I think both the Ralphgate Mail headline and the picture the Times have used for Farage are both pretty disgusting, it is up to Messrs Miliband and Farage to pursue the matters should they wish if they feel any smearing has taken place.
I think both are beyond the pale, but that is the price we pay for a free press. Our libel laws are very much sufficient.
My source at the Daily Mail tells me Rothermere is fuming: Has given Dacre a one year contract only: wants him out and Geordie Greig in!
Snow's bang on about Greig from the MoS being clearly lined up to replace Dacre (Steafel looking even more of a Dacre yes-man joke lately hardly helped his already slim chances) but the question is when?
Rothermere seems to be assuming that all regulatory business can be done in dusted in about a year. I have my doubts and there's no way Dacre wants to leave before it is finished so he can stamp his authority all over it. Even if some of those doing the negotiating on the press side might be praying for it.
Rothermere despises this kind of public spotlight on him and his families past, whatever Dacre's defenders say. So it's hardly be a shock that he would be furious.
My source at the Daily Mail tells me Rothermere is fuming: Has given Dacre a one year contract only: wants him out and Geordie Greig in!
Jon Snow's source is winding him up, bigtime. Dacre runs probably the most successful paper in the country, and has created the world's most popular newspaper website.
Yeah. "One year contract". Of course.
To be fair Dacre is 64, I think.
Perhaps if he retires at 65 he can draw his pension and then be employed as a consultant or whatever? Am sure there is a reason beyond the obvious...
I think both the Ralphgate Mail headline and the picture the Times have used for Farage are both pretty disgusting, it is up to Messrs Miliband and Farage to pursue the matters should they wish if they feel any smearing has taken place.
I think both are beyond the pale, but that is the price we pay for a free press. Our libel laws are very much sufficient.
The situation seems to be that it's impossible to end the shutdown because it's not actually about anything except an argument over whether the government should be shut down. You can't make an agreement if you were never disagreeing about anything particular in the first place.
If the parties can't get together and find something to disagree about in two weeks House Republicans will destroy the world economy.
The only reason the House Republicans have this power is because of the electoral anomaly that gave them more seats in the House with fewer votes than the Democrats in 2012.
I guess there's something about the American psyche that explains why that isn't a bigger deal in the current impasse? A poster recently suggested there would be mass civil disobedience if Miliband became PM with fewer votes than Cameron...
I don't know who said that but they're wrong. Voters don't understand voting systems, and the media like to declare a winner, which is de facto the person who ends up in charge.
On Ralphgate, I have felt all week that the Mail's article itself and the paper's immediate reaction was reprehensible.
But I can't help thinking that Miliband and the wider Left are now going to use this as a crusade against the Mail and "the right wing press" (presumably nothing wrong with having a left wing press in the Mirror and Guardian, but I digress...).
We all know Miliband is capable of jumping on a bandwagon when he sees one, but to now start using his late father's memory and a slight on it by a newspaper the Left hates with a venomous passion (see Ali C on Newsnight) as a means of fomenting public outrage against the Mail and Paul Dacre, would be somewhat unseemly (and ironic), and so I do hope that won't happen.
But then I see that Miliband has written to the owner of the Mail today, and publicised the fact he's written to the owner of the Mail, so one can't help feeling that's exactly what he is going to do after all, true to form.
My sympathies may shift...
Francis Maude made a good point on Newsnight last night: "Not everything which is disagreeable should be made illegal."
I'm not not at all sure that Labour understands this.
What is Labour arguing should be made illegal?
Tim: Isn't Labour's support for the full Leveson proposals exactly that?
TBH I dislike the idea that anything which someone doesn't like should be banned or criminalised and all parties are to some extent guilty of this.
My source at the Daily Mail tells me Rothermere is fuming: Has given Dacre a one year contract only: wants him out and Geordie Greig in!
Jon Snow's source is winding him up, bigtime. Dacre runs probably the most successful paper in the country, and has created the world's most popular newspaper website.
Yeah. "One year contract". Of course.
To be fair Dacre is 64, I think.
He's 65 next month - but Rothermere confirmed in Tatler (see link earlier) that he would stay on for at least another 12 months.....
But it's rubbish. The idea he would really threaten the country's most successful editor with a zero hours contract - because he annoyed the socialist leader of Labour (a man who wants to state-censor newspapers, by the by) is beyond silly.
Could be the world's most successful editor. I can't think of any traditional paper anywhere that's handled the transition to online as successfully as the Mail has.
"Labour sources said that at the end of the service, Prof Keen's daughter was approached by a woman who shook her hand and offered her condolences, before introducing herself as a reporter from the Mail on Sunday.
The reporter asked whether Prof Keen's daughter wished to comment on the Daily Mail article about Mr Miliband senior and was told "no comment". When the reporter asked again, she was given the same answer, at which point she left."
Mr. Smukesh, that's cunningly why I didn't say you had said it.
I was just contrasting the two pespectives.
Not sure I implied the Mail should close down.I actually like the paper and the website.
But they have deliberately chosen to escalate the row about a LOTO`s father and employed dubious means inorder to garner supporting evidence for their original contention.
There has to be consequences just like the Mail would expect there to be for politicians,immigrants,teenagers,benefit cheats when they get it wrong.
On Ralphgate, I have felt all week that the Mail's article itself and the paper's immediate reaction was reprehensible.
But I can't help thinking that Miliband and the wider Left are now going to use this as a crusade against the Mail and "the right wing press" (presumably nothing wrong with having a left wing press in the Mirror and Guardian, but I digress...).
We all know Miliband is capable of jumping on a bandwagon when he sees one, but to now start using his late father's memory and a slight on it by a newspaper the Left hates with a venomous passion (see Ali C on Newsnight) as a means of fomenting public outrage against the Mail and Paul Dacre, would be somewhat unseemly (and ironic), and so I do hope that won't happen.
