Is he also in favour of children's shows with characters that are into bondage?
No idea, but the libs are going to be off the scene for years if they want LGBT relationships introduced to infants. Bonkers.
Is this the sort of nonsense that you Tories were spreading when you were phoning swing voters and smearing defending Lib Dem MPs, American-style?
I think Mr Cameron ought to take greater care with his party.
You tories?
I'm not a tory, I've never phoned or smeared anybody. I'm simply saying that this type of nonsense alienates vast swathes of the population. Its Lamb's prerogative to hold those views and he's honest enough to voice them, but its a big factor in why their vote collapsed.
My experience of small children is that they are very matter-of-fact about adult relationships. My other half and I never bothered explaining to my nephews and nieces when they were small that we were a couple and they didn't feel the need to ask. For them, no doubt, it was just a small part of their life, to be accepted without comment.
As they got older, labels became more important to them (though my nephew with Asperger's has never been the least bit interested in our relationship and for all I know in his mid-20s he may still think we're just really good friends).
My other half's great-nephews and nieces are going through the same process. The small ones by and large seem as uninterested as my own nephews and nieces were at that stage.
I can recall only two tricky questions:
1) One of my nephews when he was about five turned to my other half and asked: "so when did you join our family?" Before anyone could answer his elder sister, aged about seven at the time, said: "oh don't be so stupid. [He's] been a member of our family since long before you were born."
2) A couple of years after our civil partnership, one of my other half's great-nieces took a taxi journey with us to London Zoo. She looked puzzled, then asked: "you got married to each other, didn't you?" My other half confirmed that. She paused, then asked: "so which of you was the girl?" My other half stammered "pardon?". She repeated: "which of you was the girl? Who wore the dress?"
In the front, the taxi driver was no doubt trying not to cry with laughter.
Oh, and after our civil partnership, which was in an August, one of my other half's nephews, aged 8 or 9 at the time, went back to school in the September and the class was asked by the teacher what they did in their summer holidays, with all of them writing down what each of them had done. My other half's nephew piped up: "my uncle married a MAN. And they KISSED." I can't imagine the teacher was expecting that response (and none of the children at our civil partnership saw any kissing, so I have no idea where that came from). In two dozen school textbooks in rural Ireland there is a record of our civil partnership.
Mr. Antifrank, I can't help but notice you haven't told us which of you wore the dress
I do wonder about a few gay marriage things, though. Such as surnames (I know women don't always take the man's name now, but it's still common), and whether you're pronounced man and husband/woman and wife.
She was doing all right until the last sentence: "Just as Labour championed the white heat of technology in the 1960s, so today we need to champion the white flashing constellations of the networked world."
How on earth did that groan-making phrase get past whoever she asked to check her speech?
In any case it's an odd reference to make. The Wilson 'white heat of technology' guff was an unmitigated disaster, it simply involved pouring taxpayers' money down the drain.
It also doesn't make much sense. The only manufacturing sectors a rich country could be competitive at won't be very labour-intensive in 15 years time, as it all goes automated.
At least Cooper is talking about the right things: innovation, R&D, productivity etc. This is the only way forward for Labour. Ed M didn't mention any of these things as far as I can recall.
So it should be absolutely inconceivable that a children's character is gay?
Because that's all Lamb said: that it was not "out of the question".
Which sounds more like a politician not taking a view at all, rather than going on a crusade for a gay Peppa Pig.
I am far more concerned that Peppa Pig is neither Halal or Kosher! What does that say about our cartoons? Though perhaps introducing a Mohammad character into the storyline may be rather provocative.
And surely Tinky Winky bats for the other side? And as for PC Plum in Balamory...
Errh Mr Fox, I seem to remember that muslims have been offended by peppa pig. Who cares if anybody is gay, bi, muslim, quaker etc etc its a kids cartoon ffs not a documentary.
So it should be absolutely inconceivable that a children's character is gay?
Because that's all Lamb said: that it was not "out of the question".
