Yes. The key point. It needs to be able to be stated in plain English in a short sentence.
It's almost as if many in the party don't want to be a Social Democratic Party, even though it was an election winning formula, because Blair was associated with that kind of politics.
I don't think it needs to be a sentence, but the Labour Party does have to go back to mission statement level. I thought it would be interesting to see if I could define it, as a Tory, in a sympathetic way. How about:
- Bringing about equality, social and economic; - Making the economy better, for its own sake and better for everyone; - Ensuring a bold vision for the UK by international participation.
That's a pretty good list, Mr Rabbit.
In 1997, when I voted New Labour, what I was hoping for was a party that would try to run the economy at least as well as the Conservatives, but distribute the proceeds of it more fairly.
I think that Labour did this in their first term fairly well, but in the second term they went off plan. That's a separate discussion.
Think of all the Scottish food banks that this trial could have paid for...
How many pairs of tartan trews..?
Or nights in the Peninsula Hotel, Chicago, or more seriously, under privileged students to University because of the Scottish middle class subsidy of free University tuition?
University student numbers are higher under the SNP.
Just not for Scots:
Scottish students are losing out on places at some of the country’s most eminent universities to youngsters from the Continent attracted by the SNP’s promise of a ‘free’ degree, new figures have suggested. Official statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act found the number of Scots accepted at Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee universities has fallen over the past two years.
Edinburgh is an absolute bargain for anyone in the EU, (apart from the English/Welsh/N Irish). It is normally between 20th and 30th in the world rankings list.
There is no other university in the top 50 that has such low tuition fees.
Typically, a EU student will pay about 1500 pounds per annum.
It is not at all surprising that so many people are taking advantage of it.
Lamb would be a safe pair of hands but the LDs cannot afford that now, Farron offers their best chance to win back Labour tactical voters in LD-Tory marginals
I'm not sure that there are all that many seats which could be called LD-Tory marginals.
The LDs are back to c.a. 1970 with Jeremy Thorpe. They achieved a great deal between 1970-74 with the Heath government facing big problems. Thorpe was very charismatic; he was also the sole recipient in England of the NOTA vote (the SNP did well at that time too). Farron might appeal to some but the big difference is he is competing for attention with UKIP and the Greens as the non-establishment choice.
The LDs are back to c.a. 1970 with Jeremy Thorpe. They achieved a great deal between 1970-74 with the Heath government facing big problems. Thorpe was very charismatic; he was also the sole recipient in England of the NOTA vote (the SNP did well at that time too). Farron might appeal to some but the big difference is he is competing for attention with UKIP and the Greens as alternatives to the establishment parties.
And there is the core problem for the Liberals and why they are most likely dead for at least a generation if not forever. There are far too many alternatives to voting Liberal.
Yes. The key point. It needs to be able to be stated in plain English in a short sentence.
It's almost as if many in the party don't want to be a Social Democratic Party, even though it was an election winning formula, because Blair was associated with that kind of politics.
I don't think it needs to be a sentence, but the Labour Party does have to go back to mission statement level. I thought it would be interesting to see if I could define it, as a Tory, in a sympathetic way. How about:
- Bringing about equality, social and economic; - Making the economy better, for its own sake and better for everyone; - Ensuring a bold vision for the UK by international participation.
That's a pretty good list, Mr Rabbit.
In 1997, when I voted New Labour, what I was hoping for was a party that would try to run the economy at least as well as the Conservatives, but distribute the proceeds of it more fairly.
I think that Labour did this in their first term fairly well, but in the second term they went off plan. That's a separate discussion.
I cast an anti-Tory LibDem vote in 1997 and remember saying to a friend a couple of years later that if I had known how right- wing the Blair government would be, I might have voted Labour. However I recall by 2001 I was already back to voting Tory, albeit without much enthusiasm.
Think of all the Scottish food banks that this trial could have paid for...
How many pairs of tartan trews..?
Or nights in the Peninsula Hotel, Chicago, or more seriously, under privileged students to University because of the Scottish middle class subsidy of free University tuition?
