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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Harry Hayfield’s Local By-Election Preview : December 4th 2

SystemSystem Posts: 12,213
edited December 2014 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Harry Hayfield’s Local By-Election Preview : December 4th 2014

Netherfield on Mansfield (Mansfield Independent Forum defence)
Result of last election to council (2011): Labour 26, Mansfield Independents 10 (Labour majority of 16)
Result of last election in ward (2011): Mansfield Independents 444 (51%), Labour 401 (46%), Liberal Democrats 34 (4%)
Candidates duly nominated: Karen Seymour (TUSC), Sid Walker (UKIP), Sarah Wright (Lab)

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

  • First
  • ArtistArtist Posts: 1,893
    Strange that Tim Aker is potentially going to be a MEP, local councilor and PPC.
  • Cheers for this, Mr. Hayfield.

    Mr. Eagles, even under Alexander and Ancient Rome cavalry had their own separate ranks (I forget the details, but the Romans did have decurions and ala (and turma, I think)).

    In the back of the TA Dodge book on Alexander I believe there's an appendix with a full list of ranks. [I was going to write a military fantasy based on the Macedonian system].
  • Artist said:

    Strange that Tim Aker is potentially going to be a MEP, local councilor and PPC.

    Wasn't/Isn't Mike Hancock both a MP and Councillor.

    And some of the Nats were/are MPs and MSPs concurrently.
  • TSE, cavalry units have always been squadrons, probably dating back to the 18th Century. It is the use for military aviation units that is modern.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    edited December 2014

    Cheers for this, Mr. Hayfield.

    Mr. Eagles, even under Alexander and Ancient Rome cavalry had their own separate ranks (I forget the details, but the Romans did have decurions and ala (and turma, I think)).

    In the back of the TA Dodge book on Alexander I believe there's an appendix with a full list of ranks. [I was going to write a military fantasy based on the Macedonian system].

    That might explain it, I thought it could be a reason.

    I was thinking that it might be that Cavalrymen were Preening Egotists.
  • Artist said:

    Strange that Tim Aker is potentially going to be a MEP, local councilor and PPC.

    Wasn't/Isn't Mike Hancock both a MP and Councillor.

    And some of the Nats were/are MPs and MSPs concurrently.
    Wouldn't the EU Parly rules mean he has to give up being an MEP if elected MP?

  • TSE, cavalry units have always been squadrons, probably dating back to the 18th Century. It is the use for military aviation units that is modern.

    Cheers.
  • Artist said:

    Strange that Tim Aker is potentially going to be a MEP, local councilor and PPC.

    Wasn't/Isn't Mike Hancock both a MP and Councillor.

    And some of the Nats were/are MPs and MSPs concurrently.
    Wouldn't the EU Parly rules mean he has to give up being an MEP if elected MP?

    I believe so.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    http://order-order.com/2014/12/04/first-they-came-for-the-upper-decile/

    One of the reasons why the Tory core is evaporating.
  • Cheers for this, Mr. Hayfield.

    Mr. Eagles, even under Alexander and Ancient Rome cavalry had their own separate ranks (I forget the details, but the Romans did have decurions and ala (and turma, I think)).

    In the back of the TA Dodge book on Alexander I believe there's an appendix with a full list of ranks. [I was going to write a military fantasy based on the Macedonian system].

    That might explain it, I thought it could be a reason.

    I was thinking that it might be that Cavalrymen were Preening Egotists.
    Infantryman's joke:

    "Look at that horse's arse"

    "But it's a nice horse he's sitting on"

  • Cheers for this, Mr. Hayfield.

    Mr. Eagles, even under Alexander and Ancient Rome cavalry had their own separate ranks (I forget the details, but the Romans did have decurions and ala (and turma, I think)).

    In the back of the TA Dodge book on Alexander I believe there's an appendix with a full list of ranks. [I was going to write a military fantasy based on the Macedonian system].

    That might explain it, I thought it could be a reason.

    I was thinking that it might be that Cavalrymen were Preening Egotists.
    Infantryman's joke:

    "Look at that horse's arse"

    "But it's a nice horse he's sitting on"

    Heh. James Hewitt was a Cavalryman, which proves our point.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,880
    TFS/MD (last thread) Spending as a percentage of gdp has fallen from 47%-44% so far, it is forecast to fall to 35-40% by 2018-19. Which would be at the same level, if not slightly less than the 38% of GDP taken in tax revenue.

    What I do find unfair is ringfencing, non-frontline NHS spending, overseas aid and pensioners' benefits like free TV licenses should face the same cuts as every other department
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    Artist said:

    Strange that Tim Aker is potentially going to be a MEP, local councilor and PPC.

    Wasn't/Isn't Mike Hancock both a MP and Councillor.

    And some of the Nats were/are MPs and MSPs concurrently.
    Wouldn't the EU Parly rules mean he has to give up being an MEP if elected MP?

    That maybe, then the next UKIP member on the list takes his place.
  • Mr. HYUFD, I heartily agree.
  • HYUFD said:

    TFS/MD (last thread) Spending as a percentage of gdp has fallen from 47%-44% so far, it is forecast to fall to 35-40% by 2018-19. Which would be at the same level, if not slightly less than the 38% of GDP taken in tax revenue.

    What I do find unfair is ringfencing, non-frontline NHS spending, overseas aid and pensioners' benefits like free TV licenses should face the same cuts as every other department

    Why can't free the tv licenses tab get picked up by the BBC?
    Would be a good way of trimming their overall spend.

  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    FPT;for the benefit of isam.
    Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES.
    The facts

    1) 1.5 million of the total 4.6 million households in receipt of tax credits do not have any adult in paid employment.

