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  • Ed Miliband jets off on holiday to avoid endorsing any of the leadership candidates. Sums him up totally and to think he wanted to lead the Country.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591

    Extract from the leadership rules:

    "No candidates or persons acting on behalf of a candidate will use their own material, access to publicity or any media outlets to disparage or brief against any other candidate."

    Mandleson plan by rule breaking

    Sounds as if no candidate can make the finish line then!
    Jezza has run a positive campaign.
    Yes he has. It's a lot easier to run a positive campaign when chunks of your supporters will happily throw massive amounts of bile at your opponents with no direction from you needed whatsoever, it takes the burden off. Enthusiastic amateurs always do it best.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Tristram Hunt on Newsnight shortly.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903

    twitter.com/benrileysmith/status/633379833913966592

    I suggest 'Ed Stone' as a character for SeanT in his next book. Pretty mean and hard as granite.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Speaking of lecturing from Blairites..... Tristram Hunt is about to be interviewed on Newsnight to swing some more votes Jezza's way.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    MTimT said:

    @ Cyclefree. Re our discussion yesterday, I did know one Philosophy student at Bristol. I forget his name, but he looked like a blue-eyed Jesus and fancied himself as an aesthete. Wonder if you can work out who it was based on that sketchy description! :)

    Good heavens! I shall have a proper think. There's one person who might fit the description. If it is indeed the same person he made a pass at me to the soundtrack of Blondie's "Denis, Denis". But, TBH, he sounds like the sort of person I'd have crossed the street to avoid. I was a bit of a punk then.....
  • AndyJS said:

    I was born overseas - but so what? I' m a UK Citizen, and have been resident here since I was four months old (early 1976).

    Was it a deliberate decision for you to be born overseas? (No offence intended).
    No, my mother went back to India to care for my sick grandad (he had a stroke during 1975) while she was pregnant with me. He outlived my birth by only a few weeks.

    As for first entering the country - probably Heathrow rather than Calais!
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    Possibly he is too much of an admirer of Napoleon to write well about him. The biography by Philip Dwyer is good.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2015
    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    Mr Palmer says- ''I wonder what Cooper's 2nd preferences are doing. I know she's called for them to go to Burnham, but the current spat makes that seem less certain.''
    lf Labour had a sensible system of voting in rounds then they would know at each round who would be last and dropped out. There would be no need for second guessing just first voting.
  • Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
  • JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    What is wrong with some people?

    http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2015/08/muslim-majority-school-to-integrate-genders-despite-protests-from-parents

    A Muslim-majority, non-faith school is to integrate boys' and girls' classes for the first time, after being placed in special measures by Ofsted.

    The Crest Academies in Brent, a secular, non-denominational school which has previously taught the genders separately, has faced protests from parents after the headteacher announced plans to teach boys and girls together as part of his bid to turn the failing school around.
  • twitter.com/benrileysmith/status/633379833913966592

    I suggest 'Ed Stone' as a character for SeanT in his next book. Pretty mean and hard as granite.
    What's Ed Miliband's favourite rail station in London?

    'Eadstone Lane* :)


    * on the Euston to Watford DC Line, for those curious :)
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited August 2015

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.

    Do you think [name] has what it takes to be a good PM?

    Boris Johnson - 32%
    Theresa May - 28%
    Andy Burnham - 27%
    George Osborne - 23%
    Yvette Cooper - 22%
    Jeremy Corbyn - 17%
    Liz Kendall - 16%
    Michael Gove - 13%

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline-part-two.pdf

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline.pdf
  • From The Times, one in six voters in the Labour leadership election are members of Unite

    The Times has also seen data, collated by Labour’s compliance unit and disseminated to the leadership campaign teams last Friday, that revealed the breakdown of the trade unions to which affiliated voters and some party members, belong.

    It revealed that more than half the 189,703 affiliated voters signed up to vote in the ballot, along with at least 6.4 per cent of the party’s 299,755 members, are Unite members.
    Overall, Unite members comprise more than 18 per cent of the 610,753 people signed up.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.
    And they voted to achieve just that in May. Oh wait.......

  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Cyclefree said:

    Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.
    And they voted to achieve just that in May. Oh wait.......

    They voted for Cameron over Miliband in May (as predicted consistently by "best PM" polls for the previous 5 years).
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.

    Do you think [name] has what it takes to be a good PM?

    Boris Johnson - 32%
    Theresa May - 28%
    Andy Burnham - 27%
    George Osborne - 23%
    Yvette Cooper - 22%
    Jeremy Corbyn - 17%
    Liz Kendall - 16%
    Michael Gove - 13%

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline-part-two.pdf

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline.pdf
    What's the direction of travel? I'd be interested to know if the public's view of Osborne as a potential PM is increasing, as the commentariat's predictions of him becoming PM have certainly increased.
  • Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.

    Do you think [name] has what it takes to be a good PM?

    Boris Johnson - 32%
    Theresa May - 28%
    Andy Burnham - 27%
    George Osborne - 23%
    Yvette Cooper - 22%
    Jeremy Corbyn - 17%
    Liz Kendall - 16%
    Michael Gove - 13%

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline-part-two.pdf

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline.pdf
    Apples and oranges.

