I just don't understand it at all. The plea that those who don't love it not comment on it is just sad. The fact it's like a montage video of a TV drama romantic pairing is just bizarre (or its like an in memoriam video, which is even weirder). The fact they are so moved by it when you could find images of Boris smiling with people and do the exact same thing.
I'm sorry, but it is seriously creepy stuff. I swear I try, not always successfully, to appreciate that people can passionately believe in a particular leader, and that good can come from that, but that is just creepy.
I just played it and got tears in my ears. 50% for the right reason and 50% for all the wrong ones.
The thing is, for some people (not many but also not a few) the Corbyn project was a massive thing. Lives spent arguing and activating for that sort of politics, most of the time ignored or laughed at, largely in the shadows, and then break through and into the light, for 4 years in charge of the Labour Party, coming close to power in 2017, and now - because of Dec 12th - it's all over. The dream is dead.
And there is no sadder thing on this earth than when your dream dies. People should respect this. They should not need to be socialists themselves to empathize.
I just watched it. It was excellent. The bit with the wreath was especially poignant.
It’s about as lovely as the Labour video someone posted below. Definitely eye of the beholder stuff - though I suspect a majority are immune to the appeal of both.
I just don't understand it at all. The plea that those who don't love it not comment on it is just sad. The fact it's like a montage video of a TV drama romantic pairing is just bizarre (or its like an in memoriam video, which is even weirder). The fact they are so moved by it when you could find images of Boris smiling with people and do the exact same thing.
I'm sorry, but it is seriously creepy stuff. I swear I try, not always successfully, to appreciate that people can passionately believe in a particular leader, and that good can come from that, but that is just creepy.
I just played it and got tears in my ears. 50% for the right reason and 50% for all the wrong ones.
The thing is, for some people (not many but also not a few) the Corbyn project was a massive thing. Lives spent arguing and activating for that sort of politics, most of the time ignored or laughed at, largely in the shadows, and then break through and into the light, for 4 years in charge of the Labour Party, coming close to power in 2017, and now - because of Dec 12th - it's all over. The dream is dead.
And there is no sadder thing on this earth than when your dream dies. People should respect this. They should not need to be socialists themselves to empathize.
There's empathy for seeing a dream fall apart, and then there's watching people create a musical montage video with soft focus shots of the dear leader whilst they wallow. The grief and upset of people who are very fearful for the future and who believed so greatly in the cause I respect totally.
What I don't respect is adolescent worship of political figures, particularly when people are ignoring negatives about that person because they are projecting a dream on to that person. It's why I have no issue with people who respect Thatcher, but think people who to this day compare every new leader to her and consider what she would so and how no one measures up, are weirdly obsessed.
There are great political leaders out there. There are leaders who might not be great but whose vision was beloved by many. These sorts of people might be respected across the political divide, or merely loved by one side, which is not to be dismissed. But they are just normal men and women, and sometimes a lot more normal than their worhshippers are prepared to admit. Respect, even admiration and loyalty, is understandable. Worship is not. And tribute videos set to music and stock images, is worship. I don't respect that one bit.
I just don't understand it at all. The plea that those who don't love it not comment on it is just sad. The fact it's like a montage video of a TV drama romantic pairing is just bizarre (or its like an in memoriam video, which is even weirder). The fact they are so moved by it when you could find images of Boris smiling with people and do the exact same thing.
I'm sorry, but it is seriously creepy stuff. I swear I try, not always successfully, to appreciate that people can passionately believe in a particular leader, and that good can come from that, but that is just creepy.
Not that its a surprise but yes, I agree, that's borderline unsettling.
I just don't understand it at all. The plea that those who don't love it not comment on it is just sad. The fact it's like a montage video of a TV drama romantic pairing is just bizarre (or its like an in memoriam video, which is even weirder). The fact they are so moved by it when you could find images of Boris smiling with people and do the exact same thing.
I'm sorry, but it is seriously creepy stuff. I swear I try, not always successfully, to appreciate that people can passionately believe in a particular leader, and that good can come from that, but that is just creepy.
I just played it and got tears in my ears. 50% for the right reason and 50% for all the wrong ones.
The thing is, for some people (not many but also not a few) the Corbyn project was a massive thing. Lives spent arguing and activating for that sort of politics, most of the time ignored or laughed at, largely in the shadows, and then break through and into the light, for 4 years in charge of the Labour Party, coming close to power in 2017, and now - because of Dec 12th - it's all over. The dream is dead.
And there is no sadder thing on this earth than when your dream dies. People should respect this. They should not need to be socialists themselves to empathize.
There's empathy for seeing a dream fall apart, and then there's watching people create a musical montage video with soft focus shots of the dear leader whilst they wallow. The grief and upset of people who are very fearful for the future and who believed so greatly in the cause I respect totally.
What I don't respect is adolescent worship of political figures, particularly when people are ignoring negatives about that person because they are projecting a dream on to that person. It's why I have no issue with people who respect Thatcher, but think people who to this day compare every new leader to her and consider what she would so and how no one measures up, are weirdly obsessed.
