I thought the Telegraph report on Molenbeek, the Brussels radical-training ground, was astonishing.
The Belgian minister admitted in so many words that they'd 'lost control' of the area, that it is the 'European political centre of radical Islam' and that most of the big European terrorist attacks have been planned there. As nonchalantly as that.
That story is a microcosm of all that is wrong with the EU. The EU could be a leading force in tackling continental terrorism yet we have lacksadaisical, politically-correct, lazy chaps like him in charge, shrugging his shoulders about guns, terrorism, organised crime and drug running operating from an area of 100,000 people that is only 30% Muslim.
How hard is it to get a grip on 30,000 people if the Belgian authorities really put their minds to it?
Does this really have anything to do with the EU? For all that there is a Home and Justice aspect to the EU, this only amounts to the facilitation of co-operation. It still relies on the governments getting the information and then sharing it in the first place. The failure is Belgium's in this case.
The alternative - what you appear to propose - is a Euro-FBI, which were it seriously put forward as an option would send Eurosceptics barmy. I cannot see it as a political runner.
Sorry - my bad! But yeah - Belgium needs to have a look at itself.
Government announces 15% funding increase for GCHQ, MI5 and MI6 - money for an extra 1,900 officers - ahead of the publication of the SDSR next week. I assume this announcement has been brought forward from that:
@MichaelHabetler: the worst people during tragedies are people who bring up another tragedy that didnt get press to feel superior theyre like tragedy hipsters
I've had chance to gather my thoughts on Friday's atrocity. SeanT once said that I specialised in stating the obvious, which is probably the nicest thing that anyone has ever said about me. So here are a few things that seem obvious to me.
1) This was a direct assault on the way that we live, intended to strike maximum terror into our hearts. 2) It was well-organised and in large parts well-executed. 3) These were not the actions of Muslims as a whole. The great bulk of Muslims in Europe would be appalled by these actions also. 4) However, a significant minority of Muslims would not be appalled or would be ambivalent or, in a few cases, would actively supportive of these actions. The number of each of those groups of Muslims is far too great to ignore or simply to discount. 5) ISIS is merely an example of the problem, not the problem itself, just as Al Qaeda is. ISIS may well have been wiped off the map in a year's time. The ideology will be sustained. 6) We cannot hope to eliminate the ideology completely: ideologies have a long afterlife at the fringes. We can hope to contain it in both the UK and the wider world and to limit its adherents' ability to do the harm that they wish it to do. 7) We have been pretty good at containing the ability of adherents to do the harm that they wish to do and far poorer at containing the ideology itself. We need to do both. 8) The harder battle is in working out how to take on an idea. Setting up cricket tests to apply to a minority that already feels excluded and picked on is unlikely to douse the flames: the reverse. 9) We therefore need a much wider-ranging conversation about what Britishness means - where the acceptable parameters of behaviour lie and, importantly, what is incompatible with being part of British society. What are the limits of tolerance? These probably need much more patrolling than they have received to date. They also need to be seen to be colour blind and ideology blind in their enforcement if they are not going to foster much greater resentment. 10) So far as military action is concerned, it needs to be taken with a clear and achievable set of aims. We have not been given a clear set of aims for British involvement in Syria beyond "everyone else is doing it so why can't we?" 11) There are going to be no quick solutions. It is easier to change behaviours than ideas. We should be settling in for the long haul.
Cynthia Payne, madam: Brothel keeper dubbed 'Madam Cyn' who was jailed after holding sex parties in exchange for Luncheon Vouchers
She drummed up business by word of mouth, and by distributing her calling card, signed Cynthia Payne LV (Luncheon Vouchers). She barred men under 40 (“all Jack-the-lads boasting about their prowess”); her regular clients included a night watchman in his sixties, who availed himself of a special £5 discount for pensioners, a vicar with a penchant for plump angels, an exhibitionist professor, and a barrister who would arrive as if dressed for court, then change into a full tart’s costume of extra high heels, black stockings and make-up.
@MichaelHabetler: the worst people during tragedies are people who bring up another tragedy that didnt get press to feel superior theyre like tragedy hipsters
Compare Cameron / Putin photo vs Obama / Putin one. Very different.
But then I can't imagine Putin has got much time for somebody coming along saying could you bomb the crap out of ISIL in Syria please, why can't you do it, erhh, well, I'm not allowed.
"...it's not only the left that feel that Britain is now seriously lopsided in terms of both wealth and opportunity, and an alternative that set out concrete ways to address that would get an interested audience"
I think that is very true, Nick. I also think that the number of people who have such concerns is growing, and growing very quickly. Whether Labour can come up with a real programme to do anything about the situation other than its usual raise taxes and benefits and dumb down education is another matter.
@iainjwatson: Jeremy Corbyn says unfortunately last week's bombing in Beirut got very little coverage and media should report what happens outside europe
But it’s just blatantly untrue.
Search Google News and you will find pages and pages of reports of the attacks in Beirut. Pages and pages and pages. Over 1,286 articles in fact — lots of which pre-date the attacks in Paris.
The sheer number of people who will, though, happily claim that the media hasn’t reported it does my head in.
He was on Lorraine Kelly's show this morning talking about this.
He came across as amiable enough, if a little verbose, until she engaged him on the subject of man-hole covers.
At which point, all his oddness became very visible. Weirder than Ed.
It actually endears him to me a little. Every true Englishman should have a little eccentric hobby. Whether it's fishing, geocaching, making little model armies, or dogging.
@iainjwatson: Jeremy Corbyn says unfortunately last week's bombing in Beirut got very little coverage and media should report what happens outside europe
But it’s just blatantly untrue.
Search Google News and you will find pages and pages of reports of the attacks in Beirut. Pages and pages and pages. Over 1,286 articles in fact — lots of which pre-date the attacks in Paris.
The sheer number of people who will, though, happily claim that the media hasn’t reported it does my head in.
You may be correct "that the man's an idiot". But trying to prove it based on 1,286 hits in Google News is not going to be successful. I searched Google News for "dog show in belgium 2015" and got over 15 million hits.