But then I see that Miliband has written to the owner of the Mail today, and publicised the fact he's written to the owner of the Mail, so one can't help feeling that's exactly what he is going to do after all, true to form.
My sympathies may shift...
Francis Maude made a good point on Newsnight last night: "Not everything which is disagreeable should be made illegal."
I'm not not at all sure that Labour understands this.
What is Labour arguing should be made illegal?
Tim: Isn't Labour's support for the full Leveson proposals exactly that?
TBH I dislike the idea that anything which someone doesn't like should be banned or criminalised and all parties are to some extent guilty of this.
No. Nothing the Mail has printed would be banned under any proposed changes. Obviously Dacre and co are going to try and spin that from wherever he's hiding, but just because the Mail group has screwed up big time doesn't make it true
I was making a point about the Leveson proposals not the Mail story about R Milliband.
But it's rubbish. The idea he would really threaten the country's most successful editor with a zero hours contract - because he annoyed the socialist leader of Labour (a man who wants to state-censor newspapers, by the by) is beyond silly.
Could be the world's most successful editor. I can't think of any traditional paper anywhere that's handled the transition to online as successfully as the Mail has.
So, not a journalist or publication whom one would wish to have a falling out with then.
My source at the Daily Mail tells me Rothermere is fuming: Has given Dacre a one year contract only: wants him out and Geordie Greig in!
Jon Snow's source is winding him up, bigtime. Dacre runs probably the most successful paper in the country, and has created the world's most popular newspaper website.
Yeah. "One year contract". Of course.
To be fair Dacre is 64, I think.
He also has health issues as Rothermere knows.
It's hardly unprecedented for someone to get replaced as they get older. Steafel's predecessor Sinclair retired only a few years ago (rumoured to be because he found out he was never in consideration to replace Dacre) Which leaves the triumverate of Steafel, Verity and Carter still there who would still be doing their job as the go-between for any Dacre replacement and the staff, which would greatly ease the transition. The Mail's evolving online strategy could also easily be encompassed by Greig. Perhaps even more smoothly than with Dacre.
It's just about the timing, and no doubt the final not inconsiderable paycheque.
Croydon Council Leader (Mike Fisher) has also applied for Croydon South selection according to the Croydon Advertiser. On the other hand, GLA member Steve O’Connell didn’t apply.
But it's rubbish. The idea he would really threaten the country's most successful editor with a zero hours contract - because he annoyed the socialist leader of Labour (a man who wants to state-censor newspapers, by the by) is beyond silly.
Could be the world's most successful editor. I can't think of any traditional paper anywhere that's handled the transition to online as successfully as the Mail has.
Compare and contrast:
"The Daily Mail & General Trust (DMGT), which owns the Daily Mail, said its profits rose by 10% through improving productivity and efficiency.
Pre-tax profits rose 10% to £255m for the 12 months to the end of September."
"The chief executive of The Guardian has delivered a rather grim verdict about the newspaper’s future (or lack thereof). ‘At the moment, I believe we could not survive in the U.K,’ says Andrew Miller, blaming the ‘oversupply’ of newspapers and the omnipresence of the BBC."
More than 220,000 middle class parents face fines from HMRC in child benefit crackdown
Nearly a quarter of a million middle class parents face a fine from HM Revenue & Customs over their failure to register for self-assessment after claiming child benefit.
But it's rubbish. The idea he would really threaten the country's most successful editor with a zero hours contract - because he annoyed the socialist leader of Labour (a man who wants to state-censor newspapers, by the by) is beyond silly.
Could be the world's most successful editor. I can't think of any traditional paper anywhere that's handled the transition to online as successfully as the Mail has.
Compare and contrast:
"The Daily Mail & General Trust (DMGT), which owns the Daily Mail, said its profits rose by 10% through improving productivity and efficiency.
Pre-tax profits rose 10% to £255m for the 12 months to the end of September."
"The chief executive of The Guardian has delivered a rather grim verdict about the newspaper’s future (or lack thereof). ‘At the moment, I believe we could not survive in the U.K,’ says Andrew Miller, blaming the ‘oversupply’ of newspapers and the omnipresence of the BBC."
If there is an oversupply of newspapers / media outlets then some will close. What's strange is that the CEO of the Guardian assumes that his will be a casualty. After all, some will survive.
Actually, I'm not convinced that any daily paper will survive more than 5-10 years. There's a role for weeklies / magazine periodicals. There's a role for web- / app-delivered up-to-the minute news. There's a role for super-local TV. I don't see a role for the daily morning dead tree press.
Vivalatabloid @tabloidtroll Interesting that a memorial service at one of London's largest hospitals, open to all, has suddenly become "private" in a matter of hours.
''American Way: US debt ceiling debacle as Congress threatens to go nuclear.''
That is a poor article because it fails to explain why the republicans (who are, after all democratic politicians who must face re-election) are prepared to drive their own country to default rather than agree with Obama.
Deals have been Washington's stock in trade since.... er..... Washington. - what's different this time?
I worked at Euromoney for six years, which is part of Associated Press. It was started by people who were previously ion the Mail finance team and it's a lean, money-hungry machine, that's for sure. I remember when the current Lord Rothermere took over. He came to our office to have a look round and everyone thought he was a graduate trainee. I got fired in the end. It was the making of me.
''I've written what I think is quite a decent piece on this, with an angle I've not heard explored yet but which could blow up very quickly (or not). ''
IMF head warns US debt crisis threatens world economy
IMF managing director Christine Lagarde says failure to raise the debt ceiling is a far worse threat to global economy than the current government shutdown.
Is there a market on what rEd will whine about tomorrow?
He'll be complaining that the Editor and Publisher of Britain's most successful online newspaper won't take his calls when he wants them to write a puff piece.
