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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Here’s a funny thing. Polls that carry out fieldwork online

SystemSystem Posts: 11,696
edited November 2014 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Here’s a funny thing. Polls that carry out fieldwork online are 4-9% more favourable to the “big 2″ than phone surveys

The big methodology difference is in sampling. The phone firms used randomised dialling and theoretically anybody with a landline, and now mobile, can be included.

Read the full story here


«134

Comments

  • Options
    JamesMJamesM Posts: 221
    edited November 2014
    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.
  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    @Plato,

    Answered you re video recording and editing h/w and s/w on the previous thread.
  • Options
    BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 7,997
    Mike - Are you also suggesting that the phone surveys are a more accurate estimate than the on-line polls? You seem to be. In which case we should make an automatic adjustment (-2% from each of the main parties?) to all on-line polls. It makes no difference to the lead but might make a difference to the implied number of seats.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Does it let you break the encryption of VTS files? I've a T1 drive full of ripped stuff from elsewhere, but not the kit to do it myself yet - so tried using Aimer DVD Ripper - that sometimes works. Hence my thinking of just plucking it off the screen instead to get round the problem.

    I've oodles of screengrabbed video sitting on my T2 DVR that I want to save to a hard format too - urgh, so annoying. I feel a whole weekend sat on the carpet fiddling about is due.
    Swiss_Bob said:

    Plato said:

    OT Anyone on here recommend a video editing software package? I'm trying to convert all my DVDs to soft copy. So I'm thinking of buying a streaming capture product that will suck the playback from the screen instead. I can also save streamed TV or interwebbery and use when I want to/on the device that suits me.

    I'm looking at this and it seems quite attractive and great value. Linky > movavi.com/suite/video-conversion.html

    Any expertise on this subject most appreciated. I really resent buying DVDs and then being trapped in that format/rummaging about for the right disc when I want to skip about a boxset or bodge up my own favourite clips. I can do it with CDs easy-peasy.

    I've used Audacity to fix weird Microsoft file property errors in audio files and it's fine for shareware - I prefer something more slick interface wise.

    PS @DavidL‌ - I think it was you who recommended giffgaff after your son subscribed for his new mobile - it's brilliant! He's got an excellent nose for a great deal and superb customer service

    You can buy very cheap devices which include the editing software, I use a Grabby Terratec USB device using S Video as the input, it's much higher quality than the RCA yellow plug, I bought a much more expensive HD card but it doesn't work :-(
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    SNP have manged to add another 5000 members in a week post conference. Up to 90,000 now.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Congratulations! No longer a virgin. Now you can give others knowing looks ;^ )
    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Golly, just read it's the first time Merc have won since Fangio - Holy Moly.
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    edited November 2014
    Alistair said:

    SNP have manged to add another 5000 members in a week post conference. Up to 90,000 now.

    What's the membership fee ? Or, is it 2 for the price of 1 ?

    90000 is equivalent to 1.08 million UK wide !!!
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,137
    Barnesian said:

    Mike - Are you also suggesting that the phone surveys are a more accurate estimate than the on-line polls? You seem to be. In which case we should make an automatic adjustment (-2% from each of the main parties?) to all on-line polls. It makes no difference to the lead but might make a difference to the implied number of seats.

    Not sure the actual result in R&S would support that suggestion.

  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

    Now, you need to buy a round and the ceremony can end.
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    surbiton said:

    Alistair said:

    SNP have manged to add another 5000 members in a week post conference. Up to 90,000 now.

    What's the membership fee ? Or, is it 2 for the price of 1 ?

    90000 is equivalent to 1.08 million UK wide !!!
    Minimum fee is £12, "standard" fee is £36.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    FPT:
    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    She was born in Great Yarmouth, the daughter of an Austrian father and Filipina mother, who gave her, she says, “an immigrant work ethic” as well as an early love of music. “My dad came over from Austria when he was seven,” she says, “and mum came in the 1960s. The mentality was: ‘We’re here to work.’ If I didn’t work a 16-hour day, I couldn’t look my aunties in the eye. You’ve got to remember many of them are cleaners. There are no silver spoons. We are a family of grafters.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/im-a-celebrity/11247621/Myleene-Klass-a-deadly-force-of-nature-pure-and-simple.html

    No wonder she took up the violin, tears blinding me thinking of her climbing all those chimneys 32 hours a day.
    The comments on here about Ms Klass long ago left fair comment and are becoming a complete disgrace, in the face of no evidence what so ever people appear to have decided she must be a tax dodger, I hope OGH's lawyers are on standby for that one. MG has called her "thick" any number of times, which seems doubtful given her success, plus the minor detail of her degree in astronomy.
    Klass has been an amateur astronomer for most of her life,[68] having been taught the basics by her father. She was one of only a handful of celebrities, engineers and scientists who were at the UK National Space Centre control centre for the touch-down of the UK Mars probe Beagle 2 in the early morning of Christmas Day 2003. Since then she has been a keen supporter of the UK's work in the European space programme
    As for all the comments which amount to allegations of parasitism, perhaps people should reflect on her charity work in Sierra Leone, Children in Need and several other children's charities.
    Incidentally the comments made by here mother I completely believe, I have some experience here since I employee a number of working class filipinos, and teach filipino children every day.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    Plato said:

    Golly, just read it's the first time Merc have won since Fangio - Holy Moly.

    True, although it's only their fifth competition season if F1 since Fangio won.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    FPT

    Gadfly's excellent graph showing signs of Peak Kipper

    http://www.mediafire.com/view/8yyma1ni3z34set/YouGov polls 12 months to 23 November 2014.jpg#
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    http://order-order.com/2011/09/04/why-cant-progressives-be-the-change-they-want-to-see/
  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    edited November 2014
    Plato said:

    Does it let you break the encryption of VTS files? I've a T1 drive full of ripped stuff from elsewhere, but not the kit to do it myself yet - so tried using Aimer DVD Ripper - that sometimes works. Hence my thinking of just plucking it off the screen instead to get round the problem.

    I've oodles of screengrabbed video sitting on my T2 DVR that I want to save to a hard format too - urgh, so annoying. I feel a whole weekend sat on the carpet fiddling about is due.

    Swiss_Bob said:

    Plato said:

    OT Anyone on here recommend a video editing software package? I'm trying to convert all my DVDs to soft copy. So I'm thinking of buying a streaming capture product that will suck the playback from the screen instead. I can also save streamed TV or interwebbery and use when I want to/on the device that suits me.

    I'm looking at this and it seems quite attractive and great value. Linky > movavi.com/suite/video-conversion.html

    Any expertise on this subject most appreciated. I really resent buying DVDs and then being trapped in that format/rummaging about for the right disc when I want to skip about a boxset or bodge up my own favourite clips. I can do it with CDs easy-peasy.

    I've used Audacity to fix weird Microsoft file property errors in audio files and it's fine for shareware - I prefer something more slick interface wise.

    PS @DavidL‌ - I think it was you who recommended giffgaff after your son subscribed for his new mobile - it's brilliant! He's got an excellent nose for a great deal and superb customer service

    You can buy very cheap devices which include the editing software, I use a Grabby Terratec USB device using S Video as the input, it's much higher quality than the RCA yellow plug, I bought a much more expensive HD card but it doesn't work :-(
    I take the feed off the Sky box (S Video or RCA) so there's no encryption at that point. I also have a card in the PC that I have the satellite cabled into, you can slot a card into it, ie a Sky card (I think) that will decrypt a signal if you have the right card for the encrypted channel.