There are great political leaders out there. There are leaders who might not be great but whose vision was beloved by many. These sorts of people might be respected across the political divide, or merely loved by one side, which is not to be dismissed. But they are just normal men and women, and sometimes a lot more normal than their worhshippers are prepared to admit. Respect, even admiration and loyalty, is understandable. Worship is not. And tribute videos set to music and stock images, is worship. I don't respect that one bit.
Good article and discussion - with national politics being a bit tumbleweed at the moment, it's a good time to look at underlying issues.
A few thoughts (partly as the borough council Exec member responsible for parking):
* Making towns interesting is the key. If it's merely somewhere to provide routine shopping, then retail parks will win. A few specialist shops, ideally on a common theme, will bring people in from other areas. Brighton has reinvented itself from a decaying seaside resort to an arty, edgy place for greenish people - not everyone's cup of tea, but a definite new identity. I don't think you have to go back to your former identity to thrive, and some really can't - the fishing and coal industries aren't going to suddenly boom.
* The point about surplus of shops vs shortage of housing is good, but can't be taken too far - if you aren't careful, you end up with a dormitory of people always commuting somewhere else.
* Free parking is fine for short stops ("I'll pop into Boots to get...") but counter-productive if extended too long, as commuters start to block the space. There's also an issue of what shops want (a stream of people coming and going) vs preventing too much pollution. Farnham, in my patch, has a pretty good shopping area, which draws in loads of traffic and a serious air quality problem.
* Ideally you want park and ride or park and stride, but"ride" costs money and as for "stride", most people really don't like walking with heavy shopping, or indeed at all. Farnham has some car parks in easy walking distance from the centre - they are badly under-used, and there is even a request from a local fitness centre to get them cheap parking in the nearest multi-story, as their supposedly fitness-aspiring clients can't be bothered to walk from the one a bit further away.
Excellent points Nick and I agree with all of them, specialist shops, free parking short enough to attract shoppers but not long enough to be taken by commuters and car parks close to the shops is key
Cars will not be needed to transport heavy shopping as it increasingly moves on-line. Local Authorities should discourage cars and provide frequent bus services, possibly subsidised. They already do for OAPs.
On-line shopping will inevitably win for material substances (potatoes) and services that can be downloaded (music). But on-line is useless for personal services (haircut, nails) and particularly for experiences (cafes, bars) and products that you want to touch, feel, try or put on before buying. Also for things you want NOW - today's newspaper or a pint of milk.
Kind of on topic, if people are to celebrate, shouldn't it be done locally in small pubs rather than a congregation in a big city?
A great point. And it would be far more appropriate given that Brexit is a provincial thing and the centre of resistance to it was London.
For Leavers to celebrate Brexit Day in the capital is like scoring for Man U at Anfield and running the length of the pitch to celebrate in front of the Kop.
Really tacky - and possibly slightly dangerous too.
We are having a Brexit Party in Epping for local Tories on Friday night but we are paying for it ourselves
I presume Remain voters aren't on the guest list?
There will be Remain voters there who respect democracy (including me)
Enjoy the evening. As a Leave voter, I'll probably be in bed by 11.
I'll be wearing a black tie and a glum expression to mark the occasion.
This is going to be an exceedingly active area of debate over the next few years...
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jan/26/priti-patel-radicalised-youth-plan-so-flawed-its-mad A Home Office-funded study into tackling radicalisation among young people has concluded that the approach being pushed through by the home secretary, Priti Patel, is so flawed that it is “madness”. Instead the research, which will be unveiled on Wednesday and is described as one of the biggest scientific surveys of its type in Europe, found that the most effective strategy was precisely the opposite approach pursued by Patel. Generating “positive psychology” among young people was found to be significantly more effective than punitive policies when challenging “violent youth radicalisation”, defined as gang crime through to the development of extreme ideologies....
Kind of on topic, if people are to celebrate, shouldn't it be done locally in small pubs rather than a congregation in a big city?
A great point. And it would be far more appropriate given that Brexit is a provincial thing and the centre of resistance to it was London.
For Leavers to celebrate Brexit Day in the capital is like scoring for Man U at Anfield and running the length of the pitch to celebrate in front of the Kop.
Really tacky - and possibly slightly dangerous too.
We are having a Brexit Party in Epping for local Tories on Friday night but we are paying for it ourselves
I presume Remain voters aren't on the guest list?
There will be Remain voters there who respect democracy (including me)
Enjoy the evening. As a Leave voter, I'll probably be in bed by 11.
I'll be wearing a black tie and a glum expression to mark the occasion.
In this weather, a few more clothes might be appropriate...
This is going to be an exceedingly active area of debate over the next few years...
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jan/26/priti-patel-radicalised-youth-plan-so-flawed-its-mad A Home Office-funded study into tackling radicalisation among young people has concluded that the approach being pushed through by the home secretary, Priti Patel, is so flawed that it is “madness”. Instead the research, which will be unveiled on Wednesday and is described as one of the biggest scientific surveys of its type in Europe, found that the most effective strategy was precisely the opposite approach pursued by Patel. Generating “positive psychology” among young people was found to be significantly more effective than punitive policies when challenging “violent youth radicalisation”, defined as gang crime through to the development of extreme ideologies....
