It's all undeniably awkward, but destined to blow over, since neither Ed nor Len are going anywhere. Unlike some I think it will create a dip in Labour's poll rating (especially in polls that measure certainty to vote) for the usual reason that people are annoyed by division, but I doubt if it will last.
OGH- down here in Kent, yesterday DC opened the biggest windfarm off the coast in europe and made a verty good speech on the need for more renewable energy. Some staying stum on climate change I must say!
So 1 day actions dont count except for when they boost the strike day numbers under the Tories in which case they do?
Not really Neil it's what the germans would call a Warnstreik. A day out for the lads amd maybe get the fire going and grill some sausages. It makes a point but hurts no-one. To put it in context the 70s had an average of 13 million lost days per annum , the 80s about 7 million and the noughties only had 2 years which exceeded a million. So bigging up a million looks a bit desperate given the historical precedents.
Next UK General Election - market movements tonight
Most Seats market: Lab lengthening - now 5/8 at Betfair Overall Majority market: Lab Maj lengthening - now 24/17 at Betfair SNP Seats market: +6.5 shortening - now 4/5 at Ladbrokes
So bigging up a million looks a bit desperate given the historical precedents.
Sigh, you were the one bigging up the single year with more than a million days lost due to a single one day action across the public sector.
If you've actually looked at the data you'll have seen that the days lost have been reduced since 1990 under Governments of both colours and in no way more reduced under the last Labour Government (or earlier Labour Governments) which was your main point.
A crisis shouldn't be regarded as a problem but an opportunity.
It certainly is by wee Dougie and Murphy. Of course the fact that they are involved in all this should be setting alarm bells off for little Ed but is he smart enough to realise the connection? Doubtful. We'll see if wee Dougie gets that election strategy job or not. Particularly if little Ed forgets who was behind the Blairite whisper campaigns against him early on.
The only thing more amusing than that would be for little Ed to listed to the likes of Dan Hodges. As big a joke as he is it's amazing how heavily the swivel-eyed loons seem to rely on his 'sage wisdom'.
So bigging up a million looks a bit desperate given the historical precedents.
Sigh, you were the one bigging up the single year with more than a million days lost due to a single one day action across the public sector.
If you've actually looked at the data you'll have seen that the days lost have been reduced since 1990 under Governments of both colours and in no way more reduced under the last Labour Government (or earlier Labour Governments) which was your main point.
Sigh back, then you've misunderstood what I said. My point was and is that Unions didn;t pushed induistrial action against a Labour government to protect their members interests. Whereas as soon as Labout goes ex govt the willingness to resort to strikes increases, hence the sudden jump in days lost.
A crisis shouldn't be regarded as a problem but an opportunity.
It certainly is by wee Dougie and Murphy. Of course the fact that they are involved in all this should be setting alarm bells off for little Ed but is he smart enough to realise the connection? Doubtful. We'll see if wee Dougie gets that election strategy job or not.
Just as well Labour's troubles are only making headlines in England:
OGH- down here in Kent, yesterday DC opened the biggest windfarm off the coast in europe and made a verty good speech on the need for more renewable energy. Some staying stum on climate change I must say!
Don't bring up awkward things like facts and reality... Labour have said he hasn't and therefore he hasn't.
Yes, this is starting to stink to high heaven. I suspect Ed was planning a spin offensive against the unions, stung as he's been from the start by accusations that he's in their pocket. He's also desperate to get Murdoch and The Sun back on board. However, union elements with the PLP and elsewhere got wind of it, and departed amid a flurry of embittered press releases and p*ss-taking resignation letters. Their aim was to humiliate and destabilize Ed before he could mount his propaganda coup. Ed now looks broken and forlorn.
A crisis shouldn't be regarded as a problem but an opportunity.
It certainly is by wee Dougie and Murphy. Of course the fact that they are involved in all this should be setting alarm bells off for little Ed but is he smart enough to realise the connection? Doubtful. We'll see if wee Dougie gets that election strategy job or not.
Just as well Labour's troubles are only making headlines in England:
I posted a link regarding scotland already because the implications for SLAB are clear and far of far more consequence than PB tories wetting themselves because they hear the word "union" in this story.
