"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
What about if that man wins I am out of here? I can see her doing that.
"The surprise frontrunner in the Labour leadership contest, Jeremy Corbyn, found himself facing a potential exodus of talent from the front bench if he became party leader with Liz Kendall, Yvette Cooper and Chuka Umunna all saying that they would not serve in a shadow cabinet led by him."
Immigration from EU reaches 2m and inc a record 973,000 from 8 East European countries that joined in 2004. Biggest wave of migration in UK history. This along with illegal immigration across the EU is really getting out of control.
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
What about if that man wins I am out of here? I can see her doing that.
"The surprise frontrunner in the Labour leadership contest, Jeremy Corbyn, found himself facing a potential exodus of talent from the front bench if he became party leader with Liz Kendall, Yvette Cooper and Chuka Umunna all saying that they would not serve in a shadow cabinet led by him."
Apparently there has been some pressure applied from the leadership for the mainstream candidates to alter the dynamics of the race. The only revelation of real interest would be her teaming up with Andy Burnham or Liz Kendall dropping out. That might be a game changer.
Presumably she wouldn't be the one to announce Liz standing down.
I've more or less equalised my gains on Burnham and Corbyn.
Jowell said the ban was necessary to promote equality and make women feel safe travelling around the capital.
She said she wanted to give women the confidence to "focus on their talents rather than their tummies."
Yes, poor diddums. Clearly women need to be protected from silly posters because they are so weak-minded that the mere sight of such a poster will distract them from their talents.
To be fair some of those adverts can be very distracting for guys.
I'm grateful I was too young to drive when those wonderbra adverts came out.
What about taking the train? This is clearly referring to one particular advert which was a picture of a woman in a bikini that you can see on every beach. I see lots of images of shirtless men in far more difficult to attain bodies on the front of women's magazines. Other than occasionally thinking I need to hit the gym more, it does not affect me that much. I would like to think women have similar mental strength to men, but left wing politicians keep on implying otherwise.
Tessa Jowell, the woman who signed legal papers having no idea why her home was being remortgaged, or how her husband was planning on repaying the loan.
'"As the feminist you are, are we to believe that you signed for a mortgage loan on your house for your husband, without knowing exactly how it was going to be paid back?" Woman's Hour presenter Jenni Murray asked Jowell.'
Jowell said the ban was necessary to promote equality and make women feel safe travelling around the capital.
She said she wanted to give women the confidence to "focus on their talents rather than their tummies."
Yes, poor diddums. Clearly women need to be protected from silly posters because they are so weak-minded that the mere sight of such a poster will distract them from their talents.
Thanks for drawing that to my attention. I'd been considering voting for her but I cannot vote for anyone who is so illiberal and silly. There was nothing wrong with the Beach Body Ready? advert.
Apparently there has been some pressure applied from the leadership for the mainstream candidates to alter the dynamics of the race. The only revelation of real interest would be her teaming up with Andy Burnham or Liz Kendall dropping out. That might be a game changer.
Presumably she wouldn't be the one to announce Liz standing down.
I've more or less equalised my gains on Burnham and Corbyn.
Whoever drops out will simply leech more votes to Corbyn.
David Cameron lowered the British flag for the King of Saudi Arabia, who is perhaps the person most responsible for Islamic State.
Some people get passes, others don't.
He gave the order to do this, did he? Or was it just standard diplomatic protocol?
Don't recall it happening for Kim Jong Il.
As silly as this whole argument is, was Kim Jong Il technically the Head of State? I'm not sure he was, officially, though naturally my N Korea knowledge is not stellar.
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
Under AV you don't need to step down.
Only if this election was conducted under FPTP would they need to step down.
Eeesh. Do I have to do a thread explaining the intricacies of AV?
If she tells them to second preference Burnham, what percentage actually do?
Of course it isn't the same.
(Excluding Kendall). Presumably all voters who prefer Burnham to Corbyn. If they don't have any preference after Cooper and there's only (in effect) an FPTP election on offer which Cooper isn't part of then why should they vote at all. So, no she doesn't need to step down. However, it would be a newsworthy gesture.
If there was a single flaw in the British Prime Minister's recent speech on countering extremism in the UK, it might be encapsulated in the name "Anjem Choudary." His speech went into terrific detail on the significance of tacking radicalism through the education system, the Charity Commission, the broadcasting license authority and numerous other means. But it failed the Choudary test.