Cynthia Payne, madam: Brothel keeper dubbed 'Madam Cyn' who was jailed after holding sex parties in exchange for Luncheon Vouchers
She drummed up business by word of mouth, and by distributing her calling card, signed Cynthia Payne LV (Luncheon Vouchers). She barred men under 40 (“all Jack-the-lads boasting about their prowess”); her regular clients included a night watchman in his sixties, who availed himself of a special £5 discount for pensioners, a vicar with a penchant for plump angels, an exhibitionist professor, and a barrister who would arrive as if dressed for court, then change into a full tart’s costume of extra high heels, black stockings and make-up.
I spent a bit of time with her 20 years ago. She was a fascinating lady, brutally honest and a great judge of people. She seemed very lost, because of her reputation she had few friends or family which was a shame.
@iainjwatson: Jeremy Corbyn says unfortunately last week's bombing in Beirut got very little coverage and media should report what happens outside europe
But it’s just blatantly untrue.
Search Google News and you will find pages and pages of reports of the attacks in Beirut. Pages and pages and pages. Over 1,286 articles in fact — lots of which pre-date the attacks in Paris.
The sheer number of people who will, though, happily claim that the media hasn’t reported it does my head in.
He was on Lorraine Kelly's show this morning talking about this.
He came across as amiable enough, if a little verbose, until she engaged him on the subject of man-hole covers.
At which point, all his oddness became very visible. Weirder than Ed.
It actually endears him to me a little. Every true Englishman should have a little eccentric hobby. Whether it's fishing, geocaching, making little model armies, or dogging.
I've never been able to talk about manhole covers after the time I met some of England's women cricketers.
We ended talking about the boxes that men use to protect their ahem dangly bits, and turns out women also have something similar, except they call them "manhole covers"
Even IDS got two years so there will be no move yet. Remember too that IDS was only replaced by Michael Howard who was still very much of the right so if Corbyn is replaced before the election the only likely replacement is Hilary Benn who as his reservations about Syrian airstrikes show is still a figure on Labour's left even if, like Michael Howard, he is a more experienced and mainstream figure than the incumbent
Why is Stephen Kinnock not going to be next leader, post-come-to-their-senses?
If his name was different surely he would be 8/1 rather than 20s?
Has he massively blotted his copybook at some point or some other egregious mis-step? I'm on him but have no idea of his previous...
1) he's a brand new MP.
2) why do you expect the Labour electorate to come to their senses?
He's a possible but 20/1 is still far too short. One scenario:
Corbyn, despite much misgiving in between, makes it through to 2020 then crashes badly at the election. He stands down and Watson takes over. Watson persuades the NEC not to call a leadership election until after the rules have been changed "in light of a third defeat, each worse than the last". The new rules are adopted at a conference early in 2021, removing the three-pounder clause. Watson finally stands down in June, by which point, Kinnock has been an MP for six years and has been promoted to the front bench.
I think that's not out of the bounds of possibility but nor is it topside of a 5% shot.
I assume you are on Watson large, because according to the above scenario everyone apart from Watson should be 50s and Watson should be 4/6? But Dan Jarvis is 5/1.
What about defeat after defeat leads Lab to realise that they are going to lose in 2020. Then the field is open and I don't think lack of front bench experience is going to be important, given the current incumbent.
@iainjwatson: Jeremy Corbyn says unfortunately last week's bombing in Beirut got very little coverage and media should report what happens outside europe
But it’s just blatantly untrue.
Search Google News and you will find pages and pages of reports of the attacks in Beirut. Pages and pages and pages. Over 1,286 articles in fact — lots of which pre-date the attacks in Paris.
The sheer number of people who will, though, happily claim that the media hasn’t reported it does my head in.
He was on Lorraine Kelly's show this morning talking about this.
He came across as amiable enough, if a little verbose, until she engaged him on the subject of man-hole covers.
At which point, all his oddness became very visible. Weirder than Ed.
It actually endears him to me a little. Every true Englishman should have a little eccentric hobby. Whether it's fishing, geocaching, making little model armies, or dogging.
I've never been able to talk about manhole covers after the time I met some of England's women cricketers.
We ended talking about the boxes that men use to protect their ahem dangly bits, and turns out women also have something similar, except they call them "manhole covers"
Perhaps that's actually what Corbyn's interested in.
Do we have any photos of him with the England women cricket team?
I can't bear Obama, being the first black POTUS isn't something he's done anything with - next it looks like Hilary - the first female POTUS with nothing about her either bar scandal and having a famous husband.
For all some knock Mrs T - she became a living legend/got an -ism and still talked about as influencial decades after leaving office.
Compare Cameron / Putin photo vs Obama / Putin one. Very different.
But then I can't imagine Putin has got much time for somebody coming along saying could you bomb the crap out of ISIL in Syria please, why can't you do it, erhh, well, I'm not allowed.
I've never had much time for Marr, but this morning on Radio 4 (BBC) was quite revealing. He directed a discussion in Paris on Friday morning with 3 French authors and intellectuals only hours before the attacks and massacres occurred. What was said was most interesting, especially about France since 1880.
If you get a chance to listen via iPlayer or repeat, you'll get an education.
"Rock The Boat is self described as ‘...about ensuring that pressure is kept up on Lib Dem party officers, staff and leaders to properly tackle sexual harassment within the party. It provides a space for coordination and organisation of campaigns and the sharing of ideas."
Samy Amimour, one of the suicide bombers at the Bataclan, was known to French intelligence services.
He was placed under a formal investigation in October 2012 for terrorist conspiracy after it emerged that he planned to go to Yemen.
He was placed under judicial supervision and an international arrest warrant was issued against him when he broke the conditions of his bail in autumn 2013.
Cynthia Payne, madam: Brothel keeper dubbed 'Madam Cyn' who was jailed after holding sex parties in exchange for Luncheon Vouchers
She drummed up business by word of mouth, and by distributing her calling card, signed Cynthia Payne LV (Luncheon Vouchers). She barred men under 40 (“all Jack-the-lads boasting about their prowess”); her regular clients included a night watchman in his sixties, who availed himself of a special £5 discount for pensioners, a vicar with a penchant for plump angels, an exhibitionist professor, and a barrister who would arrive as if dressed for court, then change into a full tart’s costume of extra high heels, black stockings and make-up.
I spent a bit of time with her 20 years ago. She was a fascinating lady, brutally honest and a great judge of people. She seemed very lost, because of her reputation she had few friends or family which was a shame.
I don't know if it is pubic knowledge, but I was told the identity of the Govt. minister caught at one of her parties. Made me chuckle...