    Anything you have already have recorded onto any device can be copied, as long as it's not encrypted and the box has an RCA or S Video output you're good, not forgetting the red and white RCA plugs for stereo sound. You can also record surround sound because standard Dolby surround is recorded on the stereo channels (not 5.1).

    EDIT Re VTS is that an encoding format like MP3? or is it actually an encrypted format, there's a difference, lots of editing software will accept lots of different encoding formats and allow you to save it in the format you like. I think MP4 is one of the standard video encoding formats.
  • Options
    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    Indigo said:

    FPT:

    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    She was born in Great Yarmouth, the daughter of an Austrian father and Filipina mother, who gave her, she says, “an immigrant work ethic” as well as an early love of music. “My dad came over from Austria when he was seven,” she says, “and mum came in the 1960s. The mentality was: ‘We’re here to work.’ If I didn’t work a 16-hour day, I couldn’t look my aunties in the eye. You’ve got to remember many of them are cleaners. There are no silver spoons. We are a family of grafters.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/im-a-celebrity/11247621/Myleene-Klass-a-deadly-force-of-nature-pure-and-simple.html

    No wonder she took up the violin, tears blinding me thinking of her climbing all those chimneys 32 hours a day.
    The comments on here about Ms Klass long ago left fair comment and are becoming a complete disgrace, in the face of no evidence what so ever people appear to have decided she must be a tax dodger, I hope OGH's lawyers are on standby for that one. MG has called her "thick" any number of times, which seems doubtful given her success, plus the minor detail of her degree in astronomy.
    Klass has been an amateur astronomer for most of her life,[68] having been taught the basics by her father. She was one of only a handful of celebrities, engineers and scientists who were at the UK National Space Centre control centre for the touch-down of the UK Mars probe Beagle 2 in the early morning of Christmas Day 2003. Since then she has been a keen supporter of the UK's work in the European space programme
    As for all the comments which amount to allegations of parasitism, perhaps people should reflect on her charity work in Sierra Leone, Children in Need and several other children's charities.
    Incidentally the comments made by here mother I completely believe, I have some experience here since I employee a number of working class filipinos, and teach filipino children every day.

    And ultra dweebs think she can't buy a garage for 2 million in the same way she abysmally failed to eat a horse when she was so hungry.

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.
  • Options
    peter_from_putneypeter_from_putney Posts: 6,875
    This is surely also due in no small measdure to the "shy syndrome".
  • Options
    JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548
    If things stay as they are now at Hull, and Saints beat Villa tomorrow, we'll have double the points of Spurs or Liverpool!
  • Options
    MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    MarqueeMark said:

    Barnesian said:

    Mike - Are you also suggesting that the phone surveys are a more accurate estimate than the on-line polls? You seem to be. In which case we should make an automatic adjustment (-2% from each of the main parties?) to all on-line polls. It makes no difference to the lead but might make a difference to the implied number of seats.

    Not sure the actual result in R&S would support that suggestion.

    The only Rochester polls were done by phone because that's the only way of getting a big enough sample. The final figures would have been pretty good if my suggestion had been adopted and they's discounted the views of non-2010 voters by 50%. Ashcroft was best.

  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    On topic, I reminded of the scene in Valkerie where a lieutenant in the Reserve Army asks the commander whether a coup is underway and the commander replies that he is certain one is; he just isn't sure which side he is being given orders by.

    The differences in the results between the methods are significant for one to be clearly systemically wrong. The question is which one.

    It probably comes down to turnout and particularly with the new UKIP supporters. Panel membership is unlikely to include many politically disengaged (I know YouGov and the others poll for much more than politics but the sort of people who sign up for polling panels are likely to be the sort to be more engaged in society at most levels, including politics - in other words, they contain a disproportionately small number of non-voters). By contrast, the phone pollsters are picking up more former non-voters who now say they'll vote, and in particular, vote UKIP. There is also the related question of prompting, which antifrank covered in an excellent post on his blog the other day.

    How legitimate are those findings? My inclination would be to favour those which give less rather than more weight to those who didn't vote in 2010.
  • Options
    Paul_Mid_BedsPaul_Mid_Beds Posts: 1,409
    edited November 2014
    Now Frank Field has put the boot in.....

    "Former welfare minister Frank Field said the [Thornberry] incident was ‘the most serious thing that has happened’ to Labour - ‘because it gives vent to what everybody’s guts are telling them about us’.

    ‘It’s the north London set we’ve got to control. They are a Berlin Wall trying to prevent us reaching out to our voters and like the Berlin Wall they’ve got to be demolished.
    ‘Ed’s trying to move us on immigration and welfare and with one blast of a tweet she wrecks that and puts us back to square one. The real problem we have is that there’s a whole group of them.’"


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2846174/Miliband-clique-millionaire-allies-Berlin-Wall-Labour-ordinary-working-class-voters.html

    Also the top rated readers comment in that article states:

    "Saturday's poll in the Mirror shows that 71% of its' readers feel that UKIP would be a fresh start for the UK and a poll in today's Sun shows UKIP on 28% and Labour on 25% at the General Election. Labour is a dead man walking."

    Not seen anything about that poll here?
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,234
    Alistair said:

    surbiton said:

    Alistair said:

    SNP have manged to add another 5000 members in a week post conference. Up to 90,000 now.

    What's the membership fee ? Or, is it 2 for the price of 1 ?

    90000 is equivalent to 1.08 million UK wide !!!
    Minimum fee is £12, "standard" fee is £36.
    Up another 2k to 92k during yesterday's Hydro event. They must be raking in a pretty penny in subs alone.

  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    edited November 2014
    Plato said:

    Golly, just read it's the first time Merc have won since Fangio - Holy Moly.

    Plato, here is a link to a list of devices that you might be interested in:

    http://www.pcupgrade.co.uk/category.asp?categoryid=486

    I have bought stuff here and they are reputable and helpful from my experience. Phone them and ask their advice, they're a lot cheaper than me :-)

    This is similar or identical to the one I use, it's probably a newer version of the one I have, it looks the same but that doesn't mean much because I bought mine a few years ago, it's £40.

    http://www.pcupgrade.co.uk/productdetails.asp?ProductID=6935&categoryid=486

    Grabby - Technical data
    Features

    PC interface: USB 2.0
    Analogue signal inputs: Composite- (RCA) and S-Video, Stereo Audio (RCA)
    Video standard: PAL, NTSC, SECAM
    Capture rate PAL: Up to 720x576 pixel/25 fps
    Capture rate NTSC: Up to 720x480 pixel/29,9 fps
    Powered via USB bus (no additional power supply needed)
    Software
    MAGIX Movies on DVD TerraTec Edition
    System requirements
    PC with 2,0 GHz Intel® or AMD CPU
    Microsoft® Windows®XP SP 2 or Windows® Vista® SP1
    512 RAM (1024 MB recommended)
    USB 2.0 interface
    sound card
    800 MB of available hard drive space for program installation
    Graphic card with a least 800 x 600 pixel resolution (1024 x 768 recommended)
    CD/DVD drive for archiving your recordings
    5 GB of available hard drive space for DVD disc burning
    Scope of delivery
    Grabby
    Video cable
    Software and driver DVD
    Quick Start Guide
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,137
    philiph said:

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.