Which sounds more like a politician not taking a view at all, rather than going on a crusade for a gay Peppa Pig.
I am far more concerned that Peppa Pig is neither Halal or Kosher! What does that say about our cartoons? Though perhaps introducing a Mohammad character into the storyline may be rather provocative.
And surely Tinky Winky bats for the other side? And as for PC Plum in Balamory...
The real issue with kids TV is deciding whether or not the characters are male or female in the first place, let alone whether they have sapphic tendencies. Fortunately, we have eyelashes for that (boys don't have eyelashes).
Nice anecdotage from antifrank, too. Good to know that your nieces and nephews don't find your lifestyle odd, though perhaps they haven't seen your post count on here.
Is he also in favour of children's shows with characters that are into bondage?
No idea, but the libs are going to be off the scene for years if they want LGBT relationships introduced to infants. Bonkers.
Is this the sort of nonsense that you Tories were spreading when you were phoning swing voters and smearing defending Lib Dem MPs, American-style?
I think Mr Cameron ought to take greater care with his party.
You tories? I'm not a tory, I've never phoned or smeared anybody. I'm simply saying that this type of nonsense alienates vast swathes of the population. Its Lamb's prerogative to hold those views and he's honest enough to voice them, but its a big factor in why their vote collapsed.
Profound apologies then, Mr Blackburn. I did not mean to offend you. You may very well be right when you say "that this type of nonsense alienates vast swathes of the population". But, as has been amply shown below, the line that you and others are peddling is not what Norman Lamb has said.
Well, we know where 190 of the 1,000 jobs are going to come from.
I'm sure you and Simon St Clare will be on here every day during LD Conference just to remind everyone how rubbish and irrelevant the party is but it's your time....
An odd comment. I've praised the LDs enough on here (Cable aside) for the way they behaved in coalition, and have repeatedly said it is a shame that they got so hammered for behaving reasonably well. I've also voted LD in the past.
On topic: for me it would have to be Farron, as I've said for quite a while.
It is the equivalent of two baldy men fighting for a comb.
I too am returning from Euroland* and with the same dilemma on Farron vs Lamb. I am off to the East Midlands hustings on Monday and will decide after that. I am increasingly leaning to Lamb, who has impressed me with his forthrightness and is no mean campaigner himself as his Norfolk majority shows.
* In Green Spain - a wonderful place with great food and wine and delightful people.
I look forward to explanations about how this would create two classes of MP, and how what we have now is not that already. Someone on here tried at length to make that distinction to me, and either I was too stupid, or the explanation not convincing, or both (but I feel confident on this one it just wasn't convincing)
I look forward to explanations about how this would create two classes of MP, and how what we have now is not that already. Someone on here tried at length to make that distinction to me, and either I was too stupid, or the explanation not convincing, or both (but I feel confident on this one it just wasn't convincing)
Tories are bringing in 3rd class
Succinct, but already more convincing at first glance than those presenting that we don't have two classes now.
If all your children's TV is devoid of LGBT relationships, in proper proportion to real life, then you create problems later. Problems that children do not have as antifrank and others have so well demonstrated.
I am far more concerned that Peppa Pig is neither Halal or Kosher! What does that say about our cartoons?
It says that we prefer living cartoon animals.
I suppose if Peppa lived in a Danish crate piggery and was dispatched to make bacon sarnies, what it gained in social realism would be lost in plot line.
I know nothing of antifrank's upbringing but I'd imagine he wasn't taught a lot about LGBT relationships. Despite, or perhaps because of that he seems balanced, happy and non judgemental. Leave kids to watch cartoons ffs, not everything in life has to have a message.
I am far more concerned that Peppa Pig is neither Halal or Kosher! What does that say about our cartoons?
It says that we prefer living cartoon animals.
I suppose if Peppa lived in a Danish crate piggery and was dispatched to make bacon sarnies, what it gained in social realism would be lost in plot line.