    2) many other recipients of in-work tax credits (0.9 million of the 3.1 million working) work less than 30 hours per week - so would be ineligible if single as they fail to meet the minimum hours requirement;

    That means 2.4 million of 4.6 million of tax credit recipients- the majority (largely) - are indeed families, and that's without dissecting the circumstances of the remaining 2.2 million, many of whom will be families.

    The ones I see in the course of my work are almost always families. The payouts are often very substantial. Removing entitlements to tax credits and housing benefits on the basis of insufficient Uk residence would make it financially difficult for these people to live here.



  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    @TSE good tip re Cineworld right next to Ashton West.

    Enjoyed it muchly
  • MikeK said:

    http://order-order.com/2014/12/04/first-they-came-for-the-upper-decile/

    One of the reasons why the Tory core is evaporating.

    I don't agree clobbering the wealthy is economically productive, but that graph shows middle earners has done comparatively well from this government. Of course the real core, pensioners, have done the best. Too well, if you ask me. They can take some trimming and still vote Tory.

    Although I'd have cut further and faster, and not been so populist with the tax strikes at upper earners and lowered the top rate to 40p in one swoop, and cut IHT, my beef is not with Osborne.

    He is shrinking the size of the state, balancing the book, reforming stamp duty, pensions, higher rate tax, fuel duty and income tax thresholds. He is also prioritising investment in science, infrastructure and trying to kick-start the North.

    The silly things are the wrecking of the justice and defence budgets. Also stupidly making international aid commitment, and NHS real-terms increases, sacrosanct.

    I detect much more of Cameron in the latter than Osborne. But I also think Osborne is too much of a social liberal to do anything about immigration, and he's not a BOO'er. But if he was, and adressed all the above, I would vote Tory again.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited December 2014
    The Irish PM is closer to getting booted out from his own party's leadership today, the irish peasants seem ungrateful for the record GDP increase as his support continues to slump in the polls:

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/kenny-two-bad-polls-away-from-crisis-1.2025614

    " “We need a John Redwood, ” said one deputy in reference to the Tory frontbencher who mounted an ultimately doomed leadership challenge to John Major in 1995.
    One Fine Gael minister put it: “This is a crisis of party politics.” "

    A warning on those putting all the eggs in one basket.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    chestnut said:

    FPT;for the benefit of isam.

    Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES.
    The facts

    1) 1.5 million of the total 4.6 million households in receipt of tax credits do not have any adult in paid employment.

    2) many other recipients of in-work tax credits (0.9 million of the 3.1 million working) work less than 30 hours per week - so would be ineligible if single as they fail to meet the minimum hours requirement;

    That means 2.4 million of 4.6 million of tax credit recipients- the majority (largely) - are indeed families, and that's without dissecting the circumstances of the remaining 2.2 million, many of whom will be families.

    The ones I see in the course of my work are almost always families. The payouts are often very substantial. Removing entitlements to tax credits and housing benefits on the basis of insufficient Uk residence would make it financially difficult for these people to live here.





    The government tables disagree with you

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/tax-credits-entitlement-tables-working-and-have-no-children/tax-credits-entitlement-tables-working-and-have-no-children
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,880
    edited December 2014
    MD Indeed, it is pure politicking to protect them, it just means other departments have to face even deeper cuts

    Hertsmere I also agree, the BBC could easily afford it
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Craig Woodhouse ‏@craigawoodhouse · 17m17 minutes ago
    Top spot by @kiranstacey - GNI revision adds £1bn to our foreign aid bill http://on.ft.com/1s0jYGG

  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    I don't think that will be necessary, Tim Aker is well known and well funded in a UKIP stronghold in a council seat which UKIP own by 17% just months ago.
    Mansfield and Rossendale are the open races tonight.
  • isam said:

    chestnut said:

    FPT;for the benefit of isam.

    Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES.
    The facts

    1) 1.5 million of the total 4.6 million households in receipt of tax credits do not have any adult in paid employment.

    2) many other recipients of in-work tax credits (0.9 million of the 3.1 million working) work less than 30 hours per week - so would be ineligible if single as they fail to meet the minimum hours requirement;

    That means 2.4 million of 4.6 million of tax credit recipients- the majority (largely) - are indeed families, and that's without dissecting the circumstances of the remaining 2.2 million, many of whom will be families.

    The ones I see in the course of my work are almost always families. The payouts are often very substantial. Removing entitlements to tax credits and housing benefits on the basis of insufficient Uk residence would make it financially difficult for these people to live here.



    The government tables disagree with you

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/tax-credits-entitlement-tables-working-and-have-no-children/tax-credits-entitlement-tables-working-and-have-no-childrenIn what way? Single people get tax credits but they (usually) have to work 30 hours a week and earn very little to qualify. For families with children, the hours you have to work are less (I think it's 24 between you), the income higher, and of course as well as Working Tax Credits you get Child Tax Credits, and tax credits for childcare. So I think Chestnut is right. it is easier to qualify for TCs as a family, and you are likely to get paid a lot more as well.

  • Mr. HYUFD, it's ever been thus. Roman Emperors threw money at the army to try and save themselves, then the barbarians.

    Strong emperors like Trajan, Aurelian and Basil could buck the trend. Average ones presided over slow decline, and atrocious ones like the Angeli, Commodus and Honorius accelerated it drastically.

    I wonder whether those who followed Alexander or Hannibal ever complained about how crap their leaders were, and wished for the good old days when Philip or Hamilcar were in charge.

    We face some interesting strategic problems. Our debt's enormous, the deficit is enormous, interest payments are mounting and we're shackled to a corpse called the eurozone. Our constitutional position both domestically and overseas is unsustainable, liberties are being curtailed, our demographic forecasts are appalling and there is a substantial lack of faith in our political class.