    One is in opposition, whilst the other is in government as Chancellor and has been delivering austerity since 2010.

    Why do you think only 4% more prefer Burnham to Osborne?
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    Danny565 said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.
    And they voted to achieve just that in May. Oh wait.......

    They voted for Cameron over Miliband in May (as predicted consistently by "best PM" polls for the previous 5 years).
    Thanks. I hadn't realised.

  • Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.

    Do you think [name] has what it takes to be a good PM?

    Boris Johnson - 32%
    Theresa May - 28%
    Andy Burnham - 27%
    George Osborne - 23%
    Yvette Cooper - 22%
    Jeremy Corbyn - 17%
    Liz Kendall - 16%
    Michael Gove - 13%

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline-part-two.pdf

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline.pdf
    Apples and oranges.

    One is in opposition, whilst the other is in government as Chancellor and has been delivering austerity since 2010.

    Why do you think only 4% more prefer Burnham to Osborne?
    Naught but PB Tory Propaganda!
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    Dear darling Mr Nabavi, you say ''how can we know how the £3 vote-baggers and union affiliates are leaning?''
    They are leaning left (that's 'Left!') to a gravity defying degree.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.

    Do you think [name] has what it takes to be a good PM?

    Boris Johnson - 32%
    Theresa May - 28%
    Andy Burnham - 27%
    George Osborne - 23%
    Yvette Cooper - 22%
    Jeremy Corbyn - 17%
    Liz Kendall - 16%
    Michael Gove - 13%

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline-part-two.pdf

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline.pdf
    Apples and oranges.

    One is in opposition, whilst the other is in government as Chancellor and has been delivering austerity since 2010.

    Why do you think only 4% more prefer Burnham to Osborne?
    I'm just bemused by this view that Osborne-led Tories would be unbeatable in 2020, when on the basis of that poll the public views the prospect of him being PM with....something less than full enthusiasm.
  • Dear darling Mr Nabavi, you say ''how can we know how the £3 vote-baggers and union affiliates are leaning?''
    They are leaning left (that's 'Left!') to a gravity defying degree.

    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/632950671420096512
    https://twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/632948421805113344
  • SeanT said:

    MikeK said:

    SeanT said:

    SeanT said:

    JWisemann said:

    Okay, so arming Islamic fundamentalists across a quarter of the globe is realpolitik, chatting to a nutter at a function in aid of oppressed people is tantamount to being Hitler. Of course.

    Ah, Mister Smithson, with this you are spoiling us!

    SeanT said:


    That said the single most impressive Italian I've met recently - a world ski jump champion who also knew more history than most academics - yearned for a return of a Mussolini, to sort all the problems.

    Did he think colonial humiliation, recurring military defeat, invasion & occupation by both allies & enemies and a ubiquitous (if slightly unfair) reputation for martial cowardice was worth it just to get a few commies jailed and the trains to run on time?
    If Fascist Italy had just chosen the poet Gabriele d'Annunzio as leader (as nearly happened) rather than the oafish Mussolini, all would have been well.

    I wrote about d'Annunzio for Das Torygraf

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/seanthomas/100253258/this-man-was-a-sadomasochist-drug-addict-fearless-pilot-and-politician-only-in-italy/

    G d'Annunzio is my favourite politician EVAH. Possibly my favourite single person.
    D'Annunzio is certainly a fascinating character, far more so than Musso. I've had Lucy Hughes-Hallet's bio by my bed since Christmas, must get down to it. Bit off reading lately.
    It's possibly the best biography I've read since Ellmann's Joyce. Which is enormous praise. As that is perhaps the best literary biography ever.

    Of course Hughes-Hallett had much better material to work with, but good luck to her. She chose well.

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.
    Andrew Roberts' Napoleon starts well but languishes after the early Italian campaigns. Pity, it could have been a good book.
    Yes that's my sense. It's like he was over-invested in his subject, too much the admirer, and too full of his thesis (Napoleon the Great!) to be more daring and interesting. Also his prose is just a tiny bit inert, in this book (I hear much praise of his other books)

    TBH tho I rarely read great books in any genre, these days (think I've just read too much, and now prefer TV and movies). Granite Island by Dorothy Carrington is brilliant, however, as is Tracks by Robyn Davidson. Both read this year and written decades ago.
    Did you see Roberts' TV series?
  • Danny565 said:

    Danny565 said:

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Burnham is crap and pathetic, yet the public would still prefer him to be PM than Osborne.

    Do you think [name] has what it takes to be a good PM?

    Boris Johnson - 32%
    Theresa May - 28%
    Andy Burnham - 27%
    George Osborne - 23%
    Yvette Cooper - 22%
    Jeremy Corbyn - 17%
    Liz Kendall - 16%
    Michael Gove - 13%

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline-part-two.pdf

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/Assets/Docs/Polls/political-monitor-july-2015-topline.pdf
    Apples and oranges.

    One is in opposition, whilst the other is in government as Chancellor and has been delivering austerity since 2010.

