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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Sandpit said:

    It turns out that there is a market for a maximum wage:

    https://twitter.com/johnrentoul/status/819098016317636608

    Jeremy Corbyn was onto something, even if his execution and timing was atrocious.

    Tell folks that currently, the top 1% pay 27% of all income tax. Then ask folks if there should be a maximum tax these same 1% pay. Then ask them if they want to make up the difference themselves with higher tax. (which is ACTUALLY what this twattish policy means).
    It's got nothing to do with tax. It's about the fairer distribution of profits. If poorer people earn more they won't be as dependent on tax-funded handouts from the state.
    Which is why the government is raising minimum wages and income tax allowances, and when we leave the EU will also be discouraging the unskilled immigration which keeps wages low for the poorest.
    Leaving aside the question of whether or not we will actually do anything at all about immigration, it is probably more skilled and semi-skilled immigrants (the Polish plumber and his builder mates) keeping wages down.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Wednesday is the usual day for the Supreme Court issuing its judgments and the Supreme Court's tweets so far this morning do not list it among the cases for which judgments are to be given today. If it were due out today, I expect we would already have had a commotion in the media.

    Wait ... the Supreme Court tweets?
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,154
    PlatoSaid said:

    Re the Trump gossip - I noticed this in the Cummings epic https://dominiccummings.wordpress.com/2017/01/09/on-the-referendum-21-branching-histories-of-the-2016-referendum-and-the-frogs-before-the-storm-2/ It's about 60% the way in.

    (NB. Whoever leaked the Hilary email story was probably doing something similar. This played into the media obsession with scandal and process such that they spent a ridiculous amount of time on it despite probably 80% of them wanting Hilary to win. It shows how powerfully the media is in the grip of dynamics they rarely reflect on themselves. Putin’s communication maestro, Surkov, uses these sorts of tricks all the time. Cf. Peter Pomerantsev’s great book, a must read for any MP before they pontificate on Putin’s mafia government.)

    Anyone read it?

    What never seems to get mentioned in the leaks of the Democrat e-mails is no-one has ever suggested they are fake. That people had to resign was down to what they said - and that was never questioned. That they were seen to be a duplicitous bunch of shits trying to stiff Bernie Sanders whilst claiming they were being treated even-handedly was only a story because they were being a duplicitous bunch of shits. Moral of the story? If you are doing bad stuff, assume that foreign security services are going to discover it.

    If the whole of our Parliamentary expenses scandal was shown ultimately to be down to the Telegraph getting a bunch of Russian-hacked documents, would we here get all bent out of shape?
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340

    Wednesday is the usual day for the Supreme Court issuing its judgments and the Supreme Court's tweets so far this morning do not list it among the cases for which judgments are to be given today. If it were due out today, I expect we would already have had a commotion in the media.

    Wait ... the Supreme Court tweets?
    I know, I know. The Pope, the CIA and the Queen, and now the Supreme Court. We're going to hell in a handcart.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,014
    Mr. L, speaking of court tweets...

    https://twitter.com/CourtNewsUK/status/818777861679120385

    Mmm, patriarchy.
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    HYUFD said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    One problem Trump may have is that I would be surprised if he had not, at some time, had contact with Russian spooks. Given his role and prominence, he is the sort of person they would look into, even if informally and without his knowledge.

    I bet prominent people here in the UK will have as well. I mean, if they set a honeytrap for OGH ... ;)

    FSB (and our own MI5 and MI6) almost certainly have large files on Trump and other prominent businessmen with interests around he world. It's already been seen with stories starting to leak about Rex Tillerson.

    Any international businessman will have greased the right palms to get a contract signed in various parts of the world, it's just the way these places do business.
    And there's the danger if Trump's done anything like it.

    I wonder how much the FSB had on Obama before he came to power? I'm guessing not much as he was a bit of a surprise candidate. Unless, of course, they'd followed OGH's early tip. ;)
    Yes, there will be a huge contrast with Obama. The incumbent was probably the cleanest president for a century, hadn't been to Washington at all and was pretty much unknown outside Illinois before he ran for the top job. Contrast with Trump, who has always been controversial and certainly hasn't been ultra careful in his business dealings as might be expected of someone running for high office.

    There will be loads of skeletons in Trump's closet for those who wish to look hard enough for them, but he does have an uncanny ability to brush most of his past dalliances under the carpet. Unless they find a direct link between Trump himself and the Russian govt in a way thats unambiguously treasonous, he'll probably be okay. Depends how much he offends the Washington Republicans I guess.
    Trump is basically an independent who used the Republican Party as a vehicle to become President, if Washington Republicans become too difficult he will throw them under a bus in the 2018 mid terms as will his supporters

    If it has got to that stage by 2018 then it is highly unlikely that Trump will see out his term. He'll either be impeached by a Republican or a Democrat Congress.

  • Options
    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956

    Essexit said:

    This is all very reminiscent of the night I came back to the flat around 11.30pm, went on twitter and PB and it dawned on me I'd have to write a thread about David Cameron allegedly sticking his dangly bits inside a dead pig's head.

    If there's to be a similar thread about Trump, fingers crossed for some piss-poor urination puns.
    That's a decision for Mike.

    The saddest thing about the Cameron pig story was it was right at the end of my stint as guest editor, I had written a thread about AV which had to get bumped because I had to cover the pig story.
    Maybe you'll get to do an A-Wee thread?

    I'll see myself out.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    PlatoSaid said:

    Re the Trump gossip - I noticed this in the Cummings epic https://dominiccummings.wordpress.com/2017/01/09/on-the-referendum-21-branching-histories-of-the-2016-referendum-and-the-frogs-before-the-storm-2/ It's about 60% the way in.

    (NB. Whoever leaked the Hilary email story was probably doing something similar. This played into the media obsession with scandal and process such that they spent a ridiculous amount of time on it despite probably 80% of them wanting Hilary to win. It shows how powerfully the media is in the grip of dynamics they rarely reflect on themselves. Putin’s communication maestro, Surkov, uses these sorts of tricks all the time. Cf. Peter Pomerantsev’s great book, a must read for any MP before they pontificate on Putin’s mafia government.)

