I was rather hoping for Leave to be doing better. I have 3 figures on Leave on Betfair on 4 ish. My plan was to trade out and be "all green" by now. Unfortunately the betting has hardly budged, still 3.2ish. Could all of the Leavers start buying? as surely if the Remain are doing disastrously as they claim then the odds should be Odds on to Leave.
If Cameron does get his REMAIN vote though, I'm increasingly of the view that this whole fiasco is going to be his and the Conservative's "Iraq moment".
All the lies, the smears, the spin. OTT "fear" and even dodgy dossiers will blow up in his and the Tories face if/when the whole EU project falls apart anyway.
I can see all this eventually leading to the Tories being in the wilderness for ten years like Labour is now (let's face it, Labour's nadir - electing Jeremy Cobryn as their leader - Is a direct result of Blar and Iraq and you can see that since 2003 Labours situation has slowly got worse and worse and worse until reaching the point we now have - Corbyn leading them!)
Watch the Tories take a similar trajectory over the next few years if REMAIN wins and the EU falls apart (and takes us with it)
"According to three Fox sources, Fox chief Roger Ailes has told people he's lost confidence in Rubio's ability to win. "We're finished with Rubio," Ailes recently told a Fox host. "We can't do the Rubio thing anymore." "
"Ailes is now back to searching for a candidate the channel can rally behind. "He's thinking, What do we do about the whole damn thing?" one of the news executive's friends said. "
"According to three Fox sources, Fox chief Roger Ailes has told people he's lost confidence in Rubio's ability to win. "We're finished with Rubio," Ailes recently told a Fox host. "We can't do the Rubio thing anymore." "
"Ailes is now back to searching for a candidate the channel can rally behind. "He's thinking, What do we do about the whole damn thing?" one of the news executive's friends said. "
And the Guardian will more Project Fear...I am sure (and willing to be corrected) but we don't actually flog many Rollers to the EU, to France it is basically bugger all. The big market these days is the Arabs.
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/705154297219178496
Is anyone in the EU paying £200K for a car really going to be put off the purchase if the price goes up by a few %?
BMW are just one of many companies not least in the car industry. The notion that Nissan employees can be sanguine about leaving the EU is risible. And lots and lots of jobs are ultimately dependant on the car industry. Rolls Royce parts come from lots of places and final assembly is in the end not dependent on being here. The fact that RR is not British any more is not a good advert for our competence. JLR is another. Change would not be overnight but would be there nonetheless. At some point investment elsewhere would affect the situation here. Oh no it won't say the leavers. Fine and dandy so long as your job does not depend on their prejudice. Just why should workers play Russian Roulette to satisfy some revenge strategy by a bunch of tory losers.
Woe! Woe! And thrice Woe!
I doubt the workers in these companies would appreciate your sceptism
I thought all the jobs were going if we didn't join the Euro, are the car manufacturers still waiting to find suitable premises overseas? Or was that the same as this, scaremongering garbage.
Again an extreme viewpoint. Of course all jobs are not going to go but where Companies, particularly foreign owned Companies, consider Brexit a risk to their Company's work force they are entitled to say so. Leave are going to need to address all these questions sensibly and not revert to type by implying they are of no consequence
"According to three Fox sources, Fox chief Roger Ailes has told people he's lost confidence in Rubio's ability to win. "We're finished with Rubio," Ailes recently told a Fox host. "We can't do the Rubio thing anymore." "
"Ailes is now back to searching for a candidate the channel can rally behind. "He's thinking, What do we do about the whole damn thing?" one of the news executive's friends said. "
Life puts me as ever well behind the news cycle but there you go...
Fascinating Premiership race this year - Champions League football at Stratford next year ?
Anyway, back 18 hours or so - I thought Trump had a slightly disappointing night and once again he has under-performed his polling. In delegate terms, he won more than any of his opponents but comprehensively failed to land the knockout blow. Indeed, the polls showing him close to Cruz in TX were way off.
The only thing helping Trump is Rubio, Cruz and Kasich all staying in the race but who can blame them - Rubio has to win FL, no ifs, buts and maybes and the Trump wins in SC, AL and GA all suggest northern FL will be his for the taking taking Rubio the south but it looks a tough battle. Kasich clearly thinks he will win OH and Cruz could yet win Missouri.
Trump needs to win FL and perform well elsewhere in a fortnight to seal the deal but if he wants to bring Unity to the party, he'll have to make sure she gets an invitation first.
On the Dem side, HRC did enough last night without wholly convincing. The firewall of the south held for her and like Trump for the GOP I imagine she has the ultimate insurance policies of NY and CA if she needs them.
On the EU Referendum, it seems to have quietened a tad after the initial baseline barrage from both sides. Neither LEAVE nor REMAIN have covered themselves in glory and both need to decide how to offer a more persuasive and positive viewpoint.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Is the reason because more Brits visit France on holiday, than French visit UK?
And Brits who semi-retire to France / have second homes there?
Or perhaps the French National Health Service is more efficient than the UK in claiming costs incurred by visiting foreign nationals using their services. – If the media is to be believed, the UK appears not to even bother chasing up unpaid bills?
"According to three Fox sources, Fox chief Roger Ailes has told people he's lost confidence in Rubio's ability to win. "We're finished with Rubio," Ailes recently told a Fox host. "We can't do the Rubio thing anymore." "
"Ailes is now back to searching for a candidate the channel can rally behind. "He's thinking, What do we do about the whole damn thing?" one of the news executive's friends said. "
and a £625m EU wide - staggering. Well done John Mann, probably number 3 on my most admired Labour MP list behind Kate Hoey and Frank Field.
That says more about how useless our NHS in getting payment than anything else
Yes I think this is correct. I had cause to visit a French A&E department last year and they don't let you leave without sorting out the paperwork so they can make sure they get paid.
"According to three Fox sources, Fox chief Roger Ailes has told people he's lost confidence in Rubio's ability to win. "We're finished with Rubio," Ailes recently told a Fox host. "We can't do the Rubio thing anymore." "
"Ailes is now back to searching for a candidate the channel can rally behind. "He's thinking, What do we do about the whole damn thing?" one of the news executive's friends said. "
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Only a fool would not recognise that Remain are throwing all sorts of nonsensical mud at Leave.
and a £625m EU wide - staggering. Well done John Mann, probably number 3 on my most admired Labour MP list behind Kate Hoey and Frank Field.
That says more about how useless our NHS in getting payment than anything else
Yes I think this is correct. I had cause to visit a French A&E department last year and they don't let you leave without sorting out the paperwork so they can make sure they get paid.
