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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Local By-Election Preview: August 7th 2014

Broadley Common, Epping Upland and Nazing on Epping Forest (Con Defence)
Result of last election to council (2014): Conservatives 37, Residents 12, Liberal Democrats 3, Independents 2, United Kingdom Independence Party 2, Green 1, Labour 1 (Conservative majority of 16)
Result of ward at last election (2011):

Read the full story here

GeoffM

First!

DavidL

Too late for the previous thread but there is going to be hell to pay if Salmond wins the referendum and Scotland is then told that there will be no currency union.

The demands for a second referendum would be immense and the UK government would still be in a position to insist on it. Just another example of the holes that Salmond is digging for himself. I wonder which way he will be voting?

The Yes campaign make Gulf War II look like a masterpiece of forward planning.

Monksfield

Ref comments on Epping Forest and Huntingdonshire above. Funny how the residents in some of these places might vote for Tories at national level but don't trust them to run the local council

HYUFD

OKC Previous thread, Both sides are doing it, Brian Cox, Frankie Boyle and the Proclaimers and Sean Connery etc are all pushing Yes. There is a difference anyway between Guardian readers writing patronising letters to Ohio rednecks on why Bush was so awful, and a positive message about why the rest of the UK wants Scotland to stay in the union and how they value its contribution!

JBriskin

Err, this article isn't signed???

MikeK

Come on UKIP, show your mettle tonight. I recon an average of 25% of the vote spread through all the wards.

JBriskin

UK tory journos willing to take on the Obama/Drones issue now eh?? Bloody hell - only a Thursday - you should warn us about these things.

DavidL

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

Tim_B

The US Amateur Golf Tournament starts on Saturday, It's a curious beast - a 9 day golf tournament, part stroke play, part match play, played over both courses at the Atlanta Athletic Club.

The greens and tees are roped but the fairways are not, It'll be interesting how it goes.

HYUFD

SeanT Actually Obama has provided airdrops of supplies to the Yazidis and is said to be considering air strikes on ISIS if absolutely necessary http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/us-aid-iraqi-trapped-mountain-isis

JBriskin

ICYMI Sean-


Retweeted by Kay Burley


Sky News Newsdesk ‏@SkyNewsBreak · 17m
U.S. military official says President #Obama considering airstrikes in #Iraq to help deliver aid to thousands of refugees fleeing #ISIS

HYUFD

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

foxinsoxuk

SeanT said:

DavidL said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

The parallels with the (militantly atheistic) Khmer Rouge are extremely eerie. I intend to blog about them next week.

Thats my line!

At breakfast I commented on the Cambodian tribunal verdicts, and described ISIS as Khymer Rouge with prayer mats, wanting their own year zero.

MarkSenior

Slight error by Harry on the Huntingdon seat . The CC election in 2013 for the same division same boundaries was won by UKIP . Their candidate in this by election is their CC .
The seat was also fought in May this year and won by the Conservatives
Con 864 UKIP 576 Lab 172 LD 138

DavidL

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

DavidL said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

The parallels with the (militantly atheistic) Khmer Rouge are extremely eerie. I intend to blog about them next week.

Thats my line!

At breakfast I commented on the Cambodian tribunal verdicts, and described ISIS as Khymer Rouge with prayer mats, wanting their own year zero.

Er, I made the comparison several weeks ago, on pb. The KR and Isis exploit the same flaw of the human brain that makes us susceptible to evil fanaticism.

I doubt either of us are the first to note the eerie echoes.

I have to say that I drew the parallel as well without any knowledge of either of your contributions. It is indeed an obvious comparison given the complete lack of humanity, empathy and reason shown by both. It is like a form of autism. Truly weird and profoundly sick.

foxinsoxuk

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

DavidL said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

The parallels with the (militantly atheistic) Khmer Rouge are extremely eerie. I intend to blog about them next week.

Thats my line!

At breakfast I commented on the Cambodian tribunal verdicts, and described ISIS as Khymer Rouge with prayer mats, wanting their own year zero.

Er, I made the comparison several weeks ago, on pb. The KR and Isis exploit the same flaw of the human brain that makes us susceptible to evil fanaticism.

I doubt either of us are the first to note the eerie echoes.

It is year zero.

But the difference between ISIS and other Islamist groups like Hamas is one of ability and equipment, the intent is the same.

Read Hamas charter and weep:

http://archive.adl.org/main_israel/hamas_charter.html#.U-PkaslwaBY

I have sympathy for the Palestinians, but none for their chosen leaders.

Cyclefree

SeanT said:

JBriskin said:

ICYMI Sean-


Retweeted by Kay Burley


Sky News Newsdesk ‏@SkyNewsBreak · 17m
U.S. military official says President #Obama considering airstrikes in #Iraq to help deliver aid to thousands of refugees fleeing #ISIS

Let's hope it's right. I've seen other reports saying Obama is resisting Pentagon/Clintonite attempts to bully him into taking on Isis, I've seen other reports saying the US has not droned or bombed Isis as the Saudis have requested this, in alliance against Iran.

It's a total Mongolian clusterf*ck, as we used to say in the 90s, and at the centre of it is a great big fat disappointing mediocrity, Barack Obama.

