Categories
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Paging all Brexiteers who hate American Presidents interfering
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Paging all Brexiteers who hate American Presidents interfering in UK politics
World exclusive: Trump backs Boris to be Britain’s next PM with highly controversial intervention into Tory contest. "I know the different players. But I think Boris would do a very good job. He would be excellent”.https://t.co/Qt0zjwwePJ
0
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
On the other hand, isn't this guy in the Cabinet now? I know there is very little for them to do right now, but doesn't he have a department to run? Indeed. Like May eventually running down the sympathy she might deserve through her own actions, Nandy has lost the right to expect to be taken seriously.
> Regarding Julia Hartley-Brewer, or any of the other non platformed speakers at Uni’s etc, why don’t the complainers just not attend?
It's their conference, not Brewer's. Jeez.
> > @isam said:
> > Regarding Julia Hartley-Brewer, or any of the other non platformed speakers at Uni’s etc, why don’t the complainers just not attend?
>
> It's their conference, not Brewer's. Jeez.
Indeed it is, and we don't want the poor mites being offended by hearing something they might not agree with, do we?
Presumably someone in charge invited JHB in the first place. I don’t think the question has been answered as to why those who are offended by her just don’t attend
Here we go again...
> > @ah009 said:
> > > @isam said:
> > > Regarding Julia Hartley-Brewer, or any of the other non platformed speakers at Uni’s etc, why don’t the complainers just not attend?
> >
> > It's their conference, not Brewer's. Jeez.
>
> Indeed it is, and we don't want the poor mites being offended by hearing something they might not agree with, do we?
That's their business. Why do you even care?
If I held a housewarming party and my partner invited Brewer, I'd uninvite her. Nobody's rights are being trampled. The guests who'd quite like to listen to her stories can find another way. It's not my obligation to host her even if someone else thought it was a great idea.
https://twitter.com/johnestevens/status/1134566048437587968?s=21
(Unlikely on the polls, someone will say, and sure, but someone is going to end up cobbling together majority support in the House, and the choices there are pretty grim)
> > @isam said:
>
> > Regarding Julia Hartley-Brewer, or any of the other non platformed speakers at Uni’s etc, why don’t the complainers just not attend?
>
>
>
> It's their conference, not Brewer's. Jeez.
>
> Jeez man! 😝
>
> Presumably someone in charge invited JHB in the first place. I don’t think the question has been answered as to why those who are offended by her just don’t attend
Perhaps because those organising the conference would rather have the attendees rather than the speaker. But whatever. It's their choice, not yours.
If you don't like their decision, why not just not think about it?
As for his plan - he will say no to referendum, election and revoking A50, but the middle those he cannot necessarily prevent if he cannot maintain a majority of support. And given he is saying no to the other two and won't be able to get a new deal, he is in fact choosing a new election while backing no deal.
> The Iron Saj? Really?
>
> https://twitter.com/johnestevens/status/1134566048437587968?s=21
But iron is magnetic
I'm not saying don't look up to a previous, very successful leader, but the way every little detail must be referred back to her is just lame.
> The Iron Saj? Really?
>
> https://twitter.com/johnestevens/status/1134566048437587968?s=21
Not sure how he intends to 'build trust with Dublin' based on that spread.
Tory leadership is now a race to the bottom of the 'No deal' barrel to see what scrapings can be found.
> Telegraph: Sajid Javid reveals he is prepared to take Britain out of EU without a deal
>
> Here we go again...
This is where Rory's video explaining why No Deal is a bad idea comes in.
Britain is going to end up crashing out of the EU because dimwit politicians feel the need to pander to c. 150,000 mostly male white pensioners mostly located in the SE of England and because they don't have the gumption to understand what No Deal actually means or the intelligence to explain it.
Or the courage to think seriously about what is in the country's interests, even if that involves speaking some hard truths to power, in this case, the voters.
> I never want to hear of Boris or Trump ever again.
>
>
Don't worry; I'm sure they've never heard of you.
> > @steve_garner said:
> > > @ah009 said:
> > > > @isam said:
> > > > Regarding Julia Hartley-Brewer, or any of the other non platformed speakers at Uni’s etc, why don’t the complainers just not attend?