The French healthcare system is very efficient at chasing up outstanding bills too, until they're paid. There's no escape. Mind you, the service makes the NHS look Third World so one can't complain.
and a £625m EU wide - staggering. Well done John Mann, probably number 3 on my most admired Labour MP list behind Kate Hoey and Frank Field.
That says more about how useless our NHS in getting payment than anything else
Yes I think this is correct. I had cause to visit a French A&E department last year and they don't let you leave without sorting out the paperwork so they can make sure they get paid.
I guess given their Carte Vitale, they are already set up to process payment details. Having seen the mess one local hospital made with my wife's paperwork there is no way we would be able to replicate the same charging efficiency.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Wouldn't your time be better spent issuing pre-vote warnings on where we should move our investments in the event of the Brexit apocalypse?
And the Guardian will more Project Fear...I am sure (and willing to be corrected) but we don't actually flog many Rollers to the EU, to France it is basically bugger all. The big market these days is the Arabs.
twitter.com/hendopolis/status/705154297219178496
Is anyone in the EU paying £200K for a car really going to be put off the purchase if the price goes up by a few %?
BMW are just one of many companies not least in the car industry. The notion that Nissan employees can be sanguine about leaving the EU is risible. And lots and lots of jobs are ultimately dependant on the car industry. Rolls Royce parts come from lots of places and final assembly is in the end not dependent on being here. The fact that RR is not British any more is not a good advert for our competence. JLR is another. Change would not be overnight but would be there nonetheless. At some point investment elsewhere would affect the situation here. Oh no it won't say the leavers. Fine and dandy so long as your job does not depend on their prejudice. Just why should workers play Russian Roulette to satisfy some revenge strategy by a bunch of tory losers.
Woe! Woe! And thrice Woe!
I doubt the workers in these companies would appreciate your sceptism
I thought all the jobs were going if we didn't join the Euro, are the car manufacturers still waiting to find suitable premises overseas? Or was that the same as this, scaremongering garbage.
Again an extreme viewpoint. Of course all jobs are not going to go but where Companies, particularly foreign owned Companies, consider Brexit a risk to their Company's work force they are entitled to say so. Leave are going to need to address all these questions sensibly and not revert to type by implying they are of no consequence
You contemptible mewling infant.
what will you say to all the BAE workers who will lose their jobs if the EU goes ahead with its ban on arms sales to saudi arabia? Or other arms sales bans we will have no control over that haven;t yet been announced?
What if the eurozone integrates further and decides to smash the City with punitive regulation, costing millions of jobs and countless billion in revenues?
What do you say to the estimated 120,000 fishermen who saw their lives and communities decimated by EU membership?
Or Steelmen who are losing their jobs because the EU refuses to act over chinese anti dumping or expensive green energy?
The risks are both ways, and in my view far more balanced against staying in than coming out.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Only a fool would not recognise that Remain are throwing all sorts of nonsensical mud at Leave.
And only a greater fool wouldn't understand that some of it will stick.
For that matter, only a complete 100% dumbo would think that it is all the Remain campaign's doing, rather than some of it being genuine independent warnings. We have been treated recently to the hilarious spectacle of people claiming that the entire set of G20 finance ministers were nobbled by Osborne, one of the funniest suggestions in years.
Rather than pretending none of this matters, the Leave campaigns need to address the doubts in a serious way. That's going to be tough.
Tomorrow's Project Fear's headline "French to end Calais deal if UK exit EU" is getting a rehash in tomorrow papers. BBC tried that this one last week.
In case of Brexit, Calais is presumably going to be filled with all those Brits who have been left stranded on holiday, surely?
"British tourists could be left STRANDED ABROAD if voters back Brexit, ministers warn"
"British pensioners in Spain without pets to eat, WILL TURN ON EACH OTHER FOR FOOD"
"In the event of Brexit, electricity from France will no longer work in British cables, leading to blackouts"
The EU will demand we return all their oxygen from our air....and will dump all their carbon dioxide in our airspace, claiming we no longer meet our international obligations.
Exiting the EU will LITERALLY LEAVE US GASPING FOR AIR.
These constant statements coming out from project fear remind me of those stupid messages that roll across the ticker at the bottom of the screen when you play Sim City *
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Wouldn't your time be better spent issuing pre-vote warnings on where we should move our investments in the event of the Brexit apocalypse?
Your GE stuff last year was great.
Dollars, obv.
However, be careful: if it's Remain, there will be an immediate rise in sterling.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
1. Do you deny "project fear" is taking place?
2. Do you deny Cameron is trying to present his "renegotiation" as something far more significant than it really is?
3. Agreed, the Tories probably won't split (as a eurosceptic party being lead by a couple of passionate europhiles they are more likely to just rid themselves of the leader and Osborne) but you can envisage a scenario where all this does so much damage to them that they are out of power for years and years in the end.
4. I don't know if everyone is laughing at REMAIN'S nonsense but most people I speak to think these warnings are mainly rubbish. Biggest problem is that we've heard it time and time again. Over the ERM. Over the Euro.
Far from being the disaster silly John Major told us it would be, leaving the ERM turned out to be the moment our economic miracle began (remember the "golden legacy" Ken Clarke gave Labour which Gordon Brown then squandered?) we all know it happened predminantly because of us leaving the ERM and in-spite of Clarke and Major not because of them.
Tomorrow's Project Fear's headline "French to end Calais deal if UK exit EU" is getting a rehash in tomorrow papers. BBC tried that this one last week.
In case of Brexit, Calais is presumably going to be filled with all those Brits who have been left stranded on holiday, surely?
"British tourists could be left STRANDED ABROAD if voters back Brexit, ministers warn"
"British pensioners in Spain without pets to eat, WILL TURN ON EACH OTHER FOR FOOD"
"In the event of Brexit, electricity from France will no longer work in British cables, leading to blackouts"
The EU will demand we return all their oxygen from our air....and will dump all their carbon dioxide in our airspace, claiming we no longer meet our international obligations.
Exiting the EU will LITERALLY LEAVE US GASPING FOR AIR.
These constant statements coming out from project fear remind me of those stupid messages that roll across the ticker at the bottom of the screen when you play Sim City *
* yes it's a guilty pleasure
Guilty pleasure indeed, but the programmers of Sim City performed a very useful function in showing the youth what happens to your cities when you jacked up the tax rate to a maximum of 20%, with all those factories in the yellow industrial zone turning an ugly black...or the purple of the commercial zone turning an equally ugly mix of purple and black!
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Wouldn't your time be better spent issuing pre-vote warnings on where we should move our investments in the event of the Brexit apocalypse?
