UKIPs may not like Cameron, but he really is their best shot at a referendum to leave the EU.
Read the thread. Kippers do not want a referendum.
Or in other words vote Tory or milibrand gets in
what a totally pathetic reason to give for voting Tory is that really the best reason you can come up with. Just goes to show the sorry state of the conservative party but then what can you expect from a tory party led by a new labour disciple like Cameron.
Surely voting to avoid a repeat of the last Labour govt is the sanest and best reason ever to vote A particular way ? It was the worst govt ever.
And this government is merely a continuation of that previous one. I should have been warned I guess by Cameron claiming to be heir to Blair but I didn't actually take the claim seriously.
The tories just like labour continue to fritter away the wealth of our children and grandchildren to purchase electoral advantage where is the actual difference?
Neither is prepared to take the hard decisions and instead prefer to kick the can down the road and hope those as yet ineligble to vote can carry the burden.
Labour and Conservative are merely to cheeks of the same arse leaving the lib dems as the orifice between them. No before anyone says it I do not think UKIP are necessarily going to be any better but as a wise man once said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing again and again while hoping the outcome will be different. That to me about sums up voting for one of the traditional three
Count me in as CCC member number 2. I wonder if, in years to come having, a low party number will confer the same sort of secular sainthood that it did in the Communist Party? I hope not but it might give our grandchildren something to talk about over dinner.
Count me in as CCC member number 2. I wonder if, in years to come having, a low party number will confer the same sort of secular sainthood that it did in the Communist Party? I hope not but it might give our grandchildren something to talk about over dinner.
I suspect we might have a membership of 2 - the Statler and Waldorf of PB :-)
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Might I suggest we put malcomG in the FO, since that would be his response to anyone trying to push us around ?
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Perhaps there could be a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments for you to head? Your job could be to periodically go round the other departments, and if they aren't up to much, down they go.
Also, I object to a trains enthusiast running Transport - granted, trains are great in that you can sleep in them, but what the car lovers of our society? Are they to be neglected?
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Might I suggest we put malcomG in the FO, since that would be his response to anyone trying to push us around ?
I did think of that but I thought he would not be available, either through actually being foreign or wishing he was foreign, and in either case his certainty that everything that comes out of London is a lie might make it difficult for him to negotiate with other governments.
Is Rod Crosby about. Sorry to be off topic,should wait for nightghawks really. I revisited my birthplace today(Crosby) first time for 40 years,well Blundellsands actually. Wow many changes,and much the same. I really wanted to visit the Carnegie,but it was permanently closed,surely an act of political vandalism by the Labour controlled Sefton council, What would Carnegie have thought if his gift had been thrown away like this,shameful. Corrie park looked sad and neglected,bowling greens a field of weeds,and the putting green just mud,but the Erratic boulder still there,and the boating lake. The Crown buildings all but gone,the BS gone,the George gone(I think). The swimming baths gone but replaced,Seafield renamed,St Marys has got rid of the evil Christian Brothers and got girls,Merchants still looking fine. My former home looked better than I remember,and the Gormley statues down below the erosion looked great.Lunch at the Pheasant,then Formby and Southport. Rod ,I am sure this all sounds familiar,great day out.
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Might I suggest we put malcomG in the FO, since that would be his response to anyone trying to push us around ?
I did think of that but I thought he would not be available, either through actually being foreign or wishing he was foreign, and in either case his certainty that everything that comes out of London is a lie might make it difficult for him to negotiate with other governments.
But think of all the ships we'd need to build just to keep ourselves safe. malc would fill the Clyde shipyards and become a national hero :-)
No mention of Farage on the QT site: 'Conservative Party chairman Grant Shapps MP, Labour's shadow business secretary Chuka Umunna MP and Liberal Democrat peer Shirley Williams.'
"I do acknowledge that for historical, geopolitical and economic reasons the case of the UK may be seen as a special one. Precisely because of this, it would be a mistake to transform an exception for the UK into a rule for everybody else"
Sounds like what amounts to treason for an EU bureaucrat given their usual positions on such arguments. I've only been online a short while, anyone know what's brought this on from him?