University student numbers are higher under the SNP.
Just not for Scots:
Scottish students are losing out on places at some of the country’s most eminent universities to youngsters from the Continent attracted by the SNP’s promise of a ‘free’ degree, new figures have suggested. Official statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act found the number of Scots accepted at Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee universities has fallen over the past two years.
Edinburgh is an absolute bargain for anyone in the EU, (apart from the English/Welsh/N Irish). It is normally between 20th and 30th in the world rankings list.
At Edinburgh University, the proportion of Scots fell by four percentage points to 40.5 per cent, from 8,309 in 2011/12 to 8,014 in 2014/15, while the number of EU students rose from 8.6 per cent (1,602) to 10.3 per cent (2,028) over the same period.
It's Farron or bust for the LD's. Ashdown has done enough damage to the LD by installing Nick Clegg as leader, and after that he now thinks he can shovel Lamb down the throats of whatever is left?
Liberal is so vague though and can mean all sorts of things. Economic liberals? Social Liberals? Libertarians? The key question is how are the LDs different from the other parties - Con, Lab, Green etc
I think the answer to your first questions, Mr Vale II, has to be "yes". Political parties are broad churches, aren´t they? - so there is little point really in trying to discern sub-categories of liberalism. Unless you are an academic, of course.
As for the other question, the other parties are all authoritarian, to a greater or lesser extent.
I don´t want people to tell me what I have to do. This is why I am a Liberal.
Think of all the Scottish food banks that this trial could have paid for...
How many pairs of tartan trews..?
Or nights in the Peninsula Hotel, Chicago, or more seriously, under privileged students to University because of the Scottish middle class subsidy of free University tuition?
University student numbers are higher under the SNP.
Just not for Scots:
Scottish students are losing out on places at some of the country’s most eminent universities to youngsters from the Continent attracted by the SNP’s promise of a ‘free’ degree, new figures have suggested. Official statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act found the number of Scots accepted at Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee universities has fallen over the past two years.
Edinburgh is an absolute bargain for anyone in the EU, (apart from the English/Welsh/N Irish). It is normally between 20th and 30th in the world rankings list.
At Edinburgh University, the proportion of Scots fell by four percentage points to 40.5 per cent, from 8,309 in 2011/12 to 8,014 in 2014/15, while the number of EU students rose from 8.6 per cent (1,602) to 10.3 per cent (2,028) over the same period.
Its a triumph for the SNP!
Yes an absolute triumph. More Scots go to University than every before. Meanwhile all Scottish Universities are busier than every before as a percentage, of course the total size of the cohort is smaller but that's based on birth rates 18 years ago which are nothing to do with the SNP (or any political party really). However, the SNP are making up this gap by attracting the best talent from around the world, many of whom will then stay in Scotland after they graduate. It's a massive win/win for the SNP.
But please, continue bleating about the loss of 140,000 "places" for half day basket weaving courses for pensioners.
Think of all the Scottish food banks that this trial could have paid for...
How many pairs of tartan trews..?
Or nights in the Peninsula Hotel, Chicago, or more seriously, under privileged students to University because of the Scottish middle class subsidy of free University tuition?
University student numbers are higher under the SNP.
Just not for Scots:
Scottish students are losing out on places at some of the country’s most eminent universities to youngsters from the Continent attracted by the SNP’s promise of a ‘free’ degree, new figures have suggested. Official statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act found the number of Scots accepted at Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee universities has fallen over the past two years.
Edinburgh is an absolute bargain for anyone in the EU, (apart from the English/Welsh/N Irish). It is normally between 20th and 30th in the world rankings list.
At Edinburgh University, the proportion of Scots fell by four percentage points to 40.5 per cent, from 8,309 in 2011/12 to 8,014 in 2014/15, while the number of EU students rose from 8.6 per cent (1,602) to 10.3 per cent (2,028) over the same period.
Its a triumph for the SNP!
