I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
Without prejudice to whether it's a good decision or not, it is a meaningful change if the Chancellor can no longer direct advisors to formulate political policy, and is kind of stuck as boss of a permanent secretary doing day-to-day implementation of existing policy very indirectly.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
A highly talented individual who is not going to be allowed to have opinions. Number 10 has decided it is going to take over the Treasury.
Why shouldn't the First Lord of the Treasury be responsible for the Treasury?
So juvenile.
Not really. Its a serious point.
The Treasury is so powerful because it funds everything the government does. The First Lord of the Treasury became the Prime Minister for a reason and go back far enough and the First Lord of the Treasury had the same role as what we call the Chancellor today.
The two co-ordinating together seems to me to be common sense.
Perhaps the reason the Chancellor position was hived off to begin with was because the Prime Minister has other things to do than look at spreadsheets.
But no I guess your point that “but look at his job title” trumps everything.
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
How am I whinging or moaning? Just remarking the fact that if the government loses it's Chancellor after just two months, things might not be quite 100% tickety-boo.
Things are bloody tickety-boo. That's why he booted out the overrated and disloyal Sajid Javid.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
Whilst meanly expressed, this is an important point. I frequently observe that PB has no memory, and people have been so used to the fragile politics of the 2010's they find it difficult to comprehend the new reality. I think people will continue to be surprised and shocked for some time, when they really shouldn't be given the size of the majority.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
There is no beast around the cabinet table with the authority to challenge bad decisions or ideas from the mind of Cummings.
Which is what you'd love but why the fuck should Gov't be run that way?
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
If Blair had been this decisive he would have moved/sacked Brown in 2003 after the election. Many of the problems with the Treasury come from that period. A bizarre desire to fight turf wars with No 10 that they cannot win, an arrogance and expectation that they would fill the top ranks of the Civil Service, the right to be a government within a government. It was not such a problem with Cameron and Osborne but only because Cameron gave Osborne almost unlimited slack to do what he or the Treasury wanted. Hammond and May had similar problems as we got back to normal.
The Treasury cannot be a government within a government. It is there to facilitate government as well as to explain the limits of the possible. The concern is that those limits will be less evident if the support team are focused on No 10's short term political advantage. We shall see.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
A highly talented individual who is not going to be allowed to have opinions. Number 10 has decided it is going to take over the Treasury.
Why shouldn't the First Lord of the Treasury be responsible for the Treasury?
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
He's been picked purely due to his willingness to acquiesce to be a front man for Classic Dom.
Sorry about Julian Smith though. He was one of the very few competents in Johnson's cabinet. It was why he was sacked, it seems.
Erm I'm sorry but he really wasn't. Julian may be a decent bloke but if you ask anyone close to the events he had terrible people skills, not only routinely forgetting people's names but an incapacity to engage with people in any social skills sense. Quite extraordinary in a Chief Whip. Less damaging in a NI Secretary. But, really, not up to the level Johnson-Cummings now want.
Well he was more successful than the previous six or so NI Secretaries.
I don't agree. His CV is pretty darned impressive. Good early life background, business stock, Head Boy at Winchester, First Class degreee Lincoln College Oxford, Fulbright Scholar and success in the city.
He's the first properly talented Conservative in a generation.
Mmm, that is one talented Oxbridge PPE public schoolboy City Hedge Fund manager right there.
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
How am I whinging or moaning? Just remarking the fact that if the government loses it's Chancellor after just two months, things might not be quite 100% tickety-boo.
Things are bloody tickety-boo. That's why he booted out the overrated and disloyal Sajid Javid.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
You can look it 2 ways.
If the new cabinet delivers then 5 years from now no-one will care about this reshuffle.
On the other hand if the cabinet doesn't deliver and the Government runs into the sand then this will look like hubris.
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
Whilst meanly expressed, this is an important point.
Apologies for being a little mean. I'm frustrated with my colleagues who can't accept the result of either 1. The EU Referendum or 2. The General Election.
It has happened. We lost. They won. Handsomely. The new paradigm isn't going to shift by constant carping.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
How am I whinging or moaning? Just remarking the fact that if the government loses it's Chancellor after just two months, things might not be quite 100% tickety-boo.
Things are bloody tickety-boo. That's why he booted out the overrated and disloyal Sajid Javid.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
It does seem that Johnson/Cummings are taking 'decisive' actions for the sake of being decisive and spending billions of pounds doing so. Some actions may be right, some may be wrong, but they don't give the impression of being thought through (except in a political wargamed sense). We seem to have a PM who is more of a Trump than an Obama. Two years in, with Starmer as Labour leader and a new LibDem leader should see some of the chickens coming home to roost.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
A highly talented individual who is not going to be allowed to have opinions. Number 10 has decided it is going to take over the Treasury.
Why shouldn't the First Lord of the Treasury be responsible for the Treasury?
So juvenile.
Not really. Its a serious point.
The Treasury is so powerful because it funds everything the government does. The First Lord of the Treasury became the Prime Minister for a reason and go back far enough and the First Lord of the Treasury had the same role as what we call the Chancellor today.
The two co-ordinating together seems to me to be common sense.
Perhaps the reason the Chancellor position was hived off to begin with was because the Prime Minister has other things to do than look at spreadsheets.
But no I guess your point that “but look at his job title” trumps everything.
Indeed he does have other things to do and will continue to have other things to do. The Chancellor can continue to do the spreadsheets, with his team.