Is Rod Crosby about. Sorry to be off topic,should wait for nightghawks really. I revisited my birthplace today(Crosby) first time for 40 years,well Blundellsands actually. Wow many changes,and much the same. I really wanted to visit the Carnegie,but it was permanently closed,surely an act of political vandalism by the Labour controlled Sefton council, What would Carnegie have thought if his gift had been thrown away like this,shameful. Corrie park looked sad and neglected,bowling greens a field of weeds,and the putting green just mud,but the Erratic boulder still there,and the boating lake. The Crown buildings all but gone,the BS gone,the George gone(I think). The swimming baths gone but replaced,Seafield renamed,St Marys has got rid of the evil Christian Brothers and got girls,Merchants still looking fine. My former home looked better than I remember,and the Gormley statues down below the erosion looked great.Lunch at the Pheasant,then Formby and Southport. Rod ,I am sure this all sounds familiar,great day out.
I accept that "women can act in ways which make rape more likely" but that's factual causation, not legal or moral responsibility: the link is broken by the intervention of the rapist.
Then when it comes to sentencing, we do not need to ask what level of culpability the victim has, only the level of culpability of the attacker.
Let's draw an analogy with murder. Someone who kills and intended to kill or to cause grievous bodily harm is entitled to an acquittal of murder and a conviction for manslaughter, if they can demonstrate loss of control (s. 54-55 of the Coroners and Justice Act 2009, replacing provocation under the pre-2010 law). The statute is fairly impenetrable, but it is clear that someone's criminal liability in a murder case can dependent on the actions of the "victim". Moreover, the actions of the "victim" in such a case are plainly relevant to sentence. If such an approach to murder is in principle justifiable why can it not be justified in respect of rape?
Sentencing can clearly depend on the actions of the victim in murder, and in rape. But at no point does the culpability of the victim enter into the equation.
Consider "According to the Council’s guideline on seriousness, culpability is determined by the extent to which the offender intends to cause harm – the worse the harm intended, the greater the offender’s culpability."
On one level, the victim's actions may endear in the perpretator certain facts leading him to believe that no harm was being done. On the other hand, not only is this not the victim's culpability but the perpetrator's culpability in light of the victim's actions, but at the end of the day the victim's actions are never constitutive of the perpetrator's intention to cause harm but are merely the background in which it sits.
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Perhaps there could be a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments for you to head? Your job could be to periodically go round the other departments, and if they aren't up to much, down they go.
Also, I object to a trains enthusiast running Transport - granted, trains are great in that you can sleep in them, but what the car lovers of our society? Are they to be neglected?
No, the idea of creating a department for the eradication of departments is just insane. Might as well have a Department for Administrative Affairs - at least that was Fictional, which the Ministry for Economic Affairs wasn't.
Having a trains' man in charge at transport may not be as bad as you fear for car lovers, especially if the right chap is chosen. The alternative might be to put Jessup in at Transport and Socrates in at Energy, not sure you'd like that any better.
Anyway, if you don't like my picks why not come up with your own. This is a game of PB Fanatsy Cabinets after all.
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Perhaps there could be a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments for you to head? Your job could be to periodically go round the other departments, and if they aren't up to much, down they go.
Also, I object to a trains enthusiast running Transport - granted, trains are great in that you can sleep in them, but what the car lovers of our society? Are they to be neglected?
No, the idea of creating a department for the eradication of departments is just insane. Might as well have a Department for Administrative Affairs - at least that was Fictional, which the Ministry for Economic Affairs wasn't.
Having a trains' man in charge at transport may not be as bad as you fear for car lovers, especially if the right chap is chosen. The alternative might be to put Jessup in at Transport and Socrates in at Energy, not sure you'd like that any better.
Anyway, if you don't like my picks why not come up with your own. This is a game of PB Fanatsy Cabinets after all.
How about Mr Dancer for Minister for all the Regions except Yorkshire ? We've got to get him out into the wider world some time.