More than 220,000 middle class parents face fines from HMRC in child benefit crackdown
Nearly a quarter of a million middle class parents face a fine from HM Revenue & Customs over their failure to register for self-assessment after claiming child benefit.
More than 220,000 middle class parents face fines from HMRC in child benefit crackdown
Nearly a quarter of a million middle class parents face a fine from HM Revenue & Customs over their failure to register for self-assessment after claiming child benefit.
''I've written what I think is quite a decent piece on this, with an angle I've not heard explored yet but which could blow up very quickly (or not). ''
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
Its interesting in this hyper sensitive time, when we get a week worth of wall to wall coverage of a hatchet job on a leading politician, but somehow this is ok?
Much that I think Farage is a pub bore, especially the first photo, you could set up with anybody you fancy who makes a speech infront of that style of microphone.
But hey it seems the above was all s##ts and giggles, but over-egging Milibands Marxist family background is an absolute no no.
I wonder if this has anything to do with Sue Lloyd-Roberts' Newsnight report a few weeks ago on FGM and the way that girls from this country are taken there to have it performed.
Since the country is tiny in both area and population, it's possible a single Newsnight report could have made quite an impact on the government there.
I wonder if this has anything to do with Sue Lloyd-Roberts' Newsnight report a few weeks ago on FGM and the way that girls from this country are taken there to have it performed.
Since the country is tiny in both area and population, it's possible a single Newsnight report could have made quite an impact on the government there.
Comrade Andy!
Agree, it is sad to see Gambia leave. But I thought the reason is that they don't want to be part of a "Neo-Colonial Institution"
It said it had "decided that The Gambia will never be a member of any neo-colonial institution and will never be a party to any institution that represents an extension of colonialism".
Also:
"Two years ago President Yahya Jammeh accused the UK of backing his political opposition ahead of elections.
There is a history of tension between President Jammeh, who came to power in a 1994 coup, and the UK."
''I've written what I think is quite a decent piece on this, with an angle I've not heard explored yet but which could blow up very quickly (or not). ''
Is it the angle that dare not speak its name?
I couldn't say.
Is that an angle that points out that the awkward part of the Republican party are being awkward since they are no longer beholden to the Republican party as they have right of tea party billionaires directly paying for their campaigns.
When you understand the above its clear whats going to happen. Unless and until Obamacare goes everything else is going on hold.
I worked at Euromoney for six years, which is part of Associated Press. It was started by people who were previously ion the Mail finance team and it's a lean, money-hungry machine, that's for sure. I remember when the current Lord Rothermere took over. He came to our office to have a look round and everyone thought he was a graduate trainee. I got fired in the end. It was the making of me.
Was introduced to Neil Osborn a couple of weeks ago and he wants to have lunch. Did you meet him while he was there / is it a good use of time?
I infer that you don't have any more facts at your disposal than I do, so we're both into the realms of 'reasonable speculation'.
I agree that Ed was placed to know or at least suspect what was going on. To what extent he was in a position to do anything about it can only be a matter of conjecture for us though.
No conjecture necessary however about his brother's decision not to resign from the Cabinet and thereby force Brown's resignation. We can judge that, and I judged it to be a lack of political judgement rather than cowardice.
Would Ed's resignation in the manner you suggest have helped at all? Personally I doubt it. Sure, he'd have had the moral high ground for a bit, but it's a useless bit of real estate, and if he chose to stay and fight from within, I would respect that - if indeed, that's what he did...we just don't know.
Looking forward, I should say Ed is in a pretty good position to clean out the stables. None of the combatants in the Blair/Brown wars would dare lift a finger against him now. Even Balls, I should think, could safely be installed at The Treasury in due course, with a firm warning to behave or go straight to the backbenches.
It's what Blair should have done with Brown, but maybe their personal history made that impossible.
Okay, we can't have evidence, and can only infer from what little has come out so far.
So let's look at it another way. It is clear that the heart of the Labour party was broken for a good number of years, with both sides spreading poisonous briefings. Not about the opposition, but about their own colleagues. This was known about. Careers were ended.
Yet no-one had the moral courage to say: enough. No-one had the intellectual honesty to say that this is not what the Labour Party should be. Instead, they all pretended that nothing was going on, that everything was fine.
They are all culpable in their silence. As are the journalists who also knew full well what was going on: the ones who received the poisonous briefings.
If there is an oversupply of newspapers / media outlets then some will close. What's strange is that the CEO of the Guardian assumes that his will be a casualty. After all, some will survive.
Actually, I'm not convinced that any daily paper will survive more than 5-10 years. There's a role for weeklies / magazine periodicals. There's a role for web- / app-delivered up-to-the minute news. There's a role for super-local TV. I don't see a role for the daily morning dead tree press.
There's easily room for a few Dailys. Sure, eventually online will be utterly dominant but there's still more than enough who like to take a paper for the commute/breakfast or to peruse the sports or celeb gossip during a break, lunch etc. and that's not about to completely vanish in 10 years. Reduce yes but not vanish. Not everyone loves to squint at a phone or is able to easily access a PC online during work. The generations coming might view paper based delivery mechanisms with the same curiosity as a vinyl record but we still have a ways to go before they are the only ones consuming the news.
All the proprietors are looking at evolving online strategies as they know perfectly well nothing is as certain as change on the internet. The accountants are doing the math and all trying to come up with the best way to monetise huge numbers of pageviews as well as how to adapt their content to online.
Anyone who thinks the mail online is the same as the paper edition doesn't have a clue what they are talking about. It's specifically adapted to harvest the greatest number of pageviews. That's why it's so celeb gossip heavy in content along with some innovative and technically brilliant ways of ensuring it's always at or near the top of the stories people are searching for. That it is celeb gossip focused with the usual nods to amusing pet stories, the bizarre 'gasp' stories, cancer/health scares/stories and other long established tabloid mainstays is completely unsurprising too. That stuff works and it's always worked. It might be laughable bollocks most of the time but it gets the pageviews.