> > >
> > > It's their conference, not Brewer's. Jeez.
> >
> > Indeed it is, and we don't want the poor mites being offended by hearing something they might not agree with, do we?
>
> That's their business. Why do you even care?
> If I held a housewarming party and my partner invited Brewer, I'd uninvite her. Nobody's rights are being trampled. The guests who'd quite like to listen to her stories can find another way. It's not my obligation to host her even if someone else thought it was a great idea.
That's slightly missing the point. The Royal College invited her and can, of course, disinvite her. But the time to think about whether she would make a suitable speaker is surely before the invite goes out. Withdrawing it just because some potential attendees don't want to listen is a bit pathetic. Attendees aren't locked in a room and forced to listen, after all.
> The Iron Saj? Really?
>
>
>
> https://twitter.com/johnestevens/status/1134566048437587968
>
>
>
> When will they learn to stop using 'Iron' comparisons? Didn't work out well for May.
>
> As for his plan - he will say no to referendum, election and revoking A50, but the middle those he cannot necessarily prevent if he cannot maintain a majority of support. And given he is saying no to the other two and won't be able to get a new deal, he is in fact choosing a new election while backing no deal.
Oh FFS stop bring logic into this madness.
> > @isam said:
>
> > > @isam said:
>
> >
>
> > > Regarding Julia Hartley-Brewer, or any of the other non platformed speakers at Uni’s etc, why don’t the complainers just not attend?
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > It's their conference, not Brewer's. Jeez.
>
> >
>
> > Jeez man! 😝
>
> >
>
> > Presumably someone in charge invited JHB in the first place. I don’t think the question has been answered as to why those who are offended by her just don’t attend
>
>
>
> Perhaps because those organising the conference would rather have the attendees rather than the speaker. But whatever. It's their choice, not yours.
>
> If you don't like their decision, why not just not think about it?
>
> What an odd comment on a discussion board like this.
If it sounds odd, good. It's a parody of your question.
> Sounds like something out of a WWE wrestling match - The iron Saj !
Desperately embarrassing.
Another sad case of the Brexit virus eating the brain.
Glad I am only mildly green on this fellah.
> I never want to hear of Boris or Trump ever again.
>
>
Sounds like you want to no platform them :-)
Meanwhile cricket ace Matt Hancock is continuity May.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/31/david-cameron-uses-memoirs-settle-scores-backstabbing-michael/
But it remains very confused. Is he unconditionally committing to an October 31st exit or not? This is a good test of the sanity/honesty of any candidate, because it's impossible to guarantee in any scenario that arrangements and legislation will be in place on time. Javid seems to accept this: "There is no getting around the fact that the timing for negotiations and then getting the legislation through will be challenging." Dead right. And if the negotiations go really well and the EU accepts that the backstop can be modified (fat chance, but bear with me..) , is he seriously saying that at the last minute he'd pull the plug and crash out in chaos at short notice because the timetable proved to be too 'challenging'?
Alternatively, he says he's prepared reluctantly to leave with No Deal. OK, but what about this bit: "It's simply not credible to promise you can deliver No Deal if parliament is dead set against it.". Dead right again. So is he promising that or not?
> I never want to hear of Boris or Trump ever again.
>
>
You'll probably have to switch off the news for at least the next 5 years.
> But the time to think about whether she would make a suitable speaker is surely before the invite goes out.
Sure. But if they believe they've made a mistake, and it's entirely up to them whom they have as a guest, why do any of us care that they change their mind.
Indeed, I'd go as far as to say people should change their mind after new information more often. The saddest and most ridiculous moments in public life come when someone knows they've erred but the double down and plough on regardless. There are notable recent examples I could cite.
> Tories just make me sad now, look at how they have to refer to The Saj's pitch as a 'Thatcher war cry' to get pumped up about it, they are obsessed. Why not just put on one of her old dresses and claim it gives you super conservative powers?
>
> I'm not saying don't look up to a previous, very successful leader, but the way every little detail must be referred back to her is just lame.
