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I hope Nigel Farage is putting his money where his mouth is – politicalbetting.com

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  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 7,661
    boulay said:

    carnforth said:

    Foss said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Taz said:

    Stereodog said:

    Marjorie Taylor Greene praises Pelosi and wishes her well in retirement and wishes her own side could do as well to get things done as Nancy did.

    I'm sorry? Has the original MTG been abducted by aliens and replaced by an alternative human version????


    Marjorie Taylor Greene: "I will praise Nancy Pelosi. She had an incredible career for her party. I served under her speakership in my first term in Congress and I'm very impressed at her ability to get things done. I wish we could get things done for our party like Nancy Pelosi was able to deliver for her party."
    https://x.com/atrupar/status/1986464366145794529

    Bizarre.
    Next: MTG welcomes the election of Zohran Mamdani as "a breath of fresh air".
    I think MTG is in some ways and admirable person who has the courage of her convictions. She's even willing to defy Trump occasionally. It's just that her convictions are mostly bat shit crazy.
    She told wizened old Emily Maitlis to ‘fuck off’ so she’s not all bad.
    She said David Cameron could kiss her ass when he went to Washington to try and get more support for Ukraine.

    She can fuck right off too.
    Yeah, but she is alerting the world to the dangers of the Jewish space lasers.
    I thought Mel Brooks did that? Until ‘they’ got to him…

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0Wai7VFzycI
    Mel Brooks will be 100 in nine months. Apparently, he is still entirely with it.
    Mel Brooks, Clint Eastwood and Michael Caine are really the only great celebs I can think of who i will be generally saddened by their passing when it happens. Roger Moore was another who has sadly gone but those three are truly legends.

    Edit to add, Robert Smith from the Cure too but hopefully he has a long way to go, especially as I intend to see their tour next year.
    I almost can't imagine Steve Martin dying. Perhaps because he has looked old for 40 years...
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 82,965
    Scott_xP said:

    @jamieson.bsky.social‬

    🚨🚨🚨 The jury has reached a verdict. Sean Dunn, aka the DC Sandwich Guy, has been found NOT GUILTY of assault.

    No longer Subway judice ?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 82,965

    Taz said:

    Stereodog said:

    Marjorie Taylor Greene praises Pelosi and wishes her well in retirement and wishes her own side could do as well to get things done as Nancy did.

    I'm sorry? Has the original MTG been abducted by aliens and replaced by an alternative human version????


    Marjorie Taylor Greene: "I will praise Nancy Pelosi. She had an incredible career for her party. I served under her speakership in my first term in Congress and I'm very impressed at her ability to get things done. I wish we could get things done for our party like Nancy Pelosi was able to deliver for her party."
    https://x.com/atrupar/status/1986464366145794529

    Bizarre.
    Next: MTG welcomes the election of Zohran Mamdani as "a breath of fresh air".
    I think MTG is in some ways and admirable person who has the courage of her convictions. She's even willing to defy Trump occasionally. It's just that her convictions are mostly bat shit crazy.
    She told wizened old Emily Maitlis to ‘fuck off’ so she’s not all bad.
    I thought it was SKY's Martha Kelner?

    https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/marjorie-taylor-greene-sky-news-martha-kelner-signalgate-b2722183.html

    "We don’t give a crap about your opinion and your reporting. Why don’t you go back to your country where you have a major migrant problem?”
    Probably why Taz thought Emily was wizened ?
  • FossFoss Posts: 2,001
    edited November 6
    isam said:

    Can't help feel that this government has now reached the stage of being beleaguered. Feels like one bad news story after another. Rayner, Mandelson, now this story about escapes.

    Lab are also a bit unlucky as the media didn't care about mistaken releases until it happened to the Epping guy. But that happens when a government is on the ropes.

    It's funny, I watched PMQ's unpacked on Times Radio today, and they said something along the lines of "Everyone knows that lots of prisoners get released by mistake..."

    I consider myself a relatively normal member of the public, and I didn't think that at all. I was surprised any were ever released by mistake
    It also suggests that there might be people who should have been released but haven’t been.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,961
    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
  • PhilPhil Posts: 3,046
    isam said:

    Can't help feel that this government has now reached the stage of being beleaguered. Feels like one bad news story after another. Rayner, Mandelson, now this story about escapes.

    Lab are also a bit unlucky as the media didn't care about mistaken releases until it happened to the Epping guy. But that happens when a government is on the ropes.

    It's funny, I watched PMQ's unpacked on Times Radio today, and they said something along the lines of "Everyone knows that lots of prisoners get released by mistake..."

    I consider myself a relatively normal member of the public, and I didn't think that at all. I was surprised any were ever released by mistake
    We all know mistakes happen occasionally. I don’t think people were generally aware that the prison service had gone from accidentally releasing one a week to releasing 4-5 a week though.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 12,481
    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 39,890
    edited November 6
    Marjorie Taylor Greene seems to have mellowed considerably, over the last year. Compared to people like Peter Hegseth and Laura Loomer, she’s almost a RINO.

    Her formative years were spent in Forsyth County, which was “invaded” by the blacks, in 1987.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1987_Forsyth_County_protests
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    Taz said:

    Stereodog said:

    Marjorie Taylor Greene praises Pelosi and wishes her well in retirement and wishes her own side could do as well to get things done as Nancy did.

    I'm sorry? Has the original MTG been abducted by aliens and replaced by an alternative human version????