Rather childish of The Guardian to use this picture. I doubt it was accidental
This is going to be an exceedingly active area of debate over the next few years...
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jan/26/priti-patel-radicalised-youth-plan-so-flawed-its-mad A Home Office-funded study into tackling radicalisation among young people has concluded that the approach being pushed through by the home secretary, Priti Patel, is so flawed that it is “madness”. Instead the research, which will be unveiled on Wednesday and is described as one of the biggest scientific surveys of its type in Europe, found that the most effective strategy was precisely the opposite approach pursued by Patel. Generating “positive psychology” among young people was found to be significantly more effective than punitive policies when challenging “violent youth radicalisation”, defined as gang crime through to the development of extreme ideologies....
It isn't about effectiveness. It is about making voters think that you are sticking it to the scrotes.
Anything perceived as hand-wringing just won't wash.
Kind of on topic, if people are to celebrate, shouldn't it be done locally in small pubs rather than a congregation in a big city?
A great point. And it would be far more appropriate given that Brexit is a provincial thing and the centre of resistance to it was London.
For Leavers to celebrate Brexit Day in the capital is like scoring for Man U at Anfield and running the length of the pitch to celebrate in front of the Kop.
Really tacky - and possibly slightly dangerous too.
We are having a Brexit Party in Epping for local Tories on Friday night but we are paying for it ourselves
I presume Remain voters aren't on the guest list?
There will be Remain voters there who respect democracy (including me)
Enjoy the evening. As a Leave voter, I'll probably be in bed by 11.
I'll be wearing a black tie and a glum expression to mark the occasion.
In this weather, a few more clothes might be appropriate...
This is going to be an exceedingly active area of debate over the next few years...
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jan/26/priti-patel-radicalised-youth-plan-so-flawed-its-mad A Home Office-funded study into tackling radicalisation among young people has concluded that the approach being pushed through by the home secretary, Priti Patel, is so flawed that it is “madness”. Instead the research, which will be unveiled on Wednesday and is described as one of the biggest scientific surveys of its type in Europe, found that the most effective strategy was precisely the opposite approach pursued by Patel. Generating “positive psychology” among young people was found to be significantly more effective than punitive policies when challenging “violent youth radicalisation”, defined as gang crime through to the development of extreme ideologies....
It isn't about effectiveness. It is about making voters think that you are sticking it to the scrotes. Anything perceived as hand-wringing just won't wash.
While that’s perhaps true, this government is going to be around long enough to be judged on outcomes.
Cars will not be needed to transport heavy shopping as it increasingly moves on-line. Local Authorities should discourage cars and provide frequent bus services, possibly subsidised. They already do for OAPs.
On-line shopping will inevitably win for material substances (potatoes) and services that can be downloaded (music). But on-line is useless for personal services (haircut, nails) and particularly for experiences (cafes, bars) and products that you want to touch, feel, try or put on before buying. Also for things you want NOW - today's newspaper or a pint of milk.
I could not do my weekly shop without getting a lift (or a taxi) home from the supermarket, and most customers are in the same position. Nor can I take the morning off work to be in when the lorry turns up with the spuds I've ordered online in this brave new world.
Kind of on topic, if people are to celebrate, shouldn't it be done locally in small pubs rather than a congregation in a big city?
A great point. And it would be far more appropriate given that Brexit is a provincial thing and the centre of resistance to it was London.
For Leavers to celebrate Brexit Day in the capital is like scoring for Man U at Anfield and running the length of the pitch to celebrate in front of the Kop.
Really tacky - and possibly slightly dangerous too.
We are having a Brexit Party in Epping for local Tories on Friday night but we are paying for it ourselves
I presume Remain voters aren't on the guest list?
There will be Remain voters there who respect democracy (including me)
Enjoy the evening. As a Leave voter, I'll probably be in bed by 11.
Some of us will be four time zones ahead, and will have to stay up until 3am to raise a glass!
It would be interesting to see how the average age of a town affects how it looks and feels, and the general levels of satisfaction within it.
There is a generational aspect. The move online is being led by the young. The shops that are being lost are valued by the old. So the loss is being felt by a group who do not see the compensating gains.
Town Centres should be half the size they were ten years ago in ten years time, with the failing shops used for housing. Hopefully fewer pound shops and more independent specialist outlets
It’s ironic that people are complaining about a lack of housing and a glut of empty retail space simultaneously.
Also ironic that people worry about the environment (or say they do) but also want to drive their cars into town centres.
It would be interesting to see how the average age of a town affects how it looks and feels, and the general levels of satisfaction within it.
There is a generational aspect. The move online is being led by the young. The shops that are being lost are valued by the old. So the loss is being felt by a group who do not see the compensating gains.
Town Centres should be half the size they were ten years ago in ten years time, with the failing shops used for housing. Hopefully fewer pound shops and more independent specialist outlets
It’s ironic that people are complaining about a lack of housing and a glut of empty retail space simultaneously.