    I won't be entirely surprised if the Chancellor re-uses it in his Autumn statement.

  • Options
    Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,059
    Poch=reckless

    Spurs=labour

    That is all.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    MarqueeMark said:

    philiph said:

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.

    I won't be entirely surprised if the Chancellor re-uses it in his Autumn statement.

    Hopefully it's Im going to point at a few things and cut the tax on them..
  • Options
    ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 4,993
    MarqueeMark said:

    philiph said:

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.

    I won't be entirely surprised if the Chancellor re-uses it in his Autumn statement.

    In the way that he pointed at pasties and tried to tax them?
  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
  • Options
    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,317
    Paul_Mid_Beds said:

    Now Frank Field has put the boot in.....

    "Former welfare minister Frank Field said the [Thornberry] incident was ‘the most serious thing that has happened’ to Labour - ‘because it gives vent to what everybody’s guts are telling them about us’.

    ‘It’s the north London set we’ve got to control. They are a Berlin Wall trying to prevent us reaching out to our voters and like the Berlin Wall they’ve got to be demolished.
    ‘Ed’s trying to move us on immigration and welfare and with one blast of a tweet she wrecks that and puts us back to square one. The real problem we have is that there’s a whole group of them.’"


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2846174/Miliband-clique-millionaire-allies-Berlin-Wall-Labour-ordinary-working-class-voters.html

    Also the top rated readers comment in that article states:

    "Saturday's poll in the Mirror shows that 71% of its' readers feel that UKIP would be a fresh start for the UK and a poll in today's Sun shows UKIP on 28% and Labour on 25% at the General Election. Labour is a dead man walking."

    Not seen anything about that poll here?

    It's now blindingly obvious that an alliance of non-London Labour MPs have it in for Ed and his metropolitan clique. And why not? UKIP is of minor significance in London but could wreak havoc in the North and Midlands. Perhaps Ed needs to step up his assault on Myleene Klass. It would demonstrate he carries no flag for posh, affluent, creative types and might endear him to the Don't-Know-Much-About-Art Brigade. Sure, it could attract accusations of philistinism from the pages of the Guardian and the London Review of Books, but does anyone really care?
  • Options
    JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548
    Paul_Mid_Beds said:

    Now Frank Field has put the boot in.....

    "Former welfare minister Frank Field said the [Thornberry] incident was ‘the most serious thing that has happened’ to Labour - ‘because it gives vent to what everybody’s guts are telling them about us’.

    ‘It’s the north London set we’ve got to control. They are a Berlin Wall trying to prevent us reaching out to our voters and like the Berlin Wall they’ve got to be demolished.
    ‘Ed’s trying to move us on immigration and welfare and with one blast of a tweet she wrecks that and puts us back to square one. The real problem we have is that there’s a whole group of them.’"


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2846174/Miliband-clique-millionaire-allies-Berlin-Wall-Labour-ordinary-working-class-voters.html

    Also the top rated readers comment in that article states:

    "Saturday's poll in the Mirror shows that 71% of its' readers feel that UKIP would be a fresh start for the UK and a poll in today's Sun shows UKIP on 28% and Labour on 25% at the General Election. Labour is a dead man walking."

    Not seen anything about that poll here?

    Think it's a Sun poll of Sun readers
  • Options
    peter_from_putneypeter_from_putney Posts: 6,875
    No sign as yet of Nate Silver (538.com) offering his thoughts on GE 2015. Hopefully he will initiate coverage over the coming weeks.
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Paul_Mid_Beds said:

    Now Frank Field has put the boot in.....

    "Former welfare minister Frank Field said the [Thornberry] incident was ‘the most serious thing that has happened’ to Labour - ‘because it gives vent to what everybody’s guts are telling them about us’.

    ‘It’s the north London set we’ve got to control. They are a Berlin Wall trying to prevent us reaching out to our voters and like the Berlin Wall they’ve got to be demolished.
    ‘Ed’s trying to move us on immigration and welfare and with one blast of a tweet she wrecks that and puts us back to square one. The real problem we have is that there’s a whole group of them.’"


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2846174/Miliband-clique-millionaire-allies-Berlin-Wall-Labour-ordinary-working-class-voters.html

    Also the top rated readers comment in that article states:

    "Saturday's poll in the Mirror shows that 71% of its' readers feel that UKIP would be a fresh start for the UK and a poll in today's Sun shows UKIP on 28% and Labour on 25% at the General Election. Labour is a dead man walking."

    Not seen anything about that poll here?

    Why doesn't Frank Field join UKIP ? That will solve a problem.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Being right is such as nasty Tory concept though, you need to move with the times, the zeitgeist now is to be spectacularly wrong, but in a well meaning, and sanctimonious way. I think the idea is that people wont mind that you are talking b*llocks, so long as its social aware, ethical and right-on b*llocks.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    surbiton said:

    Paul_Mid_Beds said:

    Now Frank Field has put the boot in.....

    "Former welfare minister Frank Field said the [Thornberry] incident was ‘the most serious thing that has happened’ to Labour - ‘because it gives vent to what everybody’s guts are telling them about us’.

    ‘It’s the north London set we’ve got to control. They are a Berlin Wall trying to prevent us reaching out to our voters and like the Berlin Wall they’ve got to be demolished.
    ‘Ed’s trying to move us on immigration and welfare and with one blast of a tweet she wrecks that and puts us back to square one. The real problem we have is that there’s a whole group of them.’"


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2846174/Miliband-clique-millionaire-allies-Berlin-Wall-Labour-ordinary-working-class-voters.html

    Also the top rated readers comment in that article states:

    "Saturday's poll in the Mirror shows that 71% of its' readers feel that UKIP would be a fresh start for the UK and a poll in today's Sun shows UKIP on 28% and Labour on 25% at the General Election. Labour is a dead man walking."

    Not seen anything about that poll here?

    Why doesn't Frank Field join UKIP ? That will solve a problem.
    I think he has aspirations for Labour to become the party of the working man.
  • Options
    FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    ThomasNashe said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    philiph said:

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.

    I won't be entirely surprised if the Chancellor re-uses it in his Autumn statement.

    In the way that he pointed at pasties and tried to tax them?
    The same way as warmed up fish and chips are already taxed?
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    david_herdson said:

    On topic, I reminded of the scene in Valkerie where a lieutenant in the Reserve Army asks the commander whether a coup is underway and the commander replies that he is certain one is; he just isn't sure which side he is being given orders by.

    The differences in the results between the methods are significant for one to be clearly systemically wrong. The question is which one.

    It probably comes down to turnout and particularly with the new UKIP supporters. Panel membership is unlikely to include many politically disengaged (I know YouGov and the others poll for much more than politics but the sort of people who sign up for polling panels are likely to be the sort to be more engaged in society at most levels, including politics - in other words, they contain a disproportionately small number of non-voters). By contrast, the phone pollsters are picking up more former non-voters who now say they'll vote, and in particular, vote UKIP. There is also the related question of prompting, which antifrank covered in an excellent post on his blog the other day.

    How legitimate are those findings? My inclination would be to favour those which give less rather than more weight to those who didn't vote in 2010.