    On the other hand, we retain control of our monetary policy (which should be a statement of the obvious, but is a distinct advantage over the cabal of madness called the eurozone), growth is better here than elsewhere by a large margin, unemployment is low and inflation is low.

    We may have a window of opportunity to position ourselves better.

    But then, the Romans did in the third century, when some muppet caught stealing money killed Aurelian and prevented him putting the Empire on a permanently sound footing. [If he hadn't, it's possible it would still be here today. And if that sounds mad, consider the Crisis of the Third Century deepened after his death despite the good work of Probus et al. and the Empire lasted until the mid-15th century].
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    isam said:
    Do I need to point you in the direction of a dictionary?

    "Largely" = mostly, to great extent.

    Putting up a table of how the means test functions doesn't equate to the number of claimants.
  • HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    edited December 2014
    FPT

    @TSE

    "Mr Llama, you're a chap well versed in military matters, can I pick your brain on a matter.

    Why are the sub-ordinate units of a Cavalry Regiment known as Squadrons, and not Battalions like the rest of the Army.

    Squadrons are what one associates with the RAF and not the regular army."

    The designation of a sub-unit as a Squadron is originally a naval term. One talked about the West Indies squadron, for example, meaning a group of ships under a commander but too small to call a fleet.

    A cavalry regiment is about the same size as an army battalion and its squadrons are therefore roughly equivalent to an army company. Why they are termed squadrons rather than companies I don't know, but it has been that way for a couple of hundred years at least, which means that it is good enough. Cavalry squadrons are divided into troops rather than the platoons one finds in the infantry. The Royal Marines also use the term Troop but for formations of company and not platoon size.

    Of course the army is not without its anomalies. A regiment may have one or several battalions, but a multi-battalion regiment will almost never fight as a regiment (unlike the practice in, for example, the US army). The Royal Regiment of Artillery is, of course, not a regiment at all; it is a corps and is made up of numerous regiments. On the other hand the old Royal Rifle Corps was never a corps but only a regiment, but the Royal Tank Regiment is a corps (the RTR exists only to provide armoured jobs for officers who aren't "of the right stuff" for cavalry regiments).

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known*, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    *In recent years members of the RAF have become known as "Kevins", this is not a practice I support.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2014

    isam said:

    chestnut said:

    FPT;for the benefit of isam.

    Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES.
    The facts

    1) 1.5 million of the total 4.6 million households in receipt of tax credits do not have any adult in paid employment.

    2) many other recipients of in-work tax credits (0.9 million of the 3.1 million working) work less than 30 hours per week - so would be ineligible if single as they fail to meet the minimum hours requirement;

    That means 2.4 million of 4.6 million of tax credit recipients- the majority (largely) - are indeed families, and that's without dissecting the circumstances of the remaining 2.2 million, many of whom will be families.

    The ones I see in the course of my work are almost always families. The payouts are often very substantial. Removing entitlements to tax credits and housing benefits on the basis of insufficient Uk residence would make it financially difficult for these people to live here.



    The government tables disagree with you

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/tax-credits-entitlement-tables-working-and-have-no-children/tax-credits-entitlement-tables-working-and-have-no-children
    In what way? Single people get tax credits but they (usually) have to work 30 hours a week and earn very little to qualify. For families with children, the hours you have to work are less (I think it's 24 between you), the income higher, and of course as well as Working Tax Credits you get Child Tax Credits, and tax credits for childcare. So I think Chestnut is right. it is easier to qualify for TCs as a family, and you are likely to get paid a lot more as well.



    Maybe I am seeing things, but looks to me as though table 2 has a column titled

    "Single, 16 or over & work 16-29 hours a week"

    Then shows how much you are entitled to in tax credits

    @chestnut‌ said

    "many other recipients of in-work tax credits (0.9 million of the 3.1 million working) work less than 30 hours per week - so would be ineligible if single as they fail to meet the minimum hours requirement;"
  • @TSE good tip re Cineworld right next to Ashton West.

    Enjoyed it muchly

    Glad you enjoyed it.

    Was recently IMAX'd
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2014
    chestnut said:

    isam said:
    Do I need to point you in the direction of a dictionary?

    "Largely" = mostly, to great extent.

    Putting up a table of how the means test functions doesn't equate to the number of claimants.
    "many other recipients of in-work tax credits (0.9 million of the 3.1 million working) work less than 30 hours per week - so would be ineligible if single as they fail to meet the minimum hours requirement;"

    There is a column on the link I provided showing the amount that single people working less than 30 hours can claim. You ay they are "ineligible"

    So either you, or the government tables are wrong, that's all I am saying

    Could be them
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    "Single, 16 or over & work 16-29 hours a week"

    Only applies to disabled workers.
  • FPT

    @TSE

    "Mr Llama, you're a chap well versed in military matters, can I pick your brain on a matter.

    Why are the sub-ordinate units of a Cavalry Regiment known as Squadrons, and not Battalions like the rest of the Army.

    Squadrons are what one associates with the RAF and not the regular army."

    The designation of a sub-unit as a Squadron is originally a naval term. One talked about the West Indies squadron, for example, meaning a group of ships under a commander but too small to call a fleet.

    A cavalry regiment is about the same size as an army battalion and its squadrons are therefore roughly equivalent to an army company. Why they are termed squadrons rather than companies I don't know, but it has been that way for a couple of hundred years at least, which means that it is good enough. Cavalry squadrons are divided into troops rather than the platoons one finds in the infantry. The Royal Marines also use the term Troop but for formations of company and not platoon size.

