2 said:

    The coronavirus outbreak spreading across Europe has been linked to two Chinese tourists who fell ill with it in Italy in January after flying from Wuhan, where the epidemic began.

    A senior Italian health official investigating the origin of Italy’s outbreak, which has killed 11 and infected over 300 and is now infecting people across the continent, told The Times there was a “concrete hypothesis” that the Chinese couple were the cause.

    “Right now it’s the only certain piece of hard data we have,” said Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team, which is investigating the outbreak.

    Mr Faccini noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/italy-links-coronavirus-outbreak-to-chinese-tourists-p8002005p

    Those flights bringing people into Italy from Wuhan should have never have been allowed to arrive. It was a common opinion 4-5 weeks ago. So what can we learn from it now?
    Curious if not surprising that Italy isn't in the top 20 of destinations of international flights from Wuhan:

    https://academic.oup.com/jtm/advance-article/doi/10.1093/jtm/taaa008/5704418
    They appear to have pinned it on one Chinese couple who visited Parma early in the year.
    Really? According to the Times:

    Marino Faccini, the head of Milan’s infectious diseases team,... noted that the couple — a man aged 66 and his 65 year old wife — visited Parma in Italy during their January visit, taking them close to 10 towns in Lombardy which have been placed in quarantine after hundreds of cases emerged there at the end of last week. Both Chinese tourists are from Wuhan, where the virus first emerged.

    Mr Faccini said the timing of the couple’s visit to Parma after they flew into Milan on January 23 was suspicious, but added, “We know of no contacts yet with people from the towns under lockdown, and possibly never will.”
    [my bold]

    What about all the others who travelled from China to Italy?
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
  • I see the Guardian is reporting the same report (uncritically) as the BBC did yesterday. I’ve still seen precious little evidence of the causation other than the fact it is “likely” caused by austerity, which is a correlation / causation thing.

    https://amp.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/24/austerity-blamed-for-life-expectancy-stalling-for-first-time-in-century?

    I don’t doubt that it’s possible budget reductions might have had an impact on life expectancy. However, some other factors that this report ignores:

    > Record employment (moving people off benefit should lead to both better mental health and increased incomes)
    > Changed attitudes to mental health over the last ten years (better support and recognition of problems)
    > Dietary changes (more sugar and fats in our food and more convenience food)
    > Sedentary lifestyle changes (people glued to their phones and doing less exercise)
    > Higher numbers of marriages and reduced divorces (which you’d think would lead to greater family stability and resilience)

    As far as I can tell the report barely considers any of these factors, which leads to me to believe they’d already reached their conclusions before they’d started it.

    Fun chart for the day. Shows the slow down in extension of life expectancy is not a uk only phenomena.

  • Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.
  • I see the Guardian is reporting the same report (uncritically) as the BBC did yesterday. I’ve still seen precious little evidence of the causation other than the fact it is “likely” caused by austerity, which is a correlation / causation thing.

    https://amp.theguardian.com/society/2020/feb/24/austerity-blamed-for-life-expectancy-stalling-for-first-time-in-century?

    I don’t doubt that it’s possible budget reductions might have had an impact on life expectancy. However, some other factors that this report ignores:

    > Record employment (moving people off benefit should lead to both better mental health and increased incomes)
    > Changed attitudes to mental health over the last ten years (better support and recognition of problems)
    > Dietary changes (more sugar and fats in our food and more convenience food)
    > Sedentary lifestyle changes (people glued to their phones and doing less exercise)
    > Higher numbers of marriages and reduced divorces (which you’d think would lead to greater family stability and resilience)

    As far as I can tell the report barely considers any of these factors, which leads to me to believe they’d already reached their conclusions before they’d started it.

    Fun chart for the day. Shows the slow down in extension of life expectancy is not a uk only phenomena.

    Yes, it might be plateauing anyway.
  • EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,958

    Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    Getting their excuses in early.
  • Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    I told my wife we need to start stocking up. Beans and toilet roll were her key priorities.

    Cross rail - let’s not panic. But panic anyway.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,359

    Alistair said:

    55% of Scots believe a referendum should be held within the next 5 years. (17% now, 23% after Holyrood election, 15% within the next 5 years)

    https://twitter.com/WhatScotsThink/status/1232314228674969601

    The Right Direction/Wrong Direction question is ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING and totally non-intuitive result on the cross tabs.

