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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Some of the headlines after the big statement are not quite

SystemSystem Posts: 11,002
edited June 2013 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Some of the headlines after the big statement are not quite what Osborne must have been hoping for

When I first saw Osborne’s pre-sending review statement Tweet with a picture of himself at his desk eating a burger it looked like a mistake. It was just too contrived and in any case the Chancellor is always going to have a battle convincing us that he’s a man of the people.

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    First?
  • JohnLoonyJohnLoony Posts: 1,790
    Eight Thousand, Five Hundred and Thirty-Seventh!
  • JohnLoonyJohnLoony Posts: 1,790
    When the Royal baby is born, they should give him/her the middle names "Nelson Mandela" just to annoy Peter Hitchens.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 58,941
    Soothsayer cameron was correct on this one.. "Too many tweets makes a twat". Still I don't think anyone claimed it was from a fast food joint like BK or McDonalds, and anyone with half a brain cell would realise that it wasn't since the packaging ins't emblazoned with their logos. Can you imagine the media frenzy if there had been a fancy drink on the table too.. I think there would have significant calls for a judge-led enquiry into the whole fiasco.

    O/T but spare a thought for us folks here in Phoenix - temperatures are set to reach 48C (120 in old money) over the weekend... phew!
  • PendduPenddu Posts: 265
    And on the political betting front...some news from Wales. The Ynys Mon by-election date has been set for 1st August. This surprised me as Plaid wanted it to be taken quickly, so you would automatically expect Labour to force a delay.

    Plaid should be favourites because they hold the seat (at least in the Senedd) and they enjoyed relative success in the recent Council elections. They dont currently have a candidate, but with two strong potential candidates in Heledd Fychan and Rhun ap Iorwerth as well as a popular local councillor, but this should be sorted out later this week.

    Labour are the obvious challenger but they are a bit of a disorganised shambles on the island at the moment, and again dont have a firm candidate. Conservatives are unlikley to do well unless they select Peter Rodgers, but even then that wont be enough. Nothing expected from LDs or UKIP.

    My prediction: Plaid hold with around 9,500 votes - Labour second with around 6,500 - Conservatives, LD and UKIP all around 3,000 each (but with Peter Rodgers having potential to increase Con vote to around 6,000)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Wonder why they didn't order from the much closer one on Charing Cross Road? Oh well, if this is the Sun's main attack on the CSR I doubt Osborne will be too upset....

    And Osborne's not the only one getting flak over trivia:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/4985857/Alex-Salmond-is-blasted-for-sneaking-into-class.html
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    edited June 2013
    Good YouGov for Labour as UKIP fall further - now below LibDems: Latest YouGov / The Sun results 26th June - CON 31%, LAB 42%, LD 11%, UKIP 10%; APP -33 - See more at: http://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/06/27/update-labour-lead-11/#sthash.XxEgcsZ5.dpuf

    Last time the LibDems were ahead of UKIP was late March.

    UKIP down, Labour up.

    Coincidence, of course!
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,136
    I'm not sure you can blame the tweet for this. If it hadn't been that the press could have found something else.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    tim said:

    I'm not sure you can blame the tweet for this. If it hadn't been that the press could have found something else.

    A pyschiatrist should do an analysis of the Fop Cameron/Fop Osborne use of food to equate themselves with the common man.
    And your obsession with this?

    "Tim has posted 32,618 comments on PB since his first contribution in June 2005."
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    I'm torn. On the one hand, I detest photo-opportunities, especially of this type. On the other hand, I expect that a lot of Sun readers will have eaten in Byron and will wonder what the fuss is about. Calling it a "posh diner" is overstating it a fair bit - it will be waiting some time for its second Michelin star.

    On balance, I'd say that George Osborne deserves what he got from this. And that the Sun also deserves to lose a few sales over this. So everyone's a winner.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    edited June 2013
    "New estimates of the UK's reserves of shale gas will be published on Thursday, and are expected to be much larger than originally thought – potentially supplying the UK with decades' worth of natural gas, if a high proportion of the gas in the rocks can be extracted at a low cost. However that key question that cannot yet be answered due to the lack of experimental wells drilled so far and the challenges posed by the UK's high density of population."

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2013/jun/27/uk-shale-gas-survey-fracking?CMP=twt_fd

    R4 reporting now double previous estimates:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23069499
  • Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019
    A "posh" burger would be one from our way - Kobe - a burger made from Kobe beef is about £16!
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,766

    "New estimates of the UK's reserves of shale gas will be published on Thursday, and are expected to be much larger than originally thought – potentially supplying the UK with decades' worth of natural gas, if a high proportion of the gas in the rocks can be extracted at a low cost. However that key question that cannot yet be answered due to the lack of experimental wells drilled so far and the challenges posed by the UK's high density of population."

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2013/jun/27/uk-shale-gas-survey-fracking?CMP=twt_fd

    You beat me to it: the number is apparently 1,300 trillion cubic feet - although that is an 'in-place' number, rather than a 'recoverable' number. Still, however you spin it, this is an ever greater number than we'd previously thought, and with a bit of luck we'll start commercially exploiting this before the end of the decade.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    rcs1000 said:

    "New estimates of the UK's reserves of shale gas will be published on Thursday, and are expected to be much larger than originally thought – potentially supplying the UK with decades' worth of natural gas, if a high proportion of the gas in the rocks can be extracted at a low cost. However that key question that cannot yet be answered due to the lack of experimental wells drilled so far and the challenges posed by the UK's high density of population."

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2013/jun/27/uk-shale-gas-survey-fracking?CMP=twt_fd

    You beat me to it: the number is apparently 1,300 trillion cubic feet
    "It said there could be 1,300 trillion cubic feet at one site alone, but it is unclear how much could be extracted."