    Marjorie Taylor Greene: "I will praise Nancy Pelosi. She had an incredible career for her party. I served under her speakership in my first term in Congress and I'm very impressed at her ability to get things done. I wish we could get things done for our party like Nancy Pelosi was able to deliver for her party."
    https://x.com/atrupar/status/1986464366145794529

    Bizarre.
    Next: MTG welcomes the election of Zohran Mamdani as "a breath of fresh air".
    I think MTG is in some ways and admirable person who has the courage of her convictions. She's even willing to defy Trump occasionally. It's just that her convictions are mostly bat shit crazy.
    She told wizened old Emily Maitlis to ‘fuck off’ so she’s not all bad.
    I thought it was SKY's Martha Kelner?

    https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/marjorie-taylor-greene-sky-news-martha-kelner-signalgate-b2722183.html

    "We don’t give a crap about your opinion and your reporting. Why don’t you go back to your country where you have a major migrant problem?”
    🥱🥱🥱🥱

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/mar/06/marjorie-taylor-greene-emily-maitlis-interview
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 25,713
    isam said:

    Can't help feel that this government has now reached the stage of being beleaguered. Feels like one bad news story after another. Rayner, Mandelson, now this story about escapes.

    Lab are also a bit unlucky as the media didn't care about mistaken releases until it happened to the Epping guy. But that happens when a government is on the ropes.

    It's funny, I watched PMQ's unpacked on Times Radio today, and they said something along the lines of "Everyone knows that lots of prisoners get released by mistake..."

    I consider myself a relatively normal member of the public, and I didn't think that at all. I was surprised any were ever released by mistake
    Not something I'd have particularly thought about or known the answer to either but given that I did know prisons are overcrowded, underfunded, understaffed with the staff who are there often inexperienced and/or demotivated I'd be far more surprised if things were running smoothly.
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006
    Nigelb said:

    Taz said:

    Stereodog said:

    Marjorie Taylor Greene praises Pelosi and wishes her well in retirement and wishes her own side could do as well to get things done as Nancy did.

    I'm sorry? Has the original MTG been abducted by aliens and replaced by an alternative human version????


    Marjorie Taylor Greene: "I will praise Nancy Pelosi. She had an incredible career for her party. I served under her speakership in my first term in Congress and I'm very impressed at her ability to get things done. I wish we could get things done for our party like Nancy Pelosi was able to deliver for her party."
    https://x.com/atrupar/status/1986464366145794529

    Bizarre.
    Next: MTG welcomes the election of Zohran Mamdani as "a breath of fresh air".
    I think MTG is in some ways and admirable person who has the courage of her convictions. She's even willing to defy Trump occasionally. It's just that her convictions are mostly bat shit crazy.
    She told wizened old Emily Maitlis to ‘fuck off’ so she’s not all bad.
    I thought it was SKY's Martha Kelner?

    https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/marjorie-taylor-greene-sky-news-martha-kelner-signalgate-b2722183.html

    "We don’t give a crap about your opinion and your reporting. Why don’t you go back to your country where you have a major migrant problem?”
    Probably why Taz thought Emily was wizened ?
    Is, not was. She has not rejuvenated.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/mar/06/marjorie-taylor-greene-emily-maitlis-interview
  • CookieCookie Posts: 16,350
    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    ISTR one of the Gaza independents was the decision maker (at AVFC? At West Mids police? Can't remember.) Which doesn't strike me as a disinterested ad impartial observer.
    I'm sceptical it was a decision taken with no regard to the religion of the MTA fans.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 40,840
    @joshgerstein.bsky.social‬
    · now
    BREAKING: Judge orders Trump admin to provide full SNAP payments to states for November. Judge John McConnell (Obama) says Trump admin defied his earlier order allowing partial payment only if recipients could get that money on time
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,747
    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,961
    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 7,767

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    Trying to work out which phrase makes me want to vom more when politicians say it, “fairness” or “our NHS”.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 25,713

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,747
    edited November 6
    boulay said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    Trying to work out which phrase makes me want to vom more when politicians say it, “fairness” or “our NHS”.
    I'm sure Rachel will see it as part of The Cure for the nation's finances...
  • carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 7,767

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
    Even as a righty I would respect Labour more if they really went for it. Don’t Fanny around worrying about the politics, see if the UK can be a high tax lefty country, What’s the point of them otherwise. If it works then people like me might accept it and benefit and if it doesn’t then, well we go back to a different route. But tiny tweaks are pointless.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 8,354

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
    I am immensely skeptical that they can successfully land this, after not only promising it at the GE but spending the last 18 months repeating the promise time and time again.

    It will require politicians of exceptional political skill. And this is Keir Starmer and Rachel Reeves we’re talking about.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 6,600
    Scott_xP said:

    @joshgerstein.bsky.social‬
    · now
    BREAKING: Judge orders Trump admin to provide full SNAP payments to states for November. Judge John McConnell (Obama) says Trump admin defied his earlier order allowing partial payment only if recipients could get that money on time

    A lot of those SNAP recipients are from Red States and I expect they’re so brainwashed that they’ll still be cheering on the stain on humanity as he was hoping to starve them in an attempt to blame the Dems .
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
    Lucy Powell is going into but for you guys

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986481340112408586?s=61
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 12,481
    edited November 6
    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 6,600
    Taz said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
    Lucy Powell is going into but for you guys

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986481340112408586?s=61
    Powell has decided that by going down this route it will help her leadership ambitions. She can turn around and play the manifesto pledge martyr !
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006
    nico67 said:

    Taz said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
    Lucy Powell is going into but for you guys

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986481340112408586?s=61
    Powell has decided that by going down this route it will help her leadership ambitions. She can turn around and play the manifesto pledge martyr !
    Indeed. She’s just not a serious politician given this, how else are they supposed to get the level of money they need.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 82,965
    Eight months ??