That test is: What do you do about a British-born man who is qualified to work but appears never to have done so, and who instead spends his time taking his "dole" money and using it to fund a lifestyle devoted solely to preaching against the state?
Charge him under s.12 of the Terrorism Act?
Why did we scrap the sedition laws, that appears to describe the offence most accurately ?
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
Under AV you don't need to step down.
Only if this election was conducted under FPTP would they need to step down.
Eeesh. Do I have to do a thread explaining the intricacies of AV?
Yes, but the act of standing down may change the dynamics.
True but some voters might not get it and simply vote for one candidate without a 2nd or 3rd preference. Pooling resources and running as a team would surely boost the potential of the ticket by a few percentage points.
Immigration from EU reaches 2m and inc a record 973,000 from 8 East European countries that joined in 2004. Biggest wave of migration in UK history. This along with illegal immigration across the EU is really getting out of control.
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
Under AV you don't need to step down.
Only if this election was conducted under FPTP would they need to step down.
Eeesh. Do I have to do a thread explaining the intricacies of AV?
If she tells them to second preference Burnham, what percentage actually do?
Of course it isn't the same.
(Excluding Kendall). Presumably all voters who prefer Burnham to Corbyn. If they don't have any preference after Cooper and there's only (in effect) an FPTP election on offer which Cooper isn't part of then why should they vote at all. So, no she doesn't need to step down. However, it would be a newsworthy gesture.
"If they don't have any preference after Cooper and there's only (in effect) an FPTP election on offer"
Because AV is not used to give a full expression of preferences people actually hold. You have to think your second preference is going to be in the top two.
Apparently there has been some pressure applied from the leadership for the mainstream candidates to alter the dynamics of the race. The only revelation of real interest would be her teaming up with Andy Burnham or Liz Kendall dropping out. That might be a game changer.
Presumably she wouldn't be the one to announce Liz standing down.
I've more or less equalised my gains on Burnham and Corbyn.
Presumably. Those two apparently are also not on the best terms. I could see the two Eds and some other folks pushing her to team up with Andy.
If there was a single flaw in the British Prime Minister's recent speech on countering extremism in the UK, it might be encapsulated in the name "Anjem Choudary." His speech went into terrific detail on the significance of tacking radicalism through the education system, the Charity Commission, the broadcasting license authority and numerous other means. But it failed the Choudary test.
That test is: What do you do about a British-born man who is qualified to work but appears never to have done so, and who instead spends his time taking his "dole" money and using it to fund a lifestyle devoted solely to preaching against the state?
I would doubt that Choudary is solely funded by dole money - obviously his dole should be zero, but even if that were not a factor, I suspect he's funded from outside the UK. Which is the real problem.
"Although my vote is private, I did say in 2010 that I thought David Cameron would be a better prime minister than Gordon Brown and I said in 2015 that he would be a better prime minister than Ed Miliband, and, although I am disappointed by the cut in tax credits for the working poor, I stand by that."
If there was a single flaw in the British Prime Minister's recent speech on countering extremism in the UK, it might be encapsulated in the name "Anjem Choudary." His speech went into terrific detail on the significance of tacking radicalism through the education system, the Charity Commission, the broadcasting license authority and numerous other means. But it failed the Choudary test.
That test is: What do you do about a British-born man who is qualified to work but appears never to have done so, and who instead spends his time taking his "dole" money and using it to fund a lifestyle devoted solely to preaching against the state?
I would doubt that Choudary is solely funded by dole money - obviously his dole should be zero, but even if that were not a factor, I suspect he's funded from outside the UK. Which is the real problem.
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
I suspect the intervention will be that she actually goes after Corbyn directly and strongly, positioning herself as the SBC (somebody but Courbyn) candidate, rather than the invisible safety candidate she pitched as originally, when she thought she was taking on Burnham and Kendall.
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
That is surely the only "major intervention" left.
Under AV you don't need to step down.
Only if this election was conducted under FPTP would they need to step down.
Eeesh. Do I have to do a thread explaining the intricacies of AV?
