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Voter suppression could work for the Tories – politicalbetting.com

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  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,014

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    I am so old I never really got modern notation but I did once beat the reigning woman's Scottish Champion at Chess,. Despite the excellent Queen's Gambit series there is a very marked difference in ability between men and women at chess. Probably got something to do with spatial awareness. So I don't find it particularly surprising that women might think that someone genetically a male could have an unfair advantage.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963
    edited April 12

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    I was going to comment, the Tory who got the Police to re-investigate SKS should have been fined for wasting Police time.
    That was Ric Holden, who is quite a piece of work. But it took the heat off Boris-Rishi cake gate. It got Big G very excited too!
    Nothing gets me excited - indeed I need to look after my pacemaker

    Mind you on Rayner, it would seem to be a minor story but only if she had not demanded such high standards from conservative politicians, and she and many others in Labour will see increasing scrutiny as they close in on power
    Glad to hear you are taking all of this excitement with calm!

    What truly bemuses me about Raynergate is that the Tories don't understand that the deeper they probe the worse they look.

    Polls show that most voters see politics - and specifically the Tory party / government - as corrupt. Endless scandals over very large amounts of money. Peerages and gongs openly being sold. PPE money accidentally deposited in Tory pockets. So from this position of propriety they have decided to go into bat over £1,500 of alleged CGT which HMRC have already said isn't due. Which reopens the floodgates of people on social media highlighting the real (Tory) scandals.

    I genuinely don't get it. People in glass houses are told not to throw stones. And yet here are the Tories being showered with glass whilst people encourage them to throw more stones.
    You may be right and it is a non story, but turn it round and Labour would be having a field day

    It is called politics
    Not just Labour, *everyone* is having a field day about genuine real verified Tory corruption. For massive sums of money. Dodgy donors, dodgy contracts, dodgy peerages. Go ask normals what exercises them - it isn't Rayner.

    This is my point. If Tories want to focus on Rayner thats fine, as long as you're comfortable with the spotlight on the vastly worse Tory scandals.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,832
    DavidL said:

    At last the bungling cops are investigating Rayner. Chances of a prosecution approx = 0

    Isn't it fabulous that Greater Manchester is such a peaceful and law abiding metropolis that the police have time to spare to investigate this trivia?
    Its not trivia
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,319
    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world
    I sold my Islington pied-à-terre 10 years ago. The price of similar flats has barely moved since. One-bedroom, post-war, £425k.
  • kinabalu said:

    My opinion? Gender is different to birth sex. It's an identity concept whereas birth sex is physical. You can't change your birth sex (it's a historical fact) and for most people that's not a problem because it accords with their gender identity. For a small minority it is a problem. They feel female in a male body or male in a female one. This causes distress which can be alleviated by transitioning and living their lives as female born men or male born women. The Gender Recognition Act provides a route for people to do this, validating their identity and giving it legal recognition.

    This is pretty much where I am. I think sex and gender are different - and to be fair most people I know trans or otherwise agree with this.

    My question was more about the existence of "gender" which some here have said doesn't exist. I can't really buy into that because what is it that people who feel they are born into the wrong body "feel"? What is that thing?
    What they "feel" is no more or less how much I feel about whether God exists or not - and we have laws to protect discrimination on those grounds.

    I do think from certain circles - not here - gender and sex are conflated dishonestly. And for me that is the route of the issue. People like Graham Linehan go too far into "they're all just the same really and they're always men even if they look like women" and for me that's too far into the "anti" camp. To be clear there are the same people on the pro side who send him death threats so it's just as bad there.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,449

    In today's YouGov "Wrong to Leave" is up to 20% among respondents willing to admit that they voted Leave, and 57% overall. Only 33% say "Right to Leave".

    This is particularly notable because the unweighted sample has 837 Remain voters to 768 Leave, suggesting that there are a number of former Leave voters who have managed to convince themselves they voted otherwise - this "false recall" effect is quite common when there's a change of view like this. People's shame and regret means that they lie to themselves.

    If this number increases further over time it will eventually have political consequences.