    Anyone read it?

    What never seems to get mentioned in the leaks of the Democrat e-mails is no-one has ever suggested they are fake. That people had to resign was down to what they said - and that was never questioned. That they were seen to be a duplicitous bunch of shits trying to stiff Bernie Sanders whilst claiming they were being treated even-handedly was only a story because they were being a duplicitous bunch of shits. Moral of the story? If you are doing bad stuff, assume that foreign security services are going to discover it.

    If the whole of our Parliamentary expenses scandal was shown ultimately to be down to the Telegraph getting a bunch of Russian-hacked documents, would we here get all bent out of shape?
    True, though it has been suggested the DNC was far more generous to Sanders than was justified by his performance -- he kept running long after it was clear he could not win.
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Alistair said:

    The important thing to remember is that t doesn't matter if it is true or not. Just what people feel.

    I presume Trump felt briefly warm but then cooled rapidly.

    It seems that the Trump supporters are taking this allegation literally but not seriously while their opponents are taking it seriously but not literally.
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    SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,978
    edited January 2017
    Slight quibble on the header - it was not a Labour rebrand, it was a Corbyn one. We are now at the stage where the more it is about Corbyn the better it is for Labour post-Corbyn.
  • Options
    For some reason a fine old Yiddish word springs to mind.

    pisher

    Noun

    (plural pishers)

    1. (derogatory) Somebody who is inept at a task or new to a job.


    Though I presume the Don would (allegedly) be the pishee.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,436
    edited January 2017
    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Just catching up on the Kempton Park story. Many a good day spent there in the past. :(
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing/article-4105574/Jockey-Club-announces-proposals-shut-Kempton-Park-2021.html

    Worth it if they get £100M though , and King George goes to Sandown. Sensible decision.
    Maybe, maybe not. They killed the Champion Stakes stone dead (IMO) by moving it to that supermarket Ascot.

    Each track has its own character and the races there evolve to be associated with that character. A King George involves them coming round the far turn and then racing on on the flat over the last three fences over nearly a mile with the race being played out over who jumps those fences the better. We all remember the great finishes there as a result.

    At Sandown, they come round the corner, jump the pond fence, then have one more fence and a short, uphill run-in.

    Completely different.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,896
    Sandpit said:

    Just catching up on the Kempton Park story. Many a good day spent there in the past. :(
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing/article-4105574/Jockey-Club-announces-proposals-shut-Kempton-Park-2021.html

    As I understand it, Spelthorne Borough Council asked organisations to submit sites for possible residential development (a "call for sites" as it is known). Jockey Club Racecourses have offered Kempton Park but on two conditions - first, they get £100 million or more for the site and second, planning permission is granted for a new floodlit all-weather track at The Links in Newmarket.

    I would argue writing Kempton's obituary is a shade premature. The racecourse site is large and has a purpose-built railway station which is a huge plus and is very close to the A308 and therefore the M25, M4 and M3 and obviously Heathrow. The view from a colleague who knows the site is that 3,000 homes would be about right and the £100 million valuation not unreasonable in the current climate. He also thinks Spelthorne are mad at the moment and will face huge local opposition.

    The second phase involves the often prickly planning situation in Newmarket where there's no guarantee the JCR scheme will get past the local planners.

    The JCR needs the money to improve Cheltenham, Sandown and its other tracks and a new AW track at Newmarket is a direct challenge to Chelmsford who will be staging floodlit turf racing at the new "racino" within a couple of years though no one seems to know where the extra fixtures will come from.

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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,793
    Small Business Confidence Index +8.5 in Q4 vs -2.9 in Q3

    Up across most of the UK - outliers are London (-2%) and Scotland (-29%)

    SNP sure to blame Brexit - but that affects whole UK, only IndyRef2 affects Scotland:

    http://www.fsb.org.uk/docs/default-source/fsb-org-uk/fsb-sbi-q4-2016---jan-11-2017.pdf?sfvrsn=0
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    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095

    Slight quibble on the header - it was not a Labour rebrand, it was a Corbyn one. We are now at the stage where the more it is about Corbyn the better it is for Labour post-Corbyn.

    I think you said that about Gordon Brown......
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    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,729

    PlatoSaid said:

    Re the Trump gossip - I noticed this in the Cummings epic https://dominiccummings.wordpress.com/2017/01/09/on-the-referendum-21-branching-histories-of-the-2016-referendum-and-the-frogs-before-the-storm-2/ It's about 60% the way in.

    (NB. Whoever leaked the Hilary email story was probably doing something similar. This played into the media obsession with scandal and process such that they spent a ridiculous amount of time on it despite probably 80% of them wanting Hilary to win. It shows how powerfully the media is in the grip of dynamics they rarely reflect on themselves. Putin’s communication maestro, Surkov, uses these sorts of tricks all the time. Cf. Peter Pomerantsev’s great book, a must read for any MP before they pontificate on Putin’s mafia government.)

    Anyone read it?

    What never seems to get mentioned in the leaks of the Democrat e-mails is no-one has ever suggested they are fake. That people had to resign was down to what they said - and that was never questioned. That they were seen to be a duplicitous bunch of shits trying to stiff Bernie Sanders whilst claiming they were being treated even-handedly was only a story because they were being a duplicitous bunch of shits. Moral of the story? If you are doing bad stuff, assume that foreign security services are going to discover it.

    If the whole of our Parliamentary expenses scandal was shown ultimately to be down to the Telegraph getting a bunch of Russian-hacked documents, would we here get all bent out of shape?
    The Telegraph brought to light expense claims from all sides of the Commons. The Russians tilted the US election in their favoured direction by leaking only one side. That is a big difference.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953

    Wednesday is the usual day for the Supreme Court issuing its judgments and the Supreme Court's tweets so far this morning do not list it among the cases for which judgments are to be given today. If it were due out today, I expect we would already have had a commotion in the media.

    Ah, thanks. Maybe next Wednesday then.