On topic this is a double problem because MPs and bigwigs need to think Corbyn is a liability, but they also need to be able to satisfy the members that he's a liability. In practice I think this means Labour need to go substantially backwards in real elections.
I expect an easy Labour win in Oldham with any reduced majority explainable away by low turnout. It is not a threat to him.
The challenge will come next year in the Scottish, Welsh and London Mayoral elections. If Labour does badly there the perception of being a loser will become dangerous to him.
And the omens are not good in either Scotland or Wales. In London Labour have a candidate who wants to keep his distance (as, in fairness, do the Tories). What role is he going to play in these campaigns? Looking irrelevant would be even worse than looking weak.
Agree. Corbyn must get a better result than last year in Scotland and Wales and win the London mayoralty or the odds must be on him being forced out. I am not convinced that this would automatically lead to the election of another left-wing leader - the new Corbynista members are basically a flashmob and if Corbyn is seen to fail electorally they could easily melt away as quickly as they appeared.
"Eurocrats are in tragic denial about the Paris attacks The European project is collapsing around their ears, and yet still they desperately scramble to save the Schengen free movement zone"
The ideology espoued by Islamic State reminds me of Nazi Germany.
For the perfect blue eyed, blonde aryan race read Sunni Muslims. Everyone else, the Kuffar are the Jews and gypsies - inferior beings.
Just as Nazi ideology was not wiped out in 1945, so Islamism will not be wiped out by the flattening of Raqqa, Mosul and the total defeat of the Islamic state. Support should also be given to the Nigerian Gov't to flatten Boku Haram in the north and Kenya given whatever assistance it needs to deal with Al Shabab.
IS being defeated will not create a perfect world, Saudi Arabia will continue to be a disgusting regime; Iran and Israel will continue to view each other with the most suspicion. But we did not crush Switzerland in World War 2 despite there being an obvious money trail back to the Nazis, and all the states with possible cash trails back to IS can't and shouldn't be dealt with with bombs, it pushes the mission too far.
IS has bombed a Russian plane, murdered innocent civilians in Beirut, Turkey, Kenya and of course Paris. The attack on Paris was a violation of article 5 and an assault on our closest neighbour - it should be taken apart without pity.
It is not the total solution, but it is what we must do - for now.
The problem we have is that with the arrival of millions of non British people over the last 40 odd years, it is inevitable that the notion of being British would change... But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people... What we have to do now is try to control/make sense of a surplus of supply through heavy regulation, which I don't think works or is wise in business or immigration
In practice I think this means Labour need to go substantially backwards in real elections.
Given previous form, the membership would likely conclude that they had been insufficiently left wing, that the public had been bamboozled by Rupert Murdoch and the cruel characterisations of the wicked right-wing media and that they needed to up their level of intellectual purity.
In practice I think this means Labour need to go substantially backwards in real elections.
Given previous form, the membership would likely conclude that they had been insufficiently left wing, that the public had been bamboozled by Rupert Murdoch and the cruel characterisations of the wicked right-wing media and that they needed to up their level of intellectual purity.
Well, this is the problem with pegging an ejection strategy on gaffes and media narratives. The members won't believe anything except actual lost seats, and even then if there's any kind of straw to cling to then they'll cling to it.
The ideology espoued by Islamic State reminds me of Nazi Germany.
For the perfect blue eyed, blonde aryan race read Sunni Muslims. Everyone else, the Kuffar are the Jews and gypsies - inferior beings.
Just as Nazi ideology was not wiped out in 1945, so Islamism will not be wiped out by the flattening of Raqqa, Mosul and the total defeat of the Islamic state. Support should also be given to the Nigerian Gov't to flatten Boku Haram in the north and Kenya given whatever assistance it needs to deal with Al Shabab.
IS being defeated will not create a perfect world, Saudi Arabia will continue to be a disgusting regime; Iran and Israel will continue to view each other with the most suspicion. But we did not crush Switzerland in World War 2 despite there being an obvious money trail back to the Nazis, and all the states with possible cash trails back to IS can't and shouldn't be dealt with with bombs, it pushes the mission too far.
IS has bombed a Russian plane, murdered innocent civilians in Beirut, Turkey, Kenya and of course Paris. The attack on Paris was a violation of article 5 and an assault on our closest neighbour - it should be taken apart without pity.
It is not the total solution, but it is what we must do - for now.
I'll go with all of that. Hamas an hezbollah can wait a few months.
I think if Labour are silly enough to go into the next election with the current leadership they'll deserve to risk coming third with less than 25%, a real possibility IMO.
@iainjwatson: Jeremy Corbyn says unfortunately last week's bombing in Beirut got very little coverage and media should report what happens outside europe
But it’s just blatantly untrue.
Search Google News and you will find pages and pages of reports of the attacks in Beirut. Pages and pages and pages. Over 1,286 articles in fact — lots of which pre-date the attacks in Paris.
The sheer number of people who will, though, happily claim that the media hasn’t reported it does my head in.
He was on Lorraine Kelly's show this morning talking about this.
He came across as amiable enough, if a little verbose, until she engaged him on the subject of man-hole covers.
At which point, all his oddness became very visible. Weirder than Ed.
It actually endears him to me a little. Every true Englishman should have a little eccentric hobby. Whether it's fishing, geocaching, making little model armies, or dogging.
I've never been able to talk about manhole covers after the time I met some of England's women cricketers.
We ended talking about the boxes that men use to protect their ahem dangly bits, and turns out women also have something similar, except they call them "manhole covers" This rather undermines the politically correct decision to rename manhole covers as 'inspection chamber' covers.
I think if Labour are silly enough to go into the next election with the current leadership they'll deserve to risk coming third with less than 25%, a real possibility IMO.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Would be interested in yr concept though. A shared history without large changes in population? Is that more or less it? Not sure how the free market fits in
'Re. The Oldham by election, Matt Singh posted yesterday, via election data, that it was likely to ve closer than currently thought. Not sure I quite agree but worth flagging...
I think if Labour are silly enough to go into the next election with the current leadership they'll deserve to risk coming third with less than 25%, a real possibility IMO.