    I think Labour's polling team is keeping a keen eye on the EU polling. They will find what they perceive to be the right time and they will tack towards it for electoral advantage.
    Relevant in that context;

    For those who think the issue of Brexit will go away, the frontier of age/Brexit preferences is steadily shifting in a pro-EU direction - and is likely to continue to do so as a result of population replacement. Data via BESResearch




    https://twitter.com/drjennings/status/1777990515360714783

    (About half the shift against Brexit so far is people changing their minds, the other half is happening one funeral at a time.)
  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,808
    Leon said:

    I now understand the reactions of many PBers when they see me talking about AI. It’s the feeling I get when I see, on here, the word ‘trans’

    Yes, both those subjects have me reactively closing the page.
  • MortimerMortimer Posts: 14,142
    ToryJim said:

    Mortimer said:

    Labour lead with 26 points in today's yougov

    Lab 45 (+2)
    Con 19 (-1)
    Libdem 8 (=)
    Reform 15 (-1)
    Green 7 (-1)

    Unreal that the backbenchers will accept that.

    Taxi for Rishi on May 3rd....
    At some point you have to recognise that the wisest thing you can do is huddle in the lifeboat and pray. Keep thinking that hurling yourself into the sea in search of a more comfortable mode of rescue won’t result in you drowning in the attempt is foolhardy in extremis.
    Handy for all the Tory wets, eh?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world
    I sold my Islington pied-à-terre 10 years ago. The price of similar flats has barely moved since. One-bedroom, post-war, £425k.
    Ditto Camden. Hasn’t budged in almost a decade. If we descend into Fentanyl Hell that won’t help, either

    However the values are now so low compared to other world cities I think we may see a correction: upwards
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963
    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,058
    Leon said:

    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    On a different note, there was a horrible knife attack in Bordeaux yesterday. An Afghan asylum seeker stabbed two people brutally, killing one, injuring the other, before being shot dead by police. All on horrific video if you want to see. NSFW

    That’s another 100,000 votes for Le Pen right there. The French authorities must also be terrified of some awful event ruining the Olympics. There are so many bad actors who would love to disrupt it, from islamists to Putin to China to random nutters, of which France has many. And with Schengen they can come from anywhere in Europe

    I was having just that conversation with a French friend last week. They’re a little upset about the Seine being too dirty for the swimming, but what they’re absolutely terrified of is a terrorist attack on the Olympics.

    There’s plenty of domestic and foreign sources of trouble out there at the moment, and it wouldn’t be too difficult to pull off something close to a venue. The security forces must be having one hell of a job to try and understand the situation well enough to stop something.
    Indeed. It’s probably the worst moment to hold an Olympics since WW2 in terms of global security. And France is not a police state like China which can staple people in apartments

    I feel for them, and I don’t often say that about the French
    The Olympics is a thing whose time is over. Taken over by big money and jingoism. Now they are even paying prize money, the Olympics’ have lost their raison d’etre.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,614

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    I was going to comment, the Tory who got the Police to re-investigate SKS should have been fined for wasting Police time.
    That was Ric Holden, who is quite a piece of work. But it took the heat off Boris-Rishi cake gate. It got Big G very excited too!
    Nothing gets me excited - indeed I need to look after my pacemaker

    Mind you on Rayner, it would seem to be a minor story but only if she had not demanded such high standards from conservative politicians, and she and many others in Labour will see increasing scrutiny as they close in on power
    Glad to hear you are taking all of this excitement with calm!

    What truly bemuses me about Raynergate is that the Tories don't understand that the deeper they probe the worse they look.

    Polls show that most voters see politics - and specifically the Tory party / government - as corrupt. Endless scandals over very large amounts of money. Peerages and gongs openly being sold. PPE money accidentally deposited in Tory pockets. So from this position of propriety they have decided to go into bat over £1,500 of alleged CGT which HMRC have already said isn't due. Which reopens the floodgates of people on social media highlighting the real (Tory) scandals.

    I genuinely don't get it. People in glass houses are told not to throw stones. And yet here are the Tories being showered with glass whilst people encourage them to throw more stones.
    You may be right and it is a non story, but turn it round and Labour would be having a field day

    It is called politics
    Not just Labour, *everyone* is having a field day about genuine real verified Tory corruption. For massive sums of money. Dodgy donors, dodgy contracts, dodgy peerages. Go ask normals what exercises them - it isn't Rayner.