Also ironic that people worry about the environment (or say they do) but also want to drive their cars into town centres.
And, yes, I am one of those hypocrites!
Thanks for the article.
The electrification of transport will do quite a bit to transform urban centres. Asthmatics might be able to live in London again...
Cars will not be needed to transport heavy shopping as it increasingly moves on-line. Local Authorities should discourage cars and provide frequent bus services, possibly subsidised. They already do for OAPs.
On-line shopping will inevitably win for material substances (potatoes) and services that can be downloaded (music). But on-line is useless for personal services (haircut, nails) and particularly for experiences (cafes, bars) and products that you want to touch, feel, try or put on before buying. Also for things you want NOW - today's newspaper or a pint of milk.
I could not do my weekly shop without getting a lift (or a taxi) home from the supermarket, and most customers are in the same position. Nor can I take the morning off work to be in when the lorry turns up with the spuds I've ordered online in this brave new world.
I don't do a weekly shop. I shop more or less daily and never use my car for shopping. I walk or take the bus. For on-line shopping, I give a code to the deliverer that gives them access to a secure place at home if I'm not in.
Kind of on topic, if people are to celebrate, shouldn't it be done locally in small pubs rather than a congregation in a big city?
A great point. And it would be far more appropriate given that Brexit is a provincial thing and the centre of resistance to it was London.
For Leavers to celebrate Brexit Day in the capital is like scoring for Man U at Anfield and running the length of the pitch to celebrate in front of the Kop.
Really tacky - and possibly slightly dangerous too.
We are having a Brexit Party in Epping for local Tories on Friday night but we are paying for it ourselves
I presume Remain voters aren't on the guest list?
There will be Remain voters there who respect democracy (including me)
Enjoy the evening. As a Leave voter, I'll probably be in bed by 11.
I'll be wearing a black tie and a glum expression to mark the occasion.
There's empathy for seeing a dream fall apart, and then there's watching people create a musical montage video with soft focus shots of the dear leader whilst they wallow. The grief and upset of people who are very fearful for the future and who believed so greatly in the cause I respect totally.
What I don't respect is adolescent worship of political figures, particularly when people are ignoring negatives about that person because they are projecting a dream on to that person. It's why I have no issue with people who respect Thatcher, but think people who to this day compare every new leader to her and consider what she would so and how no one measures up, are weirdly obsessed.
There are great political leaders out there. There are leaders who might not be great but whose vision was beloved by many. These sorts of people might be respected across the political divide, or merely loved by one side, which is not to be dismissed. But they are just normal men and women, and sometimes a lot more normal than their worhshippers are prepared to admit. Respect, even admiration and loyalty, is understandable. Worship is not. And tribute videos set to music and stock images, is worship. I don't respect that one bit.
It is a bit adolescent, yes, but it's strictly for the more committed Corbynite to indulge in some nostalgia at his passing. Because he has passed politically - he and 'it' is over.
I half liked it (unlike you I'm a sucker for this sort of thing) and half thought "oh dear". It's also quite funny due to the strained version of the song. The Kop it is not. Guy sounded on his deathbed. Touch of the Laurence Foxes about it.
But, OK, I accept your view as the more mature and enlightened one.
Cars will not be needed to transport heavy shopping as it increasingly moves on-line. Local Authorities should discourage cars and provide frequent bus services, possibly subsidised. They already do for OAPs.
On-line shopping will inevitably win for material substances (potatoes) and services that can be downloaded (music). But on-line is useless for personal services (haircut, nails) and particularly for experiences (cafes, bars) and products that you want to touch, feel, try or put on before buying. Also for things you want NOW - today's newspaper or a pint of milk.
I could not do my weekly shop without getting a lift (or a taxi) home from the supermarket, and most customers are in the same position. Nor can I take the morning off work to be in when the lorry turns up with the spuds I've ordered online in this brave new world.
Golly, I hadn't realised Marxist/Stalinist/Commie CorbLab was centre left. Someone better tell the BJ party and assorted UK tabloids about the misapprehension under which they've been 'labouring'.
Yes but Westminster has to agree and the Tories won a UK wide majority with a manifesto commitment to no indyref2 after the 'once in a generation' (in Salmond's words) referendum in 2014 voted to stay in the UK
I'd wait to see ALL the questions asked in the poll - that they led with this one may be telling.....
Indeed and only 50% of Scots actually think Holyrood should be able to decide when to call an indyref2 even if there is a Nationalist majority at the 2021 Holyrood elections
On the topic of Alastair Meeks' article, it's very good and I agree with most of it. One paragraph that irks though:
"The opposition, however, would probably be ill-advised to place too much emphasis on towns. If the government gives proper attention to it, it has a good chance of making a difference to towns’ prospects that the public gives it credit for. Labour could easily see a focus on towns backfire on them."
That presupposes that the sole purpose of opposition is to make the government look bad. If the opposition is successful in changing the agenda of the governing party, that's a good thing even if it doesn't help the opposition win the next general election.
It's too early to say whether the Tories are just making symbolic gestures, or whether they are serious about this issue. If it turns out to be the latter, then as a Labour member I'll be very happy about that.