Corbyn has surely made a virtue of not-winning unless using his own purity yardstick. As has been noted more than once, everyone who's going to Corbyn already has.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well if you leave a certain, limited amount of people to their own devices, community will evolve... an unlimited amount of people that you try to regulate into a community doesn't work
The ideology espoued by Islamic State reminds me of Nazi Germany.
For the perfect blue eyed, blonde aryan race read Sunni Muslims. Everyone else, the Kuffar are the Jews and gypsies - inferior beings.
Just as Nazi ideology was not wiped out in 1945, so Islamism will not be wiped out by the flattening of Raqqa, Mosul and the total defeat of the Islamic state. Support should also be given to the Nigerian Gov't to flatten Boku Haram in the north and Kenya given whatever assistance it needs to deal with Al Shabab.
IS being defeated will not create a perfect world, Saudi Arabia will continue to be a disgusting regime; Iran and Israel will continue to view each other with the most suspicion. But we did not crush Switzerland in World War 2 despite there being an obvious money trail back to the Nazis, and all the states with possible cash trails back to IS can't and shouldn't be dealt with with bombs, it pushes the mission too far.
IS has bombed a Russian plane, murdered innocent civilians in Beirut, Turkey, Kenya and of course Paris. The attack on Paris was a violation of article 5 and an assault on our closest neighbour - it should be taken apart without pity.
It is not the total solution, but it is what we must do - for now.
Yes.
For Master Race, read Master Religion.
I've seen some compare what's going on to the IRA campaign over here, but there is very little comparison in terms of scale or overall intent.
In the same way that our society has challenged, and thrown off, the illiberal and socially and sexually repressive problems associated with Christianity, most notably Catholicism, the same challenge needs to be taken to Islam.
Even IDS got two years so there will be no move yet. Remember too that IDS was only replaced by Michael Howard who was still very much of the right so if Corbyn is replaced before the election the only likely replacement is Hilary Benn who as his reservations about Syrian airstrikes show is still a figure on Labour's left even if, like Michael Howard, he is a more experienced and mainstream figure than the incumbent
Why is Stephen Kinnock not going to be next leader, post-come-to-their-senses?
If his name was different surely he would be 8/1 rather than 20s?
Has he massively blotted his copybook at some point or some other egregious mis-step? I'm on him but have no idea of his previous...
1) he's a brand new MP.
2) why do you expect the Labour electorate to come to their senses?
He's a possible but 20/1 is still far too short. One scenario:
Corbyn, despite much misgiving in between, makes it through to 2020 then crashes badly at the election. He stands down and Watson takes over. Watson persuades the NEC not to call a leadership election until after the rules have been changed "in light of a third defeat, each worse than the last". The new rules are adopted at a conference early in 2021, removing the three-pounder clause. Watson finally stands down in June, by which point, Kinnock has been an MP for six years and has been promoted to the front bench.
I think that's not out of the bounds of possibility but nor is it topside of a 5% shot.
I assume you are on Watson large, because according to the above scenario everyone apart from Watson should be 50s and Watson should be 4/6? But Dan Jarvis is 5/1.
What about defeat after defeat leads Lab to realise that they are going to lose in 2020. Then the field is open and I don't think lack of front bench experience is going to be important, given the current incumbent.
Call the scenario a known unknown.
That's certainly possible, though it still wouldn't justify Kinnock's odds.
I don't think that Watson would count in my scenario (which is far from the only one, of course). Deputy leaders filling in don't usually count for bets, though they will if elected in their own right. That's not what I'm thinking of here; more a prolonged interregnum. IIRC, Labour's rules allow up to something like 18 months between one leader going and the next having to be elected. That does give time for Watson - who is a Labour man through and through - to sort out the mess that Miliband created and Corbyn has exploited.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well if you leave a certain, limited amount of people to their own devices, community will evolve... an unlimited amount of people that you try to regulate into a community doesn't work
thanks for the clarification, sorry got to go now. don't mean to be rude. Cheers!
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I expect an easy Labour win in Oldham with any reduced majority explainable away by low turnout. It is not a threat to him.
The challenge will come next year in the Scottish, Welsh and London Mayoral elections. If Labour does badly there the perception of being a loser will become dangerous to him.
And the omens are not good in either Scotland or Wales. In London Labour have a candidate who wants to keep his distance (as, in fairness, do the Tories). What role is he going to play in these campaigns? Looking irrelevant would be even worse than looking weak.
Agree. Corbyn must get a better result than last year in Scotland and Wales and win the London mayoralty or the odds must be on him being forced out. I am not convinced that this would automatically lead to the election of another left-wing leader - the new Corbynista members are basically a flashmob and if Corbyn is seen to fail electorally they could easily melt away as quickly as they appeared.
The problem for sane Labour will be the same as it was this time: where is the vaguely credible leadership from the centre left that they can coalesce around?
I expect an easy Labour win in Oldham with any reduced majority explainable away by low turnout. It is not a threat to him.
The challenge will come next year in the Scottish, Welsh and London Mayoral elections. If Labour does badly there the perception of being a loser will become dangerous to him.
And the omens are not good in either Scotland or Wales. In London Labour have a candidate who wants to keep his distance (as, in fairness, do the Tories). What role is he going to play in these campaigns? Looking irrelevant would be even worse than looking weak.
Agree. Corbyn must get a better result than last year in Scotland and Wales and win the London mayoralty or the odds must be on him being forced out. I am not convinced that this would automatically lead to the election of another left-wing leader - the new Corbynista members are basically a flashmob and if Corbyn is seen to fail electorally they could easily melt away as quickly as they appeared.
The problem for sane Labour will be the same as it was this time: where is the vaguely credible leadership from the centre left that they can coalesce around?
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
Cynthia Payne, madam: Brothel keeper dubbed 'Madam Cyn' who was jailed after holding sex parties in exchange for Luncheon Vouchers
She drummed up business by word of mouth, and by distributing her calling card, signed Cynthia Payne LV (Luncheon Vouchers). She barred men under 40 (“all Jack-the-lads boasting about their prowess”); her regular clients included a night watchman in his sixties, who availed himself of a special £5 discount for pensioners, a vicar with a penchant for plump angels, an exhibitionist professor, and a barrister who would arrive as if dressed for court, then change into a full tart’s costume of extra high heels, black stockings and make-up.