  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,876
    How Osborne framed the 7 day dole wait tells you everything. The sheer vindictiveness of it was a genuine surprise. Punish people who have just been thrown out of work; imply they are more interested in getting benefits than finding a new job; and all to create a new dividing line with Labour. Never mind that it will cause considerable extra pain to folk who clearly cannot be considered feckless scroungers, as long as it makes Ed Balls uncomfortable it's worth it. I wish I could cut and paste the words he used yesterday. They shame him and the Conservative Party.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 31,715
    How does the post counter work? The estimable John Loony posted at about 4am, and was clocked at 150. Posted again at 4.40am and was still clocked at 150.
    If posts within the same hour count as one, then I shudder to think what astronomical levels an accurate count of some poster's would achieve!

    Number of pebbles in Wales comes to mind!
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Interesting analysis of Afghanistan :

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/26/nato-taliban-india-pakistan

    Forget Nato v the Taliban. The real Afghan fight is India v Pakistan
    Afghanistan's old ethnic conflict has become a proxy war for the bitter feud between the region's two nuclear powers
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited June 2013
    tim said:

    @Carlotta

    And I'm always on the money and call elections right,.

    And so modest with it tim - who can forget when you tried to pass yourself off as a humble worker of the land.

    Must have missed your GE 2015 call ? Lab maj nailed on ?

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540

    I wish I could cut and paste the words he used yesterday. They shame him and the Conservative Party.

    "And we’re going to introduce a new seven day wait before people can claim benefits.

    Those first few days should be spent looking for work, not looking to sign on.

    We’re doing these things because we know they help people stay off benefits and help those on benefits get back into work faster."

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/06/george-osbornes-spending-round-2013-speech/
  • FinancierFinancier Posts: 3,916
    tim said:

    @Carlotta

    And I'm always on the money and call elections right, whereas you end up trying to spin Maria Hutchings as a viable candidate.

    Don't forget that Osborne has ended up in this position because he's spending more than Labour ever did, and the deficit is rising.

    He has failed, and is reduced to adopting a mockney accent and tweeting photo's of his burger.

    But don't forget that he has failed.


    Jealousy will get you everywhere - failed farmer, failed wine merchant, - just a 24/7 smearer and sneerer - especially about other people's misfortunes and personal tragedies- pathetic!
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    Off-topic.

    Some on here might not like F1, but you have to like what it does for the UK:
    The industry continues to grow, with companies in Motorsport Valley producing an estimated turnover of £6billion, of which £3.6billion is exported.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/23048643

    I wonder how that compares to the Premier League?
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,876

    I wish I could cut and paste the words he used yesterday. They shame him and the Conservative Party.

    "And we’re going to introduce a new seven day wait before people can claim benefits.

    Those first few days should be spent looking for work, not looking to sign on.

    We’re doing these things because we know they help people stay off benefits and help those on benefits get back into work faster."

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/06/george-osbornes-spending-round-2013-speech/

    Yup, there you go.

    People who have just been thrown out of work are looking to sign on instead of looking for new jobs. Because it is impossible to do both. In George's world as soon as you are made unemployed you become an idle scrounger. And all to create a dividing line. Lovely stuff.

    It's great to see a son of privilege who has never had to worry about having to make ends meet telling those who have just lost their livelihoods that preventing them from claiming social security is good for them.

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,876
    Financier said:

    tim said:

    @Carlotta

    And I'm always on the money and call elections right, whereas you end up trying to spin Maria Hutchings as a viable candidate.

    Don't forget that Osborne has ended up in this position because he's spending more than Labour ever did, and the deficit is rising.

    He has failed, and is reduced to adopting a mockney accent and tweeting photo's of his burger.

    But don't forget that he has failed.


    Jealousy will get you everywhere - failed farmer, failed wine merchant, - just a 24/7 smearer and sneerer - especially about other people's misfortunes and personal tragedies- pathetic!

    A post wonderfully lacking in self-awareness!!

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    @SouthamObserver - your inference from Osborne's remarks say as much about you as they do about him. What is your view of Labour's rapid acceptance of this change?
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    Penddu said:

    And on the political betting front...some news from Wales. The Ynys Mon by-election date has been set for 1st August. This surprised me as Plaid wanted it to be taken quickly, so you would automatically expect Labour to force a delay.

    Plaid should be favourites because they hold the seat (at least in the Senedd) and they enjoyed relative success in the recent Council elections. They dont currently have a candidate, but with two strong potential candidates in Heledd Fychan and Rhun ap Iorwerth as well as a popular local councillor, but this should be sorted out later this week.

    Labour are the obvious challenger but they are a bit of a disorganised shambles on the island at the moment, and again dont have a firm candidate. Conservatives are unlikley to do well unless they select Peter Rodgers, but even then that wont be enough. Nothing expected from LDs or UKIP.

    My prediction: Plaid hold with around 9,500 votes - Labour second with around 6,500 - Conservatives, LD and UKIP all around 3,000 each (but with Peter Rodgers having potential to increase Con vote to around 6,000)

    2011 result
    Plaid 9969
    Con 7032
    Lab 6307
    LD 759

    2013 local elections approx results

    Plaid 9000
    Lab 6300
    Con 2700 ( 1 ward not fought )
    LD 2350 ( only 3 wards fought )
    UKIP 4500 ( 1 candidate in each ward )
    Independents lots of votes

    Much split voting which will overstate each parties vote but clearly Plaid hold favourites with Labour challengers
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    And your obsession with this?

    "Tim has posted 32,618 comments on PB since his first contribution in June 2005."

    Of those, 18,397 feature his creepy obsession with me. Sad

    15,233 feature Osborne (man on a boat, man on a train, man gets out of a car, man cries at funeral). There are another 467 "man eats burger" to come

    4,097 feature Jeremy Hunt's resignation(s)

    2,220 feature the end of Michael Gove's career

    3,350 feature Chris Huhne's next cabinet position

    5,112 feature Samantha Cameron

    9,206 features shrouds of various shades waving furiously

    13,729 have been MODERATED

    426 feature the rural idyll of the Cheshire farmer

    12 feature bets, including "man will apologise for agreeing with opponent"

    0 feature the merits of Ed Miliband, Ed Balls or any of Labours' programme for Government
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    " History will regard her as the worst prime minister since Kevin Rudd."