Your GE stuff last year was great.
Dollars, obv.
However, be careful: if it's Remain, there will be an immediate rise in sterling.
Also, investors aren't likely to be that keen on president Trump...
We have been treated recently to the hilarious spectacle of people claiming that the entire set of G20 finance ministers were nobbled by Osborne, one of the funniest suggestions in years.
It is sort of obvious that they were likely asked to say something. But that misses the point, that given the recent track record of finance ministers predicting the future I have no idea why anybody would take them seriously. They have no real idea what the effect would be. If only the global economy was predictable we'd be able to assess the claims of the two camps, but it is not as we have repeatedly had demonstrated to us.
EU membership probably wouldn't rank in the top 5 things that will effect the UK economy over the next 30 years.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
And its hard to claim groupthink when Leave supporters on here include those from left, centre and right... has it occurred to you when people from very different philosophies come to same conclusion they might be correct??
Tomorrow's Project Fear's headline "French to end Calais deal if UK exit EU" is getting a rehash in tomorrow papers. BBC tried that this one last week.
In case of Brexit, Calais is presumably going to be filled with all those Brits who have been left stranded on holiday, surely?
"British tourists could be left STRANDED ABROAD if voters back Brexit, ministers warn"
"British pensioners in Spain without pets to eat, WILL TURN ON EACH OTHER FOR FOOD"
"In the event of Brexit, electricity from France will no longer work in British cables, leading to blackouts"
The EU will demand we return all their oxygen from our air....and will dump all their carbon dioxide in our airspace, claiming we no longer meet our international obligations.
Exiting the EU will LITERALLY LEAVE US GASPING FOR AIR.
These constant statements coming out from project fear remind me of those stupid messages that roll across the ticker at the bottom of the screen when you play Sim City *
* yes it's a guilty pleasure
Guilty pleasure indeed, but the programmers of Sim City performed a very useful function in showing the youth what happens to your cities when you jacked up the tax rate to a maximum of 20%, with all those factories in the yellow industrial zone turning an ugly black...or the purple of the commercial zone turning an equally ugly mix of purple and black!
Sim City....Its all about City: Skylines...highly recommended btw.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
1. Do you deny "project fear" is taking place?
2. Do you deny Cameron is trying to present his "renegotiation" as something far more significant than it really is?
3. Agreed, the Tories probably won't split (as a eurosceptic party being lead by a couple of passionate europhiles they are more likely to just rid themselves of the leader and Osborne) but you can envisage a scenario where all this does so much damage to them that they are out of power for years and years in the end.
4. I don't know if everyone is laughing at REMAIN'S nonsense but most people I speak to think these warnings are mainly rubbish. Biggest problem is that we've heard it time and time again. Over the ERM. Over the Euro. Far from being the disaster silly John Major told us it would be, leaving the ERM turned out to be the moment our economic miracle began (remember the "golden legacy" Ken Clarke gave Labour which Gordon Brown then squandered?)
1. It's more Project Doubt rather than Project Fear, but yes, of course it exists. What did anyone expect? For that matter, the Leave campaign is trying exactly the same technique, with lurid warnings about migration and nonsense about the UK being forced into the Euro if we stay. Welcome to politics.
2. He's talking it up, his opponents are talking it down. Welcome to politics.
4. You're talking to the wrong people, and in any case it doesn't work like that. We are going to have four months of stories like the Rolls Royce one today. A continual drip-drip of doubt (not all of it orchestrated by the Remain campaign, although some of it will be). Voters won't believe it all, they'll think it's exaggerated, and they'll be right. That doesn't mean it won't work - the Remain side don't need to convince, they only need to sow doubt. Stories like the Rolls Royce one are most definitely not good news for Leave, and grown-up Leavers will recognise this fact.
"The billionaire industrialist Koch brothers, the most powerful conservative mega donors in the United States, will not deploy their $400 million political arsenal to attack Republican front-runner Donald Trump in the U.S. presidential primary election, according to an official from the brother's political umbrella group."
Stuart Andrew, Carolin Ansell, Tracey Crouch, Jackie Doyle-Price James Heappey, George Hollingbery, Mark Lancaster, Pauline Latham Phillip Lee, Charlotte Leslie, David Mackintosh, Johnny Mercer Huw Merriman, Stephen Metcalfe, Amanda Milling, Andrew Mitchell Wendy Morton, Caroline Nokes, Jesse Norman, Rebecca Pow Mary Robinson, David Rutley, Grant Shapps, Amanda Solloway John Stevenson, Rory Stewart, Kelly Tolhurst, Michael Tomlinson
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
1. Do you deny "project fear" is taking place?
2. Do you deny Cameron is trying to present his "renegotiation" as something far more significant than it really is?
3. Agreed, the Tories probably won't split (as a eurosceptic party being lead by a couple of passionate europhiles they are more likely to just rid themselves of the leader and Osborne) but you can envisage a scenario where all this does so much damage to them that they are out of power for years and years in the end.
4. I don't know if everyone is laughing at REMAIN'S nonsense but most people I speak to think these warnings are mainly rubbish. Biggest problem is that we've heard it time and time again. Over the ERM. Over the Euro. Far from being the disaster silly John Major told us it would be, leaving the ERM turned out to be the moment our economic miracle began (remember the "golden legacy" Ken Clarke gave Labour which Gordon Brown then squandered?)
1. It's more Project Doubt rather than Project Fear, but yes, of course it exists. What did anyone expect? For that matter, the Leave campaign is trying exactly the same technique, with lurid warnings about migration and nonsense about the UK being forced into the Euro if we stay. Welcome to politics.
2. He's talking it up, his opponents are talking it down. Welcome to politics.
4. You're talking to the wrong people, and in any case it doesn't work like that. We are going to have four months of stories like the Rolls Royce one today. A continual drip-drip of doubt (not all of it orchestrated by the Remain campaign, although some of it will be). Voters won't believe it all, they'll think it's exaggerated, and they'll be right. That doesn't mean it won't work - the Remain side don't need to convince, they only need to sow doubt. Stories like the Rolls Royce one are most definitely not good news for Leave, and grown-up Leavers will recognise this fact.
Project Fear is winning the propaganda war because they’re up against Project We Haven’t a Feking Clue. - This dialy bleating by some that it's not fair is a real PB low point IMHO.