    "How legitimate are those findings? My inclination would be to favour those which give less rather than more weight to those who didn't vote in 2010. "

    Agreed. Ironically, that would go in favour of online polls even though they come from a small class of people - the politicos.

    Or, really discount the 2010 non voters by say 75%.

    Incidentally, was Reckless' less than expected majority due to many non 2010 voter in the end not turning up - as expected ?
  • Options
    peter_from_putneypeter_from_putney Posts: 6,875
    The "Next Minister to leave the Cabinet" markets appear to have been taken down. I very much expect Uncle Vince to have a major flounce and pack his bags in the aftermath of the Autumn Statement. After all, this be his last opportunity to attract any meaningful attention to himself before the sun finally sets on his political career.
  • Options
    SmarmeronSmarmeron Posts: 5,099
    @Flightpath
    I am not sure about fish and chips, but Mike would do well to tax reheated arguments on here.
  • Options
    surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,137
    surbiton said:

    Paul_Mid_Beds said:

    Now Frank Field has put the boot in.....

    "Former welfare minister Frank Field said the [Thornberry] incident was ‘the most serious thing that has happened’ to Labour - ‘because it gives vent to what everybody’s guts are telling them about us’.

    ‘It’s the north London set we’ve got to control. They are a Berlin Wall trying to prevent us reaching out to our voters and like the Berlin Wall they’ve got to be demolished.
    ‘Ed’s trying to move us on immigration and welfare and with one blast of a tweet she wrecks that and puts us back to square one. The real problem we have is that there’s a whole group of them.’"


    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2846174/Miliband-clique-millionaire-allies-Berlin-Wall-Labour-ordinary-working-class-voters.html

    Also the top rated readers comment in that article states:

    "Saturday's poll in the Mirror shows that 71% of its' readers feel that UKIP would be a fresh start for the UK and a poll in today's Sun shows UKIP on 28% and Labour on 25% at the General Election. Labour is a dead man walking."

    Not seen anything about that poll here?

    Why doesn't Frank Field join UKIP ? That will solve a problem.
    For Frank Field maybe. Not for Labour....

  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    peter_from_putney said:

    The "Next Minister to leave the Cabinet" markets appear to have been taken down. I very much expect Uncle Vince to have a major flounce and pack his bags in the aftermath of the Autumn Statement. After all, this be his last opportunity to attract any meaningful attention to himself before the sun finally sets on his political career.

    I think you might have something there, needs to think about shifting those memoirs as well
  • Options
    peter_from_putneypeter_from_putney Posts: 6,875
    Indigo said:

    peter_from_putney said:

    The "Next Minister to leave the Cabinet" markets appear to have been taken down. I very much expect Uncle Vince to have a major flounce and pack his bags in the aftermath of the Autumn Statement. After all, this be his last opportunity to attract any meaningful attention to himself before the sun finally sets on his political career.

    I think you might have something there, needs to think about shifting those memoirs as well
    I might have were I able to bet on his departure, but it seems I can't!
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    Smarmeron said:

    @Flightpath
    I am not sure about fish and chips, but Mike would do well to tax reheated arguments on here.

    The current arrangement is idiotic
    Under long-standing VAT legislation, sale of most foods bought to eat or cook at home is zero-rated for VAT, meaning that no tax is charged. By contrast, meals bought and consumed in a restaurant, and hot take-away food or drink, are charged at a standard 20% tax rate. At the boundary between these two classes, there has been a history of legal challenges around food which is baked for sale, and is sold while still hot. If food could be claimed to be hot only incidentally, it could be zero-rated - this would apply to freshly baked bread, but also pies, pasties and similar items http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasty_tax
    If someone makes you some food you pay tax, if they make a produce that you can take home to cook and then "incidentally" heat it up for you , you dont pay tax. Osborne was just trying to simplify a bit of arcane tax nonsense, make the government a few quid, and level the playing field for snack sellers.
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    MarqueeMark said:

    Barnesian said:

    Mike - Are you also suggesting that the phone surveys are a more accurate estimate than the on-line polls? You seem to be. In which case we should make an automatic adjustment (-2% from each of the main parties?) to all on-line polls. It makes no difference to the lead but might make a difference to the implied number of seats.

    Not sure the actual result in R&S would support that suggestion.

    The R&S situation was unusual in any number of ways:

    - It was a Con/UKIP battle, which relatively few seats will be in 2015 and the big picture certainly won't be.
    - The polls were taken over quite a long period and their accuracy is difficult to assess given how much campaigning went on afterwards.
    - Turnout (or, before the event, likelihood to vote) for a by-election is lower than at a GE and may disproportionately affect those planning on voting for a minor party so again it's difficult to read across from one to the other.

    We should be cautious about applying too closely the lessons from R&S, such as they are, to polling for the GE.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    surbiton said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
    He isn't dodging tax, he doesn't live in the UK, I dont pay tax in the UK either, because I dont live there "Not resident or normally resident for tax purposes"
  • Options
    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    I was unaware that if you became ex-pat.. lived in another country and paid taxes there that you lost you right to be called British or English,Welsh or Norther Irish..Is this a new Labour Policy
  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    surbiton said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
    Who's making him a hero but the fans? (I don't think he's hero, I think he's one of the best formula 1 drivers in the world which I admire, I don't envy him his money).

    He has avoided tax by leaving the country. I don't blame him.

    If you want a good tax take, make it reasonable, not punitive.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    edited November 2014
    Plato said:

    Congratulations! No longer a virgin. Now you can give others knowing looks ;^ )

    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

    Did he not think so much of the UK that he changed his nationality to Monegasque to avoid paying tax. Hard to see why a rat like that winning a race is of any good to the UK.
    Desperately sad how people need to think that these types are any good for the UK, shows how far down the ladder we have dropped, need to count foreigners to be able to say we win anything.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    richardDodd said:

    I was unaware that if you became ex-pat.. lived in another country and paid taxes there that you lost you right to be called British or English,Welsh or Norther Irish..Is this a new Labour Policy

    Happens in Scotland - hence Wings and I didn't get a vote in the referendum.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    malcolmg said:

    Plato said:

    Congratulations! No longer a virgin. Now you can give others knowing looks ;^ )

    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

    Did he not think so much of the UK that he changed his nationality to Monegasque to avoid paying tax. Hard to see why a rat like that winning a race is of any good to the UK.
    Desperately sad how people need to think that these types are any good for the UK, shows how far down the ladder we have dropped, need to count foreigners to be able to say we win anything.
    You dont need to change your nationality to not pay tax... Move somewhere else, pay your tax there, works for tens of thousands of expat workers.
  • Options
    FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    surbiton said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
    He is not a tax dodger. There are no fraudulent front companies. He lives abroad like Sean Connery and he does most of his work abroad. A lot of his earnings will come from foreign companies. The company he drives for is German. Most of the personal visits required of him by his sponsors will be abroad.
    The team itself is based in Brackley and is a significant British business. It and he are good news for Britain.

    I suppose one day you will wake up and find yourself in the real world. One where labour are not threatening to tax people at a total of over 60% of their earnings.
  • Options
    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Hamilton.. another working class lad who by his own efforts has become a world champion in a very demanding sport..and who now resides almost entirely abroad..is being hounded by the tax nutters of the Labour and other fringe parties.
  • Options
    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,419
    surbiton said:

    david_herdson said:

    On topic, I reminded of the scene in Valkerie where a lieutenant in the Reserve Army asks the commander whether a coup is underway and the commander replies that he is certain one is; he just isn't sure which side he is being given orders by.