But having spads co-ordinated between the two seems sane.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
Without prejudice to whether it's a good decision or not, it is a meaningful change if the Chancellor can no longer direct advisors to formulate political policy, and is kind of stuck as boss of a permanent secretary doing day-to-day implementation of existing policy very indirectly.
We will see, but it seems possible that Sunak remains effectively Chief Secretary to the Treasury, and Cummins de facto Chancellor.
Of course that might not be the case, and Sunak might develop an independent power base. Time will tell.
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
I haven't been whingeing or moaning at all. This is entirely consistent with Boris Johnson's ways of working. He will reward the supine, sack the insufficiently supine and gather power to himself. Competence is not a relevant consideration.
It will make for poor government making bad decisions, but I'd already priced all of that in.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
There is no beast around the cabinet table with the authority to challenge bad decisions or ideas from the mind of Cummings.
Which is what you'd love but why the fuck should Gov't be run that way?
They won a majority. We lost. Get over it.
You’re in a weird mood. Didn’t have you down as a fan of Cummings. Perfectly valid for oppositions to criticise governments, express concern, and offer helpful advice when they run into trouble like they did today.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
Things are bloody tickety-boo. That's why he booted out the overrated and disloyal Sajid Javid.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
You are on the Left in the same way that if only we could get a hold of the Moon and slice a little wedge off, it would grace a Ploughman's.
@Mysticrose The Tories won handsomely but a large part of the electoral coalition were remainer-Conservatives sticking with the party for fear of Corbyn. Corbyn is off to be replaced by the definitely not as scary Starmer and this tilts the field towards the possibility of leaving the EU without a trade deal more than it was previously a chance.
I've just checked my Ladbrokes account. I had a £20 pound bet on Sunak and the 200/1 being offered was boosted to 250/1. So that's £5000 possible winnings.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
There is no beast around the cabinet table with the authority to challenge bad decisions or ideas from the mind of Cummings.
Which is what you'd love but why the fuck should Gov't be run that way?
They won a majority. We lost. Get over it.
Boris is implementing Labour policies, from nationalising the railways, through massive infrastructure investment, right down to sacking his Chancellor. It surely can't be a coincidence that Dom spent those mystery years in Russia and Rishi Sunak went to the same school as Seamus Milne. #winningtheargument #butnotthebloodyelection
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
There is no beast around the cabinet table with the authority to challenge bad decisions or ideas from the mind of Cummings.
Which is what you'd love but why the fuck should Gov't be run that way?
They won a majority. We lost. Get over it.
Your posts are refreshingly honest amongst a sea of posters who ever since brexit - never mind the election - have made vinegar seem like sweet lemonade amidst their bile reflections. Nice to see a grown up on the site.
Re: the “football club” analogy. “Troubleshooter on a short term brief to avoid relegation” is usually quite a specific skill set. Owners who then back said manager with cash and long contracts usually come to regret it. Happy to accept counter examples!
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
I haven't been whingeing or moaning at all. This is entirely consistent with Boris Johnson's ways of working. He will reward the supine, sack the insufficiently supine and gather power to himself. Competence is not a relevant consideration.
It will make for poor government making bad decisions, but I'd already priced all of that in.
Quite. Claims that there's nothing to see here are wide of the mark. It is an innovation the consequences of which are for now uncertain, even if there are strong indications... "The chancellor said no self-respecting minister would accept those terms."...
...a reporter shouts: "Are you going to be the prime minister's puppet?"
Perhaps unsurprisingly, the new chancellor doesn't respond.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Part of this could be to convince the EU that Boris means business. Yes WTO has become a discernible probability given the noises coming from Barnier et al.
I've just checked my Ladbrokes account. I had a £20 pound bet on Sunak and the 200/1 being offered was boosted to 250/1. So that's £5000 possible winnings.
I'm in the same situation.
Is there any way to 'cash out' the profit? I'm assuming laying on Betfair would mean putting cash in to lay (since I'm not in the market yet). Is there any way to take the profit without tying up cash on Betfair?
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
Dom needs Boris. Its one thing they have in common. The litany of those who thought Boris needed them is long but, alas, largely forgotten.
Boris should go for broke and replace the Lords of the Treasury with himself as Lord Treasurer. Putting the Treasury into Commission was a worthy experiment in 1714, but I think its trial period should now end.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
A highly talented individual who is not going to be allowed to have opinions. Number 10 has decided it is going to take over the Treasury.
I had always thought that the PM was First Lord of the Treasury, no. How, then, is No. 10 taking over, given Treasury was always under its mantle?
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
But most political talent is also smoke and mirrors?
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I’ve considered WTO a racing certainty ever since March last year when the May deal failed to get through. It’ll be badged as an Australia-like deal for those too stupid or ignorant to understand the reality but since Australia trades with the EU on a WTO basis, it’ll be a crash out deal on 1.1.2021 with tariffs and barriers and bureaucracy.
We’ve just got a bit more time to prepare for it, that’s all.
Let’s hope we don’t need to import any medicines to deal with Coronavirus next winter, eh!
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
A highly talented individual who is not going to be allowed to have opinions. Number 10 has decided it is going to take over the Treasury.
I had always thought that the PM was First Lord of the Treasury, no. How, then, is No. 10 taking over, given Treasury was always under its mantle?
The last person to try that was Gladstone. That did not end very well.
