Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
You really think most Britons have not travelled outside Europe? I don't have the figures but I'd be surprised if most haven't been further at least once.
Europe and north African islands that could effectively be part of Europe - yes I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
I would imagine that there would be a large correlation between the groups and that well-travelled people will indeed largely be a sub-set of the 44%.
Personally I've been to all of the above apart from South America.
As for the Leave/Remain split I'm not sure if it would be that dramatic. Older people have had more opportunities to travel and to learn the foibles of the EU and see the bigger world outside it. Younger naive Remainers may not have had as many opportunities to leave Europe yet.
"Twenty-two percent of Britons have never travelled on a plane and one in four have never visited a capital city in Europe,while nearly a third (29 per cent) have never travelled outside of Europe, and a fifth have never been to a beach, according to new research.
Though to be fair the original claim included not just Europe but north African islands like Tenerife. Its also worth noting that the distance between London and Tenerife (or even Edinburgh and Tenerife) is well under half of that between Seattle and Orlando.
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Avoiding the runway vote on monday is an act of shear folly for his career. If he cannot vote against and accept the consequences he cannot be PM of the UK
Mind you I fully support runway 3 and also no 4
Yes, well done to the government for whipping the vote, even if it was at the cost of a minor resignation and Boris needing to find a way to be somewhere else.
My only annoyance is that they’re not legislating for runway 4 at the same time, they should really be planning to start building that on the day R3 opens.
May well see the SNP vote with the government for once
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months (until he spat his dummy because the self confessed Corbyn supporting journo asked one tough question) and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
"Twenty-two percent of Britons have never travelled on a plane and one in four have never visited a capital city in Europe,while nearly a third (29 per cent) have never travelled outside of Europe, and a fifth have never been to a beach, according to new research.
I would be extremely dubious of that claim especially when it says only 42% have been to the USA unless it included Tenerife and Turkey as 'outside Europe' in a similar way Americans could say going to Canada or Mexico is 'outside the USA'.
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
Jez is, and always has been, a hard Brexit supporter. His 7/10 for remain comment was devastating. Much like the Queen's supposed "give me three good reasons why we should remain" was pretty difficult for the remain side to deal with.
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
And when Brexit has happened? And those who put their faith in Corbyn FINALLY see that he had no intention of getting in the way of delivering Brexit? Or of ever overturning it? What then, for that army of Remain-voting Corbynistas? Looks like a whole army of converts for the Can't Be Arsed Party next time around.....
Delors was spectacularly successful, but at a price, he turned enough of the U.K. electorate (mostly on the right) from mildly positive to so negative they were set on the exit path.
A great read......I would arguethat the populist UK right, aided by the Daily Mail, Express and a misguided sense of nostalgia of a B&W 1950s Britain were what turned folk against the EU -we suffer from a very powerful nostalgia and to this day I see it as one of the national malaise
Nostalgia is the dominant force on the left and the right. The UK gives every sign of being a country that believes its best days are in the past.
Astute point. "Global Britain" is a image of bygone age that people prefer to a disconcerting present and future.
Believe me that that’s not how the rest of the world see a G7 country, member of the Security Council, soon to be the 4th biggest voice on the World Trade Organisation and one of the easiest countries in the world to do business or set up a business.
The rest of the world sees a country inflicting harm on itself for no discernable gain.
Disagree. 90% of world growth in the coming years will be outside the EU. As that organisation becomes increasingly protectionist, insular and overbearing with regulation, the biggest opportunities lie elsewhere. Like every change it will take some adjustment, but those companies willing to seize the opportunities will do very well in the future. A decade from now, I believe that most people will only be complaining that we didn’t leave the EU earlier.
Not obvious from this chart why leaving "protectionist, insular" EU, which does a lot more international trade than we do, helps the UK
Really?It is pretty demomstrable from that chart that non-EU countries have far more economic growth than EU ones, and they are the ones we should piggy back off.
Also, your fact is wrong. The UK exports a higher percentage of GDP to non-EU markets than the EU does.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
"Twenty-two percent of Britons have never travelled on a plane and one in four have never visited a capital city in Europe,while nearly a third (29 per cent) have never travelled outside of Europe, and a fifth have never been to a beach, according to new research.