    Of course the army is not without its anomalies. A regiment may have one or several battalions, but a multi-battalion regiment will almost never fight as a regiment (unlike the practice in, for example, the US army). The Royal Regiment of Artillery is of course not a regiment at all it is a corps and is made up of numerous regiments. On the other hand the old Royal Rifle Corps was never a corps but only a regiment, but the Royal Tank Regiment was a corps (the RTR exists only to provide armoured jobs for officers who aren't "of the right stuff" for cavalry regiments).

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    isam said:

    So either you, or the government tables are wrong, that's all I am saying

    Could be them

    "You are single or have a partner and the person who works has a disability"

    It only relates to disabled workers.


  • FPT

    @TSE

    "Mr Llama, you're a chap well versed in military matters, can I pick your brain on a matter.

    Why are the sub-ordinate units of a Cavalry Regiment known as Squadrons, and not Battalions like the rest of the Army.

    Squadrons are what one associates with the RAF and not the regular army."

    The designation of a sub-unit as a Squadron is originally a naval term. One talked about the West Indies squadron, for example, meaning a group of ships under a commander but too small to call a fleet.

    A cavalry regiment is about the same size as an army battalion and its squadrons are therefore roughly equivalent to an army company. Why they are termed squadrons rather than companies I don't know, but it has been that way for a couple of hundred years at least, which means that it is good enough. Cavalry squadrons are divided into troops rather than the platoons one finds in the infantry. The Royal Marines also use the term Troop but for formations of company and not platoon size.

    Of course the army is not without its anomalies. A regiment may have one or several battalions, but a multi-battalion regiment will almost never fight as a regiment (unlike the practice in, for example, the US army). The Royal Regiment of Artillery is of course not a regiment at all it is a corps and is made up of numerous regiments. On the other hand the old Royal Rifle Corps was never a corps but only a regiment, but the Royal Tank Regiment was a corps (the RTR exists only to provide armoured jobs for officers who aren't "of the right stuff" for cavalry regiments).

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    edited December 2014

    FPT

    @TSE

    "y.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
    Hah I like that.

    Has today's James Bond news met with your approval?
  • FPT

    @TSE

    "y.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
    Hah I like that.

    Has today's James Bond news met with your approval?
    Oh my word, "Yes". I think I did a sex-wee.
  • FPT

    @TSE

    "y.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
    Hah I like that.

    Has today's James Bond news met with your approval?
    Oh my word, "Yes". I think I did a sex-wee.
    Same here, Christoph Waltz as Blofeld is an inspired casting decision.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2014
    chestnut said:

    isam said:

    So either you, or the government tables are wrong, that's all I am saying

    Could be them

    "You are single or have a partner and the person who works has a disability"

    It only relates to disabled workers.


    Ah fair enough you are right on that one, my mistake

    Although your original point was that single people didn't claim them, which was wrong

    "What about families, you know, the ones who actually claim tax credits" implied that single people didn't/couldn't
  • Given the lack of excitable tweeting, I am presume the YouGov will be same old same old.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,821
    edited December 2014
    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    'Next time we'll really punish the fat arsed opponents by throwing everything but the kitchen sink at them.' I think that's it.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,880
    MD Not sure how you got from ringfencing to the roman empire other than Emperors' throwing money at the army, which Osborne is doing in reverse with money from the army going to the NHS and overseas aid. Agree with your overall comments about our positives and negatives, albeit demographically our population is still set to grow to 70 million within a decade or 2
  • FPT

    @TSE

    "y.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
    Hah I like that.

    Has today's James Bond news met with your approval?
    Oh my word, "Yes". I think I did a sex-wee.
    Same here, Christoph Waltz as Blofeld is an inspired casting decision.
    Something to look forward to post GE2015. If I can bear to wait out the next 10.5 months.
  • Mr. HYUFD, in Rome, power lay with the soldiers. In modern Britain, pensioners (because they actually vote reliably). Admittedly, they tend not to murder Prime Ministers to remove them from office, but the basic principle remains sound.

    Who is this Waltz fellow?
  • FPT

    @TSE

    "y.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
    Hah I like that.

    Has today's James Bond news met with your approval?
    Oh my word, "Yes". I think I did a sex-wee.
    Same here, Christoph Waltz as Blofeld is an inspired casting decision.
    Something to look forward to post GE2015. If I can bear to wait out the next 10.5 months.
    2015 is going to be a great cinematic year.

    Avengers, Minions, James Bond, Jurassic Park, Star Wars, Ant Man, Jupiter Ascending, Terminator, Pitch Perfect 2 (Guilty Pleasure I know)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    edited December 2014

    Mr. HYUFD, in Rome, power lay with the soldiers. In modern Britain, pensioners (because they actually vote reliably). Admittedly, they tend not to murder Prime Ministers to remove them from office, but the basic principle remains sound.

    Who is this Waltz fellow?

    Top actor, he's been in Inglorious Basterds, Horrible Bosses 2, Water for Elephants, Green Hornet, Zero Theorem, and his best ever role, in Django Unchained for which he won an Oscar
  • Mr. Eagles, I'll take your word for it. Never seen any of those.
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245

    FPT

    @TSE

    "Mr Llama, you're a chap well versed in military matters, can I pick your brain on a matter.

    Why are the sub-ordinate units of a Cavalry Regiment known as Squadrons, and not Battalions like the rest of the Army.

    Squadrons are what one associates with the RAF and not the regular army."

    The designation of a sub-unit as a Squadron is originally a naval term. One talked about the West Indies squadron, for example, meaning a group of ships under a commander but too small to call a fleet.

    A cavalry regiment is about the same size as an army battalion and its squadrons are therefore roughly equivalent to an army company. Why they are termed squadrons rather than companies I don't know, but it has been that way for a couple of hundred years at least, which means that it is good enough. Cavalry squadrons are divided into troops rather than the platoons one finds in the infantry. The Royal Marines also use the term Troop but for formations of company and not platoon size.

