A family with two young kids in a three bedroomed house are defined as having a spare room, I don't think you've been following this have you
I shared a bedroom with my brother until the age of about 10. Nothing wrong with that - my parents wanted a spare room that my Dad used as a home office.
Re: AfD: "Opinion polls have them at around 5 per cent, but pollsters say the total on Monday could be higher. Many who might vote for them will not say so, fearing the label of extremists."
I don't think it's impossible that they might get the highest share of the vote of all of the minor parties, including the Greens and Die Linke.
A simple solution to both "spare room subsidy" and housing shortage would be to allow tennants to let their spare bedroom, provided that they stayed in residence themselves.
No one needs to move, rooms used productively, someone else no longer homeless. Sorted. Next!
In the Scottish town in which I was born there are hardly any 1 bedroom flats. In a place where the cost of land is the square root of bugger all, it has been the policy for years to build 2/3 bedroom properties so that people did not have to move if they got married or their families grew in size.
The furore over Spare Room Subsidy/Bedroom Tax is a microcosm of all that is wrong with politics and political reporting.
It is a policy that will help a lot of families and one that will financially penalise some families. It is not some great evil, or some plot by Tories to hurt the poor. It is a imperfect policy designed with good intention to fix an imperfect situation.
Yet it's another classic case of the implications of the policy being lost in the polarising hoohah of politics. Tories evil, hurting the poor. Labour party of shirkers, loving benefits. Blah blah blah.
Amidst it all are families with disabled people in them, really struggling. And the irony is that every MP in parliament wants to help those people.
Not that you'd ever believe it if you follow politics.
ps - Ed Miliband will regret agreeing to restore the benefits. The Tories were being bashed by talk of 'bedroom taxes', without the policy being known by the public. Ed Miliband has now invited a backlash. He would've been better served letting the Tories be bashed with it till the election.
Why did no one else think of that, get all families to live in one room and bingo, no housing shortage.
No, tim, only immigrants do that [ after sponging on the benefits ]! And working two shifts.
I am quite disappointed in ukip for taking any action against Bloom. Anyone who listens to the recording of what he said could hear the context, it was a joke, and one that went down well with the women in the room.
It seems they are letting the Beeb, C4 and lefty newspapers dictate the pace for them, not impressed at all.
The sceptic in me thinks it suits them to let Godders be a scapegoat and take the spotlight off Farage after the Crick Dulwich College story... Maybe it was all a big ploy?!
The sceptic in me thinks it suits them to let Godders be a scapegoat and take the spotlight off Farage after the Crick Dulwich College story... Maybe it was all a big ploy?!
You're overthinking it.
Mr Farage should perhaps have handled it better, but none of us are perfect.
Newsnight: the UKIP MEP who wrecked his own party conference... "Has UKIP lost the plot?"
"not a scene from a farce or a sitcom...but today's UKIP party conference..."
Crosby is really getting his rocks off on this. I doubt it will have any major effect on UKIP at all.
You look like a bunch of amateurs tonight. No question that it has knocked you back a little. The slut comment, coupled with assaulting Crick (technically, that's what happened) would be the end for a mainstream politician.
I am quite disappointed in ukip for taking any action against Bloom. Anyone who listens to the recording of what he said could hear the context, it was a joke, and one that went down well with the women in the room.
It seems they are letting the Beeb, C4 and lefty newspapers dictate the pace for them, not impressed at all.
The sceptic in me thinks it suits them to let Godders be a scapegoat and take the spotlight off Farage after the Crick Dulwich College story... Maybe it was all a big ploy?!
A family with two young kids in a three bedroomed house are defined as having a spare room, I don't think you've been following this have you
I shared a bedroom with my brother until the age of about 10. Nothing wrong with that - my parents wanted a spare room that my Dad used as a home office.
You only lived in a three bedroomed house ?
No, but my parents thought it was important we grew up in as normal a manner as possible
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
This is unbelievable, the last Labour Government are toxic on this issue after their pensions raid last time. And now they appear to want to repeat the same mistakes all over again?
'The privileged few' whom Ed refers to in his phrase "shady schemes of tax loopholes for the privileged few" currently include two-thirds of those approaching retirement (but not public-sector workers with gold-plated inflation-linked final salary schemes, of course), and also includes the huge mass of less well-off workers who will soon be auto-enrolled in the new workplace pensions.