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/06/the-demise-of-julia-gillard/
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    tim said:

    Chris Mason ‏@ChrisMasonBBC
    The Chancellor explains his Byron burger the other night by telling @daybreak: "Mcdonalds doesn't deliver"

    They don't :

    http://www.mcdonalds.co.uk/ukhome/whatmakesmcdonalds/questions/food/delivery-service/why-dont-you-run-a-delivery-service-in-the-uk.html

    I guess you'd rather be complaining about

    - "Civil Servant and Government Driver sent to pick up Chancellor's Burger!"
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,876

    @SouthamObserver - your inference from Osborne's remarks say as much about you as they do about him. What is your view of Labour's rapid acceptance of this change?

    If Labour has accepted that those thrown out of work are more interested in getting benefits than finding new jobs then shame on them.

    Osborne could have framed this measure in any number of ways - regretful necessity, unavoidable, no choice etc - but he chose to do it in the way that he did.

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Ed Balls on R4 - not committing to reverse 7 days - "it needs to be looked at" - Gen Sec of TUC and Charity saying its inhumane, but Balls won't commit to reverse it - "the government is just catching up with many things we've been proposing for two years"
  • MillsyMillsy Posts: 900
    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr. D, you have my sympathy. That sounds horrendous.

    Mr. Tokyo, I suspect you're probably right. This is a pathetic move by the Sun. There's a lot of serious business regarding the spending decisions to praise or censure and instead they're bleating about someone spending a tenner on a meal (and that someone has a six figure salary) instead of ordering a cheaper version from somewhere that apparently doesn't deliver.

    Mr. Jessop, those are tasty figures. F1 also provides a lot of direct high end engineering employments and probably tens of thousands of jobs for suppliers. More than half the teams are based in a little area of England (Oxfordshire, I think), which must be a significant boost to the local economy.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited June 2013
    Amidst the predictable shrieking and whining from the tea party tories, never forget how many of them tried to dismiss Osbrowne's omnishambles in their usual incompetent manner.

    This certainly isn't omnishambles level coverage but you'd have to be some sort of mad swivel eyed loon not to realise it's hardly going to help since Osbrowne's own approval ratings are hilariously bad and reflect the fact that he's a toxic liabiilty.

    That we have grown used to the out of touch public relations stupidity of Cammie and Osbrowne does not make it any less amusing.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited June 2013
    Isn't it depressing that the Sun thinks eating a Burger and chips makes you a man of the people? No wonder you can't walk the streets without seeing the most gross and repulsive examples of obesity seen outside of a Sumo wrestlers summer camp.

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 38,876
    Millsy said:

    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.

    In general, I agree. But on this specific measure I think Osborne may have over-stretched. People who have just been thrown out of work cannot really be labelled idle scroungers. I think most reasonable voters will recognise that the ability to claim JSA when you have been made unemployed is not an incentive to get yourself the sack.

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Roger said:

    Isn't it depressing that the Sun thinks eating a Burger and chips makes you a man of the people? No wonder you can't walk the streets without seeing the most gross and repulsive examples of obesity seen outside of a Sumo wrestlers summer camp

    Been in the US recently? Every time I go I come away thinking "I can put the diet off..."
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,673

    Wonder why they didn't order from the much closer one on Charing Cross Road? Oh well, if this is the Sun's main attack on the CSR I doubt Osborne will be too upset....

    And Osborne's not the only one getting flak over trivia:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/4985857/Alex-Salmond-is-blasted-for-sneaking-into-class.html

    wonder how many of those 6 year olds he managed to get to vote for SNP in the by-election , SUN is really slow and desperate , most papers had the story last week but it was told with a bit less of the bovine manure additives
  • Osborne is not a naturally likeable character. But he is succeeding in turning around the nature of debate on spending and cuts:

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/benedictbrogan/100223632/spending-review-george-osborne-has-made-cuts-the-new-normal/

    This country still has a horrific deficit, a horrific debt burden, scarily thinly capitalised banks and a disastrous entitlements culture. If Ozzy is making a start in reshaping all our expectations here he is doing the whole country a big favour. We will need to run surpluses at some point. The austerity hasn't even started.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,673
    rcs1000 said:

    "New estimates of the UK's reserves of shale gas will be published on Thursday, and are expected to be much larger than originally thought – potentially supplying the UK with decades' worth of natural gas, if a high proportion of the gas in the rocks can be extracted at a low cost. However that key question that cannot yet be answered due to the lack of experimental wells drilled so far and the challenges posed by the UK's high density of population."

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2013/jun/27/uk-shale-gas-survey-fracking?CMP=twt_fd

    You beat me to it: the number is apparently 1,300 trillion cubic feet - although that is an 'in-place' number, rather than a 'recoverable' number. Still, however you spin it, this is an ever greater number than we'd previously thought, and with a bit of luck we'll start commercially exploiting this before the end of the decade.
    It is the usual bollocks to detract from the mess the country is in , only thing it will do is wreck the countryside , make a few rich people richer and guarantee we pay extra for gas and billions on clearing up the mess left behind. All the gas in Scotland is across the central belt where more than 90% of the population live so just a joke unless we are going to have drilling wells in our gardens.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Miss Vance, the other day I read a story about some American medical chaps voting that obesity was a disease:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/23011804

    That seems like utter tosh to me. Whilst obesity can sometimes be a symptom of other issues generally it's a symptom of pie-enthusiasm and cake-appreciation.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    malcolmg said:

    Wonder why they didn't order from the much closer one on Charing Cross Road? Oh well, if this is the Sun's main attack on the CSR I doubt Osborne will be too upset....