    Of course the army is not without its anomalies. A regiment may have one or several battalions, but a multi-battalion regiment will almost never fight as a regiment (unlike the practice in, for example, the US army). The Royal Regiment of Artillery is of course not a regiment at all it is a corps and is made up of numerous regiments. On the other hand the old Royal Rifle Corps was never a corps but only a regiment, but the Royal Tank Regiment was a corps (the RTR exists only to provide armoured jobs for officers who aren't "of the right stuff" for cavalry regiments).

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    Re 3, if we had poor weather in Ireland and were waiting for a heli lift, we could pretty much guarantee if it was a crab aircraft, we'd either be walking or waiting. If it was navy, we'd be back on schedule.
  • isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    Star performers don't necessarily give their best performances on a cold Tuesday night in Stoke.
  • A vile attack on Shneur, a top UKIPer I've met.

    A Labour Party twitter account has accused UKIP of being 'full of money-grabbing Jews' in a
    disgraceful attack on UKIP candidate Shneur Odze this evening.

    http://nopenothope.blogspot.co.uk/2014/12/london-labour-ukip-full-of-money.html
  • Mr. HYUFD, in Rome, power lay with the soldiers. In modern Britain, pensioners (because they actually vote reliably). Admittedly, they tend not to murder Prime Ministers to remove them from office, but the basic principle remains sound.

    Who is this Waltz fellow?

    Top actor, he's been in Inglorious Basterds, Horrible Bosses 2, Water for Elephants, Green Hornet, Zero Theorem, and his best ever role, in Django Unchained for which he won an Oscar
    Django Unchained. My favourite film of last few years. Puts '12 years a Slave' to Shame.
    ps recommend Paddington, Definitely an adult film.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    FPT

    @TSE

    "Mr Llama, you're a chap well versed in military matters, can I pick your brain on a matter.

    Why are the sub-ordinate units of a Cavalry Regiment known as Squadrons, and not Battalions like the rest of the Army.

    Squadrons are what one associates with the RAF and not the regular army."

    The designation of a sub-unit as a Squadron is originally a naval term. One talked about the West Indies squadron, for example, meaning a group of ships under a commander but too small to call a fleet.

    ....

    Interesting subject.
    The etymology of 'squadron' is Italian meaning 'square'. From the 16th centuary.
    We can imagine squares of troops - pikemen etc. So it may be that for tightly packed masses of cavalry it was maintained. One can perhaps imagine early galleons grouped tightly together.
    'regiment' from Latin and old French, really means to rule or be ordered and in fact in military use it possibly comes after the term squadron in the sense of 'ordered systematically'
  • valleyboy said:

    Mr. HYUFD, in Rome, power lay with the soldiers. In modern Britain, pensioners (because they actually vote reliably). Admittedly, they tend not to murder Prime Ministers to remove them from office, but the basic principle remains sound.

    Who is this Waltz fellow?

    Top actor, he's been in Inglorious Basterds, Horrible Bosses 2, Water for Elephants, Green Hornet, Zero Theorem, and his best ever role, in Django Unchained for which he won an Oscar
    Django Unchained. My favourite film of last few years. Puts '12 years a Slave' to Shame.
    ps recommend Paddington, Definitely an adult film.
    I loved Paddington, seen it three times already.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    isam said:

    Although you're original point was that single people didn't claim them, which was wrong

    "What about families, you know, the ones who actually claim tax credits"

    What proportion of the tax credit case-load are single people? My view, expressed then in a conversation with two other contributors was "Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES."

    That's accurate.



  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,880
    MD From Maximus to Victor Meldrew in a thousand years
  • valleyboy said:

    Mr. HYUFD, in Rome, power lay with the soldiers. In modern Britain, pensioners (because they actually vote reliably). Admittedly, they tend not to murder Prime Ministers to remove them from office, but the basic principle remains sound.

    Who is this Waltz fellow?

    Top actor, he's been in Inglorious Basterds, Horrible Bosses 2, Water for Elephants, Green Hornet, Zero Theorem, and his best ever role, in Django Unchained for which he won an Oscar
    Django Unchained. My favourite film of last few years. Puts '12 years a Slave' to Shame.
    ps recommend Paddington, Definitely an adult film.
    I loved Paddington, seen it three times already.
    Wow!

  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2014

    A vile attack on Shneur, a top UKIPer I've met.

    A Labour Party twitter account has accused UKIP of being 'full of money-grabbing Jews' in a
    disgraceful attack on UKIP candidate Shneur Odze this evening.

    http://nopenothope.blogspot.co.uk/2014/12/london-labour-ukip-full-of-money.html

    Blimey

    I was going to say it was probably a fake like the @UKIPNorthLondon @UKIPEastLondon ones.. are we sure the "apology" isn't a double bluff?

    I'd bet 1/2 it isn't a real Labour account, and that its the same person doing the fake UKIP ones
  • UKIP's best chance of a gain this week is in St. Marys on Adur District council tomorrow.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2014
    chestnut said:

    isam said:

    Although you're original point was that single people didn't claim them, which was wrong

    "What about families, you know, the ones who actually claim tax credits"

    What proportion of the tax credit case-load are single people? My view, expressed then in a conversation with two other contributors was "Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES."

    That's accurate.



    Cant spend another Thursday night arguing over this. My original comment, that you seem to disagree with, was that stopping in work tax credits will not have much of an effect on immigration of migrant Labour from Eastern Europe.

    Nothing you have said has changed my view
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    It was dem mean spoof accounts on the interwebz taking the pee out of our harking back to the halcyon days and dirty tricks !


