Amber Rudd makes far too convenient a scapegoat and this gives far too convenient a pretext. The impulse for Theresa May to withdraw love and support must be super-strong right now.
But can Mrs May afford to have another pissed off MP on the backbenches?
She's got that very awkward set of Customs Union votes coming up.
Latest story suggests rudd could be out I reckon... What are her odds?
I did tip her at 33/1.
Now 2/1, which is probably about right in current circumstances. I'm not sure Labour has the ability to hit the back of the net despite only having the keeper to beat.
This memo has to be the end. Either
1. She's lied to Parliament.
2. She didn't even bother to read the memo for her own department.
Either way you'd think she's got to be toast.
Wasn't Amber Rudd accompanies at the Select Committee by the Permanent Secretary of the Home Office? He seems to have kept quiet and not intervened to correct Rudd, so presumably did not read the memo either.
Amber Rudd makes far too convenient a scapegoat and this gives far too convenient a pretext. The impulse for Theresa May to withdraw love and support must be super-strong right now.
But can Mrs May afford to have another pissed off MP on the backbenches?
She's got that very awkward set of Customs Union votes coming up.
Just what I was thinking. She's a lock to vote with the Gov't as Home Sec, as a remainer backbencher... not so much.
Overall I think Amber has been poor anyway, maybe not enough attention to detail or so much attention to security and policing matters that immigration fell between the stools
I think Amber has a LOT of allies - Remember how Cameron and Osborne sent her out to nail Boris in the referendum debate + How she stood in for Theresa in the leaders debates last year (while Mrs May cowered behind the settee)
However enough is enough. She's got to go.
I judge Amber on her mishandling of Windrush, not because she is a remainer, and if it is the former she should go, but the later no
Amber Rudd makes far too convenient a scapegoat and this gives far too convenient a pretext. The impulse for Theresa May to withdraw love and support must be super-strong right now.
But can Mrs May afford to have another pissed off MP on the backbenches?
She's got that very awkward set of Customs Union votes coming up.
I'll not have a bad word said against Mrs May
she sacked that twat Osborne
one day a grateful nation shall erect a statue to her
Latest story suggests rudd could be out I reckon... What are her odds?
I did tip her at 33/1.
Now 2/1, which is probably about right in current circumstances. I'm not sure Labour has the ability to hit the back of the net despite only having the keeper to beat.
This memo has to be the end. Either
1. She's lied to Parliament.
2. She didn't even bother to read the memo for her own department.
Either way you'd think she's got to be toast.
Wasn't Amber Rudd accompanies at the Select Committee by the Permanent Secretary of the Home Office? He seems to have kept quiet and not intervened to correct Rudd, so presumably did not read the memo either.
Latest story suggests rudd could be out I reckon... What are her odds?
I did tip her at 33/1.
Now 2/1, which is probably about right in current circumstances. I'm not sure Labour has the ability to hit the back of the net despite only having the keeper to beat.
This memo has to be the end. Either
1. She's lied to Parliament.
2. She didn't even bother to read the memo for her own department.
Either way you'd think she's got to be toast.
Wasn't Amber Rudd accompanies at the Select Committee by the Permanent Secretary of the Home Office? He seems to have kept quiet and not intervened to correct Rudd, so presumably did not read the memo either.
The whole department probably needs dismantling and starting again...
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
The internal war in labour over this is sad to see, how has a once great party been brought down to this.
I would say that the Wadsworth case may be political in the sense something had to be seen to be done before the locals next week but it has triggered real internal anger
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
You seem quite obsessed with the colour of Marc Wadsworth's skin.
Would it be OK if he were a white 'anti racist campaigner', or it were the reputation of an innocent white man at stake?
I wonder if there would have been such a baying lynch mob at hands were it not such an impressive black anti racism campaigner. Just as we can question Marc because his incident upset Ruth who is Jewish we can question the actions of those acting against Marc who is Black.