I spent a bit of time with her 20 years ago. She was a fascinating lady, brutally honest and a great judge of people. She seemed very lost, because of her reputation she had few friends or family which was a shame.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I would disagree that any nationality is a carefully constructed concept, although I don't really think of Britain as a country or myself as particularly British
I always come back to the question, regarding the immigration of the last 40 odd years; was it worth it? Do the upsides outweigh the downsides? Why create the problems we are facing when they were obvious and avoidable?
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I doubt your claim for the successful civilization of Scotland. The early 18th century Scotland you describe is markedly similar to the present failed entity.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I would disagree that any nationality is a carefully constructed concept, although I don't really think of Britain as a country or myself as particularly British
I always come back to the question, regarding the immigration of the last 40 odd years; was it worth it? Do the upsides outweigh the downsides? Why create the problems we are facing when they were obvious and avoidable?
The simple answer, and it is simple but with a large basis of truth, is that the Labour Party wanted immigration to boost their voter numbers. That is why they removed almost all barriers to large scale immigration in 2004/5
I expect an easy Labour win in Oldham with any reduced majority explainable away by low turnout. It is not a threat to him.
The challenge will come next year in the Scottish, Welsh and London Mayoral elections. If Labour does badly there the perception of being a loser will become dangerous to him.
And the omens are not good in either Scotland or Wales. In London Labour have a candidate who wants to keep his distance (as, in fairness, do the Tories). What role is he going to play in these campaigns? Looking irrelevant would be even worse than looking weak.
Agree. Corbyn must get a better result than last year in Scotland and Wales and win the London mayoralty or the odds must be on him being forced out. I am not convinced that this would automatically lead to the election of another left-wing leader - the new Corbynista members are basically a flashmob and if Corbyn is seen to fail electorally they could easily melt away as quickly as they appeared.
The problem for sane Labour will be the same as it was this time: where is the vaguely credible leadership from the centre left that they can coalesce around?
Major Dan Jarvis
The Left needs answers to an era where money is very limited, security is under threat and mass migration has no end in sight.
Until they can answer those they won't seriously be considered by floating voters and, at the moment, they are giving precisely the wrong answers to all of them.
The Left talks about the Right living in the past, but I'd say that's more true of the Left now: they are living in, and still trying to fight, the post-colonial socio-cultural battles of the 1960s-1990s at the moment.
The constant IRA comparison is incredibly lazy and completely inaccurate.
For the IRA, violence was a means to an end, which is why they stood down eventually For the Islamists, violence is the end
The challenge for the West is that we may be able to defeat them on the ground militarily but how do we defeat their idea.
No, it's still a means to an end; it's just that the end they desire is much bigger than the IRA's and that the level of violence they have at their disposal currently is insufficient to bring that end about.
I expect an easy Labour win in Oldham with any reduced majority explainable away by low turnout. It is not a threat to him.
The challenge will come next year in the Scottish, Welsh and London Mayoral elections. If Labour does badly there the perception of being a loser will become dangerous to him.
And the omens are not good in either Scotland or Wales. In London Labour have a candidate who wants to keep his distance (as, in fairness, do the Tories). What role is he going to play in these campaigns? Looking irrelevant would be even worse than looking weak.
Agree. Corbyn must get a better result than last year in Scotland and Wales and win the London mayoralty or the odds must be on him being forced out. I am not convinced that this would automatically lead to the election of another left-wing leader - the new Corbynista members are basically a flashmob and if Corbyn is seen to fail electorally they could easily melt away as quickly as they appeared.
The problem for sane Labour will be the same as it was this time: where is the vaguely credible leadership from the centre left that they can coalesce around?
Major Dan Jarvis
Maybe, but at the moment he looks the sort of blank sheet that people can project what they want to see onto. If he is going to be credible he needs to start defining himself and that is tricky in a party led by the likes of Corbyn and McDonnell.
Jeremy Corbyn just looks totally irrelevant, doesn't he? Completely outside the serious discussions on all points of most concern to voters, except on the few points like immigration where he's firmly on the wrong side.
Corbyn is, was and aleays will be. The events of the last few days have only reinforced that. Labour members knew who they were voting for and they did it anyway. They are not interested in power.
Corbyn looks broken, he has got away with sounding like a petulant 16 year old for the last 50 years. He is out of his depth, resorting to the sound bites from Stop The War.
Trying to blame the press for not reporting events is an interesting excuse from JC, but how does he propose to work to a political solution in Syria? ISIS aren't behaving like a government in waiting willing to negotiate with Assaad, let alone other factions within Syria.
Corbyn's patronage of Stop The War, his halting attempts to avoid direct condemnation of ISIS don't bode well when you look at how Dan Jarvis used simpler, more direct language in The Mirror to condemn the Paris attacks. Labour can't afford to stick with a holy fool like Corbyn.
France conducted 23 arrests and seized 31 weapons in overnight raids in the wake of the Paris attacks, Bernard Cazeneuve, the interior minister, has announced.
It carried out 168 raids and has assigned 104 people to house arrest. A rocket launcher and a Kalashnikov rifle were found near the southeast city of Lyon.
'No, it's still a means to an end; it's just that the end they desire is much bigger than the IRA's'
That's right. Dismissing these people as mad psychopaths is a mistake. They have definite goals. The problem is here in the West we simply can't understand the way their minds work.
"Corbyn’s power within LAB will soon hinge on perceptions of his likely general election performance"
I disagree. The hard left does not hold, and never has held, electoral success as the prime political objective: they are instead devoted to control of party. Corbyn's opponents in parliament have no realistic route to removing him.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I would disagree that any nationality is a carefully constructed concept, although I don't really think of Britain as a country or myself as particularly British
I always come back to the question, regarding the immigration of the last 40 odd years; was it worth it? Do the upsides outweigh the downsides? Why create the problems we are facing when they were obvious and avoidable?
The simple answer, and it is simple but with a large basis of truth, is that the Labour Party wanted immigration to boost their voter numbers. That is why they removed almost all barriers to large scale immigration in 2004/5
Mike Smithson's article displays one two key flaws when talking about replacing Corbyn. Firstly it assumes there is an alternative leader who is plausible and more likely to win elections. To me, there is no such candidate. Secondly it assumes that a divided Party can pluck up its courage and overthrow a hundred years of treating its existing Leader as omnipotent until after they lose a GE. I would suggest there is zero appetite for that... and those who internally oppose Corbyn probably hope he stays to a crushing defeat.