Don't be silly isam this article shows UKIP in a good light and the journalist in a bad light. They won't go near it.
Actually it looks more like a few young people got drunk and there was a bit of argy-bargy. Not really a political story and doesn't looks very interesting. Bet you if Alex Dixon wasn't female and vaguely presentable the telegraph wouldn't have run the story at all
Telegraph readers were shedding bucketfuls of tears about poor widows living in £2 million plus properties in response to an article about a proposed mansion tax.
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know.
On the entertainment UKIP have provided us today (why did they have to provide so much in one go? That's at least a month's worth of amusement compressed into one day):
It seems to me that the key point isn't so much the amusement, or the direct damage it does, but the indirect damage. Wasn't one of the selling points that (like Beppo Grillo's Five Star Movement) they weren't a party like all the others? In particular, that their conference wasn't a stage-managed show?
And here we have Nigel Farage throwing a hissy fit because Godfrey Bloom (who wasn't doing anything other than being Godfrey Bloom) managed to upstage the UKIP stage-managed conference.
This is not good from UKIP's point of view - and Farage's reaction was the worst bit of it.
Bloom's marmite moment is nice vehicle for discussion about so many things that annoy people today. And because it is funny and accessible it will allow conversion across all classes about numerous topics that are hard to talk about. On balance I think Ukip will profit even if they have to do a funny walk with one foot in the PC world of TV and other grounded in non-PC reality.
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
Depends on which part of country you live,60 grand a year in Bradford is pretty well off to me.
A family with two young kids in a three bedroomed house are defined as having a spare room, I don't think you've been following this have you
I shared a bedroom with my brother until the age of about 10. Nothing wrong with that - my parents wanted a spare room that my Dad used as a home office.
You only lived in a three bedroomed house ?
No, but my parents thought it was important we grew up in as normal a manner as possible
Sharing a room unnecessarily before being sent to Eton is a strange definition of normality
Saved on the heating bills as well - they didn't have the heat the top floor ;-)
But, more seriously, my Dad ran a small business quite successfully and derived a decent income from that. Nothing unreasonable with that - and he's still serving on the board at the age of 70
A family with two young kids in a three bedroomed house are defined as having a spare room, I don't think you've been following this have you
I shared a bedroom with my brother until the age of about 10. Nothing wrong with that - my parents wanted a spare room that my Dad used as a home office.
You only lived in a three bedroomed house ?
No, but my parents thought it was important we grew up in as normal a manner as possible
Sharing a room unnecessarily before being sent to Eton is a strange definition of normality
In Eton, sharing a bed with another boy is almost mandatory ! It's called bonding !
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
A family with two young kids in a three bedroomed house are defined as having a spare room, I don't think you've been following this have you
I shared a bedroom with my brother until the age of about 10. Nothing wrong with that - my parents wanted a spare room that my Dad used as a home office.
You only lived in a three bedroomed house ?
No, but my parents thought it was important we grew up in as normal a manner as possible
Sharing a room unnecessarily before being sent to Eton is a strange definition of normality
In Eton, sharing a bed with another boy is almost mandatory ! It's called bonding !
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
Come mike,get the like button back ;-)
The plumber I use makes a very nice living - lives up in Suffolk, but works 3 days a week in London.
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
Someone with kids on £50-60k a year is paying 70% marginal rates care of Osborne,Labour is right to say they shouldn't be asked to pay anymore.
I don't dispute that, just don't tell me that they ain't rich. That's more than double my wages. Admittedly, they obviously don't take double home, but I wouldn't mind earning that 60k. Anyway it wasn't really about that, it's Surby rattling my chain about 200k plumbers!
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
Someone with kids on £50-60k a year is paying 70% marginal rates care of Osborne,Labour is right to say they shouldn't be asked to pay anymore.
Do you think the low paid or people below 50/60 grand a year will give a shit what the marginal rates are,to me,it looks like labour sticking up for the well off ,what's MP's pay,isn't that over 60 grand a year,interesting ;-)
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
Someone with kids on £50-60k a year is paying 70% marginal rates care of Osborne,Labour is right to say they shouldn't be asked to pay anymore.