There is no victim hierarchy, we cannot condemn someone black for the sake of someone Jewish or sacrifice someone Jewish for the sake of someone Black. If people seem to be targeting someone Jewish questions should be asked as they rightly have done in the Labour party. That doesn't mean we can take our eye of the ball though, if people are ganging up on and smearing a black anti racist campaigner then questions have to be asked as well.
It is all well and good being extra woke about the racism that suits your political agenda but it is important to equally apply that to racism which doesn't.
If simply bringing the party into disrepute is the charge then quite frankly Labour could kick out plenty of the anti Corbyn Labour members as well, I suspect we won't be seeing that happening though. Also he said working not conspiring.
Well, if I ever rejoin the Conservatives, and publicly accuse one of the party's MP's of working with the left wing press in order to harm the party (while distributing leaflets calling for the expulsion of "traitors" from the party), I'm likely to get into hot water if I can't justify my accusation.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
This is one of the worst things about it, there has been a bit of time elapsed since it happened where the incident has been played up as an anti-semitic incident. Now the man has been found guilty.
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
Amber Rudd makes far too convenient a scapegoat and this gives far too convenient a pretext. The impulse for Theresa May to withdraw love and support must be super-strong right now.
But can Mrs May afford to have another pissed off MP on the backbenches?
She's got that very awkward set of Customs Union votes coming up.
The CU votes will not change as I cannot see a way TM wins the HOC on this subject anyway. The maths do not add up
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
So I can't call Bliar , a Tory ? Will I be expelled ?
The evidence that I have seen [ maybe there are other evidence I have not seen ] does not suggest anything ant-semitic.
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
You seem quite obsessed with the colour of Marc Wadsworth's skin.
Would it be OK if he were a white 'anti racist campaigner', or it were the reputation of an innocent white man at stake?
I wonder if there would have been such a baying lynch mob at hands were it not such an impressive black anti racism campaigner. Just as we can question Marc because his incident upset Ruth who is Jewish we can question the actions of those acting against Marc who is Black.
There is no victim hierarchy, we cannot condemn someone black for the sake of someone Jewish or sacrifice someone Jewish for the sake of someone Black. If people seem to be targeting someone Jewish questions should be asked as they rightly have done in the Labour party. That doesn't mean we can take our eye of the ball though, if people are ganging up on and smearing a black anti racist campaigner then questions have to be asked as well.
It is all well and good being extra woke about the racism that suits your political agenda but it is important to equally apply that to racism which doesn't.
If simply bringing the party into disrepute is the charge then quite frankly Labour could kick out plenty of the anti Corbyn Labour members as well, I suspect we won't be seeing that happening though. Also he said working not conspiring.
Well, if I ever rejoin the Conservatives, and publicly accuse one of the party's MP's of working with the left wing press in order to harm the party (while distributing leaflets calling for the expulsion of "traitors" from the party), I'm likely to get into hot water if I can't justify my accusation.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
This is one of the worst things about it, there has been a bit of time elapsed since it happened where the incident has been played up as an anti-semitic incident. Now the man has been found guilty.
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
Your anger is there for all to see but this has come from within labour and reported on by the broadcast media widely who could never be accused of being the right wing press
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
So I can't call Bliar , a Tory ? Will I be expelled ?
The evidence that I have seen [ maybe there are other evidence I have not seen ] does not suggest anything ant-semitic.
That's up to the Labour Party. It's not up to me to tell them how to enforce party discipline, but on the fact of this case, I can see how the NEC could reasonably conclude that Marc Wadsworth had brought the party into disrepute.
Marc Wadsworth was a campaigner for justice in the Stephen Lawrence case. This man has been fighting against racism for years and now the right wing media get to imply he is some kind of racist when nobody on here who watched the video evidence would say he was anti-semitic in this case.
Absolutely disgusting, those MPs targetting this black anti racist campaigner for purely political reasons should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
People were complaining about Len's piece the other day, where he pointed out that there was anti semites in Labour that need to be kicked out but that there were also those using anti semitism to smear Corbyn and his supporters.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
So I can't call Bliar , a Tory ? Will I be expelled ?