    And Osborne's not the only one getting flak over trivia:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/4985857/Alex-Salmond-is-blasted-for-sneaking-into-class.html

    most papers had the story last week but it was told with a bit less of the bovine manure additives
    Its gained legs as the local council have taken it up:

    "Scotland's most senior civil servant is to be asked to investigate First Minister Alex Salmond's professional conduct over a school visit."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-23070207

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/410622/Brazen-Alex-Salmond-faces-probe-over-school-visit

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/scotland/article3801429.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2013_06_26

    Looks like the silly season is starting early......
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540

    Millsy said:

    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.

    I think Osborne may have over-stretched
    This wouldn't be the first time you've thought that, nor the first time the polling when it emerged hasn't backed you up.....

    I expect Ashcroft will publish his Boris Polling today....

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/

    Osborne on R4 shortly.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,673
    Patrick said:

    Osborne is not a naturally likeable character. But he is succeeding in turning around the nature of debate on spending and cuts:

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/benedictbrogan/100223632/spending-review-george-osborne-has-made-cuts-the-new-normal/

    This country still has a horrific deficit, a horrific debt burden, scarily thinly capitalised banks and a disastrous entitlements culture. If Ozzy is making a start in reshaping all our expectations here he is doing the whole country a big favour. We will need to run surpluses at some point. The austerity hasn't even started.

    Yes brain of Britain , how do you explain the increased borrowing of over £120 billion per annum, how will he magic that into surplus. Just stay in the corner with your pointy hat on.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    tim said:

    @MorrisDancer.

    I assume you are missing the point deliberately?

    @iainmartin1: Osborne says resulting row about his Byron burger is an "occupational hazard." Well, yes, but only if you tweet pics of you eating burgers

    Is that difficult to grasp?

    The difficulty you face tim is that not everyone is as sophisticated as you although to be fair, most Sun readers are.

    You are suffering from wood-from-trees syndrome. Perhaps you should take a moment.

    The overwhelming narrative will be that he was eating a burger. That will be the image people recall. Eating burgers, or more generally having lunch at our desks, as opposed to attending Bullingdon Club dinners or visiting Tuscan villas, or commenting 24/7 on a blog, is something that everyone can relate to.

    And that will be the enduring message.
  • Mike or RCS1000,

    Since there's little to bet on right ow we talk politics. Is the state of our banks worth a thread? As per below I think Ozzy is doing a good job reshaping expectations - but I don't think he's really more than scratched the surface of our banking problems. Mainly their resilience to shock and the systemic threat of Too Big To Fail. Vickers needs to be implemented in full ASAP. If, as seems now all but inevitable, there is a global govt bond market collapse the UK banks are going to be trashed. And then all politics is off.

    If there is one thing that would genuinely bring tumbleweed to our cities and cause us all to starve to death it will be the utter collapse of the global banking / payments system, and we're near the front of that queue.
  • BobajobBobajob Posts: 1,536
    @Southam

    Fascinating drama from Down Under. Be great if there are any students of Aussie politics lurking to do us a thread. I have a sneaky feeling Labor are going to win this thing now.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited June 2013
    @ Carlotta

    "Been in the US recently? Every time I go I come away thinking "I can put the diet off...""

    We're getting close and it's much worse here than in other parts of Europe. I'd start treating the seriously obese in the same way smokers were treated a few years ago. I watched yesterday an enormous fat woman open a packet of chocolates and share them with her baby in a pram.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,673

    malcolmg said:

    Wonder why they didn't order from the much closer one on Charing Cross Road? Oh well, if this is the Sun's main attack on the CSR I doubt Osborne will be too upset....

    And Osborne's not the only one getting flak over trivia:

    http://www.thesun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/news/4985857/Alex-Salmond-is-blasted-for-sneaking-into-class.html

    most papers had the story last week but it was told with a bit less of the bovine manure additives
    Its gained legs as the local council have taken it up:

    "Scotland's most senior civil servant is to be asked to investigate First Minister Alex Salmond's professional conduct over a school visit."

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-23070207

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/410622/Brazen-Alex-Salmond-faces-probe-over-school-visit

    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/scotland/article3801429.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2013_06_26

    Looks like the silly season is starting early......
    No doubt it will be Jimmy Krankie's big story at First Ministers Questions today
  • For those who think the logic behind the replacement of Gillard was right, then the the 7/2 @ SJ/Bet365 that the ALP will win the next federal election must look relatively attractive.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    edited June 2013
    tim said:

    #GeorgesWhopper

    Remember how you kept us all entertained with your endless posting about Cameron's horse riding? Looks like you've found your next idée fixe.....

    ......Meanwhile SO agonises over the Labour front bench's acceptance of the 7 day sign on change - which I understand, if not agree with......looks like there might be trouble with the troops on this though....
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Roger, a while ago I read a little on obesity. There are two forms: hyperplastic and hypertropic. One involves having larger fat cells than usual, the other having more. Over-feeding children (by parents, obviously) leads to the creation of more fat cells than they would otherwise have. If you like, it raises their baseline of fatness, making it far easier for them to be fat/obese in adulthood and far harder for them to subsequently shift that weight.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,673
    TOPPING said:

    tim said:

    @MorrisDancer.

    I assume you are missing the point deliberately?

    @iainmartin1: Osborne says resulting row about his Byron burger is an "occupational hazard." Well, yes, but only if you tweet pics of you eating burgers

    Is that difficult to grasp?

    The difficulty you face tim is that not everyone is as sophisticated as you although to be fair, most Sun readers are.

    You are suffering from wood-from-trees syndrome. Perhaps you should take a moment.

    The overwhelming narrative will be that he was eating a burger. That will be the image people recall. Eating burgers, or more generally having lunch at our desks, as opposed to attending Bullingdon Club dinners or visiting Tuscan villas, or commenting 24/7 on a blog, is something that everyone can relate to.

    And that will be the enduring message.
    It will just reinforce the opinion that he is a fake attempting to pretend that he is just a commoner like the rest of us.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    Patrick said:

    Mike or RCS1000,

    Since there's little to bet on right ow we talk politics.