Things are bloody tickety-boo. That's why he booted out the overrated and disloyal Sajid Javid.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
You are on the Left in the same way that if only we could get a hold of the Moon and slice a little wedge off, it would grace a Ploughman's.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
What did Hammond, Osborn, Darling or Brown know about Western Cumbria? Should only Tim Farron or Rory Stewart be considered for the role of Chancellor? He was robotic in the debates but surely that was exactly what was asked of him, Amber Rudd offered the same in 2017.I suspect Sunak's outlook aligns more with the PM than Javid's does and he will be easier to control, however Javid was critical of Boris in his failed leadership bid, his pro EU adviser was sacked for 'leaking' and he's overseen the HS2 flipflop so he is certainly not irreplaceable.
Having said all that I think and hope he returns to the cabinet at some point down the line, but much like Raab and Patel I question whether he is deserving of one of the big jobs.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I’ve considered WTO a racing certainty ever since March last year when the May deal failed to get through. It’ll be badged as an Australia-like deal for those too stupid or ignorant to understand the reality but since Australia trades with the EU on a WTO basis, it’ll be a crash out deal on 1.1.2021 with tariffs and barriers and bureaucracy.
We’ve just got a bit more time to prepare for it, that’s all.
Let’s hope we don’t need to import any medicines to deal with Coronavirus next winter, eh!
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
How am I whinging or moaning? Just remarking the fact that if the government loses it's Chancellor after just two months, things might not be quite 100% tickety-boo.
Things are bloody tickety-boo. That's why he booted out the overrated and disloyal Sajid Javid.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
You can look it 2 ways.
If the new cabinet delivers then 5 years from now no-one will care about this reshuffle.
On the other hand if the cabinet doesn't deliver and the Government runs into the sand then this will look like hubris.
The risk to Johnson is that he is seen as Cummings hostage. Anything that goes wrong now will be blamed on him.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I’ve considered WTO a racing certainty ever since March last year when the May deal failed to get through. It’ll be badged as an Australia-like deal for those too stupid or ignorant to understand the reality but since Australia trades with the EU on a WTO basis, it’ll be a crash out deal on 1.1.2021 with tariffs and barriers and bureaucracy.
We’ve just got a bit more time to prepare for it, that’s all.
Let’s hope we don’t need to import any medicines to deal with Coronavirus next winter, eh!
Wuhan is an important area for pharmaceutical production, we may have some difficult shortages fairly shortly.
I think Coronavirus will be over by WTO time, more likely to hit over the summer, if not sooner.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
But most political talent is also smoke and mirrors?
Not real talent, no. Thatcher had real talent, for instance.
There are lots of people in the City making money. Some are talented; far more are pretty average and simply lucky to be in the right place at the right time. A considerable number are utterly dreadful but have done the requisite amount of arse licking.
Being a good hedge fund manager or whatever Sunak was tells you nothing about his political skills and his very privileged background working with equally privileged rich people like him does not obviously suggest someone who is going to understand the sorts of issues and concerns of the Tory party’s new constituency.
If the Tories think that all Northern voters want or need is some tarted up leisure centres with the promise of a train service in a few years time - under the guise of “infrastructure” spending, they’re heading for an - eventual - fall.
I wonder whether the SNP's Treasury spokesman going on the day of the Scottish Budget encouraged the Government to push out Javid?
Yes its 4 weeks from a budget so in normal circumstances the Chancellor would never be pushed out - but the thought may have been that if the SNP can cope with their Chancellor going on the day of the budget itself, then he can cope with his going 4 weeks before it.
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I’ve considered WTO a racing certainty ever since March last year when the May deal failed to get through. It’ll be badged as an Australia-like deal for those too stupid or ignorant to understand the reality but since Australia trades with the EU on a WTO basis, it’ll be a crash out deal on 1.1.2021 with tariffs and barriers and bureaucracy.
We’ve just got a bit more time to prepare for it, that’s all.
Let’s hope we don’t need to import any medicines to deal with Coronavirus next winter, eh!
Wuhan is an important area for pharmaceutical production, we may have some difficult shortages fairly shortly.
I think Coronavirus will be over by WTO time, more likely to hit over the summer, if not sooner.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
But most political talent is also smoke and mirrors?
Not real talent, no. Thatcher had real talent, for instance.
There are lots of people in the City making money. Some are talented; far more are pretty average and simply lucky to be in the right place at the right time. A considerable number are utterly dreadful but have done the requisite amount of arse licking.
Being a good hedge fund manager or whatever Sunak was tells you nothing about his political skills and his very privileged background working with equally privileged rich people like him does not obviously suggest someone who is going to understand the sorts of issues and concerns of the Tory party’s new constituency.
If the Tories think that all Northern voters want or need is some tarted up leisure centres with the promise of a train service in a few years time - under the guise of “infrastructure” spending, they’re heading for an - eventual - fall.
You need to spend more time with politicians.
Going back nearly thirty years to find an example isn't convincing
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
But most political talent is also smoke and mirrors?
Not real talent, no. Thatcher had real talent, for instance.
There are lots of people in the City making money. Some are talented; far more are pretty average and simply lucky to be in the right place at the right time. A considerable number are utterly dreadful but have done the requisite amount of arse licking.
Being a good hedge fund manager or whatever Sunak was tells you nothing about his political skills and his very privileged background working with equally privileged rich people like him does not obviously suggest someone who is going to understand the sorts of issues and concerns of the Tory party’s new constituency.