    Why do you think only 4% more prefer Burnham to Osborne?
    I'm just bemused by this view that Osborne-led Tories would be unbeatable in 2020, when on the basis of that poll the public views the prospect of him being PM with....something less than full enthusiasm.
    Just look at the direction of travel, Osborne's star is in the ascendant

    From July 2014

    Just under one in five (18%) agree for George Osborne, with 61% disagree with what it takes to be PM.

    So in a year, the changes +5 that agree he has what it takes to be PM, and a fall in 8% that disagree.

    So a 13% net change in a year
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051

    Yvette Cooper: Andy Burnham is too similar to Jeremy Corbyn and must step aside.
    Well they are both men one was favourite and is now an outsider
    LOL Kendall too similar to Cooper who steps aside?
    Cooper loses any chance of 2nd place with this kind of Bollox IMO

    I've just heard Cooper on the News (her voice seemed almost to be breaking before she regained some control and heaven forbid she seemed to be blinking a lot) - anyway - she said she did not know what Burnham stood for anymore as his opinions changed so much. Incredibly cutting. At the death - when its all too late - the race is hotting up.
    From what I saw of Burnham he looked totally weak and pathetic. A perfect rabbit caught in the headlights.
    I'm coming to the conclusion that Strictly Come Dancing might have been a better format for this leadership election.
    Andy Burnham is one of the crappest and most over-promoted MPs we have today. I can't stand him, he's crap and he only just scraped fourth last time over Diane Abbott.

    The idea he is being pushed as the "credible PM" in this contest shows just how pathetic the Labour contenders are.
    Danny565 is absolutely right and Comres confirmed it on Sunday with Burnham the only one of the 4 contendors in positive territory. I have voted for Burnham today as he is clearly the most electable in my view, but Labour will make their own choice. In 2010 David Miliband was the most electable, but he is not on the ballot!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    On what world is Burnham too similar to Corbyn?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051

    Hard to see beyond the bluffs and double-bluffs, but the claim from Cooper's camp that she's getting 60% of Burnham's 2nd preferences sounds pretty grim for the ABC people if Burnham comes 3rd - I can't see more than 5-10% of Burnham's 2nds going to Kendall, so that means Corbyn is getting a third of them.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/aug/17/labour-leadership-andy-burnham-yvette-cooper-contest

    I wonder what Cooper's 2nd preferences are doing. I know she's called for them to go to Burnham, but the current spat makes that seem less certain.

    I put Cooper last, behind Kendall and Corbyn, she offers nothing either to floating voters, Scotland or Labour's core, even Corbyn would be a better bet!
  • JEOJEO Posts: 3,656
    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    edited August 2015
    Very good piece on the FT on Cameron from Janan Ganesh, who I generally find to be a very good writer, whatever he's talking about and whether or not I agree with it. I feel like Cameron, who is not exceptional, has been underestimated by both sides, though there is some sense that is changing. A few snippets:

    A party with a good frontman or woman can afford to get everything else wrong, and probably will not. Most other variables — policy, strategy, organisation — flow from the leader...

    The resignation of Mr Cameron as prime minister before 2020 will change politics more than anyone seems to appreciate, including his own Tories, who tend to assume he is eminently replaceable, and the many Labour MPs who privately write off the next election...

    Because of his outward banality, the vanilla sheen that says “Son-in-law of the Year”, we have Mr Cameron down as fortunate rather than inspired. Yet in May he added to his vote share and parliamentary seats, a rare enough feat for an incumbent that is all the more remarkable for being preceded by five years of stringent fiscal policy...

    Mr Cameron also normalises the abnormal. He makes a government of unsettling ambition seem middle-of-the-road...It is precisely his reputation as an unromantic problem-solver that allows the government to take risks. Voters trust the Tories not to go too far as long as he is at the top.


    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/0884c558-44ca-11e5-b3b2-1672f710807b.html#axzz3j755apx3
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,840
    SeanT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Titles? Serious and sincere request. I need some good books. Too many have been recently disappointing.

    I did like Rebecca tho, by Daphne du Maurier (I read it last year, I understand I'm a little later than most people), and also Tim Cumming's brilliant poetry collection Rebel Angels in the Mind Shop.
    I'm currently reading Tom Holland's 'In the Shadow of the Sword', which I'm enjoying and I suspect would appeal, though I'm only a hundred pages in so it's early days. That said, for a subject as epic as the transition from late antiquity to the early middle ages, and the rise of Islam in that vortex, I'd have expected a longer book so it may skim things a bit. Anyway, it's set off well.

    One book I did enjoy was Andrew Hodges' biography of Alan Turing. There is a lot of detail (and maths), but it's worth it.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    edited August 2015
    SeanT said:

    Titles? Serious and sincere request. I need some good books. Too many have been recently disappointing.

    Samuel Pepys: The Unequalled Self , by Claire Tomalin. I've read three other biographies of my avatar, but this one is in a different league to the others.

    On the fiction side, the book club, after the disappointment of The Ice Twins, reverted to comfort zone, but very successfully: The Age of Innocence. Definitely a goody, if you haven't read it.

    Other goodies, in no particular order: Ismail Kadare's Broken April; The Bridge of San Luis Rey by Thornton Wilder; Suite Francaise (but you need to read it in French, the English translation is poor)...
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    SeanT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Titles? Serious and sincere request. I need some good books. Too many have been recently disappointing.