    Looks like the much-touted "Indy surge" is receding even before it passed the seaweed zone.
    How do you deduce that from these figures then.
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Boris should be fine though. As we've seen with other recent examples, he and Cummings have been superb at reconstructing the thought processes of the British Right, so that they now regard all governmental and legal authority as belonging solely to the PM (rather than parliament, the cabinet, the courts or anything else). It's been an astonishing psychological takeover.
  • Essexit said:

    Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    Getting their excuses in early.
    “Influenza on the line, I repeat, your train is delayed because the driver is dead with influenza on the line”
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,653
    edited February 2020

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.

    I am interested in the idea that reneging on international agreements has no downsides. Why bother with them if that is the case? Should all treaties the UK signs be considered worthless? If so, should we expect anyone to sign any with us?

  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Boris should be fine though. As we've seen with other recent examples, he and Cummings have been superb at reconstructing the thought processes of the British Right, so that they now regard all governmental and legal authority as belonging solely to the PM (rather than parliament, the cabinet, the courts or anything else). It's been an astonishing psychological takeover.

    If there are no consequences, I totally agree. I suspect there may be, though.

  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,482
    Fpt
    Charles said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Alistair said:

    ydoethur said:

    Gabs3 said:

    Why is no-one talking about the anti-Muslim pogroms in India right now? Police standing by while innocent victims are beaten. This could easily spiral into genocide.

    I’m afraid the honest answer is probably because the British media has little or no interest in India. I only found out about it a few minutes ago, after three days. It certainly sounds extremely grim.
    The anti Muslim Modi mobs have going on for months now.
    I don’t know why but anyway I meet from Bombay calls it Bombay, not Mumbai.

    I’m up for that because I much prefer calling it Bombay as an English speaker anyway, we don’t call Vienna “Wien”, for example.

    I’m not sure if it means anything.
    I don’t think I’ve ever had a Chicken Chennai for dinner.

    The Indians all use use old names, even Mumbai airport is still BOM on your ticket.
    That doesn't mean much, Ho Chin Min City is still SGN too.

    Nobody calls Harare "Salisbury" any more.
    I do. Rhodesia never dies.
    That’s a bit weird, even in jest

    It’s a matter of courtesy. If the government of somewhere changes its name then it’s polite to follow.

    Hence Beijing, Mumbai, Derry etc
    They haven't changed their names (London/Derry excepted) - the names are the same. Beijing for Peking, Mumbai for Bombay, Kolkata for Calcutta, are just ham-fisted attempts to get 'closer' phonetically to the native pronunciation. In some cases it's not even much closer. I believe the Chinese pronunciation of their capital city is about equidistant between Peking and Beijing.
  • Remember what I was saying about Gilead on here a couple of days ago ...
    https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/24/investing/gilead-sciences-coronavirus-who-remdesivir/index.html
  • Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    I told my wife we need to start stocking up. Beans and toilet roll were her key priorities.

    Cross rail - let’s not panic. But panic anyway.
    It’s caused some jaws to drop there.

    I stocked up for 2-3 weeks about a fortnight ago.

    Not for a siege but just because I’m assuming a peak interruption to supply chains at some point (we know this thing peaks over a 2-3 month period, and then drops).
  • Essexit said:

    Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    Getting their excuses in early.
    No it’s serious.

    It’s one of our two primary management buildings.

    Everyone has been sent home.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,405

    Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    That's the excuse for the next delay sorted.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    I told my wife we need to start stocking up. Beans and toilet roll were her key priorities.

    Cross rail - let’s not panic. But panic anyway.
    It’s caused some jaws to drop there.

    I stocked up for 2-3 weeks about a fortnight ago.

    Not for a siege but just because I’m assuming a peak interruption to supply chains at some point (we know this thing peaks over a 2-3 month period, and then drops).
    Was at a hospital in Torrevieja, costa Blanca where the emergency department admissions staff were in masks as were the porters and cleaners.
  • Trump gearing up to declare the virus is a hoax?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,385

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 2,752
    malcolmg said:

    Alistair said:

    55% of Scots believe a referendum should be held within the next 5 years. (17% now, 23% after Holyrood election, 15% within the next 5 years)

    https://twitter.com/WhatScotsThink/status/1232314228674969601

    The Right Direction/Wrong Direction question is ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING and totally non-intuitive result on the cross tabs.