The unions are symptom not cause. If there was harmony over the direction SLAB and scottish labour MPs were taking then it would not be an issue. The fact that it has escalated to 'funny business' shall we say (and on both sides lest anyone be under the illusion this is all about one type of candidate getting the sh*t end of the stick) is merely a measure of the chasm that still exists between the Blairites and the Brownites.
I posted a while back that the venue of that battle had merely changed from westminster to scotland and this is just yet more proof of it.
Not clear what's more embarrassing for Bolivia - their 'our President was kidnapped' story unravelling.....or the fact that the aircraft is called FAB1....I think Lady Penelope should be told...
It rather seems to me that Ed Miliband's handling of this farrago could not have been worse.
1. He should have taken action weeks ago, when the Falkirk concerns first emerged. 2. Instead he did very little, allowed colleagues to insult Eric Joyce for raising the concerns, and generally dithered. 3. We don't know exactly what was behind Tom Watson's resignation, but, whatever it was, Ed M dithered over accepting it. 4. That would have been OK, if the dithering had been of the 'I hope you can stay in post, why don't you take a couple of days to think about it' variety. Instead, he seems to have decided to try to keep Watson in post at all costs. 5. He chose utterly fatuous themes for PMQs yesterday, knowing full well they were fatuous and that Cammo would hit back with the Unite comments. 6. He compounded the error by preparing fatuous lines about how great Tom Watson is, which was an utterly bizarre thing to do. 7. Such was the chaos that these fatuous lines were left lying around in the loo. Was this really coincidence? With red-on-red smearing in full flow, it seems a bit unlikely. 8. And today he really blew it badly with the risible line that he wanted to sack Watson all along. Really, Ed? In that case, why did you have two separate pre-packaged responses ready for yesterday, strongly saying the diametric opposite?
He's annoyed the unions, he's annoyed the Blairites,he's annoyed the Brownites, he's got every political journalist in the country running round saying how weak he is, and he's allowed Watson to make a laughing stock of him as well.
No doubt Buddha Ed's zen-like calm will allow him to contemplate this mess with equanimity, but I don't think his colleagues will be quite so unconcerned.
A crisis shouldn't be regarded as a problem but an opportunity.
It certainly is by wee Dougie and Murphy. Of course the fact that they are involved in all this should be setting alarm bells off for little Ed but is he smart enough to realise the connection? Doubtful. We'll see if wee Dougie gets that election strategy job or not.
Just as well Labour's troubles are only making headlines in England:
The fact that it has escalated to 'funny business' shall we say (and on both sides lest anyone be under the illusion this is all about one type of candidate getting the sh*t end of the stick)
There were reports yesterday (by Crick) that Gemma Doyle's husband was also recruiting (11 IIRC) members for himself in Falkirk
But as I worked a lot today and I am a bit tired...I am not sure I got your point. Do you think the fact it's happening in Falkirk and not in a Welsh or English CLPs is not a pure coincidence but related to the state of SLAB?
He's annoyed the unions, he's annoyed the Blairites,he's annoyed the Brownites, he's got every political journalist in the country running round saying how weak he is, and he's allowed Watson to make a laughing stock of him as well.
But he's not 'weak' - no sireee! That's that other fella - you know - the Prime Minister.....
He's annoyed the unions, he's annoyed the Blairites,he's annoyed the Brownites, he's got every political journalist in the country running round saying how weak he is, and he's allowed Watson to make a laughing stock of him as well.
But he's not 'weak' - no sireee! That's that other fella - you know - the Prime Minister.....
*chortle*
Barbeque Dave gives his MPs a taste for EU victory: PM flips burgers during event in Downing Street
Prime Minister hosts Conservative get together to soothe relations
Labour and Lib Dems boycotting tomorrow's Commons vote on EU
Mr Cameron has promised an in-out referendum by 2017
Tories punished as 'rebels' for backing referendum now invited for bash
"Under the Labour government, babies were being born at the fastest rate since the 1950s. The population explosion began in 2001, but it wasn’t until 2008 that the Office for National Statistics flagged it up to the Department for Education and the local authorities – those responsible for planning ahead for schools.
Meanwhile, between 2004 and 2010, Labour cut the number of primary school places by 5 per cent – wiping out any extra spaces that might have absorbed the population growth. And during that period, Labour cut school funding by £150m.