    Yvette Cooper at next Lab leader (5/2) or PM (11/1).
  • @MalcolmG

    He hasn't. It's no secret that I think the coalition should have been much more aggressive on spending cuts from Day 1. Spending not investment mind. But what we are clearly seeing is that the spending cuts which have happened are not translating into worse services or unemployment - the doomsday messages were wrong. This is a green light to push alot harder. The CSR was only a step in the right direction.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    Patrick said:

    Mike or RCS1000,

    Since there's little to bet on right ow we talk politics. Is the state of our banks worth a thread? As per below I think Ozzy is doing a good job reshaping expectations - but I don't think he's really more than scratched the surface of our banking problems. Mainly their resilience to shock and the systemic threat of Too Big To Fail. Vickers needs to be implemented in full ASAP. If, as seems now all but inevitable, there is a global govt bond market collapse the UK banks are going to be trashed. And then all politics is off.

    If there is one thing that would genuinely bring tumbleweed to our cities and cause us all to starve to death it will be the utter collapse of the global banking / payments system, and we're near the front of that queue.

    good idea Patrick. Have a look at the Anglo scandal in Ireland and ask why the UK tax payer is on the hook for billions because senior bankers had a shockingly cynical attitude to securing funds for a bail out.
  • BobajobBobajob Posts: 1,536
    tim said:

    Financier said:

    tim said:

    @Carlotta

    And I'm always on the money and call elections right, whereas you end up trying to spin Maria Hutchings as a viable candidate.

    Don't forget that Osborne has ended up in this position because he's spending more than Labour ever did, and the deficit is rising.

    He has failed, and is reduced to adopting a mockney accent and tweeting photo's of his burger.

    But don't forget that he has failed.


    Jealousy will get you everywhere - failed farmer, failed wine merchant, - just a 24/7 smearer and sneerer - especially about other people's misfortunes and personal tragedies- pathetic!

    A post wonderfully lacking in self-awareness!!


    Following the food theme I was hoping for one of financiers "Morrisons are struggling not due to their lack of an online presence but due to the number of pies they have in their southern stores" posts.

    Or a betting tip from a man with £20 million credit at the bookies who only bets on mathematical certainties.
    LOL.


    LOL. Hilarious stuff from the PB Tories this morning.
    Meanwhile - here's a poser: has any government in history had more grocery-related cock-ups than this one? I can now count pasty-gate, burger-gate, wine-tax-gate.... And I know I have missed a few!

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited June 2013
    Byron burgers must be made up unlimited free advertising.

  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Cutting edge journalsm and incisive analysis from the Sun.The Chancellor delivers the Spending Review and the Sun leads with a story of him eating a posh burger..would anyone choose to eat a macdonalds if there was a good alternative.
    Maguire(Mirror) twittered all day yesterday that the PM was eating roast beef and drinking claret in the HOC dining room, showing his complete scorn for the starving masses..It is traditional for every PM, regardles of his politics, to have a roast beef lunch after PMQ's.A proper journo should know that.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 40,950
    malcolmg said:

    TOPPING said:

    tim said:

    @MorrisDancer.

    I assume you are missing the point deliberately?

    @iainmartin1: Osborne says resulting row about his Byron burger is an "occupational hazard." Well, yes, but only if you tweet pics of you eating burgers

    Is that difficult to grasp?

    The difficulty you face tim is that not everyone is as sophisticated as you although to be fair, most Sun readers are.

    You are suffering from wood-from-trees syndrome. Perhaps you should take a moment.

    The overwhelming narrative will be that he was eating a burger. That will be the image people recall. Eating burgers, or more generally having lunch at our desks, as opposed to attending Bullingdon Club dinners or visiting Tuscan villas, or commenting 24/7 on a blog, is something that everyone can relate to.

    And that will be the enduring message.
    It will just reinforce the opinion that he is a fake attempting to pretend that he is just a commoner like the rest of us.
    Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

    He was having lunch. He chose a burger (no doubt that was workshopped first).

    The burger legacy will be good for him.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited June 2013

    Millsy said:

    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.

    In general, I agree. But on this specific measure I think Osborne may have over-stretched. People who have just been thrown out of work cannot really be labelled idle scroungers. I think most reasonable voters will recognise that the ability to claim JSA when you have been made unemployed is not an incentive to get yourself the sack.

    It is counterproductive and crass as we have come to expect from Osbrowne's desperate political master strategies.

    It merely raises the tories toxicity since the frontman for this kind of pitiful posturing is an out of touch fop incapable of understanding that those who are put out of work and change jobs during this time of austerity are from all sectors of the economy and most definitely not from one small skew of the underclass. The great majority of voters will have family or friends who have changed jobs or been put out of work during these years of seemingly endless austerity. So Osbrowne continually trying to blame them for his own economic incompetence is about as wise as him doing so just before he and his fellow MPs will have to defend their own massive £10,000 pay rise.



  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,967
    So Toff Rail is already £8bn over budget 6 years before they start building it.

    As I've said before its going to be nothing more than a London-Birmingham commuter route with the northern extensions cancelled because of 'surprise' cost overruns.

    The money then 'saved' will be spent on Crossrail 2.

    If it was really designed to help northern England wouldn't they start building it in the north?


  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    Patrick said:

    @MalcolmG

    He hasn't. It's no secret that I think the coalition should have been much more aggressive on spending cuts from Day 1. Spending not investment mind. But what we are clearly seeing is that the spending cuts which have happened are not translating into worse services or unemployment

    Unemployment is higher than it was in May 2010.

    Have you been in a cave and missed all the coverage about the deterioration in A&E services?

  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    edited June 2013
    Has Ed Miliband resigned yet ? or at least resigned himself to a humiliating defeat in 2015. About time too that Paddypower payed out on another Con/LibDem Coalition government in 2015.