    Looks like the much-touted "Indy surge" is receding even before it passed the seaweed zone.
    How do you deduce that from these figures then.
    Well, No is ahead of Yes, albeit by just one point. That was after a few polls which had Yes ahead by one or two points.

    There was some talk at the time of this representing a "tipping point" following which Yes would surge further ahead.

    Probably too early to say but talk of a surge, and there was some, appears to be premature.

    (Another theory is that the move to Yes was a Brexit blip caused by our departure from the EU, and that things would fall back to the prevailing narrow No lead. This poll seems to support that contention but, as I say, too early to tell).

  • glwglw Posts: 9,908
    He doesn't care about the health impact, he only cares about the stock markets because he's always banging on about how great "everyone's" 401(k) is doing because of the markets, if he can even take any credit for that. If the stock markets tank his boasts will look pathetic. Of course back on planet Earth most people are going to be more worried about the health effects.
  • BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 2,752
    glw said:

    He doesn't care about the health impact, he only cares about the stock markets because he's always banging on about how great "everyone's" 401(k) is doing because of the markets, if he can even take any credit for that. If the stock markets tank his boasts will look pathetic. Of course back on planet Earth most people are going to be more worried about the health effects.
    What he cares about is banging the "America is Great" drum, regardless. This is smart as it means anyone who dissents (ie, Democrats) appear lacking in the patriotic mojos. This is what Trump is all about. He wants everyone to see him as Mr America.
  • Ireland v Italy postponed.

    I think Italy v England will also be postponed.
  • Mr. Eagles, Six Nations curtailed, perhaps?
  • “Sue, you’re shouting at tea” lol
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,359

    malcolmg said:

    Alistair said:

    55% of Scots believe a referendum should be held within the next 5 years. (17% now, 23% after Holyrood election, 15% within the next 5 years)

    https://twitter.com/WhatScotsThink/status/1232314228674969601

    The Right Direction/Wrong Direction question is ABSOLUTELY FASCINATING and totally non-intuitive result on the cross tabs.

    Looks like the much-touted "Indy surge" is receding even before it passed the seaweed zone.
    How do you deduce that from these figures then.
    Well, No is ahead of Yes, albeit by just one point. That was after a few polls which had Yes ahead by one or two points.

    There was some talk at the time of this representing a "tipping point" following which Yes would surge further ahead.

    Probably too early to say but talk of a surge, and there was some, appears to be premature.

    (Another theory is that the move to Yes was a Brexit blip caused by our departure from the EU, and that things would fall back to the prevailing narrow No lead. This poll seems to support that contention but, as I say, too early to tell).

    I did not see much talk of any expected surge, that will only happen when campaigning starts or longer term as Westminster continue to crap on Scotland. Once the disaster that is Brexit, immigration , and the subjugation of the little devolved powers there are peak you are likely to see more change. Also given 70% of young people want it and the old staunch dyed in the wool unionists are popping off will also mean an uptick for certain.
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
    It is not a war. We are just no longer in any kind of restriction. We are freer to act. We would much much prefer to be in a close trading relationship with our nearest competitors. But if that is not to be the case, then regulatory alignment will be dropped day after WA.
  • Mr. Eagles, Six Nations curtailed, perhaps?

    I think they'll go for the 2001 foot and mouth approach.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    Ireland v Italy postponed.

    I think Italy v England will also be postponed.

    I guess they will just allocate Ireland and England a 36-3 victory?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    Mr. Eagles, Six Nations curtailed, perhaps?

    I think they'll go for the 2001 foot and mouth approach.
    Steady on, mass slaughter and outdoor pyres of all contacts seems a little over the top.
  • Mr. Eagles, Six Nations curtailed, perhaps?

    I think they'll go for the 2001 foot and mouth approach.
    Hope they are not planning on burying 1/2 million dead bodies in Great Orton like last time,
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Cheltenham Festival to go ahead is 1.46 on Betfair
  • Just as happened with the political leaders of Wuhan, his complacency could really come back to bite him when it reaches the US in force.
  • Foxy said:

    Mr. Eagles, Six Nations curtailed, perhaps?