Yes an absolute triumph. More Scots go to University than every before. Meanwhile all Scottish Universities are busier than every before as a percentage, of course the total size of the cohort is smaller but that's based on birth rates 18 years ago which are nothing to do with the SNP (or any political party really). However, the SNP are making up this gap by attracting the best talent from around the world, many of whom will then stay in Scotland after they graduate. It's a massive win/win for the SNP.
But please, continue bleating about the loss of 140,000 "places" for half day basket weaving courses for pensioners.
Is that not because the entire of the euoprean union except England gets free tuition in Scotland?
Where the SNP want to sit. While during that period the Labour awkward squad also sat there but on the opposite side. It's 18 years since Labour and the third party have had to share a side of the Commons.
Not sure who sat there pre 1997. I think Skinner did.
Think of all the Scottish food banks that this trial could have paid for...
How many pairs of tartan trews..?
Or nights in the Peninsula Hotel, Chicago, or more seriously, under privileged students to University because of the Scottish middle class subsidy of free University tuition?
University student numbers are higher under the SNP.
Just not for Scots:
Scottish students are losing out on places at some of the country’s most eminent universities to youngsters from the Continent attracted by the SNP’s promise of a ‘free’ degree, new figures have suggested. Official statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act found the number of Scots accepted at Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee universities has fallen over the past two years.
Edinburgh is an absolute bargain for anyone in the EU, (apart from the English/Welsh/N Irish). It is normally between 20th and 30th in the world rankings list.
At Edinburgh University, the proportion of Scots fell by four percentage points to 40.5 per cent, from 8,309 in 2011/12 to 8,014 in 2014/15, while the number of EU students rose from 8.6 per cent (1,602) to 10.3 per cent (2,028) over the same period.
Its a triumph for the SNP!
Yes an absolute triumph. More Scots go to University than every before. Meanwhile all Scottish Universities are busier than every before as a percentage, of course the total size of the cohort is smaller but that's based on birth rates 18 years ago which are nothing to do with the SNP (or any political party really). However, the SNP are making up this gap by attracting the best talent from around the world, many of whom will then stay in Scotland after they graduate. It's a massive win/win for the SNP.
But please, continue bleating about the loss of 140,000 "places" for half day basket weaving courses for pensioners.
If we are going to get all sneery about basket weaving courses, let's also accept that 1. most courses at most universities are too crap to bother with and 2. most people at university are too thick to profit from it. Sorry, but there it is. More Scots go to University than every before = more thickoes on more crap courses, though the phenomenon is not confined to Scotland.
Great move by the SNP, Scotland will, as usual, be cheering them on.
Skinner needs to shift himself or the speaker should remove him for disrupting parliament.
At least when the public in scotland ask the SNP what did it do during the 5 years in parliament they can say "absolutely nothing, but at least we made Dennis Skinner angry".
Liberal is so vague though and can mean all sorts of things. Economic liberals? Social Liberals? Libertarians? The key question is how are the LDs different from the other parties - Con, Lab, Green etc
I think the answer to your first questions, Mr Vale II, has to be "yes". Political parties are broad churches, aren´t they? - so there is little point really in trying to discern sub-categories of liberalism. Unless you are an academic, of course.
As for the other question, the other parties are all authoritarian, to a greater or lesser extent.
I don´t want people to tell me what I have to do. This is why I am a Liberal.
Mr PClipp. Are you a Liberal or a Liberal Democrat. Serious and genuine question, which I'm asking myself.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
Think of all the Scottish food banks that this trial could have paid for...
How many pairs of tartan trews..?
Or nights in the Peninsula Hotel, Chicago, or more seriously, under privileged students to University because of the Scottish middle class subsidy of free University tuition?
University student numbers are higher under the SNP.
Just not for Scots:
Scottish students are losing out on places at some of the country’s most eminent universities to youngsters from the Continent attracted by the SNP’s promise of a ‘free’ degree, new figures have suggested. Official statistics obtained under the Freedom of Information (FOI) Act found the number of Scots accepted at Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee universities has fallen over the past two years.
Edinburgh is an absolute bargain for anyone in the EU, (apart from the English/Welsh/N Irish). It is normally between 20th and 30th in the world rankings list.