'Its interesting in this hyper sensitive time, when we get a week worth of wall to wall coverage of a hatchet job on a leading politician, but somehow this is ok?
@Hayley_Barlow #c4news understands that the 2 MoS journalists suspended today are Amy Iggulden assistant editor features & Jo Knowsley freelance reporter.
That's alright then, if the reporter is a freelance, she doesn't actually work for the MoS, according to tim (if the same rules apply as to Guardian writers......)
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
Doesn't the paper still lose £40 million a year? - Irrespective of it's US readership, if they can't translate that into cold hard cash, how will it survive?
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
Doesn't the paper still lose £40 million a year? - Irrespective of it's US readership, if they can't translate that into cold hard cash, how will it survive?
Minimising tax by the use of legal exemptions and opaque vehicles in dodgy tax havens?
@Hayley_Barlow #c4news understands that the 2 MoS journalists suspended today are Amy Iggulden assistant editor features & Jo Knowsley freelance reporter.
That's alright then, if the reporter is a freelance, she doesn't actually work for the MoS, according to tim (if the same rules apply as to Guardian writers......)
No.......?
I hope the Southam Observers of this world remember this precedent the next time a small business owner sacks employees for attending a funeral.
@Hayley_Barlow #c4news understands that the 2 MoS journalists suspended today are Amy Iggulden assistant editor features & Jo Knowsley freelance reporter.
Is there any other link to that Carlotta please or is it just a tweet?
"Two weeks ago the consensus was that these practices were a dark stain on Labour’s proud heritage. Until the Daily Mail popped up and described Ralph Miliband as the “Man who hated Britain”.
At which point the God-fearing people of Labourstone, Wyoming, all of whom had been calling for the gunslingers be thrown out of town, turned around and screamed in unison, “Quick, Sundance Campbell, get out your six-shooter! The Dacre gang are riding up main-street! Send them to Cemetery Hill!”
I worked at Euromoney for six years, which is part of Associated Press. It was started by people who were previously ion the Mail finance team and it's a lean, money-hungry machine, that's for sure. I remember when the current Lord Rothermere took over. He came to our office to have a look round and everyone thought he was a graduate trainee. I got fired in the end. It was the making of me.
Was introduced to Neil Osborn a couple of weeks ago and he wants to have lunch. Did you meet him while he was there / is it a good use of time?
I knew of him, but did not work with him. He was on Euromoney magazine and I was in a different part of the business. He was certainly pretty senior. I think he was the publisher or publishing director, so responsible for the commercial side of things and Euromoney back then was the company's single biggest revenue earner. But it was 13 years ago that I left and I can't tell you anything about his activities since then. However, I imagine that if his career trajectory continued in the same way it was going he is pretty well connected in the banking/institutional investment world, so is probably worth having a meet with.
"The consequences of Miliband’s open commitment to socialism last week are only just beginning to be felt. One will be a more adversarial relationship between left and right – in print and out of it. The Mail’s treatment of dead, decent, plumb wrong, Marxist but non Britain-hating Ralph Miliband is a sign of this."
I wonder if this has anything to do with Sue Lloyd-Roberts' Newsnight report a few weeks ago on FGM and the way that girls from this country are taken there to have it performed.
Since the country is tiny in both area and population, it's possible a single Newsnight report could have made quite an impact on the government there.
Comrade Andy!
Agree, it is sad to see Gambia leave. But I thought the reason is that they don't want to be part of a "Neo-Colonial Institution"
It said it had "decided that The Gambia will never be a member of any neo-colonial institution and will never be a party to any institution that represents an extension of colonialism".
Also:
"Two years ago President Yahya Jammeh accused the UK of backing his political opposition ahead of elections.
There is a history of tension between President Jammeh, who came to power in a 1994 coup, and the UK."
The Commonwealth hasn't changed recently: if it's a neo-colonial institution now than it always has been, so that doesn't explain why they decided to leave at this particular time.
Something must have happened recently to annoy the Gambian government, something to do with the UK.
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
Doesn't the paper still lose £40 million a year? - Irrespective of it's US readership, if they can't translate that into cold hard cash, how will it survive?
Minimising tax by the use of legal exemptions and opaque vehicles in dodgy tax havens?
They already tried that, it didn't work. - Perhaps they'll go the whole hog this time and move GMG HQ to Lichtenstein?
@Josias - So what you seem to be saying is that a scheme whose details you have not seen and whose details we do not know will not be flexible enough to take into account special cases. OK.
Anyway, clearly we do not agree that there is a big difference between an online publishing company and one that focuses on developing land to build homes. I suppose it's possible that there are significant overlaps which I am missing, but you have not been able to show them. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree and wait to see what the scheme actually entails.
They're not special cases; they're all too common. Or do you think that planning request go through instantaneously? That there are not conditions on many applications? That people and small firms have no trouble with financing? Do you not understand that these things take time?
I don't see why you're incapable of thinking: "Hum. My business isn't affected by this, but if it was, it'd be trouble. I'm glad I'm not them."
Instead, keep on sticking your head in the sand.
As a matter of interest, can any supporters of this plan point to research about how many accepted plans with final approval lapse per year? Surely if they're so in favour of this change, they'll have the figures at their fingertips, ready to show the scale of the problem.
Its interesting in this hyper sensitive time, when we get a week worth of wall to wall coverage of a hatchet job on a leading politician, but somehow this is ok?
Much that I think Farage is a pub bore, especially the first photo, you could set up with anybody you fancy who makes a speech infront of that style of microphone.
But hey it seems the above was all s##ts and giggles, but over-egging Milibands Marxist family background is an absolute no no.