    One assumes the media will get a day's notice/tip off and go completely ballistic for 48 hours, based entirely on their own view of the issue and completely irrespective of the actual judgement.
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    stodgestodge Posts: 12,896

    Millwall football club in trouble?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38577838

    My understanding on this one is that Lewisham BC are trying to buy the site for residential redevelopment. As with Kempton, there is a railway station more or less on the site and the Bermondsey Dive Under project (due to complete mid 2018) will provide increased capacity into the redeveloped London Bridge meaning more trains.

    There are some "concerns" as to how this has happened behind the scenes and some questions are being asked about the involvement of certain senior Lewisham BC officers and members.

    As for Millwall, they will either have to ground share but I can't see that or move out of London completely (as did Wimbledon). It is rumoured there is a site on the North Kent coast in which the club are interested though that would be a huge move for the supporters.

    Again, expect plenty of local opposition.
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    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,729

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953

    Sandpit said:

    It turns out that there is a market for a maximum wage:

    https://twitter.com/johnrentoul/status/819098016317636608

    Jeremy Corbyn was onto something, even if his execution and timing was atrocious.

    Tell folks that currently, the top 1% pay 27% of all income tax. Then ask folks if there should be a maximum tax these same 1% pay. Then ask them if they want to make up the difference themselves with higher tax. (which is ACTUALLY what this twattish policy means).
    It's got nothing to do with tax. It's about the fairer distribution of profits. If poorer people earn more they won't be as dependent on tax-funded handouts from the state.
    Which is why the government is raising minimum wages and income tax allowances, and when we leave the EU will also be discouraging the unskilled immigration which keeps wages low for the poorest.
    Leaving aside the question of whether or not we will actually do anything at all about immigration, it is probably more skilled and semi-skilled immigrants (the Polish plumber and his builder mates) keeping wages down.
    It's certainly true that there are a lot of people one or two skill levels above min wage - earning £20k ish - and finding life quite difficult, especially those who are a little older and have families. These are the JAMs that Theresa May is saying she will concentrate on helping.

    A sensible future system would link employment visas for foreign workers to apprenticeship schemes, so a building company could hire a Polish plumber if they also trained up a British plumber at the same time.
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    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    Donald Trump is just like Jesus Christ, both spent time with prostitutes.

    Dan Brown even did a book about it.
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    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    edited January 2017

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    Donald Trump is just like Jesus Christ, both spent time with prostitutes.

    Dan Brown even did a book about it.
    I don't think the Good Lord consorted with prostitutes in the way you are implying!
  • Options

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    Donald Trump is just like Jesus Christ, both spent time with prostitutes.

    Dan Brown even did a book about it.
    I don't think the Good Lord consorted with prostitutes in the way you are implying!
    Haven't you watched The Da Vinci Code documentary starring Tom Hanks?
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383

    PlatoSaid said:

    Re the Trump gossip - I noticed this in the Cummings epic https://dominiccummings.wordpress.com/2017/01/09/on-the-referendum-21-branching-histories-of-the-2016-referendum-and-the-frogs-before-the-storm-2/ It's about 60% the way in.

    (NB. Whoever leaked the Hilary email story was probably doing something similar. This played into the media obsession with scandal and process such that they spent a ridiculous amount of time on it despite probably 80% of them wanting Hilary to win. It shows how powerfully the media is in the grip of dynamics they rarely reflect on themselves. Putin’s communication maestro, Surkov, uses these sorts of tricks all the time. Cf. Peter Pomerantsev’s great book, a must read for any MP before they pontificate on Putin’s mafia government.)

    Anyone read it?

    What never seems to get mentioned in the leaks of the Democrat e-mails is no-one has ever suggested they are fake. That people had to resign was down to what they said - and that was never questioned. That they were seen to be a duplicitous bunch of shits trying to stiff Bernie Sanders whilst claiming they were being treated even-handedly was only a story because they were being a duplicitous bunch of shits. Moral of the story? If you are doing bad stuff, assume that foreign security services are going to discover it.

    If the whole of our Parliamentary expenses scandal was shown ultimately to be down to the Telegraph getting a bunch of Russian-hacked documents, would we here get all bent out of shape?
    A few prominent PBers claimed they were fake and had Cyrillic text. I won't embarrass them.

    My spidey-sense tells me this Trump story is beyond tripe - and even less credible than Cameron's Pig. It's a spoiler for the confirmation sessions IMO.

    I was most amused by WaPo rowing away from #FakeNews after it backfired all over the MSM - some of us said it was total folly from the start, and would only expose their own failures.

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2017/01/09/washington-post-cries-uncle-stop-using-tainted-term-fake-news/
  • Options
    Carolus_RexCarolus_Rex Posts: 1,414
    Now that is funny. I don't even dislike Farage that much, but it's still funny.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,004

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    He performed poorly in Utah anyway, and all the bible belt would rather die before voting Democrat. So no electoral odds anyhow.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,004
    This 7-4 figure for the Supreme Court regarding Brexit has sprung up a couple of times. I hope no clerks have been leaking..
  • Options
    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬
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    glwglw Posts: 9,554

    Anyone read it?

    I read it quite a while ago, it's okay. There are loads of similar books about the collusion between the Russian government, the security and intelligence services, the media, the oligarchs, and organised crime.

    David Satters' book Darkness at Dawn is one of the better books, but a little old now. Masha Gessen's book The Man Without a Face is good too, and a better book than Pomerantsev's.


  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,004

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    I doubt the Kremlin would leak this story to embarrass Trump.
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    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    So bears DON'T shit in the woods?!
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    Pulpstar said:

    This 7-4 figure for the Supreme Court regarding Brexit has sprung up a couple of times. I hope no clerks have been leaking..

    There's nothing worse than *accurate* irresponsible ill-informed press speculation.
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953
    stodge said:

    Sandpit said:

    Just catching up on the Kempton Park story. Many a good day spent there in the past. :(
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing/article-4105574/Jockey-Club-announces-proposals-shut-Kempton-Park-2021.html

    As I understand it, Spelthorne Borough Council asked organisations to submit sites for possible residential development (a "call for sites" as it is known). Jockey Club Racecourses have offered Kempton Park but on two conditions - first, they get £100 million or more for the site and second, planning permission is granted for a new floodlit all-weather track at The Links in Newmarket.