"I've seen other reports saying the US has not droned or bombed Isis as the Saudis have requested this,"

A Saudi lobby telling the Americans what to do? Surely not, I thought only Israel did this.

ISIS have the same Wahabist version of Islam that the Saudis promulgate, via their wealth. Saudi Arabia should be told to get stuffed. We should save the Yazidis and the Christians and the Kurds and all those who don't want to live under a genocidal regime.

Cyclefree

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

DavidL said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

The parallels with the (militantly atheistic) Khmer Rouge are extremely eerie. I intend to blog about them next week.

Thats my line!

At breakfast I commented on the Cambodian tribunal verdicts, and described ISIS as Khymer Rouge with prayer mats, wanting their own year zero.

Er, I made the comparison several weeks ago, on pb. The KR and Isis exploit the same flaw of the human brain that makes us susceptible to evil fanaticism.

I doubt either of us are the first to note the eerie echoes.

It is year zero.

But the difference between ISIS and other Islamist groups like Hamas is one of ability and equipment, the intent is the same.

Read Hamas charter and weep:

http://archive.adl.org/main_israel/hamas_charter.html#.U-PkaslwaBY

I have sympathy for the Palestinians, but none for their chosen leaders.

Agree with your last sentence. Trouble is the Palestinians voted for Hamas. Why is it that they do not develop leaders of distinction?

BTW I referred to the Hamas charter a few days ago in response to a NP comment.

Edin_Rokz

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

JohnLilburne

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

Problem is that any air strikes will be too late (they already are: the time to bomb people is before they expect them), too little and not savage enough. We need the Kurds to push the Caliphate into concentrating their forces and then drop a few fuel-air bombs on them. As starters. If we go to war against them, our military objective should be to seek their utter destruction. Instead we will ponce around, give them warnings, lob a few drones at them, and in the end just piss them off and make another enemy of them who will seek to blow up tube trains.

JBriskin

Is this Harry then?? If it's not signed because of any criticism from me he should be well aware that no-one takes me very seriously.

For whatever reason I happened to read a bit more than usual - the more Importance of Being Ernst references the better I say

FTR - Aberdeen fans appear to be car beeping a 5-2 aggregate loss - Is this a normal kind of behaviour in the rest of the UK???

HYUFD

To reinforce SeanT's point, images of a beheaded girl, executed for being Christian amongst others, warning, very graphic! http://www.catholic.org/news/international/middle_east/story.php?id=56339

ISIS almost make the Nazis look humane

TheScreamingEagles

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Scrapheap_as_was

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Have I missed this month's ICM?

HurstLlama

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Edin_Rokz

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

HYUFD

BBC news main headline, White House Spokesman says US considering limited, focused air strikes and UN Security Council in emergency session

JBriskin

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

It's just-

24 hours news cycle + Internet

Keep Calm and Carry On

TheScreamingEagles

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Have I missed this month's ICM?

No, it should be out Mon/Tues next week

peter_from_putney

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

JBriskin

Sorry, I'm drunk enough to do better than that - give me a sec.

MikeK

Who said the Romanians weren't coming?
UKIP warning was ignored, and now they are pouring in:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2673475/Romanians-sleeping-rough-London-tripled-just-months-borders-opened-2-000-arrested-12-weeks.html

foxinsoxuk

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

DavidL said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

The parallels with the (militantly atheistic) Khmer Rouge are extremely eerie. I intend to blog about them next week.

Thats my line!

At breakfast I commented on the Cambodian tribunal verdicts, and described ISIS as Khymer Rouge with prayer mats, wanting their own year zero.

Er, I made the comparison several weeks ago, on pb. The KR and Isis exploit the same flaw of the human brain that makes us susceptible to evil fanaticism.

I doubt either of us are the first to note the eerie echoes.

It is year zero.

But the difference between ISIS and other Islamist groups like Hamas is one of ability and equipment, the intent is the same.

Read Hamas charter and weep:

http://archive.adl.org/main_israel/hamas_charter.html#.U-PkaslwaBY

I have sympathy for the Palestinians, but none for their chosen leaders.

I think Hamas are repulsive, but they are not remotely as crazy as Isis. Even al Qaeda have rejected Isis as being too extreme.

The Gaza Strip under Hamas is not Afghanistan under the Taliban.

To pursue our communist analogy, I'd say Hamas are like East German communism, Iran is equivalent to Maoism, the Taliban equals North Korean communism.

And, yes, Isis are Year Zero. Total nihilism.

Read that article 7 of the Hamas Charter.

It doesn't say kill the IDF, or kill the settlers, or kill the zionists or even kill the Israelis. It says kill the Jews wherever you find them. It is a charter for genocide. At least Hitler used euphemisms such as final solution or special treatment. Hamas are not so mealy mouthed.

Life_ina_market_town

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

Is there any evidence that if the people of the book surrender peacefully to the Islamic State, accept dhimmi status, and pay the jizya, they will be badly treated? It is perfectly understandable why the Christians are fleeing in what used to be Iraq, but there is no evidence that the Caliph Ibrahim intends a genocide against Christians, as opposed to the rafidah and other apostates and heretics...