    The differences in the results between the methods are significant for one to be clearly systemically wrong. The question is which one.

    It probably comes down to turnout and particularly with the new UKIP supporters. Panel membership is unlikely to include many politically disengaged (I know YouGov and the others poll for much more than politics but the sort of people who sign up for polling panels are likely to be the sort to be more engaged in society at most levels, including politics - in other words, they contain a disproportionately small number of non-voters). By contrast, the phone pollsters are picking up more former non-voters who now say they'll vote, and in particular, vote UKIP. There is also the related question of prompting, which antifrank covered in an excellent post on his blog the other day.

    How legitimate are those findings? My inclination would be to favour those which give less rather than more weight to those who didn't vote in 2010.

    "How legitimate are those findings? My inclination would be to favour those which give less rather than more weight to those who didn't vote in 2010. "

    Agreed. Ironically, that would go in favour of online polls even though they come from a small class of people - the politicos.

    Or, really discount the 2010 non voters by say 75%.

    Incidentally, was Reckless' less than expected majority due to many non 2010 voter in the end not turning up - as expected ?
    It's possible, though with a 50% turnout, that shouldn't have had too big an effect (but then again, the polls didn't massively overstate his majority so it wouldn't have taken too much to shift it). I suspect that the polls may have understated the degree of tactical voting too.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,883
    On Topic

    Which type of polling has proved most accurate in recent elections.

    Phone or online anybody know?
  • Options
    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,796
    @Plato

    A recommendation re dvd capture on prev thread. (MakeMKV)
  • Options
    FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    richardDodd said:

    Hamilton.. another working class lad who by his own efforts has become a world champion in a very demanding sport..and who now resides almost entirely abroad..is being hounded by the tax nutters of the Labour and other fringe parties.

    Hounded by the same mentality that UKIP are chasing after.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    richardDodd said:

    Hamilton.. another working class lad who by his own efforts has become a world champion in a very demanding sport..and who now resides almost entirely abroad..is being hounded by the tax nutters of the Labour and other fringe parties.

    Perhaps it was the flag waving by Lewis that gets em riled.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    @OliverCooper: Labour candidate hijacks Children In Need to attack @StuartAndrewMP, who's raised millions for children's health. http://t.co/FFlChTg85q
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    philiph said:

    Indigo said:

    FPT:

    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    She was born in Great Yarmouth, the daughter of an Austrian father and Filipina mother, who gave her, she says, “an immigrant work ethic” as well as an early love of music. “My dad came over from Austria when he was seven,” she says, “and mum came in the 1960s. The mentality was: ‘We’re here to work.’ If I didn’t work a 16-hour day, I couldn’t look my aunties in the eye. You’ve got to remember many of them are cleaners. There are no silver spoons. We are a family of grafters.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/im-a-celebrity/11247621/Myleene-Klass-a-deadly-force-of-nature-pure-and-simple.html

    No wonder she took up the violin, tears blinding me thinking of her climbing all those chimneys 32 hours a day.
    The comments on here about Ms Klass long ago left fair comment and are becoming a complete disgrace, in the face of no evidence what so ever people appear to have decided she must be a tax dodger, I hope OGH's lawyers are on standby for that one. MG has called her "thick" any number of times, which seems doubtful given her success, plus the minor detail of her degree in astronomy.
    Klass has been an amateur astronomer for most of her life,[68] having been taught the basics by her father. She was one of only a handful of celebrities, engineers and scientists who were at the UK National Space Centre control centre for the touch-down of the UK Mars probe Beagle 2 in the early morning of Christmas Day 2003. Since then she has been a keen supporter of the UK's work in the European space programme
    As for all the comments which amount to allegations of parasitism, perhaps people should reflect on her charity work in Sierra Leone, Children in Need and several other children's charities.
    Incidentally the comments made by here mother I completely believe, I have some experience here since I employee a number of working class filipinos, and teach filipino children every day.
    And ultra dweebs think she can't buy a garage for 2 million in the same way she abysmally failed to eat a horse when she was so hungry.

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.

    LOL, If looking through a telescope makes you clever then I have been very wrong. Another sychophant wittering on about lawyers, get a life you dimwit.
    Why has the sainted virgin not given one of her garages to charity as they are so meaningless to her. Then you crown it all by impersonating a donkey and state that as you teach some foreign people and employ some as skivvies no doubt that she must be great. I have really been taught a lesson, I bet you were also playing a violin when you were posting that.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    Flightpath said:

    richardDodd said:

    Hamilton.. another working class lad who by his own efforts has become a world champion in a very demanding sport..and who now resides almost entirely abroad..is being hounded by the tax nutters of the Labour and other fringe parties.

    Hounded by the same mentality that UKIP are chasing after.
    Champagne socialists and misanthropic scottish nationalists ?
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    TGOHF said:

    richardDodd said:

    I was unaware that if you became ex-pat.. lived in another country and paid taxes there that you lost you right to be called British or English,Welsh or Norther Irish..Is this a new Labour Policy

    Happens in Scotland - hence Wings and I didn't get a vote in the referendum.
    Harry , going to Scotland once for a holiday does not make you Scottish
  • Options
    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    malcolmg said:

    philiph said:

    Indigo said:

    FPT:

    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    She was born in Great Yarmouth, the daughter of an Austrian father and Filipina mother, who gave her, she says, “an immigrant work ethic” as well as an early love of music. “My ot to remember many of them are cleaners. There are no silver spoons. We are a family of grafters.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/im-a-celebrity/11247621/Myleene-Klass-a-deadly-force-of-nature-pure-and-simple.html

    No wonder she took up the violin, tears blinding me thinking of her climbing all those chimneys 32 hours a day.
    The comments on here about Ms Klass long ago left fair comment and are becoming a complete disgrace, in the face of no evidence what so ever people appear to have decided she must be a tax dodger, I hope OGH's lawyers are on standby for that one. MG has called her "thick" any number of times, which seems doubtful given her success, plus the minor detail of her degree in astronomy.
    Klass has been an amateur astronomer for most of her life,[68] having been taught the basics by her father. She was one of only a handful of celebrities, engineers and scientists who were at the UK National Space Centre control centre for the touch-down of the UK Mars probe Beagle 2 in the early morning of Christmas Day 2003. Since then she has been a keen supporter of the UK's work in the European space programme
    As for all the comments which amount to allegations of parasitism, perhaps people should reflect on her charity work in Sierra Leone, Children in Need and several other children's charities.
    Incidentally the comments made by here mother I completely believe, I have some experience here since I employee a number of working class filipinos, and teach filipino children every day.
    And ultra dweebs think she can't buy a garage for 2 million in the same way she abysmally failed to eat a horse when she was so hungry.

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.
    LOL, If looking through a telescope makes you clever then I have been very wrong. Another sychophant wittering on about lawyers, get a life you dimwit.
    Why has the sainted virgin not given one of her garages to charity as they are so meaningless to her. Then you crown it all by impersonating a donkey and state that as you teach some foreign people and employ some as skivvies no doubt that she must be great. I have really been taught a lesson, I bet you were also playing a violin when you were posting that.