In Havering there seems to be an abundance of "Turkish" shops opening up. I wonder if this is due to the "Hellbanianz" running London's drug trade out of Barking
"Labour haven’t really addressed any of this yet, even in the face of a huge defeat. Some activists still sing that Seven Nation Army song; some of them talk about becoming a ‘social movement’; Corbyn as their just-about-still-leader has spoken of becoming the ‘resistance’ to Tory rule. For too many left media outlets and bloviating outriders, everyone hates the Tories, and those voters who don’t are grinding the faces of the poor. When you’ve just achieved less than a third of the vote on a 67% turnout, maybe it’s you that people don’t like much – or trust to help those in need. Just a thought."
On the topic of Alastair Meeks' article, it's very good and I agree with most of it. One paragraph that irks though:
"The opposition, however, would probably be ill-advised to place too much emphasis on towns. If the government gives proper attention to it, it has a good chance of making a difference to towns’ prospects that the public gives it credit for. Labour could easily see a focus on towns backfire on them."
That presupposes that the sole purpose of opposition is to make the government look bad. If the opposition is successful in changing the agenda of the governing party, that's a good thing even if it doesn't help the opposition win the next general election.
It's too early to say whether the Tories are just making symbolic gestures, or whether they are serious about this issue. If it turns out to be the latter, then as a Labour member I'll be very happy about that.
Well said. I assume it would annoy them if Tories get credit for something, but there are occasions when oppositions even vote with the government on issues because contrary to the oft repeated phrase, it is not the purpose of the opposition to automatically oppose simply for the sake of it (though obviously they usually will as they have a different view, and fair enough), and if there is to be a revival of towns, then the country would benefit from it happening even under the Tories, it can hardly wait 5 years.
Just four and a half years and she gets the all-time record. World super-heavyweight monarch, unifying all belts.
Why the glum look, Charles?
How long do you think it will be before people start getting suspicious about her immortality? I think once she is in her 120s she will have to openly reveal herself as the God-Empress of Mankind.
If she persists in the fiction that she can have Indyref2 this year, her reputation may never recover. You can see why it’s hard to admit the game’s a bogie though.
Besides letting down the SNP members she has marched up so many hills, Ms Sturgeon said a vote for the SNP last month would stop Brexit, stop Boris, and deliver Indyref2. The first and second didn’t pan out, leaving her clinging to the third.
If she gives up on that too, it’s three strikes. Not a good look for a leader under daily attack for over-promising and under-delivering in government.
If she persists in the fiction that she can have Indyref2 this year, her reputation may never recover. You can see why it’s hard to admit the game’s a bogie though.
Besides letting down the SNP members she has marched up so many hills, Ms Sturgeon said a vote for the SNP last month would stop Brexit, stop Boris, and deliver Indyref2. The first and second didn’t pan out, leaving her clinging to the third.
If she gives up on that too, it’s three strikes. Not a good look for a leader under daily attack for over-promising and under-delivering in government.
There are lots of factors. In my view, the one that gets discussed too little, relative to its importance, is self-righteousness. That applies in all of these countries, and also in the USA, where the results aren't as objectively bad, but where the most transparently corrupt and incompetent president in history has a very good chance of being re-elected.
This is why people who go on about the "hard left" miss the point. The self-righteousness is far more associated with liberalism than socialism, is as common on the centre-left as among Corbynites, and is why Phillips wouldn't have been any better than Long-Bailey.
An awakening of white nationalism two generations after the shadow of Nazism was put to the sword, renewed and legitimised by, among others, Matthew Goodwin. Why else do his populist nationalisms exclude the most successful populist nationalist in Europe, Emmanuel Macron?
If she persists in the fiction that she can have Indyref2 this year, her reputation may never recover. You can see why it’s hard to admit the game’s a bogie though.
Besides letting down the SNP members she has marched up so many hills, Ms Sturgeon said a vote for the SNP last month would stop Brexit, stop Boris, and deliver Indyref2. The first and second didn’t pan out, leaving her clinging to the third.
If she gives up on that too, it’s three strikes. Not a good look for a leader under daily attack for over-promising and under-delivering in government.
I don't think it damages Nicola particularly. No more than the Benn Act damaged Boris. People don't blame her.
Sounds plausible. Opponents can say he/she made impossible promises, or was ineffective, but at the end of the day people like the professed intent, so long as the enemy are seen as the reason they were unsuccessful.
A decent sized sample for a change, and some interesting subsidiary questions. The "angry old man" image of Sanders that we tend to get over here is belied by his being the most-liked candidate, as well as the candidate most likely to get second preferences from the others. But a significant chunk of Biden's vote is people who think he's got the best chance to beat Trump. That could either strengthen (and pull across liberals) or quite possibly weaken (if other candidates still seem to be doing as well in polls).
There are lots of factors. In my view, the one that gets discussed too little, relative to its importance, is self-righteousness. That applies in all of these countries, and also in the USA, where the results aren't as objectively bad, but where the most transparently corrupt and incompetent president in history has a very good chance of being re-elected.