At Edinburgh University, the proportion of Scots fell by four percentage points to 40.5 per cent, from 8,309 in 2011/12 to 8,014 in 2014/15, while the number of EU students rose from 8.6 per cent (1,602) to 10.3 per cent (2,028) over the same period.
Its a triumph for the SNP!
the SNP are making up this gap by attracting the best talent from around the world
Its the way you tell em!
I'm sure FREE has nowt to do with it......
Oh, and I thought Universities recruited students, not political parties.....
Both, Mr Cole. Both labels are fairly broad ones, and they are not exclusive.
Our Tory friends here on PB are obsessive is trying to distinguish between those who came to the Liberal Democrats via the Liberal Party, and those who came in via the SDP. They usually get it wrong, of course.
And they completely overlook the fact that most Lib Dem members came in long after the two parties were merged into one.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
Off topic, has anyone noticed that Greg Callus, once of this parish, has been caught in the middle of that most deadly of activities, the academic spat?
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
Admit it, you've had it on repeat ever since...
Not over half term in Croatia but it's a joy to return to!
Some interesting names in the list of nominations for Tim Farron. One is Sir Alan Beith who might be thought of as one of the establishment in the party. But there is a significant connection - Farron has a degree in Politics from Newcastle University and Beith was a lecturer in Politics at the same university ( although I don't think he actually taught him).
Great move by the SNP, Scotland will, as usual, be cheering them on.
Skinner needs to shift himself or the speaker should remove him for disrupting parliament.
Squabbling over seats. Jeez, and to think these bell ends think they're owed a pay rise. A substantial pay cut would be more in order.
As if the voting public, their employers, give a shit where any of them sit. They all need to stop acting like pathetic school children, and get on with what they're paid for, and we expect them to do.
Does Skinner actually do any work for his constituents or simply spend his hours, and taxpayers coin at being a professional Dennis?
PeterC Most of the seats the LDs lost in May were to the Tories, from Twickenham to Eastbourne to Solihull, they need tactical votes from Labour voters to win them back
The US has yet to file extradition papers with Switzerland for the FIFA folks, they have until July 6 to do so.
Candidates to succeed Blatter must declare by August.
Also, Chuck Blazer is due to start his testimony today.
Perhaps they are waiting to indict Blatter too. Although I think a deal was struck in exchange for Blatter's resignation.
Something major happened between Blatter's reelection and crowing subsequent statement on Friday, and yesterday.
There might have been some kind of deal, not with the FBI, but as the FBI investigation has now reached the FIFA Secretary General, and multiple news agencies have reported that Blatter is a target, the pressure on him began to build. It may be an exercise in self-preservation, something he's very good at.
Once the questioning of the indicted gets under way, the race for survival will begin, and the first to flip and shop Blatter will get the best deal.
US Attorneys (and particularly the one for the Southern District of New York) are different folks. DOJ will not move on a prosecution until every i is dotted, every t crossed, and every detail and question resolved, so they have a cast iron bullet proof case.
As I've said before, the Feds have limitless patience, limitless resources, and are relentless.
Blatter and FIFA have never faced anything like this.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
Admit it, you've had it on repeat ever since...
Not over half term in Croatia but it's a joy to return to!
For your next avatar may I suggest the pic of Dave with "316" underneath him from the 10pm BBC exit poll. What a glorious moment
the SNP are making up this gap by attracting the best talent from around the world
Its the way you tell em!
I'm sure FREE has nowt to do with it......
Oh, and I thought Universities recruited students, not political parties.....
I can practically hear your frantic desperate wails "SNP Bad, SNP Bad, my lies are true, SNP Bad". It's just a shame that it is both untrue and having absolutely no effect on public opinion in Scotland.
The SNP sets the framework that allows Universities to attract students. Scotland's Universities are doing a magnificent job of accommodating Scottish students while attracting large numbers of talented students from other countries. Many will return home after graduating, many will stay and add to Scotland's economy.
Meanwhile the opponents of the SNP can keep mewling as long and loud as they want. it isn't working.