    This is my point. If Tories want to focus on Rayner thats fine, as long as you're comfortable with the spotlight on the vastly worse Tory scandals.
    I am not a member of the conservative party and am politically homeless

    I am comfortable with the spotlight on conservative scandals and justice being achieved

    Rayner is likely a non story but I would not be surprised if Starmer hopes it is a story so he and Reeves can remain on the centre ground and not turned left by Rayner
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,058

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    There aren’t any nice green fields any more. This winter has turned them into brown mudbaths.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568

    Leon said:

    I now understand the reactions of many PBers when they see me talking about AI. It’s the feeling I get when I see, on here, the word ‘trans’

    Yes, both those subjects have me reactively closing the page.
    It’s when my close friends started saying ‘Leon, shut the fuck up about AI’, that I realised I was becoming something of a monomaniac and that @rcs1000 and @TSE had a point. I now reserve my thoughts on this fascinating subject to dedicated subreddits (full of nutters like me) and essays for the Gazette

    Maybe those who are obsessed with the trans issue can learn from my sensitivity and politesse. I’m sure there are hundreds of subreddits dedicated to discussions of non-binaryness
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963
    Glad to see that the pitch to keep the remaining 12 Tory voters is paying dividends. In taking people to court for a social security payment it advised them to take, DWP is quids in, losing loads of money from its successful persecutions.

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2024/apr/12/carers-allowance-benefit-error-30p-a-week-dwp

    Remember that it is clearly pointless taxing zillionaires as it raises less tax. Laffer Curve and all that. But it isn't pointless persecuting carers and successfully costing the government more money. Laugher Curve and all that, and not remotely hypocritical behaviour from the remaining 11 people who are voting Tory.
  • DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 723
    edited April 12
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    I am so old I never really got modern notation but I did once beat the reigning woman's Scottish Champion at Chess,. Despite the excellent Queen's Gambit series there is a very marked difference in ability between men and women at chess. Probably got something to do with spatial awareness. So I don't find it particularly surprising that women might think that someone genetically a male could have an unfair advantage.
    Peak Elo ratings:

    Susan Polgar b.1969, 2577 (274 behind Gary Kasparov's 2851 at his peak)
    Sofia Polgar, b.1974, 2505 (346 behind)
    Judit Polgar, b. 1976, 2735 (116 behind)

    Maybe Laszlo and Klara Polgar's attention lapsed a bit with Sofia, or maybe Susan's male opponents got distracted by her blonde hair, but the trend there was upwards. If they'd had a 4th or 5th daughter she'd have whupped Kasparov's arse.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    edited April 12
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    I am so old I never really got modern notation but I did once beat the reigning woman's Scottish Champion at Chess,. Despite the excellent Queen's Gambit series there is a very marked difference in ability between men and women at chess. Probably got something to do with spatial awareness. So I don't find it particularly surprising that women might think that someone genetically a male could have an unfair advantage.
    Judit Polgar reached #8 in the world, with a rating of 2735.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judit_Polgár

    Most professional chess tournaments are actually pretty mixed, because there’s many fewer women’s tournaments on the calendar outside of the world championship.

    Queen’s Gambit was very good for women’s chess, and the rise of social media has also seen a lot more players able to compete by earning revenue from streaming both online and over-the-board tournament games. I follow a Swedish lady chess master called Anna Cramling on Youtube. She’s the daughter of two grandmasters, an international master herself, and has nearly a million followers thanks to being a 22-year-old Swedish blonde with a bubbly personality a great chess player.
    https://www.youtube.com/@AnnaCramling
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,942
    edited April 12
    @Leon I didn't see your final post last night to me until today. Thank you (I think). It was rather sweet. I think it was a compliment but I'm not sure. Quote: 'I'm actually quite fond of you in a "fond of Radio 4 comedy" kind of way, I hope that is returned'. As I do like Radio 4 comedies and, in particular, you hoped it was returned, I'm interpreting it as such.