    I would argue writing Kempton's obituary is a shade premature. The racecourse site is large and has a purpose-built railway station which is a huge plus and is very close to the A308 and therefore the M25, M4 and M3 and obviously Heathrow. The view from a colleague who knows the site is that 3,000 homes would be about right and the £100 million valuation not unreasonable in the current climate. He also thinks Spelthorne are mad at the moment and will face huge local opposition.

    The second phase involves the often prickly planning situation in Newmarket where there's no guarantee the JCR scheme will get past the local planners.

    The JCR needs the money to improve Cheltenham, Sandown and its other tracks and a new AW track at Newmarket is a direct challenge to Chelmsford who will be staging floodlit turf racing at the new "racino" within a couple of years though no one seems to know where the extra fixtures will come from
    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.
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    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    edited January 2017

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    It would be interesting to know how many who voted for Trump to drain the swamp were surprised by his cabinet of billionaires. It is not exactly Mr Smith Goes to Washington.
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    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    My favourite ever political anecdote is Tom Driberg saying that his opponent in an election tried to smear him by telling constituents that he was gay, but utterly failed because one third didn't understand what they were being told, one third didn't believe it and one third didn't mind.

    And what are the bible bashers going to do about it this side of 2020? I am not a Trump supporter; I just don't think this is going anywhere.

    Can't help wondering about the fluid dynamics, mind you. Do professional troupes of watersporters bring inflatable paddling pools with them to protect the carpets?
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    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
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    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    So bears DON'T shit in the woods?!
    Not this Russian bear.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    Donald Trump is just like Jesus Christ, both spent time with prostitutes.

    Dan Brown even did a book about it.
    I don't think the Good Lord consorted with prostitutes in the way you are implying!
    Haven't you watched The Da Vinci Code documentary starring Tom Hanks?
    Mr Eagles, that wasn't a documentary!
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,014
    Mr. Eagles, don't knock ill-informed speculation. I fluked a Perez winning tip a year or two ago when I thought the odds were good and didn't realise he had a grid penalty.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,004

    Pulpstar said:

    This 7-4 figure for the Supreme Court regarding Brexit has sprung up a couple of times. I hope no clerks have been leaking..

    There's nothing worse than *accurate* irresponsible ill-informed press speculation.
    It won't be the judges, I watched some of the proceedings and they're clearly made of better stuff than thicko ministers and journos.
    I'd be disappointed if I was in their shoes and some clerks had leaked to ministers who was voting which way.
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    isamisam Posts: 41,009
    Sandpit said:

    stodge said:

    Sandpit said:

    Just catching up on the Kempton Park story. Many a good day spent there in the past. :(
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing/article-4105574/Jockey-Club-announces-proposals-shut-Kempton-Park-2021.html

    As I understand it, Spelthorne Borough Council asked organisations to submit sites for possible residential development (a "call for sites" as it is known). Jockey Club Racecourses have offered Kempton Park but on two conditions - first, they get £100 million or more for the site and second, planning permission is granted for a new floodlit all-weather track at The Links in Newmarket.

    I would argue writing Kempton's obituary is a shade premature. The racecourse site is large and has a purpose-built railway station which is a huge plus and is very close to the A308 and therefore the M25, M4 and M3 and obviously Heathrow. The view from a colleague who knows the site is that 3,000 homes would be about right and the £100 million valuation not unreasonable in the current climate. He also thinks Spelthorne are mad at the moment and will face huge local opposition.

    The second phase involves the often prickly planning situation in Newmarket where there's no guarantee the JCR scheme will get past the local planners.

    The JCR needs the money to improve Cheltenham, Sandown and its other tracks and a new AW track at Newmarket is a direct challenge to Chelmsford who will be staging floodlit turf racing at the new "racino" within a couple of years though no one seems to know where the extra fixtures will come from
    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.
    https://twitter.com/oflynnmep/status/819108015165022208
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    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    For PB geeks

    /dev/null
    The first episode of 'The Computer Programme' was broadcast by the BBC 35 years ago on 11th Jan 1982 https://t.co/NaarZDvNIS via @YouTube
  • Options
    Sandpit said:

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    Donald Trump is just like Jesus Christ, both spent time with prostitutes.

    Dan Brown even did a book about it.
    I don't think the Good Lord consorted with prostitutes in the way you are implying!
    Haven't you watched The Da Vinci Code documentary starring Tom Hanks?
    Mr Eagles, that wasn't a documentary!
    Oh. :lol:
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,729
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    My favourite ever political anecdote is Tom Driberg saying that his opponent in an election tried to smear him by telling constituents that he was gay, but utterly failed because one third didn't understand what they were being told, one third didn't believe it and one third didn't mind.

    And what are the bible bashers going to do about it this side of 2020? I am not a Trump supporter; I just don't think this is going anywhere.

    Can't help wondering about the fluid dynamics, mind you. Do professional troupes of watersporters bring inflatable paddling pools with them to protect the carpets?
    Mid terms.
  • Options
    stodge said:

    Millwall football club in trouble?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38577838

    My understanding on this one is that Lewisham BC are trying to buy the site for residential redevelopment. As with Kempton, there is a railway station more or less on the site and the Bermondsey Dive Under project (due to complete mid 2018) will provide increased capacity into the redeveloped London Bridge meaning more trains.

    There are some "concerns" as to how this has happened behind the scenes and some questions are being asked about the involvement of certain senior Lewisham BC officers and members.

    As for Millwall, they will either have to ground share but I can't see that or move out of London completely (as did Wimbledon). It is rumoured there is a site on the North Kent coast in which the club are interested though that would be a huge move for the supporters.

    Again, expect plenty of local opposition.
    I understand Kent is the more likely option. I think losing places like Millwall FC and Kempton really denudes the surroundings of character. New Cross doesn't have much going for it but at least it sounds/looks vibrant on match days.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,729

    Now that is funny. I don't even dislike Farage that much, but it's still funny.
    LOL - first time I've ever posted that.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,154
    edited January 2017
    Pulpstar said:

    This 7-4 figure for the Supreme Court regarding Brexit has sprung up a couple of times. I hope no clerks have been leaking..