If only Trump can have those numbers in Kentucky, Kansas, Maine and Louisiana on Saturday, we can call the race typically over. One big hurdle is the Fox debate.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
Stuart Andrew, Carolin Ansell, Tracey Crouch, Jackie Doyle-Price James Heappey, George Hollingbery, Mark Lancaster, Pauline Latham Phillip Lee, Charlotte Leslie, David Mackintosh, Johnny Mercer Huw Merriman, Stephen Metcalfe, Amanda Milling, Andrew Mitchell Wendy Morton, Caroline Nokes, Jesse Norman, Rebecca Pow Mary Robinson, David Rutley, Grant Shapps, Amanda Solloway John Stevenson, Rory Stewart, Kelly Tolhurst, Michael Tomlinson
I'm amazed that there isn't a riot in Thurrock yet at the local MP remaining on the fence!
As for my MP in Romsey and Southampton North, after being one of the 81 rebels voting for a referendum in the last parliament, she must be the only one on the fence of those 81 still in the House of Commons I would have thought.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
And its hard to claim groupthink when Leave supporters on here include those from left, centre and right... has it occurred to you when people from very different philosophies come to same conclusion they might be correct??
Ask again. Perhaps he didn't hear you last time.
You'll probably get a pithy 'rolls eyes' in return.
Voters won't believe it all, they'll think it's exaggerated, and they'll be right. That doesn't mean it won't work - the Remain side don't need to convince, they only need to sow doubt. Stories like the Rolls Royce one are most definitely not good news for Leave, and grown-up Leavers will recognise this fact.
You may be right that in the end it will prove effective but the "payback" will come afterwards when the EU falls apart and drags us down with it.
Cameron will end up another toxic exPM and the Tories will find themselves in the political wilderness for a generation (IMO).
Stephen Lawrence murder suspect Neil Acourt admits conspiracy to supply £4million worth of cannabis
The trio were accused of conspiring with others to supply the Class B drug between January 1, 2014 and February 2 this year.
They were charged after police seized approximately 100 kilos of cannabis following a surveillance operation that lasted for two years, Scotland Yard said.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
So leaving the EU won't affect the Sangatte Protocols, and a large proportion of the rubbish being put about by Remain is just that. Rubbish. It's good to get this stuff out in the open.
"Cameron's making things up to entrap Leave", is a peach.
You may be right that in the end it will prove effective but the "payback" will come afterwards when the EU falls apart and drags us down with it.
Cameron will end up another toxic exPM and the Tories will find themselves in the political wilderness for a generation (IMO).
The EU is not going to fall apart.
I can see a route for the Tories getting themselves into the political wilderness for a generation, which is a Leave result, followed by a serious economic hit from the uncertainty, chaos as the party splits on whether to go for an EEA route or not, choosing the EEA route, and people who voted Leave on the assumption that Leave meant an end to free movement feeling (reasonably enough) totally betrayed.
A more likely scenario is a comfortable Remain result, the EU issue being closed down for a generation, and Cameron lauded as the man who finally cauterised the wound.
You may be right that in the end it will prove effective but the "payback" will come afterwards when the EU falls apart and drags us down with it.
Cameron will end up another toxic exPM and the Tories will find themselves in the political wilderness for a generation (IMO).
The EU is not going to fall apart.
I can see a route for the Tories getting themselves into the political wilderness for a generation, which is a Leave result, followed by a serious economic hit from the uncertainty, chaos as the party splits on whether to go for an EEA route or not, choosing the EEA route, and people who voted Leave on the assumption that Leave meant an end to free movement feeling (reasonably enough) totally betrayed.
A more likely scenario is a comfortable Remain result, the EU issue being closed down for a generation, and Cameron lauded as the man who finally cauterised the wound.
I'll look forward to quoting that one back at you.
NB: Richard Nabavi 2/3/16 - 'The EU is not going to fall apart. '
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
You may be right that in the end it will prove effective but the "payback" will come afterwards when the EU falls apart and drags us down with it.
Cameron will end up another toxic exPM and the Tories will find themselves in the political wilderness for a generation (IMO).
The EU is not going to fall apart.
I can see a route for the Tories getting themselves into the political wilderness for a generation, which is a Leave result, followed by a serious economic hit from the uncertainty, chaos as the party splits on whether to go for an EEA route or not, choosing the EEA route, and people who voted Leave on the assumption that Leave meant an end to free movement feeling (reasonably enough) totally betrayed.
A more likely scenario is a comfortable Remain result, the EU issue being closed down for a generation, and Cameron lauded as the man who finally cauterised the wound.
I'll look forward to quoting that one back at you.
NB: Richard Nabavi 2/3/16 - 'The EU is not going to fall apart. '
The bit that made me chuckle was "Cameron lauded as the man who finally cauterised the wound."
So leaving the EU won't affect the Sangatte Protocols, and a large proportion of the rubbish being put about by Remain is just that. Rubbish. It's good to get this stuff out in the open.
"Cameron's making things up to entrap Leave", is a peach.
No, 'Cameron taking Leave's dishonest argument and turning it back on them'.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
So leaving the EU won't affect the Sangatte Protocols, and a large proportion of the rubbish being put about by Remain is just that. Rubbish. It's good to get this stuff out in the open.
"Cameron's making things up to entrap Leave", is a peach.
More importantly the migrant crisis has nothing to do with our membership,of the EU which is the brush the dishonest Leavers are trying to tar it with. Equally the sainted Carswell disagrees diametrically with the Farage tactics of trying to blame it all on migrants.
The reputation of polling companies took a hammering last May yet the ref polls don't provide much comfort that they have sorted out the problems. The difference between the online and phone polls is huge and consistent - they can't both be right.
Either ComRes / Ipsos Mori/ Survation or ICM/ YouGov/ TNS/ BMG are happily taking someone's fees for producing duff polls. It doesn't install much confidence. I am surprised the industry is content to go on in this way, rapidly losing credibility.
If I were spending cash on any sort of polling I would be beginning to wonder if I was being taken for a ride.
If you pay me some dosh I could do a poll and find out.
Tomorrow's Project Fear's headline "French to end Calais deal if UK exit EU" is getting a rehash in tomorrow papers. BBC tried that this one last week.
In case of Brexit, Calais is presumably going to be filled with all those Brits who have been left stranded on holiday, surely?