    Eight months ago, Rep. Sylvester Turner D-TX died. His seat in the U.S. House is still vacant. On Tuesday, two Dems advanced to a runoff for that seat. When is the runoff?? We don't know.

    That runoff date still must be set by Gov. Greg Abbott.

    https://x.com/jamiedupree/status/1986505834134691937
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,046
    Scott_xP said:

    @jamieson.bsky.social‬

    🚨🚨🚨 The jury has reached a verdict. Sean Dunn, aka the DC Sandwich Guy, has been found NOT GUILTY of assault.

    That can’t be right. I thought the USA was now a Nazi state with the 21st century version of Roland Friesler in the chair? Perhaps rumours of the end of USA democracy have been a tad overstated? @RochdalePioneers
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 25,713
    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
    I can't remember any other foreign team being individually banned by the UK authorities. There are definitely teams with similar hooligans out there who have been allowed to bring fans.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,747
    Income tax increase as described by me below £12bn

    Freeze thresholds to 2030 £10bn

    Rest raised by pence per mile charge on electric vehicles!
  • boulayboulay Posts: 7,767

    isam said:

    Sir Keir having to tell off another underling for not following the rules. He used to say if his staff messed up, the buck stopped with him, and that “the fish rots from the head”

    🚨 NEW: Culture Secretary Lisa Nandy broke the Governance Code by not declaring that her pick for Independent Football Regulator Chair had donated to her leadership campaign

    Starmer: "The process followed was not entirely up to the standard expected"


    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986487637515833831?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    "The process followed was not entirely up to the standard expected" is interesting lawyerspeak for "as bent as a nine bob note".
    Those eleven words deserve to become this government's epitaph.

    You can also make endless variations on it.

    "The government's performance was not entirely up to the standard expected."
    "The economy's performance was not entirely up to the standard expected."
    "The tax receipts received were not entirely up to the level expected."
    "The votes cast for Labour were not entirely up to the numbers expected."
    Here's the issue:

    image
    Wait until she learns about the Black Death.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 15,752
    Phil said:

    isam said:

    Can't help feel that this government has now reached the stage of being beleaguered. Feels like one bad news story after another. Rayner, Mandelson, now this story about escapes.

    Lab are also a bit unlucky as the media didn't care about mistaken releases until it happened to the Epping guy. But that happens when a government is on the ropes.

    It's funny, I watched PMQ's unpacked on Times Radio today, and they said something along the lines of "Everyone knows that lots of prisoners get released by mistake..."

    I consider myself a relatively normal member of the public, and I didn't think that at all. I was surprised any were ever released by mistake
    We all know mistakes happen occasionally. I don’t think people were generally aware that the prison service had gone from accidentally releasing one a week to releasing 4-5 a week though.
    I wonder if it just it picked on randomly to mark a chronological point in this government. For a time every government, and this one more than most, can blame everything on its predecessors. For some things this is long term - stuff like massive infrastructure, 5 million migrants the public decide they can do without and so on. But lots of things belong, in our minds, to ordinary boring basic competence, which a government should do about everything at all times. Among these are not releasing prisoners who should not be. Other things are answering the phone and stuff like that.

    I think we have decided that 16 months is long enough for the boring competence bits to be entirely Labour's fault.

  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,795
    boulay said:

    isam said:

    Sir Keir having to tell off another underling for not following the rules. He used to say if his staff messed up, the buck stopped with him, and that “the fish rots from the head”

    🚨 NEW: Culture Secretary Lisa Nandy broke the Governance Code by not declaring that her pick for Independent Football Regulator Chair had donated to her leadership campaign

    Starmer: "The process followed was not entirely up to the standard expected"


    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986487637515833831?s=46&t=CW4pL-mMpTqsJXCdjW0Z6Q

    "The process followed was not entirely up to the standard expected" is interesting lawyerspeak for "as bent as a nine bob note".
    Those eleven words deserve to become this government's epitaph.

    You can also make endless variations on it.

    "The government's performance was not entirely up to the standard expected."
    "The economy's performance was not entirely up to the standard expected."
    "The tax receipts received were not entirely up to the level expected."
    "The votes cast for Labour were not entirely up to the numbers expected."
    Here's the issue:

    image
    Wait until she learns about the Black Death.
    That's covered by next year's budget.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 56,500
    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    "Islamists "rise up" in Birmingham to hunt down Jews" - streamed 3 hours ago.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Pk-V-dde5g
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 8,354
    edited November 6

    boulay said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
    Even as a righty I would respect Labour more if they really went for it. Don’t Fanny around worrying about the politics, see if the UK can be a high tax lefty country, What’s the point of them otherwise. If it works then people like me might accept it and benefit and if it doesn’t then, well we go back to a different route. But tiny tweaks are pointless.
    I remember my driving test. I was nervous and drove too timidly making a few mistakes. Five minutes in, I assumed I'd failed, decided f*** it, and drove fine and with confidence for the rest of the test and fortunately passed.