Wasn't Nawaz caught heading into a strip club earlier in the year, or was it my imagination that the Twitterati poured seven buckets of shit over his head ?
The constant IRA comparison is incredibly lazy and completely inaccurate.
For the IRA, violence was a means to an end, which is why they stood down eventually For the Islamists, violence is the end
The challenge for the West is that we may be able to defeat them on the ground militarily but how do we defeat their idea.
No, it's still a means to an end; it's just that the end they desire is much bigger than the IRA's and that the level of violence they have at their disposal currently is insufficient to bring that end about.
I think killing is both a means and an end for these people, as it was for groups like the Taiping, Khmer Rouge, or Shining Path.
Imagine John of Leyden or Jim Jones ruling over millions of people.
Wasn't Nawaz caught heading into a strip club earlier in the year, or was it my imagination that the Twitterati poured seven buckets of shit over his head ?
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I would disagree that any nationality is a carefully constructed concept, although I don't really think of Britain as a country or myself as particularly British
I always come back to the question, regarding the immigration of the last 40 odd years; was it worth it? Do the upsides outweigh the downsides? Why create the problems we are facing when they were obvious and avoidable?
The simple answer, and it is simple but with a large basis of truth, is that the Labour Party wanted immigration to boost their voter numbers. That is why they removed almost all barriers to large scale immigration in 2004/5
EU nationals can't vote in general elections.
Southern Observer demonstrates the art of using a non sequitur
Rather interesting development - I'm not sure GCHQ will be happy about it, but Anonymous clearly has some very clever people within its team.
Hacking group Anonymous has declared war on ISIS in a new YouTube video following the horrific attacks in Paris on Friday night which left 129 people dead.
In a newly released video on the group's French YouTube page, the Anonymous hackers warn the terror group to 'expect us' because its members 'are going to hunt you down'.
"Corbyn’s power within LAB will soon hinge on perceptions of his likely general election performance"
I disagree. The hard left does not hold, and never has held, electoral success as the prime political objective: they are instead devoted to control of party. Corbyn's opponents in parliament have no realistic route to removing him.
Good morning all.
I seem to be harping on about 'the long game' a lot nowadays. If the hard left get control of Labour party mechanisms, they simply have to wait for their opportunity. The Tories won't last forever. The Lib Dems aren't credible as a Labour replacement. They might have to wait for 2025, or even 2030. Doesn't matter. Rome wasn't built in a day etc.
Similarly, militant Islam just has to be patient. Democracies have no stamina.
France conducted 23 arrests and seized 31 weapons in overnight raids in the wake of the Paris attacks, Bernard Cazeneuve, the interior minister, has announced.
It carried out 168 raids and has assigned 104 people to house arrest. A rocket launcher and a Kalashnikov rifle were found near the southeast city of Lyon.
Rocket launchers and assault rifles. The left has certainly achieved its goal of rubbing people's noses in it.
Interesting. Highest rated comment (+245) on recent Graun editorial. It's a response to a comment halfway down the page, normally a hindrance in attracting eyeballs...
Exactly. This Guardian comment piece is a useless ragbag of liberal sound bites . There is no " diplomatic " solution to defend our " western liberal values " whatever that drivel means. There is a jihadist regime in the Middle East , it mutilates , rapes , throws gay people from buildings , beheads and burns people to death in cages. It attracts nihilistic young Muslims with promises of raping young women and killing with bombs and guns. It does so in Iraq and Syria , and if it can in European capitals. It does so in the name of a medieval Wahhabi theocracy. What the hell is there to negotiate with ? What "liberal values " do we expect them to adopt. They hate us , they want to infiltrate us and they want to kill us . Eventually , dear old woolly Guardian , we will have to destroy them , or they will destroy us.
Tactical war sandals(tm) being strapped on by the readership.
Wasn't Nawaz caught heading into a strip club earlier in the year, or was it my imagination that the Twitterati poured seven buckets of shit over his head ?
Pop Nawaz strip club into twitter search - you'll see what I mean !
English-law and 19thC liberalism are based upon two, simple concepts (and may others):
#1: Innocent until proven guilty, and #2: Better that ninety-nine guilty men go free than one innocent be convicted.
Yes, we have a migration problem (and an even more venal bennies culture, c.f. Dr Sven) but banning people-of-'faith' from a beauty-salon - wtf - is as pathetic as the TVP response!
[Probably another part of the 'Heroic-Armed-Wing-of-the-Labour-Party'.]
France should be our focus: And Raqqa should become our target. I'd rather Tonkas with 500-lb twins and multiple-Brimstones (and Rafeal 'lecies/RAPTOR) were doing the targeting then Mirage-2000s but France needs to grieve....
'The simple answer, and it is simple but with a large basis of truth, is that the Labour Party wanted immigration to boost their voter numbers. That is why they removed almost all barriers to large scale immigration in 2004/5
EU nationals can't vote in general elections.'
As you well know a large portion of immigration under New Labour's open door policy was from Commonwealth countries,whose citizens are allowed to vote in UK general elections even if they have not become UK nationals.
Given how sophisticated the PB audience is, I've no idea why any regular poster posts nonsense like this. It convinces no one and encourages the rest of us to scroll by without reading.
But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people...
Not sure I follow. "a free market within a fixed number of people"?
Well you have a certain, limited amount of people and let them do what they like
Britishness was, as Dair would tell you, a very carefully constructed concept.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I would disagree that any nationality is a carefully constructed concept, although I don't really think of Britain as a country or myself as particularly British
I always come back to the question, regarding the immigration of the last 40 odd years; was it worth it? Do the upsides outweigh the downsides? Why create the problems we are facing when they were obvious and avoidable?
The simple answer, and it is simple but with a large basis of truth, is that the Labour Party wanted immigration to boost their voter numbers. That is why they removed almost all barriers to large scale immigration in 2004/5
EU nationals can't vote in general elections.
Any lawful resident can vote in General Elections if they become British citizens. Labour's initial targets were Asians who generally voted Labour until they became fed up with Labour's wars.
Jeremy Corbyn just looks totally irrelevant, doesn't he? Completely outside the serious discussions on all points of most concern to voters, except on the few points like immigration where he's firmly on the wrong side.
Sums him and his Labour party up perfectly. This is what Nick and his mates voted for. They'd do it again.