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have never been to North America even if that is lower than the 72% of Americans who have never been to Europe.
70% of Britons have never been to Africa, 73% of Britons have never been to Asia and 86% of Britons have never been to Australia though over 90% have been to continental Europe.
And yes most of those going to Asia, Australia and Africa will be subsets of those going to N America on travel and flight costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
"Twenty-two percent of Britons have never travelled on a plane and one in four have never visited a capital city in Europe,while nearly a third (29 per cent) have never travelled outside of Europe, and a fifth have never been to a beach, according to new research.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months (until he spat his dummy because the self confessed Corbyn supporting journo asked one tough question) and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
The Labour leadership's position on the EU referendum campaign was dreadful...no leadership was shown at all...
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
Keep trying, you might even convince yourself. They caught his team on camera doing exactly the opposite.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
Is that first sentence surprising? We’re an offshore European island, there are dozens (probably hundreds in high summer) of cheap flights daily and hundreds of holiday offers.
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
I keep receiving emails from my local Labour PPC asking me to help with door knocking in Norwich North despite not having been a party member since the end of 1996 - though I did sign up as a supporter in order to vote in the 2015 Leadership Election.I have now replied to her directly informing her that I have no intention of supporting a gender-vetted candidate at the next election.
I think one of the mistakes the pro remain media did was not to give more air time to the Corbyn campaign to remain in. I believe that would have done far more to convince Labour voters than the Alan Johnson official Labour remain campaign. I think there was more interest in continuing the Labour civil war which intensified just after the vote than winning the vote itself.
In the end the media were far more interested in the Tory fight anyway. For all the blame to go around I think the pro remain media has to look at itself as well as pointing the finger at others.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
And when Brexit has happened? And those who put their faith in Corbyn FINALLY see that he had no intention of getting in the way of delivering Brexit? Or of ever overturning it? What then, for that army of Remain-voting Corbynistas? Looks like a whole army of converts for the Can't Be Arsed Party next time around.....
I don't know if you missed the original comments but the discussion is centred around the actual referendum rather than overturning the referendum via a general election. So it would be voting for remain rather than voting for Corbyn, although you might have inadvertently somewhat made my point for me. Being anti Corbyn was more important than pro remain, in the end they might not get their way on either.
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have never been to North America even if that is lower than the 72% of Americans who right.
No. You were wrong.
"Twenty-two percent of Britons have never travelled on a plane and one in four have never visited a capital city in Europe,while nearly a third (29 per cent) have never travelled outside of Europe, and a fifth have never been to a beach, according to new research.
Now that the Tories have sacrificed fiscal responsibility and business on the altar of Brexit purity, what exactly can they pitch at the next election?
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have never been to North America even if that is lower than the 72% of Americans who have never been to Europe.
70% of Britons have never been to Africa, 73% of Britons have never been to Asia and 86% of Britons have never been to Australia though over 90% have been to continental Europe.
20% of Brits have never been to a beach? That’s over 10 million people. I find that impossible to believe.
And 30% have been to Africa - seriosly???? That’s over 15 million. Really????
There are lots of flights to North African holiday destinations and relatively cheap offers to South Africa. I do find the figure about the beach surprising, though, although I don’t think beach/sun holidays are as popular with the non-Europeans who have settled here as with European-type residents.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is at well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
Is that first sentence surprising? We’re an offshore European island, there are dozens (probably hundreds in high summer) of cheap flights daily and hundreds of holiday offers.
Cost of flights is of course key, the longer the flight, the more the cost
There are lots of flights to North African holiday destinations and relatively cheap offers to South Africa. I do find the figure about the beach surprising, though, although I don’t think beach/sun holidays are as popular with the non-Europeans who have settled here as with European-type residents.
Before the terrorists attacks in North Africa, places like Tunisia and Egypt were very popular as much cheaper than Spain or Portugal. A quick google shows 1.5 million Brits went on vacation to Egypt in 2010.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Now that the Tories have sacrificed fiscal responsibility and business on the altar of Brexit purity, what exactly can they pitch at the next election?