    I did like Rebecca tho, by Daphne du Maurier (I read it last year, I understand I'm a little later than most people), and also Tim Cumming's brilliant poetry collection Rebel Angels in the Mind Shop.
    Rebecca is a wonderful book. It's the only book I know of where the title character doesn't appear in the book.

    Ir also won the Best Picture Oscar for David O Selznick in 1940. It was his second in a row, as he won it for Gone With The Wind the previous year.

    There is one significant difference between the book and the movie. Anyone know what it is?

    Regarding reading material, have you read Raymond Chandler's Philip Marlowe novels?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    SeanT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Titles? Serious and sincere request. I need some good books. Too many have been recently disappointing.

    I did like Rebecca tho, by Daphne du Maurier (I read it last year, I understand I'm a little later than most people), and also Tim Cumming's brilliant poetry collection Rebel Angels in the Mind Shop.
    The count of monte Cristo
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903

    Dear darling Mr Nabavi, you say ''how can we know how the £3 vote-baggers and union affiliates are leaning?''
    They are leaning left (that's 'Left!') to a gravity defying degree.

    twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/632950671420096512
    twitter.com/Sunil_P2/status/632948421805113344
    You've only just noticed??


  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    JEO said:

    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/

    A Fox poll today had Hillary beating Trump by 5 and Fiorina by 7 but losing to Bush by 2 and Rubio by 2. However if Trump runs as an independent she beats Bush by 11 and Rubio by 12

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/16/fox-news-poll-shakeup-in-gop-field-after-first-debate-sanders-gains-on-clinton/
  • flightpath01flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    MikeK said:

    SeanT said:

    SeanT said:

    JWisemann said:

    Okay, so arming Islamic fundamentalists across a quarter of the globe is realpolitik, chatting to a nutter at a function in aid of oppressed people is tantamount to being Hitler. Of course.

    Ah, Mister Smithson, with this you are spoiling us!

    SeanT said:


    That said the single most impressive Italian I've met recently - a world ski jump champion who also knew more history than most academics - yearned for a return of a Mussolini, to sort all the problems.

    Did he think colonial humiliation, recurring military defeat, invasion & occupation by both allies & enemies and a ubiquitous (if slightly unfair) reputation for martial cowardice was worth it just to get a few commies jailed and the trains to run on time?
    If Fascist Italy had just chosen the poet Gabriele d'Annunzio as leader (as nearly happened) rather than the oafish Mussolini, all would have been well.

    I wrote about d'Annunzio for Das Torygraf

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/seanthomas/100253258/this-man-was-a-sadomasochist-drug-addict-fearless-pilot-and-politician-only-in-italy/

    G d'Annunzio is my favourite politician EVAH. Possibly my favourite single person.
    D'Annunzio is certainly a fascinating character, far more so than Musso. I've had Lucy Hughes-Hallet's bio by my bed since Christmas, must get down to it. Bit off reading lately.
    It's possibly the best biography I've read since Ellmann's Joyce. Which is enormous praise. As that is perhaps the best literary biography ever.

    Of course Hughes-Hallett had much better material to work with, but good luck to her. She chose well.

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.
    Andrew Roberts' Napoleon starts well but languishes after the early Italian campaigns. Pity, it could have been a good book.
    But it was a biography - what did you expect to happen?
  • david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,840

    Hard to see beyond the bluffs and double-bluffs, but the claim from Cooper's camp that she's getting 60% of Burnham's 2nd preferences sounds pretty grim for the ABC people if Burnham comes 3rd - I can't see more than 5-10% of Burnham's 2nds going to Kendall, so that means Corbyn is getting a third of them.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/aug/17/labour-leadership-andy-burnham-yvette-cooper-contest

    I wonder what Cooper's 2nd preferences are doing. I know she's called for them to go to Burnham, but the current spat makes that seem less certain.

    Cooper's claim ties in with what the polls found so I'd be inclined to believe her. That said, Burnham's votes may not be redistributed anyway and even if they are, it'll just reduce Corbyn's lead.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    HYUFD said:

    JEO said:

    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/

    A Fox poll today had Hillary beating Trump by 5 and Fiorina by 7 but losing to Bush by 2 and Rubio by 2. However if Trump runs as an independent she beats Bush by 11 and Rubio by 12

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/16/fox-news-poll-shakeup-in-gop-field-after-first-debate-sanders-gains-on-clinton/
    There are many reports of both Biden and Gore(!) folks reaching out to Clinton donors. The panic in the Democratic Party is almost palpable.
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Cyclefree. Re our discussion yesterday, I did know one Philosophy student at Bristol. I forget his name, but he looked like a blue-eyed Jesus and fancied himself as an aesthete. Wonder if you can work out who it was based on that sketchy description! :)

    Good heavens! I shall have a proper think. There's one person who might fit the description. If it is indeed the same person he made a pass at me to the soundtrack of Blondie's "Denis, Denis". But, TBH, he sounds like the sort of person I'd have crossed the street to avoid. I was a bit of a punk then.....
    He was in Wills with me in 1977-78. Some other snippets of memory returning through the haze of time. Said Philosophy student's best mate was a small guy with a black beard called Andre from the East End (studying law) who claimed to know the Kray twins, and thought they were basically good blokes. Can see his face, just can't recall the name.