    Starmer and Labour should really be at the stage where they say f*** it and start doing things, because their timidity is not popular with anyone at all. They have nothing to lose by being bolder from here.
    I’m still incredibly bemused why they didn’t do it last year. It’d have done them damage, of course, but they at least had the hand to play of “we’ve seen the accounts and unfortunately we’re going to have to do the right thing even though we didn’t want to raise IT”. No government ever has a hand as strong again as in their first budget in power. They now start from a position of weakness having backed themselves even further into a corner. It really is quite ludicrous.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 23,773
    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 20,495
    Taz said:

    nico67 said:

    Taz said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
    Lucy Powell is going into but for you guys

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986481340112408586?s=61
    Powell has decided that by going down this route it will help her leadership ambitions. She can turn around and play the manifesto pledge martyr !
    Indeed. She’s just not a serious politician given this, how else are they supposed to get the level of money they need.
    Magic money tree, same as every other politician who grubs after popularity. Different species, but the same basic principle.

    Something for nothing beats nothing for something in the polls. Always has, always will, unfortunately.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,046

    boulay said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
    Even as a righty I would respect Labour more if they really went for it. Don’t Fanny around worrying about the politics, see if the UK can be a high tax lefty country, What’s the point of them otherwise. If it works then people like me might accept it and benefit and if it doesn’t then, well we go back to a different route. But tiny tweaks are pointless.
    I remember my driving test. I was nervous and drove too timidly making a few mistakes. Five minutes in, I assumed I'd failed, decided f*** it, and drove fine and with confidence for the rest of the test and fortunately passed.

    Starmer and Labour should really be at the stage where they say f*** it and start doing things, because their timidity is not popular with anyone at all. They have nothing to lose by being bolder from here.
    That’s exactly like my driving test. Stalled the car pulling away, assumed I’d failed. Didn’t realise that wasn’t a fail… Chilled out drive after that and all good. Even had a debate about why I didn’t stop for the woman at the zebra crossing. I argued she wasn’t at the crossing she was approaching it, so I couldn’t be sure she was going to,cross.
    I passed, so must have been ok…
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    Yes, that’s exactly,what happened.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 7,767

    boulay said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
    Even as a righty I would respect Labour more if they really went for it. Don’t Fanny around worrying about the politics, see if the UK can be a high tax lefty country, What’s the point of them otherwise. If it works then people like me might accept it and benefit and if it doesn’t then, well we go back to a different route. But tiny tweaks are pointless.
    I remember my driving test. I was nervous and drove too timidly making a few mistakes. Five minutes in, I assumed I'd failed, decided f*** it, and drove fine and with confidence for the rest of the test and fortunately passed.

    Starmer and Labour should really be at the stage where they say f*** it and start doing things, because their timidity is not popular with anyone at all. They have nothing to lose by being bolder from here.
    I’m still incredibly bemused why they didn’t do it last year. It’d have done them damage, of course, but they at least had the hand to play of “we’ve seen the accounts and unfortunately we’re going to have to do the right thing even though we didn’t want to raise IT”. No government ever has a hand as strong again as in their first budget in power. They now start from a position of weakness having backed themselves even further into a corner. It really is quite ludicrous.
    It happens all the time, think of Blair’s majorities. They get in and are too concerned with winning the next election and staying in power that they end up not exercising the power they actually had. What’s the point of being in government if you don’t enact what you believe. Being in power has become the end rather than the means to an end.

    Like I said, theoretically I am so anti Labour but just maybe they could prove me wrong and enact social democratic policies that do make the country great and happy. If they do then I will tip my hat and accept I was wrong and yet they never do anything different.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,046

    boulay said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    If you are going to break the promise, isn't it better to raise a bit more so you can do something with it rather than paper over the cracks? Or raise more in total but start uplifting personal allowances so you at least get a few winners.
    Even as a righty I would respect Labour more if they really went for it. Don’t Fanny around worrying about the politics, see if the UK can be a high tax lefty country, What’s the point of them otherwise. If it works then people like me might accept it and benefit and if it doesn’t then, well we go back to a different route. But tiny tweaks are pointless.
    I remember my driving test. I was nervous and drove too timidly making a few mistakes. Five minutes in, I assumed I'd failed, decided f*** it, and drove fine and with confidence for the rest of the test and fortunately passed.

    Starmer and Labour should really be at the stage where they say f*** it and start doing things, because their timidity is not popular with anyone at all. They have nothing to lose by being bolder from here.
    I’m still incredibly bemused why they didn’t do it last year. It’d have done them damage, of course, but they at least had the hand to play of “we’ve seen the accounts and unfortunately we’re going to have to do the right thing even though we didn’t want to raise IT”. No government ever has a hand as strong again as in their first budget in power. They now start from a position of weakness having backed themselves even further into a corner. It really is quite ludicrous.
    Yes you would have thought that was the time for the ‘we need to do this because it’s worse than anyone could have foreseen’ budget. But that would have been the adults in the room. Thought Labour were supposed to be that.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 35,795

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    I'm not sure the Maccabi Tel Aviv fans are entirely innocent victims:

    "The evening before the match, Maccabi Tel Aviv fans were filmed pulling Palestinian flags from houses, making racist anti-Arab chants such as "death to Arabs", assaulting people, and vandalising local property"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_riots
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,410
    As mentioned earlier, Gala fans were causing trouble in Amsterdam this week. But they won’t be banned from Man City away.
  • scampi25scampi25 Posts: 322
    Re the tax rises. I reject the whole idea, unless they're accompanied by serious welfare cuts and significant reforms to health and social care. Otherwise they'll be back for more and more tax before the year is out.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 56,500

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    I'm not sure the Maccabi Tel Aviv fans are entirely innocent victims:

    "The evening before the match, Maccabi Tel Aviv fans were filmed pulling Palestinian flags from houses, making racist anti-Arab chants such as "death to Arabs", assaulting people, and vandalising local property"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/November_2024_Amsterdam_riots
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Pk-V-dde5g
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 46,313
    edited November 6

    Scott_xP said:

    @jamieson.bsky.social‬

    🚨🚨🚨 The jury has reached a verdict. Sean Dunn, aka the DC Sandwich Guy, has been found NOT GUILTY of assault.