Did any accompanying pieces to the Farage pic accuse him of hating Britain or being evil? If not, I don't think the comparison holds much water.
''American Way: US debt ceiling debacle as Congress threatens to go nuclear.''
That is a poor article because it fails to explain why the republicans (who are, after all democratic politicians who must face re-election) are prepared to drive their own country to default rather than agree with Obama.
Deals have been Washington's stock in trade since.... er..... Washington. - what's different this time?
Although I don't agree with the Republicans on this I can sort of understand their attitude, because they're probably right to view the Health Care Act as potentially the start of a whole new era of interventionist government.
I worked at Euromoney for six years, which is part of Associated Press. It was started by people who were previously ion the Mail finance team and it's a lean, money-hungry machine, that's for sure. I remember when the current Lord Rothermere took over. He came to our office to have a look round and everyone thought he was a graduate trainee. I got fired in the end. It was the making of me.
Was introduced to Neil Osborn a couple of weeks ago and he wants to have lunch. Did you meet him while he was there / is it a good use of time?
I knew of him, but did not work with him. He was on Euromoney magazine and I was in a different part of the business. He was certainly pretty senior. I think he was the publisher or publishing director, so responsible for the commercial side of things and Euromoney back then was the company's single biggest revenue earner. But it was 13 years ago that I left and I can't tell you anything about his activities since then. However, I imagine that if his career trajectory continued in the same way it was going he is pretty well connected in the banking/institutional investment world, so is probably worth having a meet with.
@Hayley_Barlow #c4news understands that the 2 MoS journalists suspended today are Amy Iggulden assistant editor features & Jo Knowsley freelance reporter.
Is there any other link to that Carlotta please or is it just a tweet?
If you've never been to New York - this 360 panorama scene is just brilliant - the size of Central Park is just WOW - I never noticed how big it was when I was there
@Hayley_Barlow #c4news understands that the 2 MoS journalists suspended today are Amy Iggulden assistant editor features & Jo Knowsley freelance reporter.
Is there any other link to that Carlotta please or is it just a tweet?
It was a tweet re-tweeted by Jon Snow......
Thank you. I was simply after a bit more detail but what you posted is about it for the moment. Iggulden is just a wee bit surprising.
When a milk tanker crashed in my then home village in southern Derbyshire, a story appeared in a couple of national papers with a headline of 'The Leak District'. Despite the Peak District being about ten miles to the north ...
For this reason, I expect the 'near' means it happened somewhere in Dorset.
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
What total nonsense. That's like saying "With the users it has, there's no way Blackberry is going out of business" - in about 2008.
Hard to believe you are a businessman. There is EVERY possibility the Guardian will disappear. The same can be said, with varying degrees of certainty, about every major paper in the UK.
Some of them will go under, for sure. The Guardian is fighting with the NYT for the same readership, and the NYT has no intention of losing.
The Guardian's own CEO said it wouldn't be printing editions within the decade...
"The chief executive of The Guardian has delivered a rather grim verdict about the newspaper’s future (or lack thereof). ‘At the moment, I believe we could not survive in the U.K,’ says Andrew Miller, blaming the ‘oversupply’ of newspapers and the omnipresence of the BBC. He has been speaking to the New Yorker magazine which has run one of its brilliant investigations (read it all here) and his verdict is reinforced by the editor, Alan Rusbridger, who (the piece says) ‘can envisage a paperless Guardian in five to ten years’. Rusbridger can also ‘imagine…printing on only certain days’. So the newspaper that came out with the slogan ‘we own the weekend‘ may soon have to add an appendage: ‘Mondays to Fridays… Not so much.’ http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/09/guardian-ceo-the-newspaper-cant-survive-in-the-uk/
Meanwhile the Daily Mail, Sun and Telegraph are making money
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
meh. They'll got to freemium or some other new model. Of which there are no shortage being dreamed up. But none of them works as effectively paywall so they all end up looking like variations of or halfway houses to paywall.
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
Doesn't the paper still lose £40 million a year? - Irrespective of it's US readership, if they can't translate that into cold hard cash, how will it survive?
Minimising tax by the use of legal exemptions and opaque vehicles in dodgy tax havens?
They already tried that, it didn't work. - Perhaps they'll go the whole hog this time and move GMG HQ to Lichtenstein?
Are you sure? How much tax did they pay on the disposal of Auto Traders?
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
What total nonsense. That's like saying "With the users it has, there's no way Blackberry is going out of business" - in about 2008.
Hard to believe you are a businessman. There is EVERY possibility the Guardian will disappear. The same can be said, with varying degrees of certainty, about every major paper in the UK.
Some of them will go under, for sure. The Guardian is fighting with the NYT for the same readership, and the NYT has no intention of losing.
I disagree. The NYT and the Guardian are the second and the third most read online newspapers in the world. They already co-exist. The NYT's style and coverage are very different to the Guardian's. As is its business model, from what I can tell.
Of course there is a *chance* the Guardian will disappear; but it is very doubtful, especially as unlike BlackBerry it does not need to turn a profit, does not have shareholders and has the Scott Trust subsidy cushion. .
BlackBerry should not have disappeared either. Its management made a series of catastrophic decisions. I do not believe the Grauniad's leadership will do the same. Maybe I'm wrong, but if I were to bet I'd say that it will still be around in 10 years time and doing OK, though no doubt as an entirely online operation.
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
Doesn't the paper still lose £40 million a year? - Irrespective of it's US readership, if they can't translate that into cold hard cash, how will it survive?
Minimising tax by the use of legal exemptions and opaque vehicles in dodgy tax havens?
They already tried that, it didn't work. - Perhaps they'll go the whole hog this time and move GMG HQ to Lichtenstein?
Are you sure? How much tax did they pay on the disposal of Auto Traders?