This is why people who go on about the "hard left" miss the point. The self-righteousness is far more associated with liberalism than socialism, is as common on the centre-left as among Corbynites, and is why Phillips wouldn't have been any better than Long-Bailey.
It's also a preference for undiluted wine in countries with PR or similar (which is most of them). If you're green/left, you vote for a Green party (Germany, Austria) or a Left party (Germany, Sweden, Netherlands). Why wouldn't you?
The FUNDAMENTAL problem of centrists is the lack of a convincing positive narrative, such as that which Blair offered, and perhaps Macron. You can't win purely on the basis that you're not a worse option.
Just four and a half years and she gets the all-time record. World super-heavyweight monarch, unifying all belts.
Why the glum look, Charles?
How long do you think it will be before people start getting suspicious about her immortality? I think once she is in her 120s she will have to openly reveal herself as the God-Empress of Mankind.
Charles will have a search made of the attics of Buck House for that picture of her that is doing all the ageing......
An awakening of white nationalism two generations after the shadow of Nazism was put to the sword, renewed and legitimised by, among others, Matthew Goodwin. Why else do his populist nationalisms exclude the most successful populist nationalist in Europe, Emmanuel Macron?
You seem to be forgetting Angela Merkel's responsibility for renewing right-wing nationalism across Europe...
On the topic of Alastair Meeks' article, it's very good and I agree with most of it. One paragraph that irks though:
"The opposition, however, would probably be ill-advised to place too much emphasis on towns. If the government gives proper attention to it, it has a good chance of making a difference to towns’ prospects that the public gives it credit for. Labour could easily see a focus on towns backfire on them."
That presupposes that the sole purpose of opposition is to make the government look bad. If the opposition is successful in changing the agenda of the governing party, that's a good thing even if it doesn't help the opposition win the next general election.
It's too early to say whether the Tories are just making symbolic gestures, or whether they are serious about this issue. If it turns out to be the latter, then as a Labour member I'll be very happy about that.
Yes, I'm happy for a Conservative government to implement Labour policies.
The "winning the argument" thing gets mocked but in this particular sense it is not a meaningless or silly notion.
There are lots of factors. In my view, the one that gets discussed too little, relative to its importance, is self-righteousness. That applies in all of these countries, and also in the USA, where the results aren't as objectively bad, but where the most transparently corrupt and incompetent president in history has a very good chance of being re-elected.
This is why people who go on about the "hard left" miss the point. The self-righteousness is far more associated with liberalism than socialism, is as common on the centre-left as among Corbynites, and is why Phillips wouldn't have been any better than Long-Bailey.
It's also a preference for undiluted wine in countries with PR or similar (which is most of them). If you're green/left, you vote for a Green party (Germany, Austria) or a Left party (Germany, Sweden, Netherlands). Why wouldn't you?
The FUNDAMENTAL problem of centrists is the lack of a convincing positive narrative, such as that which Blair offered, and perhaps Macron. You can't win purely on the basis that you're not a worse option.
Good point, yeah. The first one would suggest not much applicability to the UK. The second one was probably a major factor in the 2015 result, and the 2017 improvement.
Although those are reasons why the centre-left might do badly in any period. It needs to be coupled to something that's happening right now (e.g. dissatisfaction with the establishment) to explain why recent results are particularly bad.
Yep. YNWA. The Anfield anthem. If you watch the vid, what it is is stills of JC at key moments in his career set to an 'unplugged' acoustic cover of that song. It's as if he's died. And perhaps, politically, he has.
My issue with the 50p Brexit coin is the disingenuous misquote from Thomas Jefferson. The words were chosen because the other more relevant to Brexiteers half of the phrase goes, "entangling alliances with none". But they don't quite say it.
As Brexit has turned out to be an exercise in disingenuousness, the coin is actually fine, as a symbol.
Mr. 43, disingenuousness is indeed fitting, given the Lisbon Treaty paved the way for what followed, and Brown signed us up to it after all three (then) major parties promised us a referendum on it*.
*Technically the Constitution, but the content is practically identical.
On a less partisan note, politicians would've been better served by being more honest with the electorate in the long term. Feigning scepticism in opposition and acting compliantly in office, using the EU as a scapegoat and never explaining what the advantages of membership are (and there are some, just as there are associated costs) could not help but stoke scepticism amongst the electorate.
On a less partisan note, politicians would've been better served by being more honest with the electorate in the long term. Feigning scepticism in opposition and acting compliantly in office, using the EU as a scapegoat and never explaining what the advantages of membership are (and there are some, just as there are associated costs) could not help but stoke scepticism amongst the electorate.
Fair enough, MD. No-one has a monopoly on disingenuousness.
There are lots of factors. In my view, the one that gets discussed too little, relative to its importance, is self-righteousness. That applies in all of these countries, and also in the USA, where the results aren't as objectively bad, but where the most transparently corrupt and incompetent president in history has a very good chance of being re-elected.
This is why people who go on about the "hard left" miss the point. The self-righteousness is far more associated with liberalism than socialism, is as common on the centre-left as among Corbynites, and is why Phillips wouldn't have been any better than Long-Bailey.