    I think they'll go for the 2001 foot and mouth approach.
    Steady on, mass slaughter and outdoor pyres of all contacts seems a little over the top.
    “I’m sorry, at least one person in your area has been confirmed as infected. It means we need to, as a precautionary measure ‘clean’ all those who might be in contact. Yes. Just step in to the back of the bus with blacked out windows. Don’t mind the soldiers wearing masks and holding machine guns. Toiletries? Oh now you won’t be needing them where you are going. I mean. Everything will be provided. Just get onto the bus”
  • GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    Presumably the rugby has been postponed and not played behind closed doors because there would be a significant proportion who would fly out there anyway and watch it in the pub.
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
    It is not a war. We are just no longer in any kind of restriction. We are freer to act. We would much much prefer to be in a close trading relationship with our nearest competitors. But if that is not to be the case, then regulatory alignment will be dropped day after WA.
    The Withdrawal Agreement is embedded in UK law. That cannot just be dropped if the government fancies it.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,482

    Just as happened with the political leaders of Wuhan, his complacency could really come back to bite him when it reaches the US in force.
    Actually, I think Trump has this wholly right for a change. Take all necessary steps but be positive.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    Fishing said:

    Sir Keir defining Starmerism would probably a bit like Randolph Churchill defining his philosophy, Tory Democracy, when asked by a colleague:

    "To tell you the truth, I don't know myself ... but I believe it is principally opportunism".

    Labour supporters must hope so. In this country, naked political opportunism spells 80 seat majorities.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,385

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
    It is not a war. We are just no longer in any kind of restriction. We are freer to act. We would much much prefer to be in a close trading relationship with our nearest competitors. But if that is not to be the case, then regulatory alignment will be dropped day after WA.
    Quite mad!
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Presumably the rugby has been postponed and not played behind closed doors because there would be a significant proportion who would fly out there anyway and watch it in the pub.


    Juve playing in Lyon tonight

    https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00551-1
  • glw said:

    He doesn't care about the health impact, he only cares about the stock markets because he's always banging on about how great "everyone's" 401(k) is doing because of the markets, if he can even take any credit for that. If the stock markets tank his boasts will look pathetic. Of course back on planet Earth most people are going to be more worried about the health effects.
    Trump's language there though will make it harder for him to act later, if necessary - though it is true that consistency has never been his strong suit.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    kinabalu said:

    Fishing said:

    Sir Keir defining Starmerism would probably a bit like Randolph Churchill defining his philosophy, Tory Democracy, when asked by a colleague:

    "To tell you the truth, I don't know myself ... but I believe it is principally opportunism".

    Labour supporters must hope so. In this country, naked political opportunism spells 80 seat majorities.
    Surely they would be dismayed? They love thinking they have the moral high ground
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
    It is not a war. We are just no longer in any kind of restriction. We are freer to act. We would much much prefer to be in a close trading relationship with our nearest competitors. But if that is not to be the case, then regulatory alignment will be dropped day after WA.
    The Withdrawal Agreement is embedded in UK law. That cannot just be dropped if the government fancies it.
    Day after WA, gvt creates new law to ban live export of animals. Done. Alignment ended. It would sail through both houses.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,695

    Ireland v Italy postponed.

    I think Italy v England will also be postponed.

    So long as England v Wales still goes ahead - I've got tickets.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,709

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
    It is not a war. We are just no longer in any kind of restriction. We are freer to act. We would much much prefer to be in a close trading relationship with our nearest competitors. But if that is not to be the case, then regulatory alignment will be dropped day after WA.
    The Withdrawal Agreement is embedded in UK law. That cannot just be dropped if the government fancies it.
    Day after WA, gvt creates new law to ban live export of animals. Done. Alignment ended. It would sail through both houses.
    So it would be illegal to transport a cow from Newry to Dundalk but not John o'Groats to Land's End?
  • Just as happened with the political leaders of Wuhan, his complacency could really come back to bite him when it reaches the US in force.
    Whereas in our country it is the irresponsible right wing tabloids that are whipping up the panic. The front pages of Express and Mail today are utterly inexcusable. At some point they will tie the EU or Princess Diana into the story no doubt!
  • Ireland v Italy postponed.

    I think Italy v England will also be postponed.

    So long as England v Wales still goes ahead - I've got tickets.
    looks like poor old France will be denied a proper Grand Slam by a mutant variant of the common cold
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    US new home sales today strongest since 2007,. might give markets a bit of a floor for a while...

  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    Yes, it might be plateauing anyway.