If the Tories think that all Northern voters want or need is some tarted up leisure centres with the promise of a train service in a few years time - under the guise of “infrastructure” spending, they’re heading for an - eventual - fall.
The Resolution Foundation report on the "Blue Wall", it is not obvious that railways or housing are the answer there.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
It is a takeover, not a merger.
The PM was always the ultimate boss of the Treasury.
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
There is no beast around the cabinet table with the authority to challenge bad decisions or ideas from the mind of Cummings.
Which is what you'd love but why the fuck should Gov't be run that way?
Sterling up half a cent against the dollar, I'd have thought long term this could mean GBP weakness as Johnson opens up the taps with no internal resistance ?
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I’ve considered WTO a racing certainty ever since March last year when the May deal failed to get through. It’ll be badged as an Australia-like deal for those too stupid or ignorant to understand the reality but since Australia trades with the EU on a WTO basis, it’ll be a crash out deal on 1.1.2021 with tariffs and barriers and bureaucracy.
We’ve just got a bit more time to prepare for it, that’s all.
Let’s hope we don’t need to import any medicines to deal with Coronavirus next winter, eh!
Wuhan is an important area for pharmaceutical production, we may have some difficult shortages fairly shortly.
I think Coronavirus will be over by WTO time, more likely to hit over the summer, if not sooner.
That's an important judgement coming from a staunch Conservative supporter such as yourself. Don't tell me they've lost your vote?
You lost your chancellor today, that is always a big deal. The fact it wasn't intended makes it more so.
Pretending this is not a big deal and bad news is just silly.
I'm on the Left and I don't think this is 'bad news' at all. Javid screwed up over HS2 and Boris is stamping his authority on Gov't.
Reminds me of Thatcher. Of course people like you and Alastair Meeks will whinge and moan out of bitterness for the whole of the next 5 years.
For those of us who are able to take a step back and be objective, it's fun politics to watch. We haven't seen a PM able to be this decisive since Tony Blair more than a quarter of a century ago.
Guess that's why it shocks some people.
Whilst meanly expressed, this is an important point. I frequently observe that PB has no memory, and people have been so used to the fragile politics of the 2010's they find it difficult to comprehend the new reality. I think people will continue to be surprised and shocked for some time, when they really shouldn't be given the size of the majority.
I am old enough to remember when a PM with a large majority lost a Chancellor as a result of a clash between said Chancellor and an unelected advisor.
Perhaps you also remember what happened next and whether it led to good or bad government?
Javid will be pleased with current Mail headline. Doesn't look well on Johnson.
Sajid RESIGNS after refusing to let Dominic Cummings sack his staff: Javid quits after saying he won't be 'Chancellor in name only' during extraordinary showdown with Boris Johnson
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
A bit snarky plus you have your all City types are shysters jumper on again. He was head boy at Winchester, and just to get in to Winchester sets you apart somewhat; he got a first at Oxford, and then went on to the US, and then to GS.
Does that make him a good politician? It shows that he has a hell of a lot of tools to be able to understand and respond to the needs of the people in Western Cumbria and the fact that he has been appointed Chancellor shows that as a politician, he is doing something right.
And will he be a patsy? In all probability yes he will. I am growing to like even less the character of this government but that is not relevant. If he is a patsy he will do more to help the people of Western Cumbria as Chancellor than as a back bencher. Or as a hedge fund principal.
Mortality rate from COVID19 ex Wuhan is 0.5% interestingly, and 2.7% in Wuhan. So either the Wuhan figures are underreported or the health systems in Wuhan are likely overwhelmed*.
Your posts are refreshingly honest amongst a sea of posters who ever since brexit - never mind the election - have made vinegar seem like sweet lemonade amidst their bile reflections. Nice to see a grown up on the site.
It's "refreshingly honest" to say you are on the Left when you are on the Right?
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
However, if you're currently coming onto this market I would suggest the 14/1 on next Conservative leader currently available on Betfair represents much better value than the 18/1 next PM.
I think they're both awful value, it's a good reminder of how bettors overvalue the shiny new thing anyhow. He's a chancellor like Hammond and Javid, not a PM. The last chancellor who probably could have been a serious contender for PM was probably err... Osborne.
I don't agree. His CV is pretty darned impressive. Good early life background, business stock, Head Boy at Winchester, First Class degreee Lincoln College Oxford, Fulbright Scholar and success in the city.
He's the first properly talented Conservative in a generation.
But will he have the balls to knife Johnson when the time comes?
The basic point - politically - is surely: does this make Boris look strong or does it make him look weak? Does he look decisive and in control - or indecisive and vulnerable? Surely, it is the former. Having a reputation for being strong and decisive is critical to his political longevity and prospects. Thatcher and Blair both gave the impression that they knew what they were about. So does Boris.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
What did Hammond, Osborn, Darling or Brown know about Western Cumbria? Should only Tim Farron or Rory Stewart be considered for the role of Chancellor? He was robotic in the debates but surely that was exactly what was asked of him, Amber Rudd offered the same in 2017.I suspect Sunak's outlook aligns more with the PM than Javid's does and he will be easier to control, however Javid was critical of Boris in his failed leadership bid, his pro EU adviser was sacked for 'leaking' and he's overseen the HS2 flipflop so he is certainly not irreplaceable.
Having said all that I think and hope he returns to the cabinet at some point down the line, but much like Raab and Patel I question whether he is deserving of one of the big jobs.