I would be very happy if Peppa were carted off to the make bacon. Have you seen how vile she is to poor Daddy Pig?
From this week's Oldie (which I hasn't to add I only bought because of the article on Peppa!)
Children’s television is dreadful, says Zenga Longmore. And worst of all is Peppa Pig, with its precocious little girl pig, her brother George and the hideously smug multitasking Mummy Pig – all of whom take a sadistic delight in humiliating poor Daddy Pig. It should be banned forthwith.
I know nothing of antifrank's upbringing but I'd imagine he wasn't taught a lot about LGBT relationships. Despite, or perhaps because of that he seems balanced, happy and non judgemental. Leave kids to watch cartoons ffs, not everything in life has to have a message.
I think you are now getting dangerously close to what Norman Lamb was, in fact, saying, Mr Blackburn!!!
Succinct, but already more convincing at first glance than those presenting that we don't have two classes now.
There is a single class of MPs de jure at present, since Parliament has unlimited legislative competence throughout the United Kingdom, and every MP has a vote in every division, and each vote has equal weight. The proposed amendments to the Standing Orders modify this principle to some extent, since in certain divisions, the votes of English, or English and Welsh MPs will be worth more than those of Scottish MPs.
There are two classes of MP de facto at present, because Parliament does not in practice legislate in respect of Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales where the subject matter of the legislation falls within the legislative competence of a devolved legislature. The government's proposed changes do not alter this situation, since Scottish MPs will retain the ability to vote on legislation applying only to England whose subject matter falls within the legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament.
As I was driving today the name of Russell Brand was mentioned on the radio and I was thinking of how ghastly he was, and I then I realised that Charlotte Church was equally ghastly , but in a different way. They ought to marry. They would be made for each other
People asking you to pay money you own them (only not really, since a lot has already been written off to aid them) is blackmail?
Actually, it doesn't even really seem that, as the problem now appears to be new, slightly kinder arrangements are wanted on both sides but the Greeks aren't trusted to deliver it even if they promised to, and the Greeks are sick of being asked to.
No need to apologise Mr Clipp, I've been called far worse. My point is what is Lamb thinking of discussing such nonsense
Worse than being called a Tory, Mr Blackburn? The mind boggles..... I don´t think Norman Lamb was "discussing such nonsense". I think he was just answering a question. Probably from a journalist.
I see the nasty LDs like to dish it out, before whining when they have to take it.
For some of us, friend Felix, "Tory" is the worst insult available. But some people don´t seem to mind.....
That is why, I think, the term "Tory Herd" has been banned on PBC.
People asking you to pay money you own them (only not really, since a lot has already been written off to aid them) is blackmail?
Actually, it doesn't even really seem that, as the problem now appears to be new, slightly kinder arrangements are wanted on both sides but the Greeks aren't trusted to deliver it even if they promised to, and the Greeks are sick of being asked to.
The incidents at Alton Towers this year are very odd because the park hardly had any problems at all in the previous 35 years of operation. I used to go there a lot as a teenager since we lived nearby and I know it was operated very efficiently; it's not a case of things being covered up in a "previous age" so-to-speak.
Peppa Pig is so middle class. Just look at her family and friends.
Honestly, the thing that I find most offensive about Peppa Pig is the animation. *That* is what will damage children, the lazy, paleolithic 2D styling that will surely not do anything but retard the viewers' own artistic abilities. Makes me mad.
The incidents at Alton Towers this year are very odd because the park hardly had any problems at all in the previous 35 years of operation. I used to go there a lot as a teenager since we lived nearby and I know it was operated very efficiently; it's not a case of things being covered up in a "previous age" so-to-speak.
Many moons ago, in the first or second year of its operation, I nearly lost my front teeth and got a bloodied nose on the Black Hole when my face smacked into the back of the head / seat back of the person in front of me. A little later the ride design was slightly changed.
There were also problems with the cable car in its first year, when a car got blown into trees, and I think a death when someone fell under a roadsweeper.