The evidence that I have seen [ maybe there are other evidence I have not seen ] does not suggest anything ant-semitic.
Don’t worry, you could probably rejoin under a pseudonym
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
Good God. How many years has she been involved in politics?
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
You seem quite obsessed with the colour of Marc Wadsworth's skin.
Would it be OK if he were a white 'anti racist campaigner', or it were the reputation of an innocent white man at stake?
I wonder if there would have been such a baying lynch mob at hands were it not such an impressive black anti racism campaigner. Just as we can question Marc because his incident upset Ruth who is Jewish we can question the actions of those acting against Marc who is Black.
There is no victim hierarchy, we cannot condemn someone black for the sake of someone Jewish or sacrifice someone Jewish for the sake of someone Black. If people seem to be targeting someone Jewish questions should be asked as they rightly have done in the Labour party. That doesn't mean we can take our eye of the ball though, if people are ganging up on and smearing a black anti racist campaigner then questions have to be asked as well.
It is all well and good being extra woke about the racism that suits your political agenda but it is important to equally apply that to racism which doesn't.
If simply bringing the party into disrepute is the charge then quite frankly Labour could kick out plenty of the anti Corbyn Labour members as well, I suspect we won't be seeing that happening though. Also he said working not conspiring.
Well, if I ever rejoin the Conservatives, and publicly accuse one of the party's MP's of working with the left wing press in order to harm the party (while distributing leaflets calling for the expulsion of "traitors" from the party), I'm likely to get into hot water if I can't justify my accusation.
Considering the civil war in the party and how both sides thought they were in the right and fighting for the good of the party you could throw out huge numbers of Labour members on the grounds of harming the party, working with the wrong people and calling for your opponents to leave, although traitors is harsher language than I would like to see used, plenty of that both sides as well.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
On topic - Gove reminds me of Keith Joseph - intellectual heft, sans presentation skills - who is Gove's Maggie? Hunt?
If Jeremy Hunt is Margaret Thatcher I am Bugs Bunny!
There is no current Thatcher (which frankly should be fairly obvious - people like her tend to stand out).
That said, while I agree about Gove, we are perhaps in a post-PR era where ideas matter more and presentation for its own sake, less. Presentation *of* ideas (or of values or events), by contrast, is crucial.
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
This is one of the worst things about it, there has been a bit of time elapsed since it happened where the incident has been played up as an anti-semitic incident. Now the man has been found guilty.
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
Your anger is there for all to see but this has come from within labour and reported on by the broadcast media widely who could never be accused of being the right wing press
You are probably right, I could maybe accuse them of helping create the atmosphere where this occurred or maybe indirect blame in other ways but blame in this case probably doesn't belong with the right wing press.... it is always tempting/comforting to fall back on the old enemies though!
On topic - Gove reminds me of Keith Joseph - intellectual heft, sans presentation skills - who is Gove's Maggie? Hunt?
If Jeremy Hunt is Margaret Thatcher I am Bugs Bunny!
There is no current Thatcher (which frankly should be fairly obvious - people like her tend to stand out).
That said, while I agree about Gove, we are perhaps in a post-PR era where ideas matter more and presentation for its own sake, less. Presentation *of* ideas (or of values or events), by contrast, is crucial.
Yes, but surely the point is that, if the presentation is awful, people won't even listen to the politician in question and so won't ever even hear their ideas?
That seemed to be a lot of floating voters' problem with Hillary: a lot of people just instinctively found her so irritating/boring that they just switched the channel when she came on, so they never heard much directly from her.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
This "judgement" was done simply to make the baying press happy ! Shameful day for Labour.
On topic - Gove reminds me of Keith Joseph - intellectual heft, sans presentation skills - who is Gove's Maggie? Hunt?
If Jeremy Hunt is Margaret Thatcher I am Bugs Bunny!
There is no current Thatcher (which frankly should be fairly obvious - people like her tend to stand out).