    Never fully became a punk myself, but was definitely into the Stranglers, and later all the post-punk bands like Killing Joke, The Fall, Siouxsie, The Psychadelic Furs, Joy Division, the Cure et al.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    SeanT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:



    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:

    PS I'm slightly struggling with Andrew Roberts' Napoleon. Brilliant on facts but needs more absurd, colourful gossip. Hopefully it will sharpen up.

    First book of his I haven't finished.

    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Titles? Serious and sincere request. I need some good books. Too many have been recently disappointing.

    I did like Rebecca tho, by Daphne du Maurier (I read it last year, I understand I'm a little later than most people), and also Tim Cumming's brilliant poetry collection Rebel Angels in the Mind Shop.
    Here goes:-

    Mark Thompson's The White War on the Italian campaign in WW1 - little known (by non-Italians obviously) and good background to D'Annunzio.

    James Holland has written two good books on the Battle of Britain and Italy 1944. Raleigh Trevelyan is also very good on the latter.

    Norman Lewis is a brilliant writer. His travel books are superb, as are Naples 44 and The Honoured Society (on the Mafia). Try his autobiography Jackdaw Cake.

    Timothy Snyder's Bloodlands: utterly harrowing but very well worth reading.

    Tony Judt: Postwar - A History of Europe from 1945, Reappraisals, Rethinking the Twentieth Century (with Timothy Snyder) and Past Imperfect. The Memory Chalet and When the Facts Change are both good collections of his essays.

    Tom Holland writes very well about the classical world. Rub on, Persian Fire and Millenium.

    John Horne Burns - The Gallery (short stories set in Naples and North Africa 1944/45) - well worth reading.

    Michael Burleigh: The Third Reich - A new history, Earthly Powers and Sacred Causes ( 2 books).

    Mark Mazower: Dark Continent

    I've also enjoyed the first volume of Elsa Ferrante's sequence of novels - My Brilliant Friend.

    Anyway, that should keep you going for a bit......
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    JEO said:

    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/

    A Fox poll today had Hillary beating Trump by 5 and Fiorina by 7 but losing to Bush by 2 and Rubio by 2. However if Trump runs as an independent she beats Bush by 11 and Rubio by 12

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/16/fox-news-poll-shakeup-in-gop-field-after-first-debate-sanders-gains-on-clinton/
    There are many reports of both Biden and Gore(!) folks reaching out to Clinton donors. The panic in the Democratic Party is almost palpable.
    There is panic in the GOP too given the Trump runaway train continues on!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    JEO said:

    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/

    A Fox poll today had Hillary beating Trump by 5 and Fiorina by 7 but losing to Bush by 2 and Rubio by 2. However if Trump runs as an independent she beats Bush by 11 and Rubio by 12

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/16/fox-news-poll-shakeup-in-gop-field-after-first-debate-sanders-gains-on-clinton/
    There are many reports of both Biden and Gore(!) folks reaching out to Clinton donors. The panic in the Democratic Party is almost palpable.
    The biggest rallies so far have been for Bernie Sanders
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Fun factoid -

    in addition to his sumptuous private plane, a Boeing 757, Trump owns 3 - THREE - helicopters. One based in NYC (that's the one in Iowa over the weekend), one in Florida, and one in Turnberry.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    JEO said:

    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/

    A Fox poll today had Hillary beating Trump by 5 and Fiorina by 7 but losing to Bush by 2 and Rubio by 2. However if Trump runs as an independent she beats Bush by 11 and Rubio by 12

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/16/fox-news-poll-shakeup-in-gop-field-after-first-debate-sanders-gains-on-clinton/
    There are many reports of both Biden and Gore(!) folks reaching out to Clinton donors. The panic in the Democratic Party is almost palpable.
    The biggest rallies so far have been for Bernie Sanders
    I'm not going to get into this with you. It has already been established by more than me that you have no real understanding of the tides and currents of the US political environment.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    MTimT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Cyclefree. Re our discussion yesterday, I did know one Philosophy student at Bristol. I forget his name, but he looked like a blue-eyed Jesus and fancied himself as an aesthete. Wonder if you can work out who it was based on that sketchy description! :)

    Good heavens! I shall have a proper think. There's one person who might fit the description. If it is indeed the same person he made a pass at me to the soundtrack of Blondie's "Denis, Denis". But, TBH, he sounds like the sort of person I'd have crossed the street to avoid. I was a bit of a punk then.....
    He was in Wills with me in 1977-78. Some other snippets of memory returning through the haze of time. Said Philosophy student's best mate was a small guy with a black beard called Andre from the East End (studying law) who claimed to know the Kray twins, and thought they were basically good blokes. Can see his face, just can't recall the name.

    Never fully became a punk myself, but was definitely into the Stranglers, and later all the post-punk bands like Killing Joke, The Fall, Siouxsie, The Psychadelic Furs, Joy Division, the Cure et al.
    I went out with the brother of the Buzzcock's lead guitarist - though not when I was at uni. And spent more time than was probably good for me at the Hacienda. Still love the Smiths.