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11273244/Ukip-warns-supporters-about-fake-town-impersonating-them-on-Twitter.html

    Ukip failed to see the funny side of a parody account about a fake town impersonating them on Twitter.
    MEP David Coburn was eager to ensure his followers weren’t fooled by the @Trumpton_Ukip account and urged his followers to block or report it.

    A spate of fake Ukip Twitter accounts have emerged this week, with the Eurosceptic party claiming to be the victim of “a dirty tricks campaign”.

    Mr Coburn has clearly never watched popular children’s TV show Trumpton, which was first aired on the BBC in the 1960s.

    UKIP Trumpton say its number of followers has quadrupled since Mr Coburn’s tweet.
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known*, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    So, they didn't shoot down any Argentine aeroplanes during the Falklands War?

    I thought RAF pilots flew from the carriers.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    isam said:

    Cant spend another Thursday night arguing over this. My original comment, that you seem to disagree with, was that stopping in work tax credits will not have much of an effect on immigration of migrant Labour from Eastern Europe.

    Nothing you have said has changed that

    I don't think it will make much difference to single blokes. I think it will make a substantial difference to people looking to move their families here.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Scott_P said:

    @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.

    Green on 8 !
  • Ninoinoz said:

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known*, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    So, they didn't shoot down any Argentine aeroplanes during the Falklands War?

    I thought RAF pilots flew from the carriers.
    AFAIAA the Argentinian Air Force took no part in the Falklands war.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    chestnut said:

    isam said:

    Cant spend another Thursday night arguing over this. My original comment, that you seem to disagree with, was that stopping in work tax credits will not have much of an effect on immigration of migrant Labour from Eastern Europe.

    Nothing you have said has changed that

    I don't think it will make much difference to single blokes. I think it will make a substantial difference to people looking to move their families here.
    I would have thought, though you may have stats to disprove this, that a lot of EU migrants start families here rather than bring young children with them?
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    FPT

    @TSE

    "y.

    Many thanks.

    The mantra of the British Army has always been

    1) Never march on Moscow
    2) Never get involved in the Balkans
    3) Never trust the RAF

    Wise words
    4) Never go fighting with your armies in mainland Asia*

    *Unless it's colonial. Retaking Burma, and defeating communists in Malaysia are ok.
    Hah I like that.

    Has today's James Bond news met with your approval?
    Oh my word, "Yes". I think I did a sex-wee.
    Same here, Christoph Waltz as Blofeld is an inspired casting decision.
    Something to look forward to post GE2015. If I can bear to wait out the next 10.5 months.
    2015 is going to be a great cinematic year.

    Avengers, Minions, James Bond, Jurassic Park, Star Wars, Ant Man, Jupiter Ascending, Terminator, Pitch Perfect 2 (Guilty Pleasure I know)
    None of them are not sequels though, also "Ant Man"?
    We have Superman, Batman, Spiderman, Iron Man and now Ant Man?
    What's next, Bicycle Repair Man?
    I think I'll stick to TV, although the return of Blofeld is something to look at I'm sure they will massacre the film.
  • @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    Scott_P said:

    @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.

    Too early to say, we will know by Monday night.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited December 2014
    The Greens have selected more candidates than the LDs as things currently stand.

    Check out my candidates' spreadsheet for details.
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464

    Ninoinoz said:

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known*, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    So, they didn't shoot down any Argentine aeroplanes during the Falklands War?

    I thought RAF pilots flew from the carriers.
    AFAIAA the Argentinian Air Force took no part in the Falklands war.
    What??????? Shome mishtake shurely! They were flying from places like Rio Gallegos on the mainland.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited December 2014
    We might have a rule of thumb for yougov polls: UKIP get half of the Tory share and the Greens get half of the UKIP share.
  • Noting the Mirror front page, has any MP ever been described as a junior MP?
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited December 2014
    TGOHF said:

    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    It was dem mean spoof accounts on the interwebz taking the pee out of our harking back to the halcyon days and dirty tricks !


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11273244/Ukip-warns-supporters-about-fake-town-impersonating-them-on-Twitter.html

    Ukip failed to see the funny side of a parody account about a fake town impersonating them on Twitter.
    MEP David Coburn was eager to ensure his followers weren’t fooled by the @Trumpton_Ukip account and urged his followers to block or report it.

    A spate of fake Ukip Twitter accounts have emerged this week, with the Eurosceptic party claiming to be the victim of “a dirty tricks campaign”.

    Mr Coburn has clearly never watched popular children’s TV show Trumpton, which was first aired on the BBC in the 1960s.

    UKIP Trumpton say its number of followers has quadrupled since Mr Coburn’s tweet.
    He was probably pointing out that there are many fake UKIP accounts spouting unpleasant views on twitter and UKIP weren't associated with any of them.. So what if it is a fictional place? If it has UKIPs name all over it, and is making unpleasant comments, its best to make everyone aware that its fake.

    Most people under 35 would never have heard of Trumpton the show, and could easily have thought it was a legit UKIP account

    If someone set up a spoof account with your "real" name on it, a picture of you, and a fictional town as the address would you be happy for it to say racist and homophobic things unchallenged?

  • HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    Ninoinoz said:

    The RAF, or Crab Air as they are not quite affectionately known*, grew out of the old Royal Flying Corps and the Royal Naval Air Service. I expect that they chose the term squadron for their standard unit because it was too small (12 aircraft) to be a regiment but too big to be a company, plus they had delusions of grandeur (knights of the sky and all that stuff). Frankly who cares what the Crabs think or do - they haven't shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945 and their primary objective is to preserve the RAF and to hell with the County's defence needs. They couldn't even close the runway at Port Stanley.

