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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Tonght’s Local By-Election Preview by Harry Hayfield

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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,758

    @Mr Dancer.

    The German language is awesome, as Schadenfreude is the greatest word in the history of mankind.

    But Latin is so elegant.

    I have to confess, swearing in French is the best, it's like wiping your arse with silk.

    Mr Eagles I can and do swear frequently in french. It hasn't a patch on English.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897
    QT - 'going to focus on Thatcher's Legacy'

    Well, I'm switching off then. It may well be appropriate and a worthy topic for the modern historical politically inclined, but I tend to glaze over when shouty people start talking past one another, delving the depths of political hyperbole, when 'debating' Thatcher's legacy when I have no experience of it.

    I tend to either get worked up on things that happened while I was politically aware, or like to debate older historical politics in a reasoned fashion, so I tend to get left behind when people get all passionate about Thatcher and her policies.
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    Adebayor has just taken the second worst penalty in history (after Chris Waddle's attempt at Italia 90)
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    @Mr Dancer.

    The German language is awesome, as Schadenfreude is the greatest word in the history of mankind.

    But Latin is so elegant.

    I have to confess, swearing in French is the best, it's like wiping your arse with silk.

    Mr Eagles I can and do swear frequently in french. It hasn't a patch on English.
    Merde Alors.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    On the 2011 Darlington result posted in the leader, I think it must be pointed out that Labour had 2 candidates (599 + 544) while the Tory just 1 (polling 277).

    Adding the 2 Labour candidate together makes it look like Labour had more support than actually had IMO.

    It's pretty clear that the great majority Tory voters didn't use their second vote in 2011.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    kle4 said:

    AveryLP said:

    Oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
    What was the matter with her? I didn't notice anything unusual in her words, and she actually sounded like a normal person, not a blandified party apparatchik.
    Oh it was nothing to do with the candidate, kle4.

    I had just spilt my coffee on the keyboard.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,054
    sam said:

    sam said:

    SeanT said:

    I've got a new Telegraph blog to write. Anyone got any burning ideas? Something they want to get off their chest?

    Perhaps tim has an opinion on the political and electoral merits of Geo Osborne which I could relay.

    Maybe you could link your recent trip to the Maldives with Global Warming? The islands are supposed to be about to be inundated, aren't they? Supposed to...
    Sunil, what is the line that runs underneath a bridge on the District line between West Ham and Bromley-by-bow? It's near Limehouse on the c2c and runs between north and South. Is it the East London Line?
    @sam

    It's not the East London, that runs under the District line further west at Whitechapel. Do you mean the DLR at Bow? There's nothing between West Ham and Bromley by Bow except the River Lea!
    It could well be, I've been looking at the tube maps and that seems most likely, thanks

    SeanT said:

    I've got a new Telegraph blog to write. Anyone got any burning ideas? Something they want to get off their chest?




    Perhaps tim has an opinion on the political and electoral merits of Geo Osborne which I could relay.

    If you want something topical, how about doing a different angle on MMR and the Swansea measles epidemic? Every commentator and their dog are going on about how the Wakefield controversy has led to this situation.

    Instead, write something on how hard it is for anyone, even highly educated people, to know who to trust when it comes to important decisions such as MMR. Such decisions are so specialist that people who are not intimately involved with that speciality have to follow whoever they trust.

    Throw in a media who (with one or two honourable exceptions) do not understand it either, and snake-oil salesmen, and we have a situation where it is all too easy for people to make the wrong decisions with the best of intentions. MMR threw in another couple of factors: fear, and the understandable desire of parents wanting to find *something* to blame for their child's autism.

    Also mention that it will happen again. And again.

    (AGW is another area which is outside of most people's understanding at a deep level. People just follow their instincts, and read the blogs, and use the data, that backs up those instincts).

    However, for a rather off-piste topic, how about a blog on the way that 98.347% of people could not tell an invented statistic if it bit them on the backside?
    Peter Hitchens did that earlier...


    http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co.uk/
    Ah, bollox. At least it was a good enough idea, then. Hitchens comes at it from an unusual angle, if only because he was peripheral to the controversy.

    Hitchens has one of his conclusions wrong - he still somewhat amazingly believes that Wakefield did not set out to deceive. I thought that was well proven by now, and his motives for the deception clear.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897

    @Mr Dancer.