Surely it would be cheaper for them to share a taxi and visit each LD member individually?
There are roughly 60,000 Lib Dem members.
what on earth are they expecting or do they want from their party?
Centre Right? Centre Left? Left? Right?
WHAT DO THEY WANT???
Ahem...just that along with (population of UK - [60,000]) I can't see what the point of the LDs is.
My view is that Lib Dems (or at least Libs) stand for Freedom, illustrated by:
- Individual freedom (free from government interference)
- Free markets (free from government intervention)
- Free trade (between all countries not just within the EU) and against protectionism
- Free education (up to age 18)
- Free health treatment (at the point of delivery)
- Welfare for those unable to look after themselves
- Health and welfare paid for by a contributory system which qualifies you (a la Beveridge)
- A small state so as to let people run their own lives
A great list.
But.
I suspect that it exists only in your head as to what the Liberals should be like. How closely does it correspond to their manifesto? A lot of it sounds like free-market conservativism to me.
The Liberals were always about not being the others. That of course has now been taken by the Kippers and, less so, the Greens. The one shot they had of actually not being the others for real, putting themselves in govt specifically to be a moderating influence on a larger party, they were slaughtered for it.
The only thing I can remember about them as being a defining credo is the promotion of education (what with hypothecated taxes at one time). And look what happened to them with that.
This is all extremely silly. The SNP need to decide who the enemy is: if they are going to prevent government legislation they disagree with there will have to be a certain amount of liaison and cooperation between the parties. The longer this goes on, the less likely that will happen.
It's like two drunks fighting over the last can of seventy shilling. It's petty and ridiculous. They all need to grow up.
The US has yet to file extradition papers with Switzerland for the FIFA folks, they have until July 6 to do so.
Candidates to succeed Blatter must declare by August.
Also, Chuck Blazer is due to start his testimony today.
Perhaps they are waiting to indict Blatter too. Although I think a deal was struck in exchange for Blatter's resignation.
Something major happened between Blatter's reelection and crowing subsequent statement on Friday, and yesterday.
There might have been some kind of deal, not with the FBI, but as the FBI investigation has now reached the FIFA Secretary General, and multiple news agencies have reported that Blatter is a target, the pressure on him began to build. It may be an exercise in self-preservation, something he's very good at.
Once the questioning of the indicted gets under way, the race for survival will begin, and the first to flip and shop Blatter will get the best deal.
US Attorneys (and particularly the one for the Southern District of New York) are different folks. DOJ will not move on a prosecution until every i is dotted, every t crossed, and every detail and question resolved, so they have a cast iron bullet proof case.
As I've said before, the Feds have limitless patience, limitless resources, and are relentless.
Blatter and FIFA have never faced anything like this.
Thank you for your insights on the way the Feds operate. Most interesting.
(Mr Evershed): My view is that Lib Dems (or at least Libs) stand for Freedom, illustrated by:
- Individual freedom (free from government interference)
- Free markets (free from government intervention)
- Free trade (between all countries not just within the EU) and against protectionism
- Free education (up to age 18)
- Free health treatment (at the point of delivery)
- Welfare for those unable to look after themselves
- Health and welfare paid for by a contributory system which qualifies you (a la Beveridge)
- A small state so as to let people run their own lives.
(Mr Topping) A great list. But. I suspect that it exists only in your head as to what the Liberals should be like. How closely does it correspond to their manifesto? A lot of it sounds like free-market conservativism to me.
I don´t think you should set too much store by the recent manifesto, Mr Topping. A lot of Lib Dems also looked upon it as a bit Conservative-lite, and were not inspired by it. But there was a reason for that. And that is now water under the bridge.
Mr Evershed´s list gives you a much clearer picture of what the Liberal Democrats stand for.
Both Lamb and Farron are squatting in seats that were Tory even in the absolute nadir of 1997 (and in the case of W&L 2001 as well). The fact that the LDs can be reduced to eight seats and still hold these two is completely unacceptable and therefore, from our perspective, renders both candidates entirely unsuitable for leadership.