    That can’t be right. I thought the USA was now a Nazi state with the 21st century version of Roland Friesler in the chair? Perhaps rumours of the end of USA democracy have been a tad overstated? @RochdalePioneers
    ...
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 8,354
    edited November 6
    scampi25 said:

    Re the tax rises. I reject the whole idea, unless they're accompanied by serious welfare cuts and significant reforms to health and social care. Otherwise they'll be back for more and more tax before the year is out.

    Pretty much where I am. I don’t reject the idea of paying more tax per se. I think we do need to, in the short to medium term. And I’d rather they raised income tax than did their stupid weird tinkering around the edges to raise bits here and there which were just having distorting effects and concentrating anger. But I agree that has to be coupled with efficiency and welfare savings and meaningful reform, otherwise we are going to find ourself stuck in a loop. Nothing I have seen so far suggests the government has the guts for that fight. But maybe Starmer and Reeves will feel more emboldened to try some more radical moves in the coming months, having freed themselves from their silly pledges. Won’t hold my breath, but that’s the best case scenario.

  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,391
    edited November 6
    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
    Now the precedent has been established, I take it that Millwall fans will be prevented from travelling to see their team play Birmingham City later this season?

    Otherwise some might think that there’s a racial aspect to their decision.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 56,345
    Taz said:

    nico67 said:

    Taz said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
    Lucy Powell is going into but for you guys

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986481340112408586?s=61
    Powell has decided that by going down this route it will help her leadership ambitions. She can turn around and play the manifesto pledge martyr !
    Indeed. She’s just not a serious politician given this, how else are they supposed to get the level of money they need.
    Obviously by getting Ed Miliband in so that we can unleash the green revolution and stop Zack Polanski in his tracks.
  • bobbobbobbob Posts: 149

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    I think the problem is that you can only see Jewish people as Jews regardless of any other attributes,

    You are unable to see Israeli football hooligans as anything but Jews therefore preventing them attacking Britain is antisemitic

    Thankfully most people in this country aren’t racist so do can understand the difference.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,046

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
    Now the precedent has been established, I take it that Millwall fans will be prevented from travelling to see their team play Birmingham City later this season?

    Otherwise some might think that there’s a racial aspect to their decision.
    Arguably the police would probably like to ban a lot if not all away fans.

    Sad thing is Imcan go to the Rec to watch top flight rugby, sit next to fans from both clubs, have a beer and a chat and there’s never any trouble. Why can’t football fans do that?

    (And to be clear on a few things (1) I’ve been to hundreds of football matches at all levels (2) most football fans could do as rugby fans do - it is a minority of wankers that ruin it for everyone).
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 21,046
    bobbob said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    I think the problem is that you can only see Jewish people as Jews regardless of any other attributes,

    You are unable to see Israeli football hooligans as anything but Jews therefore preventing them attacking Britain is antisemitic

    Thankfully most people in this country aren’t racist so do can understand the difference.
    Why are they the only fans so beyond the pale that our gallant boys in blue cannot handle hav8ng them at the game? They manage Luton vs Watford, Liverpool vs Man Utd, all Millwall and Leeds fixtures ok.
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
    Now the precedent has been established, I take it that Millwall fans will be prevented from travelling to see their team play Birmingham City later this season?

    Otherwise some might think that there’s a racial aspect to their decision.
    Errr, we spanked them last night 4-0 and, of,course, plod was happy for their fans to infest our city.
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    bobbob said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    I think the problem is that you can only see Jewish people as Jews regardless of any other attributes,

    You are unable to see Israeli football hooligans as anything but Jews therefore preventing them attacking Britain is antisemitic

    Thankfully most people in this country aren’t racist so do can understand the difference.
    Why are they the only fans so beyond the pale that our gallant boys in blue cannot handle hav8ng them at the game? They manage Luton vs Watford, Liverpool vs Man Utd, all Millwall and Leeds fixtures ok.
    Millwall were in Birmingham last night and the boys in blue had no issue with that.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 56,500
    edited November 6
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DeO-0S7hdM

    "Pro-Israel protesters "put in Jew Cage" at Villa Park"
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,391
    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
    Now the precedent has been established, I take it that Millwall fans will be prevented from travelling to see their team play Birmingham City later this season?

    Otherwise some might think that there’s a racial aspect to their decision.
    Errr, we spanked them last night 4-0 and, of,course, plod was happy for their fans to infest our city.
    Ah, yes. I saw the result, but somehow thought it’d been in London. The fact that it was in Birmingham makes the differential treatment of troublesome supporters on consecutive evenings all the more stark.
  • ThomasNasheThomasNashe Posts: 5,391
    I think the broader point about all this is the growing antisemitism that we are seeing in this country over recent years. That Jewish communities thrived in Britain during the twentieth century while they were subject to pogroms and worse elsewhere is something we should justly be proud of. And now, that tradition is now in serious jeopardy and far too many of our citizens are blind to it (wilfully in some cases).
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    Taz said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    Yes, it does look like that from the police statement... but I don't really believe them. I think they just didn't want to upset the natives.