I hold no brief for Javid who I’ve always thought overrated. The Tories are making a great play about wanting to do something for their new Northern constituencies. It would help if we saw some evidence of them having senior people in their team who have some understanding or empathy or knowledge about those places. A career spent exclusively in the City does not immediately suggest this. Sunak may surprise us all. Let’s see. If he is intelligent as is claimed he ought to realise that being seen as Boris’s patsy is the road to ruin.
Reminds me of the cynic’s description of the ideal team size.
Three: -
- one to do the work (Cummings) - one to take the credit (Boris) - one to carry the can (Sunak)
I doubt it will do Boris any immediate harm, but having the PM and Chancellor as effectively the same person has never been done in this country before. A fundamental 'belt-and-braces' arrangement in British politics has been abolished in an instant. This is huge news.
Not really. Churchill was both Prime Minister and Minister of Defence simultaneously. You could get rid of all the Cabinet ministers and Government would continue (and arguably improve in the short term). It's Boris who forms the Government and he can do that how he pleases. As I said recently, the Prime Minister is a really powerful individual.
The main issue here is time - there literally aren't enough hours in the day for one person to attend to everything important properly. Either they rely on good people around them to do it (and up to now there's been a theory that this was Boris's style) or they get into can-kicking for everything they don't have time for, or they make half-baked decisions. Option 1 is generally preferred for effective government.
Suank is a good person. You want to rely upon good people yes, but you need to rely upon those good people to be pulling in the same direction as you want them to do so.
The PM is First Lord of the Treasury. I don't see why it is shocking that SPADs could be jointly co-ordinated between the First Lord of the Treasury and the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
It is a takeover, not a merger.
The PM was always the ultimate boss of the Treasury.
Britain has long been a country of polite fictions. Cabinet government has been a polite fiction for some time, and here we see the end of both the politeness and the fiction.
I can see the merit in ending the pretence, but I mourn the loss of politeness that goes with it. I also think that it's sometimes the polite fictions and white lies that help a country of strangers get along. Stripped bare of all pretence and that may be a lot harder to manage.
Your posts are refreshingly honest amongst a sea of posters who ever since brexit - never mind the election - have made vinegar seem like sweet lemonade amidst their bile reflections. Nice to see a grown up on the site.
It's "refreshingly honest" to say you are on the Left when you are on the Right?
Are you seriously claiming mysticrose in on the Right?
Unlike people like Nigel_Foremain whom I've never seen show anything positive to the Tories but claims to be a Tory, Rose has consistently been pro-Left including during the election.
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
What would be the point?
Well quite. It'd look like the sour grapes it is. The PM can add Javid to his list of enemies within the Tories, but now is most definitely not the time.
Since Javid resigned, does he get to make a speech in the HoC?
Unfortunately his rhetorical powers make Geoffrey Howe look like Cicero, so it probably doesn't matter either way.
Be like getting savaged by a bald sheep!
Javid was right not to back down because of Cummings. At least, now that we taken back control and are no longer answerable to unelected bureaucrats, we can vote Cummings out at the next election.
Mortality rate from COVID19 ex Wuhan is 0.5% interestingly, and 2.7% in Wuhan. So either the Wuhan figures are underreported or the health systems in Wuhan are likely overwhelmed*.
* I'd guess this to be more likely.
There must be an indirect impact on mortality from a disease like this. If the hospitals are clogged up with COVID patients, what impact is that having on care for cancer patients, heart failure patients etc?
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
What would be the point?
To undermine Johnson and set the rumour mill rolling - set up possibility of Anthony Meyer type challenge later in the year. Media speculation all over again as to how many letters had been sent in etc.Circa 55 letters required - could easily get 20 letters sent in purely out of personal bitterness.
The basic point - politically - is surely: does this make Boris look strong or does it make him look weak? Does he look decisive and in control - or indecisive and vulnerable? Surely, it is the former. Having a reputation for being strong and decisive is critical to his political longevity and prospects. Thatcher and Blair both gave the impression that they knew what they were about. So does Boris.
Boris does not look like much of anything. He seems to have vanished since the election
Since Javid resigned, does he get to make a speech in the HoC?
Unfortunately his rhetorical powers make Geoffrey Howe look like Cicero, so it probably doesn't matter either way.
Be like getting savaged by a bald sheep!
Javid was right not to back down because of Cummings. At least, now that we taken back control and are no longer answerable to unelected bureaucrats, we can vote Cummings out at the next election.
Err.....
Of course we can since he's not a bureaucrat. If Johnson loses the election then Cummings is gone.
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I hold the opposite view on that. Hard Brexit would be to seriously and gratuitously damage the economy. It would be lunacy. "Boris" will not be doing it. No upside, all downside. There will be a closely aligned, low friction Deal. He has the power capital to go that way and he will do so. I'm close to certain of this.
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
What would be the point?
Well quite. It'd look like the sour grapes it is. The PM can add Javid to his list of enemies within the Tories, but now is most definitely not the time.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
A bit snarky plus you have your all City types are shysters jumper on again. He was head boy at Winchester, and just to get in to Winchester sets you apart somewhat; he got a first at Oxford, and then went on to the US, and then to GS.
Does that make him a good politician? It shows that he has a hell of a lot of tools to be able to understand and respond to the needs of the people in Western Cumbria and the fact that he has been appointed Chancellor shows that as a politician, he is doing something right.