I don't dispute that, just don't tell me that they ain't rich. That's more than double my wages. Admittedly, they obviously don't take double home, but I wouldn't mind earning that 60k. Anyway it wasn't really about that, it's Surby rattling my chain about 200k plumbers!
Wait until you go on strike, I can guarantee you that the PB Tories will have your wages at £60k from your two jobs before they can say "The FBU funds the Labour Party"
Higher rate taxpayers have been asked to contribute least to austerity. They should contribute more.
There hasn't been any austerity. Taxes have gone up but there's been no austerity.
There has been and will be fiscal consolidation in every year of this parliament. Tax increases and spending cuts split roughly 20:80 in their contribution. Of the fiscal consolidation plans adopted by the large countries in the EU, the contribution from taxes is lowest by proportion in the UK.
@tim - Any other ideas? Given Brown's handouts of money we don't have to families with children (to the extent of Darling running out of money at the end of the third week in every month, and thus having to borrow one quarter of every month's expenditure), why are you surprised that getting the public finances back towards a semblance of sanity 'hammers' this group? Osborne has done incredibly well to spread the pain so evenly, given the starting point.
Since UKIP's plan for a bad-publicity-free conference seems to have gone to shit, can't they reverse the decision on @david_kendrick1? I'm sure right now they'd rather the media were talking about whatever he's accused of than what they're actually talking about.
The daft thing is that Crick has a lot of form for doorstepping politicians with provocative questioning at Conferences etc. But the one thing you shouldn't ever do is give them credence at all by taking the bait and responding to the questions. Had Bloom simple ignored Crick and let him rattle on with that theme, it would have actually reflected more on Crick's attempts as a journalist to frame the party in this light.
On the entertainment UKIP have provided us today (why did they have to provide so much in one go? That's at least a month's worth of amusement compressed into one day):
It seems to me that the key point isn't so much the amusement, or the direct damage it does, but the indirect damage. Wasn't one of the selling points that (like Beppo Grillo's Five Star Movement) they weren't a party like all the others? In particular, that their conference wasn't a stage-managed show?
And here we have Nigel Farage throwing a hissy fit because Godfrey Bloom (who wasn't doing anything other than being Godfrey Bloom) managed to upstage the UKIP stage-managed conference.
This is not good from UKIP's point of view - and Farage's reaction was the worst bit of it.
Labour out of touch if they think people on £60k aren't rich.
Do you think a plumber considers himself rich ?
I know lots of plumbers, sparkies, chippies, builders, plasterers, decorators, landscapers. Round my neck of the woods, they don't make 60 grand a year. Maybe in your socialist utopia, they might.
Clearly you haven't met any of those people making £200k a year.? Is London a socialist utopia ? Comrade Boris should know ?
There you go. Its always about London. In the real world, plumbers don't make 5 grand a month. Be honest for a change, admit that your beloved Labour have made a mistake, 60 grand outside London, makes you rich. If a plumber round here made 200k a year, he's dealing drugs.
Someone with kids on £50-60k a year is paying 70% marginal rates care of Osborne,Labour is right to say they shouldn't be asked to pay anymore.
I don't dispute that, just don't tell me that they ain't rich. That's more than double my wages. Admittedly, they obviously don't take double home, but I wouldn't mind earning that 60k. Anyway it wasn't really about that, it's Surby rattling my chain about 200k plumbers!
Wait until you go on strike, I can guarantee you that the PB Tories will have your wages at £60k from your two jobs before they can say "The FBU funds the Labour Party"
Every fireperson I know has two jobs.
That is why they do not want the shift changes, nothing to do with how the fire service works.
Since UKIP's plan for a bad-publicity-free conference seems to have gone to shit, can't they reverse the decision on @david_kendrick1? I'm sure right now they'd rather the media were talking about whatever he's accused of than what they're actually talking about.
It is a funny old world, isn't it? David Kendrick seems to be unfailingly polite, reasonable and straightforward in the points he makes, and he doesn't even get as far as being allowed to stand as a no-hoper in a constituency where the only question is by how great a margin the UKIP candidate will lose the deposit.