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Perhaps there could be a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments for you to head? Your job could be to periodically go round the other departments, and if they aren't up to much, down they go.
Also, I object to a trains enthusiast running Transport - granted, trains are great in that you can sleep in them, but what the car lovers of our society? Are they to be neglected?
No, the idea of creating a department for the eradication of departments is just insane. Might as well have a Department for Administrative Affairs - at least that was Fictional, which the Ministry for Economic Affairs wasn't.
Having a trains' man in charge at transport may not be as bad as you fear for car lovers, especially if the right chap is chosen. The alternative might be to put Jessup in at Transport and Socrates in at Energy, not sure you'd like that any better.
Anyway, if you don't like my picks why not come up with your own. This is a game of PB Fanatsy Cabinets after all.
Believe me I am trying, but my chronic indecisiveness is truly a bar here. Yokel for Foreign Office, surely?
Even I was not serious about a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments. It would need a much better name.
Just taking Mr. Brooke's idea of the CCC party and running forward to a game of PB fanatsy cabinets:
PM: TSE (first among equals) Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well) Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place) Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN) Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA) Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains) Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?) Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course) DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it) DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Perhaps there could be a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments for you to head? Your job could be to periodically go round the other departments, and if they aren't up to much, down they go.
Also, I object to a trains enthusiast running Transport - granted, trains are great in that you can sleep in them, but what the car lovers of our society? Are they to be neglected?
No, the idea of creating a department for the eradication of departments is just insane. Might as well have a Department for Administrative Affairs - at least that was Fictional, which the Ministry for Economic Affairs wasn't.
Having a trains' man in charge at transport may not be as bad as you fear for car lovers, especially if the right chap is chosen. The alternative might be to put Jessup in at Transport and Socrates in at Energy, not sure you'd like that any better.
Anyway, if you don't like my picks why not come up with your own. This is a game of PB Fanatsy Cabinets after all.
A friend at the Treasury says that there's such a thing as "Transport [excluding trains]" team there.
I read that as The Good Life and wondered what I'd missed in the 70s.
Me too. There is, I think, two whole generations of men in the isles who, whenever the name Felicity Kendal is mentioned have a spasm in the trouser department. (there was a picture of her in today's telegraph - she is still gorgeous)
On the subject of a fantasy cabinet, could I be both Welsh Secretary, Minister of State for the Commonwealth and a PPS in the Culture Department (with special responsibility for fitness)
I read that as The Good Life and wondered what I'd missed in the 70s.
Me too. There is, I think, two whole generations of men in the isles who, whenever the name Felicity Kendal is mentioned have a spasm in the trouser department. (there was a picture of her in today's telegraph - she is still gorgeous)
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
It surprises me that so many on the right think that the Tories being a point behind is somehow a great sign.
Labour:
-Helped bugger up the nations finances -Have a weak leader who sounds like an out of touch posh boy just as much as his Conservative counterpart -Don't seem to have a clear economic policy other than borrow and spend
Given that the economy is turning and the sheer amount of cack that the country has been through now appears to be on their way out, why should Labour have a lead?
The only bigger variable you have the possibility of the Conservatives leaking more votes on the right to UKIP.
Those on the right need to get a bit more ambitious, being behind, being level isn't good enough nor is it to be celebrated. Its not as if Labour is sh*t hot.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
We're asking the same question. Unless the past allegiances of UKIP voters have changed, which doesn't seem all that likely, there must be some other underlying current flow of voters that hasn't yet been fully identified.
It surprises me that so many on the right think that the Tories being a point behind is somehow a great sign.
Labour:
-Helped bugger up the nations finances -Have a weak leader who sounds like an out of touch posh boy just as much as his Conservative counterpart -Don't seem to have a clear economic policy other than borrow and spend
Given that the economy is turning and the sheer amount of cack that the country has been through now appears to be on their way out, why should Labour have a lead?
The only bigger variable you have the possibility of the Conservatives leaking more votes on the right to UKIP.