That said, while I agree about Gove, we are perhaps in a post-PR era where ideas matter more and presentation for its own sake, less. Presentation *of* ideas (or of values or events), by contrast, is crucial.
Hunt has neither Gove's Brains nor the charisma and presentation skills of Davidson or Boris plus he is under investigation by the Parliamentary Standards Board if you want someone with public appeal there are far better options
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
Corbyn only comes out of his shell during election campaigns that matter..ie his leadership campaigns and GE...the rest of the time he is completely and utterly useless, but even at his worst he is not as bad as Ed Miliband who was marginally better than IDS....
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
This is one of the worst things about it, there has been a bit of time elapsed since it happened where the incident has been played up as an anti-semitic incident. Now the man has been found guilty.
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
Your anger is there for all to see but this has come from within labour and reported on by the broadcast media widely who could never be accused of being the right wing press
You are probably right, I could maybe accuse them of helping create the atmosphere where this occurred or maybe indirect blame in other ways but blame in this case probably doesn't belong with the right wing press.... it is always tempting/comforting to fall back on the old enemies though!
Good on you for your response - honest reflection does us all good from time to time
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
There's been a full hearing before the NCC with Wadsworth represented by Counsel, Roger. Unless you've at least seen a copy of the full judgment, which I don't think is available anywhere, you are yourself breaching the rules of natural justice, by saying tthere has been a breach of them. Here's Clive Lewis yesterday:
On topic - Gove reminds me of Keith Joseph - intellectual heft, sans presentation skills - who is Gove's Maggie? Hunt?
If Jeremy Hunt is Margaret Thatcher I am Bugs Bunny!
There is no current Thatcher (which frankly should be fairly obvious - people like her tend to stand out).
That said, while I agree about Gove, we are perhaps in a post-PR era where ideas matter more and presentation for its own sake, less. Presentation *of* ideas (or of values or events), by contrast, is crucial.
I think the fact that Gove looks like a toad will ultimately not be held against him
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
If the government ignores Parliament re: CU, then Parliament can and has the power to revoke Art.50.
The EU has made it clear that as long as the revocation is done before March 29th [ or was it end of 2020 ] , all will be forgotten. It would just be a bad nightmare.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
The deal or otherwise has to go to the HOC for a meaningful vote and at that point anything could happen, even dare I say it another referendum on the outcome
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
This is one of the worst things about it, there has been a bit of time elapsed since it happened where the incident has been played up as an anti-semitic incident. Now the man has been found guilty.
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
Do you join Wadsworth in wanting to see fewer "white boys" around?
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
If the government ignores Parliament re: CU, then Parliament can and has the power to revoke Art.50.
The EU has made it clear that as long as the revocation is done before March 29th [ or was it end of 2020 ] , all will be forgotten. It would just be a bad nightmare.
I shall call it the Bobby Ewing moment.
Does it have the power? I thought it was the executive that handled the execution of diplomacy. On your second point, has that been confirmed? I thought there were differing views on that.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
In the absence of agreemnet between the EU Commission and the UK Government, then the Uk leaves the EU under WTO terms.
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
Corbyn only comes out of his shell during election campaigns that matter..ie his leadership campaigns and GE...the rest of the time he is completely and utterly useless, but even at his worst he is not as bad as Ed Miliband who was marginally better than IDS....
Hi tyson............But who do we vote for..... the Tories whose endemic racism is even more widespread than we thought or Labour who who are allowing Guido to pull their strings?
Well here you go, proof of exactly what he was saying. A great victory for the right wing media and Corbyn sceptic MPs who cares that it came at the cost of the reputation of an innocent black man.
Well done to Clive Lewis and Chris Williamson for standing up for him. I am absolutely disgusted by the treatment of this man, it is about time people started to stand up to these bullies.
Surely if you accuse one of your own party's MPs of conspiring with the right wing press, you need to provide evidence to support that charge, or else you will be accused of bringing the party into disrepute.