When the DfE was finally warned about the population rise by the ONS in 2008, it reacted “too slowly”, a cross-party committee of MPs found.
Blame who you like, but Labour left a ticking time bomb."
Also as much as this must be fun for the Tories it doesn't change the basics. It's on the ground campaigning that wins elections. Not blog posts, tweets or press endorsements.
Lab 54% (+17) UKIP 35% (+7) Con 8% (-12) TUSC 4% (+4) LD DNS (-16)
Well if its poor for UKIP (eventhough they increased their vote share by one fifth) its a bloody disaster for the Coalition parties......
It is a ward UKIP won easily in 2007 . The vote share changes you give are in fact incorrect . The result in 2011 was Lab 471 UKIP 431 Con 112 so the UKIP vote share was down . . I think for some reason you are giving the changes from 2010 .
Do you think the fact it's happening in Falkirk and not in a Welsh or English CLPs is not a pure coincidence but related to the state of SLAB?
Do I think Labour fiefdoms in scotland are ripe for such 'funny business'? Well we could always check with Glasgow council to see how squeaky clean things are there?
You misunderstand the SLAB/Scottish labour connection. This has exposed the likes of Lamont and Sarwar yet again as little more than impotent bystanders as little ED struggles to cope. Yet they too are struggling with the same deep divisions over direction exemplified by the Brown Blair chasm that simply will not go away.
When little Ed launched his "root and branch reform" of scottish labour he did it seemingly oblivious to the fact that he and his command structure was part of the problem. It was hardly all Gray's fault since little Ed still gave the orders. That situation still persists and though it might suit his purposes to paint this farce as all the fault out of control unions he won't be able to keep that up if the Blairites overplay their hand or the Brownites hit back.
It is most acute in scotland because that's where the uber-Blairites and Brownites are still fighting their proxy battles.
Also as much as this must be fun for the Tories it doesn't change the basics. It's on the ground campaigning that wins elections. Not blog posts, tweets or press endorsements.
And a leader of a party that doesn't look weak,and a party that wins on the economic argument,not a party that throws it's 5 point plan away because it mostly agree's with the governing party on the economy(or lost the argument)
Oh that last point must also make ed balls look weak ;-)
You would post anything at all if it diverted attention from what was going on within Labour and the Unions. FWIW.. frankly it doesn't matter a monkeys toss who becomes the next Govt, they are all as bad as each other, but Ed Miliband is the worst of them all, yes, even worse than Clegg.
"Ed Miliband's approval rating is so low, it is almost as bad as his approval rating within his own family"
His great week gets better,
Dara O'Brien also mocking the Political Lobby's fascination with where Osborne purchased his burger last week. Also highlighted Eric Pickles tongue in cheek picture alongside a salad.
I still think one of the problems for SLAB is that many old Brownites and Blairite flag carriers comes from Scotland. And another, related to the previous point, is that too many Scottish MPs used to be big Westminster beasts.
Compared and contrast with Welsh Labour. Technically they had the same relationship as SLAB with UK Labour in terms of rules and commands, but you don't usually hear many fights or pseudo fights between Westminster and Cardiff Bay groups. WLAB is not known for its biggest fresh new ideas but because it's quite "managerial". That allows them to keep it going quite smoothly. If you aren't bright, be at least diligent and keep your house in order. Welsh Labour didn't have in the last decade many big beasts at Westminster though. Peter Hain was the highest profile MP but even they had little regard for him. They didn't have AMs leaving Cardiff Bay for Westminster either.
I'm quite tired tonight, so, sorry for grammar mistakes and senseless thoughts.
@DPJHodges Labour now appear to be spinning Tom Watson was sacked after all.
So far in this saga, we have had Tom Watson say he wanted to resign but was asked to stay on, but then he resigned anyway? And now its being spun that he was sacked?
Move over Vichy Pollard, its now the Labour party who own 'yeah, but no, but yeah, but no'. Just wait to see where the Labour spin stops to see which one it lands on.
'New Falkirk twist: Now Labour refuse to commit to pass evidence of law-breaking to the police 04/07/2013, 07:00:33 AM by Atul Hatwal
Another day, another Falkirk West farrago. Labour has now managed to tie itself in knots over what to do with evidence of illegal activities, uncovered as a result of the party’s inquiries.
The current position is that Labour will not commit to handing over any evidence of suspected law-breaking to the police or relevant authorities.