I think this is a very astute post. The question is where the greater self-righteousness comes from. Here's my theory:
One advantage the right wing has always had over the left is that the right fights for the status quo, or the status quo before a recent change, while the left fights for an ideal future. The latter is a lot scarier to people as there is a bigger gap to what we currently have. Successful parties of both sides have had to moderate their policy platforms and messages to win over people but it is even more important for the left because of the bigger gap. This moderation has usually been forced on them by talking to people outside their bubble. However social media encourages bubble thinking and thus makes the left further away from the median voter.
< controversial > It’s almost like when Jimmy Savile died, and almost immediately everyone who was a victim of his behaviour came forward to tell their story. < / controversial >
If she persists in the fiction that she can have Indyref2 this year, her reputation may never recover. You can see why it’s hard to admit the game’s a bogie though.
Besides letting down the SNP members she has marched up so many hills, Ms Sturgeon said a vote for the SNP last month would stop Brexit, stop Boris, and deliver Indyref2. The first and second didn’t pan out, leaving her clinging to the third.
If she gives up on that too, it’s three strikes. Not a good look for a leader under daily attack for over-promising and under-delivering in government.
I don't think it damages Nicola particularly. No more than the Benn Act damaged Boris. People don't blame her.
Sounds plausible. Opponents can say he/she made impossible promises, or was ineffective, but at the end of the day people like the professed intent, so long as the enemy are seen as the reason they were unsuccessful.
It is too much indy that will do for Nicola, not too little.
The problem for Bercow is that his very public persona has been that of being visibly short tempered and not above making personal comments to put people down. Whether people enjoyed him doing so or felt it was justified in light of the targets of his ire, it is as a result hard not to believe he is a bully given his public behaviour toward others.
There are lots of factors. In my view, the one that gets discussed too little, relative to its importance, is self-righteousness. That applies in all of these countries, and also in the USA, where the results aren't as objectively bad, but where the most transparently corrupt and incompetent president in history has a very good chance of being re-elected.
This is why people who go on about the "hard left" miss the point. The self-righteousness is far more associated with liberalism than socialism, is as common on the centre-left as among Corbynites, and is why Phillips wouldn't have been any better than Long-Bailey.
I think this is a very astute post. The question is where the greater self-righteousness comes from. Here's my theory:
One advantage the right wing has always had over the left is that the right fights for the status quo, or the status quo before a recent change, while the left fights for an ideal future. The latter is a lot scarier to people as there is a bigger gap to what we currently have. Successful parties of both sides have had to moderate their policy platforms and messages to win over people but it is even more important for the left because of the bigger gap. This moderation has usually been forced on them by talking to people outside their bubble. However social media encourages bubble thinking and thus makes the left further away from the median voter.
I think you're right that this is why self-righteousness is more common on the left. Both due to the left being on the side of change, and due to the bubbles that form (there are plenty of bubbles on the right, of course, but they don't tend to have the same motivation).
One thing that I think the left need to decouple is how radicalism of policy and how strident they are in attitude. For example, there's enough evidence from 2017 and from polling that nationalisation is not electoral poison, provided it's presented with an air of calm. I would guess the same is true on the liberal axis (e.g. transgender rights), although I'm less confident of that.
And apologies for the unnecessary dig at Jess Phillips. I know you were supporting her.
Mr. 43, disingenuousness is indeed fitting, given the Lisbon Treaty paved the way for what followed, and Brown signed us up to it after all three (then) major parties promised us a referendum on it*.
*Technically the Constitution, but the content is practically identical.
All the substantive things that Brexiteers claim we need to leave long predate the Lisbon Treaty, so your argument is a model of disingenuousness.
Comments
Definitely eye of the beholder stuff - though I suspect a majority are immune to the appeal of both.
What I don't respect is adolescent worship of political figures, particularly when people are ignoring negatives about that person because they are projecting a dream on to that person. It's why I have no issue with people who respect Thatcher, but think people who to this day compare every new leader to her and consider what she would so and how no one measures up, are weirdly obsessed.
There are great political leaders out there. There are leaders who might not be great but whose vision was beloved by many. These sorts of people might be respected across the political divide, or merely loved by one side, which is not to be dismissed. But they are just normal men and women, and sometimes a lot more normal than their worhshippers are prepared to admit. Respect, even admiration and loyalty, is understandable. Worship is not. And tribute videos set to music and stock images, is worship. I don't respect that one bit.
Will there be a companion coin to mark deMeghanification?
But pleasing nonetheless.
On-line shopping will inevitably win for material substances (potatoes) and services that can be downloaded (music). But on-line is useless for personal services (haircut, nails) and particularly for experiences (cafes, bars) and products that you want to touch, feel, try or put on before buying. Also for things you want NOW - today's newspaper or a pint of milk.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jan/26/priti-patel-radicalised-youth-plan-so-flawed-its-mad
A Home Office-funded study into tackling radicalisation among young people has concluded that the approach being pushed through by the home secretary, Priti Patel, is so flawed that it is “madness”.