Regaining sovereignty and reducing immigration for the 17 million who voted Leave, keeping out Corbyn for the business community
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
Jez is, and always has been, a hard Brexit supporter. His 7/10 for remain comment was devastating. Much like the Queen's supposed "give me three good reasons why we should remain" was pretty difficult for the remain side to deal with.
I've never understood the logic to this, if you are slightly eurosceptic or considering voting leave a bare faced lie claiming the EU is 10/10 isn't going to convince you, a more honest 7/10 assessment might not either but it is probably better.
Although I wonder if this is part of why Corbyn appeals to younger people and not older people. I prefer the honesty, it wouldn't have changed my vote but Corbyn saying the EU is 10/10 would have just been a lie, I'm sure anyone who looks at it can come up with flaws with the EU. If I was wavering on a subject I'd more likely vote for something that someone honestly assessed as good even if they could see flaws rather than pretend it is perfect. I get the feeling older voters like more certainty though, either the EU must be great or terrible. It is either the Germans taking over again and we must get our independence back or I can't think of much here other than criticising someone for only calling it 7/10... most of the EU is great stuff seemed to centre around the absence of it being bad.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
That's a really good article, David - it manages to be topical yet looking at the roots of an issue, and also lightish-hearted but quite deep. You really are a very good writer. Many thanks.
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
"Brexit and Betrayal"? Shouldn't hebe celebrating success on the second anniversary of independence day?
Today is a day for straight to WTO terms, no exit bill and transition period and slam the doors shut to immigrants on our way out diehard Brexiteers and straight back to the EU and the single market and customs union and maybe even add the Euro and Schengen too diehard Remainers, those in the middle will stay away from central London today on the Brexit anniversary
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is at well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
Is that first sentence surprising? We’re an offshore European island, there are dozens (probably hundreds in high summer) of cheap flights daily and hundreds of holiday offers.
Cost of flights is of course key, the longer the flight, the more the cost
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea.
Did the Royals and the hangers-on really get that our of hand at the wedding?
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
Turkey is not technically in Asia, it is in Asia. But I applaud the logic of excluding the bits of Asia which Britons have been to, from counting as evidence that Britons have been to Asia.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
Turkey is not technically in Asia, it is in Asia. But I applaud the logic of excluding the bits of Asia which Britons have been to, from counting as evidence that Britons have been to Asia.
Now that the Tories have sacrificed fiscal responsibility and business on the altar of Brexit purity, what exactly can they pitch at the next election?
Leaving aside the implications, "Fuck business" is a great slogan. Short, memorable.and differentiating.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
Keep trying, you might even convince yourself. They caught his team on camera doing exactly the opposite.
They caught him on camera doing the opposite to speaking at rallies and meetings?
I wasn't claiming he was permanently talking at rallies and meetings, I imagine he slept and other things but video evidence of him not being at a rally or a meeting during the EU referendum doesn't prove he didn't attend one any more than video evidence of him not being at a rally or meeting during the election campaign proves he didn't attend one.
Edit: another thought that crossed my mind yesterday, what if ide.
Considerinciopath.
Given the U
Most Trump voters have absolutely no idea what Brexit is.
They do, Br
This is palpable nonsense. But I know you will dig in and refuse to
You really think mostst haven't been further at least once.
Europe and norths the case.
Google to the rescue again:
"Aside from Europe, North America is the most popular holiday spot for Britons, with 44% of British adults saying they have been. Africa (30%) is the second most popular destination, and 27% of Britons have also been to Asia. 14% have been to Australia and 12% have been to South America."
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have light costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
opean-capital/
I would be extremely dubious of td Turkey etc.
Indeed
Yep, if you don't like the evidence, just ignore it.
The evidence is clear that the only continent the majority of Britons have travelled to is Europe, Turkey is technically in Asia though with just a slice in Europe and Tenerife is off Africa though technically part of Spain (which may confuse those sampled) which would distort the figures for those saying they 'have travelled outside Europe'
Turkey is not technically in Asia, it is in Asia. But I applaud the logic of excluding the bits of Asia which Britons have been to, from counting as evidence that Britons have been to Asia.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
I'm not talking about interviews with him, much in the same way as the election he's at his best campaigning to people rather than doing interviews. If journalists were shooting and covering that and Corbyn's remain message but getting stopped by Corbyn then fair enough, I suspect they had their own agenda/thoughts that guided how they covered things and it didn't produce the result they wanted.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
Keep trying, you might even convince yourself. They caught his team on camera doing exactly the opposite.