    Do you think any parties MPs other than the Islamic Independents would have started petitions trying to get Maccabi's fans banned from their city?
    Tel Aviv police have also previously banned these fans. I suspect they just followed their lead.
    Now the precedent has been established, I take it that Millwall fans will be prevented from travelling to see their team play Birmingham City later this season?

    Otherwise some might think that there’s a racial aspect to their decision.
    Errr, we spanked them last night 4-0 and, of,course, plod was happy for their fans to infest our city.
    Ah, yes. I saw the result, but somehow thought it’d been in London. The fact that it was in Birmingham makes the differential treatment of troublesome supporters on consecutive evenings all the more stark.
    Cracking result, especially after spanking Pompey by the same score on Saturday.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,410
    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006
    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 25,713

    I think the broader point about all this is the growing antisemitism that we are seeing in this country over recent years. That Jewish communities thrived in Britain during the twentieth century while they were subject to pogroms and worse elsewhere is something we should justly be proud of. And now, that tradition is now in serious jeopardy and far too many of our citizens are blind to it (wilfully in some cases).

    We are a less tolerant country than we were 20 years ago in a lot of ways, not just this one. I think it is mostly down to social media.

    Also lets remember, we are still better than the vast majority of countries at this.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 80,309
    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Never seen such a poor player as David in the history of the game
  • isamisam Posts: 42,961

    I think the broader point about all this is the growing antisemitism that we are seeing in this country over recent years. That Jewish communities thrived in Britain during the twentieth century while they were subject to pogroms and worse elsewhere is something we should justly be proud of. And now, that tradition is now in serious jeopardy and far too many of our citizens are blind to it (wilfully in some cases).

    We are a less tolerant country than we were 20 years ago in a lot of ways, not just this one. I think it is mostly down to social media.

    Also lets remember, we are still better than the vast majority of countries at this.
    Disintegration

    For most of our existence, humans lived in societies with the attributes of old Hadleigh. Most people lived in one place all (or almost all) the time. Societies were very rooted, bound by ties of kin, friendship and proximity. Everyone had to deal with everyone else, and deal with them as whole human beings, with all their faults and virtues. This meant we had to have a broad-mindedness about difference, even within a much more confined society. You couldn’t just cancel someone for bad behaviour or for their shocking views. The next day you would see them again and you’d just have to deal with them for who they were

    https://alastair-meeks.medium.com/disintegration-00815e8a5fe5
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 40,840
    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Nobody was more reliably wrong than David
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 20,495
    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Like the rest of us then.

    Humans can pretty easily be persuaded to overlook blooming obvious evidence. And the cleverer those humans are, the easier it is, in some ways.

    Which has wider implications for the stuff we talk about here.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,410
    Pulpstar said:

    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Never seen such a poor player as David in the history of the game
    I honestly thought he had played a blinder. He needed to get rid of Joe. But then he ended the game.
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006
    edited November 6

    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Like the rest of us then.

    Humans can pretty easily be persuaded to overlook blooming obvious evidence. And the cleverer those humans are, the easier it is, in some ways.

    Which has wider implications for the stuff we talk about here.
    I’m sure it has for those who want to over analyse these things.

    What evidence as there ? Nothing firm.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 62,239
    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    It was handled very poorly by the British government: there was no reason at all why Macabbi fans could not have been bussed in.
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006
    Celebrity Traitors emergency YouTube time

    https://x.com/marinahyde/status/1986556255876395088?s=61
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006
    rcs1000 said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    It was handled very poorly by the British government: there was no reason at all why Macabbi fans could not have been bussed in.
    Birmingham had Millwall fans, really the lowest of the low when it comes to soccer hooliganism in the UK, in town last night, plod managed just fine. Brum, themselves, have an unpleasant element too,
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 20,495
    edited November 6
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Like the rest of us then.

    Humans can pretty easily be persuaded to overlook blooming obvious evidence. And the cleverer those humans are, the easier it is, in some ways.

    Which has wider implications for the stuff we talk about here.
    I’m sure it has for those who want to over analyse these things.

    What evidence as there ? Nothing firm.
    It's an illustration of a wider thing about being human.

    All those intelligent, well-meaning lefties who were able to ignore that the Soviet Union was on the road to hell.

    Or JD Vance, who had Trump's number long ago, but persuaded himself to ignore his instincts.

    Or loads of other examples. The danger for clever people is their ability to construct a wobbly argument for utter bollocks.

    The important bit about democracy isn't that it gets things right, because mostly it doesn't. It's that it leaves the door open to changing its mind afterwards. (Which is what the Traitors game mechanic doesn't allow for, really.)

    As for what evidence? Alan's giggling at "I am a faithful" was pretty obvious. And Team Faithful did work it out, but then panicked.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 68,723
    Tesla shareholders on Thursday approved a plan that could make Elon Musk the world’s first trillionaire, two days after New Yorkers elected a tax-the-rich candidate as their next mayor.

    Ny Times Breaking News
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 62,239

    Tesla shareholders on Thursday approved a plan that could make Elon Musk the world’s first trillionaire, two days after New Yorkers elected a tax-the-rich candidate as their next mayor.

    Ny Times Breaking News

    Personal view: the Tesla share option scheme will never pay out.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 56,500

    Tesla shareholders on Thursday approved a plan that could make Elon Musk the world’s first trillionaire, two days after New Yorkers elected a tax-the-rich candidate as their next mayor.

    Ny Times Breaking News

    "There is no money!"
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 26,551
    People are talking about the Traitors TV show. I haven't watched it. What is the nature of the kerfuffle?
  • TazTaz Posts: 22,006

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Like the rest of us then.