JohnLilburne

HYUFD said:

BBC news main headline, White House Spokesman says US considering limited, focused air strikes and UN Security Council in emergency session

Why tell the enemy what you are about to do? Just do it. Let the world work out what you've done afterwards.

JohnLilburne

Scrapheap_as_was said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Have I missed this month's ICM?

There should be one coming shortly, the last was 11-13 July.

JBriskin

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

It all started in Ukraine. There was mass demonstrations. Anyone remember what they were demonstrating for?? Bonus points if you do. Anyway - it's now a civil war there.

Basically - that's all and only what's happened - there's always crazy stuff going on in the middle east - never anything of note.

Although the missing plane was a really good one (and apparently still not solved!)

2014 - great year for the unemployed with a Tv.

MikeK

ISIS in Tower Hamlets.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/flag-isis-jihadi-islamic-state-flown-poplar-east-london

bigjohnowls

Tonights YG EICIPM

less than 9 months to go

JohnLilburne

Life_ina_market_town said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

I confess myself mystified. Obama is happy to zap anyone in Waziristan or Yemen, and he could presumably vapourise these evil genocidal bastards. Yet nothing.

This morning 50,000 people fled their city of Qaraqosh, in the dark, as Isis approached.

50,000 people. Fleeing in the night. Scared of being crucified, raped, or beheaded.

Is there any evidence that if the people of the book surrender peacefully to the Islamic State, accept dhimmi status, and pay the jizya, they will be badly treated?

Well yes, IS is offering them "the sword" and already seems to be cutting heads off.

HYUFD

JohnLilburne Normally there is advanced warning before strikes, I would expect the US will also need to co-ordinate action with the Kurds on the ground too

Edin_Rokz

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

TheScreamingEagles

Unfortunate juxtaposition of one headline and a photograph on the front of the telegraph

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BudtKRwCMAAGqqB.jpg

HYUFD

EdinRokz Bush Snr actually successfully ousted Saddam from Kuwait with a full international coalition behind him, though agree his son was too trigger happy. Problem is Obama has gone the other way, and so far has done nothing about Iraq or Syria. Hillary offers hope for a middle way in 2016

malcolmg

DavidL said:

Too late for the previous thread but there is going to be hell to pay if Salmond wins the referendum and Scotland is then told that there will be no currency union.

The demands for a second referendum would be immense and the UK government would still be in a position to insist on it. Just another example of the holes that Salmond is digging for himself. I wonder which way he will be voting?

The Yes campaign make Gulf War II look like a masterpiece of forward planning.

David, I am now convinced you are really stupid.

Life_ina_market_town

JohnLilburne said:

Well yes, IS is offering them "the sword" and already seems to be cutting heads off.

Only for those Christians who do not submit to the Caliphate in the manner previously described.

HurstLlama

Edin_Rokz said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

I wish I hadn't asked now. Your last paragraph is total bollocks, what weapons? The rest of the stuff of fantasy novels.

FalseFlag

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

foxinsoxuk said:

SeanT said:

DavidL said:

SeanT said:

Is Yokel around? Can he explain why Obama isn't droning the f*ck out of Isis?

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/isis-offensive-iraq-christian-exodus

You are talking about a country that was happy to kill people walking in Afghanistan because they were tall. The truth is America's respect for human life or the rule of law outwith its boundaries has been pretty much on a par with ISIS.

So why indeed are they not bombing the **** out of them? Since Pol Pot and his friends hung up their cattle prods, arguably the most evil and despicable people on the planet (and it is not like there is not a lot of competition).

Congratulations on your piece. It made very important points. This is Srebrenica all over again.

The parallels with the (militantly atheistic) Khmer Rouge are extremely eerie. I intend to blog about them next week.

Thats my line!

At breakfast I commented on the Cambodian tribunal verdicts, and described ISIS as Khymer Rouge with prayer mats, wanting their own year zero.

Er, I made the comparison several weeks ago, on pb. The KR and Isis exploit the same flaw of the human brain that makes us susceptible to evil fanaticism.

I doubt either of us are the first to note the eerie echoes.

It is year zero.

But the difference between ISIS and other Islamist groups like Hamas is one of ability and equipment, the intent is the same.

Read Hamas charter and weep:

http://archive.adl.org/main_israel/hamas_charter.html#.U-PkaslwaBY

I have sympathy for the Palestinians, but none for their chosen leaders.

I think Hamas are repulsive, but they are not remotely as crazy as Isis. Even al Qaeda have rejected Isis as being too extreme.

The Gaza Strip under Hamas is not Afghanistan under the Taliban.

To pursue our communist analogy, I'd say Hamas are like East German communism, Iran is equivalent to Maoism, the Taliban equals North Korean communism.

And, yes, Isis are Year Zero. Total nihilism.

Read that article 7 of the Hamas Charter.

It doesn't say kill the IDF, or kill the settlers, or kill the zionists or even kill the Israelis. It says kill the Jews wherever you find them. It is a charter for genocide. At least Hitler used euphemisms such as final solution or special treatment. Hamas are not so mealy mouthed.