Those on the right need to get a bit more ambitious, being behind, being level isn't good enough nor is it to be celebrated. Its not as if Labour is sh*t hot.
Yes and no, I guess. A one point Labour lead is roughly, UNS, the Labour majority borderline when the LibDem vote is low. So from a Conservative perspective they need only inch on to deny Labour a majority.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible.
You know what, I come on here for poll analysis and there is no mention of polling! I have searched long and hard for even a whiff of a mention of YouGov. Nope. Nowt. Silence. I'm off to bed.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
We're asking the same question. Unless the past allegiances of UKIP voters have changed, which doesn't seem all that likely, there must be some other underlying current flow of voters that hasn't yet been fully identified.
The always readable Hopi Sen did a piece (in reply to a PB thread) that has stuck in the mind that could explain this.
How to lose vote share without losing a single voter
It surprises me that so many on the right think that the Tories being a point behind is somehow a great sign.
Labour:
-Helped bugger up the nations finances -Have a weak leader who sounds like an out of touch posh boy just as much as his Conservative counterpart -Don't seem to have a clear economic policy other than borrow and spend
Given that the economy is turning and the sheer amount of cack that the country has been through now appears to be on their way out, why should Labour have a lead?
The only bigger variable you have the possibility of the Conservatives leaking more votes on the right to UKIP.
Those on the right need to get a bit more ambitious, being behind, being level isn't good enough nor is it to be celebrated. Its not as if Labour is sh*t hot.
The amusing this is that the "last bastion" (copyright: G. Brown) of the Union is the Scottish Labour Party. And those cracks are getting wider by the day.
Evening all, just wondering if YouGov reads Con35,Lab34, Lib8 or9, UKIP 13 or 14, how many of us would read it and not realise crossover had occurred. These numbers the other way round are becoming quite a regular occurrence.
Assume we have a Populus in the morning. I wonder if it will tighten too.
Evening all, just wondering if YouGov reads Con35,Lab34, Lib8 or9, UKIP 13 or 14, how many of us would read it and not realise crossover had occurred. These numbers the other way round are becoming quite a regular occurrence.
I can say at least one person would read it and not realise, as I just did that with your example until the second sentence clued me in.
It surprises me that so many on the right think that the Tories being a point behind is somehow a great sign.
Labour:
-Helped bugger up the nations finances -Have a weak leader who sounds like an out of touch posh boy just as much as his Conservative counterpart -Don't seem to have a clear economic policy other than borrow and spend
Given that the economy is turning and the sheer amount of cack that the country has been through now appears to be on their way out, why should Labour have a lead?
The only bigger variable you have the possibility of the Conservatives leaking more votes on the right to UKIP.
Those on the right need to get a bit more ambitious, being behind, being level isn't good enough nor is it to be celebrated. Its not as if Labour is sh*t hot.
Because people generally hate their governments, except for around election time, when they may or may not choose to give them another go if they the think the Opposition isn't up to it.
The (normal) electoral cycle is such that from here the Oppositions position can only get worse (outside the normal ebb and flow of day to day polls)
Between now and polling day Labours position can only get worse, IMO, which means by May 7th 2010 the Conservatives should have a fairly modest lead in most polls (perhaps 5%?)
Not enough to secure an outright majority, probably, but enough to win again in terms of votes and seats and to continue to Coalition for five more years.
I'll predict ICM, as the last pollster to give the Conservatives a lead in March 2012, will be the first pollster to show them back in the lead this summer or autumn.
It surprises me that so many on the right think that the Tories being a point behind is somehow a great sign.
Labour:
-Helped bugger up the nations finances -Have a weak leader who sounds like an out of touch posh boy just as much as his Conservative counterpart -Don't seem to have a clear economic policy other than borrow and spend
Given that the economy is turning and the sheer amount of cack that the country has been through now appears to be on their way out, why should Labour have a lead?
The only bigger variable you have the possibility of the Conservatives leaking more votes on the right to UKIP.
Those on the right need to get a bit more ambitious, being behind, being level isn't good enough nor is it to be celebrated. Its not as if Labour is sh*t hot.
