I wonder how many people would suddenly change their views on EU membership in/out if their employers point out how much of their sales and exports (and therefore jobs) are dependent on Britain's membership of the EU. This problem will become a live issue for thousands of Scots after 19th September if their employers have to begin assessing the effect of Scotland being outside the EU and wanting in.
Dear Dear Easterross , not that old canard, we will still be in the EU and by the time we have finalised negotiations and departed the union , we will still be in the EU.
malc I agree with that, but what none of the Nats will face up to is the terms of membership will have changed and not to Scotland's benefit. Fisheries, oil, Euro, rebates etc. , that's the price of rejoining.
Alan, Hopefully we will not get completely rogered, we can always tell them to F off if we do not like it.
"Hopefully we will not get completely rogered"
That's the plan is it? Hope and moonshine? Best of luck with that.
You are obviously a bit dense and misinterpreted my witty riposte to Alan, the Scottish Government are not stupid and will obviously negotiate hard in the country's best interests. As I clearly said if the EU are not reasonable then we can tell them where to stick it. No-one can know in advance what the positions will be but it would not be surprising if they were light on Scotland to tweak London's tail.
However, it should also be remembered that EWNI will also be in negotiations at the same time to reenter the EU, or to adjust to its new, but continuing, place in the EU (on precisely the same logic as Scotland, depending on which side of that part of the indy debate one tends to be). I for one don't believe that the EU will automatically roll over and allow EWNI to claim to be the sole continuing state without at least a poke in the biceps and a hard stare.
I think you'll be surprised! The rUK will not "claim" anything, it will be automatically recognised as the continuing member state.
The naivety is breathtaking.
Your knowledge of international law is clearly non-existent.
Maybe Dickson's seen the non existent EU legal advice on which Salmond spent £20,000 trying to keep secret?
Nick doesn't need to win a majority; he just needs to win over some of the pro-european Conservatives and Labour. If his vote goes to 15% for the Euro vote then he is a winner.
Stick Farage on the air and the guy speaks with more faux sincerity and passion than any of the other leaders. This is the start of the UKIP election campaign - they will be covered extensively in the Euros and will speak with the clear position and simplicity that Cameroon Tories can only dream of.
The recent upswell in the Tory vote and downswell in the UKIP one? Won't last. When UKIP Get coverage their share increases. That means their position strengthens in the run up to the Yerp elections this May then the same for the GE. Which means a corresponding reversion in the Tory vote. Whilst the Labour VI stays at 38. But I'm sure that I'm wrong and Cameron with his track record of sincerity and simple position on Europe will win through on those UKIP defectees.....
@paulwaugh First proper gaffe? Did Farage just blunder by appearing to trash the UK car industry? #LBCdebate
@nicholaswatt Has @Nigel_Farage just said that EU cars from outside UK are better than those built in UK?
Think he was pointing out BMW 5 series are higher cost and added value than a Nissan, though it did seem clumsily expressed to me.
The UK is the second largest luxury car manufacturer in Europe and probably in the world.
RR, Bentley, Jaguar, Land Rover, Aston Martin, Mini ain't cheap.
Sure. I suppose Farage was referring to Nissan, Honda, Toyota, Ford. I'm afraid I'm not up on the facts of the automotive balance of trade overall though.
Stick Farage on the air and the guy speaks with more faux sincerity and passion than any of the other leaders. This is the start of the UKIP election campaign - they will be covered extensively in the Euros and will speak with the clear position and simplicity that Cameroon Tories can only dream of.
The recent upswell in the Tory vote and downswell in the UKIP one? Won't last. When UKIP Get coverage their share increases. That means their position strengthens in the run up to the Yerp elections this May then the same for the GE. Which means a corresponding reversion in the Tory vote. Whilst the Labour VI stays at 38. But I'm sure that I'm wrong and Cameron with his track record of sincerity and simple position on Europe will win through on those UKIP defectees.....
I can't see this affecting the Labour or LD vote shares very much.
O/T (sorry Watcher et al) but a very amusing story with some serious wider implications for what happens if the mainstream media is not telling the full story.
Spare a thought for the staffers hunched over laptops trying churn out instant memes almost before the sentence is finished.
They knew what they were getting into, I have no sympathy for such minions.