The only people committing genocide are the Israelis though not Hamas. Of course Hamas was setup by Israel to divide the Palestinians and weaken Fatah.

HYUFD

LIMT I suggest you look at my link below of a beheaded little girl, decapitated purely for being Christian!

JohnLilburne

HYUFD said:

JohnLilburne Normally there is advanced warning before strikes, I would expect the US will also need to co-ordinate action with the Kurds on the ground too

I expect they will need to talk to the Kurds too. Secretly. But why advanced warning of air strikes? Surely you want your enemy to be underneath them, unconcerned.

TheScreamingEagles

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

I wish I hadn't asked now. Your last paragraph is total bollocks, what weapons? The rest of the stuff of fantasy novels.

Does that mean our Challenger I tanks were inferior to the Iraqi T72s?

Garethofthevale

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

Here's another jolly story for you that may be the next to kick off:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/azerbaijan-president-threatens-war-armenia-twitter

kle4

JBriskin said:

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

It all started in Ukraine. There was mass demonstrations. Anyone remember what they were demonstrating for?? Bonus points if you do. Anyway - it's now a civil war there.

Seems pretty remarkable really, as protesting about the government backing out of the signing of an association agreement sounds on the face of it to be among the most boring reasons for protest ever, but when the situation is just right, lots of players are involved and it is easy to run into stark and deep divisive choices, anything can happen I guess.

FalseFlag

Cyclefree said:

SeanT said:

JBriskin said:

ICYMI Sean-


Retweeted by Kay Burley


Sky News Newsdesk ‏@SkyNewsBreak · 17m
U.S. military official says President #Obama considering airstrikes in #Iraq to help deliver aid to thousands of refugees fleeing #ISIS

Let's hope it's right. I've seen other reports saying Obama is resisting Pentagon/Clintonite attempts to bully him into taking on Isis, I've seen other reports saying the US has not droned or bombed Isis as the Saudis have requested this, in alliance against Iran.

It's a total Mongolian clusterf*ck, as we used to say in the 90s, and at the centre of it is a great big fat disappointing mediocrity, Barack Obama.

"I've seen other reports saying the US has not droned or bombed Isis as the Saudis have requested this,"

A Saudi lobby telling the Americans what to do? Surely not, I thought only Israel did this.

ISIS have the same Wahabist version of Islam that the Saudis promulgate, via their wealth. Saudi Arabia should be told to get stuffed. We should save the Yazidis and the Christians and the Kurds and all those who don't want to live under a genocidal regime.

We should save the Palestinian Christians and Muslims living under the genocidal Israeli regime in their Gaza Gulag too by that logic. Worse than the Nazis.

TheScreamingEagles

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

That would explain why Alex Salmond was so exercised by Aliens the other night.

HYUFD

JohnLilburne Well I expect the actual attack will come unannounced, at the moment they have simply said they are exploring the possibility

HurstLlama

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

I wish I hadn't asked now. Your last paragraph is total bollocks, what weapons? The rest of the stuff of fantasy novels.

Does that mean our Challenger I tanks were inferior to the Iraqi T72s?

Of course they were Mr Eagles, that's why we lost so many tanks! There is still the question though as to what weapon systems the UK sold to the Iraqis that were better than those with which we equipped out own troops. That was the claim.

Life_ina_market_town

HYUFD said:

LIMT I suggest you look at my link below of a beheaded little girl, decapitated purely for being Christian!

I quote from the link:

A week ago, Christians were warned to either leave the city of Mosul and other areas under Islamic State control, or they would have to pay a tax or be put to death.

There is no evidence that those who submit peacefully to the Caliphate, accept dhimmi status, and pay the jizya are being put to the sword.

TheScreamingEagles

HurstLlama said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

I wish I hadn't asked now. Your last paragraph is total bollocks, what weapons? The rest of the stuff of fantasy novels.

Does that mean our Challenger I tanks were inferior to the Iraqi T72s?

Of course they were Mr Eagles, that's why we lost so many tanks! There is still the question though as to what weapon systems the UK sold to the Iraqis that were better than those with which we equipped out own troops. That was the claim.

Well, there was that SuperGun we sold to Iraq, which was better than our MLRS trucks,

As an aside, the supergun story dominated my life for a while as a schoolboy.

JohnLilburne

HYUFD said:

JohnLilburne Well I expect the actual attack will come unannounced, at the moment they have simply said they are exploring the possibility

They have said too much then, IS will be dispersing already and finding defensive positions.

HurstLlama

Life_ina_market_town said:

HYUFD said:

LIMT I suggest you look at my link below of a beheaded little girl, decapitated purely for being Christian!

I quote from the link:

A week ago, Christians were warned to either leave the city of Mosul and other areas under Islamic State control, or they would have to pay a tax or be put to death.

There is no evidence that those who submit peacefully to the Caliphate, accept dhimmi status, and pay the jizya are being put to the sword.

Difficult to provide an affidavit if you are dead.

Danny565

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

JBriskin

kle4 said:

JBriskin said:

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

It all started in Ukraine. There was mass demonstrations. Anyone remember what they were demonstrating for?? Bonus points if you do. Anyway - it's now a civil war there.