    The German language is awesome, as Schadenfreude is the greatest word in the history of mankind.

    But Latin is so elegant.

    I have to confess, swearing in French is the best, it's like wiping your arse with silk.

    Mr Eagles I can and do swear frequently in french. It hasn't a patch on English.
    I have to say that germanic languages seem more appropriate for it to me. Sure, using French to wipe one's own arse with silk sounds cool and all, but sweating should be harsh, guttural, rough.

    No real shock in Lascelles then. I'm really hoping for an exciting May elections, but sadly I'm assisting with the count in my area so won't be able to keep a full eye on things.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    AveryLP said:

    kle4 said:

    AveryLP said:

    Oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
    What was the matter with her? I didn't notice anything unusual in her words, and she actually sounded like a normal person, not a blandified party apparatchik.
    Oh it was nothing to do with the candidate, kle4.

    I had just spilt my coffee on the keyboard.
    Think what your coffee could have done if Rowena was the speaking candidate!
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited April 2013

    AveryLP said:

    kle4 said:

    AveryLP said:

    Oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
    What was the matter with her? I didn't notice anything unusual in her words, and she actually sounded like a normal person, not a blandified party apparatchik.
    Oh it was nothing to do with the candidate, kle4.

    I had just spilt my coffee on the keyboard.
    Think what your coffee could have done if Rowena was the speaking candidate!
    It would have been champagne, Andrea.

    Or at least, at this time of night, a very fine Brandy del Marchesato.

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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897
    edited April 2013
    Seems a high number of uncontesteds for a Unitary.

    "Up to 24,000 people in Wiltshire will be unable to vote in next month's local elections due to uncontested seats.

    Of the 98 Wiltshire Council seats up for election, six are uncontested and all are Conservative controlled."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-22105512
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    Telegraph calls for Leveson style suppression and censoring of BBC music play list good taste...

    https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/322462254178107392/photo/1

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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,054
    tim said:

    @josiasJessop

    It wasn't hard to know what to trust in the MMR case.
    There was never any research linking MMR to autism.

    Oh lordy, you're off on this again. We now know there is no link. What matters to people is what is reported by the media; and at the time parts of the media were hyping up the possibility of a link massively. Witness the TV interviews where Blair was asked whether Leo had had the single jab.

    Even Private Eye got in on the act, enough to cause my scepticism to waver for a couple of weeks.

    You cannot expect people to trawl through the literature on every possible subject. The media (TV as well as various commentators and newspapers) have a responsibility to report such matters responsibly. Instead they often go for the dramatic headlines, ignoring important things like probabilities.

    ISTR the same thing happened in 1996 or 1997 with a pill that was rumoured to be dangerous to take. A GF of mine at the time freaked out about it; I just told her to go to see her doctor to ask his advice.
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    Didn't the BBC ban "Relax" on the grounds of taste?
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    RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    Dan Hodges really is a brilliant writer of short provocative articles.

    Never mind whether you agree or disagree with him: the actual wording is superb.

    Sean, over to you.
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    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    Oh. I assumed the sumptuous guide to bread making included: 1. Buy up rights to songs that might be linked to people. 2. Sell to gleeful ghouls.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited April 2013

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    kle4 said:

    Seems a high number of uncontesteds for a Unitary.

    "Up to 24,000 people in Wiltshire will be unable to vote in next month's local elections due to uncontested seats.

    Of the 98 Wiltshire Council seats up for election, six are uncontested and all are Conservative controlled."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-22105512

    7 uncontested wards also in Shropshire (+ 1 further guaranteed Tory seat in a undercontested ward).
    Durham wards will be all contested but 6-7 are underconsted (for ex 3 to be elected: 3 Lab candidate, 2 others. So 1 Lab is elected by default)
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897
    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    So?
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    RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    AveryLP said:

    Oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
    I was ahead of you there. See last night's thread.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    @tim

    "Dr Andrew Wakefield is in front of the General Medical Council on charges of serious professional misconduct, his paper on 12 children with autism and bowel problems is described as “debunked” – although it never supported the conclusions ascribed to it – and journalists have convinced themselves that his £435,643 fee from legal aid proves that his research was flawed.

    I will now defend the heretic Dr Andrew Wakefield.