"British tourists could be left STRANDED ABROAD if voters back Brexit, ministers warn"
'Yesterday the British chancellor George Osborne accused me — from the front bench and under parliamentary privilege — of being a “revolutionary Marxist”. Various media have reported that I am “advising” the Labour Party. Neither of these claims is true. I have left Channel 4 News to become a freelance journalist, writing a weekly Guardian column, with a wide range of other projects at the planning stage, including a Medium blog called Mosquito Ridge. I have agreed to contribute a lecture to Labour’s The New Economics series, following prestigious names such as Joseph Stiglitz, Yanis Varoufakis, Marianna Mazzucato and Simon Wren-Lewis. I will be focusing on unconvetnional monetary policy and the democratisation of central banks. That’s all. It’s up to the Labour Party whether they listen to what I say. But it is very specifically not formal advice. As to Mr Osborne’s claim that I am “revolutionary Marxist” it is completely inaccurate. I am radical social democrat who favours the creation of a peer-to-peer sector (co-ops, open source etc) alongside the market and the state, as part of a long transition to a post-capitalist economy. There’s a comprehensive critique of Bolshevism in my latest book, Postcapitalism: A Guide to Our Future. In the next months I will likely be travelling to hostile environments, repressive regimes and seeking access to societies where, with one Google search, people will discover that the government of my own country considers me a “revolutionary Marxist”. I will keep you posted on the outcome of that. As for the Mao/Mickey Mouse jibe, I was tailed for hours in 2008 in Beijing by the secret police of Mr Osborne’s favourite Marxist government, after interviewing the victims of Mao’s Great Leap Forward. I am happy to state that Mao was a despot whose policies killed millions; I look forward to hearing Mr Osborne say that on his next trip to China. Mickey Mouse on the other hand is a universal 20th century icon representing the triumph of the little guy against the bully, the innocent against the corrupt, the weak against the strong. I am happy to be identified with those ideals.'
He can come across as a bit sanctimonious at times but he's within his rights to lambast a government that seems to believe it can say whatever it wants without consequence.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
If Cameron left a burning bag of crap on your doorstep you would be impressed...
"Donald Trump ... has now lost 80%, four out of five of the closed primary states where Republican voters are choosing the Republican nominee. Upcoming we have over 20 states that are closed. If Donald Trump keeps that losing record only winning one out of five with over 1,000 delegates being distributed in these upcoming 20 closed primary and caucus states, Donald Trump is in a world of trouble. "
This is overegging it a bit, but trump's differential performance in open/closed primaries is definitely something to consider.
Trump is fighting an air war.
The 5 states that vote on Saturday are all closed primaries.
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
EU referendum: 200 small firm bosses and entrepreneurs tell Britons to vote for Brexit
The letter urges Britons not to listen to 'a minority of managers from Britain's largest companies' who want Britons to stay in the EU
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
If Cameron left a burning bag of crap on your doorstep you would be impressed...
"Cameron forced me to open the scorched front door, and neutralise the fire whilst covering my shoes in hot dog shit. I was impressed."
I wonder if the BBC will be reporting on his grilling over using the widely discredited £3,000 figure.
BBC paper review: implication from a reviewer that this is a biased report on the front page of the Telegraph. Why is it also on the BBC News website in that case?
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
1. Do you deny "project fear" is taking place?
2. Do you deny Cameron is trying to present his "renegotiation" as something far more significant than it really is?
3. Agreed, the Tories probably won't split (as a eurosceptic party being lead by a couple of passionate europhiles they are more likely to just rid themselves of the leader and Osborne) but you can envisage a scenario where all this does so much damage to them that they are out of power for years and years in the end.
4. I don't know if everyone is laughing at REMAIN'S nonsense but most people I speak to think these warnings are mainly rubbish. Biggest problem is that we've heard it time and time again. Over the ERM. Over the Euro. Far from being the disaster silly John Major told us it would be, leaving the ERM turned out to be the moment our economic miracle began (remember the "golden legacy" Ken Clarke gave Labour which Gordon Brown then squandered?)
1. It's more Project Doubt rather than Project Fear, but yes, of course it exists. What did anyone expect? For that matter, the Leave campaign is trying exactly the same technique, with lurid warnings about migration and nonsense about the UK being forced into the Euro if we stay. Welcome to politics.
2. He's talking it up, his opponents are talking it down. Welcome to politics.
4. You're talking to the wrong people, and in any case it doesn't work like that. We are going to have four months of stories like the Rolls Royce one today. A continual drip-drip of doubt (not all of it orchestrated by the Remain campaign, although some of it will be). Voters won't believe it all, they'll think it's exaggerated, and they'll be right. That doesn't mean it won't work - the Remain side don't need to convince, they only need to sow doubt. Stories like the Rolls Royce one are most definitely not good news for Leave, and grown-up Leavers will recognise this fact.
Project Fear is winning the propaganda war because they’re up against Project We Haven’t a Feking Clue. - This dialy bleating by some that it's not fair is a real PB low point IMHO.
Spoilt teenagers? Its that mentality. Leave have determined their best hope is project terror. Millions of the little so and so's queuing up to burn our babies on the points of their bayonets. Low point? PB is on the way out at this rate.
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
The sad reality is that most of them don't believe they owe anything to their employees and if they were to start moaning they'd just shift their jobs somewhere else.
"Donald Trump ... has now lost 80%, four out of five of the closed primary states where Republican voters are choosing the Republican nominee. Upcoming we have over 20 states that are closed. If Donald Trump keeps that losing record only winning one out of five with over 1,000 delegates being distributed in these upcoming 20 closed primary and caucus states, Donald Trump is in a world of trouble. "
This is overegging it a bit, but trump's differential performance in open/closed primaries is definitely something to consider.
Trump is fighting an air war.
The 5 states that vote on Saturday are all closed primaries.
Advantage Cruz/Rubio/Kasich
Yes, that's an interesting article. I agree it's over-egging it, but there could be some truth in it.
It's not so much air war vs ground war, though - the sheer number of contests mean that it's hard for any candidate to get a ground-war advantage in primaries (as opposed to caucuses). It's more about whether independents can vote.
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
I understand it is the heads of BMW in Germany issuing the warnings. I would think they have more knowledge than most leavers on the subject. Also the warnings re Calais are coming from French government officials. Leavers need to be able to respond as these warnings will increase from many quarters and they will not be able to be pinned as scare tactics
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
There's something very Victorian industrial baron about company owners leaning on their workers to vote the right way.
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
I understand it is the heads of BMW in Germany issuing the warnings. I would think they have more knowledge than most leavers on the subject. Also the warnings re Calais are coming from French government officials. Leavers need to be able to respond as these warnings will increase from many quarters and they will not be able to be pinned as scare tactics
If the comments about the Calais camps by French officials are true then the French cannot be trusted and we should decide to leave anyway.
Leave campaigners should ask Remain campaigners about this in every interview until Cameron buckles. You can't hide facts from the British people during such a big decision.
Leave campaigners should ask Remain campaigners about this in every interview until Cameron buckles. You can't hide facts from the British people during such a big decision.