Not quite sure on the figure wrt the sale of Auto trader, but, with the formation of GMG Hazel Acquisition 1 Limited, set up in the Caymans Isles where the corporation tax rate is zero, this ‘ vehicle’ allowed the Guardian Media Group to dodge stamp duty saving itself a £600,000. I believe.
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
If you are using Chrome, use a plugin called MediaHint. It gives your computer a UK IP address (or at least obfuscates your non-UK one) and all the privileges associated with it ;-) I've used it for almost a year now and it works well.
Labour History Group @LabourHistory Support Labour? Enjoy quizzes? Fancy a cash prize? Then get in touch with @LucyRigby to join in our quiz night 23 Oct pic.twitter.com/3jP4FlJ989
The Guardian is no longer a UK paper, which is the point the CEO is making. It is a paper with a UK edition. If you go to the US, the online edition you get is for the US and it is completely different - much to the frustration of people like me looking for football scores.
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
What total nonsense. That's like saying "With the users it has, there's no way Blackberry is going out of business" - in about 2008.
Hard to believe you are a businessman. There is EVERY possibility the Guardian will disappear. The same can be said, with varying degrees of certainty, about every major paper in the UK.
Some of them will go under, for sure. The Guardian is fighting with the NYT for the same readership, and the NYT has no intention of losing.
I disagree. The NYT and the Guardian are the second and the third most read online newspapers in the world.
Does that include when the NYT erected its partial paywall? I thought it went up after October 2012?
Might have a stab at this myself, as a quick glance suggests it might be some form of letter-substitution, with 'E' being 'A' or 'I'. But that might just be an attempt to throw people off ...
Rob Harris @RobHarris Which was 1 of the most viewed websites in UK's Dept for Environment, Food & Rural Affairs (March-Sept)? CricInfo gov.uk/government/upl…
Where did anyone get the idea that Hodges was anything other than a Tory? I've just read his piece 'praising' Campbell's performance on Newsnight as Mark Anthony praised Brutus. He's not even got the subtlety of Iago.He's just blue through and through and good luck to him
"....Okay, we can't have evidence, and can only infer from what little has come out so far.
"So let's look at it another way. It is clear that the heart of the Labour party was broken for a good number of years, with both sides spreading poisonous briefings. Not about the opposition, but about their own colleagues. This was known about. Careers were ended.
"Yet no-one had the moral courage to say: enough. No-one had the intellectual honesty to say that this is not what the Labour Party should be. Instead, they all pretended that nothing was going on, that everything was fine.
"They are all culpable in their silence. As are the journalists who also knew full well what was going on: the ones who received the poisonous briefings."
PtP replies:
I don't have my copy of Rawnesley to hand, Josias, but I remember enough to be sure that it is simply not true that 'they all pretended that nothing was going on'.
On a personal, one-to-one level, Jowell and Prescott, Clarke and Milburn, and others faced the issue head on. There was even one well documented meeting of the PLP at which the Party Leadership was told bluntly to sort it out. Some paid a price for their courage, as you indicated; others remained to fight another day.
It's very easy for us to write bravely from the anonymous safety of our computers but when you're in the firing line, it does take quite a bit of courage to speak out; and then of course there are always those who genuinely believed they were acting in the Party's interest, if not the Country's, by taking the positions they did.
I agree it would be helpful if we were better served by our Press in this regard, but I have long since given up expecting much from that quarter.
PS Sorry about the somewhat awkward layout - having trouble with my Vanilla.
Reacting to news of Hobsbawm's death, Ed Miliband called him "an extraordinary historian, a man passionate about his politics [...] He brought history out of the ivory tower and into people's lives.
Comments
but the question is when?
Rothermere seems to be assuming that all regulatory business can be done in dusted in about a year. I have my doubts and there's no way Dacre wants to leave before it is finished so he can stamp his authority all over it. Even if some of those doing the negotiating on the press side might be praying for it.
Rothermere despises this kind of public spotlight on him and his families past, whatever Dacre's defenders say. So it's hardly be a shock that he would be furious.
Perhaps if he retires at 65 he can draw his pension and then be employed as a consultant or whatever? Am sure there is a reason beyond the obvious...
http://labourpress.tumblr.com/post/62990373673/michael-dugher-letter-to-david-cameron-on-lynton
TBH I dislike the idea that anything which someone doesn't like should be banned or criminalised and all parties are to some extent guilty of this.
I was just contrasting the two pespectives.
http://www.bracknellnews.co.uk/news/bracknell/articles/2013/09/25/93453-bracknell-cat-goes-missing/
The reporter asked whether Prof Keen's daughter wished to comment on the Daily Mail article about Mr Miliband senior and was told "no comment". When the reporter asked again, she was given the same answer, at which point she left."
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mail-sunday-apologises-unreservedly-ed-2334789#ixzz2gfQllZLt
But they have deliberately chosen to escalate the row about a LOTO`s father and employed dubious means inorder to garner supporting evidence for their original contention.
There has to be consequences just like the Mail would expect there to be for politicians,immigrants,teenagers,benefit cheats when they get it wrong.
I doubt the Mail gatecrashed the memorial event to report on his distinguished career in the study and treatment of diabetes.
It's hardly unprecedented for someone to get replaced as they get older. Steafel's predecessor Sinclair retired only a few years ago (rumoured to be because he found out he was never in consideration to replace Dacre) Which leaves the triumverate of Steafel, Verity and Carter still there who would still be doing their job as the go-between for any Dacre replacement and the staff, which would greatly ease the transition. The Mail's evolving online strategy could also easily be encompassed by Greig. Perhaps even more smoothly than with Dacre.
It's just about the timing, and no doubt the final not inconsiderable paycheque.
American Way: US debt ceiling debacle as Congress threatens to go nuclear
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/us-politics/10341419/American-Way-US-debt-ceiling-debacle-as-Congress-threatens-to-go-nuclear.html
US shutdown: White House talks fail to end deadlock
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24378831
Newspapers that understand the market will ultimately win out over ones that think that they should have a subsidy to survive.