Seems pretty remarkable really, as protesting about the government backing out of the signing of an association agreement sounds on the face of it to be among the most boring reasons for protest ever, but when the situation is just right, lots of players are involved and it is easy to run into stark and deep divisive choices, anything can happen I guess.

Yes - thanks for picking up on this - I hope other PBers are paying attention - Surely nothing wrong with reminding those of political persuasion what actually started off the Ukraine civil war.

TheScreamingEagles

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

HYUFD

LIAMT Oh OK then, this is now a GOOD BEHEADING, as Chris Morris may have said, a girl who was probably not even ten and did not understand what was happening was decapitated and it is her fault for refusing to be clear on her devotion to Islam!!!

HurstLlama

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

I wish I hadn't asked now. Your last paragraph is total bollocks, what weapons? The rest of the stuff of fantasy novels.

Does that mean our Challenger I tanks were inferior to the Iraqi T72s?

Of course they were Mr Eagles, that's why we lost so many tanks! There is still the question though as to what weapon systems the UK sold to the Iraqis that were better than those with which we equipped out own troops. That was the claim.

Well, there was that SuperGun we sold to Iraq, which was better than our MLRS trucks,

As an aside, the supergun story dominated my life for a while as a schoolboy.

But there was no actual super-gun was there? Outside Freddie Forsyth's imagination that is, and it wasn't a weapon system sold by the UK. It was some chunks of metal that combined with other chunks of metal from other countries may, possibly, have made a weapon that, absent a nuclear shell, would have feck all use.

I am still waiting for Mr. Rohkz to justify his original claim. I can't imagine why its taking him so long, surely he must have had weapons and systems in mind when he posted it.

JohnLilburne

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HurstLlama said:

Edin_Rokz said:

HYUFD said:

SeanT We all know Obama is the 'ditherer in chief' and is far more interested in creating a legacy in the history books for ending wars than starting them and so is reluctant to commit even when required. The Kurds are tough but if ISIS push into Kurdish heartlands I would expect US strikes, the same if they got close to Baghdad (probably joined by Iran).

Er, No! Obama actually thinks before he acts. Just consider what happens when you allow a Bush to be President. Kuwait, and 2, repeat TWO Iraq wars and what has happened since?

The Iraqi invasion of Kuwait was President Bush's fault? Care to explain that one?

Yep! Saddam Hussein thought that the US Ambassador had given him a wink to proceed. And there is more than likely the chance that someone at Foggy Bottom wouldn't have realised the importance of the remark.

OK, So Saddam was off his trolley, as anyone who had read the Amnesty International reports at that time would agree on.

But Saddam wouldn't have done anything that the US/UK wouldn't have liked. Nuts he was, but not totally.

He had a couple of sons who made up for that.

And we did supply, the UK, arms and weapons systems to Iraq that were superior to the arms that our soldiers had at the time of the first Iraq war.

I wish I hadn't asked now. Your last paragraph is total bollocks, what weapons? The rest of the stuff of fantasy novels.

Does that mean our Challenger I tanks were inferior to the Iraqi T72s?

Of course they were Mr Eagles, that's why we lost so many tanks! There is still the question though as to what weapon systems the UK sold to the Iraqis that were better than those with which we equipped out own troops. That was the claim.

Well, there was that SuperGun we sold to Iraq, which was better than our MLRS trucks,

As an aside, the supergun story dominated my life for a while as a schoolboy.

There's bits of it at the Royal Armouries museum at Fort Nelson, or at least there was when I last visited, plus odd bits of Iraqi ordnance showing that our artillerymen still like to capture war trophies.

HYUFD

JohnLilburne ISIS do not know where the strike will be or at what time, and I expect strikes will only take place once Kurds have given a clear indication of ISIS positions, though agree would be best to keep details quiet from now on

JBriskin

SeanT said:

Garethofthevale said:

Edin_Rokz said:

And there is something rather interesting happening now - anyone thought about how many so called un-natural disasters have happened recently within the past few months? Planes crashing? Wars happening? etc.?

I've been around a few years and I can't remember such a series like this.

Wot Next? Flying Saucers from Mars.

Here's another jolly story for you that may be the next to kick off:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/07/azerbaijan-president-threatens-war-armenia-twitter

I think everyone should go to war with everyone else. For a start, England should invade the Faroes, massacring their pilot whale fisherman. But we can do better than that.

Personally I'm going to blockade the neighbours, and then secretly tunnel into their fridge and torment their pet hamsters, for no reason at all, thus establishing the new state of The Posh End of Delancey Street.

Are you pissed Sean??

We're literally on the Pimms!!!!

Let the Unemployed and Tory Journos unite!!!!!

TheScreamingEagles

HurstLlama said:

But there was no actual super-gun was there? Outside Freddie Forsyth's imagination that is, and it wasn't a weapon system sold by the UK. It was some chunks of metal that combined with other chunks of metal from other countries may, possibly, have made a weapon that, absent a nuclear shell, would have feck all use.