Instead the research, which will be unveiled on Wednesday and is described as one of the biggest scientific surveys of its type in Europe, found that the most effective strategy was precisely the opposite approach pursued by Patel. Generating “positive psychology” among young people was found to be significantly more effective than punitive policies when challenging “violent youth radicalisation”, defined as gang crime through to the development of extreme ideologies....
Anything perceived as hand-wringing just won't wash.
I would back Wilder, that said.
And, yes, I am one of those hypocrites!
Thanks for the article.
For on-line shopping, I give a code to the deliverer that gives them access to a secure place at home if I'm not in.
Why the glum look, Charles?
https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020/01/monty-pythons-terry-jones-joins-the-choir-invisible/
I half liked it (unlike you I'm a sucker for this sort of thing) and half thought "oh dear". It's also quite funny due to the strained version of the song. The Kop it is not. Guy sounded on his deathbed. Touch of the Laurence Foxes about it.
But, OK, I accept your view as the more mature and enlightened one.
https://www.newyorker.com/news/campaign-chronicles/joe-bidens-battle-with-bernie-sanders-for-working-class-voters
Snippet of the song being sung as Jeremy was marching on the 70s demo, Was it?
(a) through a storm, hold your head up high
(b) sweet silver song of a lark
(c) dreams be tossed and blown
(d) none of the above
https://twitter.com/NicholasTyrone/status/1221367578867662849
https://mobile.twitter.com/marchandsteve/status/1221423603800891393
"The opposition, however, would probably be ill-advised to place too much emphasis on towns. If the government gives proper attention to it, it has a good chance of making a difference to towns’ prospects that the public gives it credit for. Labour could easily see a focus on towns backfire on them."
That presupposes that the sole purpose of opposition is to make the government look bad. If the opposition is successful in changing the agenda of the governing party, that's a good thing even if it doesn't help the opposition win the next general election.
It's too early to say whether the Tories are just making symbolic gestures, or whether they are serious about this issue. If it turns out to be the latter, then as a Labour member I'll be very happy about that.
"Labour haven’t really addressed any of this yet, even in the face of a huge defeat. Some activists still sing that Seven Nation Army song; some of them talk about becoming a ‘social movement’; Corbyn as their just-about-still-leader has spoken of becoming the ‘resistance’ to Tory rule. For too many left media outlets and bloviating outriders, everyone hates the Tories, and those voters who don’t are grinding the faces of the poor. When you’ve just achieved less than a third of the vote on a 67% turnout, maybe it’s you that people don’t like much – or trust to help those in need. Just a thought."
https://capx.co/the-labour-party-still-doesnt-get-it/
https://www.twitter.com/Andrew_Adonis/status/1221408246650621952
Besides letting down the SNP members she has marched up so many hills, Ms Sturgeon said a vote for the SNP last month would stop Brexit, stop Boris, and deliver Indyref2. The first and second didn’t pan out, leaving her clinging to the third.
If she gives up on that too, it’s three strikes. Not a good look for a leader under daily attack for over-promising and under-delivering in government.
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/18185973.tom-gordon-nicola-sturgeons-next-steps-put-judgment-line/
This is why people who go on about the "hard left" miss the point. The self-righteousness is far more associated with liberalism than socialism, is as common on the centre-left as among Corbynites, and is why Phillips wouldn't have been any better than Long-Bailey.
The FUNDAMENTAL problem of centrists is the lack of a convincing positive narrative, such as that which Blair offered, and perhaps Macron. You can't win purely on the basis that you're not a worse option.
The "winning the argument" thing gets mocked but in this particular sense it is not a meaningless or silly notion.
Although those are reasons why the centre-left might do badly in any period. It needs to be coupled to something that's happening right now (e.g. dissatisfaction with the establishment) to explain why recent results are particularly bad.
As Brexit has turned out to be an exercise in disingenuousness, the coin is actually fine, as a symbol.
*Technically the Constitution, but the content is practically identical.
Peace
Prosperity
or Friendship with all nations?
One advantage the right wing has always had over the left is that the right fights for the status quo, or the status quo before a recent change, while the left fights for an ideal future. The latter is a lot scarier to people as there is a bigger gap to what we currently have. Successful parties of both sides have had to moderate their policy platforms and messages to win over people but it is even more important for the left because of the bigger gap. This moderation has usually been forced on them by talking to people outside their bubble. However social media encourages bubble thinking and thus makes the left further away from the median voter.
That's Rejoiners for you......
For the first time in 3 years Trump has briefly hit his 2016 vote share of 45.6 in the approval average:
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_trump_job_approval-6179.html
< controversial >
It’s almost like when Jimmy Savile died, and almost immediately everyone who was a victim of his behaviour came forward to tell their story.
< / controversial >
One thing that I think the left need to decouple is how radicalism of policy and how strident they are in attitude. For example, there's enough evidence from 2017 and from polling that nationalisation is not electoral poison, provided it's presented with an air of calm. I would guess the same is true on the liberal axis (e.g. transgender rights), although I'm less confident of that.
And apologies for the unnecessary dig at Jess Phillips. I know you were supporting her.
https://twitter.com/siennamarla/status/1221440311488106498