There's a word you're dancing around here, and I'll say it: cult
> It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
> > @AndyJS said:
> > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
As they say, it's a clash between an immoveable object and an unstoppable force. Not going to end well.
Whatever one might think of foreign endorsements, surely getting the nod of approval from Trump cannot be considered a positive development given the way he is viewed in this country.
> > @AndyJS said:
> > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
Absolutely right.
> > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > @AndyJS said:
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> >
> > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
> Absolutely right.
Yes, absolutely agree.
We cannot tolerate the intolerant.
> > @rottenborough said:
> > Telegraph: Sajid Javid reveals he is prepared to take Britain out of EU without a deal
> >
> > Here we go again...
>
> This is where Rory's video explaining why No Deal is a bad idea comes in.
>
> Britain is going to end up crashing out of the EU because dimwit politicians feel the need to pander to c. 150,000 mostly male white pensioners mostly located in the SE of England and because they don't have the gumption to understand what No Deal actually means or the intelligence to explain it.
>
> Or the courage to think seriously about what is in the country's interests, even if that involves speaking some hard truths to power, in this case, the voters.
>
>
The trouble about speaking hard truths to the voters is that ultimately they have the power to get rid of you - all the more so when they are not necessarily truths.
> > @AndyJS said:
> > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
Well said. And I didn't have time to say well said for your, and others, excoriation of McVey's comments the other day. This is the law of the land. There is absolutely no clash of values here.
> > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > @AndyJS said:
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> >
> > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
> As they say, it's a clash between an immoveable object and an unstoppable force. Not going to end well.
It will end with some of the children being withdrawn and home-'educated'/indoctrinated - which is not an ideal solution. But the schools have to be protected and the law must be upheld.
It is clear that these protests are being manipulated by those with a very specific agenda - and that agenda must be defeated.
> > @AndyJS said:
> > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
> I wonder if Boris is daft enough to think a Trump endorsement is a good thing.
>
>
>
> Whatever one might think of foreign endorsements, surely getting the nod of approval from Trump cannot be considered a positive development given the way he is viewed in this country.
>
> In the Tory membership? At least insofar as it might make them believe a deal with the USA will be easier?
Even in the Tory membership. I am not a Tory (to use the old much missed phrase) but almost all of those I do know regard Trump in exactly the same way that most non-Tories do. He is a kind of uniting figure across the political spectrum - well almost.
> > @AndyJS said:
>
> > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
>
>
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
> It’s the Trojan Horse scandal again. If you allow mass immigration on the scale the UK has, it’s entirely predictable. Foreigners aren’t desperate to ‘become British’, they don’t think we are better than them, it was arrogant of the establishment to think otherwise.
This is grossly offensive. Homophobia has deep roots in British culture.
You are a racist.
[1] I'm booking a place at the upcoming RSS Conference. With accom, flight and booking fees it's going to be well over a grand
[2] And pub quizzes and getting pissed, obvs. A bunch of us had a really great curry in Manchester once. One of the guys was a PhD and Professor from Harvard. He didn't know what a chicken kurma was....
> > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > @AndyJS said:
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> >
> > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
> It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
That isn't strictly true - both May and Corbyn were absent when the vote to repeal Section 28 was held. So they didn't vote for it - but they didn't vote against it
> > @ah009 said:
> > > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > > @AndyJS said:
> > > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> > >
> > > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
> >
> > It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
>
> That isn't strictly true - both May and Corbyn were absent when the vote to repeal Section 28 was held. So they didn't vote for it - but they didn't vote against it
Perhaps there were several votes? Else either you or this article is mistaken
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8696102.stm
https://twitter.com/campbellclaret/status/1134469589201408001?s=21
> Terrific this for Bozza. Everyone talking about him, crowding out all the others. And he doesn't even have to open his mouth. Obvious danger of putting foot in it.
>
> He was quiet for the last week or so. But with the court business and now this, it is all on him. Granted it is in the realm of MPs at the moment, but lack of cut through for anyone other than Boris and, to a smaller degree, Rory (who has no chance) is good for Boris.