    HiHo

    Not that I said any of those things.
  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    edited November 2014
    @malcolmg

    For someone so 'intelligent' you have a real problem considering she's a minor nobody in the scheme of things.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    Flightpath said:

    surbiton said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
    He is not a tax dodger. There are no fraudulent front companies. He lives abroad like Sean Connery and he does most of his work abroad. A lot of his earnings will come from foreign companies. The company he drives for is German. Most of the personal visits required of him by his sponsors will be abroad.
    The team itself is based in Brackley and is a significant British business. It and he are good news for Britain.

    I suppose one day you will wake up and find yourself in the real world. One where labour are not threatening to tax people at a total of over 60% of their earnings.
    You thick turnip if that is what you think why are you constantly denigrating Connery because he chooses to live a broad. You have more faces than the town clock.
  • Options
    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    malcolmg said:

    LOL, If looking through a telescope makes you clever then I have been very wrong. Another sychophant wittering on about lawyers, get a life you dimwit.
    Why has the sainted virgin not given one of her garages to charity as they are so meaningless to her. Then you crown it all by impersonating a donkey and state that as you teach some foreign people and employ some as skivvies no doubt that she must be great. I have really been taught a lesson, I bet you were also playing a violin when you were posting that.

    @PBModerator: Maybe we can do with a few less personal insults, especially ones which are wrong.
  • Options
    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited November 2014
    malcolmg said:

    TGOHF said:

    richardDodd said:

    I was unaware that if you became ex-pat.. lived in another country and paid taxes there that you lost you right to be called British or English,Welsh or Norther Irish..Is this a new Labour Policy

    Happens in Scotland - hence Wings and I didn't get a vote in the referendum.
    Harry , going to Scotland once for a holiday does not make you Scottish
    Bit harsh on Wings there malc - not forgiven him for his counterproductive campaign ?
  • Options
    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,317
    First Myleene Klass, now Lewis Hamilton is being vilified by the British Left. Apart from Russell Brand, is there anyone from the world of sport and entertainment these people actually admire?
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    philiph said:

    malcolmg said:

    philiph said:

    Indigo said:

    FPT:

    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    She was born in Great Yarmouth, the daughter of an Austrian father and Filipina mother, who gave her, she says, “an immigrant work ethic” as well as an early love of music. “My ot to remember many of them are cleaners. There are no silver spoons. We are a family of grafters.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/im-a-celebrity/11247621/Myleene-Klass-a-deadly-force-of-nature-pure-and-simple.html

    No wonder she took up the violin, tears blinding me thinking of her climbing all those chimneys 32 hours a day.
    As for all the comments which amount to allegations of parasitism, perhaps people should reflect on her charity work in Sierra Leone, Children in Need and several other children's charities.
    Incidentally the comments made by here mother I completely believe, I have some experience here since I employee a number of working class filipinos, and teach filipino children every day.
    And ultra dweebs think she can't buy a garage for 2 million in the same way she abysmally failed to eat a horse when she was so hungry.

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.
    LOL, If looking through a telescope makes you clever then I have been very wrong. Another sychophant wittering on about lawyers, get a life you dimwit.
    Why has the sainted virgin not given one of her garages to charity as they are so meaningless to her. Then you crown it all by impersonating a donkey and state that as you teach some foreign people and employ some as skivvies no doubt that she must be great. I have really been taught a lesson, I bet you were also playing a violin when you were posting that.
    HiHo

    Not that I said any of those things.

    Philip , I was merely commenting on the idiot you replied to by following the thread, apologies if it appeared I was berating your good self.
  • Options
    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Theuniondivvie said:

    Alistair said:

    surbiton said:

    Alistair said:

    SNP have manged to add another 5000 members in a week post conference. Up to 90,000 now.

    What's the membership fee ? Or, is it 2 for the price of 1 ?

    90000 is equivalent to 1.08 million UK wide !!!
    Minimum fee is £12, "standard" fee is £36.
    Up another 2k to 92k during yesterday's Hydro event. They must be raking in a pretty penny in subs alone.

    As "anyone but but Labour" ABL now spoilt for choice as I could now do one of the following .....

    1) place 12 quid bet on Labour not getting majority
    2) Buy basic membership with SNP for 12 quid

    Wonder which one should pay out better for an ABL?

    :-)
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited November 2014
    VTS is the encryption script format to stop you watching another DVD format or copying the files. Hence, it's a bit tricky to circumnavigate. That's what annoys me - I bought the bloody product and have to get on my knees every 45x4 minutes to change discs or guess which disc a certain scene is on.

    I could just rip the whole thing and do it at will - or copy AN Others rip using peer2peer.

    I really do wonder why the distributors of DVDs are still stuck in pre-ripped CD land - it's exactly the same issue. So IT geeks get round it instead and either pirate or sell me software to do it.
    Swiss_Bob said:

    Plato said:


    snip

    Swiss_Bob said:

    Plato said:

    OT Anyone on here recommend a video editing software package? I'm trying to convert all my DVDs to soft copy. So I'm thinking of buying a streaming capture product that will suck the playback from the screen instead. I can also save streamed TV or interwebbery and use when I want to/on the device that suits me.

    I'm looking at this and it seems quite attractive and great value. Linky > movavi.com/suite/video-conversion.html

    Any expertise on this subject most appreciated. I really resent buying DVDs and then being trapped in that format/rummaging about for the right disc when I want to skip about a boxset or bodge up my own favourite clips. I can do it with CDs easy-peasy.


    PS @DavidL‌ - I think it was you who recommended giffgaff after your son subscribed for his new mobile - it's brilliant! He's got an excellent nose for a great deal and superb customer service

    You can buy very cheap devices which include the editing software, I use a Grabby Terratec USB device using S Video as the input, it's much higher quality than the RCA yellow plug, I bought a much more expensive HD card but it doesn't work :-(
    I take the feed off the Sky box (S Video or RCA) so there's no encryption at that point. I also have a card in the PC that I have the satellite cabled into, you can slot a card into it, ie a Sky card (I think) that will decrypt a signal if you have the right card for the encrypted channel.

    Anything you have already have recorded onto any device can be copied, as long as it's not encrypted and the box has an RCA or S Video output you're good, not forgetting the red and white RCA plugs for stereo sound. You can also record surround sound because standard Dolby surround is recorded on the stereo channels (not 5.1).

    EDIT Re VTS is that an encoding format like MP3? or is it actually an encrypted format, there's a difference, lots of editing software will accept lots of different encoding formats and allow you to save it in the format you like. I think MP4 is one of the standard video encoding formats.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    Swiss_Bob said:

    @malcolmg

    For someone so 'intelligent' you have a real problem considering she's a minor nobody in the scheme of things.

    Bob , For just someone , you are a snidey nasty pass remarkable little runt.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    TGOHF said:

    malcolmg said:

    TGOHF said:

    richardDodd said:

    I was unaware that if you became ex-pat.. lived in another country and paid taxes there that you lost you right to be called British or English,Welsh or Norther Irish..Is this a new Labour Policy

    Happens in Scotland - hence Wings and I didn't get a vote in the referendum.
    Harry , going to Scotland once for a holiday does not make you Scottish
    Bit harsh on Wings there malc - not forgiven him for his counterproductive campaign ?
    LOL
  • Options
    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704
    malcolmg said:

    philiph said:

    malcolmg said:

    philiph said:

    Indigo said:

    FPT:

    malcolmg said:

    CarlottaVance said:

    She was born in Great Yarmouth, the daughter of an Austrian father and Filipina mother, who gave her, she says, “an immigrant work ethic” as well as an early love of music. “My ot to remember many of them are cleaners. There are no silver spoons. We are a family of grafters.”