Yes that's right Tim, pensioners have made no contribution whatsoever form having the return on their savings diminished by QE. Of course you do not care about savings/wealth as you have repeatedly supported its confiscation from new taxation.
Finally, someone gets it... http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100237080/nigel-farage-the-only-politician-who-dares-say-what-were-thinking/ "Since at least the beginning of the Blair era and probably well before, the left has very successfully managed to close down any argument of which it disapproves by crying "racist", "elitist", "homophobe", "NIMBY", "Little Englander", "fascist", or whatever. This has created within the Westminster bubble a culture of caution bordering on cowardice. Before a politician speaks he almost never asks himself: "Is this true?" Rather, he asks himself: "Will this get me into trouble with the BBC?" Which is why, of course, we get politicians like Rachel "Boring" Reeves."
Finally, someone gets it... http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100237080/nigel-farage-the-only-politician-who-dares-say-what-were-thinking/ "Since at least the beginning of the Blair era and probably well before, the left has very successfully managed to close down any argument of which it disapproves by crying "racist", "elitist", "homophobe", "NIMBY", "Little Englander", "fascist", or whatever. This has created within the Westminster bubble a culture of caution bordering on cowardice. Before a politician speaks he almost never asks himself: "Is this true?" Rather, he asks himself: "Will this get me into trouble with the BBC?" Which is why, of course, we get politicians like Rachel "Boring" Reeves."
I am going to give a shout out to all our pensioners who saved and planned for their retirement during their working lives. They have been getting a lousy return for their savings in recent years, and to cap it all, many still carry on paying tax on their retirement income. I not talking about 'rich or previously high earning' pensioners. Many of these people like my parents and my aunt and uncle were not high earners during their working lives, they just planned ahead for their retirement.
So much focus on pensioners these days centres around the cost to the Treasury and the current taxpayer for their State pension. But very little note is given to either their combined long term contributions in tax or NI over their working lives, or their continued tax contributions to the Treasury in retirement. Its not quite the one way street that is portrayed by some in the media these days. But having invested so much in their retirement and this country, is it any sodding wonder that they turn out to vote in the numbers they do and therefore make a difference that sees political parties recognising their contributions?
Finally, someone gets it... http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100237080/nigel-farage-the-only-politician-who-dares-say-what-were-thinking/ "Since at least the beginning of the Blair era and probably well before, the left has very successfully managed to close down any argument of which it disapproves by crying "racist", "elitist", "homophobe", "NIMBY", "Little Englander", "fascist", or whatever. This has created within the Westminster bubble a culture of caution bordering on cowardice. Before a politician speaks he almost never asks himself: "Is this true?" Rather, he asks himself: "Will this get me into trouble with the BBC?" Which is why, of course, we get politicians like Rachel "Boring" Reeves."
"On Friday morning, Ireland's Daily Mail detailed how Ryanair had charged a customer 188 euros (£160) to change his flight after his family had died in a fire."
I support the original Ryanair decision on this one. They should run their business with simple, clear rules rather than requiring their staff to become experts in telling the difference between people making up stories and people whose families have really died in fires, then charging all their passengers for the cost of doing that.
Day 2 of the Tour Championship is in the books, so some observations -
Tiger played in the last pairing on Thursday, and in the first pairing today. His first round had no birdies and 3 bogeys. I was the flag man on 7 on Thursday, standing right at the tee markers. As Tiger arrived on the tee it was apparent he was in some discomfort. He made eye contact and smiled a wincing smile, then took a club from Joey and stretched his back for several seconds.
Today Tiger was 5 under par for the round leaving the 13th green. He then double bogeyed 14, bogeyed 16, then triple bogeyed 17. He has not sunk a putt over 5 feet in either round.
Today I was on the left side of the landing area on 7 (435 yard uphill dogleg left). There was not much activity until the Phil Mickelson / D.A. Points pairing came through. Mickelson hit to the far right of the fairway, the other side from me. Points hit just outside the ropes on my side. We dropped a couple of poles before he arrived and got the crowd back. When he arrived he was brusque and needed more poles dropped and more crowd moved back, as he was going to hit to the left of a tree just off the fairway. This took a couple of minutes as there was only one other marshal and myself. Then he hit his shot and walked off without a glance, a smile, or any acknowledgement of the marshals. This is unusual, but it happens. The other marshal and I put the stakes back in the ground, and I turned around to find Phil Mickelson and Bones, his caddy, heading straight for me, striding across the fairway. He shook our hands, then said he just wanted to thank us for all the work marshals do, and how much he appreciated us. Then he looked in the direction of Points, who was striding up the fairway, smiled a bit and said "He's been like that all day." Bones said Thanks and then they were off up to the green.