And will he be a patsy? In all probability yes he will. I am growing to like even less the character of this government but that is not relevant. If he is a patsy he will do more to help the people of Western Cumbria as Chancellor than as a back bencher. Or as a hedge fund principal.
I have met so many people who had firsts at brilliant universities and did impressive stuff in the US and went to GS or other places where it is hard to get into and who have brilliant CVs etc and some of them are some of the stupidest people I have ever met, utterly lacking in common-sense or empathy and, occasionally, morality.
Sunak is an unknown quantity. There are lots of people about with impressive CVs. I have a pretty impressive one myself. But he is an unknown quantity as a politician and yet he is now being hailed as the Tories’ new Messiah. A sense of proportion please.
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
What would be the point?
To undermine Johnson and set the rumour mill rolling - set up possibility of Anthony Meyer type challenge later in the year. Media speculation all over again as to how many letters had been sent in etc.Circa 55 letters required - could easily get 20 letters sent in purely out of personal bitterness.
I suspect this is not the time for that to collect traction.
If the motivation is bitterness rather than cats fighting in a sack over what is seen as 'policy', then bitterness garners little support compared to 'policy'
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I hold the opposite view on that. Hard Brexit would be to seriously and gratuitously damage the economy. It would be lunacy. "Boris" will not be doing it. No upside, all downside. There will be a closely aligned, low friction Deal. He has the power capital to go that way and he will do so. I'm close to certain of this.
Aren't you also [close to] certain that Trump will lose the election? Despite a lot of concerning evidence to the contrary.
I think you're letting your hopes run away with you.
Mortality rate from COVID19 ex Wuhan is 0.5% interestingly, and 2.7% in Wuhan. So either the Wuhan figures are underreported or the health systems in Wuhan are likely overwhelmed*.
* I'd guess this to be more likely.
There must be an indirect impact on mortality from a disease like this. If the hospitals are clogged up with COVID patients, what impact is that having on care for cancer patients, heart failure patients etc?
Diseases are usually more deadly for anyone with a pre-existing condition or even just the elderly. It might not be the hospitals that get clogged up...
Yes, I've felt WTO has been nailed on for some time. Dom and Boris want to make a statement - they only need each other.
I hold the opposite view on that. Hard Brexit would be to seriously and gratuitously damage the economy. It would be lunacy. "Boris" will not be doing it. No upside, all downside. There will be a closely aligned, low friction Deal. He has the power capital to go that way and he will do so. I'm close to certain of this.
But you are also convinced Trump will come second in a two horse race.
Since Javid resigned, does he get to make a speech in the HoC?
Unfortunately his rhetorical powers make Geoffrey Howe look like Cicero, so it probably doesn't matter either way.
Be like getting savaged by a bald sheep!
Javid was right not to back down because of Cummings. At least, now that we taken back control and are no longer answerable to unelected bureaucrats, we can vote Cummings out at the next election.
Err.....
Of course we can since he's not a bureaucrat. If Johnson loses the election then Cummings is gone.
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
What would be the point?
To undermine Johnson and set the rumour mill rolling - set up possibility of Anthony Meyer type challenge later in the year. Media speculation all over again as to how many letters had been sent in etc.Circa 55 letters required - could easily get 20 letters sent in purely out of personal bitterness.
I suspect this is not the time for that to collect traction.
If the motivation is bitterness rather than cats fighting in a sack over what is seen as 'policy', then bitterness garners little support compared to 'policy'
Any letter sent in would not have to reveal the motivation - whatever its reality might be.
Mortality rate from COVID19 ex Wuhan is 0.5% interestingly, and 2.7% in Wuhan. So either the Wuhan figures are underreported or the health systems in Wuhan are likely overwhelmed*.
* I'd guess this to be more likely.
There must be an indirect impact on mortality from a disease like this. If the hospitals are clogged up with COVID patients, what impact is that having on care for cancer patients, heart failure patients etc?
Diseases are usually more deadly for anyone with a pre-existing condition or even just the elderly. It might not be the hospitals that get clogged up...
One reason I suspect the mortality rate outside of China is so low is that those who have caught the illness largely are fit and healthy travellers who can better shrug off the illness.
If this virus starts to infect and go around hospitals or care homes etc then the mortality rate will shoot up tragically.
Since Javid resigned, does he get to make a speech in the HoC?
Unfortunately his rhetorical powers make Geoffrey Howe look like Cicero, so it probably doesn't matter either way.
Be like getting savaged by a bald sheep!
Javid was right not to back down because of Cummings. At least, now that we taken back control and are no longer answerable to unelected bureaucrats, we can vote Cummings out at the next election.
Err.....
Of course we can since he's not a bureaucrat. If Johnson loses the election then Cummings is gone.
You make me laugh
You're right! Johnson losing an election? Clearly a bridge too far!
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
A bit snarky plus you have your all City types are shysters jumper on again. He was head boy at Winchester, and just to get in to Winchester sets you apart somewhat; he got a first at Oxford, and then went on to the US, and then to GS.
Does that make him a good politician? It shows that he has a hell of a lot of tools to be able to understand and respond to the needs of the people in Western Cumbria and the fact that he has been appointed Chancellor shows that as a politician, he is doing something right.
And will he be a patsy? In all probability yes he will. I am growing to like even less the character of this government but that is not relevant. If he is a patsy he will do more to help the people of Western Cumbria as Chancellor than as a back bencher. Or as a hedge fund principal.