    Humans can pretty easily be persuaded to overlook blooming obvious evidence. And the cleverer those humans are, the easier it is, in some ways.

    Which has wider implications for the stuff we talk about here.
    I’m sure it has for those who want to over analyse these things.

    What evidence as there ? Nothing firm.
    It's an illustration of a wider thing about being human.

    All those intelligent, well-meaning lefties who were able to ignore that the Soviet Union was on the road to hell.

    Or JD Vance, who had Trump's number long ago, but persuaded himself to ignore his instincts.

    Or loads of other examples. The danger for clever people is their ability to construct a wobbly argument for utter bollocks.

    The important bit about democracy isn't that it gets things right, because mostly it doesn't. It's that it leaves the door open to changing its mind afterwards. (Which is what the Traitors game mechanic doesn't allow for, really.)

    As for what evidence? Alan's giggling at "I am a faithful" was pretty obvious. And Team Faithful did work it out, but then panicked.
    All down to the editing really. We see what they want us to see.

    The traitors game mechanic is not that different from any other show that starts off with a group of people and eliminates them. It,is just how it is done, it is entertainment. Nothing more or less. Ephemera. Will be forgotten about in a few years time.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 23,773
    bobbob said:

    Eabhal said:

    isam said:

    Eabhal said:

    bobbob said:

    Anyone hear much today from Kier Starmer, Lisa Nandy et al on the Maccabib Tel Aviv match ? Feels like it’s all gone quiet over there

    Turns out the ban on fans wasn't because of rampant anti-Semitism in Birmingham, as anyone with a sliver of knowledge of football could have told you: https://news.sky.com/story/significant-hooliganism-within-maccabi-tel-aviv-fan-base-is-reason-for-aston-villa-match-ban-13465257

    A lot of ill-informed hyperventilating on PB a few weeks ago.

    I reckon there is a fair bit of anti-semitism in Birmingham though. More than a sliver. And if it hadn't been a place with so many muslims living there, the away fans would have been allowed
    From that police statement it looks like they were worried about the Maccabi fans targeting Brummies.
    The police are talking shite.

    Jews were being threatened by anti-Semites, and the response by the police was to tell the Jews not to come.

    I think the problem is that you can only see Jewish people as Jews regardless of any other attributes,

    You are unable to see Israeli football hooligans as anything but Jews therefore preventing them attacking Britain is antisemitic

    Thankfully most people in this country aren’t racist so do can understand the difference.
    So why aren't fans of other teams banned?

    Anx why was the ban implemented following threats from local anti-Semiites?
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 131,307
    There is no possibility of a general election in 2027, Labour MPs won't vote for Christmas and they have a big enough majority to avoid it
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 68,723
    rcs1000 said:

    Tesla shareholders on Thursday approved a plan that could make Elon Musk the world’s first trillionaire, two days after New Yorkers elected a tax-the-rich candidate as their next mayor.

    Ny Times Breaking News

    Personal view: the Tesla share option scheme will never pay out.
    Seems to be a ten year plan. Tesla wont exist as an independent company in ten years, if at all.

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 40,840
    Apparently the company that demolished the WhiteHouse are unhappy.

    Trump hasn't paid them...
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 23,773
    HYUFD said:

    There is no possibility of a general election in 2027, Labour MPs won't vote for Christmas and they have a big enough majority to avoid it

    We'd have to see a heck of a lot of defections to Sultanarama. Zero possibility.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 82,965

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    tlg86 said:

    I’ve spent all series praising the intelligence of the celebs on traitors. What a pair of idiots.

    Utter fuckwits.
    Like the rest of us then.

    Humans can pretty easily be persuaded to overlook blooming obvious evidence. And the cleverer those humans are, the easier it is, in some ways.

    Which has wider implications for the stuff we talk about here.
    I’m sure it has for those who want to over analyse these things.

    What evidence as there ? Nothing firm.
    It's an illustration of a wider thing about being human.

    All those intelligent, well-meaning lefties who were able to ignore that the Soviet Union was on the road to hell.

    Or JD Vance, who had Trump's number long ago, but persuaded himself to ignore his instincts.

    I don't think Vance is going against his instincts.
    He's aware enough to know exactly what he's going along with, and just wants to be the next guy after Trump.

    Fuck knows just how bad he'd be if he actually became president.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 131,307
    edited November 6
    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 68,723
    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
  • ozymandiasozymandias Posts: 1,552
    viewcode said:

    People are talking about the Traitors TV show. I haven't watched it. What is the nature of the kerfuffle?

    I haven’t see it either. From its title I assume it’s a documentary about the Labour Party.
  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,571
    Scott_xP said:

    Apparently the company that demolished the WhiteHouse are unhappy.

    Trump hasn't paid them...

    Complaining about Trump failing to pay you what you're owed is like a wife of Boris complaining of infidelity. That should have been their working assumption from the start, so you're not going to get much sympathy.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,562

    Taz said:

    nico67 said:

    Taz said:

    carnforth said:

    Rachel Reeves plans to raise income tax in upcoming budget

    The chancellor’s submission to Office for Budget Responsibility strongly indicates she will be reversing a key manifesto pledge this month


    Rachel Reeves has told the budget watchdog that she plans to increase income tax as she seeks to repair the public finances.

    The chancellor has informed the Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) that a rise in personal taxation is one of the “major measures” on tax and spending that she is preparing to announce later this month.