Phil has always been one of my favorites, up there with Tom Watson and Jack Nicklaus. I've seen at first hand some of what he does off the course, as well as signing innumerable autographs for fans. The man is the epitome of class.
I have to be out of the house at 5.45am tomorrow as play has been moved up due to thunderstorms, and they are playing 3-somes starting at 7.30am. It's not all bad - I have a new Nike rain suit I want to try out...
UKIP's appeal has nothing to do with its policies.
Stupidest remark of the day. Well done.
I stand by it. Do you really think 11% are voting exclusively on seeking freedom from the EUSSR?
It's not just stupid, it's TEDIOUSLY stupid. Of COURSE people support UKIP because of their policies. What else draws these voters? Farage's taste in neckties? The exciting pound logo?
No, they have gathered support because people think UKIP are, in general, happy to espouse those popular but non-PC polices eschewed by all the other cowed and feeble parties. This is why the reversal of the burqa ban is so damaging.
It's not that the burqa is so salient. It's because 65% of Brits want a ban on the burqa, but every other party is so scared of being seen as racist they won't do anything about these vile garments. But, until yesterday, UKIP stood out as The Party That Wasn't Scared - on this and many other issues.
Now they have announced themselves as The Party That Is Just As Scared As The Others, But Is Mainly Staffed By Loonies.
Policies count. Expect their polling to slowly but seriously deflate, unless Nige can work a miracle.
Policies count so much that you didn't name a relevant one that would attract voters. UKIP is a howl of protest. Policies are utterly incidental.
Finally, someone gets it... http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100237080/nigel-farage-the-only-politician-who-dares-say-what-were-thinking/ "Since at least the beginning of the Blair era and probably well before, the left has very successfully managed to close down any argument of which it disapproves by crying "racist", "elitist", "homophobe", "NIMBY", "Little Englander", "fascist", or whatever. This has created within the Westminster bubble a culture of caution bordering on cowardice. Before a politician speaks he almost never asks himself: "Is this true?" Rather, he asks himself: "Will this get me into trouble with the BBC?" Which is why, of course, we get politicians like Rachel "Boring" Reeves."
UKIP's appeal has nothing to do with its policies.
Stupidest remark of the day. Well done.
Not really. I know lots of Kippers, including my uncle, who was on the Penzance UKIP executive. Obviously they like the general drift of the policies, but primarily they like the flavour - resolutely non-PC and no-nonsense. As we've seen with UKIP supporters here, they ascribe to the party what they hope it will become, rather than what it is. I think most UKIP voters wouldn't have been especially bothered by Bloom's latest weirdness - Farage should probably have shrugged it off.
UKIP's appeal has nothing to do with its policies.
Stupidest remark of the day. Well done.
Not really. I know lots of Kippers, including my uncle, who was on the Penzance UKIP executive. Obviously they like the general drift of the policies, but primarily they like the flavour - resolutely non-PC and no-nonsense. As we've seen with UKIP supporters here, they ascribe to the party what they hope it will become, rather than what it is. I think most UKIP voters wouldn't have been especially bothered by Bloom's latest weirdness - Farage should probably have shrugged it off.
Correct. UKIP will get nowhere pandering to the metrosexual elite. Their richest seams will be the dispossessed and the alienated, the 35% who don't vote at all...
I am with Seant on this one, of course UKIP's appeal is intrinsically linked to its policies! That they don't have a snowballs chance of ever seeing most of them ever enacted doesn't lessen the appeal of this protest party. Oh, wait, isn't that what we used to say about the Libdems before they finally end up entering Government? If Labour have been benefiting in the polls over the last couple of years because they are now the only main party in Opposition now we have the Con/Libdem Coalition government. You can bet that UKIP have also benefited as a result of becoming the new 'plague on all your houses political protest party'. Who can forget that key Libdem pledge on tuition fees to students? But UKIP's USP has thus far been that its more libertarian than Liberal, in other words they have appealed to the far more unPC older generation.