    The media are fingering the wrong man, and they know who should really take the blame: in MMR, journalists and editors have constructed their greatest hoax to date, and finally demonstrated that they can pose a serious risk to public health. But there are also many unexpected twists to learn from: the health journalists themselves were not at fault, the scale of the bias in the coverage was greater than anybody realised at the time, Leo Blair was a bigger player than Wakefield, and it all happened much later than you think."

    http://www.badscience.net/2008/08/the-medias-mmr-hoax/
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,362

    Didn't the BBC ban "Relax" on the grounds of taste?

    Yes, but it still managed to reach no. 1!

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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,220
    @SeanT: re your blog. Since your first Telegraph post was about the old and drugs (and you made the point that you knew about drugs) why don't you make the second about the old and sex (since you know so much about ..... etc). You get the idea.
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    Didn't the BBC ban "Relax" on the grounds of taste?

    Yes, but it still managed to reach no. 1!

    And gets referenced in every nighthawks thread I run.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    @SeanT "Confessions of a Wikipedia Self editor"?
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    slade said:

    There is also a by election on Todmorden Town council tonight ( Labour defence).

    Lab 207 LD 142 Ind 67

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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    Burton

    Rob Summons: 291 (Independent Plus)
    Robin Wilson 166 (Conservative)
    Robin Howells 162 (Labour)
    Jon Harvey: 46 (Independent).
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    And now The Times:

    "Flattering ‘British Obama’ edit on Wikipedia raises questions for MP Chuka Umunna"

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3737364.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2013_04_11
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    edited April 2013
    where is Todmorden?
    Wait, I know...it's in Calderdale! That's where Cherie's father lives.
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    where is Todmorden?

    It is in the greatest part of the UK, Yorkshire, West Yorkshire to be precise.

    About 20 miles away from Manchester.
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    FluffyThoughtsFluffyThoughts Posts: 2,420
    George Galloway ain't gonna' like the Mirror's front-page....
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Agree - Kinnock's presence will be valued in the Valleys and his absence of no consequence to anyone in St Paul's...

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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897

    where is Todmorden?

    It is in the greatest part of the UK, Yorkshire, West Yorkshire to be precise.

    About 20 miles away from Manchester.
    'greatest part of the UK'?

    'About 20 miles from Manchester'?

    Well now, both those statements cannot possibly be true, surely.
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    samsam Posts: 727

    where is Todmorden?
    Wait, I know...it's in Calderdale! That's where Cherie's father lives.



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aG_mGYp1VDQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714

    where is Todmorden?

    It is in the greatest part of the UK, Yorkshire, West Yorkshire to be precise.

    About 20 miles away from Manchester.
    yes, I remembered it later. The Booths live there. The current wife of Cherie's father stood there some years ago.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783

    George Galloway ain't gonna' like the Mirror's front-page....

    https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/322470411109560320/photo/1
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    kle4 said:

    where is Todmorden?

    It is in the greatest part of the UK, Yorkshire, West Yorkshire to be precise.

    About 20 miles away from Manchester.
    'greatest part of the UK'?

    'About 20 miles from Manchester'?

    Well now, both those statements cannot possibly be true, surely.
    Lancashire for its many, many faults, is blessed by being next door to Yorkshire.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    kle4 said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/32246692963u1698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    So?
    Kinnock is quite entitled to decline the invitation to attend. He should just be honest about it and not try to hide behind a prior engagement.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    AveryLP said:

    Oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
    I was ahead of you there. See last night's thread.
    You are always ahead of me, Richard!
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    edited April 2013
    Avery, you are disrespectful towards Cllr Olga.

    If I were you, I would pause for a moment and pray an Ave Maria.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897
    edited April 2013
    Bizarrely, in a tab open on a site about a certain popular tv show based off a famous book series, I'm getting ads for something claiming to be 'Queen's Honours Experts: Significantly increase your chances of MBE, OBE, CBE, Knighthood. Learn more'

    I guess I'll have to be awarded the KCMG on my own then.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897
    AveryLP said:

    kle4 said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/32246692963u1698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    So?
    Kinnock is quite entitled to decline the invitation to attend. He should just be honest about it and not try to hide behind a prior engagement.
    Doesn't seem like hiding if the reason is perfectly reasonable.

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    RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    AveryLP said:


    You are always ahead of me, Richard!