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/im-a-celebrity/11247621/Myleene-Klass-a-deadly-force-of-nature-pure-and-simple.html

    No wonder she took up the violin, tears blinding me thinking of her climbing all those chimneys 32 hours a day.
    As for all the comments which amount to allegations of parasitism, perhaps people should reflect on her charity work in Sierra Leone, Children in Need and several other children's charities.
    Incidentally the comments made by here mother I completely believe, I have some experience here since I employee a number of working class filipinos, and teach filipino children every day.
    And ultra dweebs think she can't buy a garage for 2 million in the same way she abysmally failed to eat a horse when she was so hungry.

    However, 'You can't just point at something and tax it' is a very good line.
    LOL, If looking through a telescope makes you clever then I have been very wrong. Another sychophant wittering on about lawyers, get a life you dimwit.
    Why has the sainted virgin not given one of her garages to charity as they are so meaningless to her. Then you crown it all by impersonating a donkey and state that as you teach some foreign people and employ some as skivvies no doubt that she must be great. I have really been taught a lesson, I bet you were also playing a violin when you were posting that.
    HiHo

    Not that I said any of those things.
    Philip , I was merely commenting on the idiot you replied to by following the thread, apologies if it appeared I was berating your good self.

    No problem, happy to be berated when deserved.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    Stark_Dawning said:

    First Myleene Klass, now Lewis Hamilton is being vilified by the British Left. Apart from Russell Brand, is there anyone from the world of sport and entertainment these people actually admire?

    another numpty who thinks the biggest insult in the world is to call someone a Leftie. Go buy a garage.
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Swiss bob

    "Plato, here is a link to a list of devices that you might be interested in:"

    This just is is one of those moments I wish I could post a shocked yellow smiley face

    8-)
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    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    peter_from_putney said:

    The "Next Minister to leave the Cabinet" markets appear to have been taken down. I very much expect Uncle Vince to have a major flounce and pack his bags in the aftermath of the Autumn Statement. After all, this be his last opportunity to attract any meaningful attention to himself before the sun finally sets on his political career.

    miaow!

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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    Indigo said:

    malcolmg said:

    LOL, If looking through a telescope makes you clever then I have been very wrong. Another sychophant wittering on about lawyers, get a life you dimwit.
    Why has the sainted virgin not given one of her garages to charity as they are so meaningless to her. Then you crown it all by impersonating a donkey and state that as you teach some foreign people and employ some as skivvies no doubt that she must be great. I have really been taught a lesson, I bet you were also playing a violin when you were posting that.

    @PBModerator: Maybe we can do with a few less personal insults, especially ones which are wrong.
    Big jessie running crying to the moderator to say a big boy is calling him names and pulling his pigtails. Man up you jelly fish
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    OmniumOmnium Posts: 9,796
    This story caught my eye

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30165655

    I'm not against selling off state assets, but these seem to be at rather knock-down prices.

    Far more troubling is that Labour plan to 'reduce the deficit' by doing so, rather than reducing national debt. Now this may seem like semantics, but it seems to me to be precisely the sort of statement that means we should be very scared of Labour's economic plans. Sane people do not sell their cars to cover their credit card interest for the month.
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    Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,317
    malcolmg said:

    Stark_Dawning said:

    First Myleene Klass, now Lewis Hamilton is being vilified by the British Left. Apart from Russell Brand, is there anyone from the world of sport and entertainment these people actually admire?

    another numpty who thinks the biggest insult in the world is to call someone a Leftie. Go buy a garage.
    No. 'Scottish nationalist' wins that by a long chalk.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,883
    “The Prime Minister promised ‘no ifs no buts’ to reduce immigration to the tens of thousands, in 2010.

    Theresa May has spent four years claiming she was on track.


    David Cameron said in May 2014 the target for net migration - the difference between the number of people coming into the UK and those leaving - was "perfectly achievable".

    Theresa May has said today.The UK is "unlikely" to meet its target for reducing immigration.

    Oh well another broken promise for the list at GE2015
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Speaking of Valkyries - the well known Ride of V... is actually an overture to the main act - so it's a bit like getting all excited whilst sat chatting and eating popcorn waiting for the curtain to go up.
    david_herdson said:

    On topic, I reminded of the scene in Valkerie where a lieutenant in the Reserve Army asks the commander whether a coup is underway and the commander replies that he is certain one is; he just isn't sure which side he is being given orders by.

    The differences in the results between the methods are significant for one to be clearly systemically wrong. The question is which one.

    It probably comes down to turnout and particularly with the new UKIP supporters. Panel membership is unlikely to include many politically disengaged (I know YouGov and the others poll for much more than politics but the sort of people who sign up for polling panels are likely to be the sort to be more engaged in society at most levels, including politics - in other words, they contain a disproportionately small number of non-voters). By contrast, the phone pollsters are picking up more former non-voters who now say they'll vote, and in particular, vote UKIP. There is also the related question of prompting, which antifrank covered in an excellent post on his blog the other day.

    How legitimate are those findings? My inclination would be to favour those which give less rather than more weight to those who didn't vote in 2010.

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    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    bigjohnowls said:

    “The Prime Minister promised ‘no ifs no buts’ to reduce immigration to the tens of thousands, in 2010.

    Theresa May has spent four years claiming she was on track.


    David Cameron said in May 2014 the target for net migration - the difference between the number of people coming into the UK and those leaving - was "perfectly achievable".

    Theresa May has said today.The UK is "unlikely" to meet its target for reducing immigration.

    Oh well another broken promise for the list at GE2015

    I think last week were were told by Ms May that it wasn't a promise, it was a "comment"... sounded like a promise to me when Cameron said it, but I guess "comment" and "politicians promise" are roughly equivalent.

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/david-cameron-urged-admit-you-4678006

    "But Home Secretary Mrs May appeared to downgrade the pledge earlier this month when she said the target was merely a “comment” after being unable to bring herself to call it a “promise”."
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    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    edited November 2014
    Moses_ said:

    Swiss bob

    "Plato, here is a link to a list of devices that you might be interested in:"

    This just is is one of those moments I wish I could post a shocked yellow smiley face

    8-)

    On reflection I should have phrased that differently. . . .
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    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Oh be fair only a "tiny tiny tiny" bit wrong after all. At least its on the same continent
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    It is quite astonishing the vitriol and hatred that right wingers spew out here , yet when answered back in any fashion they cry like big babies. What is it about bullying right wingers that makes them such jessies when on the receiving end.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,137
    Indigo said:

    peter_from_putney said:

    The "Next Minister to leave the Cabinet" markets appear to have been taken down. I very much expect Uncle Vince to have a major flounce and pack his bags in the aftermath of the Autumn Statement. After all, this be his last opportunity to attract any meaningful attention to himself before the sun finally sets on his political career.