Comments
I heard Dave was giving off mixed messages with his body language.
Anyone who's ever assumed that an email is any more secure or private than a post card is a mug.
theyre like tragedy hipsters
1) This was a direct assault on the way that we live, intended to strike maximum terror into our hearts.
2) It was well-organised and in large parts well-executed.
3) These were not the actions of Muslims as a whole. The great bulk of Muslims in Europe would be appalled by these actions also.
4) However, a significant minority of Muslims would not be appalled or would be ambivalent or, in a few cases, would actively supportive of these actions. The number of each of those groups of Muslims is far too great to ignore or simply to discount.
5) ISIS is merely an example of the problem, not the problem itself, just as Al Qaeda is. ISIS may well have been wiped off the map in a year's time. The ideology will be sustained.
6) We cannot hope to eliminate the ideology completely: ideologies have a long afterlife at the fringes. We can hope to contain it in both the UK and the wider world and to limit its adherents' ability to do the harm that they wish it to do.
7) We have been pretty good at containing the ability of adherents to do the harm that they wish to do and far poorer at containing the ideology itself. We need to do both.
8) The harder battle is in working out how to take on an idea. Setting up cricket tests to apply to a minority that already feels excluded and picked on is unlikely to douse the flames: the reverse.
9) We therefore need a much wider-ranging conversation about what Britishness means - where the acceptable parameters of behaviour lie and, importantly, what is incompatible with being part of British society. What are the limits of tolerance? These probably need much more patrolling than they have received to date. They also need to be seen to be colour blind and ideology blind in their enforcement if they are not going to foster much greater resentment.
10) So far as military action is concerned, it needs to be taken with a clear and achievable set of aims. We have not been given a clear set of aims for British involvement in Syria beyond "everyone else is doing it so why can't we?"
11) There are going to be no quick solutions. It is easier to change behaviours than ideas. We should be settling in for the long haul.
Cynthia Payne, madam: Brothel keeper dubbed 'Madam Cyn' who was jailed after holding sex parties in exchange for Luncheon Vouchers
She drummed up business by word of mouth, and by distributing her calling card, signed Cynthia Payne LV (Luncheon Vouchers). She barred men under 40 (“all Jack-the-lads boasting about their prowess”); her regular clients included a night watchman in his sixties, who availed himself of a special £5 discount for pensioners, a vicar with a penchant for plump angels, an exhibitionist professor, and a barrister who would arrive as if dressed for court, then change into a full tart’s costume of extra high heels, black stockings and make-up.
http://bit.ly/1PK5FV5
Have to give credit to Kay Burley/team with the reporting on Sky during that shooting hoax - reporting whilst lying under tables in Paris cafe.
But then I can't imagine Putin has got much time for somebody coming along saying could you bomb the crap out of ISIL in Syria please, why can't you do it, erhh, well, I'm not allowed.
Gents if you do have your next lunch meet up at Bicester Village, can you please go to Villandry?
It would be very much appreciated!
"...it's not only the left that feel that Britain is now seriously lopsided in terms of both wealth and opportunity, and an alternative that set out concrete ways to address that would get an interested audience"
I think that is very true, Nick. I also think that the number of people who have such concerns is growing, and growing very quickly. Whether Labour can come up with a real programme to do anything about the situation other than its usual raise taxes and benefits and dumb down education is another matter.
It actually endears him to me a little. Every true Englishman should have a little eccentric hobby. Whether it's fishing, geocaching, making little model armies, or dogging.
You may be correct "that the man's an idiot". But trying to prove it based on 1,286 hits in Google News is not going to be successful.
I searched Google News for "dog show in belgium 2015" and got over 15 million hits.
http://www.libdemvoice.org/all-members-will-be-able-to-attend-special-conference-in-wake-of-chris-rennard-election-to-federal-executive-48253.html
I've never been able to talk about manhole covers after the time I met some of England's women cricketers.
We ended talking about the boxes that men use to protect their ahem dangly bits, and turns out women also have something similar, except they call them "manhole covers"
What about defeat after defeat leads Lab to realise that they are going to lose in 2020. Then the field is open and I don't think lack of front bench experience is going to be important, given the current incumbent.
Call the scenario a known unknown.
We ended talking about the boxes that men use to protect their ahem dangly bits, and turns out women also have something similar, except they call them "manhole covers"
Perhaps that's actually what Corbyn's interested in.
Do we have any photos of him with the England women cricket team?
For all some knock Mrs T - she became a living legend/got an -ism and still talked about as influencial decades after leaving office.
I've never had much time for Marr, but this morning on Radio 4 (BBC) was quite revealing. He directed a discussion in Paris on Friday morning with 3 French authors and intellectuals only hours before the attacks and massacres occurred. What was said was most interesting, especially about France since 1880.
If you get a chance to listen via iPlayer or repeat, you'll get an education.
http://ldrtbpress.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/press-release-ultimatum-from-members.html
"Rock The Boat is self described as ‘...about ensuring that pressure is kept up on Lib Dem party officers, staff and leaders to properly tackle sexual harassment within the party. It provides a space for coordination and organisation of campaigns and the sharing of ideas."
He was placed under a formal investigation in October 2012 for terrorist conspiracy after it emerged that he planned to go to Yemen.
He was placed under judicial supervision and an international arrest warrant was issued against him when he broke the conditions of his bail in autumn 2013.
"Eurocrats are in tragic denial about the Paris attacks
The European project is collapsing around their ears, and yet still they desperately scramble to save the Schengen free movement zone"
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11997966/Eurocrats-are-in-tragic-denial-about-the-Paris-attacks.html
For the perfect blue eyed, blonde aryan race read Sunni Muslims. Everyone else, the Kuffar are the Jews and gypsies - inferior beings.
Just as Nazi ideology was not wiped out in 1945, so Islamism will not be wiped out by the flattening of Raqqa, Mosul and the total defeat of the Islamic state. Support should also be given to the Nigerian Gov't to flatten Boku Haram in the north and Kenya given whatever assistance it needs to deal with Al Shabab.
IS being defeated will not create a perfect world, Saudi Arabia will continue to be a disgusting regime; Iran and Israel will continue to view each other with the most suspicion. But we did not crush Switzerland in World War 2 despite there being an obvious money trail back to the Nazis, and all the states with possible cash trails back to IS can't and shouldn't be dealt with with bombs, it pushes the mission too far.