    And while we're in a generous mode another toe-curlingly awful performance from Ed Balls on 5Live. Put this man in charge of a welk stall ?!? - Fishing industry collapses !!.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Bobajob said:

    tim said:

    Financier said:

    tim said:

    @Carlotta

    And I'm always on the money and call elections right, whereas you end up trying to spin Maria Hutchings as a viable candidate.

    Don't forget that Osborne has ended up in this position because he's spending more than Labour ever did, and the deficit is rising.

    He has failed, and is reduced to adopting a mockney accent and tweeting photo's of his burger.

    But don't forget that he has failed.


    Jealousy will get you everywhere - failed farmer, failed wine merchant, - just a 24/7 smearer and sneerer - especially about other people's misfortunes and personal tragedies- pathetic!

    A post wonderfully lacking in self-awareness!!


    Following the food theme I was hoping for one of financiers "Morrisons are struggling not due to their lack of an online presence but due to the number of pies they have in their southern stores" posts.

    Or a betting tip from a man with £20 million credit at the bookies who only bets on mathematical certainties.
    LOL.


    LOL. Hilarious stuff from the PB Tories this morning.
    Meanwhile, of those on the left one poster -SO - discussing something of substance to voters - the shift to 7 days for sign on - no one else....if the right are hilarious, the left are, in the main, pathetic......

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517
    Roger said:

    Isn't it depressing that the Sun thinks eating a Burger and chips makes you a man of the people? No wonder you can't walk the streets without seeing the most gross and repulsive examples of obesity seen outside of a Sumo wrestlers summer camp.

    Would you turn down the chance to make an ad for a burger chain, sweet manufacturer or fizzy drink company?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Mick_Pork said:

    Millsy said:

    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.

    In general, I agree. But on this specific measure I think Osborne may have over-stretched. People who have just been thrown out of work cannot really be labelled idle scroungers. I think most reasonable voters will recognise that the ability to claim JSA when you have been made unemployed is not an incentive to get yourself the sack.

    It is counterproductive and crass
    which is why Balls will not commit to reverse it.....
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 24,967
    Interesting article on the BBC:

    " But this match also showed me that maybe a new cricket test is emerging.

    The first signs of it came when England's Ravi Bopara came on to bowl. The 28-year-old was born in London. His parents settled in the capital after migrating from Punjab in India in the 1970s.

    For some Indian fans in the crowd, that meant that he should be playing for India. So as he ran in to bowl, a group of young Indian fans began a chant of "traitor, traitor, traitor".

    When he came out to bat there were pockets of fans booing and when he was dismissed there were huge celebrations in the ground.

    While I was standing in the queue to get a drink, an elderly England fan turned to me and asked: "Why are you giving Bopara such a hard time?"

    Before I could answer, a young Indian fan replied: "We hate him as he plays for England. He is a disgrace." He then quickly rushed off back to the match.

    I mumbled to the England fan that not all Indian fans felt like that, and in fact the majority of us thought that he was a great role model and that we wanted to see more British Asians turning out for England. Confused, the England fan just smiled and walked back to his seat.

    When I returned to mine, I noticed a Sikh fan wearing a turban a few rows ahead.

    He was not wearing an Indian top or carrying India's flag. He was proudly wearing an England shirt with the name of his favourite player, Monty Panesar, on the back. Every time England took a wicket he jumped up from his seat to cheer.

    That did not go down well with some of the Indian fans. About five moved to some seats closer to him and began chanting "spot the sell-out". Another shouted "coconut" - a derogatory term that means you are brown on the outside but white inside. "


    When the authorites want Englishness/Britishness defined in as wishywashy terms as possible and simultaneously encourage immigrant communities to take pride in their 'own' culture it is probably inevitable that some within those immigrant communities will hate others who are more integrated for being more integrated.

    Another failure for the multicultural industry.

    And a society which feels itself split into numerous groups will struggle in the hard decades to come.


  • @ BenM

    Yada yada.

    A large number of people have left the public sector, alot have joined the private sector and alot of migrants and school leavers have joined the workforce. Overall effect - nothing much. It's not unemployment on the 'Labour Isn't Working' scale. Point is that we can and should cut at a steady pace and not worry about it causing mass unemployment.

    Likewise on health. A&E is struggling but overall we are a much healthier bunch than, say, the Americans for alot less health spending. Trimming NHS spending is not causing mass deaths or disasters. The mass deaths arose on Labour's watch - eg Stafford - and this is now getting some sunlight.

    You are a past master at seeking specific exceptions or failures to try to disprove a general trend.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    Mr. Richard, I read that the other day. It's a rather depressing article.
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    edited June 2013
    Patrick said:

    @ BenM

    Yada yada.

    .

    People suffering in A&E thanks to spending cuts, unemployment stubbornly high, and the response of the deluded Tory is "yada, yada".

    More evidence this appalling government needs to get its comeuppance in 2015.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704
    Since when is a 10 quid burger that newsworthy... pretty sure a meal in Mcdonalds costs about £6...not much difference.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559

    So Toff Rail is already £8bn over budget 6 years before they start building it.

    As I've said before its going to be nothing more than a London-Birmingham commuter route with the northern extensions cancelled because of 'surprise' cost overruns.

    The money then 'saved' will be spent on Crossrail 2.

    If it was really designed to help northern England wouldn't they start building it in the north?


    HS2 is puzzling, I can understand why some people might want to get out of Birmingham faster, but the other end is London. Why on earth would you want to spend more time there ? ;-)
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited June 2013

    Mick_Pork said:

    Millsy said:

    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.

    In general, I agree. But on this specific measure I think Osborne may have over-stretched. People who have just been thrown out of work cannot really be labelled idle scroungers. I think most reasonable voters will recognise that the ability to claim JSA when you have been made unemployed is not an incentive to get yourself the sack.

    It is counterproductive and crass
    which is why Balls will not commit to reverse it.....
    Precisely. The difference is he isn't the face of it and the toxic Osbrowne is.