They caught him on camera doing the opposite to speaking at rallies and meetings?
I wasn't claiming he was permanently talking at rallies and meetings, I imagine he slept and other things but video evidence of him not being at a rally or a meeting during the EU referendum doesn't prove he didn't attend one any more than video evidence of him not being at a rally or meeting during the election campaign proves he didn't attend one.
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
The posh go to Goodwood more than Ascot now and the polo at Cowdray Park
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea.
Did the Royals and the hangers-on really get that our of hand at the wedding?
Ha, ha! No, apparently the wedding party and the hordes of onlookers were well behaved as far as I'm aware, though I wasn't around that weekend. It's just Royal Ascot that attracts this unsavoury mix of wide boys and chinless wonders. I think that just because they're attending an event with 'Royal' in the title it gives them delusions of grandeur and a perceived licence to be an areshole. All rather sad really.
So, unless the Britons going to Africa, Aisa, Australia and S. America are sub-sets of the 44% who have been to N America, it seems that well over 50% of Britons have travelled beyond Europe (unsurprisingly).
(It'd be interesting to see that as a Leave/Remain split )
So 56% of Britons have never been to North America even if that is lower than the 72% of Americans who have never been to Europe.
70% of Britons have never been to Africa, 73% of Britons have never been to Asia and 86% of Britons have never been to Australia though over 90% have been to continental Europe.
And yes most of those going to Asia, Australia and Africa will be subsets of those going to N America on travel and flight costs principally so I was right.
No. You were wrong.
"Twenty-two percent of Britons have never travelled on a plane and one in four have never visited a capital city in Europe,while nearly a third (29 per cent) have never travelled outside of Europe, and a fifth have never been to a beach, according to new research.
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
One thing that racecourses are really good at is segregating attendees, with separate entrances and facilities. They never see each other all day until they get to the station in the evening.
AIUI the old “Silver Ring” chav zone at Ascot has now been moved from the 4 furlong pole next to the grandstand, across the track into the middle. They’ll barely see a horse all day, let alone those who paid good money for grandstand tickets or the Royal Enclosure.
That's a really good article, David - it manages to be topical yet looking at the roots of an issue, and also lightish-hearted but quite deep. You really are a very good writer. Many thanks.
I liked the subtle biblical allusion in the title. Brexit starts with genesis, and ends in the apocalypse
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
One thing that racecourses are really good at is segregating attendees, with separate entrances and facilities. They never see each other all day until they get to the station in the evening.
AIUI the old “Silver Ring” chav zone at Ascot has now been moved from the 4 furlong pole next to the grandstand, across the track into the middle. They’ll barely see a horse all day.
Surprised the Gruardian haven't been all over this setup...poor doors are totally unacceptable ;-)
Now that the Tories have sacrificed fiscal responsibility and business on the altar of Brexit purity, what exactly can they pitch at the next election?
Leaving aside the implications, "Fuck business" is a great slogan. Short, memorable.and differentiating.
Can you imagine the uproar if McDonnell had said it?
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea.
Did the Royals and the hangers-on really get that our of hand at the wedding?
Ha, ha! No, apparently the wedding party and the hordes of onlookers were well behaved as far as I'm aware, though I wasn't around that weekend. It's just Royal Ascot that attracts this unsavoury mix of wide boys and chinless wonders. I think that just because they're attending an event with 'Royal' in the title it gives them delusions of grandeur and a perceived licence to be an areshole. All rather sad really.
There is some truth in that.
Far too many people simply don’t know how to behave.
Now that the Tories have sacrificed fiscal responsibility and business on the altar of Brexit purity, what exactly can they pitch at the next election?
Leaving aside the implications, "Fuck business" is a great slogan. Short, memorable.and differentiating.
Can you imagine the uproar if McDonnell had said it?
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
Keep trying, you might even convince yourself. They caught his team on camera doing exactly the opposite.
They caught him on camera doing the opposite to speaking at rallies and meetings?
