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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Farron’s speech was pretty well received but what a mountai

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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013
    Leeds NW is a classic example of a middle class urban seat which was once safe for the Conservatives but which has been shifting relentlessly leftwards over the course of a generation (Leeds NE is similar). I wouldn't be surprised at all if Labour took it next time. Leeds NE is now a very safe seat for Labour.
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    I suspect Dave will go for the nuclear option and appoint 300 Tory life peers.

    Good luck TSE!
    Thanks, I've just read Lord Sewel won't be charged with anything

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34328196
    Only learnt today his near-namesake Brian Sewell (two Ls) died at the weekend.

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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Lolz

    Jim Pickard
    Stears in NS on Corbyn-mania: "It is not what any of my political scientist colleagues would describe as "orthodox vote-seeking behaviour."
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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-34337965

    Lucky Robinson has already resigned as FM?
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    Lennon said:

    I'm amazed he's still an MP and not a eurocrat - does anyone know why? He seems ideally suited it and would fit right in.

    Has Clegg given any indication as to whether he'll stay on in 2020? I can't see why he'd want to frankly.

    My understanding is that he would, but doesn't want to lose the Lib Dems a seat (which is likely in a by-election scenario)
    I don't see how one more makes it much worse.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    OMG

    Press Association
    Over 1,000 women recorded having their genitals mutilated in three months, NHS figures show http://t.co/UodZg08emZ http://t.co/g6ySKm74nm
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    LennonLennon Posts: 1,737

    Lennon said:

    I'm amazed he's still an MP and not a eurocrat - does anyone know why? He seems ideally suited it and would fit right in.

    Has Clegg given any indication as to whether he'll stay on in 2020? I can't see why he'd want to frankly.

    My understanding is that he would, but doesn't want to lose the Lib Dems a seat (which is likely in a by-election scenario)
    I don't see how one more makes it much worse.
    Not sure any party would willingly lose over 12% of their MP's unnecessarily?
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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    edited September 2015
    The Pope makes a speech in the White House..where he arrived by private jet..with his massive entourage...about climate change..The climate change which he claims is man made..The same Pope who exhorts the poorer people of the world to make more babies..What a Dork..
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    Just had a quick look at the impact of boundaries on the LDs' top 10 target seats:

    Cambridge needs to lose 6-8k voters and it depends which ward is removed. Taking out Cherry Hinton would flip this back to the LDs but taking out Trumpington would increase Lab's majority

    Eastbourne is likely to be no change.

    Lewes - is likely to lose LD-friendly Newhaven to Brighton Kemptown and gain some unfriendly wards from Wealden district. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Thornbury - all the S Gloucestershire seats are undersized. At least 10k voters have to be added and the LDs did badly in both Filton and Kingswood. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Twickenham - is likely to be no change.

    East Dunbartonshire needs to add 10k voters. The most likely additions would be the E Dunbartonshire wards in Cumbernauld. This would make it safer for the SNP

    Kingston - is likely to be no change.

    St Ives - needs 10k voters adding from the Camborne seat where the LDs did badly last time. Likely to make it safer for Con

    Edinburgh W - needs a few k extra votes. Can be done by assigning split wards to this constituency. Marginally safer for the SNP

    Torbay - is likely to be no change.
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    Lennon said:

    Lennon said:

    I'm amazed he's still an MP and not a eurocrat - does anyone know why? He seems ideally suited it and would fit right in.

    Has Clegg given any indication as to whether he'll stay on in 2020? I can't see why he'd want to frankly.

    My understanding is that he would, but doesn't want to lose the Lib Dems a seat (which is likely in a by-election scenario)
    I don't see how one more makes it much worse.
    Not sure any party would willingly lose over 12% of their MP's unnecessarily?
    Well, they did lose a whopping 86% of their MPs in May! :lol:
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,251

    OMG

    Press Association
    Over 1,000 women recorded having their genitals mutilated in three months, NHS figures show http://t.co/UodZg08emZ http://t.co/g6ySKm74nm

    If the NHS has these details then, presumably, they have the details of the girls/women involved, the names of their parents, their home addresses etc. So why aren't the authorities taking steps such as, for instance, making those girls and any sisters wards of court, interviewing the parents about when/where the mutilation happened etc.