If Corbyn looks close to winning on first preferences, might it be worth the others to stand down? So she could, in theory, also get close to 50% if she were to revieve all the ABC vote.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 1h1 hour ago "Austerity" means not spending money that isn't there. It isn't caused by some sort of twisted Right-wing sadism.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 7m7 minutes ago Similarly, "businesses" don't pay tax any more than your TV set pays the licence fee. All taxes fall on people - in this case, on customers.
Two points often overlooked by amongst others, the Corbyn Tendancy.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 1h1 hour ago "Austerity" means not spending money that isn't there. It isn't caused by some sort of twisted Right-wing sadism.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 7m7 minutes ago Similarly, "businesses" don't pay tax any more than your TV set pays the licence fee. All taxes fall on people - in this case, on customers.
Two points often overlooked by amongst others, the Corbyn Tendancy.
David Cameron lowered the British flag for the King of Saudi Arabia, who is perhaps the person most responsible for Islamic State.
Some people get passes, others don't.
He gave the order to do this, did he? Or was it just standard diplomatic protocol?
Don't recall it happening for Kim Jong Il.
As silly as this whole argument is, was Kim Jong Il technically the Head of State? I'm not sure he was, officially, though naturally my N Korea knowledge is not stellar.
You misunderstand in your passion. The 'silly argument' I was talking about was whether or not Kim Jong Il was legally head of state or not, and thus technically entitled to diplomatic nicities, as if that really matters much, not whether as a nation we cosy up to loathsome regimes - of course we do, that's the real world, we just like to pretend we don't ignore morality. Again, all nations pretend that.
"Please, please, please don't vote for Jezza. Thanks."
If the other candidates really think Corbyn will destroy the Labour Party, wouldnt it be better for two of them to stand down?
Could also allow for a pause while ballots are reprinted.
If a candidate withdraws from an AV election, the ballot papers would not need to be re-printed. It just means that any votes for the withdrawn candidate are transferred to the next preference. The rules of AV, if done properly, allow for a candidate to withdraw at any time up to the close of poll and the start of the count. Whether the Labour Party uses a proper version of AV, allowing that to happen, is of course a completely different kettle of ballgames.
David Cameron lowered the British flag for the King of Saudi Arabia, who is perhaps the person most responsible for Islamic State.
Some people get passes, others don't.
He gave the order to do this, did he? Or was it just standard diplomatic protocol?
Don't recall it happening for Kim Jong Il.
As silly as this whole argument is, was Kim Jong Il technically the Head of State? I'm not sure he was, officially, though naturally my N Korea knowledge is not stellar.
As I understand it, Kim Il Sung is the 'Eternal President' of N. Korea, and his son/grandson function as regents.
It is of course officially a Communist state, but with the collapse of the rule of Gyanendra of Nepal it looks like the nearest thing left to a hereditary theocratic monarchy.
Kim Il Sung *was* the President of North Korea, but when he died in 1994 nobody else succeeded him as president. In 1998 Kim Il Sung was appointed as "President in Perpetuity" but otherwise the position of President has been abolished.
A while ago I found an interesting article by Kenny Coyle in Communist Review (the organ of the CPB) which argues that Kimilsungism-Kimjongilism has replaced Marxism-Leninism as the state philosophy, and that the style of leadership is more akin to the various African and Arab Ba'athist socialist-nationalist régimes than communism.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 1h1 hour ago "Austerity" means not spending money that isn't there. It isn't caused by some sort of twisted Right-wing sadism.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 7m7 minutes ago Similarly, "businesses" don't pay tax any more than your TV set pays the licence fee. All taxes fall on people - in this case, on customers.
Two points often overlooked by amongst others, the Corbyn Tendancy.
We have a large vibrant economy that can fund all sorts of things if we choose to do so. "Austerity" is a conscious decision on what your spending priorities are. How taxes are raised is also the result of the working out of a set of priorities. We can choose to raise tax by taxing the profits of the company making the TV or charging VAT on the sale of the TV. It makes a big difference to the prosperity of different sections of society.
Two points often obfuscated by amongst others, the Neoliberal tendency.
@janemerrick23: Tomorrow @YvetteForLabour will give a speech on the future of the Labour Party. The fight starts here (or indeed there/then)
Only about six weeks late!
Probably, although maybe right now, at the height of Coybynmania and as ballots are to be sent out, is the best time to puncture that bubble? It's a theory at any rate.