That seems the reason he has been expelled not anti - semitism , is that correct.?
This is one of the worst things about it, there has been a bit of time elapsed since it happened where the incident has been played up as an anti-semitic incident. Now the man has been found guilty.
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
Do you join Wadsworth in wanting to see fewer "white boys" around?
Maybe there are other evidence regarding Wadsworth. I hope that is the case, not just the comment at the meeting.
If that is the only evidence, then half the members of any party could be expelled.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
If the government ignores Parliament re: CU, then Parliament can and has the power to revoke Art.50.
The EU has made it clear that as long as the revocation is done before March 29th [ or was it end of 2020 ] , all will be forgotten. It would just be a bad nightmare.
I shall call it the Bobby Ewing moment.
Does it have the power? I thought it was the executive that handled the execution of diplomacy. On your second point, has that been confirmed? I thought there were differing views on that.
Neither point is cut and dried. Parliament cannot of itself revoke Article 50 but it could, in theory at least, pass binding votes to the same extent - though that may necessitate or prompt a change of government.
On A50, yes, noises from within the EU have been consensual on that point but until the CJEU gives a definitive ruling, no-one can know for sure whether a state which has invoked A50 can revoke it. There are differing legal views and were the EU and UK to carry on as if the UK was still a member, only for the Court to then rule that it wasn't, would cause absolute chaos.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
In the absence of agreemnet between the EU Commission and the UK Government, then the Uk leaves the EU under WTO terms.
UK Parliament has no power over the EU.
...........unless Parliament revokes Art.50 in time.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
If the government ignores Parliament re: CU, then Parliament can and has the power to revoke Art.50.
The EU has made it clear that as long as the revocation is done before March 29th [ or was it end of 2020 ] , all will be forgotten. It would just be a bad nightmare.
I shall call it the Bobby Ewing moment.
Brexit is governed by European law, not the U.K. Parliament. It’s amusing how Remainer MPs are just as narcissistic about their own importance and powers as their Leave counterparts.
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
Corbyn only comes out of his shell during election campaigns that matter..ie his leadership campaigns and GE...the rest of the time he is completely and utterly useless, but even at his worst he is not as bad as Ed Miliband who was marginally better than IDS....
Hi tyson............But who do we vote for..... the Tories whose endemic racism is even more widespread than we thought or Labour who who are allowing Guido to pull their strings?
Obviously I'd vote for Corbyn...I did vote for Ed Miliband after all, but in the locals I'll vote Green.....
Corbyn is frustratingly useless in an irritating way.....
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
The deal or otherwise has to go to the HOC for a meaningful vote and at that point anything could happen, even dare I say it another referendum on the outcome
Yes, but unless there's some intervention with the EU, which the EU accepts - and hence, which parliament of itself cannot command - then Britain leaves on 29 March next year.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
The deal or otherwise has to go to the HOC for a meaningful vote and at that point anything could happen, even dare I say it another referendum on the outcome
One mustn't call it a second referendum. It frightens the horses. 'A further public vote on the leave terms'? Or Sir Humphrey might have come up with craftier wording ...
The wording on these things seems to change poll results +/- 5-10%, suggesting that referendums aren't a terribly reliable way to decide what's best for the country. But I think we all knew that.
Labour are making complete idiots of themselves. They'll have a revolt on their hands if they think they can flout natural justice in this way. If saying an MP is working with the media is a sacking offence then everything is.
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
Corbyn only comes out of his shell during election campaigns that matter..ie his leadership campaigns and GE...the rest of the time he is completely and utterly useless, but even at his worst he is not as bad as Ed Miliband who was marginally better than IDS....
Hi tyson............But who do we vote for..... the Tories whose endemic racism is even more widespread than we thought or Labour who who are allowing Guido to pull their strings?
Obviously I'd vote for Corbyn...I did vote for Ed Miliband after all, but in the locals I'll vote Green.....
Corbyn is frustratingly useless in an irritating way.....