    I

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    edited August 2015
    Tim_B said:

    Fun factoid -

    in addition to his sumptuous private plane, a Boeing 757, Trump owns 3 - THREE - helicopters. One based in NYC (that's the one in Iowa over the weekend), one in Florida, and one in Turnberry.

    Never mind AirForce One and Marine One it will be TrumpForce One!!
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    Cyclefree said:

    SeanT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:



    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Cyclefree said:

    AndyJS said:

    Cyclefree said:

    rcs1000 said:

    SeanT said:



    The two Hitler books by Ian Kershaw are superb IMO. My favourite history books.
    Yes, they are. Some very good history books in the last few years: Kershaw, Burleigh, Overy, Mazower, Tom Holland, James Holland, Mark Thompson, Snyder and the late and much missed Tony Judt.
    Titles? Serious and sincere request. I need some good books. Too many have been recently disappointing.

    I did like Rebecca tho, by Daphne du Maurier (I read it last year, I understand I'm a little later than most people), and also Tim Cumming's brilliant poetry collection Rebel Angels in the Mind Shop.
    Here goes:-

    Mark Thompson's The White War on the Italian campaign in WW1 - little known (by non-Italians obviously) and good background to D'Annunzio.

    James Holland has written two good books on the Battle of Britain and Italy 1944. Raleigh Trevelyan is also very good on the latter.

    Norman Lewis is a brilliant writer. His travel books are superb, as are Naples 44 and The Honoured Society (on the Mafia). Try his autobiography Jackdaw Cake.

    Timothy Snyder's Bloodlands: utterly harrowing but very well worth reading.

    Tony Judt: Postwar - A History of Europe from 1945, Reappraisals, Rethinking the Twentieth Century (with Timothy Snyder) and Past Imperfect. The Memory Chalet and When the Facts Change are both good collections of his essays.

    Tom Holland writes very well about the classical world. Rub on, Persian Fire and Millenium.

    John Horne Burns - The Gallery (short stories set in Naples and North Africa 1944/45) - well worth reading.

    Michael Burleigh: The Third Reich - A new history, Earthly Powers and Sacred Causes ( 2 books).

    Mark Mazower: Dark Continent

    I've also enjoyed the first volume of Elsa Ferrante's sequence of novels - My Brilliant Friend.

    Anyway, that should keep you going for a bit......
    Tom Holland's Rubicon not Rub On.

  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    edited August 2015
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Cyclefree. Re our discussion yesterday, I did know one Philosophy student at Bristol. I forget his name, but he looked like a blue-eyed Jesus and fancied himself as an aesthete. Wonder if you can work out who it was based on that sketchy description! :)

    Good heavens! I shall have a proper think. There's one person who might fit the description. If it is indeed the same person he made a pass at me to the soundtrack of Blondie's "Denis, Denis". But, TBH, he sounds like the sort of person I'd have crossed the street to avoid. I was a bit of a punk then.....
    He was in Wills with me in 1977-78. Some other snippets of memory returning through the haze of time. Said Philosophy student's best mate was a small guy with a black beard called Andre from the East End (studying law) who claimed to know the Kray twins, and thought they were basically good blokes. Can see his face, just can't recall the name.

    Never fully became a punk myself, but was definitely into the Stranglers, and later all the post-punk bands like Killing Joke, The Fall, Siouxsie, The Psychadelic Furs, Joy Division, the Cure et al.
    I went out with the brother of the Buzzcock's lead guitarist - though not when I was at uni. And spent more time than was probably good for me at the Hacienda. Still love the Smiths.


    I

    Good grief - are we really going here?

    My only reference here is that the older sister of a guy I went to school with went out with a member of The Troggs.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    MTimT said:

    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf

    Anna Karenina - brilliant.

    Ditto Vanity Fair.

    The short stories and novels of William Trevor and John McGahern.

    PS Perhaps we could have PB Book Club when Nighthawks fails to make an appearance!


  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    edited August 2015
    MTimT said:

    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf

    How could I have left Joseph Conrad off the list. Virtually anything by him, but Heart of Darkness, of course.

    For non-fiction:

    The Rise and Fall of Great Powers, Paul Kennedy
    A History of Warfare, John Keegan
    The Information, James Gleick
    Darwin's Dangerous Idea, Daniel Dennett
    Society of Mind, Marvin Minsky
    The Language Instinct, Stephen Pinker
    Linked, Albert-Laszlo Barabasi
    Probably Approximately Correct, Leslie Valiant
    Against the Gods: The Remarkable Story of Risk, Peter Bernstein
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,341
    Tim_B said:

    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Cyclefree. Re our discussion yesterday, I did know one Philosophy student at Bristol. I forget his name, but he looked like a blue-eyed Jesus and fancied himself as an aesthete. Wonder if you can work out who it was based on that sketchy description! :)

    Good heavens! I shall have a proper think. There's one person who might fit the description. If it is indeed the same person he made a pass at me to the soundtrack of Blondie's "Denis, Denis". But, TBH, he sounds like the sort of person I'd have crossed the street to avoid. I was a bit of a punk then.....
    He was in Wills with me in 1977-78. Some other snippets of memory returning through the haze of time. Said Philosophy student's best mate was a small guy with a black beard called Andre from the East End (studying law) who claimed to know the Kray twins, and thought they were basically good blokes. Can see his face, just can't recall the name.