    It might be. And no doubt there are multiple factors contributing to recent falls. However it does seem overwhelmingly likely that Austerity is one of them. In which case there is a respectable argument to be made that many thousands of impoverished people have been quite literally sacrificed by David Cameron and George Osborne in order to pay the bills run up by feckless capitalist speculators. It's not a pleasant thought, I know, especially if one voted for them, but it has to be at the very least contemplated.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,385

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Boris should be fine though. As we've seen with other recent examples, he and Cummings have been superb at reconstructing the thought processes of the British Right, so that they now regard all governmental and legal authority as belonging solely to the PM (rather than parliament, the cabinet, the courts or anything else). It's been an astonishing psychological takeover.
    This worries me. If the precedent is set by a lovely cuddly, trustworthy, competent PM like Boris sidelining Parliament and the Courts, there will be no counter argument when son of Corbyn becomes PM.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,405

    O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Boris should be fine though. As we've seen with other recent examples, he and Cummings have been superb at reconstructing the thought processes of the British Right, so that they now regard all governmental and legal authority as belonging solely to the PM (rather than parliament, the cabinet, the courts or anything else). It's been an astonishing psychological takeover.
    This worries me. If the precedent is set by a lovely cuddly, trustworthy, competent PM like Boris sidelining Parliament and the Courts, there will be no counter argument when son of Corbyn becomes PM.
    Correct and it will be too late by then.
  • O/T: A very useful thread on what the Northern Ireland protocol actually means in practice:

    https://twitter.com/GeorgePeretzQC/status/1232583519811055618

    In a nutshell, it's a bureaucratic nightmare, which will affect even small businesses in NI. In fact it looks completely unworkable. Trouble ahead, I think.

    It seems pretty clear the governmet is intending to ignore the provisons of the WA and that Suella Braverman has been brought in as AG to give legal cover to that. Where that leads to remains to be seen, but it's hard to see an upside for the UK.

    Hard to see a downside. The integrity of the eu single market is the EU’s problem. More of a headache for them now. We have psychologically made the leap. We are out. We are not beholden, there’s absolutely no chance of us returning any time soon.

    If Canada no tariffs, and reduced non tariff barriers is not an option. Let them build their infrastructure at the border. Our commitment is to maintain existing regulatory alignment. A very generous offer. The era of vast extended global supply chains working on ‘just in time’ is likely to be collapsing around our ears right now.
    Really? The assumption that the UK acted in good faith to ensure the terms of the GFA was flawed, because we only agreed to get the WA over the line with the attached conditions as a political expedient for Boris to look good to the electorate.

    And you think the EU are going to be unreasonable over the trade negotiation. I can't think why.

    So many Brexiteers still fighting the war we all assumed they had already won.
    It is not a war. We are just no longer in any kind of restriction. We are freer to act. We would much much prefer to be in a close trading relationship with our nearest competitors. But if that is not to be the case, then regulatory alignment will be dropped day after WA.
    The Withdrawal Agreement is embedded in UK law. That cannot just be dropped if the government fancies it.
    Day after WA, gvt creates new law to ban live export of animals. Done. Alignment ended. It would sail through both houses.
    That's barely coherent. But if you think a Bill to breach the WA would "sail through both Houses", I think you're very mistaken.

    That said, I don't see why the UK legislating to restrict UK businesses from doing business would be in breach of the WA anyway?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    eadric said:

    Just had an email from Crossrail.

    Suspected case of coronavirus in one of the site offices. Unconfirmed.

    I told my wife we need to start stocking up. Beans and toilet roll were her key priorities.

    Cross rail - let’s not panic. But panic anyway.
    It’s caused some jaws to drop there.

    I stocked up for 2-3 weeks about a fortnight ago.

    Not for a siege but just because I’m assuming a peak interruption to supply chains at some point (we know this thing peaks over a 2-3 month period, and then drops).
    We don’t know anything of the sort. Unfortunately. We can reasonably hope, based on the fragmentary evidence out of Wuhan. But we cannot know. That’s one of the big problems.

    We still don’t know the basic mortality rate. Or the true incubation period. Or why it sometimes seems to return, and worsen. We don’t know if a case grants immunity, or if it does, how long. We don’t know where it came from. We don’t know exactly how it spreads - there’s clearly an aerosol route but some doctors think fecal-oral as well.