I used to go to Alton Tower on awful lot, and only paid a few times. Naughty Jessop. ;-)
Peppa Pig is so middle class. Just look at her family and friends.
Honestly, the thing that I find most offensive about Peppa Pig is the animation. *That* is what will damage children, the lazy, paleolithic 2D styling that will surely not do anything but retard the viewers' own artistic abilities. Makes me mad.
Simple art styles can be quite effective at surprisingly complex and emotive stories I find. But they can also just be crap.
No need to apologise Mr Clipp, I've been called far worse. My point is what is Lamb thinking of discussing such nonsense
Worse than being called a Tory, Mr Blackburn? The mind boggles..... I don´t think Norman Lamb was "discussing such nonsense". I think he was just answering a question. Probably from a journalist.
I see the nasty LDs like to dish it out, before whining when they have to take it.
For some of us, friend Felix, "Tory" is the worst insult available. But some people don´t seem to mind.....
That is why, I think, the term "Tory Herd" has been banned on PBC.
If calling people names rocks your boat the LD party is welcome to you. Of course the term 'herd' can hardly be ascribed to the LDs these days.....
No need to apologise Mr Clipp, I've been called far worse. My point is what is Lamb thinking of discussing such nonsense
Worse than being called a Tory, Mr Blackburn? The mind boggles..... I don´t think Norman Lamb was "discussing such nonsense". I think he was just answering a question. Probably from a journalist.
I see the nasty LDs like to dish it out, before whining when they have to take it.
For some of us, friend Felix, "Tory" is the worst insult available. But some people don´t seem to mind.....
That is why, I think, the term "Tory Herd" has been banned on PBC.
If calling people names rocks your boat the LD party is welcome to you. Of course the term 'herd' can hardly be ascribed to the LDs these days.....
No need to apologise Mr Clipp, I've been called far worse. My point is what is Lamb thinking of discussing such nonsense
Worse than being called a Tory, Mr Blackburn? The mind boggles..... I don´t think Norman Lamb was "discussing such nonsense". I think he was just answering a question. Probably from a journalist.
I see the nasty LDs like to dish it out, before whining when they have to take it.
For some of us, friend Felix, "Tory" is the worst insult available. But some people don´t seem to mind.....
That is why, I think, the term "Tory Herd" has been banned on PBC.
If calling people names rocks your boat the LD party is welcome to you. Of course the term 'herd' can hardly be ascribed to the LDs these days.....
No need to apologise Mr Clipp, I've been called far worse. My point is what is Lamb thinking of discussing such nonsense
Worse than being called a Tory, Mr Blackburn? The mind boggles..... I don´t think Norman Lamb was "discussing such nonsense". I think he was just answering a question. Probably from a journalist.
I see the nasty LDs like to dish it out, before whining when they have to take it.
For some of us, friend Felix, "Tory" is the worst insult available. But some people don´t seem to mind.....
That is why, I think, the term "Tory Herd" has been banned on PBC.
If calling people names rocks your boat the LD party is welcome to you. Of course the term 'herd' can hardly be ascribed to the LDs these days.....
A 'taxi' of Lib Dems.
Oh if only Martin D. was here to see this day. Bless you Martin, wherever you are.
Comments
I'm not a tory, I've never phoned or smeared anybody. I'm simply saying that this type of nonsense alienates vast swathes of the population. Its Lamb's prerogative to hold those views and he's honest enough to voice them, but its a big factor in why their vote collapsed.
As they got older, labels became more important to them (though my nephew with Asperger's has never been the least bit interested in our relationship and for all I know in his mid-20s he may still think we're just really good friends).
My other half's great-nephews and nieces are going through the same process. The small ones by and large seem as uninterested as my own nephews and nieces were at that stage.
I can recall only two tricky questions:
1) One of my nephews when he was about five turned to my other half and asked: "so when did you join our family?" Before anyone could answer his elder sister, aged about seven at the time, said: "oh don't be so stupid. [He's] been a member of our family since long before you were born."