    7-4 means we only need to discover that 2 of the 7 have stayed in Moscow hotels for that to magically become 5-6..... Over to you, Vlad.
  • Options
    glwglw Posts: 9,554
    Pulpstar said:

    I doubt the Kremlin would leak this story to embarrass Trump.

    The pun not withstanding I think you are probably right there, if the FSB had some truly compromising material on Trump that would be gold, why would they let knowledge about this spread to commercial security companies? They would guard such material for use when they could exert the most pressure. But spreading malicious but false gossip is right out of the FSB and Russian government playbook.
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    My favourite ever political anecdote is Tom Driberg saying that his opponent in an election tried to smear him by telling constituents that he was gay, but utterly failed because one third didn't understand what they were being told, one third didn't believe it and one third didn't mind.

    And what are the bible bashers going to do about it this side of 2020? I am not a Trump supporter; I just don't think this is going anywhere.

    Can't help wondering about the fluid dynamics, mind you. Do professional troupes of watersporters bring inflatable paddling pools with them to protect the carpets?
    Mid terms.
    Yes, if you expect Trump to be more closely aligned with one party rather than another in 2 years time. I don't: he is, as someone said yesterday, an independent elected on a Republican ticket.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Lovely Ninja
    4Chan Claims To Have Fabricated Anti-Trump Report As A Hoax https://t.co/lRfoRHy7gr
  • Options
    mattmatt Posts: 3,789

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    That may be accurate if a touch misleading. Other people collect the information and aggregate it for the Kremlin.
  • Options
    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,793
    All very childish....but quite funny....

    https://twitter.com/BrianSpanner1/status/819112913944412160
  • Options
    According to the latest CNN poll Obama is leaving office with a 55% approval rating, Trump is beginning with an historically low 37%. Unless Trump turns that around quickly, Republican members of Congress are going to become very wary of associating too closely with him. And if something compromising does emerge it surely makes impeachment more likely. From a UK perspective, getting ratification of a Trump-negotiated trade deal that gives us a significant upside is going to get harder the more unpopular the President is.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    Lady Durrant
    Churchill bust to return to the White House under Donald #Trump after a request was put to Boris Johnson...
    https://t.co/sXGFtVpKdM
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953
    PlatoSaid said:

    Lovely Ninja
    4Chan Claims To Have Fabricated Anti-Trump Report As A Hoax https://t.co/lRfoRHy7gr

    If that's true and the whole thing is just a hoax, I'd piss myself laughing. ;)
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,051
    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
  • Options
    DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    PlatoSaid said:


    My spidey-sense tells me this Trump story is beyond tripe - and even less credible than Cameron's Pig. It's a spoiler for the confirmation sessions IMO.

    Agreed. Watersportsgate does sound bizarre and incredible -- leaving aside any fetishistic aspects together with the childishness, it is impossible to imagine Trump wasting the money.

    Whether it is a corrupted golf-club brag ("what I should have done is ...") or is a distraction from a real scandal elsewhere (follow the money) is a separate question.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,729
    Ishmael_Z said:

    Ishmael_Z said:

    Urine for a shock if you think these latest stories will damage Trump. Water off a duck's back for him at this point, no-one really thought he was a wholesome family man anyway.

    Except maybe some in the bible bashing midwestern states of the US?
    My favourite ever political anecdote is Tom Driberg saying that his opponent in an election tried to smear him by telling constituents that he was gay, but utterly failed because one third didn't understand what they were being told, one third didn't believe it and one third didn't mind.

    And what are the bible bashers going to do about it this side of 2020? I am not a Trump supporter; I just don't think this is going anywhere.

    Can't help wondering about the fluid dynamics, mind you. Do professional troupes of watersporters bring inflatable paddling pools with them to protect the carpets?
    Mid terms.
    Yes, if you expect Trump to be more closely aligned with one party rather than another in 2 years time. I don't: he is, as someone said yesterday, an independent elected on a Republican ticket.
    ... who is dependent on Congress if he wants to get his policies through.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,859
    Sandpit said:

    PlatoSaid said:

    Lovely Ninja
    4Chan Claims To Have Fabricated Anti-Trump Report As A Hoax https://t.co/lRfoRHy7gr

    If that's true and the whole thing is just a hoax, I'd piss myself laughing. ;)
    Actually, they claim to have fabricated only the salacious bit, which then got included in the report.

    This seems to be a reasonable view of the report:
    https://www.wired.com/2017/01/spy-agency-vets-read-bombshell-trump-report-caution/
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    All fully priced in before the election. If this stuff turns out to be 100% true, will your opinion of Trump be any lower than it was before you knew it was true?
  • Options
    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,859

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    To be fair, the Kremlin has other agencies to do that for them.
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953
    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    The Russians will have a *lot* of videos of businessmen with hookers.

    A friend of mine in Moscow says for businessmen to always pick up girls in the strip clubs, as the 'models' flirting with you in the hotel bar are almost always not what they seem - if they're not employed by the government they'll be employed by whoever you're trying to do a deal with. Real James Bond stuff.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,896
    isam said:

    Sandpit said:


    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.

    https://twitter.com/oflynnmep/status/819108015165022208
    The problem is, as Sandpit says, it's a prime development site. Kempton Park station is hardly used on non race days so South West Trains would love to see a new commuter pool set up in the area.

    I've been a member at Kempton Park in times past - the Clubhouse always put on free hot food for the members and on summer evenings, it was a delightful place to attend.

    These days, it only really comes to life on King George VI Chase day - by the way, the option of running it at Sandown is madness when there is another JCR track already racing on Boxing Day which should host the race - Huntingdon. Spend some money, improve the facilities and take the race there.

    As for Patrick O'Flynn's comment, well, fine, but the unwelcome truth is we need the houses and that means we need land on which to build. Brownfield will get you so far (and further than most think) but we let Hurst Park go in the mid 60s (now a housing estate and a school) for much the same reasons as Kempton is going now - we need to build houses.