    So, they didn't shoot down any Argentine aeroplanes during the Falklands War?

    I thought RAF pilots flew from the carriers.
    RAF pilots did fly from the carriers in the Falklands war but they flew ground attack versions of the Harrier and were not engaged in air combat. The Sea harriers, which did shoot down enemy aeroplanes, were all Fleet Air Arm, i.e. Royal Navy.

    In Korea a couple of RAF pilots did shoot down enemy aeroplanes but those pilots were on exchange to the USA and were flying American aircraft under American direction. There were British aerial victories in Korea but again they were won by RN Pilots flying from carriers.

    Really and truly the RAF have not shot down an enemy aeroplane since 1945.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,972
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    "A vile attack on Shneur, a top UKIPer I've met."

    Just what UKIP need. A modern man

    http://www.timesofisrael.com/orthodox-politician-draws-ire-for-refusal-to-shake-womens-hands/
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    isam said:

    TGOHF said:

    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    It was dem mean spoof accounts on the interwebz taking the pee out of our harking back to the halcyon days and dirty tricks !


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11273244/Ukip-warns-supporters-about-fake-town-impersonating-them-on-Twitter.html

    Ukip failed to see the funny side of a parody account about a fake town impersonating them on Twitter.
    MEP David Coburn was eager to ensure his followers weren’t fooled by the @Trumpton_Ukip account and urged his followers to block or report it.

    A spate of fake Ukip Twitter accounts have emerged this week, with the Eurosceptic party claiming to be the victim of “a dirty tricks campaign”.

    Mr Coburn has clearly never watched popular children’s TV show Trumpton, which was first aired on the BBC in the 1960s.

    UKIP Trumpton say its number of followers has quadrupled since Mr Coburn’s tweet.
    He was probably pointing out that there are many fake UKIP accounts spouting unpleasant views on twitter and UKIP weren't associated with any of them.. So what if it is a fictional place? If it has UKIPs name all over it, and is making unpleasant comments, its best to make everyone aware that its fake.

    Most people under 35 would never have heard of Trumpton the show, and could easily have thought it was a legit UKIP account

    If someone set up a spoof account with your "real" name on it, a picture of you, and a fictional town as the address would you be happy for it to say racist and homophobic things unchallenged?

    You'd love Trumpton - those were the days eh ?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    valleyboy said:

    Mr. HYUFD, in Rome, power lay with the soldiers. In modern Britain, pensioners (because they actually vote reliably). Admittedly, they tend not to murder Prime Ministers to remove them from office, but the basic principle remains sound.

    Who is this Waltz fellow?

    Top actor, he's been in Inglorious Basterds, Horrible Bosses 2, Water for Elephants, Green Hornet, Zero Theorem, and his best ever role, in Django Unchained for which he won an Oscar
    Django Unchained. My favourite film of last few years. Puts '12 years a Slave' to Shame.
    ps recommend Paddington, Definitely an adult film.
    I loved Paddington, seen it three times already.
    Looking forward to seeing it. Paddington's Garden Game was the first computer game I played, on the ZX Spectrum+2, in about 1987.
  • compouter2compouter2 Posts: 2,371

    @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.

    ARF!
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    isam said:

    I would have thought, though you may have stats to disprove this, that a lot of EU migrants start families here rather than bring young children with them?

    I think that most EU migrants that have families bring them with them. I have no stats to prove/disprove, just what I encounter when working.

  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    TGOHF said:

    isam said:

    TGOHF said:

    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    It was dem mean spoof accounts on the interwebz taking the pee out of our harking back to the halcyon days and dirty tricks !


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11273244/Ukip-warns-supporters-about-fake-town-impersonating-them-on-Twitter.html

    Ukip failed to see the funny side of a parody account about a fake town impersonating them on Twitter.
    MEP David Coburn was eager to ensure his followers weren’t fooled by the @Trumpton_Ukip account and urged his followers to block or report it.

    A spate of fake Ukip Twitter accounts have emerged this week, with the Eurosceptic party claiming to be the victim of “a dirty tricks campaign”.

    Mr Coburn has clearly never watched popular children’s TV show Trumpton, which was first aired on the BBC in the 1960s.

    UKIP Trumpton say its number of followers has quadrupled since Mr Coburn’s tweet.
    He was probably pointing out that there are many fake UKIP accounts spouting unpleasant views on twitter and UKIP weren't associated with any of them.. So what if it is a fictional place? If it has UKIPs name all over it, and is making unpleasant comments, its best to make everyone aware that its fake.

    Most people under 35 would never have heard of Trumpton the show, and could easily have thought it was a legit UKIP account

    If someone set up a spoof account with your "real" name on it, a picture of you, and a fictional town as the address would you be happy for it to say racist and homophobic things unchallenged?

    You'd love Trumpton - those were the days eh ?
    I remember it vaguely... it's funny how the you use the same thought process and apply the same lazy stereotypes of any UKIP supporter that people would associate with an old school racist/sexist bigot, but probably don't realise you are doing it... its just the same thing with a different target.. at least it makes you laugh I suppose

    "Take my mother in Law.. I wish some c*nt would.." boom boom
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,972
    Eagle

    "I loved Paddington, seen it three times already."

    An anti UKIP film for youngsters (and the most surreal London I've ever seen in a film)
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    John Mann MP ‏@JohnMannMP · 5h5 hours ago
    Former Whip admitted would help cover up alleged abuse “involving small boys” All parties must now open up Whip files http://labourclp50.nationbuilder.com/john_mann_mp_calls_on_party_leaders_to_open_up_whip_archives

  • Not to make light of what are serious allegations...but according to the Mirror Mark Pritchard is another "Top Tory". How many people even on here know much about him?