    The point about collecting statistic, after all, s is not to collect them but to use them to take action. They are telling you a story and the story in this case is a horrible one.

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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,026

    The Pope makes a speech in the White House..where he arrived by private jet..with his massive entourage...about climate change..The climate change which he claims is man made..The same Pope who exhorts the poorer people of the world to make more babies..What a Dork..

    Bit like Al Gore, then :D
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited September 2015
    Has this been posted yet?:

    https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/09/22/eu-referendum-state-public-opinion/

    The most popular argument for leaving the EU is that money spent on Europe could be better spent on British public services - ranks slightly ahead of controlling immigration. There's huge potential for the OUTers to weave an anti-austerity message into their pitch.
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    @GarethoftheVale2 - Many thanks for that.

    So, in summary, the net result is that the boundary review is probably going to mean that the LibDems start from a notional position which is 3 or 4 seats down on the current 8.
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    Just had a quick look at the impact of boundaries on the LDs' top 10 target seats:

    Cambridge needs to lose 6-8k voters and it depends which ward is removed. Taking out Cherry Hinton would flip this back to the LDs but taking out Trumpington would increase Lab's majority

    Eastbourne is likely to be no change.

    Lewes - is likely to lose LD-friendly Newhaven to Brighton Kemptown and gain some unfriendly wards from Wealden district. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Thornbury - all the S Gloucestershire seats are undersized. At least 10k voters have to be added and the LDs did badly in both Filton and Kingswood. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Twickenham - is likely to be no change.

    East Dunbartonshire needs to add 10k voters. The most likely additions would be the E Dunbartonshire wards in Cumbernauld. This would make it safer for the SNP

    Kingston - is likely to be no change.

    St Ives - needs 10k voters adding from the Camborne seat where the LDs did badly last time. Likely to make it safer for Con

    Edinburgh W - needs a few k extra votes. Can be done by assigning split wards to this constituency. Marginally safer for the SNP

    Torbay - is likely to be no change.

    Won't all these (and the ones they already hold) be likely to be affected by the knock-on effects from other constituencies? So even if they don't need to change themselves, they could still end up doing so because of the needs of those next door or even further down the line?
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    john_zimsjohn_zims Posts: 3,399
    @Sean_F

    'One can identify a Labour core vote; a Conservative core vote; even a UKIP core vote. But, I don't know what group can now be said to constitute the Lib Dem core vote.'

    The activists in the hall in Bournemouth ?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @BBCBreaking: #Volkswagen Chief Executive Martin Winterkorn quits after company rocked by emissions scandal http://t.co/ULiwm9Eojc http://t.co/3KWYR2pheQ
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    isamisam Posts: 41,043

    rcs1000 said:

    An interesting series of three tweets by Rafael Behr:

    Criticism of Farron migration line based on distance from mainstream public opinion mistakes his strategy. He's pitching to people who feel like dissenters from mainstream on liberal issues like this. If Daily Mail does double-page spread attacking him as open-door, bleeding-heart, foreigner-loving softie, that's a comms win in his eyes.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/live/2015/sep/23/tim-farrons-speech-to-the-lib-dem-conference-politics-live

    I think that's right. Farron is not aiming for 25% or even 18%. He is seeing if he can take the LibDems from 8% to 12%. His actions need to be seen in that light.

    Well he wont attract any ex BNPers , they have moved en block to UKIP ! Rather squeezes the LD's !
    http://www.samaritans.org/
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    Just had a quick look at the impact of boundaries on the LDs' top 10 target seats:

    Cambridge needs to lose 6-8k voters and it depends which ward is removed. Taking out Cherry Hinton would flip this back to the LDs but taking out Trumpington would increase Lab's majority

    Eastbourne is likely to be no change.