The equivalent Tory scenario would be Andrew Turner or Edward Timpson running for leader - patently ridiculous.
Off topic, has anyone noticed that Greg Callus, once of this parish, has been caught in the middle of that most deadly of activities, the academic spat?
The tweets between the two men at the centre of all this are as wearying as any pb tussle.
I think we all knew that he was exceptionally bright, as well as being a very nice guy - it's good to see that he's really made progress in his career.
The Islington North MP told the Islington Tribune:
“This decision to stand is in response to an overwhelming call by Labour members who want to see a broader range of candidates and a thorough debate about the future of the party. I am standing to give Labour party members a voice in this debate”.
Off topic, has anyone noticed that Greg Callus, once of this parish, has been caught in the middle of that most deadly of activities, the academic spat?
The tweets between the two men at the centre of all this are as wearying as any pb tussle.
I liked the description of an 'often-unedifying Twitter argument' between the two principles in this matter. Is there any other type of Twitter argument?
Corbyn standing may help Burnham, it means he becomes the 'mainstream' candidate, with Corbyn on the ultra left, Cooper on the soft Brownite wing and Kendall on the ultra Blairite wing
Corbyn standing may help Burnham, it means he becomes the 'mainstream' candidate, with Corbyn on the ultra left, Cooper on the soft Brownite wing and Kendall on the ultra Blairite wing
Corbyn reminds voters of what Labour really are all about. Len pays the bills so he calls the tune.. Even the rowing back from previous ludicrous positions wont help.. they lost the election.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
It's even more fun to re-watch it, whilst re-reading the PB threads the day before election day.
Corbyn has absolutely no chance of winning the leadership; none whatsoever.
I know, but it's like Julian Lewis running for the Tory leadership, he won't win, but he's the sort that would scare off the voters that win elections just by running.
Well. BJ Do tell us all what % of the vote you think Labour might get if he was leader?
Don't know. Would have more chance of getting Scottish seats back for sure. I think the most damaging result would be a victory for the Blair Witch myself.
Is Corbyn Scottish? Sots are voting for parties led by Scots these days. Look at how well Gordon B did in Scotland in 2010. I agree that Ms Kendall would be the most damaging result to the Conservatives. Just as David Miliband would have been.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
It's even more fun to re-watch it, whilst re-reading the PB threads the day before election day.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
It's even more fun to re-watch it, whilst re-reading the PB threads the day before election day.
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
It's even more fun to re-watch it, whilst re-reading the PB threads the day before election day.
I feel that it needs referencing that tim said that the appointment of Coulson would do for Dave... then it was the Scottish Law case that would do for Dave (in which Coulson was cleared/no case to answer..) so what is tim doing now.....(on his twitter feed) He is back to the housing bubble.. Its all terribly sad really.
Corbyn has absolutely no chance of winning the leadership; none whatsoever.
I know, but it's like Julian Lewis running for the Tory leadership, he won't win, but he's the sort that would scare off the voters that win elections just by running.
If there weren't the threshold I would say Corbyn could get enough votes to be awkward. But as it is... doubtful.
With enough backers and a Reasonable run before he is ejected ( even Labour are not that daft) it might be enough to get him a place in shadow cabinet and still cause trouble.
I feel that it needs referencing that tim said that the appointment of Coulson would do for Dave... then it was the Scottish Law case that would do for Dave (in which Coulson was cleared/no case to answer..) so what is tim doing now.....(on his twitter feed) He is back to the housing bubble.. Its all terribly sad really.
If Corbyn is on the ballot then I expect that a lot of people who otherwise would not have voted will cast a ballot. If they decide to use their second and third preferences that would be bad news for Liz.
Some interesting names in the list of nominations for Tim Farron. One is Sir Alan Beith who might be thought of as one of the establishment in the party. But there is a significant connection - Farron has a degree in Politics from Newcastle University and Beith was a lecturer in Politics at the same university ( although I don't think he actually taught him).
The trust vested in the Lib Dem establishment by its members led to this juncture, so I think their hold will be broken now.