I wasn't claiming he was permanently talking at rallies and meetings, I imagine he slept and other things but video evidence of him not being at a rally or a meeting during the EU referendum doesn't prove he didn't attend one any more than video evidence of him not being at a rally or meeting during the election campaign proves he didn't attend one.
Go do your research.
I accepted your point, like the election he was certainly not at rallies and meetings at different times, with video evidence proof of it I imagine....
I just don't accept your overall point that is proof that he didn't speak at rallies and meetings, for one he certainly did, for two filming him not doing so is not actually the equivalent of him not doing so. It only proves he wasn't at those moments.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
He didn't want to be part of the official campaigns for good reason but he certainly did speak at rallies and meetings across the country, the fact some pro remain journalists were more interested in attacking/ignoring Corbyn than staying in the EU is something for them to consider as we leave.
Keep trying, you might even convince yourself. They caught his team on camera doing exactly the opposite.
They caught him on camera doing the opposite to speaking at rallies and meetings?
I wasn't claiming he was permanently talking at rallies and meetings, I imagine he slept and other things but video evidence of him not being at a rally or a meeting during the EU referendum doesn't prove he didn't attend one any more than video evidence of him not being at a rally or meeting during the election campaign proves he didn't attend one.
Go do your research.
I accepted your point, like the election he was certainly not at rallies and meetings at different times, with video evidence proof of it I imagine....
I just don't accept your overall point that is proof that he didn't speak at rallies and meetings, for one he certainly did, for two filming him not doing so is not actually the equivalent of him not doing so. It only proves he wasn't at those moments.
I never said he didn't speak at all. You are desperately spinning. He was asked to do more, much more, to be involved in a high energy campaign, to do a lot more with Alan Johnson, and he declined.
It was caught in the Vice documentary, where they had a meeting to arrange all this and it was clear Jezza wasn't going to do it.
And then you were moaning that why were the Remain media not giving more airtime to Jezza pitch, why concentrate on Johnson...its because Labour tried to get Jezza to be fully involved and he wouldn't do it.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Imagine if all those people marching in London today calling for a second referendum had only got off their arses and marched up to voters' front doors at the time of the first referendum and sold their pro-EU message......
yeah, you're right. It would have been nearer to 55:45 remain.
Perhaps they were not inspired by the Conservative leadership of the Remain campaign. I certainly wasn`t.
Enjoy your day in the sun in London....
Just leaving home with six neighbours for the #peoplesvotemarch. I suspect it will be big.
Depends what you define as big,
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
We have agreed an FTA with Japan (via the EU), awaiting sign off, as well as a good percentage of the RoW. The USA and China are the obvious big exceptions, but the former seems more keen on trade wars than agreements at present.
We will of course dropout of the EU FTA's shortly.
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
One thing that racecourses are really good at is segregating attendees, with separate entrances and facilities. They never see each other all day until they get to the station in the evening.
AIUI the old “Silver Ring” chav zone at Ascot has now been moved from the 4 furlong pole next to the grandstand, across the track into the middle. They’ll barely see a horse all day.
Surprised the Gruardian haven't been all over this setup...poor doors are totally unacceptable ;-)
Ha, they’d probably be writing about the people they can see across the track - from their nice seat in a grandstand hospitality box!
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
They matter, but multilateral agreements are much better if the aim is to increase overall trade
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
One thing that racecourses are really good at is segregating attendees, with separate entrances and facilities. They never see each other all day until they get to the station in the evening.
AIUI the old “Silver Ring” chav zone at Ascot has now been moved from the 4 furlong pole next to the grandstand, across the track into the middle. They’ll barely see a horse all day, let alone those who paid good money for grandstand tickets or the Royal Enclosure.
We’re on an organised ‘welcome’ trip to Chelmsford City races in August. First time I’ve been for ages and I don’t think my wife’s ever been. We used to go to the dogs now and then when there was a track near where we lived.
You obviously didn't watch the Vice special on Jezza....he declined / made himself unavailable numerous times.
You obviously didn't see it. They followed him around for months and it was shown he turned down opportunities to speak at rallies / events, and basically made it nearly impossible to get him to do anything.