To recap, this sorry affair was kicked off when local Unite members complained to the party about being recruited into Labour without their knowledge.
In late May, the Sunday Herald carried details of one of the letters of complaint, originally sent in March, that ultimately triggered the NEC inquiry,
“Myself and two family members have been enrolled by Unite…I or my family did not fill in or sign any forms and wish to know what information the party holds about my family… I have concerns as to the way Unite in Falkirk are recruiting party members.”
On this basis, two laws appear to have been broken – the 1998 Data Protection Act and the 2006 Fraud Act.
Just over a month ago Uncut reported that angry members in Falkirk West were considering reporting Unite to the Information Commissioner because of a breach of their data protection rights.
Under the terms of the Act, each individual must have agreed before their personal details are passed to a different organisation.
At the point where Unite members’ personal details were registered with the Labour party, without their consent being first granted, the law will have been broken.
Then, yesterday Uncut reported on the likelihood of a breach of the Fraud Act. Whoever completed the bogus applications and validated them would have contravened section 2 of the Act under the terms of “false misrepresentation”
Submitting completed forms to the Labour party, without the new members’ consent, would have constituted false misrepresentation.
Two laws, two breaches. One to do with peoples’ rights over their personal information, the other with the act of someone deliberately falsifying membership forms.'
O/T I have just been VI'd by YouGov. Supplementary questions on Ed M and unions, BBC pay and how you would vote on a fictional European election with ballot paper included.
As you haven't responded to Mark Senior re the change in vote percentages in the Newcastle council sward can I assume that Mark's figures are therefore correct?
If so isn't this really the sort of seat that UKIP ought to moving on to win rather than Labour widenng its majority significantly?
Comments
https://twitter.com/suttonnick/status/352901067467534336/photo/1
@DPJHodges
Labour now appear to be spinning Tom Watson was sacked after all.
Most Seats market: Lab lengthening - now 5/8 at Betfair
Overall Majority market: Lab Maj lengthening - now 24/17 at Betfair
SNP Seats market: +6.5 shortening - now 4/5 at Ladbrokes
If you've actually looked at the data you'll have seen that the days lost have been reduced since 1990 under Governments of both colours and in no way more reduced under the last Labour Government (or earlier Labour Governments) which was your main point.
- Ed Miliband didn't publicly defend him in yesterday's PMQs because Cameron didn't bring him up. Ed must've been relieved at this.
- Ed Miliband's briefing papers which contained a planned defence of Tom Watson are leaked.
- Tom Watson resigns.
- Ed MIliband now can't say he sacked Watson because onlu yesterday he was about to defend him
Hmm, I wonder who leaked those briefing papers.
Ed didn't mention Tom Watson yesterday, did he?
Oh, wait...
Ooh... err... wait a minute...
The aide ran out of bogroll, and let's be honest, given Ed's performance yesterday, those papers were best of being used as bog roll
The only thing more amusing than that would be for little Ed to listed to the likes of Dan Hodges. As big a joke as he is it's amazing how heavily the swivel-eyed loons seem to rely on his 'sage wisdom'.
"Delighted to hear that @NadineDorriesMP has been readopted as Conservative candidate for the 2015 general election tonight
The Independent calls it a crisis
The Guardian call it a crisis
Why can't the right wing press print how fantastic it is for Ed?
https://twitter.com/Gareth_Rose/status/352902455492759552/photo/1
Don't bring up awkward things like facts and reality... Labour have said he hasn't and therefore he hasn't.
The unions are symptom not cause. If there was harmony over the direction SLAB and scottish labour MPs were taking then it would not be an issue. The fact that it has escalated to 'funny business' shall we say (and on both sides lest anyone be under the illusion this is all about one type of candidate getting the sh*t end of the stick) is merely a measure of the chasm that still exists between the Blairites and the Brownites.
I posted a while back that the venue of that battle had merely changed from westminster to scotland and this is just yet more proof of it.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/07/03/evo-morales-controversial-flight-over-europe-minute-by-heavily-disputed-minute/
Lab 386, UKIP 254, Con 58, TUSC 14
1. He should have taken action weeks ago, when the Falkirk concerns first emerged.
2. Instead he did very little, allowed colleagues to insult Eric Joyce for raising the concerns, and generally dithered.
3. We don't know exactly what was behind Tom Watson's resignation, but, whatever it was, Ed M dithered over accepting it.