What ever the answer to Labour's current problems are, its not a Gordon Brown intervention. But speaking equally tongue in cheek, I do find it ironic from a Scottish perspective that both the current Labour and SNP party grass roots share a loathing for any key personal involved in the Labour party when they were winning elections.
Labour look as though they are sleep walking to disaster in this leadership election.
Where is the man who saved the world, saved the banks?
General Gordon. Your Party Needs You!
LOL , unlike the disappearing Tories who don't have any leaders to worry about.
"A leader is best when the people barely know he exists. Of a good leader, who talks little, when his work is done, his aim fulfilled, they will say: we did this ourselves." Lao Tse.
Tory one has to scuttle over to Edinburgh for consolation list to save oblivion, poor Tories over there get shouldered out.
Malcolm I have tried to rearrange the words in this post in several different ways but I can't get it to mean anything. Is it a special code for Nats?
Topping Tories = Nasty party, almost extinct in God's country.
Comments
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jul/22/jeremy-corbyn-could-lose-frontbenchers-if-elected-labour-leader
Tried it.
She could say put Andy second, as TSE alludes to. But it would be far from effective.
A political answer but not unreasonable. It was a 'Have you stopped beating your wife?' question.
I wonder if any of the four candidates would have made that Kinnock speech? Possibly Liz, but not that well. Jezza would have been in the hall booing.
I remember the Spitting Image sketch based on 'Cabaret.' 'Well, Neil do you still think you can control them?' The answer was "Yes."
I doubt that the the present Labour party can.
Anyway, got to go - that Merseyside real ale in the Dispensary is calling.
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article4525078.ece
Apparently there has been some pressure applied from the leadership for the mainstream candidates to alter the dynamics of the race. The only revelation of real interest would be her teaming up with Andy Burnham or Liz Kendall dropping out. That might be a game changer.
Presumably she wouldn't be the one to announce Liz standing down.
I've more or less equalised my gains on Burnham and Corbyn.
'"As the feminist you are, are we to believe that you signed for a mortgage loan on your house for your husband, without knowing exactly how it was going to be paid back?" Woman's Hour presenter Jenni Murray asked Jowell.'
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2009/feb/17/jowell-mills-berlusconi-background
What an excellent idea - I wonder if someone can come up with one?
I've more or less equalised my gains on Burnham and Corbyn.
Whoever drops out will simply leech more votes to Corbyn.
Presumably all voters who prefer Burnham to Corbyn. If they don't have any preference after Cooper and there's only (in effect) an FPTP election on offer which Cooper isn't part of then why should they vote at all.
So, no she doesn't need to step down. However, it would be a newsworthy gesture.
2015: OK, there are almost a million here now, but they're such hard workers!
Because AV is not used to give a full expression of preferences people actually hold. You have to think your second preference is going to be in the top two.
I've more or less equalised my gains on Burnham and Corbyn.
Presumably. Those two apparently are also not on the best terms. I could see the two Eds and some other folks pushing her to team up with Andy.
http://www.yelp.co.uk/biz/the-dispensary-liverpool
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/daily-catchup-why-im-not-voting-in-labours-leadership-election-10451078.html
"Although my vote is private, I did say in 2010 that I thought David Cameron would be a better prime minister than Gordon Brown and I said in 2015 that he would be a better prime minister than Ed Miliband, and, although I am disappointed by the cut in tax credits for the working poor, I stand by that."
Surely he gets donations? Or do we stop that?
"Austerity" means not spending money that isn't there. It isn't caused by some sort of twisted Right-wing sadism.
Daniel Hannan @DanHannanMEP 7m7 minutes ago
Similarly, "businesses" don't pay tax any more than your TV set pays the licence fee. All taxes fall on people - in this case, on customers.
Two points often overlooked by amongst others, the Corbyn Tendancy.
New thread
Whether the Labour Party can be trusted to run a successful p**s up in a brewery may be the question.
I see their computer has crashed.
A while ago I found an interesting article by Kenny Coyle in Communist Review (the organ of the CPB) which argues that Kimilsungism-Kimjongilism has replaced Marxism-Leninism as the state philosophy, and that the style of leadership is more akin to the various African and Arab Ba'athist socialist-nationalist régimes than communism.
Two points often obfuscated by amongst others, the Neoliberal tendency.