I am still waiting for Mr. Rohkz to justify his original claim. I can't imagine why its taking him so long, surely he must have had weapons and systems in mind when he posted it.

They said it was a petrol extraction machine.

My friend's father worked for Sheffield Forgemasters, when the Matrix-Churchill trial collapsed, we were convinced his father was working for MI6, for a while, everyone thought my friend's Dad was like James Bond.

MikeK

Life_ina_market_town said:

HYUFD said:

LIMT I suggest you look at my link below of a beheaded little girl, decapitated purely for being Christian!

I quote from the link:

A week ago, Christians were warned to either leave the city of Mosul and other areas under Islamic State control, or they would have to pay a tax or be put to death.

There is no evidence that those who submit peacefully to the Caliphate, accept dhimmi status, and pay the jizya are being put to the sword.
I suppose #Life_ina_market_town you would be more than willing to accept dhimmi status in an Islamic theocratic state. You really are a poor specimen in even suggesting it, unless that is you are a fanatical muslim yourself.

TheScreamingEagles

JohnLilburne said:

There's bits of it at the Royal Armouries museum at Fort Nelson, or at least there was when I last visited, plus odd bits of Iraqi ordnance showing that our artillerymen still like to capture war trophies.

In an alternate universe, I'm a British Artilleryman.

MikeK

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

But there was no actual super-gun was there? Outside Freddie Forsyth's imagination that is, and it wasn't a weapon system sold by the UK. It was some chunks of metal that combined with other chunks of metal from other countries may, possibly, have made a weapon that, absent a nuclear shell, would have feck all use.

I am still waiting for Mr. Rohkz to justify his original claim. I can't imagine why its taking him so long, surely he must have had weapons and systems in mind when he posted it.

They said it was a petrol extraction machine.

My friend's father worked for Sheffield Forgemasters, when the Matrix-Churchill trial collapsed, we were convinced his father was working for MI6, for a while, everyone thought my friend's Dad was like James Bond.

I always thought that most gun parts were made in South Africa or Rhodesia.

Life_ina_market_town

HYUFD said:

LIAMT Oh OK then, this is now a GOOD BEHEADING, as Chris Morris may have said, a girl who was probably not even ten and did not understand what was happening was decapitated and it is her fault for refusing to be clear on her devotion to Islam!!!

I am not trying to justify anything that the Islamic State does. I despise it, and all other messianic totalitarianisms of its kind. I am simply pointing out that its actions thus far have been entirely in accordance with the principles it espouses, which were put into effect in nearly all medieval Islamic states.

TheScreamingEagles

Huzzah for Nick Clegg and the Sun,

Chris Ship ‏@chrisshipitv 1m

The Sun agrees with Nick> RT @Sun_Politics: EXCL: Don't Nick drug users: DPM wants to end imprisonment of some users: http://bit.ly/1u2SXaq

Life_ina_market_town

MikeK said:

I suppose #Life_ina_market_town you would be more than willing to accept dhimmi status in an Islamic theocratic state. You really are a poor specimen in even suggesting it, unless that is you are a fanatical muslim yourself.

I said at the outset that it was perfectly understandable why Christians are fleeing. I would in their position. That does not mean that we should ignore the position of those who did not flee, and the regime under which they will be forced to live. As for my own religious convictions, I am an atheist.

Danny565

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

HurstLlama

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

But there was no actual super-gun was there? Outside Freddie Forsyth's imagination that is, and it wasn't a weapon system sold by the UK. It was some chunks of metal that combined with other chunks of metal from other countries may, possibly, have made a weapon that, absent a nuclear shell, would have feck all use.

I am still waiting for Mr. Rohkz to justify his original claim. I can't imagine why its taking him so long, surely he must have had weapons and systems in mind when he posted it.

They said it was a petrol extraction machine.

My friend's father worked for Sheffield Forgemasters, when the Matrix-Churchill trial collapsed, we were convinced his father was working for MI6, for a while, everyone thought my friend's Dad was like James Bond.

That whole Matrix-Churchill thing was a fiasco and a nonsense. Some years before the Iraqis tried to set up a deal with a British company that was for sure actually about building them plants for making poison gas, but artfully disguised as an agri-chemical industry . One of the employees had a word with someone he knew in Whitehall and word was passed down to the company's chairman that such a contract would not be in the national interest. The Iraqis were shown the door. No fuss, no trial, no clumping feet of VAT inspectors.

Mind you, the Germans built them the chemical plants and made a fortune in the process.

Danny565

TheScreamingEagles said:

Huzzah for Nick Clegg and the Sun,

Chris Ship ‏@chrisshipitv 1m

The Sun agrees with Nick> RT @Sun_Politics: EXCL: Don't Nick drug users: DPM wants to end imprisonment of some users: http://bit.ly/1u2SXaq

Who knew the Sun were bleeding-heart liberals.

EDIT: Oh wait, maybe I missed the joke.