UKIP's appeal has nothing to do with its policies.
Stupidest remark of the day. Well done.
Not really. I know lots of Kippers, including my uncle, who was on the Penzance UKIP executive. Obviously they like the general drift of the policies, but primarily they like the flavour - resolutely non-PC and no-nonsense. As we've seen with UKIP supporters here, they ascribe to the party what they hope it will become, rather than what it is. I think most UKIP voters wouldn't have been especially bothered by Bloom's latest weirdness - Farage should probably have shrugged it off.
But you're agreeing with me. I don't think Kippers examine the manifesto, they like the general *sound* of the policies. And the burqa ban, however trivial, was deeply emblematic of that "sound".
If it percolates down to General Voter Consciousness that UKIP have reversed this - and it might easily, especially if people ceaselessly blog about it, say, on the Telegraph - then it will damage them.
Add that to the Bloomsday Disaster and I see a declining UKIP polling trend. What's the point in a non-PC party that is, actually, really rather PC but is a bit pretendy?
Yes, I largely agree with what you say in that form. I've seen it on the left. The Communist Party decided that it was time to modernise and moderate. They adopted the British Road to Socialism, a coherent, vaguely reasonable programme devoid of Warsaw Pact sympathies which would not have been unusual in a left-wing Labour meeting. The members thought hey, this isn't any fun, and drifted off to Labour if they were indeed mild-mannered, or to the SWP, CPGB-ML, etc. if they wanted red-blooded stuff. The party virtually disappeared, and now exists mainly to sell the Morning Star.
Farage is at heart a mainstream politician. He wants to be wooed by other parties. He is appalled to discover fruitcakes in his midst, in a way that all major parties dismiss with a weary sigh. But it may well be that the UKIP vote is actually predominantly people who want a bit of fruitcake, and dislike any hint of moderaiton and compromise.
Alternatively, it may be that Any Publicity Is Good Publicity. We shall see, very shortly.
I was just reading comments on previous thread about sex-selective abortions. Maybe I am missing something as I thought only women could have an abortion?
UKIP director Lisa Duffy began hailing the way their women succeed on ability alone – joking that she’s never had time to clean behind her fridge.
“I’ve never even pulled mine out!” quipped another female candidate.
They were teasing him... the minxes!
Perhaps the clinking glasses and wafting perfume got Godfrey thinking about Silvio Berlusconi’s “bunga-bunga” parties again - he admits he’s always longed for an invitation from the former Italian PM.
Whatever the cause, the words popped out of his mouth like a cork from a bottle of Dom Perignon
I was catching up with the threads yesterday or the day before, I forget. But I nearly highlighted one particular comment from a PB UKIPper, and because it was just so deliciously hypocritical after their criticism of the Conservative party. We have over the last few days seen some differences of opinion emerging amongst our UKIP supporters on this site. Richard Tyndall was criticising Nigel Farage's Leadership style, and he went onto welcome the reversal of UKIP's policy of banning the burqa against the tide of most of their supporters. Anyhoos, another UKIPper came back and waxed lyrical about what a broad tent UKIP was, and that this was going to see a general acceptance that there were going to be differing views or opinions on many issues.
Indeed, the conversation led onto a post that waxed lyrical about the fact that UKIP's growing membership meant that there was going to be a growing diversity of views... But again, that UKIP was a broad church which could welcome and envelope this diversity. I was nearly falling off my chair laughing at this point, they obviously don't visit ConHom or the Telegraph which is UKIP R us in the threads....
The irony of the fact that some left the Conservative party to join UKIP because they felt they couldn't accept a similar situation in that party appeared to be lost on them. But earlier today, Richard Tyndall, who in the past has heavily criticised Farage's Leadership style went onto post about his hope that UKIP would in fact eventually be able to pressure the Conservatives into changing their Leader!!! So, he didn't get the leader he wanted in his chosen party, but he still hopes that his party rather than the current membership of the Conservative party will influence who becomes the next Leader of the Conservative party. Good luck with that one!!