TSE/Kle4 Well the Tories elected IDS and almost put Liam Fox in the final round in 2005 so they are not exactly immune to ideological candidates, Jeremy Corbyn is basically playing the John Redwood role in the leadership contest ie all the ideologues and backbench obsessives will back him, he will get most of the voters who backed Abbott in 2010 plus a few who backed Ed Miliband, he might also get McCluskey, though he won't win
A month on and Neil Kinnock's diatribe waving his fist at the selfish uk electorate for not voting labour remains one of the highlights of election night.... spendid background to my filing...
It's even more fun to re-watch it, whilst re-reading the PB threads the day before election day.
Not far behind Kinnock's electorate onslaught is Tim Farron's interview with Neil where his clearly waxed eyebrows are scene-steatling as he tries impersonating a robotic wet fish....
TCPB Kendall may win back a few Tories, she would also maybe lose some to the Greens and turn off SNP voters completely. Corbyn and maybe Cooper have the opposite problem, they would hold the core vote and perhaps appeal to SNP voters but turn off Tories who voted for Blair. Burnham is the only candidate who leads with Tories, UKIP, Labour voters and in Scotland so maybe Labour's best bet to hold its core, win back a few votes in Scotland and win over a few ex New Labour voters who have switched to Cameron as well as a few Kippers
Comments
In 1997, when I voted New Labour, what I was hoping for was a party that would try to run the economy at least as well as the Conservatives, but distribute the proceeds of it more fairly.
I think that Labour did this in their first term fairly well, but in the second term they went off plan. That's a separate discussion.
There is no other university in the top 50 that has such low tuition fees.
Typically, a EU student will pay about 1500 pounds per annum.
It is not at all surprising that so many people are taking advantage of it.
I'm not sure that there are all that many seats which could be called LD-Tory marginals.
Seats where LD are in second place to Conservative
Swing needed seats
0-1% 1
1-2% 3
2-3% 2
3-4% 2
4-5% 2
5-6% 1
6-7% 8
7-8% 2
8-9% 1
9-10% 2
10-15% 6
15-20% 7
Its a triumph for the SNP!
Ashdown has done enough damage to the LD by installing Nick Clegg as leader, and after that he now thinks he can shovel Lamb down the throats of whatever is left?
SNP to escalate battle for Commons front bench amid fury at Labour's 'absolutely pathetic' behaviour
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/journalists/ben-riley-smith/11649598/SNP-to-escalate-battle-for-Commons-front-bench-amid-fury-at-Labours-absolutely-pathetic-behaviour.html
Where did the Lib Dems sit 1997-2010?
As for the other question, the other parties are all authoritarian, to a greater or lesser extent.
I don´t want people to tell me what I have to do. This is why I am a Liberal.
But please, continue bleating about the loss of 140,000 "places" for half day basket weaving courses for pensioners.
As a soap opera, this is fantastic.
Skinner needs to shift himself or the speaker should remove him for disrupting parliament.
Not sure who sat there pre 1997. I think Skinner did.
As for the other question, the other parties are all authoritarian, to a greater or lesser extent.
I don´t want people to tell me what I have to do. This is why I am a Liberal.
Mr PClipp. Are you a Liberal or a Liberal Democrat. Serious and genuine question, which I'm asking myself.
Candidates to succeed Blatter must declare by August.
Also, Chuck Blazer is due to start his testimony today.
I'm sure FREE has nowt to do with it......
Oh, and I thought Universities recruited students, not political parties.....
Our Tory friends here on PB are obsessive is trying to distinguish between those who came to the Liberal Democrats via the Liberal Party, and those who came in via the SDP. They usually get it wrong, of course.
And they completely overlook the fact that most Lib Dem members came in long after the two parties were merged into one.
Although I think a deal was struck in exchange for Blatter's resignation.
SNP makes yer proud doesn't it?
Really? - Resignation sounds small beer for what could amount to several years clink.
Perhaps we all have bits in the Lib Dems who are like us.
As if the voting public, their employers, give a shit where any of them sit. They all need to stop acting like pathetic school children, and get on with what they're paid for, and we expect them to do.