Green is of course left of Corbyn, wanting to nationalise GPs for example.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
In the absence of agreemnet between the EU Commission and the UK Government, then the Uk leaves the EU under WTO terms.
UK Parliament has no power over the EU.
The clear view of the former head of the Council's legal service is that the EU cannot kick us out against our will even if we have previously invoked Article 50. If tested in the ECJ it would probably depend on whether the revocation was in good faith.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I do not see how that gets past the HOC
Does it need to? The process is controlled by A50. Unless the notification is revoked or extended we just leave in March 2019, don't we? The main problem there is lack of preparation - we have no infrastructure to cope with a switch to WTO rules.
In the absence of agreemnet between the EU Commission and the UK Government, then the Uk leaves the EU under WTO terms.
UK Parliament has no power over the EU.
...........unless Parliament revokes Art.50 in time.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I think empty supermarket shelves will focus minds on that one. And planes not flying is a real thing. We have all said it so ridiculous it couldn't possibly happen, but the default is that it will happen unless there is agreement. Someone will have to blink and I wouldn't assume the EU will take the Irish border backstop out of the Withdrawal Agreement. The UK government will either have to sign the Withdrawal Agreement as is (does this need ratifying in HoC?), in which case the government may fall, or it will have to agree an alternative UK wide solution with the EU. There isn't currently a fudge here.
I would treat all these numbers with an absolutely massive pinch of salt.
Some "inward investment" is the foreign takeover of British firms; some is portfolio turnover by international investors; some is investment in real estate; and some is building new factories.
Now, we know that car industry investment dropped in 2017 - but while some of this is probably Brexit uncertainty related, there's also going to be some that is the result of Dieselgate, and some that we're probably past the peak of this auto cycle, at least from an investment perspective.
And some of the drop is simply that the ARM takeover happened in 2016, and there was nothing similar in 2017.
Gross Capital Formation (aka investment) has actually been very strong in the UK in 2017 - much better than I expected, so it's not clear that there has been any meaningful dropoff in the kind of inward investment we should most want to promote.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
Could be a blinder by the Cons. In all the Windrush furore no one really noticed Rudd's customs union comments.
We’re leaving the customs union.
But we’ll rejoin a customs union.
Classic British fudge.
Liam Fox’s incompetence saves us all.
I'm beginning to think Theresa is a very clever arch-Remainer. She appointed Liam on purpose, knowing he'd mess it up. So without any hint of trade deals, the Brexit Ultras are neutered, having to either suck up the EU Customs Union and vassal statehood or endorse economic collapse. They're screwed.
According to the linked BBC article, Theresa May genuinely thinks the unicorns just need to be set free and the UK will get all the benefits of EU arrangements with none of the obligations. It's not tactics on her part and stalling for time (which would be understandable).
In an impossible position TM can only count down the clock to the ultimate deadlock in the Autumn that will see the HOC defeat the hard Brexit leaving her to go to Brussels and accept a CU.
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Since he PM has already said we will not join a customs union, either the EU accepts the technology solution for the Irish border or the UK adopts WTO rules with no UK/EU agreement.
I wish the elections were taking place this week instead of next, it feels like an enormous waste of time having to wait until next Thursday for the electorate's verdict.
I wish the elections were taking place this week instead of next, it feels like an enormous waste of time having to wait until next Thursday for the electorate's verdict.
I dunno, a lot more could happen by then, the way events are moving.
Comments
She's got that very awkward set of Customs Union votes coming up.
she sacked that twat Osborne
one day a grateful nation shall erect a statue to her
Let me clarify. I do not want her to be sacked because of the Windrush scandal. If anyone should be sacked for that, it must be T May.
T May will not sack her for the same reasons. She is also the lightning rod.
I would say that the Wadsworth case may be political in the sense something had to be seen to be done before the locals next week but it has triggered real internal anger
The fact it is for bringing the party into disrepute, an open ended charge that could see the majority of the Labour party kicked out if you were super strict about it, will be glossed over and this man will be smeared as an anti semite.