    As with the reduction in greyhound tracks, there are other demands on land. I'm surprised no one is looking at Lingfield Park - good location on the outskirts of a small town, railway station and great connections to the M25 and Gatwick - but perhaps Tandridge have other options. Being even more radical, what about Aintree or Leicester or Nottingham ? To what extent in an age of unprecedented land pressure can any racecourse be justified in a suburban setting ?

  • Options
    SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,713

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

    Maybe it's true, maybe it's not, but if people condone what Buzzfeed has done, then they've lost any moral arguement about 'Fake News'.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

    Just shows how totally boring Obama is

  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,906
    ....and the joint winners are "Wikileaks' and "Water-gate'
  • Options
    Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 8,981
    PlatoSaid said:
    It is wrong on several points. Habeas corpus (habeas subjunctive) is (post-classical) Latin for "produce the body" - You have the body would be habes corpus. Bona fide is *in* good faith; etc etc.
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,051
    Ishmael_Z said:

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    All fully priced in before the election. If this stuff turns out to be 100% true, will your opinion of Trump be any lower than it was before you knew it was true?
    The problem isn't hookers. The grabbing pussy comments were much, much worse than shagging hookers.

    The problem is the fact that there could be a video and the potential for blackmail. If it happened, then Trump is a crass risk taker (which we knew)....if it isn't true, as South Observer says, it sounds like it would be true.


  • Options
    EssexitEssexit Posts: 1,956

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

    "I did not have urinary relations with those women."
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,009
    stodge said:

    isam said:

    Sandpit said:


    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.

    https://twitter.com/oflynnmep/status/819108015165022208
    The problem is, as Sandpit says, it's a prime development site. Kempton Park station is hardly used on non race days so South West Trains would love to see a new commuter pool set up in the area.

    I've been a member at Kempton Park in times past - the Clubhouse always put on free hot food for the members and on summer evenings, it was a delightful place to attend.

    These days, it only really comes to life on King George VI Chase day - by the way, the option of running it at Sandown is madness when there is another JCR track already racing on Boxing Day which should host the race - Huntingdon. Spend some money, improve the facilities and take the race there.

    As for Patrick O'Flynn's comment, well, fine, but the unwelcome truth is we need the houses and that means we need land on which to build. Brownfield will get you so far (and further than most think) but we let Hurst Park go in the mid 60s (now a housing estate and a school) for much the same reasons as Kempton is going now - we need to build houses.

    As with the reduction in greyhound tracks, there are other demands on land. I'm surprised no one is looking at Lingfield Park - good location on the outskirts of a small town, railway station and great connections to the M25 and Gatwick - but perhaps Tandridge have other options. Being even more radical, what about Aintree or Leicester or Nottingham ? To what extent in an age of unprecedented land pressure can any racecourse be justified in a suburban setting ?

    Selling England by the Pound. Everything beautiful about our country will soon go. Why is there so much pressure to build?

    The Boutique Hotel is turning into a Holiday Inn
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,859

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

    Maybe it's true, maybe it's not, but if people condone what Buzzfeed has done, then they've lost any moral arguement about 'Fake News'.
    Except that this isn't fake news; it's a genuine piece of raw intelligence which may or may not be true. Buzzfeed - and indeed any reputable new organisation - are be perfectly correct to publish it, with appropriate caveats.
    Whether it was right to have leaked it is another matter.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,896

    According to the latest CNN poll Obama is leaving office with a 55% approval rating, Trump is beginning with an historically low 37%. Unless Trump turns that around quickly, Republican members of Congress are going to become very wary of associating too closely with him. And if something compromising does emerge it surely makes impeachment more likely. From a UK perspective, getting ratification of a Trump-negotiated trade deal that gives us a significant upside is going to get harder the more unpopular the President is.

    The 2018 midterms give the Democrats a real opportunity IF they can take it to come back in the House and Senate. Whether they like it or not, the GOP will be tied to Trump's performance and to how he is viewed.

    The other possibility is even though he was elected on the GOP ticket, it may be IF he alienates the GOP lawmakers, Trump will need to reach out to the Democrats to get anything done at all.

  • Options
    Sandpit said:

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    The Russians will have a *lot* of videos of businessmen with hookers.

    A friend of mine in Moscow says for businessmen to always pick up girls in the strip clubs, as the 'models' flirting with you in the hotel bar are almost always not what they seem - if they're not employed by the government they'll be employed by whoever you're trying to do a deal with. Real James Bond stuff.

    The Chinese do it too. I remember a video that was circulated to a lot of business press people in my field of a senior executive at a major company having a fine old time with a young lady. The accompanying message - purportedly from her - was how he had promised her the world, but walked away, and this is the kind of man he really is. I guess he failed to pay the money that was asked of him. It may well be that the genesis of any Trump tape is in something similar.

  • Options

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

    Just shows how totally boring Obama is

    Or that he has no need to pay :-)
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    IIRC this is the first death penalty for hate crime

    Roseanne Barr
    Jury sentences Dylann Roof to death for Charleston church slayings YAY!! https://t.co/2UIyR8bFn7
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763
    After Trump you'd have thought the Foreign Office would have learned the acronym STFU


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/01/10/britain-will-not-deal-marine-le-pen-uks-ambassador-france-says/
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,051
    Sandpit said:

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    The Russians will have a *lot* of videos of businessmen with hookers.

    A friend of mine in Moscow says for businessmen to always pick up girls in the strip clubs, as the 'models' flirting with you in the hotel bar are almost always not what they seem - if they're not employed by the government they'll be employed by whoever you're trying to do a deal with. Real James Bond stuff.
    Honey trapping is the oldest and easiest form of espionage. Men are just so stupid....... especially rich, narcissistic, risk takers.....

    I never get what the deal is with hookers. I wouldn't want my pecker anywhere near a place where someone like Trump or Berlusconi has been maybe hours before. Yuck.