    I hope I am correct. It was a bit cryptic.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,167

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    Unleaded moved to E10 a couple of years ago.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568
    kjh said:

    @Leon I didn't see your final post last night to me until today. Thank you (I think). It was rather sweet. I think it was a compliment but I'm not sure. Quote: 'I'm actually quite fond of you in a "fond of Radio 4 comedy" kind of way, I hope that is returned'. As I do like Radio 4 comedies and, in particular, you hoped it was returned, I'm interpreting it as such.

    I hope I am correct. It was a bit cryptic.

    Reciprocated. My modest barb at you really was just a throwaway remark for my own amusement

  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    I was going to comment, the Tory who got the Police to re-investigate SKS should have been fined for wasting Police time.
    That was Ric Holden, who is quite a piece of work. But it took the heat off Boris-Rishi cake gate. It got Big G very excited too!
    Nothing gets me excited - indeed I need to look after my pacemaker

    Mind you on Rayner, it would seem to be a minor story but only if she had not demanded such high standards from conservative politicians, and she and many others in Labour will see increasing scrutiny as they close in on power
    Glad to hear you are taking all of this excitement with calm!

    What truly bemuses me about Raynergate is that the Tories don't understand that the deeper they probe the worse they look.

    Polls show that most voters see politics - and specifically the Tory party / government - as corrupt. Endless scandals over very large amounts of money. Peerages and gongs openly being sold. PPE money accidentally deposited in Tory pockets. So from this position of propriety they have decided to go into bat over £1,500 of alleged CGT which HMRC have already said isn't due. Which reopens the floodgates of people on social media highlighting the real (Tory) scandals.

    I genuinely don't get it. People in glass houses are told not to throw stones. And yet here are the Tories being showered with glass whilst people encourage them to throw more stones.
    You may be right and it is a non story, but turn it round and Labour would be having a field day

    It is called politics
    Not just Labour, *everyone* is having a field day about genuine real verified Tory corruption. For massive sums of money. Dodgy donors, dodgy contracts, dodgy peerages. Go ask normals what exercises them - it isn't Rayner.

    This is my point. If Tories want to focus on Rayner thats fine, as long as you're comfortable with the spotlight on the vastly worse Tory scandals.
    I am not a member of the conservative party and am politically homeless

    I am comfortable with the spotlight on conservative scandals and justice being achieved

    Rayner is likely a non story but I would not be surprised if Starmer hopes it is a story so he and Reeves can remain on the centre ground and not turned left by Rayner
    This wasn't specifically about you. But as you touched on it my view is that you're not a Tory member. But you do project the Tory propaganda. Exclusively. You may not vote for them, but you remain travelling in their direction. Happy to be corrected, but you can't just say it isn't true, you need to stop focusing on these pitiful Tory attempts to deflect.

    There are some genuine serious outrageous scandals out there, happening right now. Raynergate is not one of them, just as Beergate was also not one of them.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568
    Going back to property prices, a very quick check suggests Parisian apartments are almost twice as expensive as London equivalents

    That’s a massive gap. It surely cannot last, either Paris will go down or London will go up
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337

    Tres said:

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    Indeed. If Rayner has broken electoral registration law, which has yet to be determined, it wouldn’t pass a threshold for prosecution as far as I can see from reading about the case. This is all just weak sauce.

    Rishi Sunak has twice been fined by the police for breaking the law and he didn’t resign. The idea that this is a resigning matter for Rayner… I’m not remotely convinced.
    It seems spurious to me. Does your main residence for electoral purposes have to be the same as your main residence for tax purposes?
    no
    There is not even a main residence for electoral purposes. It is perfectly acceptable to be registered in multiple places as long as you only vote once (in national and London elections, others you can vote more than once). You can be registered places other than your main home as long as you have a reasonable connection to the property.

    Unless she has voted twice, which afaik no one has even suggested, it is a complete non issue and utter waste of police time.
    So this is about her address for her own vote?? Not address as a candidate?? I had assumed the latter.