Because people generally hate their governments, except for around election time, when they may or may not choose to give them another go.
The (normal) electoral cycle is such that from here the Oppositions position can only get worse (outside the normal ebb and flow of day to day polls)
Between now and polling day Labours position can only get worse, IMO, which means by May 7th 2010 the Conservatives should have a fairly modest lead in most polls (perhaps 5%?)
Not enough to secure an outright majority, probably, but enough to win again in terms of votes and seats and to continue to Coalition for five more years.
I'll predict ICM, as the last pollster to give the Conservatives a lead in March 2012, will be the first pollster to show them back in the lead this summer or autumn.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
Mr Eagles me too. Remember how before the last GE the consensus on here was that the government would be miles behind in the polls and a position of minus 10 would be thought good? It never really happened, did it? Maybe, just maybe, we ought now to be thinking against the consensus and looking for bets that see a different sort of result in 2015.
FFS! A year out, the main opposition just 1 or 2 points ahead and an insurgent party above 10%. Possibly something has changed.
And with that, and visions of Felicity Kendal running around in my head (thanks Mr. Brooke) I too am off to beddy-byes. G'night all, and thanks for the chat this evening.
When was the last time Labour made any headline news? They seem to have gone off on holiday at Easter and not returned. Is this some sort of deliberate strategy?
When was the last time Labour made any headline news? They seem to have gone off on holiday at Easter and not returned. Is this some sort of deliberate strategy?
When was the last time Labour made any headline news? They seem to have gone off on holiday at Easter and not returned. Is this some sort of deliberate strategy?
Nonsense. Johann makes terrific headlines. At least one every six months.
When was the last time Labour made any headline news? They seem to have gone off on holiday at Easter and not returned. Is this some sort of deliberate strategy?
Ed's on the front page in the evening standard quite a lot. Last week in was Empty houses, the week before that rent. Maybe they have a local strategy.
No, the idea of creating a department for the eradication of departments is just insane. Might as well have a Department for Administrative Affairs - at least that was Fictional, which the Ministry for Economic Affairs wasn't.
Having a trains' man in charge at transport may not be as bad as you fear for car lovers, especially if the right chap is chosen. The alternative might be to put Jessup in at Transport and Socrates in at Energy, not sure you'd like that any better.
Anyway, if you don't like my picks why not come up with your own. This is a game of PB Fanatsy Cabinets after all.
I might suggest RCS for energy (appears to know the finance side of the industry), or Mr Tyndall (appears to know the practical side, I think). But if you want me in that exalted position, then my energy prospectus would be nukes, CCGT, offshore wind, fracking with caveats, and reduce coal. Make clear what the energy needs of the country are, and deliver. Energy security would be first and foremost priority over greenery.
I'd also like to see power generated from all the wind and hot air produced at Westminster. I'd also put a team on developing power from the generous amount of sh*t produced in Westminster, but fear no known material could cope with such a vast tidal wave of effluent.
For transport, plan an infrastructure for roads, air and rail for fifty years into the future, using mid-case estimates. Then start building it. Pay to get roads infrastructure (e.g. potholes and others) up to German standards. Encourage people to cycle, walk and run in combination with the department of health. Have a guard on certain trains to stop people falling asleep and ending up on the South Coast.
When was the last time Labour made any headline news? They seem to have gone off on holiday at Easter and not returned. Is this some sort of deliberate strategy?
Ed's on the front page in the evening standard quite a lot. Last week in was Empty houses, the week before that rent. Maybe they have a local strategy.
Ah well, I'm not in London so that is passing me all by.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
Mr Eagles me too. Remember how before the last GE the consensus on here was that the government would be miles behind in the polls and a position of minus 10 would be thought good? It never really happened, did it?
I was looking to see what Labour's biggest lead was during this Parliament and as far as I can see it was 16% with TNS/BRMB in September 2012;
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
We're asking the same question. Unless the past allegiances of UKIP voters have changed, which doesn't seem all that likely, there must be some other underlying current flow of voters that hasn't yet been fully identified.