    SeanT could probably provide a better insight in whoring, but it just strikes me as all a bit unhygienic.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,447
    A policy wonk speaks:

    Ed Miliband ‏@Ed_Miliband 19h19 hours ago
    Whatever precise mechanism, Jeremy Corbyn is totally right to be setting agenda on the crucial issue of obscene pay differentials today.

    No wonder he was never PM if he communicates like this on Twitter.
  • Options
    ParistondaParistonda Posts: 1,819
    BussFeed shouldn't have published this in my opinion.
    A) Trump no doubt has plenty of scandals - if this turns out to be a complete hoax they will cast aspersions on any future scandals. It will be too easy to call Fake News on everything anti-Turmp in future.
    B) No need to damage Trump at this stage, wait until he is already unpopular then kick him while he's down by publishing this kind of story, once it's verified. this would have been a far better story to release a year or so into his presidency.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,729
    PlatoSaid said:

    IIRC this is the first death penalty for hate crime

    Roseanne Barr
    Jury sentences Dylann Roof to death for Charleston church slayings YAY!! https://t.co/2UIyR8bFn7

    Surely other mass murderers have been sentenced to death in the US?
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,763

    A policy wonk speaks:

    Ed Miliband ‏@Ed_Miliband 19h19 hours ago
    Whatever precise mechanism, Jeremy Corbyn is totally right to be setting agenda on the crucial issue of obscene pay differentials today.

    No wonder he was never PM if he communicates like this on Twitter.

    make him hand a kitchen back
  • Options
    SandpitSandpit Posts: 49,953
    Scott_P said:

    ttps://twitter.com/rupertmyers/status/819119220139130880

    Scott, you owe me a new keyboard for that!
  • Options
    isam said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:

    Sandpit said:


    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.

    https://twitter.com/oflynnmep/status/819108015165022208
    The problem is, as Sandpit says, it's a prime development site. Kempton Park station is hardly used on non race days so South West Trains would love to see a new commuter pool set up in the area.

    I've been a member at Kempton Park in times past - the Clubhouse always put on free hot food for the members and on summer evenings, it was a delightful place to attend.

    These days, it only really comes to life on King George VI Chase day - by the way, the option of running it at Sandown is madness when there is another JCR track already racing on Boxing Day which should host the race - Huntingdon. Spend some money, improve the facilities and take the race there.

    As for Patrick O'Flynn's comment, well, fine, but the unwelcome truth is we need the houses and that means we need land on which to build. Brownfield will get you so far (and further than most think) but we let Hurst Park go in the mid 60s (now a housing estate and a school) for much the same reasons as Kempton is going now - we need to build houses.

    As with the reduction in greyhound tracks, there are other demands on land. I'm surprised no one is looking at Lingfield Park - good location on the outskirts of a small town, railway station and great connections to the M25 and Gatwick - but perhaps Tandridge have other options. Being even more radical, what about Aintree or Leicester or Nottingham ? To what extent in an age of unprecedented land pressure can any racecourse be justified in a suburban setting ?

    Selling England by the Pound. Everything beautiful about our country will soon go. Why is there so much pressure to build?

    The Boutique Hotel is turning into a Holiday Inn
    'And that will be England gone,
    The shadows, the meadows, the lanes,
    The guildhalls, the carved choirs.
    There’ll be books; it will linger on
    In galleries; but all that remains
    For us will be concrete and tyres.'
  • Options
    Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    isam said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:

    Sandpit said:


    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.

    https://twitter.com/oflynnmep/status/819108015165022208
    The problem is, as Sandpit says, it's a prime development site. Kempton Park station is hardly used on non race days so South West Trains would love to see a new commuter pool set up in the area.

    I've been a member at Kempton Park in times past - the Clubhouse always put on free hot food for the members and on summer evenings, it was a delightful place to attend.

    These days, it only really comes to life on King George VI Chase day - by the way, the option of running it at Sandown is madness when there is another JCR track already racing on Boxing Day which should host the race - Huntingdon. Spend some money, improve the facilities and take the race there.

    As for Patrick O'Flynn's comment, well, fine, but the unwelcome truth is we need the houses and that means we need land on which to build. Brownfield will get you so far (and further than most think) but we let Hurst Park go in the mid 60s (now a housing estate and a school) for much the same reasons as Kempton is going now - we need to build houses.

    As with the reduction in greyhound tracks, there are other demands on land. I'm surprised no one is looking at Lingfield Park - good location on the outskirts of a small town, railway station and great connections to the M25 and Gatwick - but perhaps Tandridge have other options. Being even more radical, what about Aintree or Leicester or Nottingham ? To what extent in an age of unprecedented land pressure can any racecourse be justified in a suburban setting ?

    Selling England by the Pound. Everything beautiful about our country will soon go. Why is there so much pressure to build?

    The Boutique Hotel is turning into a Holiday Inn
    It's the genesis of the end of rural britain
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    "Ben actually disses his own story, which they have been unable to stand up. Would the New York Times have published this – no. Would Guido have published it? Possibly, if we thought the source was credible enough. Imagine if we published a story about a union leader consorting with a prostitute based on widely circulating rumours and off the record briefings, naming no names and getting no affidavits or pictures. Would that be credible?"

    https://order-order.com/2017/01/11/253411/
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,130
    edited January 2017
    TOPPING said:

    malcolmg said:

    Sandpit said:

    Just catching up on the Kempton Park story. Many a good day spent there in the past. :(
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/racing/article-4105574/Jockey-Club-announces-proposals-shut-Kempton-Park-2021.html

    Worth it if they get £100M though , and King George goes to Sandown. Sensible decision.
    Maybe, maybe not. They killed the Champion Stakes stone dead (IMO) by moving it to that supermarket Ascot.

    Each track has its own character and the races there evolve to be associated with that character. A King George involves them coming round the far turn and then racing on on the flat over the last three fences over nearly a mile with the race being played out over who jumps those fences the better. We all remember the great finishes there as a result.

    At Sandown, they come round the corner, jump the pond fence, then have one more fence and a short, uphill run-in.