    Never fully became a punk myself, but was definitely into the Stranglers, and later all the post-punk bands like Killing Joke, The Fall, Siouxsie, The Psychadelic Furs, Joy Division, the Cure et al.
    I went out with the brother of the Buzzcock's lead guitarist - though not when I was at uni. And spent more time than was probably good for me at the Hacienda. Still love the Smiths.


    I

    Good grief - are we really going here?

    My only reference here is that the older sister of a guy I went to school with went out with a member of The Troggs.
    OK I'm sorry. He did ask me to marry him though. Who the hell are The Troggs anyway?
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf

    Anna Karenina - brilliant.

    Ditto Vanity Fair.

    The short stories and novels of William Trevor and John McGahern.

    PS Perhaps we could have PB Book Club when Nighthawks fails to make an appearance!


    Sounds good to me. Like Sean T, I am in a rut with reading, other than for work, where I still find plenty of fascinating stuff.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    Do the Labour candidates understand AV?

    The more time they spend slagging each other off, the more of their second prefs (or thirds, which will likely matter for one of them) head away from The ABC Three ... whether into oblivion or for JC, it can't be a good thing. If they really are running scared at the prospect of JC winning the election, at least. Otherwise it makes me wonder whether they are simply using the Spectre of Corbynism as a ruse to get one up over the other ABCs, and are just keeping their fingers crossed that the Corbyn surge is an artefact of social media.
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Cyclefree said:

    Tim_B said:

    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    Cyclefree said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Cyclefree. Re our discussion yesterday, I did know one Philosophy student at Bristol. I forget his name, but he looked like a blue-eyed Jesus and fancied himself as an aesthete. Wonder if you can work out who it was based on that sketchy description! :)

    Good heavens! I shall have a proper think. There's one person who might fit the description. If it is indeed the same person he made a pass at me to the soundtrack of Blondie's "Denis, Denis". But, TBH, he sounds like the sort of person I'd have crossed the street to avoid. I was a bit of a punk then.....
    He was in Wills with me in 1977-78. Some other snippets of memory returning through the haze of time. Said Philosophy student's best mate was a small guy with a black beard called Andre from the East End (studying law) who claimed to know the Kray twins, and thought they were basically good blokes. Can see his face, just can't recall the name.

    Never fully became a punk myself, but was definitely into the Stranglers, and later all the post-punk bands like Killing Joke, The Fall, Siouxsie, The Psychadelic Furs, Joy Division, the Cure et al.
    I went out with the brother of the Buzzcock's lead guitarist - though not when I was at uni. And spent more time than was probably good for me at the Hacienda. Still love the Smiths.


    I

    Good grief - are we really going here?

    My only reference here is that the older sister of a guy I went to school with went out with a member of The Troggs.
    OK I'm sorry. He did ask me to marry him though. Who the hell are The Troggs anyway?
    Their big hit was "Wild Thing". It was a different time.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hce74cEAAaE
  • JonathanJonathan Posts: 21,706
    My aunt dated one of Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick & Tich. Not sure which. I suspect Beaky.

    Wrt books.

    Middlemarch
    A brief history of time
    & Mr Topsy Turvey

    all highly recommended
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    Do the Labour candidates understand AV?

    The more time they spend slagging each other off, the more of their second prefs (or thirds, which will likely matter for one of them) head away from The ABC Three ... whether into oblivion or for JC, it can't be a good thing. If they really are running scared at the prospect of JC winning the election, at least. Otherwise it makes me wonder whether they are simply using the Spectre of Corbynism as a ruse to get one up over the other ABCs, and are just keeping their fingers crossed that the Corbyn surge is an artefact of social media.

    With YouGov putting Corbyn on 57% I don't think it's possible to regard the surge as simply a social media generated artefact. All the other candidates must know this.
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    edited August 2015
    Another one for Sean T, "Imagining Argentina", Christopher Hampton. An amazing first novel. And from the Sci-Fi field, Snowcrash by Neal Stephenson.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    MTimT said:

    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf

    Final confirmation of my philistine status. Not only haven't I read any of those, I haven't heard of most of them. I'll have a go at one of them soon though.
  • MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    AndyJS said:

    Do the Labour candidates understand AV?

    The more time they spend slagging each other off, the more of their second prefs (or thirds, which will likely matter for one of them) head away from The ABC Three ... whether into oblivion or for JC, it can't be a good thing. If they really are running scared at the prospect of JC winning the election, at least. Otherwise it makes me wonder whether they are simply using the Spectre of Corbynism as a ruse to get one up over the other ABCs, and are just keeping their fingers crossed that the Corbyn surge is an artefact of social media.

    With YouGov putting Corbyn on 57% I don't think it's possible to regard the surge as simply a social media generated artefact. All the other candidates must know this.
    Yet if they really are desperately desperate to stop Corbyn, their tactics (especially Cooper and Burnham splitting further apart, hence making each other increasingly transfer-unfriendly) are curiously designed to play into his hands. And again, I'm sure they both know this.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,723
    How is Survation weighting turnout in this poll?