TSE linked to a GE modeller the other day who highlighted the correlation between the fall in Labour's poll numbers, and the increase in UKIP's poll numbers. UKIP are targeting Labour voters, and they're having success.
Is Rod Crosby about. Sorry to be off topic,should wait for nightghawks really. I revisited my birthplace today(Crosby) first time for 40 years,well Blundellsands actually. Wow many changes,and much the same. I really wanted to visit the Carnegie,but it was permanently closed,surely an act of political vandalism by the Labour controlled Sefton council, What would Carnegie have thought if his gift had been thrown away like this,shameful. Corrie park looked sad and neglected,bowling greens a field of weeds,and the putting green just mud,but the Erratic boulder still there,and the boating lake. The Crown buildings all but gone,the BS gone,the George gone(I think). The swimming baths gone but replaced,Seafield renamed,St Marys has got rid of the evil Christian Brothers and got girls,Merchants still looking fine. My former home looked better than I remember,and the Gormley statues down below the erosion looked great.Lunch at the Pheasant,then Formby and Southport. Rod ,I am sure this all sounds familiar,great day out.
Yes, your powers of observation do you credit! The George is still there, under another name. Crown buildings are still there. It was Central buildings that was demolished... 6 years ago... but the eyesore site remains vacant. The Carnegie decision was an outrage. It's only a matter of time before the main library goes the same way.
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
Two years ago, I would have thought people were talking rubbish/taking waccy baccy if they had told me with a year to go, the Lab lead down was down to 1% AND UKIP were on around 15%.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
Mr Eagles me too. Remember how before the last GE the consensus on here was that the government would be miles behind in the polls and a position of minus 10 would be thought good? It never really happened, did it?
I was looking to see what Labour's biggest lead was during this Parliament and as far as I can see it was 16% with TNS/BRMB in September 2012;
So with Labour's apparent glissando in the polls, which voters are changing their allegiance and where are they changing it to? Forgive me if I find it hard to credit that bleeding heart 2010 Lib Dem voters are deciding to put an X in Mr Farage's box.
There was a bloc of median income C2 types who were (past tense) neutral on the cultural axis and voted LD for economic centrist reasons. More floating voter than bleeding heart and more up north than south for 80s reasons.
It appears that the change in the LAB lead is due to a 2010LAB vote leak to UKIP and CON when comparing yougov from 6th May to the one from 10th March, with men going to CON and women to UKIP. Why would someone who voted Labour in 2010 vote for the CONs today?
Sadly no thread as yet on which to post comments from Morris re the Spanish GP. My sole betting intention thus far is to have a pint of Old Speckled Hen on Grosjean achieving a points, i.e. first 10 finish, for which those nice people at SkyBet are offering odds of 2/1.
Comments
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/voting-intention-2
#swingback
Early indicator of how Newark might go?
The tories just like labour continue to fritter away the wealth of our children and grandchildren to purchase electoral advantage where is the actual difference?
Neither is prepared to take the hard decisions and instead prefer to kick the can down the road and hope those as yet ineligble to vote can carry the burden.
Labour and Conservative are merely to cheeks of the same arse leaving the lib dems as the orifice between them. No before anyone says it I do not think UKIP are necessarily going to be any better but as a wise man once said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing again and again while hoping the outcome will be different. That to me about sums up voting for one of the traditional three
@AlanBrooke
Sound stuff, especially on the EU referendum.
Count me in as CCC member number 2. I wonder if, in years to come having, a low party number will confer the same sort of secular sainthood that it did in the Communist Party? I hope not but it might give our grandchildren something to talk about over dinner.