"NickPalmer"
Not really. I know lots of Kippers, including my uncle, who was on the Penzance UKIP executive. Obviously they like the general drift of the policies, but primarily they like the flavour - resolutely non-PC and no-nonsense. As we've seen with UKIP supporters here, they ascribe to the party what they hope it will become, rather than what it is. I think most UKIP voters wouldn't have been especially bothered by Bloom's latest weirdness - Farage should probably have shrugged it off.
Comments
'could probably have got away with "sluts"...'
Squirming over the all-white brochure...
It seems they are letting the Beeb, C4 and lefty newspapers dictate the pace for them, not impressed at all.
The sceptic in me thinks it suits them to let Godders be a scapegoat and take the spotlight off Farage after the Crick Dulwich College story... Maybe it was all a big ploy?!
Mr Farage should perhaps have handled it better, but none of us are perfect.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9378829/Libor-scandal-Osborne-and-Balls-clash-over-banks-inquiry.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2003995/Former-minister-Frank-Dobson-afford-private-rent-66k.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2427554/What-emails-did-Ed-send-smear-plotter-More-disturbing-questions-Labour-leader-serialisation-spin-doctors-explosive-memoir.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_in_the_United_Kingdom
It seems to me that the key point isn't so much the amusement, or the direct damage it does, but the indirect damage. Wasn't one of the selling points that (like Beppo Grillo's Five Star Movement) they weren't a party like all the others? In particular, that their conference wasn't a stage-managed show?
And here we have Nigel Farage throwing a hissy fit because Godfrey Bloom (who wasn't doing anything other than being Godfrey Bloom) managed to upstage the UKIP stage-managed conference.
This is not good from UKIP's point of view - and Farage's reaction was the worst bit of it.
But, more seriously, my Dad ran a small business quite successfully and derived a decent income from that. Nothing unreasonable with that - and he's still serving on the board at the age of 70
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2427553/So-Has-UKIP-come-age-ROBERT-HARDMAN-attended-partys-shambolic-gathering-years-ago-remains-unimpressed.html#ixzz2fTRABBiF
Should be fun!
http://cdn2.spectator.co.uk/wp-content/blogs.dir/11/files/2012/12/IFS-decile-chart-2.png
Must stop,me old labour coming out of me ;-)
Don't I know it.
Next?
That is why they do not want the shift changes, nothing to do with how the fire service works.
T
You must be quite desperate; now stop playing with yourself. Desist I say!
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2427554/What-emails-did-Ed-send-smear-plotter-More-disturbing-questions-Labour-leader-serialisation-spin-doctors-explosive-memoir.html
'Why the People Want Ukip and the Luvvies Don't Get It'
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/godfrey-bloom/ukip-godfrey-bloom_b_3947498.html
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100237080/nigel-farage-the-only-politician-who-dares-say-what-were-thinking/
"Since at least the beginning of the Blair era and probably well before, the left has very successfully managed to close down any argument of which it disapproves by crying "racist", "elitist", "homophobe", "NIMBY", "Little Englander", "fascist", or whatever. This has created within the Westminster bubble a culture of caution bordering on cowardice. Before a politician speaks he almost never asks himself: "Is this true?" Rather, he asks himself: "Will this get me into trouble with the BBC?" Which is why, of course, we get politicians like Rachel "Boring" Reeves."
London property boom leaves super rich scratching around for a new pad
Billionaires struggling to find suitable mansions amid surging demand in £50m-£200m price bracket
So much focus on pensioners these days centres around the cost to the Treasury and the current taxpayer for their State pension. But very little note is given to either their combined long term contributions in tax or NI over their working lives, or their continued tax contributions to the Treasury in retirement. Its not quite the one way street that is portrayed by some in the media these days. But having invested so much in their retirement and this country, is it any sodding wonder that they turn out to vote in the numbers they do and therefore make a difference that sees political parties recognising their contributions?
Tiger played in the last pairing on Thursday, and in the first pairing today. His first round had no birdies and 3 bogeys. I was the flag man on 7 on Thursday, standing right at the tee markers. As Tiger arrived on the tee it was apparent he was in some discomfort. He made eye contact and smiled a wincing smile, then took a club from Joey and stretched his back for several seconds.