As is the large field. If it were just 4 or 5 others, questions may be being asked about his silence. As it is, no Boris? Ah, well there are plenty of others to invite on the media to make tits of themselves.
Reagan - Thatcher
Bush - Blair
Trump - Boris. Can it get any worse? Trump is what Boris would look like if you put him in a microwave for a bit.
> > @AndyJS said:
>
> > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
>
>
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
> It’s the Trojan Horse scandal again. If you allow mass immigration on the scale the UK has, it’s entirely predictable. Foreigners aren’t desperate to ‘become British’, they don’t think we are better than them, it was arrogant of the establishment to think otherwise.
We are bigots for daring to suggest that the importation of bigots might not be a good thing.
> Family Fortunes wrong answer noise
>
> https://twitter.com/campbellclaret/status/1134469589201408001
Playing an intricate part in someone's suicide must surely be the "naughtiest" thing Bad Al has ever done?
@oxfordsimon is right. This is a battle that must be fought and won. But the politicians who should be defending the schools and facing down the bullies are silent and cowardly.
> > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > @ah009 said:
> > > > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > > > @AndyJS said:
> > > > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> > > >
> > > > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
> > >
> > > It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
> >
> > That isn't strictly true - both May and Corbyn were absent when the vote to repeal Section 28 was held. So they didn't vote for it - but they didn't vote against it
>
> Perhaps there were several votes? Else either you or this article is mistaken
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8696102.stm
My info was from here - https://inews.co.uk/news/corbyn-may-farron-voted-key-lgbt-issues/
So we are both right - May voted against in 2000 (when the attempted repeal failed - even with Labour's massive majority at the time) and was absent when it came back in 2003
As a result of the useful suggestion earlier today, I've updated the leadership spreadsheet with "both" and "either" totals, where those terms refer to the Wikipedia and Guido lists. (At the bottom of the page).
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1feCjt98HJcY9tlc5Zx78ZoSOC2fN-j0vRVFD5eUTbUE/edit#gid=0
> > @oxfordsimon said:
>
> > > @AndyJS said:
>
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
> >
>
> > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
>
>
> It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
>
> It is not mainstream conservatives taking their children out of school or protesting against having gay teachers in school.
>
> @oxfordsimon is right. This is a battle that must be fought and won. But the politicians who should be defending the schools and facing down the bullies are silent and cowardly.
Birmingham City Council and Jess Phillips are not. Government however...
> Terrific this for Bozza. Everyone talking about him, crowding out all the others. And he doesn't even have to open his mouth. Obvious danger of putting foot in it.
>
> He was quiet for the last week or so. But with the court business and now this, it is all on him. Granted it is in the realm of MPs at the moment, but lack of cut through for anyone other than Boris and, to a smaller degree, Rory (who has no chance) is good for Boris.
>
> He's written another Telegraph piece, I'm not paying to read his guff but the gist of it is everything going wrong with Brexit is everybody else's fault.
Perfect for him. No pesky follow up questions. Or indeed any questions. Just as he likes it.
> > @Cyclefree said:
>
> > I never want to hear of Boris or Trump ever again.
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
>
> Sounds like you want to no platform them :-)
>
> Roosevelt - Churchill
>
> Reagan - Thatcher
>
> Bush - Blair
>
> Trump - Boris. Can it get any worse? Trump is what Boris would look like if you put him in a microwave for a bit.
I'm not sure I would compare Boris to Trump.
He is a one off.
But don’t come here, become a citizen or resident, have children here and then demand that you should be able to opt out of the bits you don’t like..
> > @isam said:
> > > @AndyJS said:
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
It’s the Trojan Horse scandal again. If you allow mass immigration on the scale the UK has, it’s entirely predictable. Foreigners aren’t desperate to ‘become British’, they don’t think we are better than them, it was arrogant of the establishment to think otherwise.
> We are bigots for daring to suggest that the importation of bigots might not be a good thing.
> This whole row exposes the truth about ‘diversity’. Those who claim to want it actually just want people of different skin colours, or foreign sounding names, to all agree with western values
This isn't about agreeing with 'western values', it is about abiding by the law of the land. You can have whatever values you like - but they do not and should not trump the law of the land.