'HMRC issues thousands more national insurance numbers to EU migrants than officially arrive in Britain but the tax office has repeatedly refused to publish the figures on the grounds that it might influence the outcome of June's EU referendum.'
Well, yes, it probably would. One can guess why, hence their reluctance to release the figures.
and a £625m EU wide - staggering. Well done John Mann, probably number 3 on my most admired Labour MP list behind Kate Hoey and Frank Field.
That says more about how useless our NHS in getting payment than anything else
Yes I think this is correct. I had cause to visit a French A&E department last year and they don't let you leave without sorting out the paperwork so they can make sure they get paid.
The French healthcare system is very efficient at chasing up outstanding bills too, until they're paid. There's no escape. Mind you, the service makes the NHS look Third World so one can't complain.
The NHS is not third world. The French national health service cost far more than ours. Maybe ours should cost more, but just tell people how much more you want them to pay first.
Tomorrow's Project Fear's headline "French to end Calais deal if UK exit EU" is getting a rehash in tomorrow papers. BBC tried that this one last week.
In case of Brexit, Calais is presumably going to be filled with all those Brits who have been left stranded on holiday, surely?
"British tourists could be left STRANDED ABROAD if voters back Brexit, ministers warn"
"British pensioners in Spain without pets to eat, WILL TURN ON EACH OTHER FOR FOOD"
"In the event of Brexit, electricity from France will no longer work in British cables, leading to blackouts"
The EU will demand we return all their oxygen from our air....and will dump all their carbon dioxide in our airspace, claiming we no longer meet our international obligations.
Exiting the EU will LITERALLY LEAVE US GASPING FOR AIR.
These constant statements coming out from project fear remind me of those stupid messages that roll across the ticker at the bottom of the screen when you play Sim City *
* yes it's a guilty pleasure
Guilty pleasure indeed, but the programmers of Sim City performed a very useful function in showing the youth what happens to your cities when you jacked up the tax rate to a maximum of 20%, with all those factories in the yellow industrial zone turning an ugly black...or the purple of the commercial zone turning an equally ugly mix of purple and black!
When I was at school we had a game on the BBC Model B where you had to set tax rates and benefits levels and things, and if it was going well at election time you got reelected.
One of the precocious nerdy kids playing this game, who out of respect for his privacy I won't name except to say that he is currently Member of Parliament for Dover, came up with the idea of setting unemployment benefit to a large negative number. This guaranteed reelection, as it not only created a strong incentive to work, which reduced unemployment to a fairly lot level, but also the 100,000 billionaires who continued to sign on provided enough money to pay for the rest of the government's spending.
Leavers whining even more than Wenger tonight. It's NOT FAIR!!
Good night all.
The only whining I can see tonight is the Remain camp on leave posters,you lot are doing the whining(flightpath01 - for example) Leavers pointing things out.
Leavers whining even more than Wenger tonight. It's NOT FAIR!!
Good night all.
The only whining I can see tonight is the Remain camp on leave posters,you lot are doing the whining(flightpath01 - for example) Leavers pointing things out.
Could I repeat my request for confident Leavers to start buying on Betfair? If it is nailed on to Leave then 3.2 is free money. Thanks in advance :-)
Edit: now 3.45 for Leave - surely there should be plenty of takers on here?
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
I understand it is the heads of BMW in Germany issuing the warnings. I would think they have more knowledge than most leavers on the subject. Also the warnings re Calais are coming from French government officials. Leavers need to be able to respond as these warnings will increase from many quarters and they will not be able to be pinned as scare tactics
Alternatively BMW are looking after their own interests not the British interests, unsurprisingly. BMW have nothing to gain from the UK gaining sovereignty and improving its democracy, Brits do.
Leavers here have been saying BMW would be pushing for a free trade deal in the event of a leave vote, comments such as what BMW are making match exactly what Leavers are saying.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
If Cameron left a burning bag of crap on your doorstep you would be impressed...
"Cameron forced me to open the scorched front door, and neutralise the fire whilst covering my shoes in hot dog shit. I was impressed."
What a sad bunch of twerps you lot are. You don't see it do you.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
If Cameron left a burning bag of crap on your doorstep you would be impressed...
"Cameron forced me to open the scorched front door, and neutralise the fire whilst covering my shoes in hot dog shit. I was impressed."
What a sad bunch of twerps you lot are. You don't see it do you.
Do you believe that there will be migrant camps in Kent or that British tourists will be left stranded in Calais?? I find it odd how some people on here have no problem with the govt telling outright falsehoods when they would have torn into Labour doing the same thing at general election.
The migrant camp one was a stroke of genius. It's garbage of course, but the Leave side was dishonestly trying to make hay from the Calais chaos, despite the fact that everyone knows it has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with our membership of the EU. Cameron cornered the dishonest Leavers into arguing the truth, thus neutralising the nonsense. I was impressed.
If Cameron left a burning bag of crap on your doorstep you would be impressed...
"Cameron forced me to open the scorched front door, and neutralise the fire whilst covering my shoes in hot dog shit. I was impressed."
What a sad bunch of twerps you lot are. You don't see it do you.
Well, this Rolls Royce nonsense has pushed me more firmly into the Leave camp.
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
I understand it is the heads of BMW in Germany issuing the warnings. I would think they have more knowledge than most leavers on the subject. Also the warnings re Calais are coming from French government officials. Leavers need to be able to respond as these warnings will increase from many quarters and they will not be able to be pinned as scare tactics
Alternatively BMW are looking after their own interests not the British interests, unsurprisingly. BMW have nothing to gain from the UK gaining sovereignty and improving its democracy, Brits do.
Leavers here have been saying BMW would be pushing for a free trade deal in the event of a leave vote, comments such as what BMW are making match exactly what Leavers are saying.
It's a tricky one isn't it? Do I vote in my interest, or those of a giant German car manufacturer.
No doubt someone will make the point that BMW could choose to move production overseas, but, as has already been pointed out, a Hungarian made Rolls Royce doesn't have quite the same cachet as one built in Sussex by English craftsmen. And yes, these things do matter to your average multimillionaire.
It feels like Richard's fighting a one man battle against the forces of darkness and If the big guns aren't arriving till April 1st the Barbarians could prevail.
I wonder whether the BBC and the government have considered the possibility that the one million people who watch programmes on iPlayer without a TV license may decide to stop watching BBC programmes altogether rather than paying the fee?
Turkish ambassador to the EU currently rubbishing the EU on HardTalk - only capable of doing the easy things, incapable of handling anything difficult.
Turkish ambassador to the EU currently rubbishing the EU on HardTalk - only capable of doing the easy things, incapable of handling anything difficult.
I think that's been blindingly obvious to everyone for a very long time now.