I believe Avery's analysis would have been the preferred narrative no matter what (I only saw 20 minutes so cannot speak for the whole thing as to whether it would be accurate), but of course it depends how one judges it. Of course a debate on the EU is boring, of course few people will have watched it and of course there will be no consensus as to who 'won'. But those are unchangable facts, and judging it for what it was and what those involved hoped to achieve? People are talking about it. Positive or negative, that is all any of them wanted as a minimum.
And I've seen far more boring political debates. The small bit I saw was interesting enough for what it was.
Stick Farage on the air and the guy speaks with more faux sincerity and passion than any of the other leaders. This is the start of the UKIP election campaign - they will be covered extensively in the Euros and will speak with the clear position and simplicity that Cameroon Tories can only dream of.
The recent upswell in the Tory vote and downswell in the UKIP one? Won't last. When UKIP Get coverage their share increases. That means their position strengthens in the run up to the Yerp elections this May then the same for the GE. Which means a corresponding reversion in the Tory vote. Whilst the Labour VI stays at 38. But I'm sure that I'm wrong and Cameron with his track record of sincerity and simple position on Europe will win through on those UKIP defectees.....
I can't see this affecting the Labour or LD vote shares very much.
Exactly. Nor did the budget. Or indeed much else. The variance in the lead has pretty much all been Tories and Ukip swapping a few swingers. But strengthen the kipper score and you weaken the Tories score.
Just out of Captain America 2, now on to the Farage-Clegg debate. Not a bad mix of entertainment for the evening. Yes, I'm weird.
Was it good, going to watch it this weekend.
Captain America 2 is the usual Marvel rubbish. Very entertaining rubbish though. ;-)
The Big Boss is obvious the moment (s)he appears, and the nemesis is also obvious far too early. It plays to the genre, but does it very well.
As an aside, I'm going to start a company that advises large futuristic corps and evil organisations on designing space- and air- craft. For instance, putting central computer consoles at the end of long gangways with long drops below always ends in disaster, especially when the gangways only have puny handrails. Such craft having large voids with glass floors below is also a no-no.
Stick Farage on the air and the guy speaks with more faux sincerity and passion than any of the other leaders. This is the start of the UKIP election campaign - they will be covered extensively in the Euros and will speak with the clear position and simplicity that Cameroon Tories can only dream of.
The recent upswell in the Tory vote and downswell in the UKIP one? Won't last. When UKIP Get coverage their share increases. That means their position strengthens in the run up to the Yerp elections this May then the same for the GE. Which means a corresponding reversion in the Tory vote. Whilst the Labour VI stays at 38. But I'm sure that I'm wrong and Cameron with his track record of sincerity and simple position on Europe will win through on those UKIP defectees.....
I can't see this affecting the Labour or LD vote shares very much.
Exactly. Nor did the budget. Or indeed much else. The variance in the lead has pretty much all been Tories and Ukip swapping a few swingers. But strengthen the kipper score and you weaken the Tories score.
Just out of Captain America 2, now on to the Farage-Clegg debate. Not a bad mix of entertainment for the evening. Yes, I'm weird.
Was it good, going to watch it this weekend.
I've seen it.
Very good, slightly different to the other Marvel movies.
Totally has changed the Marvel cinematic universe.
There's two post credits scene, one midway, one right at the end.
Oh and there's lot of Scarlett Johansson
I'd agree. It's hardly a smart movie, but I dislike things being labelled as rubbish as a result (even fun rubbish), and like the first Captain America it's tone and style feels distinct from the others, and yet as it is not a WW2 movie, it is also distinct in tone from the first. I like movies that have no pretensions and are designed to be fun without going for crazily dumb fun territory.
Some good character work for new or underdeveloped characters, and agreed, has a major impact on the cinematic movie universe (about something which needed addressing, but does make me wonder what they'll do to follow it up). Johansson is actually good for once.
Didn't know about the second post credits scene. You just love to catch us out, huh, Marvel?
God knows how the public will measure that. Probably through the media I should think since most won't have seen it. And those that did already had a position.
I think Clegg messed up when he said "read the small print" though. Ouch. That'll get thrown back at him again.
Lot of wrangling about figures. Could do with the ONS for Europe. Not that anyone would trust it.