Today Tiger was 5 under par for the round leaving the 13th green. He then double bogeyed 14, bogeyed 16, then triple bogeyed 17. He has not sunk a putt over 5 feet in either round.
Today I was on the left side of the landing area on 7 (435 yard uphill dogleg left). There was not much activity until the Phil Mickelson / D.A. Points pairing came through. Mickelson hit to the far right of the fairway, the other side from me. Points hit just outside the ropes on my side. We dropped a couple of poles before he arrived and got the crowd back. When he arrived he was brusque and needed more poles dropped and more crowd moved back, as he was going to hit to the left of a tree just off the fairway. This took a couple of minutes as there was only one other marshal and myself. Then he hit his shot and walked off without a glance, a smile, or any acknowledgement of the marshals. This is unusual, but it happens. The other marshal and I put the stakes back in the ground, and I turned around to find Phil Mickelson and Bones, his caddy, heading straight for me, striding across the fairway. He shook our hands, then said he just wanted to thank us for all the work marshals do, and how much he appreciated us. Then he looked in the direction of Points, who was striding up the fairway, smiled a bit and said "He's been like that all day." Bones said Thanks and then they were off up to the green.
Phil has always been one of my favorites, up there with Tom Watson and Jack Nicklaus. I've seen at first hand some of what he does off the course, as well as signing innumerable autographs for fans. The man is the epitome of class.
I have to be out of the house at 5.45am tomorrow as play has been moved up due to thunderstorms, and they are playing 3-somes starting at 7.30am. It's not all bad - I have a new Nike rain suit I want to try out...
Drop Farage, and re-instate Bloom.
"What else draws these voters?"
NOTA - and Farage throwing his toys today risks that USP...
Farage is now a liability.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_in_the_United_Kingdom#Percentile_points_for_income_of_individuals_before_tax
I'm baffled by this Labour assertion that £60K isn't rich. What world are they living in?
Rich is top 1%...
Farage is at heart a mainstream politician. He wants to be wooed by other parties. He is appalled to discover fruitcakes in his midst, in a way that all major parties dismiss with a weary sigh. But it may well be that the UKIP vote is actually predominantly people who want a bit of fruitcake, and dislike any hint of moderaiton and compromise.
Alternatively, it may be that Any Publicity Is Good Publicity. We shall see, very shortly.
http://www.parliament.uk/about/mps-and-lords/members/pay-mps/
£66,396 a year might be their "not rich" figure.
Scary ;-)
“I’ve never even pulled mine out!” quipped another female candidate.
They were teasing him... the minxes!
Perhaps the clinking glasses and wafting perfume got Godfrey thinking about Silvio Berlusconi’s “bunga-bunga” parties again - he admits he’s always longed for an invitation from the former Italian PM.
Whatever the cause, the words popped out of his mouth like a cork from a bottle of Dom Perignon
“This place is full of sluts!” guffawed Godfrey.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ukip-mep-godfrey-blooms-sluts-2289513#ixzz2fU2lFJXc
Richard Tyndall was criticising Nigel Farage's Leadership style, and he went onto welcome the reversal of UKIP's policy of banning the burqa against the tide of most of their supporters. Anyhoos, another UKIPper came back and waxed lyrical about what a broad tent UKIP was, and that this was going to see a general acceptance that there were going to be differing views or opinions on many issues.
Indeed, the conversation led onto a post that waxed lyrical about the fact that UKIP's growing membership meant that there was going to be a growing diversity of views... But again, that UKIP was a broad church which could welcome and envelope this diversity. I was nearly falling off my chair laughing at this point, they obviously don't visit ConHom or the Telegraph which is UKIP R us in the threads....
The irony of the fact that some left the Conservative party to join UKIP because they felt they couldn't accept a similar situation in that party appeared to be lost on them. But earlier today, Richard Tyndall, who in the past has heavily criticised Farage's Leadership style went onto post about his hope that UKIP would in fact eventually be able to pressure the Conservatives into changing their Leader!!! So, he didn't get the leader he wanted in his chosen party, but he still hopes that his party rather than the current membership of the Conservative party will influence who becomes the next Leader of the Conservative party. Good luck with that one!!