    Completely different.
    Very True, perhaps they could use some of the cash to remodel Sandown.
  • Options
    PlatoSaidPlatoSaid Posts: 10,383
    And more unravelling

    "Incoming counselor to the president Kellyanne Conway on Tuesday denied that President-elect Trump was verbally briefed by heads of intelligence agencies last Friday about a report that Russian operatives may have personal and financial information about him.

    The former Trump campaign manager called out intelligence officials for not briefing Trump on the newest development in their investigation of Russian hacking of U.S. entities."

    http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2611477/
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Scott_P said:
    What do the industrial production figures look like Scott?

    2.1% eh -rejoice Scott, just rejoice.

  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,053
    PlatoSaid said:

    Lovely Ninja
    4Chan Claims To Have Fabricated Anti-Trump Report As A Hoax https://t.co/lRfoRHy7gr

    This post-truth politics, he's stuck with it now. Henceforth he'll always be the guy who gargled a Svetlana's piss in the Moscow Ritz-Carlton.

    I suspect the only reason he didn't go in for scat is because, as the Russian proverb has it, говно в говне не тонет.

  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,130
    Nigelb said:

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.

    That's Trump's problem here: it totally rings true. You would expect both him and the Russians to deny it. But they would, wouldn't they? Clinton denied all allegations against him until he was no longer able to.

    Maybe it's true, maybe it's not, but if people condone what Buzzfeed has done, then they've lost any moral arguement about 'Fake News'.
    Except that this isn't fake news; it's a genuine piece of raw intelligence which may or may not be true. Buzzfeed - and indeed any reputable new organisation - are be perfectly correct to publish it, with appropriate caveats.
    Whether it was right to have leaked it is another matter.
    It is just a bunch of losers that are sore because Trump knows they are fakers ,who have been living high on the hog for many years , peddling crap that they are really important and saving the country whilst just hosing money away on little empires.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,130
    Sandpit said:

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    The Russians will have a *lot* of videos of businessmen with hookers.

    A friend of mine in Moscow says for businessmen to always pick up girls in the strip clubs, as the 'models' flirting with you in the hotel bar are almost always not what they seem - if they're not employed by the government they'll be employed by whoever you're trying to do a deal with. Real James Bond stuff.
    Perhaps better to just keep it in your trousers, sounds like these businessmen are desperate losers.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,053
    Sandpit said:

    tyson said:

    Sandpit said:

    As if

    @NatVasilyevaAP: Putin's spokesman Peskov has just denied allegations in the Trump report, says "the Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising info"‬

    LOL. Great doublespeak there. The Kremlin doesn't collect intelligence but the FSB sure does!
    If anyone would get honey trapped, a vain, narcissistic, morally corrupt, risk taker who brags about grabbing women by their pussy with a penchant for hookers would be like taking sweets from a baby. Would explain too why Berlusconi and Shroeder became so close to Russia, though Berlusconi is such a vain man he would probably be proud for them to be posted. Straight out of the KGB copybook.

    God knows how many videos of hookers with businessmen the Russians have; just in case so to speak. And if said businessman becomes something more, like POTUS per chance, jeez, what a result.
    The Russians will have a *lot* of videos of businessmen with hookers.

    A friend of mine in Moscow says for businessmen to always pick up girls in the strip clubs, as the 'models' flirting with you in the hotel bar are almost always not what they seem - if they're not employed by the government they'll be employed by whoever you're trying to do a deal with. Real James Bond stuff.
    A "friend"... Ok... There are so many prostitutes in Moscow and SPb that it would be simply impossible for them all to be in the pay of the FSB.
  • Options
    tysontyson Posts: 6,051
    PlatoSaid said:

    IIRC this is the first death penalty for hate crime

    Roseanne Barr
    Jury sentences Dylann Roof to death for Charleston church slayings YAY!! https://t.co/2UIyR8bFn7

    Jesus Plato....god knows how your mind works. I think the fact that the guy killed 9 people might have something to do with the penalty.

    I don't agree with the penalty...everytime the US executes someone devalues that country...
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,009
    edited January 2017

    isam said:

    stodge said:

    isam said:

    Sandpit said:


    That's good background, thanks. Yes it's a huge site with a station, and it's half a mile from the M3/A316/A308 junction with transport links everywhere. Objectively it would be a prime site for development in the area.

    I had a contract for a year that was based literally next door, we always used to disappear mid afternoon and hope the boss (who had a box for the sales guys) didn't catch us at the Tote! Happy days, would be sad to see it go.

    https://twitter.com/oflynnmep/status/819108015165022208
    The problem is, as Sandpit says, it's a prime development site. Kempton Park station is hardly used on non race days so South West Trains would love to see a new commuter pool set up in the area.

    I've been a member at Kempton Park in times past - the Clubhouse always put on free hot food for the members and on summer evenings, it was a delightful place to attend.

    These days, it only really comes to life on King George VI Chase day - by the way, the option of running it at Sandown is madness when there is another JCR track already racing on Boxing Day which should host the race - Huntingdon. Spend some money, improve the facilities and take the race there.

    As for Patrick O'Flynn's comment, well, fine, but the unwelcome truth is we need the houses and that means we need land on which to build. Brownfield will get you so far (and further than most think) but we let Hurst Park go in the mid 60s (now a housing estate and a school) for much the same reasons as Kempton is going now - we need to build houses.

    As with the reduction in greyhound tracks, there are other demands on land. I'm surprised no one is looking at Lingfield Park - good location on the outskirts of a small town, railway station and great connections to the M25 and Gatwick - but perhaps Tandridge have other options. Being even more radical, what about Aintree or Leicester or Nottingham ? To what extent in an age of unprecedented land pressure can any racecourse be justified in a suburban setting ?

    Selling England by the Pound. Everything beautiful about our country will soon go. Why is there so much pressure to build?

    The Boutique Hotel is turning into a Holiday Inn
    'And that will be England gone,
    The shadows, the meadows, the lanes,
    The guildhalls, the carved choirs.
    There’ll be books; it will linger on
    In galleries; but all that remains
    For us will be concrete and tyres.'
    Very nice. That poem seems to be prophetic. What a shame.

This discussion has been closed.