    I think you might have something there, needs to think about shifting those memoirs as well
    It's hard to see what St. Vince will get out of another five years in Parliament - although if it IS another Con/LibDem coalition, I suspect it might just be a virulent stomach ulcer...



  • Options
    SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Omnium said:

    This story caught my eye

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30165655

    I'm not against selling off state assets, but these seem to be at rather knock-down prices.

    Far more troubling is that Labour plan to 'reduce the deficit' by doing so, rather than reducing national debt. Now this may seem like semantics, but it seems to me to be precisely the sort of statement that means we should be very scared of Labour's economic plans. Sane people do not sell their cars to cover their credit card interest for the month.

    That's because Labour have no idea of value or money or saving or anything about money bar spending it. They are first class experts at spending other people's money.
  • Options
    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited November 2014
    Thanx muchly - it's a tech babble mindfield. I used to speak fluent rubbish like this, but it's been a few years and I'm learning from scratch.

    Just feeling smug getting all my bits of AV liquorice talking to each other - though I feel the need to get a whiteboard and draw a network diagram as they're talking Esperanto and I don't have a clue what is being sourced from what media server/device. And just when I figure it out - one of the buggers turns themself off and I don't know WTF is going on to get back to where I was!
    Swiss_Bob said:

    Plato said:

    Golly, just read it's the first time Merc have won since Fangio - Holy Moly.

    Plato, here is a link to a list of devices that you might be interested in:

    http://www.pcupgrade.co.uk/category.asp?categoryid=486

    I have bought stuff here and they are reputable and helpful from my experience. Phone them and ask their advice, they're a lot cheaper than me :-)

    This is similar or identical to the one I use, it's probably a newer version of the one I have, it looks the same but that doesn't mean much because I bought mine a few years ago, it's £40.

    http://www.pcupgrade.co.uk/productdetails.asp?ProductID=6935&categoryid=486

    Grabby - Technical data
    Features

    PC interface: USB 2.0
    Analogue signal inputs: Composite- (RCA) and S-Video, Stereo Audio (RCA)
    Video standard: PAL, NTSC, SECAM
    Capture rate PAL: Up to 720x576 pixel/25 fps
    Capture rate NTSC: Up to 720x480 pixel/29,9 fps
    Powered via USB bus (no additional power supply needed)
    Software
    MAGIX Movies on DVD TerraTec Edition
    System requirements
    PC with 2,0 GHz Intel® or AMD CPU
    Microsoft® Windows®XP SP 2 or Windows® Vista® SP1
    512 RAM (1024 MB recommended)
    USB 2.0 interface
    sound card
    800 MB of available hard drive space for program installation
    Graphic card with a least 800 x 600 pixel resolution (1024 x 768 recommended)
    CD/DVD drive for archiving your recordings
    5 GB of available hard drive space for DVD disc burning
    Scope of delivery
    Grabby
    Video cable
    Software and driver DVD
    Quick Start Guide
  • Options
    Swiss_BobSwiss_Bob Posts: 619
    malcolmg said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    @malcolmg

    For someone so 'intelligent' you have a real problem considering she's a minor nobody in the scheme of things.

    Bob , For just someone , you are a snidey nasty pass remarkable little runt.
    Class ;-)
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,785
    malcolmg said:

    Plato said:

    Congratulations! No longer a virgin. Now you can give others knowing looks ;^ )

    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

    he changed his nationality to Monegasque to avoid paying tax.
    Got a link to that? Wouldn't want OGH getting in trouble......
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    IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    edited November 2014
    SquareRoot said:

    Omnium said:

    This story caught my eye

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30165655

    I'm not against selling off state assets, but these seem to be at rather knock-down prices.

    Far more troubling is that Labour plan to 'reduce the deficit' by doing so, rather than reducing national debt. Now this may seem like semantics, but it seems to me to be precisely the sort of statement that means we should be very scared of Labour's economic plans. Sane people do not sell their cars to cover their credit card interest for the month.

    That's because Labour have no idea of value or money or saving or anything about money bar spending it. They are first class experts at spending other people's money.
    Could raise £100m ?! How many seconds does it take for the debt to go up by that much ( I think 100m is less than one day of the interest on the debt) ? In economic terms its a rounding error on a rounding error. Also assume the act of making the sale won't cost anything which would be a first.
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    FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    malcolmg said:

    Plato said:

    Congratulations! No longer a virgin. Now you can give others knowing looks ;^ )

    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

    Did he not think so much of the UK that he changed his nationality to Monegasque to avoid paying tax. Hard to see why a rat like that winning a race is of any good to the UK.
    Desperately sad how people need to think that these types are any good for the UK, shows how far down the ladder we have dropped, need to count foreigners to be able to say we win anything.
    Like I said - you are mental. Sad but mental.
    Remind me who was that leading cheerleader for the nats? Shurely you cannot be sherious?
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    EasterrossEasterross Posts: 1,915
    Afternoon all and on thread my immediate reaction on looking at the list above was we know which of them tend to publish inaccurate garbage!
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,785
    malcolmg said:

    It is quite astonishing the vitriol and hatred that right wingers spew out here

    Why? Need to up their game? Are you offering lessons?

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    TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    CarlottaVance said:

    malcolmg said:

    Plato said:

    Congratulations! No longer a virgin. Now you can give others knowing looks ;^ )

    JamesM said:

    First! (My first ever first too!) Great day for the UK with Hamilton's win.

    he changed his nationality to Monegasque to avoid paying tax.
    Got a link to that? Wouldn't want OGH getting in trouble......
    He lives in Monaco. How is that changing nationality?
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    FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    CarlottaVance said:

    malcolmg said:

    It is quite astonishing the vitriol and hatred that right wingers spew out here

    Why? Need to up their game? Are you offering lessons?

    Vitriol like calling a British world champion a 'rat'.
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    frpenkridgefrpenkridge Posts: 670
    What did you do in the Great Klass War, Daddy?
  • Options
    Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    edited November 2014
    Indigo said:

    surbiton said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
    He isn't dodging tax, he doesn't live in the UK, I dont pay tax in the UK either, because I dont live there "Not resident or normally resident for tax purposes"
    Swiss_Bob said:

    surbiton said:

    Swiss_Bob said:

    TGOHF said:

    @pollytoynbee: @DAaronovitch @tracey_crouch Shouldn't Hamilton fly the Swiss flag, as that's where he avoids paying UK tax?

    I believe he moved to Monaco some time ago.

    As usual PT is wrong.
    Why did Harry congratulate him ? Why are we making heroes of tax dodgers ? Caroline of Monaco should have been there. If Grace was alive, there would have been a glittering reception when he returns "home".
    He doesn't live here

    Who's making him a hero but the fans? (I don't think he's hero, I think he's one of the best formula 1 drivers in the world which I admire, I don't envy him his money).

    He has avoided tax by leaving the country. I don't blame him.

    If you want a good tax take, make it reasonable, not punitive.
    Precisely !!
    The 45p tax rate has pulled in more than the 50 p tax rate put in place for the last 27days 16 hours 45mins and 30 seconds of the previous Labours 13 years of government. ( paired down to the second to try and make the Labour guys to feel better) It has been entirely higher for the entire term of the coalition (except for above aforementioned period of last Labour government)

    Who could also forget Gordon's removal of the 10 p tax band?

    Would this be a bad time to bring up flags on houses ?
This discussion has been closed.