    Lewes - is likely to lose LD-friendly Newhaven to Brighton Kemptown and gain some unfriendly wards from Wealden district. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Thornbury - all the S Gloucestershire seats are undersized. At least 10k voters have to be added and the LDs did badly in both Filton and Kingswood. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Twickenham - is likely to be no change.

    East Dunbartonshire needs to add 10k voters. The most likely additions would be the E Dunbartonshire wards in Cumbernauld. This would make it safer for the SNP

    Kingston - is likely to be no change.

    St Ives - needs 10k voters adding from the Camborne seat where the LDs did badly last time. Likely to make it safer for Con

    Edinburgh W - needs a few k extra votes. Can be done by assigning split wards to this constituency. Marginally safer for the SNP

    Torbay - is likely to be no change.

    Won't all these (and the ones they already hold) be likely to be affected by the knock-on effects from other constituencies? So even if they don't need to change themselves, they could still end up doing so because of the needs of those next door or even further down the line?
    I suppose that is definitely possible in London. There should be a lot less change in the South outside of London as in many areas most of the constituencies are the right size e.g. Berkshire and Surrey will probably see negligible change.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @OliverCooper: Corbyn says Labour MPs will be forced to compete for reselection if Conference approves it. Countdown to the #purge. http://t.co/Yn1qTjdidZ
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013
    Following on from my last post, quite a lot of seats have moved Leftwards since 1992. The Conservatives have lost 10 seats in Scotland. Edmonton, Ilford North and South, Enfield North, Croydon North, Mitcham & Morden, Ealing Acton, Brentford & Isleworth, Hayes & Harlington, Harrow West, Brent North, Westminster North, Eltham, Chorley, Lancashire West, Leeds NE and NW, Sheffield Hallam, Bristol West, Chester, Bury South, Bolton NE, Birmingham Edgbaston, Hall Green, Yardley, Brighton Pavilion, Hove, Lancaster & Fleetwood, Dewsbury, Luton North & South, Slough, Southampton Test, Gedling, Exeter, Tynemouth, Wirral South, Wirral West, Blackpool South, Southport, Crosby, Middlesborough South, Wolverhampton SW have all gone, some beyond recovery. That's 53 seats.

    In addition, seats like Croydon Central, Brighton Kemptown, Enfield Southgate, Harrow East, Chipping Barnet, Hendon, Finchley & Golders Green are much more marginal than they used to be.

    So, how are the Conservatives only down 5 seats on 1992? They've won a handful that were held by the Lib Dems and Labour, but mostly their gains are driven by population increase in Conservative-voting areas creating new constituencies, while population falls (or stagnation) are cutting the numbers of seats in left-wing areas.
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    JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    Danny565 said:

    Has this been posted yet?:

    https://yougov.co.uk/news/2015/09/22/eu-referendum-state-public-opinion/

    The most popular argument for leaving the EU is that money spent on Europe could be better spent on British public services - ranks slightly ahead of controlling immigration. There's huge potential for the OUTers to weave an anti-austerity message into their pitch.

    I also note that Leave leads among Conservatives. If dishonest Remain arguments are used, or ones that unravel after the referendum, it will destroy the party.

    It's also interesting that the soft Remain group find leave arguments much more convincing than the soft Leave group find remain arguments.

    This will be a very fine run thing.

    An excellent set of polling questions though. Well done YouGov.
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    Dan Hodges ‏@DPJHodges 3 mins3 minutes ago

    If mandatory reselection goes through it will send signal even Tom Watson can't mitigate Corbynite excesses, and that will be a big deal...
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    I can't 'wait' for Labour conference.....
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    Dan Hodges ‏@DPJHodges 3 mins3 minutes ago

    If mandatory reselection goes through it will send signal even Tom Watson can't mitigate Corbynite excesses, and that will be a big deal...