    True. It was reprehensible of me to point it out.
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    I cannot criticise a man for choosing the funeral of a friend rather than a former work colleague who he disagreed with on a daily basis.
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    samsam Posts: 727
    edited April 2013
    By the way, "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" is No4 in the charts and heading for top spot on Sunday. Should the BBC play it in the chart rundown? Personally I think not.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2306655/Ding-Dong-The-Witch-Is-Dead-BBC-dilemma-playing-song-Margaret-Thatcher-dies.html
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    RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    I'm sure Lady Thatcher's friends and relatives will be able to contain their disappointment at the unfortunate absence of Lord Kinnock.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Andrea, you are avoiding my point that a private funeral can easily be rescheduled.

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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    Avery, you are disrespectful towards Cllr Olga.

    If I were you, I would pause for a moment and pray an Ave Maria.

    Having lived in and travelled to Russia for many years, I can assure you, Andrea, that I would never be disrespectful to a girl named Olga.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897
    edited April 2013
    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Andrea, you are avoiding my point that a private funeral can easily be rescheduled.

    Why the hell should it be? It's a point all right, but I regret to say only barely.

    ETA: Also, let's go one step further: if you want people to mourn you properly, with full attention, try not to die on the same day a a famous person, otherwise you're causing great inconvenience for people.

    "So, former Foreign Minister, what do you think of your former opponent of many years, who passed away?"
    "Well, to tell you the truth I'm a bit teary because an old friend of decades passed away today after a long illness"
    "...You heartless b*stard. Stop lying and just admit you don't want to talk about them."

    Oh gods, I think I've turned into someone else for a minute there.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    edited April 2013
    sam said:

    By the way, "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" is No4 in the charts and heading for top spot on Sunday. Should the BBC play it in the chart rundown? Personally I think not.

    That a lot of saddo-lefties are funnelling money to tax-avoiding multinationals?

    Rejoice!
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    Why should it be rescheduled? If a number of people wanted to go to two funerals, then it could be. I can't imagine many at the funeral in Wales want to be at the one in London. Perhaps Mr Kinnock would have attended St Pauls if he was free. He isn't. So shouldn't be criticised. I don't think Mrs Thatcher would approve. She was entirely about looking after your own family and friends rather than some nationalised mourning incident.
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Andrea, you are avoiding my point that a private funeral can easily be rescheduled.

    It is not Neil Kinnocks prerogative to reschedule a private funeral. He will not be missed at St Paul's, whether he wants to be there or not.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    edited April 2013
    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Andrea, you are avoiding my point that a private funeral can easily be rescheduled.

    I can't see why it should be.

    And anyway, really?! In Italy it's usually the priest who decideds when a funeral takes place accordingly to his committments.
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    sam said:

    By the way, "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" is No4 in the charts and heading for top spot on Sunday. Should the BBC play it in the chart rundown? Personally I think not.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2306655/Ding-Dong-The-Witch-Is-Dead-BBC-dilemma-playing-song-Margaret-Thatcher-dies.html

    Play it and be damned. It shows who the real nasty party is.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    when my granddad died earlier this year, the funeral parlours called the Parish. The priest said "let's do it tomorrow afternoon, I am free".

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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Andrea, you are avoiding my point that a private funeral can easily be rescheduled.

    I can't see why it should be.

    And anyway, really?! In Italy it's usually the priest who decideds when a funeral takes place accordingly to his committments.
    It is much more flexible in England and Wales, Andrea. And, although we will never know for sure, I am sure that Kinnock would have been offered this option if his friendship with Olga had been very close. He could easily have declined with a "but I would far prefer to be at Olga's funeral than that of the old witch in St Paul's".
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    Olga apparently died on March 29...frankly, it's about time to do the funeral!
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited April 2013

    AveryLP said:

    AveryLP said:

    The outrage continue:

    https://twitter.com/SkyNews/status/322466929631698944/photo/1

    Though why the Daily Mail is upset that tax-avoiding multinationals are raking it in in honour of Maggie eludes me....

    They also think that Kinnock going to the funeral of Cllr Olga instead of Maggie's is a snub. Not sure why though.
    If you are unfortunate enough as a family to be due to bury a relative on the same day as the holding of a very, very rare Royal Ceremonial Funeral and you hoped for a national political figure to attend, then the simple course of action would be to reschedule the funeral by a day.