I have met so many people who had firsts at brilliant universities and did impressive stuff in the US and went to GS or other places where it is hard to get into and who have brilliant CVs etc and some of them are some of the stupidest people I have ever met, utterly lacking in common-sense or empathy and, occasionally, morality.
Sunak is an unknown quantity. There are lots of people about with impressive CVs. I have a pretty impressive one myself. But he is an unknown quantity as a politician and yet he is now being hailed as the Tories’ new Messiah. A sense of proportion please.
Let’s see what he actually does.
I really don't think, if you were to ponder slightly, that all those people were "some of the stupidest people" you have ever met. You probably disagreed with their values, especially if those values were to try to break the law or bend it, but stupid? I very much doubt it.
I'm not sure that being seen as the tea boy will be conducive to Rishi Sunak's leadership prospects. He's evidently not going to be allowed to have opinions.
Oh look, Alastair can't resist a snide and derogatory comment.
Rishi is a highly talented individual.
Where is the evidence for him being a highly talented politician? His appearances at the election debates were pretty wooden, frankly. What else is there?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
A bit snarky plus you have your all City types are shysters jumper on again. He was head boy at Winchester, and just to get in to Winchester sets you apart somewhat; he got a first at Oxford, and then went on to the US, and then to GS.
Does that make him a good politician? It shows that he has a hell of a lot of tools to be able to understand and respond to the needs of the people in Western Cumbria and the fact that he has been appointed Chancellor shows that as a politician, he is doing something right.
And will he be a patsy? In all probability yes he will. I am growing to like even less the character of this government but that is not relevant. If he is a patsy he will do more to help the people of Western Cumbria as Chancellor than as a back bencher. Or as a hedge fund principal.
I have met so many people who had firsts at brilliant universities and did impressive stuff in the US and went to GS or other places where it is hard to get into and who have brilliant CVs etc and some of them are some of the stupidest people I have ever met, utterly lacking in common-sense or empathy and, occasionally, morality.
Sunak is an unknown quantity. There are lots of people about with impressive CVs. I have a pretty impressive one myself. But he is an unknown quantity as a politician and yet he is now being hailed as the Tories’ new Messiah. A sense of proportion please.
Let’s see what he actually does.
If he is another empty suit like Raab, then he will not do anything other than spout party platitudes.
BTW - I agree with your comment about bright people lacking common-sense or empathy. The IT and tech industry is a haven for such people. Over 3 decades I have met hundreds like that, possibly thousands.
I wonder if any letters will be despatched to Graham Brady in response to these events. Why would a sacked minister not do that as a simple act of revenge?
What would be the point?
To undermine Johnson and set the rumour mill rolling - set up possibility of Anthony Meyer type challenge later in the year. Media speculation all over again as to how many letters had been sent in etc.Circa 55 letters required - could easily get 20 letters sent in purely out of personal bitterness.
I suspect this is not the time for that to collect traction.
If the motivation is bitterness rather than cats fighting in a sack over what is seen as 'policy', then bitterness garners little support compared to 'policy'
Any letter sent in would not have to reveal the motivation - whatever its reality might be.
No, but it is a game of assumptions, nods and winks. Without the nods, winks and assumptions the whole ediface falls into a dull uninteresting black hole where nobody pays any attention to it.
In addition I don't think Sir G Brady has to reveal the quantity (if any) of letters in his mailbox.
Are you seriously claiming mysticrose in on the Right?
Unlike people like Nigel_Foremain whom I've never seen show anything positive to the Tories but claims to be a Tory, Rose has consistently been pro-Left including during the election.
Comments
Make Saj a humiliating offer. Stay as CoE if he sacks all his team and accepts No 10's people instead.
Saj accepts? Fine. He's confirmed as the required patsy.
Saj refuses and resigns. Fine. He's out and replaced with alternative oven-ready patsy.
Win Win.
But no I guess your point that “but look at his job title” trumps everything.
Brom put it best with the football manager simile. Worth re-reading.
Sorry my fellow friends on the Left, we're just going to have to batten down the hatches and suck it up. The time for Johnson's fall from grace will happen. Just not yet. Not for several years.
Even more so than the last one.
Not good for the country.
They won a majority. We lost. Get over it.
The Treasury cannot be a government within a government. It is there to facilitate government as well as to explain the limits of the possible. The concern is that those limits will be less evident if the support team are focused on No 10's short term political advantage. We shall see.
Take Back Control!
If the new cabinet delivers then 5 years from now no-one will care about this reshuffle.
On the other hand if the cabinet doesn't deliver and the Government runs into the sand then this will look like hubris.
It has happened. We lost. They won. Handsomely. The new paradigm isn't going to shift by constant carping.
But, still, apologies for being somewhat sharp.
Also doesn't exactly look like a good move for those of us wishing for a softer Brexit. Bozza might go the full WTO !
We seem to have a PM who is more of a Trump than an Obama.
Two years in, with Starmer as Labour leader and a new LibDem leader should see some of the chickens coming home to roost.
But having spads co-ordinated between the two seems sane.
One might call it "joined up government".
Of course that might not be the case, and Sunak might develop an independent power base. Time will tell.
It will make for poor government making bad decisions, but I'd already priced all of that in.
Corbyn is off to be replaced by the definitely not as scary Starmer and this tilts the field towards the possibility of leaving the EU without a trade deal more than it was previously a chance.
Claims that there's nothing to see here are wide of the mark.
It is an innovation the consequences of which are for now uncertain, even if there are strong indications...