IS has bombed a Russian plane, murdered innocent civilians in Beirut, Turkey, Kenya and of course Paris. The attack on Paris was a violation of article 5 and an assault on our closest neighbour - it should be taken apart without pity.
It is not the total solution, but it is what we must do - for now.
The problem we have is that with the arrival of millions of non British people over the last 40 odd years, it is inevitable that the notion of being British would change... But being British, or any other nationality, isn't something that can be learned in a textbook, it didn't come about through planning and diktat but through a free market within a fixed number of people... What we have to do now is try to control/make sense of a surplus of supply through heavy regulation, which I don't think works or is wise in business or immigration
That's the problem, He doesn't look a potential winner because he isn't.
We ended talking about the boxes that men use to protect their ahem dangly bits, and turns out women also have something similar, except they call them "manhole covers"
This rather undermines the politically correct decision to rename manhole covers as 'inspection chamber' covers.
Would be interested in yr concept though. A shared history without large changes in population? Is that more or less it? Not sure how the free market fits in
'There is one party with a major internal crisis bigger than Labour's.
http://www.libdemvoice.org/all-members-will-be-able-to-attend-special-conference-in-wake-of-chris-rennard-election-to-federal-executive-48253'
Surely they will be focused on the Oldham by-election using Rennard's expertise ?
For Master Race, read Master Religion.
I've seen some compare what's going on to the IRA campaign over here, but there is very little comparison in terms of scale or overall intent.
In the same way that our society has challenged, and thrown off, the illiberal and socially and sexually repressive problems associated with Christianity, most notably Catholicism, the same challenge needs to be taken to Islam.
A propaganda war.
I don't think that Watson would count in my scenario (which is far from the only one, of course). Deputy leaders filling in don't usually count for bets, though they will if elected in their own right. That's not what I'm thinking of here; more a prolonged interregnum. IIRC, Labour's rules allow up to something like 18 months between one leader going and the next having to be elected. That does give time for Watson - who is a Labour man through and through - to sort out the mess that Miliband created and Corbyn has exploited.
Scotland at the beginning of the 18th century had some resemblances to a failed state in the modern middle east. It was bankrupt, riven by religious conflict and was dominated outside its few big cities by tribal groupings that were impenetrable to the outsider. It was eventually absorbed very successfully into the British state, but the process wasn't a smooth or quick one. It took generations.
I always come back to the question, regarding the immigration of the last 40 odd years; was it worth it? Do the upsides outweigh the downsides? Why create the problems we are facing when they were obvious and avoidable?
For the IRA, violence was a means to an end, which is why they stood down eventually
For the Islamists, violence is the end
The challenge for the West is that we may be able to defeat them on the ground militarily but how do we defeat their idea.
Until they can answer those they won't seriously be considered by floating voters and, at the moment, they are giving precisely the wrong answers to all of them.
The Left talks about the Right living in the past, but I'd say that's more true of the Left now: they are living in, and still trying to fight, the post-colonial socio-cultural battles of the 1960s-1990s at the moment.
The World has moved on.
Trying to blame the press for not reporting events is an interesting excuse from JC, but how does he propose to work to a political solution in Syria? ISIS aren't behaving like a government in waiting willing to negotiate with Assaad, let alone other factions within Syria.
Corbyn's patronage of Stop The War, his halting attempts to avoid direct condemnation of ISIS don't bode well when you look at how Dan Jarvis used simpler, more direct language in The Mirror to condemn the Paris attacks. Labour can't afford to stick with a holy fool like Corbyn.
That's right. Dismissing these people as mad psychopaths is a mistake. They have definite goals. The problem is here in the West we simply can't understand the way their minds work.
I disagree. The hard left does not hold, and never has held, electoral success as the prime political objective: they are instead devoted to control of party. Corbyn's opponents in parliament have no realistic route to removing him.
Firstly it assumes there is an alternative leader who is plausible and more likely to win elections. To me, there is no such candidate.
Secondly it assumes that a divided Party can pluck up its courage and overthrow a hundred years of treating its existing Leader as omnipotent until after they lose a GE. I would suggest there is zero appetite for that... and those who internally oppose Corbyn probably hope he stays to a crushing defeat.
Imagine John of Leyden or Jim Jones ruling over millions of people.
The primary reason for ISIS existing IMO is the slaughter of Muslims in wars such as Iraq.
Remind me which side were you on in those decisions.
I was on the same as Jezza.
I think a certain Ken Clarke said at the time you will create thousands of OBL's with the pursuit of this war. He was right.
I seem to be harping on about 'the long game' a lot nowadays. If the hard left get control of Labour party mechanisms, they simply have to wait for their opportunity. The Tories won't last forever. The Lib Dems aren't credible as a Labour replacement. They might have to wait for 2025, or even 2030. Doesn't matter. Rome wasn't built in a day etc.
Similarly, militant Islam just has to be patient. Democracies have no stamina.
Firstly:
English-law and 19thC liberalism are based upon two, simple concepts (and may others):
#1: Innocent until proven guilty, and
#2: Better that ninety-nine guilty men go free than one innocent be convicted.
Yes, we have a migration problem (and an even more venal bennies culture, c.f. Dr Sven) but banning people-of-'faith' from a beauty-salon - wtf - is as pathetic as the TVP response!
[Probably another part of the 'Heroic-Armed-Wing-of-the-Labour-Party'.]
France should be our focus: And Raqqa should become our target. I'd rather Tonkas with 500-lb twins and multiple-Brimstones (and Rafeal 'lecies/RAPTOR) were doing the targeting then Mirage-2000s but France needs to grieve....
:surbiton-is-a-[moderated]:
http://labourlist.org/2015/11/the-eighteenth-brumaire-of-jeremy-corbyn/
'The simple answer, and it is simple but with a large basis of truth, is that the Labour Party wanted immigration to boost their voter numbers. That is why they removed almost all barriers to large scale immigration in 2004/5
EU nationals can't vote in general elections.'
As you well know a large portion of immigration under New Labour's open door policy was from Commonwealth countries,whose citizens are allowed to vote in UK general elections even if they have not become UK nationals.
If you are so asininely stupid as to swallow radical islamic propaganda, that is your affair.