    I am sure that loyal, hard-working MPs will see this as nothing more than a rubber stamping exercise.
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    HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    Sean_F said:

    Following on from my last post, quite a lot of seats have moved Leftwards since 1992. The Conservatives have lost 10 seats in Scotland. Edmonton, Ilford North and South, Enfield North, Croydon North, Mitcham & Morden, Ealing Acton, Brentford & Isleworth, Hayes & Harlington, Harrow West, Brent North, Westminster North, Eltham, Chorley, Lancashire West, Leeds NE and NW, Sheffield Hallam, Bristol West, Chester, Bury South, Bolton NE, Birmingham Edgbaston, Hall Green, Yardley, Brighton Pavilion, Hove, Lancaster & Fleetwood, Dewsbury, Luton North & South, Slough, Southampton Test, Gedling, Exeter, Tynemouth, Wirral South, Wirral West, Blackpool South, Southport, Crosby, Middlesborough South, Wolverhampton SW have all gone, some beyond recovery. That's 53 seats.

    In addition, seats like Croydon Central, Brighton Kemptown, Enfield Southgate, Harrow East, Chipping Barnet, Hendon, Finchley & Golders Green are much more marginal than they used to be.

    So, how are the Conservatives only down 5 seats on 1992? They've won a handful that were held by the Lib Dems and Labour, but mostly their gains are driven by population increase in Conservative-voting areas creating new constituencies, while population falls (or stagnation) are cutting the numbers of seats in left-wing areas.

    Is that the same as saying that seats are changing hands because of population movements rather than existing populations changing their minds about who they prefer? If so you need to be careful about about posting stuff like that on here because it comes close to saying *looks around to see who is listening and then whispers*, "white flight".
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    Sean_F said:

    Leeds NW is a classic example of a middle class urban seat which was once safe for the Conservatives but which has been shifting relentlessly leftwards over the course of a generation (Leeds NE is similar). I wouldn't be surprised at all if Labour took it next time. Leeds NE is now a very safe seat for Labour.

    lt has one of the biggest student populations in the country; over a quarter of the electorate...
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Dan Hodges ‏@DPJHodges 3 mins3 minutes ago

    If mandatory reselection goes through it will send signal even Tom Watson can't mitigate Corbynite excesses, and that will be a big deal...

    I am sure that loyal, hard-working MPs will see this as nothing more than a rubber stamping exercise.
    The idea from some of these Labour MPs that they have a divine right to remain an MP forevermore without any accountability to activists is baffling.

    I didn't even vote for Corbyn, but I would want my MP to be deselected if he started routinely voting with the Tories on things like Syria, welfare, etc.
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    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    edited September 2015
    new thread
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    isam said:
    I'm not a better, and I haven't really considered this before. However that seems both simple and, as you say, shrewd. An upset/shock creates stories and hype, meaning people will jump in on the side that caused the shock in the next game. However the story is because it is a shock and against usual form. The value is then in opposing what most others are doing and go for the team that you'd usually expect to win.

    Is that right?
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    Is mandatory reselection on the cards for Labour? I thought it had been ruled out?
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    SR...A rubber stamping exercise..Oh Yea...
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    Winterkorn's done an Ed Miliband.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34340997
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    Sean_F said:

    runnymede said:

    Nice core vote speech...shame the core vote is only 5% or so

    One can identify a Labour core vote; a Conservative core vote; even a UKIP core vote. But, I don't know what group can now be said to constitute the Lib Dem core vote.
    The mentally disturbed.
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    BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    JEO said:

    The only problem the Liberal Democrats have is that they don't really stand up for their signature issue: liberalism. As Farron said today, he seems to think liberalism is being "open", "united", "inclusive", and otherwise nice to people.

    That's not what liberalism is. Liberalism is believing in free speech, democratic governance, the rule of law, the free press and free markets. When was the last time we heard the Liberal Democrats stand up against encroachments against any of those?