4. That would have been OK, if the dithering had been of the 'I hope you can stay in post, why don't you take a couple of days to think about it' variety. Instead, he seems to have decided to try to keep Watson in post at all costs.
5. He chose utterly fatuous themes for PMQs yesterday, knowing full well they were fatuous and that Cammo would hit back with the Unite comments.
6. He compounded the error by preparing fatuous lines about how great Tom Watson is, which was an utterly bizarre thing to do.
7. Such was the chaos that these fatuous lines were left lying around in the loo. Was this really coincidence? With red-on-red smearing in full flow, it seems a bit unlikely.
8. And today he really blew it badly with the risible line that he wanted to sack Watson all along. Really, Ed? In that case, why did you have two separate pre-packaged responses ready for yesterday, strongly saying the diametric opposite?
He's annoyed the unions, he's annoyed the Blairites,he's annoyed the Brownites, he's got every political journalist in the country running round saying how weak he is, and he's allowed Watson to make a laughing stock of him as well.
No doubt Buddha Ed's zen-like calm will allow him to contemplate this mess with equanimity, but I don't think his colleagues will be quite so unconcerned.
Angela Eagle confirms that Ed decisively and swiftly dithered over Tom's resignation for days.
Weak, weak, weak.
I think Angela Eagle did very well. They should make her Shadow Minister for the Today Programme.
But as I worked a lot today and I am a bit tired...I am not sure I got your point. Do you think the fact it's happening in Falkirk and not in a Welsh or English CLPs is not a pure coincidence but related to the state of SLAB?
They're standing to create the conditions for the revolution. I wouldnt get on the wrong side of them if I were you.
Labour council leader agrees with you and gives 387 as the Labour vote.
Strong, strong, strong.
"Under the Labour government, babies were being born at the fastest rate since the 1950s. The population explosion began in 2001, but it wasn’t until 2008 that the Office for National Statistics flagged it up to the Department for Education and the local authorities – those responsible for planning ahead for schools.
Meanwhile, between 2004 and 2010, Labour cut the number of primary school places by 5 per cent – wiping out any extra spaces that might have absorbed the population growth. And during that period, Labour cut school funding by £150m.
When the DfE was finally warned about the population rise by the ONS in 2008, it reacted “too slowly”, a cross-party committee of MPs found.
Blame who you like, but Labour left a ticking time bomb."
http://blogs.channel4.com/factcheck/factcheck-whos-to-blame-for-rising-primary-school-class-sizes/13836
As, indeed, some of us were arguing......
If that pattern continues, the rate will once again reach a new low this year:
http://www.murdermap.co.uk/Investigate.asp
http://www.arashfatemian.com/wp-content/uploads/nicola.jpg
Clay (Lab) 1368
Hatton (Con) 236
Rees (LD) 113
Thomas (NF) 108
Clay is the former MP for Sunderland North in the 80s and acted as Reg Keys' agent in Sedgefield 2005.
The closest in May was the LDs getting 13 votes in Bicester West.
Lab 54% (+17)
UKIP 35% (+7)
Con 8% (-12)
TUSC 4% (+4)
LD DNS (-16)
Well if its poor for UKIP (eventhough they increased their vote share by one fifth) its a bloody disaster for the Coalition parties......
Got to say I am very sad to see Tom leave his post. But he is a fighter and not a quitter and will be back :-)
Are you saying he'll be back to quit again?
Also as much as this must be fun for the Tories it doesn't change the basics. It's on the ground campaigning that wins elections. Not blog posts, tweets or press endorsements.
After all he has form.
I even posted something related to the groundwar earlier in the thread. It was specially for you
I know Tories won't want to hear it but Tom is a really really nice bloke. Great for a drink and passionate it what he believes in.
You misunderstand the SLAB/Scottish labour connection. This has exposed the likes of Lamont and Sarwar yet again as little more than impotent bystanders as little ED struggles to cope. Yet they too are struggling with the same deep divisions over direction exemplified by the Brown Blair chasm that simply will not go away.