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/ukpr-projection-2
And finally... This is my readers letter of the day, in the Telegraph... pic.twitter.com/TbSGdupoE1
DailySunday Politics @daily_politics 4h
Friday's guests of the day are @JamesDelingpole and @OwenJones84 joining @afneil from 1200 #bbcdp
PM: TSE (first among equals)
Home Office: Life in a market town (obvious, give him Justice as well)
Foreign Office: SeanT (a little weakness for China but his heart is in the right place)
Defence: Andy Cooke (knows what he is talking about and very sound on the RN)
Chancellor: Charles (at least he knows how to ready a balance sheet and money is in his DNA)
Energy: Jossias Jessup (getting an engineer in there must be a good thing
Transport: Dr. Sunil (who else could it be, trains trains and more trains)
Education: Southam Observer (talks a good game on the subject can he deliver it?)
Trade and Industry: AlanBrooke (of course)
DCMS: Me (because I'd want to abolish it)
DfID: Me (because after I'd abolished DCMS I could abolish this department next)
Meanwhile the PM is very confident: http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/may/08/david-cameron-hosts-dup-mps-in-lavish-downing-street-reception
Also, I object to a trains enthusiast running Transport - granted, trains are great in that you can sleep in them, but what the car lovers of our society? Are they to be neglected?
I revisited my birthplace today(Crosby) first time for 40 years,well Blundellsands actually.
Wow many changes,and much the same.
I really wanted to visit the Carnegie,but it was permanently closed,surely an act of political vandalism by the Labour controlled Sefton council, What would Carnegie have thought if his gift had been thrown away like this,shameful.
Corrie park looked sad and neglected,bowling greens a field of weeds,and the putting green just mud,but the Erratic boulder still there,and the boating lake. The Crown buildings all but gone,the BS gone,the George gone(I think). The swimming baths gone but replaced,Seafield renamed,St Marys has got rid of the evil Christian Brothers and got girls,Merchants still looking fine.
My former home looked better than I remember,and the Gormley statues down below the erosion looked great.Lunch at the Pheasant,then Formby and Southport.
Rod ,I am sure this all sounds familiar,great day out.
YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to just one point: CON 34%, LAB 35%, LD 8%, UKIP 13%
Lead at 1% for SECOND TIME IN THREE DAYS!!!
YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Labour lead falls to just one point: CON 34%, LAB 35%, LD 8%, UKIP 13%
At this rate, when crossover does happen it'll be pasted 50 times in a minute
Mike Smithson @MSmithsonPB
Labour's current poll position is the worst for the party since early 2012 - before Osborne’s 2012 Budget
Is he chairing? Thought Lucas on as well?
"I do acknowledge that for historical, geopolitical and economic reasons the case of the UK may be seen as a special one. Precisely because of this, it would be a mistake to transform an exception for the UK into a rule for everybody else"
Sounds like what amounts to treason for an EU bureaucrat given their usual positions on such arguments. I've only been online a short while, anyone know what's brought this on from him?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-eu-27325980
http://www.scotsman.com/news/uk/scotland-and-wales-bond-after-independence-1-3402928
NB. 5 poll rolling average - Lab 35.4, Con 33.6
But in terms of Lab absolute vote share, Lab position is now the worst it has been since Summer 2010.
See Anthony's graph - Lab score tonight (ie if graph were updated again tonight) is 35.4%.
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/voting-intention-2
Consider "According to the Council’s guideline on seriousness, culpability is determined by the
extent to which the offender intends to cause harm – the worse the harm intended, the
greater the offender’s culpability."
On one level, the victim's actions may endear in the perpretator certain facts leading him to believe that no harm was being done. On the other hand, not only is this not the victim's culpability but the perpetrator's culpability in light of the victim's actions, but at the end of the day the victim's actions are never constitutive of the perpetrator's intention to cause harm but are merely the background in which it sits.
Having a trains' man in charge at transport may not be as bad as you fear for car lovers, especially if the right chap is chosen. The alternative might be to put Jessup in at Transport and Socrates in at Energy, not sure you'd like that any better.
Anyway, if you don't like my picks why not come up with your own. This is a game of PB Fanatsy Cabinets after all.
1, 3, 1, 3, 1, 3, 3, 1, 3, 2.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_next_United_Kingdom_general_election
Average = 2.1%
Even I was not serious about a Department for the Eradication of Government Departments. It would need a much better name.