HYUFD

LIAMT Even Saladin had some principles of humanity, ISIS as far as I can see are just sadistic butchers twisting the Koran to justify their savagery

TheScreamingEagles

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

The logic is thus (I have my doubts)

People like Boris (he's the most popular politician in the country)

Boris is about the rejoin the parliamentary party

People will want to vote for the Tory party, 'cause Boris is back

RobD

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

The logic is thus (I have my doubts)

People like Boris (he's the most popular politician in the country)

Boris is about the rejoin the parliamentary party

People will want to vote for the Tory party, 'cause Boris is back

The public is too clever to risk a Tory bounce prior to the IndyRef....

TheScreamingEagles

HurstLlama said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

But there was no actual super-gun was there? Outside Freddie Forsyth's imagination that is, and it wasn't a weapon system sold by the UK. It was some chunks of metal that combined with other chunks of metal from other countries may, possibly, have made a weapon that, absent a nuclear shell, would have feck all use.

I am still waiting for Mr. Rohkz to justify his original claim. I can't imagine why its taking him so long, surely he must have had weapons and systems in mind when he posted it.

They said it was a petrol extraction machine.

My friend's father worked for Sheffield Forgemasters, when the Matrix-Churchill trial collapsed, we were convinced his father was working for MI6, for a while, everyone thought my friend's Dad was like James Bond.

That whole Matrix-Churchill thing was a fiasco and a nonsense. Some years before the Iraqis tried to set up a deal with a British company that was for sure actually about building them plants for making poison gas, but artfully disguised as an agri-chemical industry . One of the employees had a word with someone he knew in Whitehall and word was passed down to the company's chairman that such a contract would not be in the national interest. The Iraqis were shown the door. No fuss, no trial, no clumping feet of VAT inspectors.

Mind you, the Germans built them the chemical plants and made a fortune in the process.

Alan Clark's finest hour though.

FluffyThoughts

Gosh, some regulars have posted a lot of tripe this week. For example:

Gaza - never part of Jordan but was captured from the Egyptians. [Sceptics-and-kin are easily confused.]

St Helena "over-spec'ed" airport cannot take Voyager nor Globemaster-III (at least not fully tanked/loaded as it is designed for 737s) and I would not wish to be on a A400M Euro-Turkey when the former aircraft would have made the journey from Ascenscion (only 60-NM further via the great circle) more safely...!

The UK has 228 front-line MBTs. Four are dedicated for driver training: The rest are split between Type-56 Regiments (and you can now do the math)....

Israel is crass, but no more than Hamas. Hamas 'may' have been elected but they then executed approx 1000 Fatah officials.

Finally, as an observation:

Israel should not show ancient M109 howitzers bombing Gaza (as thick Al-Beeb journalists will call this 'tank-fire'). Instead - despite the 'La-la' protestations of Lib-Dhimmie-dom (and Warsi) the UK and US should speed-up integration of "Dual-Mode Brimstone". If drones were used to target rocket launchers using said missile then civilian casualties would be lessened. As Phil Woolas signed up to buying the Israeli/Raphael Hermes drone (a.k.a. Watchkeeper) such a deal would benefit most decent people and please Labour eejits....

TheScreamingEagles

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Huzzah for Nick Clegg and the Sun,

Chris Ship ‏@chrisshipitv 1m

The Sun agrees with Nick> RT @Sun_Politics: EXCL: Don't Nick drug users: DPM wants to end imprisonment of some users: http://bit.ly/1u2SXaq

Who knew the Sun were bleeding-heart liberals.

EDIT: Oh wait, maybe I missed the joke.

Well I'm definitely voting for Clegg next year.

Grandiose

MikeK said:

Who said the Romanians weren't coming?
UKIP warning was ignored, and now they are pouring in:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2673475/Romanians-sleeping-rough-London-tripled-just-months-borders-opened-2-000-arrested-12-weeks.html

"Westminster Council’s report shows that the number of Romanian rough sleepers in Central London has risen from 20 in January to 59 last month."

59.

Not even a swallow, let alone a summer.

"It means there has been a 25 per cent increase in the number of charges against Romanians this year."

Pouring, is it? Really?

TheScreamingEagles

RobD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

The logic is thus (I have my doubts)

People like Boris (he's the most popular politician in the country)

Boris is about the rejoin the parliamentary party

People will want to vote for the Tory party, 'cause Boris is back

The public is too clever to risk a Tory bounce prior to the IndyRef....

Indeed, we're the Conservative and UNIONIST Party

RobD

TheScreamingEagles said:

RobD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

The logic is thus (I have my doubts)

People like Boris (he's the most popular politician in the country)

Boris is about the rejoin the parliamentary party

People will want to vote for the Tory party, 'cause Boris is back

The public is too clever to risk a Tory bounce prior to the IndyRef....

Indeed, we're the Conservative and UNIONIST Party

I'll remind Sunil next time he's on!

TheScreamingEagles

The headline on the front page of The Sun appeals to my inner Finbar Saunders

Woman navy officer sunk by seaman. Heave-ho for Jolly Rodgerer

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bud5hNuIQAAUGtO.jpg

FluffyThoughts

Life_ina_market_town said:

There is no evidence that those who submit peacefully to the Caliphate, accept dhimmi status, and pay the jizya are being put to the sword.

You can offer LJ-RH a safe home in tolerant England but you will never take the religious bile that all Ulster-Scots have for those who are not there own....