When little Ed launched his "root and branch reform" of scottish labour he did it seemingly oblivious to the fact that he and his command structure was part of the problem. It was hardly all Gray's fault since little Ed still gave the orders. That situation still persists and though it might suit his purposes to paint this farce as all the fault out of control unions he won't be able to keep that up if the Blairites overplay their hand or the Brownites hit back.
It is most acute in scotland because that's where the uber-Blairites and Brownites are still fighting their proxy battles.
Oh that last point must also make ed balls look weak ;-)
You would post anything at all if it diverted attention from what was going on within Labour and the Unions.
FWIW.. frankly it doesn't matter a monkeys toss who becomes the next Govt, they are all as bad as each other, but Ed Miliband is the worst of them all, yes, even worse than Clegg.
Hate to say it mate but that don't matter as much as you think. In fact the whole weak thing you are wasting your time with.
Bollocks
You don't think the Blair "weak weak weak" meme damaged Major..???? Live in the real world.
Gotta love first past the post.
I still think one of the problems for SLAB is that many old Brownites and Blairite flag carriers comes from Scotland. And another, related to the previous point, is that too many Scottish MPs used to be big Westminster beasts.
Compared and contrast with Welsh Labour. Technically they had the same relationship as SLAB with UK Labour in terms of rules and commands, but you don't usually hear many fights or pseudo fights between Westminster and Cardiff Bay groups. WLAB is not known for its biggest fresh new ideas but because it's quite "managerial". That allows them to keep it going quite smoothly. If you aren't bright, be at least diligent and keep your house in order. Welsh Labour didn't have in the last decade many big beasts at Westminster though. Peter Hain was the highest profile MP but even they had little regard for him. They didn't have AMs leaving Cardiff Bay for Westminster either.
I'm quite tired tonight, so, sorry for grammar mistakes and senseless thoughts.
Under PR^2 they would have won one. And voters could have ditched Evan Harris while still retaining a LibDem seat...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edZjdgU0asM
Move over Vichy Pollard, its now the Labour party who own 'yeah, but no, but yeah, but no'. Just wait to see where the Labour spin stops to see which one it lands on.
Are you including the "and Abingdon" bit of Oxford West?
'Oxford West & Abingdon is one of the few seats where the LDs have realistic hopes of a gain in 2015.'
Was that before or after Clegg reneged on his student fee pledge?
In any case, under any sensible system they should have won one seat.
'New Falkirk twist: Now Labour refuse to commit to pass evidence of law-breaking to the police
04/07/2013, 07:00:33 AM
by Atul Hatwal
Another day, another Falkirk West farrago. Labour has now managed to tie itself in knots over what to do with evidence of illegal activities, uncovered as a result of the party’s inquiries.
The current position is that Labour will not commit to handing over any evidence of suspected law-breaking to the police or relevant authorities.
To recap, this sorry affair was kicked off when local Unite members complained to the party about being recruited into Labour without their knowledge.
In late May, the Sunday Herald carried details of one of the letters of complaint, originally sent in March, that ultimately triggered the NEC inquiry,
“Myself and two family members have been enrolled by Unite…I or my family did not fill in or sign any forms and wish to know what information the party holds about my family… I have concerns as to the way Unite in Falkirk are recruiting party members.”
On this basis, two laws appear to have been broken – the 1998 Data Protection Act and the 2006 Fraud Act.
Just over a month ago Uncut reported that angry members in Falkirk West were considering reporting Unite to the Information Commissioner because of a breach of their data protection rights.
Under the terms of the Act, each individual must have agreed before their personal details are passed to a different organisation.
At the point where Unite members’ personal details were registered with the Labour party, without their consent being first granted, the law will have been broken.
Then, yesterday Uncut reported on the likelihood of a breach of the Fraud Act. Whoever completed the bogus applications and validated them would have contravened section 2 of the Act under the terms of “false misrepresentation”
Submitting completed forms to the Labour party, without the new members’ consent, would have constituted false misrepresentation.
Two laws, two breaches. One to do with peoples’ rights over their personal information, the other with the act of someone deliberately falsifying membership forms.'
Mike - I keep telling you to rub in the hair tonic not drink it !!
As you haven't responded to Mark Senior re the change in vote percentages in the Newcastle council sward can I assume that Mark's figures are therefore correct?
If so isn't this really the sort of seat that UKIP ought to moving on to win rather than Labour widenng its majority significantly?