    As I said 2 days ago, the handful of Tory MPs who have never been described as "top", must feel very left out.
  • I think the three establishment parties have finally realized they can't compete with UKIP on policy, so they are now resorting to smear campaigns, but they are not working. The more smears there are aimed at UKIP the more UKIP's support increases.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Roger said:

    Eagle

    "I loved Paddington, seen it three times already."

    An anti UKIP film for youngsters (and the most surreal London I've ever seen in a film)

    Maybe we can have two mins of hate for UKIP in the Trojan Horse schools popping up in East London and Birmingham?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    isam said:

    TGOHF said:

    isam said:

    TGOHF said:

    isam said:

    Any advice on excuse making if UKIP don't win the by election tonight? I am not sure how to do it and there are plenty of experts on here

    We weren't really trying/It's only a by election/We only lost by xxxx amount/we'll win it next time

    all 4?

    It was dem mean spoof accounts on the interwebz taking the pee out of our harking back to the halcyon days and dirty tricks !


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/11273244/Ukip-warns-supporters-about-fake-town-impersonating-them-on-Twitter.html

    Ukip failed to see the funny side of a parody account about a fake town impersonating them on Twitter.
    MEP David Coburn was eager to ensure his followers weren’t fooled by the @Trumpton_Ukip account and urged his followers to block or report it.

    A spate of fake Ukip Twitter accounts have emerged this week, with the Eurosceptic party claiming to be the victim of “a dirty tricks campaign”.

    Mr Coburn has clearly never watched popular children’s TV show Trumpton, which was first aired on the BBC in the 1960s.

    UKIP Trumpton say its number of followers has quadrupled since Mr Coburn’s tweet.
    He was probably pointing out that there are many fake UKIP accounts spouting unpleasant views on twitter and UKIP weren't associated with any of them.. So what if it is a fictional place? If it has UKIPs name all over it, and is making unpleasant comments, its best to make everyone aware that its fake.

    Most people under 35 would never have heard of Trumpton the show, and could easily have thought it was a legit UKIP account

    If someone set up a spoof account with your "real" name on it, a picture of you, and a fictional town as the address would you be happy for it to say racist and homophobic things unchallenged?

    You'd love Trumpton - those were the days eh ?
    I remember it vaguely... it's funny how the you use the same thought process and apply the same lazy stereotypes of any UKIP supporter that people would associate with an old school racist/sexist bigot, but probably don't realise you are doing it... its just the same thing with a different target.. at least it makes you laugh I suppose

    "Take my mother in Law.. I wish some c*nt would.." boom boom
    What's sexist or racist about Trumpton? You need thicker skin if you are going to stand in the GE.
  • @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.

    The question is when was this poll conducted ...... before or after the Autumn statement?

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,880
    edited December 2014
    Labour Green Coalition? It surely must now be included into the mix alongside the Tory UKIP, Labour SNP, Tory LD, Labour LD combinations
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited December 2014
    You know it's bad for the Lib Dems when it's no longer even a surprise when theey're 5th.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    chestnut said:

    FPT;for the benefit of isam.

    Tax Credits are largely paid to FAMILIES.


    The ones I see in the course of my work are almost always families. The payouts are often very substantial. Removing entitlements to tax credits and housing benefits on the basis of insufficient Uk residence would make it financially difficult for these people to live here.





    Isn't that the whole idea? By denying recent immigrants tax credits and housing benefit they cannot afford to live here.
  • @tnewtondunn: YouGov/Sun poll tonight: no Autumn Statement bounce for Coalition. Libs 5th + Greens high again. LAB 32%, CON 31%, UKIP 15%, GRN 8%, LD 7%.

    The question is when was this poll conducted ...... before or after the Autumn statement?

    If it follows YouGov's normal schedule, it began at 5pm yesterday and finished at 3pm today
  • I'm looking forward to Green/UKIP crossover. ;)
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,972
    ISAM

    "Maybe we can have two mins of hate for UKIP in the Trojan Horse schools popping up in East London and Birmingham?"

    I'm being serious. There's no doubt at all that the film's political target was UKIP. One could say they laid it on with a trowel but as I was sympathetic to the message i didn't mind
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    I'm looking forward to Green/UKIP crossover. ;)

    How about SNP/LibDem crossover?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    I'm confident Paddington would have been one of the 50,000 immigrants UKIP would have allowed into the country each year.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    The important YG for tomorrow

    @WikiGuido: "64% say he's not funny" wounder RT @suttonnick: Friday's Sun front page:
    Brand - The Nation Speaks
    #bbcpapers http://t.co/Jgk6hYRaoJ
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    edited December 2014
    YouGov on Ozzy/The Autumn Statement, his net ratings fall 3% in a week.

    That's because the number of people who think he's doing a bad job as Chancellor has gone up from 41 to 44 per cent.

    The number who think he's doing a good job remains unchanged at 33 per cent.

    However, his lead over Ed Balls on who would make the best Chancellor has gone up from 13 to 15 points.

    In another boost for Mr Osborne, 74 per cent of voters think his Stamp Duty shake-up if a good idea, compared to just 7 per cent who don't.
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    isam said:

    John Mann MP ‏@JohnMannMP · 5h5 hours ago
    Former Whip admitted would help cover up alleged abuse “involving small boys” All parties must now open up Whip files http://labourclp50.nationbuilder.com/john_mann_mp_calls_on_party_leaders_to_open_up_whip_archives

    Governments whips are, well, Government officials. They used to operate from 12 Downing Street, after all.

    Any documents created during Government should be available to the public after 30 years.

    Tim Fortescue was a Tory Government whip in the 1970-1974 Heath Government.
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