    Kinnock is avoiding St. Paul's by choice.

    yes, it's a choice. A sensible choice! Every sensible man would go to the funeral of a friend rather than to the one of a person you encountered during your professional life but you weren't particularly friendly with just because said person happened to be a PM.

    Andrea, you are avoiding my point that a private funeral can easily be rescheduled.

    It is not Neil Kinnocks prerogative to reschedule a private funeral. He will not be missed at St Paul's, whether he wants to be there or not.
    I am uncertain that my point warrants pressing, and I agree that he will not be missed at St. Paul's, but families in grief organising a funeral tend to be extraordinarily flexible in meeting the requirements of mourners. Funerals are often delayed to allow family from overseas to return and most next of kin check out the availability of key attendees before arranging a final date.

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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    "The Margaret Thatcher protesters too young to remember her
    One is a middle class politics student, another is a Left-wing activist and the third came from Sweden to study in Britain."

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/margaret-thatcher/9988538/The-Margaret-Thatcher-protesters-too-young-to-remember-her.html

    Reading the tweets it appears Blunkett did not have a happy outing on QT - quoting the Spitting Image 'vegetables will have the same' sketch as fact then 'wishing she hadn't died in the run up to the council elections....'
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    Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited April 2013
    tim said:

    But get this. In Ireland, where the government refused to fund the vaccine, the Daily Mail are campaigning – vigorously – for the jab. Apparently it’s lifesaving: “Join the Irish Daily Mail’s cervical cancer vaccination campaign today”

    That's because the Irish Daily Mail is operating under the vicious jackboot of Leveson style regulation and has to resort to such depraved reasons as 'science'. As the tea party tories will tell you.

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    JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Reading the tweets it appears Blunkett did not have a happy outing on QT"

    Shows how misleading tweets can be - for the first time in about a billion years he came across rather well, and actually sounded like a Labour politician.
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    Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    tim said:

    TimMontgomerie
    Charles Moore attacking BBC for hyping Ding Dong tune.

    A cruel falsehood. He actually squarely blamed the BBC for the single in true PB tory style.

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    samsam Posts: 727
    edited April 2013

    sam said:

    By the way, "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" is No4 in the charts and heading for top spot on Sunday. Should the BBC play it in the chart rundown? Personally I think not.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2306655/Ding-Dong-The-Witch-Is-Dead-BBC-dilemma-playing-song-Margaret-Thatcher-dies.html

    Play it and be damned. It shows who the real nasty party is.
    What kind of song should not be played on the BBC? Should they just be impartial and reflect the record sales? If the BNP made a racist hit record should it be played?
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    tim said:

    TimMontgomerie
    Charles Moore attacking BBC for hyping Ding Dong tune. Has he seen front page of his newspaper, the @Telegraph? twitpic.com/cinqvy


    The Telegraph and the Mail are enjoying their outrage

    Not half as much as Maggie would have been, had she been able to watch it all whilst compos mentis.
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    corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549

    kle4 said:

    where is Todmorden?

    It is in the greatest part of the UK, Yorkshire, West Yorkshire to be precise.

    About 20 miles away from Manchester.
    'greatest part of the UK'?

    'About 20 miles from Manchester'?

    Well now, both those statements cannot possibly be true, surely.
    Lancashire for its many, many faults, is blessed by being next door to Yorkshire.
    Can't be, they can't even work out how to play rugby properly.
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,897

    "Reading the tweets it appears Blunkett did not have a happy outing on QT"

    Shows how misleading tweets can be - for the first time in about a billion years he came across rather well, and actually sounded like a Labour politician.

    Perhaps for those doing the tweeting, 'sounding like a Labour politician' is itself the qualifier for not having a happy outing? And as such not very reliable as an indicator of actual quality or lack thereof from DB.

    Just a guess though, could be nonense.

    Night all.
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    Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    @JamesKelly

    Ming on the other hand proved precisely why his tenure as lib dem leader was such a short albeit amusing one.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    Maggie came out of QT with her reputation enhanced. She still has an extraordinary ability to transcend all adversity.

    If Pork had ever had the good fortune to meet her even he would have been tamed.
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    Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    I'm sure you would try to spin his imaginary tenure as PM just as hard and just as incompetently if your prediction of Lansley becoming PM wasn't complete lunacy, Seth O Logue.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783

    he came across rather well

    By quoting a Spitting Image sketch as fact?