    We don’t know.
    It probably doesn’t like warmer weather. Which, in the medium term, is a very good thing.
  • GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    eadric said:

    Ireland v Italy postponed.

    I think Italy v England will also be postponed.

    So long as England v Wales still goes ahead - I've got tickets.
    I hope you’re right, but I fear they are now gonna start cancelling big ticket items. The F1 season is in severe jeopardy. Likewise the euros. And the Olympics.
    Meh. Close it all down NOW.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Gen X are maybe twigging that racking up an enormous debt to gain a humanities degree might not be the way to go.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    isam said:

    Surely they would be dismayed? They love thinking they have the moral high ground

    A very good point. Certainly I would rather lose with my purity intact than win ugly. But all is relative and with the oppo being "Boris" I think we can sink pretty low and yet retain that moral high ground.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,218
    I think this is a rare political misstep from President Trump.

    Because if anything bad does happen in the US, it can be blamed on him not taking it seriously. And healthcare is also a subject matter that President Trump would be well advised to stay as far away from as possible, because it's the only area where the Democrats have consistent and commanding poll leads.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,065

    glw said:

    He doesn't care about the health impact, he only cares about the stock markets because he's always banging on about how great "everyone's" 401(k) is doing because of the markets, if he can even take any credit for that. If the stock markets tank his boasts will look pathetic. Of course back on planet Earth most people are going to be more worried about the health effects.
    Trump's language there though will make it harder for him to act later, if necessary - though it is true that consistency has never been his strong suit.
    In October he'll be claiming that was his intervention that smashed the US-CoronaCrisis with only 1000 new cases in September. If Bolshie Bernie introduces his commie health system the incompetent doctors would be smearing the virus all over the country.
  • GideonWiseGideonWise Posts: 1,123
    eadric said:
    A real problem when you need evidence-based policy and you have a group of people in charge who are actively anti-science.

    But I'm sure the American civil service will be preparing hard. Just a shame they are ruled by absolute fools, starting right at the top.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,868
    rcs1000 said:

    I think this is a rare political misstep from President Trump.

    Because if anything bad does happen in the US, it can be blamed on him not taking it seriously. And healthcare is also a subject matter that President Trump would be well advised to stay as far away from as possible, because it's the only area where the Democrats have consistent and commanding poll leads.
    Yep. 53 confirmed US cases already, and surely many more not wanting to contact their healthcare system for fear of multi-thousand-$ bills, there must be more bad news from the US to come.

    All those Americans posting questions on travel forums along the lines of “will Rome be safe in April” will soon be worrying about staying at home. Until summer arrives, at least.
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,065

    Gen X are maybe twigging that racking up an enormous debt to gain a humanities degree might not be the way to go.
    Eh Gen X went to uni for the last years of tuition free education.
  • kinabalu said:

    Yes, it might be plateauing anyway.

    It might be. And no doubt there are multiple factors contributing to recent falls. However it does seem overwhelmingly likely that Austerity is one of them. In which case there is a respectable argument to be made that many thousands of impoverished people have been quite literally sacrificed by David Cameron and George Osborne in order to pay the bills run up by feckless capitalist speculators. It's not a pleasant thought, I know, especially if one voted for them, but it has to be at the very least contemplated.
    It wasn't just "feckless capitalist speculators" though.

    Real world demand for ordinary Jo people to be able to buy things they didn't have the money for - and, relatedly, for governments to sign off market behaviour that enabled that, was just as much a driver.

    Certainly, banks wanted to make profits, as did traders and so on - but at the bottom of it all were real people who also wanted to live a lifestyle they couldn't afford.
  • contrariancontrarian Posts: 5,818
    Dow has managed a 400 point bounce in early trading...
  • kinabalu said:

    Yes, it might be plateauing anyway.

    It might be. And no doubt there are multiple factors contributing to recent falls. However it does seem overwhelmingly likely that Austerity is one of them. In which case there is a respectable argument to be made that many thousands of impoverished people have been quite literally sacrificed by David Cameron and George Osborne in order to pay the bills run up by feckless capitalist speculators. It's not a pleasant thought, I know, especially if one voted for them, but it has to be at the very least contemplated.
    Remind me which party bailed out the banks to the tune of billions? I'm fairly certain it wasn't a party that had George Osborne CH and David Cameron (pbuh) as members.
This discussion has been closed.