Keep trying, you might even convince yourself. They caught his team on camera doing exactly the opposite.
They caught him on camera doing the opposite to speaking at rallies and meetings?
I wasn't claiming he was permanently talking at rallies and meetings, I imagine he slept and other things but video evidence of him not being at a rally or a meeting during the EU referendum doesn't prove he didn't attend one any more than video evidence of him not being at a rally or meeting during the election campaign proves he didn't attend one.
Go do your research.
I accepted your point, like the election he was certainly not at rallies and meetings at different times, with video evidence proof of it I imagine....
I just don't accept your overall point that is proof that he didn't speak at rallies and meetings, for one he certainly did, for two filming him not doing so is not actually the equivalent of him not doing so. It only proves he wasn't at those moments.
I never said he didn't speak at all. You are desperately spinning. He was asked to do more, much more, to be involved in a high energy campaign, to do a lot more with Alan Johnson, and he declined.
It was caught in the Vice documentary, where they had a meeting to arrange all this and it was clear Jezza wasn't going to do it.
And then you were moaning that why were the Remain media not giving more airtime to Jezza pitch, why concentrate on Johnson...its because Labour tried to get Jezza to be fully involved and he wouldn't do it.
To be fair you weren't making it exactly clear what you were getting at. He didn't attach himself to any of the official campaigns after the experience in Scotland, whilst getting a remain vote is/was important getting a future Labour government is the bigger consideration.
I have far bigger complaints about the media if I just wanted to moan about them, I just feel when they are assigning blame they never seem to think about their own part, usually happy to acknowledge the influence of the Daily Mail though.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
They matter, but multilateral agreements are much better if the aim is to increase overall trade
So how many non-European nations with an economy larger than ours has the EU reached a multilateral agreement with?
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
They matter, but multilateral agreements are much better if the aim is to increase overall trade
So how many non-European nations with an economy larger than ours has the EU reached a multilateral agreement with?
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
They matter, but multilateral agreements are much better if the aim is to increase overall trade
So how many non-European nations with an economy larger than ours has the EU reached a multilateral agreement with?
On its own, of little significance, but it’s just possible the ‘vote against Trump’s enablers’ call will get som traction.
Of the last 10 midterms in a President's first term, the President's party has lost seats in 9 of them and control of at least one chamber of Congress in 4 of them so he is really just going with the tide which will be anti GOP in November anyway and Trump or no Trump that would likely still be the case
A very good article . However, he understates the extent of grade inflation because the analysis only begins with the early 1990s. By that thime there was already a great deal of inflation built into the system when compared to the 60s and 70s .In that earlier period circa 60% of students graduated with a 2.2 and Third class degrees were much common than Firsts.At many Russell Group universities , discursive subjects such as English - History - Politics - Philosophy et al saw no Firsts awarded in most academic years.
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
They matter, but multilateral agreements are much better if the aim is to increase overall trade
So how many non-European nations with an economy larger than ours has the EU reached a multilateral agreement with?
All of them. It's called the WTO.
Fantastic! So let’s take up our seat at the WTO and argue for free trade on a global scale - as opposed to the protectionist tariff regime of the EU.
There are lots of flights to North African holiday destinations and relatively cheap offers to South Africa. I do find the figure about the beach surprising, though, although I don’t think beach/sun holidays are as popular with the non-Europeans who have settled here as with European-type residents.
Before the terrorists attacks in North Africa, places like Tunisia and Egypt were very popular as much cheaper than Spain or Portugal. A quick google shows 1.5 million Brits went on vacation to Egypt in 2010.
The Gulf states are popular too now, and add in people born in Africa, but probably the biggest factor that may skew the results through poor sampling is muslims going to Mecca (Hajj).
Checked the figures. Non eu trade is 33% of GDP for the UK and 35% for the EU as a whole So not a huge difference. Intra EU trade much higher for eurozone countries thanks to the EU breaking down barriers Brexit Britain wants to reinstate.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
No intra-EU trade is much higher for Eurozone nations for them physically bordering each other in a way we don't. For many EU nations trade going the distance of Edinburgh to London would class as INTRA-EU but it doesn't for us.
The point is, less UK EU trade simply reflects our lower trade overall. It isn't because the EU is protectionist and holding us back. The opposite in fact.