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    JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "By quoting a Spitting Image sketch as fact?"

    Carlotta, even by your standards, it's rather desperate to criticise a politician for his performance on a programme that you didn't actually watch.
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    foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    sam said:

    sam said:

    By the way, "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" is No4 in the charts and heading for top spot on Sunday. Should the BBC play it in the chart rundown? Personally I think not.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2306655/Ding-Dong-The-Witch-Is-Dead-BBC-dilemma-playing-song-Margaret-Thatcher-dies.html

    Play it and be damned. It shows who the real nasty party is.
    What kind of song should not be played on the BBC? Should they just be impartial and reflect the record sales? If the BNP made a racist hit record should it be played?
    The BBC would not play the sex pistols "God save the Queen' and FGTH's "Relax'. It just gave them more publicity. Let the munchkins sing "the Witch is Dead", it just shows how spiteful and powerless the left is nowadays.
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,080
    PPP Kentucky
    Hillary Clinton (D) 45% (47%)
    •Rand Paul (R) 45% (42%)
    •Not sure 10% (11%)
    •Hillary Clinton (D) 46% (48%)
    •Marco Rubio (R) 40% (40%)
    •Not sure 14% (12%)
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783

    "By quoting a Spitting Image sketch as fact?"

    Carlotta, even by your standards, it's rather desperate to criticise a politician for his performance on a programme that you didn't actually watch.

    James, even by your standards, it's rather desperate to defend a goof with a non- denial denial!

    Care to comment on the Yes/No split from the Scottish Green's PanelBase poll - or has it still not yet been published (unlike the rest of the results)?
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    I can't stand Neil Kinnock, but I take my hat off to him for honouring his friend, rather than joining the great and the good in London on that day.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783

    Let the munchkins sing "the Witch is Dead", it just shows how spiteful and powerless the left is nowadays.

    And how they love giving money to tax-avoiding multinationals!

    Thatcher would enjoy it enormously! (Except for the tax avoidance - and despite the efforts of the current govt, in contrast to the last, still much work to be done)
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    JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Care to comment on the Yes/No split from the Scottish Green's PanelBase poll - or has it still not yet been published (unlike the rest of the results)?"

    To the best of my knowledge it hasn't been published, which means you misrepresented your own back-of-the-envelope calculations as fact.

    Apologies are good for the soul, Carlotta. The floor's all yours.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    edited April 2013

    "Care to comment on the Yes/No split from the Scottish Green's PanelBase poll - or has it still not yet been published (unlike the rest of the results)?"

    To the best of my knowledge it hasn't been published, which means you misrepresented your own back-of-the-envelope calculations as fact.

    Apologies are good for the soul, Carlotta. The floor's all yours.

    Feel free to correct my maths James. It was based on their data.

    Why do you think it has not been published ?

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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    edited April 2013
    @Avery

    I just discovered that Rowena is actually Rowenna. With double N.
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    JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    edited April 2013
    "Feel free to correct my maths James."

    It's not your maths that are the problem. It's your wild assumption that those figures have been properly weighted, when neither you nor I have the faintest idea whether that's the case.

    On your second point, the responses to only one question have been published, and as that question is referred to as "Question 13a", that does not really support the view that the independence question alone was held back.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited April 2013

    @Avery

    I just discovered that Rowena is actually Rowenna. With double N.

    I prefer the shorter 'e', Andrea, even though I normally hate self-advertising variants of standard names.

    Rowenna trips off the tongue like a ballerina.

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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,783
    In a surprise move, the Daily Mail downplays Tone's advice to Ed:

    Ed Miliband was embroiled in a damaging row with Tony Blair yesterday over his kneejerk resistance to austerity and welfare cuts.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2307404/Labour-war-Tony-Blair-launches-strident-attack-Ed-Milibands-retreat-1980s-style-party-protest.html#ixzz2QCU85SBB
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    AveryLP said:

    @Avery

    I just discovered that Rowena is actually Rowenna. With double N.

    I prefer the shorter 'e', Andrea, even though I normally hate self-advertising variants of standard names.

    Rowenna trips off the tongue like a ballerina.