    The forecaster will assess the impact of the measures, which also include Reeves’s plans to increase economic growth, before informing the Treasury of its assessment on Monday. It is the penultimate round of forecasts before the budget on November 26.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/politics/article/rachel-reeves-budget-watchdog-raise-income-tax-plan-sr2wd8mp7

    21%/42% is my guess.
    This is in line with my thinking. In isolation it will raise around £12bn. In addition 47 or 48% for the additional rate which will raise less than £1bn but will be done to send a political message about 'fairness' and 'making those with the broadest shoulders pay more'.
    It's going to be utterly grim for additional rate taxpayers, we're going to get squeezed like a fiscal Singapore grip.
    Lucy Powell is going into but for you guys

    https://x.com/politlcsuk/status/1986481340112408586?s=61
    Powell has decided that by going down this route it will help her leadership ambitions. She can turn around and play the manifesto pledge martyr !
    Indeed. She’s just not a serious politician given this, how else are they supposed to get the level of money they need.
    Magic money tree, same as every other politician who grubs after popularity. Different species, but the same basic principle.

    Something for nothing beats nothing for something in the polls. Always has, always will, unfortunately.
    One day we'll have to wake up from that dream. But it is not this day.
  • isamisam Posts: 42,961
    edited November 6

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
    The polls are absurd at the moment, it is surely not worth extrapolating anything from them. To have a party with 5 MPs predicted to get over 400 seats is so fantastic that it must break any model used to deduce the parliamentary arithmetic

    How could you bet on it? 3/1 Reform Maj 10/11 most seats will look like the ones that got away if they do it, or the muggiest get ever if they crash and burn.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 99,562
    isam said:

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
    The polls are absurd at the moment, it is surely not worth extrapolating anything from them. To have a party with 5 MPs predicted to get over 400 seats is so fantastic that it must break any model used to deduce the parliamentary arithmetic

    How could you bet on it? 3/1 Reform Maj 10/11 most seats will look like the ones that got away if they do it, or the muggiest get ever if they crash and burn.
    Yes, the polls are clearly very extraordinary and remarkable outcomes would be expected if they came to pass, but not in an easily predictable way.

    Fun though.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 8,354
    isam said:

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
    The polls are absurd at the moment, it is surely not worth extrapolating anything from them. To have a party with 5 MPs predicted to get over 400 seats is so fantastic that it must break any model used to deduce the parliamentary arithmetic

    How could you bet on it? 3/1 Reform Maj 10/11 most seats will look like the ones that got away if they do it, or the muggiest get ever if they crash and burn.
    If Reform were to win the next election (a big “if”) it’ll be as a minority propped up by the rump of the Tories or a 330-340 seat sort of victory, IMHO.

    I don’t have the same confidence that tactical voting will be the complete spoiler that some think on here, but I think it’s clear it’ll have some impact, and it will definitely prevent a complete wipeout for Lab/LD
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 7,661
    isam said:

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
    The polls are absurd at the moment, it is surely not worth extrapolating anything from them. To have a party with 5 MPs predicted to get over 400 seats is so fantastic that it must break any model used to deduce the parliamentary arithmetic

    How could you bet on it? 3/1 Reform Maj 10/11 most seats will look like the ones that got away if they do it, or the muggiest get ever if they crash and burn.
    I just scrolled through this whole list:

    https://www.ladbrokes.com/en/sports/event/politics/uk/uk-politics/uk-next-general-election/245440619/all-markets

    And there's nothing attractive there. Now if we were six months before an election, and the numbers were the same, there might be things to nibble on.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 56,345

    isam said:

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
    The polls are absurd at the moment, it is surely not worth extrapolating anything from them. To have a party with 5 MPs predicted to get over 400 seats is so fantastic that it must break any model used to deduce the parliamentary arithmetic

    How could you bet on it? 3/1 Reform Maj 10/11 most seats will look like the ones that got away if they do it, or the muggiest get ever if they crash and burn.
    If Reform were to win the next election (a big “if”) it’ll be as a minority propped up by the rump of the Tories or a 330-340 seat sort of victory, IMHO.

    I don’t have the same confidence that tactical voting will be the complete spoiler that some think on here, but I think it’s clear it’ll have some impact, and it will definitely prevent a complete wipeout for Lab/LD
    There is a possibility that the period before the next election will be like 1994-1997 and Farage will consolidate a Blair-level domination of mainstream politics.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,858
    viewcode said:

    People are talking about the Traitors TV show. I haven't watched it. What is the nature of the kerfuffle?

    It's an entertaining series based on the difficulty in deciding who is bluffing/double-bluffing whom. Because it's TV, they successfully got lots of people engaged and rooting for one or another of the teams.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 26,551

    HYUFD said:

    Andy_JS said:

    "Find Out Now
    @FindoutnowUK

    Find Out Now voting intention:
    🟦 Reform UK: 33% (+1)
    🟢 Greens: 18% (+1)
    🔵 Conservatives: 16% (-)
    🔴 Labour: 15% (-1)
    🟠 Lib Dems: 11% (-1)

    Changes from 29th October
    [Find Out Now, 5-6th November, N=2,717]"

    https://x.com/FindoutnowUK/status/1986482146828025866

    Gives Reform 401 MPs, LDs 68, Greens 62, SNP 41, Labour 25, Conservatives 20.

    Mind you it is FON
    https://electionmaps.uk/nowcast/custom

    Andrew Lilico
    @andrew_lilico
    ·
    5h
    Has there ever been an opinion poll, since polling began, that would have entailed Labour getting fewer than 25 seats?

    https://x.com/andrew_lilico/status/1986488752978481585
    From memory, the first UK political polling poll was just before WW2 by Gallup. So I doubt it
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