If you want to campaign to change that law - fine, go ahead. But disrupting the education of children, threatening violence against teachers and utterly misrepresenting what this scheme of work is designed to do puts you completely on the wrong side of the argument.
> > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > @AndyJS said:
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> >
> > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
> It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
Wow, just wow.
> > @oxfordsimon said:
>
> > > @AndyJS said:
>
> > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
>
> >
>
> > Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
>
>
>
> It's not just Islam that has a problem here. It's also "mainstream" conservatism. The current and previous PMs voted against the repeal of Section 28.
>
> It is not mainstream conservatives taking their children out of school or protesting against having gay teachers in school.
>
> @oxfordsimon is right. This is a battle that must be fought and won. But the politicians who should be defending the schools and facing down the bullies are silent and cowardly.
I wholeheartedly agree that the government should be facing it down. I don't think it's just cowardice, though. The last two PMs have been openly homophobic within their political careers. The silence can just as easily be attributed to tacit agreement.
Also, we have bigots right here and how many are calling it out? Few. Same reasons? Fuck knows. But I've had it all my life, so no surprises.
> I wholeheartedly agree that the government should be facing it down. I don't think it's just cowardice, though. The last two PMs have been openly homophobic within their political careers. The silence can just as easily be attributed to tacit agreement.
> Also, we have bigots right here and how many are calling it out? Few. Same reasons? Fuck knows. But I've had it all my life, so no surprises.
There is no denying that May voted against pro-LGBT+ legislation earlier in her career - but she has evolved in her views over the years and is now far more of an ally than she was before.
It is right to acknowledge when people do move away from previously objectionable views towards more inclusive opinions. We are all capable of change.
> > @isam said:
> > > @isam said:
> > > > @AndyJS said:
> > > > It's fascinating to watch this clash between Islamic values and Birmingham City Council. Newsnight led on it.
> Equality and educational integrity MUST win. We cannot give way to any religion in this dispute.
> It’s the Trojan Horse scandal again. If you allow mass immigration on the scale the UK has, it’s entirely predictable. Foreigners aren’t desperate to ‘become British’, they don’t think we are better than them, it was arrogant of the establishment to think otherwise.
> > We are bigots for daring to suggest that the importation of bigots might not be a good thing.
> > This whole row exposes the truth about ‘diversity’. Those who claim to want it actually just want people of different skin colours, or foreign sounding names, to all agree with western values
>
> This isn't about agreeing with 'western values', it is about abiding by the law of the land. You can have whatever values you like - but they do not and should not trump the law of the land.
>
> If you want to campaign to change that law - fine, go ahead. But disrupting the education of children, threatening violence against teachers and utterly misrepresenting what this scheme of work is designed to do puts you completely on the wrong side of the argument.
Also important to point out. We have a widespread network of private schools. Many of them religious in nature. We are also very amenable to home schooling, certainly in comparison to many of our near neighbours.
No one is forcing these parents to send their children to these schools. Quite the opposite in fact.
But I do think there is a large element of cowardice. A fear of being called racist or islamophobic and a fear that the protestors might use violence. After all we’ve had violence threatened and used against those who write or draw something that Muslims don’t like. And when that happened people bent over backwards to criticise the authors and the cartoonists for being offensive etc after a few ritual condemnations of the violence.
It shows that for all the talk people don’t really care enough about equality for gay people or free speech. And that gets me really mad. This stuff matters.
> > @ah009 said:
> > I wholeheartedly agree that the government should be facing it down. I don't think it's just cowardice, though. The last two PMs have been openly homophobic within their political careers. The silence can just as easily be attributed to tacit agreement.
> > Also, we have bigots right here and how many are calling it out? Few. Same reasons? Fuck knows. But I've had it all my life, so no surprises.
>
> There is no denying that May voted against pro-LGBT+ legislation earlier in her career - but she has evolved in her views over the years and is now far more of an ally than she was before.
>
> It is right to acknowledge when people do move away from previously objectionable views towards more inclusive opinions. We are all capable of change.