So we have a free trade agreement with the USA? Or China? Or Japan? In fact name one non-European nation with an economy larger than ours that we have a free trade agreement with.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
The EU is not a free trade agreement. It’s an integrated internal market.
Yet our proportion of trade with the EU has shrank year on year relative to the rest of the world. Funny that. Anyway do free trade agreements matter or not in your eyes?
They matter, but multilateral agreements are much better if the aim is to increase overall trade
So how many non-European nations with an economy larger than ours has the EU reached a multilateral agreement with?
All of them. It's called the WTO.
So WTO terms are good enough?
They're progress compared with what went before but they apply between political entities, not within them. WTO rules are no more appropriate for trade between England and France than they are for trade between England and Scotland.
On its own, of little significance, but it’s just possible the ‘vote against Trump’s enablers’ call will get som traction.
Of the last 10 midterms in a President's first term, the President's party has lost seats in 9 of them and control of at least one chamber of Congress in 4 of them so he is really just going with the tide which will be anti GOP in November anyway and Trump or no Trump that would likely still be the case
The Republican Party is going through an identity crisis. We need to decide who we are. I believe we are meant to be the party of individual freedom, and I believe in the building blocks of what will get you there — ranging from limited government, taxes and spending to open markets and free trade.
I have all the merit badges and hard-fought votes to demonstrate my allegiance to those ideals. But voters in this election did not value this as much as they did fidelity to our president. In fact, on election night, my opponent proclaimed in her victory speech that “we are the party of Donald J. Trump.”...
F1: rain possible for both qualifying and the race. Would certainly be a good thing if track concerns are accurate.
They really ought to hold preseason testing at Paul Richard next year - they could then try out which of the 180 odd possible layouts works best for F1....
At Aldershot station this morning: one lonely middle aged guy wearing an EU t-shirt with his resigned wife; twenty people all dressed up in suits and fascinators going to Royal Ascot.
Which event should I go to to avoid elitists?
Ascot.
Judging by the sound and style of the majority of the people on my train, it’s popular with the masses too.
Horrible people. I live in Windsor and Ascot week is dreaded. Imagine the most obnoxious drunken tw*ts from across the social spectrum descending upon one town and you'll get an idea. On Thursday I was abused by one 'racegoer' as I was walking home. A few years ago one attempted to rob me. Awful occasion. Awful drunken, nasty yobs.
Yes, unfortunately it does attract a few chavs. There is also quite a police presence here too.
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
It does seem like the various big race festivals have now become big chav magnets.
One thing that racecourses are really good at is segregating attendees, with separate entrances and facilities. They never see each other all day until they get to the station in the evening.
AIUI the old “Silver Ring” chav zone at Ascot has now been moved from the 4 furlong pole next to the grandstand, across the track into the middle. They’ll barely see a horse all day, let alone those who paid good money for grandstand tickets or the Royal Enclosure.
We’re on an organised ‘welcome’ trip to Chelmsford City races in August. First time I’ve been for ages and I don’t think my wife’s ever been. We used to go to the dogs now and then when there was a track near where we lived.
Good luck but I fear they'll try to bore you with a lot of uninteresting behind-the-scenes detail about stabling, drug testing and so on. The appeal of racing, indeed most sport, is that it is pretty obvious what is happening and that every now and then, you will see something jaw-dropping as God sets foot on a racecourse, football pitch or running track.
Comments
Momentum chief Jon Lansman's 'run on pound' fear
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44582711
You know they will blame everything that goes wrong on the resistance of the global elite.
- Turkey
- South Africa
- Kuwait
- Saudi Arabia
- Jamaica
- South Korea
But never in an EU country.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/news/a-quarter-of-britons-have-never-been-on-a-plane-visited-a-beach-or-european-capital/
The free sample that came through the letter box - what was it a free sample of ?
Tens of thousands of people are expected to descend on Westminster for an anti-Brexit demonstration on Saturday
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jun/22/peoples-vote-march-against-brexit-london-thousands-expected
Is that big?
I'm not into expectation management.