    Small piece of advice since the PB tories just don't seem to grasp the politically obvious.
    As little Ed and Balls are busy triangulating on tory policies perhaps you should consider the purpose of that triangulation before continually reinforcing their message at every turn.

    If you still don't understand I can post a helpful reminder of the dangers of triangulation and the real reason why it's so stupid.

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Foreign investment in UK rises despite slump across rest of Europe
    UN figures suggest investors seeing Britain as haven for their money amid eurozone crisis

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/26/foreign-investment-uk-rises-europe

    I blame Osborne......
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    The Sun is being silly, of course, but so was whoever decided that tweeting the picture was a good way of countering the champers-and-foie-gras image. People respect authenticity and despise transparent PR stunts. Image massaging only works if the audience doesn't realise it's happening.

    What should worry the Tories more is that the CSR has had so little positive coverage - if it had done anything worthwhile, we wouldn't be debating burgers. And Southam Observer is right about the despicable 7 day stuff, kicking people at precisely their most vulnerable moment. Ed Balls struck a good note with the reference to Wonga but Labour really needs to stop equivocating on this one and oppose it outright. I get that we are not committing to stuff until about April 30 2015, but mood music matters too.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    I'm astonished no-one has attacked the English Heritage privatisation for creating yet another pseudo-charity wielding statutory powers, or is it only the RSPCA we object to when it prosecutes fine, upstanding citizens with links to the Prime Minister? At least Osborne had the sense to bung EH £80 million in recognition of the overlap between its supporters and his party's voters. £80 million should see it past 2015.
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    The technical double dip is likely going to be history after today's ONS revision.

    Although dip, flat, dip is nothing to write home about (although Osborne will try to make something of it no doubt).
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Foreign investment in UK rises despite slump across rest of Europe
    UN figures suggest investors seeing Britain as haven for their money amid eurozone crisis

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/26/foreign-investment-uk-rises-europe

    I blame Osborne......

    Austerity isn't working in the Eurozone either? Colour me gobsmacked.

  • RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    edited June 2013
    [Edited - I see the topic has already been covered.]
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,559
    edited June 2013
    tim said:

    Joe Watts ‏@JoeWatts_
    Cameron statement out: "I last ate a burger on April 14. It was a choice between a smaller burger and a larger one. I had the larger one."


    Hacks already speculating that Osborne lied about the delivery.
    Surely he won't have been that stupid.

    On the other hand Tony amused us with his changing palate where his favoutite food was fish and chips oop north but his taste buds changed south of the Trent and would only accept
    sun dried tomatoes in Islington.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,933
    edited June 2013
    "People respect authenticity and despise transparent PR stunts. Image massaging only works if the audience doesn't realise it's happening."

    Mr. Palmer, where's the lack of authenticity? He was eating a burger. He posted a picture of the burger.

    Mr. L, the eurozone is inherently screwed due to the insanity of trying to form a single currency which includes countries as varied in cultural, economic and size terms as Germany, Greece, Italy, Portugal, Spain and Poland.

    Edited extra bit: on Osborne, there's plenty of genuine grounds for criticism. This nonsense about a burger is not one of them.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263

    Since when is a 10 quid burger that newsworthy... pretty sure a meal in Mcdonalds costs about £6...not much difference.

    Not on this planet. I have a leaflet from my local McDonalds on the table in front of me - £1.99 for a Big Mac and fries.

    But it wouldn't matter in the least if it was £20 - Osborne is clearly not short of a bob or too and I don't care if he spends his dosh on burgers or Burberry coats or gambles it away at Aspers. The stupidity is in Ozzy's office making a point of it.

  • I know what Ben - let's just spend more, borrow more and hope all is well. I'm sure that's a low risk strategy.
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300

    Since when is a 10 quid burger that newsworthy... pretty sure a meal in Mcdonalds costs about £6...not much difference.

    Not much difference. Or, put another way, nearly twice the price. And it became newsworthy when -- and because -- GO had it tweeted.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 38,517

    So Toff Rail is already £8bn over budget 6 years before they start building it.

    As I've said before its going to be nothing more than a London-Birmingham commuter route with the northern extensions cancelled because of 'surprise' cost overruns.

    The money then 'saved' will be spent on Crossrail 2.

    If it was really designed to help northern England wouldn't they start building it in the north?

    As I've said before you are wrong.

    I don't know how many times I have to mention the concept of 'capacity' before people get it. The current network has seen large (massive?) growth in the last two decades in both passenger and freight, and it is creaking.

    There is only so much that can be done to the existing network to create more capacity (i.e. paths). It is made worse by the fact that freight trains mostly run at slower speeds (50/60/75 MPH) than passenger trains, meaning they use more paths. There are a few 100 MPH freight trains, but they have their own disadvantages in terms of track wear. A great deal of work was done at Derby in the 1960s/80s to work out the wheel/track dynamics for high-speed freight.

    We also need more stopping passenger services, which get in the way of high-speed non-stop services.

    A new high-speed route will free up many paths on the existing network for more freight and stopping passenger services. Failure to create more paths will lead to more local stations closing to make way for non-stop services, as happened after the ludicrously-handed WCML upgrade.

    A different view for you to peruse:
    http://hs2northwest.wordpress.com/
  • RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited June 2013
    @Jessop

    "Would you turn down the chance to make an ad for a burger chain, sweet manufacturer or fizzy drink company?"

    No of course not. I only refuse ads for political reasons (South African Airways once and a hair ad in Israel). I would though do a pro bono anti obesity ad. Perhaps encouraging all fast food outlets to have smaller entrances so the grossly overweight can't get in......

    Open on 20 stone woman trying to squeeze her way into Mcdonalds Party of schoolkids fall about laughing......Child's V.O Urghhhhh!
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,704

    Since when is a 10 quid burger that newsworthy... pretty sure a meal in Mcdonalds costs about £6...not much difference.

    Not on this planet. I have a leaflet from my local McDonalds on the table in front of me - £1.99 for a Big Mac and fries.