BuzzFeedUK BuzzFeed UK 2 Oct
Still the greatest Daily Mail reader letter of all time
pic.twitter.com/aJSqKi1OCS
Capitalism isn't working?
Nearly a quarter of a million middle class parents face a fine from HM Revenue & Customs over their failure to register for self-assessment after claiming child benefit.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/10351171/More-than-220000-middle-class-parents-face-fines-from-HMRC-in-child-benefit-crackdown.html
Who thought of this idea up,some very angry maybe tory voters out there ;-)
Actually, I'm not convinced that any daily paper will survive more than 5-10 years. There's a role for weeklies / magazine periodicals. There's a role for web- / app-delivered up-to-the minute news. There's a role for super-local TV. I don't see a role for the daily morning dead tree press.
Interesting that a memorial service at one of London's largest hospitals, open to all, has suddenly become "private" in a matter of hours.
That is a poor article because it fails to explain why the republicans (who are, after all democratic politicians who must face re-election) are prepared to drive their own country to default rather than agree with Obama.
Deals have been Washington's stock in trade since.... er..... Washington. - what's different this time?
'says Andrew Miller, blaming the ‘oversupply’ of newspapers and the omnipresence of the BBC'
Lefties blaming the BBC for their failure,you couldn't make it up..
Is it the angle that dare not speak its name?
IMF managing director Christine Lagarde says failure to raise the debt ceiling is a far worse threat to global economy than the current government shutdown.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24384759
Paul Dacre is the Joseph Goebbels of British Print Media!
'@avrilpitstone: Excellent. Just heard A Campbell give P Dacre editor Daily Mail credit for current measles epidemic.
Was there a 45 minute warning?
Sadly I earn no where near the headline figure and never have been over the past few years...
'Is there a market on what rEd will whine about tomorrow?'
The BBC causing the demise of the Guardian?
http://www.espn.co.uk/sauber/motorsport/story/127661.html
With the global readership it has, there is absolutely no way the Grauniad is going out of business I'm afraid.
http://beforeitsnews.com/mediadrop/uploads/2013/40/9f78a43f3402865667ded8dc1301d88742d303d4.jpg
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nigel-farage-pictured-hitler-moustache-2287966
Much that I think Farage is a pub bore, especially the first photo, you could set up with anybody you fancy who makes a speech infront of that style of microphone.
But hey it seems the above was all s##ts and giggles, but over-egging Milibands Marxist family background is an absolute no no.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24376127
I wonder if this has anything to do with Sue Lloyd-Roberts' Newsnight report a few weeks ago on FGM and the way that girls from this country are taken there to have it performed.
Since the country is tiny in both area and population, it's possible a single Newsnight report could have made quite an impact on the government there.
Agree, it is sad to see Gambia leave. But I thought the reason is that they don't want to be part of a "Neo-Colonial Institution"
It said it had "decided that The Gambia will never be a member of any neo-colonial institution and will never be a party to any institution that represents an extension of colonialism".
Also:
"Two years ago President Yahya Jammeh accused the UK of backing his political opposition ahead of elections.
There is a history of tension between President Jammeh, who came to power in a 1994 coup, and the UK."
When you understand the above its clear whats going to happen. Unless and until Obamacare goes everything else is going on hold.
So let's look at it another way. It is clear that the heart of the Labour party was broken for a good number of years, with both sides spreading poisonous briefings. Not about the opposition, but about their own colleagues. This was known about. Careers were ended.
Yet no-one had the moral courage to say: enough. No-one had the intellectual honesty to say that this is not what the Labour Party should be. Instead, they all pretended that nothing was going on, that everything was fine.
They are all culpable in their silence. As are the journalists who also knew full well what was going on: the ones who received the poisonous briefings.
There's easily room for a few Dailys. Sure, eventually online will be utterly dominant but there's still more than enough who like to take a paper for the commute/breakfast or to peruse the sports or celeb gossip during a break, lunch etc. and that's not about to completely vanish in 10 years. Reduce yes but not vanish. Not everyone loves to squint at a phone or is able to easily access a PC online during work. The generations coming might view paper based delivery mechanisms with the same curiosity as a vinyl record but we still have a ways to go before they are the only ones consuming the news.
All the proprietors are looking at evolving online strategies as they know perfectly well nothing is as certain as change on the internet. The accountants are doing the math and all trying to come up with the best way to monetise huge numbers of pageviews as well as how to adapt their content to online.
Anyone who thinks the mail online is the same as the paper edition doesn't have a clue what they are talking about. It's specifically adapted to harvest the greatest number of pageviews. That's why it's so celeb gossip heavy in content along with some innovative and technically brilliant ways of ensuring it's always at or near the top of the stories people are searching for. That it is celeb gossip focused with the usual nods to amusing pet stories, the bizarre 'gasp' stories, cancer/health scares/stories and other long established tabloid mainstays is completely unsurprising too. That stuff works and it's always worked. It might be laughable bollocks most of the time but it gets the pageviews.
'Its interesting in this hyper sensitive time, when we get a week worth of wall to wall coverage of a hatchet job on a leading politician, but somehow this is ok?
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/nigel-farage-pictured-hitler-moustache-2287966
Maybe someone could ask a high minded commentator like Comical Ali?
#c4news understands that the 2 MoS journalists suspended today are Amy Iggulden assistant editor features & Jo Knowsley freelance reporter.
That's alright then, if the reporter is a freelance, she doesn't actually work for the MoS, according to tim (if the same rules apply as to Guardian writers......)
No.......?
"Two weeks ago the consensus was that these practices were a dark stain on Labour’s proud heritage. Until the Daily Mail popped up and described Ralph Miliband as the “Man who hated Britain”.