    Bloody hell, I hope Labour make all MPs' tax and wealth records open access once they get in.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,058
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    I now understand the reactions of many PBers when they see me talking about AI. It’s the feeling I get when I see, on here, the word ‘trans’

    Yes, both those subjects have me reactively closing the page.
    It’s when my close friends started saying ‘Leon, shut the fuck up about AI’, that I realised I was becoming something of a monomaniac and that @rcs1000 and @TSE had a point. I now reserve my thoughts on this fascinating subject to dedicated subreddits (full of nutters like me) and essays for the Gazette

    Maybe those who are obsessed with the trans issue can learn from my sensitivity and politesse. I’m sure there are hundreds of subreddits dedicated to discussions of non-binaryness
    I hope there’s a subreddit somewhere dedicated to chess.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,146
    ..
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world
    I sold my Islington pied-à-terre 10 years ago. The price of similar flats has barely moved since. One-bedroom, post-war, £425k.
    Ditto Camden. Hasn’t budged in almost a decade. If we descend into Fentanyl Hell that won’t help, either

    However the values are now so low compared to other world cities I think we may see a correction: upwards
    Am now imagining Camdonians driven to Fentanyl by the meagre rise in value of their property.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890
    Taz said:

    ...

    ...

    I have just returned from hospital and seen Greater Manchester police are investigating Rayner over her registration for election purposes

    I couldn't understand why it was said they were investigating her CGT liabilities as that is a HMRC matter so at least we now know why the police are involved

    I have no idea how this will pan out but at least it should be resolved one way or another

    Fantastic work by James Daly! This would be a massive scalp for the Conservatives. There could be a custodial sentence at the end of this rainbow. It's about time, with all the political corruption that has gone on over the last 5 years!
    Broken, sleazy Labour on the slide!
    There is a magnificent irony if Rayner ends up in Holloway whilst Johnson's PPE friends can enjoy their ill gotten gains.
    Michelle Mone still seems to have plenty of questions to answer. I hope it’s not been swept under the carpet.
    A Chancellor with allegedly seven properties exempt of duty, a health secretary whose sister allegedly made PPE cash, a PM whose wife allegedly operated as a non-dom, a Foreign Secretary allegedly lobbying Government for Rex Greensill.

    To be honest I feel for Michelle. The Tory public schoolboy brethren throw some Glaswegian tenament dweller to the dogs. One rule for them etc...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    MattW said:

    The Rayner kerfuffle is good news for Labour. The Tories have a real problem with the "red queen". Northern, woman, intelligent, authentic. Everything they hate. So they are focusing all their fire on her over utter trivia, which provides the political cover to go back over all of their non-trivial corruption. Which is all over social media at the moment.

    So the Heil, GBeebies et al attack Rayner to the approval of the remaining 14 Tory voters whilst Facebook and TwiX churns out loads of Tory corruption stuff because what's good for the goose must be good for the gander.

    "the Heil, GBeebies"

    No offence RP, but do you actually think statements like that are going to look good for you if you get elected.? I think it will bite you in the arse which would be a shame.
    Its parody. The right wing media is self-parody. The Mail supported the Nazis - historical fact - and promote all kinds of guff today. GB News is not news - and now has OFCOM on their case because Tory politician interviewing Tory politician giving unfiltered Tory propaganda is not news.

    I know the remaining 13 Tory voters dislike having the mirror held up, but I am not going to upset voters by calling out what everyone else can see.
    What about The Mirror and The Express?
    The Mirror supported the Nazis too iirc.
    The Mirror was owned by the Mail, so yes.
  • Carnyx said:

    Tres said:

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    Indeed. If Rayner has broken electoral registration law, which has yet to be determined, it wouldn’t pass a threshold for prosecution as far as I can see from reading about the case. This is all just weak sauce.

    Rishi Sunak has twice been fined by the police for breaking the law and he didn’t resign. The idea that this is a resigning matter for Rayner… I’m not remotely convinced.
    It seems spurious to me. Does your main residence for electoral purposes have to be the same as your main residence for tax purposes?
    no
    There is not even a main residence for electoral purposes. It is perfectly acceptable to be registered in multiple places as long as you only vote once (in national and London elections, others you can vote more than once). You can be registered places other than your main home as long as you have a reasonable connection to the property.

    Unless she has voted twice, which afaik no one has even suggested, it is a complete non issue and utter waste of police time.
    So this is about her address for her own vote?? Not address as a candidate?? I had assumed the latter.