    But it wouldn't matter in the least if it was £20 - Osborne is clearly not short of a bob or too and I don't care if he spends his dosh on burgers or Burberry coats or gambles it away at Aspers. The stupidity is in Ozzy's office making a point of it.

    Not all burgers are the same Nick, a Big tasty at McDonalds (meal) costs well over a fiver..
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    @NickPalmer

    Ah .... bad news for NPEXMP .... sadly the latest ARSE projection has Broxtowe moving from "Too Close To Call" to "Lean" Conservative.

    Think Oz Labour Nick - No Change, No Chance.

    I'm always here for helpful advice Nick.
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    Patrick said:

    I know what Ben - let's just spend more, borrow more and hope all is well. I'm sure that's a low risk strategy.

    That's what Osborne has been doing despite the bluster.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540
    Nadine latest:

    Nadine Dorries is to stop claiming personal parliamentary expenses to avoid being further ‘targeted’ by investigations.

    Speaking exclusively to the Times & Citizen, the MP for Mid Bedfordshire revealed that she will forego around £3,040 a month in expenses including cash for Westminster accommodation, council tax, travel costs and meals.

    She said: “For me the problem is the moment I put my head above the parapet and campaigned to have the abortion limit reduced from 24 weeks to 20 I became a target.”

    She added: “Even though I’m completely innocent it’s tough for my office staff because they are the ones who are responsible for compliance.

    http://www.bedfordtoday.co.uk/news/local/exclusive-nadine-i-ll-work-for-free-1-5226386
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    Since when is a 10 quid burger that newsworthy... pretty sure a meal in Mcdonalds costs about £6...not much difference.

    Not much difference. Or, put another way, nearly twice the price. And it became newsworthy when -- and because -- GO had it tweeted.
    The point isn't the burger. The point is that the Sun feels it has to put the boot in to George Osborne even though they like a lot of his policies. Instead of praising him for his benefit crackdown - and asking for more - they have to find a way of going after him because he is so toxic with their readers.
  • @JosiasJessop
    That is all very well. One is still left with the impression that AR is right insofar as if HS2 were about benefiting the north, then construction would not be set to start in the south.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,263
    JackW said:

    @NickPalmer

    Ah .... bad news for NPEXMP .... sadly the latest ARSE projection has Broxtowe moving from "Too Close To Call" to "Lean" Conservative.

    Think Oz Labour Nick - No Change, No Chance.

    I'm always here for helpful advice Nick.

    In that case, Jack, you should plunge at Ladbrokes. You can get 3.75 on the Tories holding Broxtowe. (Labour is 1.33, UKIP 34, LDs 101)
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    Burgergate may have backfired on the "man of the people" front but was it actually intended not for that purpose at all but to give the impression George Osborne is working around the clock? Was this PR stunt a reaction to previous criticism of the Chancellor gallivanting around Washington?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,540

    . And Southam Observer is right about the despicable 7 day stuff, kicking people at precisely their most vulnerable moment. Ed Balls struck a good note with the reference to Wonga but Labour really needs to stop equivocating on this one and oppose it outright. I get that we are not committing to stuff until about April 30 2015, but mood music matters too.

    I agree that Labour's position is craven - the sums involved are likely to be manageable and its perfectly possible to strike a principled position on behalf of "job hunters" while taking some flak about "skivers" (a Labour term, before anyone starts)...... And yet, the two Eds will not - stunning, given Osborne is so crap at politics....

  • MillsyMillsy Posts: 900

    Millsy said:

    @SouthamObserver

    Whether you agree or not all that stuff on welfare and public sector workers will be popular with many people. Right wing populism is just as discomfiting as left wing populism.

    In general, I agree. But on this specific measure I think Osborne may have over-stretched. People who have just been thrown out of work cannot really be labelled idle scroungers. I think most reasonable voters will recognise that the ability to claim JSA when you have been made unemployed is not an incentive to get yourself the sack.

    Osborne's point is that if you do lose your job the first thing to do might be to look for a job rather than find the nearest job centre. But maybe these austere times isn't the best moment to be doing this sort of tinkering.
  • RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    Patrick is right: the big news is just how comprehensively Osborne has won the argument. It's a complete sea-change from 2010, when deficit denial was still a mainstream position amongst many people. There are no deficit-deniers left (well, just BenM and Paul Krugman). This bodes very well for getting the political consensus needed to complete the job of getting our public finances back into sanity.
  • Blue_rogBlue_rog Posts: 2,019

    The Sun is being silly, of course, but so was whoever decided that tweeting the picture was a good way of countering the champers-and-foie-gras image. People respect authenticity and despise transparent PR stunts. Image massaging only works if the audience doesn't realise it's happening.

    What should worry the Tories more is that the CSR has had so little positive coverage - if it had done anything worthwhile, we wouldn't be debating burgers. And Southam Observer is right about the despicable 7 day stuff, kicking people at precisely their most vulnerable moment. Ed Balls struck a good note with the reference to Wonga but Labour really needs to stop equivocating on this one and oppose it outright. I get that we are not committing to stuff until about April 30 2015, but mood music matters too.

    It's the Beeching effect. Artificially create a situation then point to it as being the "truth" then act on the "truth". The fact that the CSR hasn't been commented on much is that the 'loyal' opposition is in agreement with it and therefore there's no conflict to report. An 11 minute rebuttal for a 50 minute speech says it all!
  • Patrick is right: the big news is just how comprehensively Osborne has won the argument. It's a complete sea-change from 2010, when deficit denial was still a mainstream position amongst many people. There are no deficit-deniers left (well, just BenM and Paul Krugman). This bodes very well for getting the political consensus needed to complete the job of getting our public finances back into sanity.

    It's bizarre then that this new consensus against "deficit denial" has resulted in such little progress in actually reducing the fiscal deficit, with no reduction at all between 2011-2012 and 2013-2014, despite all the rhetoric and a degree of economic expansion.

This discussion has been closed.