2) A couple of years after our civil partnership, one of my other half's great-nieces took a taxi journey with us to London Zoo. She looked puzzled, then asked: "you got married to each other, didn't you?" My other half confirmed that. She paused, then asked: "so which of you was the girl?" My other half stammered "pardon?". She repeated: "which of you was the girl? Who wore the dress?"
In the front, the taxi driver was no doubt trying not to cry with laughter.
Oh, and after our civil partnership, which was in an August, one of my other half's nephews, aged 8 or 9 at the time, went back to school in the September and the class was asked by the teacher what they did in their summer holidays, with all of them writing down what each of them had done. My other half's nephew piped up: "my uncle married a MAN. And they KISSED." I can't imagine the teacher was expecting that response (and none of the children at our civil partnership saw any kissing, so I have no idea where that came from). In two dozen school textbooks in rural Ireland there is a record of our civil partnership.
http://news.sky.com/story/1512786/four-seen-by-medics-in-new-alton-towers-crash
I do wonder about a few gay marriage things, though. Such as surnames (I know women don't always take the man's name now, but it's still common), and whether you're pronounced man and husband/woman and wife.
And surely Tinky Winky bats for the other side? And as for PC Plum in Balamory...
Nice anecdotage from antifrank, too. Good to know that your nieces and nephews don't find your lifestyle odd, though perhaps they haven't seen your post count on here.
My point is what is Lamb thinking of discussing such nonsense
I too am returning from Euroland* and with the same dilemma on Farron vs Lamb. I am off to the East Midlands hustings on Monday and will decide after that. I am increasingly leaning to Lamb, who has impressed me with his forthrightness and is no mean campaigner himself as his Norfolk majority shows.
* In Green Spain - a wonderful place with great food and wine and delightful people.
I don´t think Norman Lamb was "discussing such nonsense". I think he was just answering a question. Probably from a journalist.
From this week's Oldie (which I hasn't to add I only bought because of the article on Peppa!)
Children’s television is dreadful, says Zenga Longmore. And worst of all is Peppa Pig, with its precocious little girl pig, her brother George and the hideously smug multitasking Mummy Pig – all of whom take a sadistic delight in humiliating poor Daddy Pig. It should be banned forthwith.
There are two classes of MP de facto at present, because Parliament does not in practice legislate in respect of Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales where the subject matter of the legislation falls within the legislative competence of a devolved legislature. The government's proposed changes do not alter this situation, since Scottish MPs will retain the ability to vote on legislation applying only to England whose subject matter falls within the legislative competence of the Scottish Parliament.
As I was driving today the name of Russell Brand was mentioned on the radio and I was thinking of how ghastly he was, and I then I realised that Charlotte Church was equally ghastly , but in a different way. They ought to marry. They would be made for each other
Actually, it doesn't even really seem that, as the problem now appears to be new, slightly kinder arrangements are wanted on both sides but the Greeks aren't trusted to deliver it even if they promised to, and the Greeks are sick of being asked to.
That is why, I think, the term "Tory Herd" has been banned on PBC.
It's a funny sort of blackmail.
That said I'd vote "No" if I was in Greece. I'd have done my utmost to get my savings outside the country prior to this point too.
The incidents at Alton Towers this year are very odd because the park hardly had any problems at all in the previous 35 years of operation. I used to go there a lot as a teenager since we lived nearby and I know it was operated very efficiently; it's not a case of things being covered up in a "previous age" so-to-speak.
Con 39% (-2)
Lab 27% (-2)
Lib Dem 9% (+1)
UKIP 11% (+1)
SNP 5% (NC)
Green 6% (+1) http://t.co/utrOOamNIU
There were also problems with the cable car in its first year, when a car got blown into trees, and I think a death when someone fell under a roadsweeper.
I used to go to Alton Tower on awful lot, and only paid a few times. Naughty Jessop. ;-)
new thread