Comments
All the lies, the smears, the spin. OTT "fear" and even dodgy dossiers will blow up in his and the Tories face if/when the whole EU project falls apart anyway.
I can see all this eventually leading to the Tories being in the wilderness for ten years like Labour is now (let's face it, Labour's nadir - electing Jeremy Cobryn as their leader - Is a direct result of Blar and Iraq and you can see that since 2003 Labours situation has slowly got worse and worse and worse until reaching the point we now have - Corbyn leading them!)
Watch the Tories take a similar trajectory over the next few years if REMAIN wins and the EU falls apart (and takes us with it)
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/03/marco-rubio-just-lost-fox-news.html
"According to three Fox sources, Fox chief Roger Ailes has told people he's lost confidence in Rubio's ability to win. "We're finished with Rubio," Ailes recently told a Fox host. "We can't do the Rubio thing anymore." "
"Ailes is now back to searching for a candidate the channel can rally behind. "He's thinking, What do we do about the whole damn thing?" one of the news executive's friends said. "
Life puts me as ever well behind the news cycle but there you go...
Fascinating Premiership race this year - Champions League football at Stratford next year ?
Anyway, back 18 hours or so - I thought Trump had a slightly disappointing night and once again he has under-performed his polling. In delegate terms, he won more than any of his opponents but comprehensively failed to land the knockout blow. Indeed, the polls showing him close to Cruz in TX were way off.
The only thing helping Trump is Rubio, Cruz and Kasich all staying in the race but who can blame them - Rubio has to win FL, no ifs, buts and maybes and the Trump wins in SC, AL and GA all suggest northern FL will be his for the taking taking Rubio the south but it looks a tough battle. Kasich clearly thinks he will win OH and Cruz could yet win Missouri.
Trump needs to win FL and perform well elsewhere in a fortnight to seal the deal but if he wants to bring Unity to the party, he'll have to make sure she gets an invitation first.
On the Dem side, HRC did enough last night without wholly convincing. The firewall of the south held for her and like Trump for the GOP I imagine she has the ultimate insurance policies of NY and CA if she needs them.
On the EU Referendum, it seems to have quietened a tad after the initial baseline barrage from both sides. Neither LEAVE nor REMAIN have covered themselves in glory and both need to decide how to offer a more persuasive and positive viewpoint.
Do you guys going on about Project Fear, and 'Cameron's lies', and the awful backlash, and the Tories splitting, and how everyone is laughing at the continual stream of warnings from multiple independent sources, actually believe all the nonsense you post, or are you singing songs in the bunker to keep your spirits up?
The EHIC system covers temporary visitors only. Once permenant residence is gained then the host govt pays, at least while we are still in the EU.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/03/02/romney-to-make-major-speech-on-2016-race.html
Your GE stuff last year was great.
what will you say to all the BAE workers who will lose their jobs if the EU goes ahead with its ban on arms sales to saudi arabia? Or other arms sales bans we will have no control over that haven;t yet been announced?
What if the eurozone integrates further and decides to smash the City with punitive regulation, costing millions of jobs and countless billion in revenues?
What do you say to the estimated 120,000 fishermen who saw their lives and communities decimated by EU membership?
Or Steelmen who are losing their jobs because the EU refuses to act over chinese anti dumping or expensive green energy?
The risks are both ways, and in my view far more balanced against staying in than coming out.
Get someone to change those nappies
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/03/02/recession-will-lead-to-eurozone-collapse-warns-french-bank/
For that matter, only a complete 100% dumbo would think that it is all the Remain campaign's doing, rather than some of it being genuine independent warnings. We have been treated recently to the hilarious spectacle of people claiming that the entire set of G20 finance ministers were nobbled by Osborne, one of the funniest suggestions in years.
Rather than pretending none of this matters, the Leave campaigns need to address the doubts in a serious way. That's going to be tough.
* yes it's a guilty pleasure
I think the legal case involving the two Tony's could involve quite a bit of fireworks - lets see.
However, be careful: if it's Remain, there will be an immediate rise in sterling.
2. Do you deny Cameron is trying to present his "renegotiation" as something far more significant than it really is?
3. Agreed, the Tories probably won't split (as a eurosceptic party being lead by a couple of passionate europhiles they are more likely to just rid themselves of the leader and Osborne) but you can envisage a scenario where all this does so much damage to them that they are out of power for years and years in the end.
4. I don't know if everyone is laughing at REMAIN'S nonsense but most people I speak to think these warnings are mainly rubbish. Biggest problem is that we've heard it time and time again. Over the ERM. Over the Euro.
Far from being the disaster silly John Major told us it would be, leaving the ERM turned out to be the moment our economic miracle began (remember the "golden legacy" Ken Clarke gave Labour which Gordon Brown then squandered?) we all know it happened predminantly because of us leaving the ERM and in-spite of Clarke and Major not because of them.
EU membership probably wouldn't rank in the top 5 things that will effect the UK economy over the next 30 years.
And its hard to claim groupthink when Leave supporters on here include those from left, centre and right... has it occurred to you when people from very different philosophies come to same conclusion they might be correct??
2. He's talking it up, his opponents are talking it down. Welcome to politics.
4. You're talking to the wrong people, and in any case it doesn't work like that. We are going to have four months of stories like the Rolls Royce one today. A continual drip-drip of doubt (not all of it orchestrated by the Remain campaign, although some of it will be). Voters won't believe it all, they'll think it's exaggerated, and they'll be right. That doesn't mean it won't work - the Remain side don't need to convince, they only need to sow doubt. Stories like the Rolls Royce one are most definitely not good news for Leave, and grown-up Leavers will recognise this fact.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-trump-koch-exclusive-idUSMTZSAPEC32FPEGCF
"The billionaire industrialist Koch brothers, the most powerful conservative mega donors in the United States, will not deploy their $400 million political arsenal to attack Republican front-runner Donald Trump in the U.S. presidential primary election, according to an official from the brother's political umbrella group."
Stuart Andrew, Carolin Ansell, Tracey Crouch, Jackie Doyle-Price
James Heappey, George Hollingbery, Mark Lancaster, Pauline Latham
Phillip Lee, Charlotte Leslie, David Mackintosh, Johnny Mercer
Huw Merriman, Stephen Metcalfe, Amanda Milling, Andrew Mitchell
Wendy Morton, Caroline Nokes, Jesse Norman, Rebecca Pow
Mary Robinson, David Rutley, Grant Shapps, Amanda Solloway
John Stevenson, Rory Stewart, Kelly Tolhurst, Michael Tomlinson
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/ms/mississippi_republican_presidential_primary-4210.html
T41 C17 R16 K8
Cruz and Rubio above the threshold...