At which point the God-fearing people of Labourstone, Wyoming, all of whom had been calling for the gunslingers be thrown out of town, turned around and screamed in unison, “Quick, Sundance Campbell, get out your six-shooter! The Dacre gang are riding up main-street! Send them to Cemetery Hill!”
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100239602/labour-needs-more-alastair-campbells-and-damian-mcbrides-the-next-election-will-be-brutal/
"The consequences of Miliband’s open commitment to socialism last week are only just beginning to be felt. One will be a more adversarial relationship between left and right – in print and out of it. The Mail’s treatment of dead, decent, plumb wrong, Marxist but non Britain-hating Ralph Miliband is a sign of this."
http://www.conservativehome.com/thetorydiary/2013/10/ralph-miliband-plumb-wrong-but-hater-of-britain.html
Something must have happened recently to annoy the Gambian government, something to do with the UK.
I don't see why you're incapable of thinking: "Hum. My business isn't affected by this, but if it was, it'd be trouble. I'm glad I'm not them."
Instead, keep on sticking your head in the sand.
As a matter of interest, can any supporters of this plan point to research about how many accepted plans with final approval lapse per year? Surely if they're so in favour of this change, they'll have the figures at their fingertips, ready to show the scale of the problem.
http://www.lewiswhyld.com/top-of-the-rock/
For this reason, I expect the 'near' means it happened somewhere in Dorset.
"The chief executive of The Guardian has delivered a rather grim verdict about the newspaper’s future (or lack thereof). ‘At the moment, I believe we could not survive in the U.K,’ says Andrew Miller, blaming the ‘oversupply’ of newspapers and the omnipresence of the BBC. He has been speaking to the New Yorker magazine which has run one of its brilliant investigations (read it all here) and his verdict is reinforced by the editor, Alan Rusbridger, who (the piece says) ‘can envisage a paperless Guardian in five to ten years’. Rusbridger can also ‘imagine…printing on only certain days’. So the newspaper that came out with the slogan ‘we own the weekend‘ may soon have to add an appendage: ‘Mondays to Fridays… Not so much.’ http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/09/guardian-ceo-the-newspaper-cant-survive-in-the-uk/
Meanwhile the Daily Mail, Sun and Telegraph are making money
http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/politics/ralph-miliband-and-the-complicated-story-of-refugees/#.Uk2LHRaIqzc
Of course there is a *chance* the Guardian will disappear; but it is very doubtful, especially as unlike BlackBerry it does not need to turn a profit, does not have shareholders and has the Scott Trust subsidy cushion. .
BlackBerry should not have disappeared either. Its management made a series of catastrophic decisions. I do not believe the Grauniad's leadership will do the same. Maybe I'm wrong, but if I were to bet I'd say that it will still be around in 10 years time and doing OK, though no doubt as an entirely online operation.
MT @martincoyne1: my grandad reads @guardian and flew bombers in WW2. He still feels bad about what he and his comrades did to Coventry
Support Labour? Enjoy quizzes? Fancy a cash prize? Then get in touch with @LucyRigby to join in our quiz night 23 Oct pic.twitter.com/3jP4FlJ989
http://www.comscoredatamine.com/2012/12/most-read-online-newspapers-in-the-world-mail-online-new-york-times-and-the-guardian/
Five discoveries in physics that could change the world.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24282059
They're all a bit 'meh' to me. The new discovery that will most change the world will slap us hard in the face when we're least expecting it.
Edit: and they've got a quiz set by GCHQ at:
http://blog.physicsworld.com/2013/10/03/physics-world-at-25-puzzle-1/
Might have a stab at this myself, as a quick glance suggests it might be some form of letter-substitution, with 'E' being 'A' or 'I'. But that might just be an attempt to throw people off ...
If I don't succeed, I'll set Mrs J onto it... ;-)
Rob Harris @RobHarris
Which was 1 of the most viewed websites in UK's Dept for Environment, Food & Rural Affairs (March-Sept)? CricInfo gov.uk/government/upl…
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/246104/RFI5781-Defra_most_accessed_websites.pdf
"....Okay, we can't have evidence, and can only infer from what little has come out so far.
"So let's look at it another way. It is clear that the heart of the Labour party was broken for a good number of years, with both sides spreading poisonous briefings. Not about the opposition, but about their own colleagues. This was known about. Careers were ended.
"Yet no-one had the moral courage to say: enough. No-one had the intellectual honesty to say that this is not what the Labour Party should be. Instead, they all pretended that nothing was going on, that everything was fine.
"They are all culpable in their silence. As are the journalists who also knew full well what was going on: the ones who received the poisonous briefings."
PtP replies:
I don't have my copy of Rawnesley to hand, Josias, but I remember enough to be sure that it is simply not true that 'they all pretended that nothing was going on'.
On a personal, one-to-one level, Jowell and Prescott, Clarke and Milburn, and others faced the issue head on. There was even one well documented meeting of the PLP at which the Party Leadership was told bluntly to sort it out. Some paid a price for their courage, as you indicated; others remained to fight another day.
It's very easy for us to write bravely from the anonymous safety of our computers but when you're in the firing line, it does take quite a bit of courage to speak out; and then of course there are always those who genuinely believed they were acting in the Party's interest, if not the Country's, by taking the positions they did.
I agree it would be helpful if we were better served by our Press in this regard, but I have long since given up expecting much from that quarter.
PS Sorry about the somewhat awkward layout - having trouble with my Vanilla.
"Interesting piece in Prospect on the differing backgrounds of Britain's Jewish refugees:"
Excellent article Carlotta. How pleasant to read something with content.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hobsbawm
Here's an interesting extract
Reacting to news of Hobsbawm's death, Ed Miliband called him "an extraordinary historian, a man passionate about his politics [...] He brought history out of the ivory tower and into people's lives.