    I would drop the second N and add a second E...Roweeena.
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    If austerity isn't boosting the economy and is proving unpopular as well, Ed should support it because...?
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    edited April 2013
    @SeanT
    Congrats on blogging for the Telegraph.
    Why do eminent women in fields such as politics and acting have male heirs who are such f*cktards?
    Maybe you could do a joint piece with one of your distinguished colleagues at Telegraph Towers.
    SeanT said:

    I've got a new Telegraph blog to write. Anyone got any burning ideas? Something they want to get off their chest?

    Perhaps tim has an opinion on the political and electoral merits of Geo Osborne which I could relay.

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    Just catching up on the earlier threads. There was an implication that somehow Edward, Lord Carson KC was less deserving of a state funeral than Margaret, Baroness Thatcher LG OM notwithstanding the fact that the latter will not, of course, receive a state funeral. It should be noted that Carson destroyed the cosy stitch up between Asquith and Redmond that Ulster would be subjected to Rome Rule from Dublin, contrary to the wishes of the people of Ulster. Had that stitch up been allowed to proceed and the Government of Ireland Act 1914 taken effect as passed, there would have undoubtedly been all out war. Carson made London wake up to that fact. He subsequently served Crown and country as HM Attorney General and Lord of Appeal in Ordinary. There could be no man more deserving of a state funeral than Carson.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    LOL.
    Pong said:

    SeanT said:

    I've got a new Telegraph blog to write. Anyone got any burning ideas? Something they want to get off their chest?

    Perhaps tim has an opinion on the political and electoral merits of Geo Osborne which I could relay.

    How about writing a piece on tax avoidance in the channel islands? We could take bets on how long your blog lasts.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    It cannot be as bad as walking into a pub after his latest screed for the Telegraph is published.

    I know I diss Dan Hodges a lot, but his latest column on being Glenda Jackson's son, just wow.

    "Humiliating? Try walking into school the day after Women in Love has just been repeated on BBC2"

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    NeilNeil Posts: 7,983

    Olga apparently died on March 29...frankly, it's about time to do the funeral!

    It's a British thing, Andrea, in my experience so far they tend to wait forever to have the funeral. (I think it's because a huge proportion of cases go to the coroner.) If I hear someone in Ireland has died I generally have to book a flight that day or risk missing the funeral.

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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    The scary thing about Telegraph posters is that many are younger than I am.
    Talk about bitter young men!

    welshowl said:

    SeanT said:

    I've got a new Telegraph blog to write. Anyone got any burning ideas? Something they want to get off their chest?

    Perhaps tim has an opinion on the political and electoral merits of Geo Osborne which I could relay.

    What age will state retirement age be I'm 2050 and how are we going to adjust society to that? My guess about 75.
    Bearing in mind the age of Telegraph readers, I don't expect many will be bothered by the retirement age in 2050. They will have been resident on their fluffy clouds playing harps for decades by then.
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    dugarbandierdugarbandier Posts: 2,596
    SeanT said:

    I've got a new Telegraph blog to write. Anyone got any burning ideas? Something they want to get off their chest?

    Perhaps tim has an opinion on the political and electoral merits of Geo Osborne which I could relay.

    How about some observations about the sentimentalization (if that is indeed a word) and our apparent inability (and the media's) to respond proportionately to a famous death. starting with Diana obviously.

    something to do with an increasing fear of our own mortality? or what...

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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    Neil said:

    Olga apparently died on March 29...frankly, it's about time to do the funeral!

    It's a British thing, Andrea, in my experience so far they tend to wait forever to have the funeral. (I think it's because a huge proportion of cases go to the coroner.) If I hear someone in Ireland has died I generally have to book a flight that day or risk missing the funeral.

    Thanks Neil

    As I said earlier, my grandfather died recently...it was a Thursday morning and the funeral took place on Friday afternoon.

    If you have relatives coming from far away, I guess you ask to hold it on Monday.

    But we tend to get them out of the way as soon as possible.
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    NeilNeil Posts: 7,983
    @Andrea

    I missed that, very sorry to hear it.
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    old_labourold_labour Posts: 3,238
    @AveryLP
    Oh f*ck
    Oh, f*ck, oh f*ck.
    Oh f*ck, oh f*ck, oh f*ck.
    AveryLP said:

    Oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear.

    Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear.
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    AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    #Neil

    Thanks. I must admit that "recently" means "2 months ago".

    #oldlabour

    We can't forget
    Iain Wright
    From the Town
    For the Town
This discussion has been closed.