HurstLlama

"Hamas 'may' have been elected"

Indeed they were, in 2006 if I recall. Anyone know what the parliamentary term is in Gaza? At the back of my mind is the thought that there were supposed to have been some elections in 2012 but they got cancelled for some reason.

TheScreamingEagles

HurstLlama said:

"Hamas 'may' have been elected"

Indeed they were, in 2006 if I recall. Anyone know what the parliamentary term is in Gaza? At the back of my mind is the thought that there were supposed to have been some elections in 2012 but they got cancelled for some reason.

The next Palestinian elections are later on this year.

I hope to do some threads on it.

dr_spyn

TheScreamingEagles said:

The headline on the front page of The Sun appeals to my inner Finbar Saunders

Woman navy officer sunk by seaman. Heave-ho for Jolly Rodgerer

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bud5hNuIQAAUGtO.jpg

Twas on the good ship Venus...

TheScreamingEagles

RobD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RobD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

The logic is thus (I have my doubts)

People like Boris (he's the most popular politician in the country)

Boris is about the rejoin the parliamentary party

People will want to vote for the Tory party, 'cause Boris is back

The public is too clever to risk a Tory bounce prior to the IndyRef....

Indeed, we're the Conservative and UNIONIST Party

I'll remind Sunil next time he's on!

Thanks, I'm worried about Sunil, he's slipped from the path recently, I mean he voted UKIP at the Euros.

HurstLlama

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

"Hamas 'may' have been elected"

Indeed they were, in 2006 if I recall. Anyone know what the parliamentary term is in Gaza? At the back of my mind is the thought that there were supposed to have been some elections in 2012 but they got cancelled for some reason.

The next Palestinian elections are later on this year.

I hope to do some threads on it.

Not too sure on the betting opportunities, Mr Eagles. Odds on the parliamentary candidate for Khan Yunis East being found with his head? Tricky to set odds in that sort of market and a bit tacky betting in it. The opinion polls should be interesting, after some of the lads visit the local ICM office the result will surely be Hamas 99.9% for week after week.

MarkSenior

Conservatives have held Huntingdon Warboys no figures yet

TheScreamingEagles

dr_spyn said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

The headline on the front page of The Sun appeals to my inner Finbar Saunders

Woman navy officer sunk by seaman. Heave-ho for Jolly Rodgerer

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bud5hNuIQAAUGtO.jpg

Twas on the good ship Venus...

I'll shut up, one of my naval jokes got me dumped a few years ago.

TheScreamingEagles

HurstLlama said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

HurstLlama said:

"Hamas 'may' have been elected"

Indeed they were, in 2006 if I recall. Anyone know what the parliamentary term is in Gaza? At the back of my mind is the thought that there were supposed to have been some elections in 2012 but they got cancelled for some reason.

The next Palestinian elections are later on this year.

I hope to do some threads on it.

Not too sure on the betting opportunities, Mr Eagles. Odds on the parliamentary candidate for Khan Yunis East being found with his head? Tricky to set odds in that sort of market and a bit tacky betting in it. The opinion polls should be interesting, after some of the lads visit the local ICM office the result will surely be Hamas 99.9% for week after week.

With Paddy Power, you never know what sort of markets they'll run.

dr_spyn

@ TheScreamingEagles Posts: 13,189
11:13PM
dr_spyn said:
» show previous quotes
Twas on the good ship Venus...

I'll shut up, one of my naval jokes got me dumped a few years ago.

She's got a lovely navel uniform?

HurstLlama

TheScreamingEagles said:

RobD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

RobD said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Danny565 said:

peter_from_putney said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

@Sun_Politics: YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead back up two to five points: CON 33%, LAB 38%, LD 7%, UKIP 12%

Probably too early for any Boris impact, so UKPR likely to remain unchanged for all three major parties.
RN is probably right - polls should now be ignored until after the holiday period.

Eh? Why would there be any Boris impact?

I mean, I can see the argument that Boris as leader would drag back people to the Tories (though even that's debateable), but why would Boris simply standing as an MP draw people in?

There was a bit of a Boris Halo effect on some of the polls when he was running/elected as London Mayor in 2008 and 2012.

Isn't that more because the story was of Tory success, so people were almost jumping on the bandwagon?

I just don't really understand why someone who wasn't going to vote Tory last week would decide to this week just because Boris was standing (unless you were actually in the constituency he was standing in, obviously). I mean it's not like people didn't already know that Boris was a Tory.

The logic is thus (I have my doubts)

People like Boris (he's the most popular politician in the country)

Boris is about the rejoin the parliamentary party

People will want to vote for the Tory party, 'cause Boris is back

The public is too clever to risk a Tory bounce prior to the IndyRef....

Indeed, we're the Conservative and UNIONIST Party

I'll remind Sunil next time he's on!

Thanks, I'm worried about Sunil, he's slipped from the path recently, I mean he voted UKIP at the Euros.

I think it might because he is spending so much time in the Midlands. His mum's influence wearing off a bit perhaps.

Also he has barely posted anything about trains for months, a couple of photos of a Cross Rail station and that is about it. Worrying.