I will accept that if you'd been talking about Cameron. He apologised and, to the best of my knowledge has not exhibited any homophobia in many years.
Theresa May's office outed a gay man last year in revenge for blowing the whistle on illegalities in a political campaign. She kept him on. She's not learned a damn thing, and I say she is still a homophobe.
> You may well be right that there is tacit agreement. There is open agreement by some eg that ghastly McVey woman.
> But I do think there is a large element of cowardice. A fear of being called racist or islamophobic and a fear that the protestors might use violence. After all we’ve had violence threatened and used against those who write or draw something that Muslims don’t like. And when that happened people bent over backwards to criticise the authors and the cartoonists for being offensive etc after a few ritual condemnations of the violence.
> It shows that for all the talk people don’t really care enough about equality for gay people or free speech. And that gets me really mad. This stuff matters.
I have been very careful not to target my comments at any specific religion - as these protests have included representatives from Christianity, Judaism and Islam and very probably others. This isn't able a specific religion - it is about all religions who demonstrate an intolerance (or worse) towards someone like me because of my sexuality.
Their ignorance and bigotry has NO place in modern society. If they want to believe it in the privacy of their own brain, so be it - I can't force them to rethink. But I can campaign to make sure that their intolerance has no protection in law.
Personally, I would like a fully secular society - with no special protections or positions for any religion. Believe whatever you want to believe - but that is a private matter and not for the public sphere.
> > @oxfordsimon said:
> > > @ah009 said:
> > > I wholeheartedly agree that the government should be facing it down. I don't think it's just cowardice, though. The last two PMs have been openly homophobic within their political careers. The silence can just as easily be attributed to tacit agreement.
> > > Also, we have bigots right here and how many are calling it out? Few. Same reasons? Fuck knows. But I've had it all my life, so no surprises.
> >
> > There is no denying that May voted against pro-LGBT+ legislation earlier in her career - but she has evolved in her views over the years and is now far more of an ally than she was before.
> >
> > It is right to acknowledge when people do move away from previously objectionable views towards more inclusive opinions. We are all capable of change.
>
> I will accept that if you'd been talking about Cameron. He apologised and, to the best of my knowledge has not exhibited any homophobia in many years.
> Theresa May's office outed a gay man last year in revenge for blowing the whistle on illegalities in a political campaign. She kept him on. She's not learned a damn thing, and I say she is still a homophobe.
Fortunately she's done. The battle for what comes next is on right now.
Of course there is an issue with the ultras in a range of religions. But there is only one which has both threatened and used violence to enforce its view of the world and any analysis of this needs to take account of that sad fact. Because it leads to violence against those it targets: gay people, women, apostates, anyone who criticises them.
What is the case you mention?
I have little time for May. But she did push through gay marriage and I believe one of her junior Lib Dem Ministers praised her for her work on it. So perhaps a bit of a mixed bag in her approach. Still her silence on this - and, worse, the silence of the Education Secretary and the Equalities Minister - has been quite disgraceful.
https://twitter.com/SteveBakerHW/status/1134537560691290112
> Fortunately she's done. The battle for what comes next is on right now.
She should never have been there in the first place.
And the favourite for her successor is clearly a racist too. It's remarkable how tolerant the Conservative Party is of all this. They can't even be trusted to elect someone with even the most basic ethical standards, let alone defend teachers who are being attacked by bigots.
And before we go on, yes I'm fully aware that the same can be said for Corbyn. And Farron. What a fucking mess.
> Of course there is an issue with the ultras in a range of religions. But there is only one which has both threatened and used violence to enforce its view of the world and any analysis of this needs to take account of that sad fact. Because it leads to violence against those it targets: gay people, women, apostates, anyone who criticises them.
I don't disagree at all - and just as with the issues with sexual exploitation of young people round the country by gangs, people have been lambasted for pointing out the correlation between membership of the gangs and the religious heritage of the participants. It isn't true to say that they all come from the same religious background - but it is absolutely true to say that the vast majority of them do.
Unless we can talk openly about these issues and the causes of the problems, we will continue to fail to tackle them properly.