PMQs would be fun.
Mr Speaker, The Leader of the Opposition, like his party, reminds me of my boxer shorts, full of bollocks.
That sort of thing.
And Minister for Fun.
Free love and anything goes in a Fett-led department.
Kingston Council
CON Control 1/2
NOC 5/2
LD Control 5/1
LAB Control 100/1
I'd be a dismissive of any French President which would lead to problems.
Things have changed pretty rapidly in the last month - this could be a key moment.
Labour:
-Helped bugger up the nations finances
-Have a weak leader who sounds like an out of touch posh boy just as much as his Conservative counterpart
-Don't seem to have a clear economic policy other than borrow and spend
Given that the economy is turning and the sheer amount of cack that the country has been through now appears to be on their way out, why should Labour have a lead?
The only bigger variable you have the possibility of the Conservatives leaking more votes on the right to UKIP.
Those on the right need to get a bit more ambitious, being behind, being level isn't good enough nor is it to be celebrated. Its not as if Labour is sh*t hot.
Crikey, we might just as well name it the Ministry for War and have done with it.
I didn't think both were possible concurrently.
Con 1/2 (SJ, PP)
LD 5/2 (Lad, PP)
UKIP 10/1 (Lad)
Lab 20/1 (Lad)
How to lose vote share without losing a single voter
http://hopisen.com/2014/how-to-lose-vote-share-without-losing-a-single-voter/
Assume we have a Populus in the morning. I wonder if it will tighten too.
The (normal) electoral cycle is such that from here the Oppositions position can only get worse (outside the normal ebb and flow of day to day polls)
Between now and polling day Labours position can only get worse, IMO, which means by May 7th 2010 the Conservatives should have a fairly modest lead in most polls (perhaps 5%?)
Not enough to secure an outright majority, probably, but enough to win again in terms of votes and seats and to continue to Coalition for five more years.
I'll predict ICM, as the last pollster to give the Conservatives a lead in March 2012, will be the first pollster to show them back in the lead this summer or autumn.
"Can we control immigration without leaving the EU?"
UKIP plant?!
Chuka says immigration is great, but we must control borders and stop immigrants undercutting wages
er how?
FFS! A year out, the main opposition just 1 or 2 points ahead and an insurgent party above 10%. Possibly something has changed.
And with that, and visions of Felicity Kendal running around in my head (thanks Mr. Brooke) I too am off to beddy-byes. G'night all, and thanks for the chat this evening.
http://www.scotsman.com/news/education/johann-lamont-s-name-spelled-wrong-in-exam-1-3392857
I'd also like to see power generated from all the wind and hot air produced at Westminster. I'd also put a team on developing power from the generous amount of sh*t produced in Westminster, but fear no known material could cope with such a vast tidal wave of effluent.
For transport, plan an infrastructure for roads, air and rail for fifty years into the future, using mid-case estimates. Then start building it. Pay to get roads infrastructure (e.g. potholes and others) up to German standards. Encourage people to cycle, walk and run in combination with the department of health. Have a guard on certain trains to stop people falling asleep and ending up on the South Coast.
Ah well, I'm not in London so that is passing me all by.
I was looking to see what Labour's biggest lead was during this Parliament and as far as I can see it was 16% with TNS/BRMB in September 2012;
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/voting-intention-2
Even then they never broke out of their 45% straight jacket.
Some of said at the time that Labour/Ed simply wasn't doing well enough.
bring it on!
Ed is no Dave.
http://www.businessinsider.com/chinese-police-will-soon-patrol-the-streets-of-paris-2014-5?IR=T
Sadly no thread as yet on which to post comments from Morris re the Spanish GP. My sole betting intention thus far is to have a pint of Old Speckled Hen on Grosjean achieving a points, i.e. first 10 finish, for which those nice people at SkyBet are offering odds of 2/1.
http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/05/08/despite-concerns-about-governance-ukrainians-want-to-remain-one-country/
54% of Crimeans want regions to be able to secede.
Two peas of the same pod.