    Total agree,

    Liberal means: 'of and pertaining to Freedom' and that means standing up for freedom min all its forms social and economic, freedom of speech, freedom of association, freedom of belief, freedom of contracture, and so on. It means the government stepping back and not trying to compel somebody to do or not to do something.

    some of these things can appear to have some negative first order down sides, free speech means that other people have the right to say things that may offend or upset us, and so on. but A liberal thinks that this is a price worth paying becomes it is much better than starting down a slippery slope to authoritarianism. And prevents the government from being a tool that can be captured (metaphorically) and be used to protect, and expand the interests of a special interests.

    Some were along the line, the word has been twisted and now the LD and people who clame to be liberal, don't seem to understand what it means, and there for can not stand up for it.

    In many cases real liberals are rationale, and compassionate, and make there arguments case by case. Perhaps this has attracted other people who may agree on one or to things, normally legalisation of drugs, but who don't take the time to understand the philosophy, and think that liberalism just means being 'nice'. as a result they bring there other prejudices and 'do gooding authoritarian streak' with them in to a movement where they should not be.

    While the Orange Book LD seemed to be returning to real liberalism, I'm not shore they are driving the party any more.
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    John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    BigRich said:

    JEO said:

    The only problem the Liberal Democrats have is that they don't really stand up for their signature issue: liberalism. As Farron said today, he seems to think liberalism is being "open", "united", "inclusive", and otherwise nice to people.

    That's not what liberalism is. Liberalism is believing in free speech, democratic governance, the rule of law, the free press and free markets. When was the last time we heard the Liberal Democrats stand up against encroachments against any of those?

    Total agree,

    Liberal means: 'of and pertaining to Freedom' and that means standing up for freedom min all its forms social and economic, freedom of speech, freedom of association, freedom of belief, freedom of contracture, and so on. It means the government stepping back and not trying to compel somebody to do or not to do something.

    some of these things can appear to have some negative first order down sides, free speech means that other people have the right to say things that may offend or upset us, and so on. but A liberal thinks that this is a price worth paying becomes it is much better than starting down a slippery slope to authoritarianism. And prevents the government from being a tool that can be captured (metaphorically) and be used to protect, and expand the interests of a special interests.

    Some were along the line, the word has been twisted and now the LD and people who clame to be liberal, don't seem to understand what it means, and there for can not stand up for it.

    In many cases real liberals are rationale, and compassionate, and make there arguments case by case. Perhaps this has attracted other people who may agree on one or to things, normally legalisation of drugs, but who don't take the time to understand the philosophy, and think that liberalism just means being 'nice'. as a result they bring there other prejudices and 'do gooding authoritarian streak' with them in to a movement where they should not be.

    While the Orange Book LD seemed to be returning to real liberalism, I'm not shore they are driving the party any more.
    I should be a Liberal. I can't be a Liberal Democrat; they're like Labour; mis-named.
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    Just had a quick look at the impact of boundaries on the LDs' top 10 target seats:

    Cambridge needs to lose 6-8k voters and it depends which ward is removed. Taking out Cherry Hinton would flip this back to the LDs but taking out Trumpington would increase Lab's majority

    Eastbourne is likely to be no change.

    Lewes - is likely to lose LD-friendly Newhaven to Brighton Kemptown and gain some unfriendly wards from Wealden district. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Thornbury - all the S Gloucestershire seats are undersized. At least 10k voters have to be added and the LDs did badly in both Filton and Kingswood. This is likely to increase the Con maj

    Twickenham - is likely to be no change.

    East Dunbartonshire needs to add 10k voters. The most likely additions would be the E Dunbartonshire wards in Cumbernauld. This would make it safer for the SNP

    Kingston - is likely to be no change.

    St Ives - needs 10k voters adding from the Camborne seat where the LDs did badly last time. Likely to make it safer for Con

    Edinburgh W - needs a few k extra votes. Can be done by assigning split wards to this constituency. Marginally safer for the SNP

    Torbay - is likely to be no change.

    A bigger electorate always makes it harder for smaller parties to defeat the two big parties.

    This because the default is for voters to vote for one of the two big parties and smaller parties have to work extra hard to establish a big enough position to get a majority. Where the two big parties have similar support is the best chance for a smaller party to sneak in.
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