    Carbon copy of what all the pollsters did at the GE?

    Or something a bit more realistic?
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    I just finished reading 'Seven Pillars of Wisdom', the Oxford edition, that's the long one.

    A wonderful book, and I learned several new words.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,051
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    JEO said:

    Trump 32%
    Bush 12%
    Carson 7%
    Huckabee 6%
    Rubio 6%
    Cruz 5%
    Fiorina 4%
    Christie 4%
    Paul 4%

    http://morningconsult.com/2015/08/trump-leads-gop-field-fiorina-rises-as-walker-fades/

    A Fox poll today had Hillary beating Trump by 5 and Fiorina by 7 but losing to Bush by 2 and Rubio by 2. However if Trump runs as an independent she beats Bush by 11 and Rubio by 12

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/16/fox-news-poll-shakeup-in-gop-field-after-first-debate-sanders-gains-on-clinton/
    There are many reports of both Biden and Gore(!) folks reaching out to Clinton donors. The panic in the Democratic Party is almost palpable.
    The biggest rallies so far have been for Bernie Sanders
    I'm not going to get into this with you. It has already been established by more than me that you have no real understanding of the tides and currents of the US political environment.
    Well Sanders is already ahead of Hillary in New Hampshire in one poll and running ahead of Trump in some polls in the general election, if Trump is GOP nominee even Sanders would have a shot!
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    AndyJS said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf

    Final confirmation of my philistine status. Not only haven't I read any of those, I haven't heard of most of them. I'll have a go at one of them soon though.
    LOL. I've moved in international circles my whole life, so have been fortunate enough to have been introduced by friends to authors whose works haven't necessarily made it onto the book lists in the UK. Looking at it, the Czechs seem inordinately represented on my list.
  • AndyJS said:

    MTimT said:

    @ Sean T: Some of my favorite all time books

    TOWER STRUCK BY LIGHTENING by Fernando Arrabal (Penguin, 1991)
    The Lady in a Car with Glasses and a Gun, Sebastian Japrisot
    The Unbearable Lightness of Being, Milan Kundera
    Candid, Voltaire
    War with the Newts, Karel Capek
    The Good Soldier Schweik, Jaroslav Hasek
    Brazzaville Beach, William Boyd
    Samarkand, Amin Maalouf

    Final confirmation of my philistine status. Not only haven't I read any of those, I haven't heard of most of them. I'll have a go at one of them soon though.
    The only books I've bought this year are the latest editions of London Railway Atlas (where I get a mention in the acknowledgements!), and the Rail Atlas of Great Britain and Ireland
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Donald Trump and I have even more in common - he had jury duty today and wasn't selected, just like me a few months ago.

    I could be a billionaire, if I had the money.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,572
    Jonathan said:

    My aunt dated one of Dave Dee, Dozy, Beaky, Mick & Tich. Not sure which. I suspect Beaky.

    Wrt books.

    Middlemarch
    A brief history of time
    & Mr Topsy Turvey

    all highly recommended

    My dad's cousin dated the Queen Mother, apparently - he was supposedly a suavely tough character (thought Churchill a hopeless wet):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Stuart,_1st_Viscount_Stuart_of_Findhorn

    Books:

    Heavy going at times but worth it: Sansom's earlier Shardlake books on an idealistic lawyer trying to avoid multiple dangers in the Reformation period (he runs out of steam by book 4 IMO)

    Lighter going than you'd expect:
    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Quest-Moral-Compass-Kenan-Malik/dp/1848874790 - easily the most readable and fairest overview of philosophy that I've ever read, and occasionally even funny. (He thinks Bentham's rigid utilitarianism would have made him an excellent X-Factor judge)
  • Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    Democratic Nomination:

    I think taking a punt against Clinton is a fair option. This email issue isn't going away and its getting worse. What it does is emphasize her divisiveness that killed her off in 2008.

    What we have, betting-wise then, is a 'who will emerge' situation to make a trading bet rather than necessarily look at the end winner. There is still room for someone new to turn up officially but if I rule out Sanders that leaves us just two as it stands from what I can see who could go anywhere.

    1. Biden, who must fancy a try.

    and 2.. Jim Webb.... who is nowhere right now and may remain nowhere or just go one way, upwards.

    Neither quite appeal yet. Is Biden as good as it gets? Surely there is someone else in the wings.

    Why rule out Bernie? I think looking at the polls its about as good as it gets. Thats the ceiling.
    So from a betting perspective, theres no more room.

    Iraq: Former Prime Minister Nouri Al Maliki is considering a coup attempt and one that would launch very soon. You may remember many moons ago when this divisive figure was ousted in the aftermath of a succession of defeats to IS, particularly in Mosul, I said that he'd retain an important post and remain a key figure

    The guy has just never left but now may face legal action over those very defeats. Maybe thats why the coup option is on the table, maybe its a threat to encourage those considering legals to back off.

    He has a powerbase but it'd be very high risk stuff.

  • valleyboyvalleyboy Posts: 606
    Louise Mench just retweeted my tweet about my Labour leadership vote.
    Should I be afraid?
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