Great victory for the right wing press, innocent man who helped campaign regarding the Stephen Lawrence murder smeared for the sake of political point scoring. Absolutely disgusting.
Also I guess it adds to the general smear of Corbyn or his supporters are somehow anti semitic but Corbyn (although he shouldn't have to) is big enough to take the abuse, there are enough Corbyn supporters to spread the burden of the lies and smears but this man has been individually brandished and that is completely unacceptable to me.
The evidence that I have seen [ maybe there are other evidence I have not seen ] does not suggest anything ant-semitic.
Oh yes they did. Hence the leak about the memo which included targets.
A potential leader rival at work?
What a sentence!
So much for that smoking gun....
That is my logic. I think if this is the outcome a lot will be very angry but most will be so weary they will accept the position and move on
Just as I was warming to them. Pathetic Labour.
Gove will never be PM.
That said, while I agree about Gove, we are perhaps in a post-PR era where ideas matter more and presentation for its own sake, less. Presentation *of* ideas (or of values or events), by contrast, is crucial.
That seemed to be a lot of floating voters' problem with Hillary: a lot of people just instinctively found her so irritating/boring that they just switched the channel when she came on, so they never heard much directly from her.
Corbyn only comes out of his shell during election campaigns that matter..ie his leadership campaigns and GE...the rest of the time he is completely and utterly useless, but even at his worst he is not as bad as Ed Miliband who was marginally better than IDS....
"On Twitter, Lewis said social media commentators “do not get to be judge, jury and executioner when it comes to who’s expelled or not. Go read a history book about what happens when an accusation equals evidence.” https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/apr/27/labour-activist-marc-wadsworth-expelled-from-party-over-antisemitism-row
I imagine he wishes he hadn't said that.
The EU has made it clear that as long as the revocation is done before March 29th [ or was it end of 2020 ] , all will be forgotten. It would just be a bad nightmare.
I shall call it the Bobby Ewing moment.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/apr/27/amber-rudd-was-told-about-migrant-removal-targets-leak-reveals
It does look difficult now. One more vote for CU
The opinion is she resigns now or goes before the HOC on monday to apologise. No 10 and Home Office gone into silence mode according to Sky.
I would be very surprised if she is still in office by Monday night
UK Parliament has no power over the EU.
If that is the only evidence, then half the members of any party could be expelled.
On A50, yes, noises from within the EU have been consensual on that point but until the CJEU gives a definitive ruling, no-one can know for sure whether a state which has invoked A50 can revoke it. There are differing legal views and were the EU and UK to carry on as if the UK was still a member, only for the Court to then rule that it wasn't, would cause absolute chaos.
Corbyn is frustratingly useless in an irritating way.....
The wording on these things seems to change poll results +/- 5-10%, suggesting that referendums aren't a terribly reliable way to decide what's best for the country. But I think we all knew that.
Should finish off any lingering prospects of being elected leader.
Department cancels a set of targets that do not exist, and then leaks a memo that appears to show they did exist after all.
[My great aunt had a coal fire. It was fantastically cosy].
Some "inward investment" is the foreign takeover of British firms; some is portfolio turnover by international investors; some is investment in real estate; and some is building new factories.
Now, we know that car industry investment dropped in 2017 - but while some of this is probably Brexit uncertainty related, there's also going to be some that is the result of Dieselgate, and some that we're probably past the peak of this auto cycle, at least from an investment perspective.
And some of the drop is simply that the ARM takeover happened in 2016, and there was nothing similar in 2017.
Gross Capital Formation (aka investment) has actually been very strong in the UK in 2017 - much better than I expected, so it's not clear that there has been any meaningful dropoff in the kind of inward investment we should most want to promote.
How the mighty have fallen
Would need a women to be promoted to cabinet to keep the balance....
https://twitter.com/theobertram/status/989617525574045697
3 new Shares for every 2 Shares held, at a price of 70p per Share
Reshuffle on Monday for starters.