In the end I didn't watch it (partly due to Futurama, but I also came up with a short story idea). The fact they were using a worm greatly depresses me.
I like Nick Ferrari. Used to listen to Five Live in the mornings. But got pissed off with them covering women's football and the like, just to be inclusive. Made me feel like I was being socially engineered. Ferrari, and many on LBC, are noticeably to the right of the BBC, but in a matter of fact, common sense way. Very refreshing.
Comments
I'm guaranteed to upset someone.
The audience must be tiny and out of those that are watching they'll mostly be converted to the "cause" one way or another.
I once wrote a PB thread from inside a gay bar.
Farage proving he is no cheap populist and knows his stuff. Wonder what Cameron & Miliband thinking? #lbcdebate
RR, Bentley, Jaguar, Land Rover, Aston Martin, Mini ain't cheap.
The recent upswell in the Tory vote and downswell in the UKIP one? Won't last. When UKIP Get coverage their share increases. That means their position strengthens in the run up to the Yerp elections this May then the same for the GE. Which means a corresponding reversion in the Tory vote. Whilst the Labour VI stays at 38. But I'm sure that I'm wrong and Cameron with his track record of sincerity and simple position on Europe will win through on those UKIP defectees.....
or indeed Tory?
Why?
Vote Mr. Speaker... Bercow land for me...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-23432322
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Southampton_plant
These strange countries are all the same, aren't they? ;-)
Very good, slightly different to the other Marvel movies.
Totally has changed the Marvel cinematic universe.
There's two post credits scene, one midway, one right at the end.
Oh and there's lot of Scarlett Johansson
Not good for Farage when he's forced to discuss paying his wife EU money. Looks like just another greedy politician.
O/T (sorry Watcher et al) but a very amusing story with some serious wider implications for what happens if the mainstream media is not telling the full story.
A NO SCORE BORE DRAW
Ladbrokes cut Yes from 4/1 to 7/2. New best prices:
Yes 7/2 (various)
No 2/9 (various)
I believe Avery's analysis would have been the preferred narrative no matter what (I only saw 20 minutes so cannot speak for the whole thing as to whether it would be accurate), but of course it depends how one judges it. Of course a debate on the EU is boring, of course few people will have watched it and of course there will be no consensus as to who 'won'. But those are unchangable facts, and judging it for what it was and what those involved hoped to achieve? People are talking about it. Positive or negative, that is all any of them wanted as a minimum.
And I've seen far more boring political debates. The small bit I saw was interesting enough for what it was.
The Big Boss is obvious the moment (s)he appears, and the nemesis is also obvious far too early. It plays to the genre, but does it very well.
As an aside, I'm going to start a company that advises large futuristic corps and evil organisations on designing space- and air- craft. For instance, putting central computer consoles at the end of long gangways with long drops below always ends in disaster, especially when the gangways only have puny handrails. Such craft having large voids with glass floors below is also a no-no.
I'll make a fortune.
I thought it would be better to quote an independent source rather than say it myself as I am so obviously biased, that's all
Cammo and Millipede 2nd class, must be gnashing their tootipegs in frustration that they were not present.
The debate though, will be a boon to both Ukip and the L/dems.
Farage is like Salmond, he doesnt care about collateral damage and has no plans for much afterwards, as long as he gets out of the Union.
Some good character work for new or underdeveloped characters, and agreed, has a major impact on the cinematic movie universe (about something which needed addressing, but does make me wonder what they'll do to follow it up). Johansson is actually good for once.
Didn't know about the second post credits scene. You just love to catch us out, huh, Marvel?
I think Clegg messed up when he said "read the small print" though. Ouch. That'll get thrown back at him again.
Lot of wrangling about figures. Could do with the ONS for Europe. Not that anyone would trust it.
However, three LBC cheers for the LBC debate!
In the end I didn't watch it (partly due to Futurama, but I also came up with a short story idea). The fact they were using a worm greatly depresses me.
I see that all the senior LDs are there to back Clegg.
Farage 57%
Clegg 36%
DK 7%
Tory supporters:
Farage 70%
Clegg 20%
Labour supporters:
Clegg 51%
Farage 42%
UKIP supporters:
Farage 93%
LD supporters:
Clegg 77%
Farage 20%