"The chancellor said no self-respecting minister would accept those terms."...
...a reporter shouts: "Are you going to be the prime minister's puppet?"
Perhaps unsurprisingly, the new chancellor doesn't respond.
Is there any way to 'cash out' the profit? I'm assuming laying on Betfair would mean putting cash in to lay (since I'm not in the market yet). Is there any way to take the profit without tying up cash on Betfair?
Being a talented City bloke - and most City talent is, frankly, smoke and mirrors - means nothing in politics and certainly does not help in understanding the economic and financial position of people in the poor parts of the country.
What does someone like Sunak know of the needs and desires of people in, say, Western Cumbria, the old industrial part not the pretty tourist places?
I didn’t much like Javid. Sunak may be better but not if he’s just going to be a patsy.
We’ve just got a bit more time to prepare for it, that’s all.
Let’s hope we don’t need to import any medicines to deal with Coronavirus next winter, eh!
He was robotic in the debates but surely that was exactly what was asked of him, Amber Rudd offered the same in 2017.I suspect Sunak's outlook aligns more with the PM than Javid's does and he will be easier to control, however Javid was critical of Boris in his failed leadership bid, his pro EU adviser was sacked for 'leaking' and he's overseen the HS2 flipflop so he is certainly not irreplaceable.
Having said all that I think and hope he returns to the cabinet at some point down the line, but much like Raab and Patel I question whether he is deserving of one of the big jobs.
Anything interesting been happening?
I think Coronavirus will be over by WTO time, more likely to hit over the summer, if not sooner.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/13/coronavirus-medical-chief-says-uk-hopes-to-delay-any-outbreak-until-summer
There are lots of people in the City making money. Some are talented; far more are pretty average and simply lucky to be in the right place at the right time. A considerable number are utterly dreadful but have done the requisite amount of arse licking.
Being a good hedge fund manager or whatever Sunak was tells you nothing about his political skills and his very privileged background working with equally privileged rich people like him does not obviously suggest someone who is going to understand the sorts of issues and concerns of the Tory party’s new constituency.
If the Tories think that all Northern voters want or need is some tarted up leisure centres with the promise of a train service in a few years time - under the guise of “infrastructure” spending, they’re heading for an - eventual - fall.
Yes its 4 weeks from a budget so in normal circumstances the Chancellor would never be pushed out - but the thought may have been that if the SNP can cope with their Chancellor going on the day of the budget itself, then he can cope with his going 4 weeks before it.
Going back nearly thirty years to find an example isn't convincing
https://twitter.com/TorstenBell/status/1227541098966454273?s=19
Titter.
Perhaps you also remember what happened next and whether it led to good or bad government?
Sajid RESIGNS after refusing to let Dominic Cummings sack his staff: Javid quits after saying he won't be 'Chancellor in name only' during extraordinary showdown with Boris Johnson
Unfortunately his rhetorical powers make Geoffrey Howe look like Cicero, so it probably doesn't matter either way.
Does that make him a good politician? It shows that he has a hell of a lot of tools to be able to understand and respond to the needs of the people in Western Cumbria and the fact that he has been appointed Chancellor shows that as a politician, he is doing something right.
And will he be a patsy? In all probability yes he will. I am growing to like even less the character of this government but that is not relevant. If he is a patsy he will do more to help the people of Western Cumbria as Chancellor than as a back bencher. Or as a hedge fund principal.
* I'd guess this to be more likely.
https://twitter.com/DavidGauke/status/1227946470608965633
Surely, it is the former. Having a reputation for being strong and decisive is critical to his political longevity and prospects. Thatcher and Blair both gave the impression that they knew what they were about. So does Boris.
Reminds me of the cynic’s description of the ideal team size.
Three: -
- one to do the work (Cummings)
- one to take the credit (Boris)
- one to carry the can (Sunak)
I can see the merit in ending the pretence, but I mourn the loss of politeness that goes with it. I also think that it's sometimes the polite fictions and white lies that help a country of strangers get along. Stripped bare of all pretence and that may be a lot harder to manage.
Unlike people like Nigel_Foremain whom I've never seen show anything positive to the Tories but claims to be a Tory, Rose has consistently been pro-Left including during the election.
https://twitter.com/MikeBloomberg/status/1227951551068721154
Err.....
https://twitter.com/Andrew_Adonis/status/1227943374428221441
Sunak is an unknown quantity. There are lots of people about with impressive CVs. I have a pretty impressive one myself. But he is an unknown quantity as a politician and yet he is now being hailed as the Tories’ new Messiah. A sense of proportion please.
Let’s see what he actually does.
If the motivation is bitterness rather than cats fighting in a sack over what is seen as 'policy', then bitterness garners little support compared to 'policy'
I think you're letting your hopes run away with you.
Niether are certain, regardless of desireability.
If this virus starts to infect and go around hospitals or care homes etc then the mortality rate will shoot up tragically.
BTW - I agree with your comment about bright people lacking common-sense or empathy. The IT and tech industry is a haven for such people. Over 3 decades I have met hundreds like that, possibly thousands.
In addition I don't think Sir G Brady has to reveal the quantity (if any) of letters in his mailbox.
Like @Gabs3 claiming to be a Remainer.
Cuckoos.
In stark contrast to your good self, if I may say so. You are 100% pukka and exactly what it says on the tin. You're a Libertarian.
Also a decent tipster - witness Header - for somebody who assures me he never bets.