Does Skinner actually do any work for his constituents or simply spend his hours, and taxpayers coin at being a professional Dennis?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QTW1Szr7ktZeVmbnnJex_CfSifFQSUTtZiBVHSiKTmw/edit#gid=0
UKIP targets:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1tMDRrAjK0OMeAfXMvDhh8HPx6GSx9_TBPRc9dm6yMNg/edit#gid=0
There might have been some kind of deal, not with the FBI, but as the FBI investigation has now reached the FIFA Secretary General, and multiple news agencies have reported that Blatter is a target, the pressure on him began to build. It may be an exercise in self-preservation, something he's very good at.
Once the questioning of the indicted gets under way, the race for survival will begin, and the first to flip and shop Blatter will get the best deal.
US Attorneys (and particularly the one for the Southern District of New York) are different folks. DOJ will not move on a prosecution until every i is dotted, every t crossed, and every detail and question resolved, so they have a cast iron bullet proof case.
As I've said before, the Feds have limitless patience, limitless resources, and are relentless.
Blatter and FIFA have never faced anything like this.
The SNP sets the framework that allows Universities to attract students. Scotland's Universities are doing a magnificent job of accommodating Scottish students while attracting large numbers of talented students from other countries. Many will return home after graduating, many will stay and add to Scotland's economy.
Meanwhile the opponents of the SNP can keep mewling as long and loud as they want. it isn't working.
But.
I suspect that it exists only in your head as to what the Liberals should be like. How closely does it correspond to their manifesto? A lot of it sounds like free-market conservativism to me.
The Liberals were always about not being the others. That of course has now been taken by the Kippers and, less so, the Greens. The one shot they had of actually not being the others for real, putting themselves in govt specifically to be a moderating influence on a larger party, they were slaughtered for it.
The only thing I can remember about them as being a defining credo is the promotion of education (what with hypothecated taxes at one time). And look what happened to them with that.
It's like two drunks fighting over the last can of seventy shilling. It's petty and ridiculous. They all need to grow up.
It does not reflect well on the SNP.
1) Blatter is under FBI investigation
2)The FBI is now investigating the 2018 and 2022 World Cup awards
The NY Times,ABC News and Reuters reported this last night.
Kendall's team say they have 35 - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/labour-leadership-contest-liz-kendall-set-to-enter-race-after-winning-the-backing-of-35-mps-10290267.html
Burnham is on 52 declared and Cooper 31. Creagh 6.
That's 124 out of 233.
Plenty of room for Corbyn to russle some feathers.
If he can announce 10 nominations, I think that's that's fair. If it's 20, 12/1 is more likely, 30+ 8/1.
Mr Evershed´s list gives you a much clearer picture of what the Liberal Democrats stand for.
A great track record of defying the whips too, according to wiki.
The equivalent Tory scenario would be Andrew Turner or Edward Timpson running for leader - patently ridiculous.
“This decision to stand is in response to an overwhelming call by Labour members who want to see a broader range of candidates and a thorough debate about the future of the party. I am standing to give Labour party members a voice in this debate”.
Jeremy Corbyn has agreed to stand as Left Candidate in Labour leadership election. Everyone contact Labour MPs to put him on ballot paper.
Jon Trickett @jon_trickett 16m16 minutes ago
I will nominate Jeremy Corbyn.
Got a few allies, clearly.
I think the most damaging result would be a victory for the Blair Witch myself.
I agree that Ms Kendall would be the most damaging result to the Conservatives. Just as David Miliband would have been.
Edit; I see HYUFD beat me to the thought.
http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2015/05/06/marf-on-this-final-day/
Fantastic!
Oh dear me ....heart of stone etc.
Jeremy Corbyn as leader is the kind of fantasy entertained only on two decadent corners of the internet. Nostalgic leftists and PB Tories.
90% supportive.
;-)
The ComRes poll that was delayed from last night, and was due tonight has now been moved to tomorrow morning.
Corbyn. Well. Ha.
He is no Tony Benn.