One big hurdle is the Fox debate.
As for my MP in Romsey and Southampton North, after being one of the 81 rebels voting for a referendum in the last parliament, she must be the only one on the fence of those 81 still in the House of Commons I would have thought.
You'll probably get a pithy 'rolls eyes' in return.
Cameron will end up another toxic exPM and the Tories will find themselves in the political wilderness for a generation (IMO).
The trio were accused of conspiring with others to supply the Class B drug between January 1, 2014 and February 2 this year.
They were charged after police seized approximately 100 kilos of cannabis following a surveillance operation that lasted for two years, Scotland Yard said.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3473317/Stephen-Lawrence-murder-suspect-Neil-Acourt-admits-conspiracy-supply-4million-worth-cannabis.html
"Cameron's making things up to entrap Leave", is a peach.
I can see a route for the Tories getting themselves into the political wilderness for a generation, which is a Leave result, followed by a serious economic hit from the uncertainty, chaos as the party splits on whether to go for an EEA route or not, choosing the EEA route, and people who voted Leave on the assumption that Leave meant an end to free movement feeling (reasonably enough) totally betrayed.
A more likely scenario is a comfortable Remain result, the EU issue being closed down for a generation, and Cameron lauded as the man who finally cauterised the wound.
NB: Richard Nabavi 2/3/16 - 'The EU is not going to fall apart. '
I've had enough of these tax-dodging fat cats trying to blackmail their rank-and-file employees (to whom the bosses owe most of their success to), and I don't want to reward that kind of campaigning.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-35707955
Equally the sainted Carswell disagrees diametrically with the Farage tactics of trying to blame it all on migrants.
'Yesterday the British chancellor George Osborne accused me — from the front bench and under parliamentary privilege — of being a “revolutionary Marxist”. Various media have reported that I am “advising” the Labour Party. Neither of these claims is true.
I have left Channel 4 News to become a freelance journalist, writing a weekly Guardian column, with a wide range of other projects at the planning stage, including a Medium blog called Mosquito Ridge.
I have agreed to contribute a lecture to Labour’s The New Economics series, following prestigious names such as Joseph Stiglitz, Yanis Varoufakis, Marianna Mazzucato and Simon Wren-Lewis. I will be focusing on unconvetnional monetary policy and the democratisation of central banks.
That’s all.
It’s up to the Labour Party whether they listen to what I say. But it is very specifically not formal advice.
As to Mr Osborne’s claim that I am “revolutionary Marxist” it is completely inaccurate. I am radical social democrat who favours the creation of a peer-to-peer sector (co-ops, open source etc) alongside the market and the state, as part of a long transition to a post-capitalist economy. There’s a comprehensive critique of Bolshevism in my latest book, Postcapitalism: A Guide to Our Future.
In the next months I will likely be travelling to hostile environments, repressive regimes and seeking access to societies where, with one Google search, people will discover that the government of my own country considers me a “revolutionary Marxist”. I will keep you posted on the outcome of that.
As for the Mao/Mickey Mouse jibe, I was tailed for hours in 2008 in Beijing by the secret police of Mr Osborne’s favourite Marxist government, after interviewing the victims of Mao’s Great Leap Forward. I am happy to state that Mao was a despot whose policies killed millions; I look forward to hearing Mr Osborne say that on his next trip to China.
Mickey Mouse on the other hand is a universal 20th century icon representing the triumph of the little guy against the bully, the innocent against the corrupt, the weak against the strong. I am happy to be identified with those ideals.'
He can come across as a bit sanctimonious at times but he's within his rights to lambast a government that seems to believe it can say whatever it wants without consequence.
"Donald Trump ... has now lost 80%, four out of five of the closed primary states where Republican voters are choosing the Republican nominee. Upcoming we have over 20 states that are closed. If Donald Trump keeps that losing record only winning one out of five with over 1,000 delegates being distributed in these upcoming 20 closed primary and caucus states, Donald Trump is in a world of trouble. "
This is overegging it a bit, but trump's differential performance in open/closed primaries is definitely something to consider.
Trump is fighting an air war.
The 5 states that vote on Saturday are all closed primaries.
Advantage Cruz/Rubio/Kasich
113 days until D-day.
Good night all.
The letter urges Britons not to listen to 'a minority of managers from Britain's largest companies' who want Britons to stay in the EU
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/12181306/EU-referendum-200-small-firm-bosses-and-entrepreneurs-tell-Britons-to-vote-for-Brexit.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Leave have determined their best hope is project terror. Millions of the little so and so's queuing up to burn our babies on the points of their bayonets.
Low point? PB is on the way out at this rate.
It's not so much air war vs ground war, though - the sheer number of contests mean that it's hard for any candidate to get a ground-war advantage in primaries (as opposed to caucuses). It's more about whether independents can vote.
I can't really comment further without being rude to my fellow site users, so I won't!!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3472949/David-Cameron-REFUSES-release-figures-prove-true-level-EU-migration-UK.html
Leave campaigners should ask Remain campaigners about this in every interview until Cameron buckles. You can't hide facts from the British people during such a big decision.
http://www.lukas-reimann.ch/ger_details_1176/_Swiss_Parliament_decides_to_withdraw_the_application_to_join_the_EU.html?utm_content=bufferdc56f&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
Well, yes, it probably would. One can guess why, hence their reluctance to release the figures.
Good night all.
When I was at school we had a game on the BBC Model B where you had to set tax rates and benefits levels and things, and if it was going well at election time you got reelected.
One of the precocious nerdy kids playing this game, who out of respect for his privacy I won't name except to say that he is currently Member of Parliament for Dover, came up with the idea of setting unemployment benefit to a large negative number. This guaranteed reelection, as it not only created a strong incentive to work, which reduced unemployment to a fairly lot level, but also the 100,000 billionaires who continued to sign on provided enough money to pay for the rest of the government's spending.
Edit: now 3.45 for Leave - surely there should be plenty of takers on here?
Leavers here have been saying BMW would be pushing for a free trade deal in the event of a leave vote, comments such as what BMW are making match exactly what Leavers are saying.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/cricket/77508007/New-Zealand-cricket-great-Martin-Crowe-has-died
http://imgur.com/S1wBgpI
No doubt someone will make the point that BMW could choose to move production overseas, but, as has already been pointed out, a Hungarian made Rolls Royce doesn't have quite the same cachet as one built in Sussex by English craftsmen. And yes, these things do matter to your average multimillionaire.
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article4704483.ece
But we'd better not leave "because Putin".