The problem, IMO, is with the group of people that voted in the referendum, the way things in the country were/are and how people felt about that combined with the Leave arguments and its media backing means that Leave wins unless the remain campaign is really good. With the benefit of hindsight...
One way I can see of changing that is really driving up turnout among remain voters. Corbyn has an appeal to a section of people whereas I can't imagine Alan Johnson would have converted or brought out many voters for remain that weren't already secured for remain.
Source: DG Trade statistical guide June 2018 p22
And how did that work out?
EDIT: and at least that march happened before Comical Ali was denying there were tanks in Baghdad.
https://twitter.com/gerardbattenmep/status/1008973459345608704
Anyone going to both?
And 30% have been to Africa - seriosly???? That’s over 15 million. Really????
The 20% who have never been to a beach are probably mainly from the inner cities
Now that the Tories have sacrificed fiscal responsibility and business on the altar of Brexit purity, what exactly can they pitch at the next election?
Although I wonder if this is part of why Corbyn appeals to younger people and not older people. I prefer the honesty, it wouldn't have changed my vote but Corbyn saying the EU is 10/10 would have just been a lie, I'm sure anyone who looks at it can come up with flaws with the EU. If I was wavering on a subject I'd more likely vote for something that someone honestly assessed as good even if they could see flaws rather than pretend it is perfect. I get the feeling older voters like more certainty though, either the EU must be great or terrible. It is either the Germans taking over again and we must get our independence back or I can't think of much here other than criticising someone for only calling it 7/10... most of the EU is great stuff seemed to centre around the absence of it being bad.
A draft memo obtained by Time magazine outlines plans to build "austere" tent camps to house 25,000 migrants.
The memo says the camps would be built on abandoned airfields in California, Alabama, and Arizona.
Another camp near San Francisco is being designed for as many as 47,000 people, the memo says.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44585716
Thankfully, not in my enclosure.
I wasn't claiming he was permanently talking at rallies and meetings, I imagine he slept and other things but video evidence of him not being at a rally or a meeting during the EU referendum doesn't prove he didn't attend one any more than video evidence of him not being at a rally or meeting during the election campaign proves he didn't attend one.
AIUI the old “Silver Ring” chav zone at Ascot has now been moved from the 4 furlong pole next to the grandstand, across the track into the middle. They’ll barely see a horse all day, let alone those who paid good money for grandstand tickets or the Royal Enclosure.
Far too many people simply don’t know how to behave.
Or are you claiming free trade agreements don't matter, in which case why does our EU membership matter?
Seems like you're trying to have your cake and eat it.
I just don't accept your overall point that is proof that he didn't speak at rallies and meetings, for one he certainly did, for two filming him not doing so is not actually the equivalent of him not doing so. It only proves he wasn't at those moments.
It was caught in the Vice documentary, where they had a meeting to arrange all this and it was clear Jezza wasn't going to do it.
And then you were moaning that why were the Remain media not giving more airtime to Jezza pitch, why concentrate on Johnson...its because Labour tried to get Jezza to be fully involved and he wouldn't do it.
http://thehill.com/homenews/393728-george-will-argues-for-voting-against-the-gop-in-midterms
On its own, of little significance, but it’s just possible the ‘vote against Trump’s enablers’ call will get som traction.
We will of course dropout of the EU FTA's shortly.
I have far bigger complaints about the media if I just wanted to moan about them, I just feel when they are assigning blame they never seem to think about their own part, usually happy to acknowledge the influence of the Daily Mail though.
http://uk.businessinsider.com/french-woman-visiting-canada-detained-in-u-s-crossing-border-while-jogging-2018-6
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1010486772541816834
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/i-wasnt-trump-enough-in-the-age-of-trump-so-i-lost/2018/06/22/56949d5a-7653-11e8-9780-b1dd6a09b549_story.html
The Republican Party is going through an identity crisis. We need to decide who we are. I believe we are meant to be the party of individual freedom, and I believe in the building blocks of what will get you there — ranging from limited government, taxes and spending to open markets and free trade.
I have all the merit badges and hard-fought votes to demonstrate my allegiance to those ideals. But voters in this election did not value this as much as they did fidelity to our president. In fact, on election night, my opponent proclaimed in her victory speech that “we are the party of Donald J. Trump.”...