    Bloody hell, I hope Labour make all MPs' tax and wealth records open access once they get in.
    As far as I am aware, the complaint is before she was an MP so it’s alleged she voted in the wrong place or was registered to vote in the wrong place.
  • PhilPhil Posts: 2,335
    edited April 12
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    I am so old I never really got modern notation but I did once beat the reigning woman's Scottish Champion at Chess,. Despite the excellent Queen's Gambit series there is a very marked difference in ability between men and women at chess. Probably got something to do with spatial awareness. So I don't find it particularly surprising that women might think that someone genetically a male could have an unfair advantage.
    The difference between male & female players at the top level just comes down to numbers. If you had 10-20x as many women putting in the number of hours of chess study required to reach the top level then there would be far more top-level female players. The nature of the distribution of talent means that differences in numbers leads to significant observed differences in the number & ELO of top-level players, without needing any intrinsic differences.

    (The story of the Polgar sisters makes this fairly obvious.)

    It’s possible that the difference in willingness to put that amount of time in is intrinsic, but the existing difference in outcomes is not strong evidence of a difference in intrinsic potential ability.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Some ideas here for the inevitable BBC Homes and Interiors programme:

    https://edition.cnn.com/travel/people-living-in-planes/index.html
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    I was going to comment, the Tory who got the Police to re-investigate SKS should have been fined for wasting Police time.
    That was Ric Holden, who is quite a piece of work. But it took the heat off Boris-Rishi cake gate. It got Big G very excited too!
    Nothing gets me excited - indeed I need to look after my pacemaker

    Mind you on Rayner, it would seem to be a minor story but only if she had not demanded such high standards from conservative politicians, and she and many others in Labour will see increasing scrutiny as they close in on power
    Glad to hear you are taking all of this excitement with calm!

    What truly bemuses me about Raynergate is that the Tories don't understand that the deeper they probe the worse they look.

    Polls show that most voters see politics - and specifically the Tory party / government - as corrupt. Endless scandals over very large amounts of money. Peerages and gongs openly being sold. PPE money accidentally deposited in Tory pockets. So from this position of propriety they have decided to go into bat over £1,500 of alleged CGT which HMRC have already said isn't due. Which reopens the floodgates of people on social media highlighting the real (Tory) scandals.

    I genuinely don't get it. People in glass houses are told not to throw stones. And yet here are the Tories being showered with glass whilst people encourage them to throw more stones.
    You may be right and it is a non story, but turn it round and Labour would be having a field day

    It is called politics
    Not just Labour, *everyone* is having a field day about genuine real verified Tory corruption. For massive sums of money. Dodgy donors, dodgy contracts, dodgy peerages. Go ask normals what exercises them - it isn't Rayner.

    This is my point. If Tories want to focus on Rayner thats fine, as long as you're comfortable with the spotlight on the vastly worse Tory scandals.
    There is the suggestion Rayner is being used to keep William Wragg off the front pages.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,614

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    I was going to comment, the Tory who got the Police to re-investigate SKS should have been fined for wasting Police time.
    That was Ric Holden, who is quite a piece of work. But it took the heat off Boris-Rishi cake gate. It got Big G very excited too!
    Nothing gets me excited - indeed I need to look after my pacemaker

    Mind you on Rayner, it would seem to be a minor story but only if she had not demanded such high standards from conservative politicians, and she and many others in Labour will see increasing scrutiny as they close in on power
    Glad to hear you are taking all of this excitement with calm!

    What truly bemuses me about Raynergate is that the Tories don't understand that the deeper they probe the worse they look.

    Polls show that most voters see politics - and specifically the Tory party / government - as corrupt. Endless scandals over very large amounts of money. Peerages and gongs openly being sold. PPE money accidentally deposited in Tory pockets. So from this position of propriety they have decided to go into bat over £1,500 of alleged CGT which HMRC have already said isn't due. Which reopens the floodgates of people on social media highlighting the real (Tory) scandals.

    I genuinely don't get it. People in glass houses are told not to throw stones. And yet here are the Tories being showered with glass whilst people encourage them to throw more stones.
    You may be right and it is a non story, but turn it round and Labour would be having a field day

    It is called politics
    Not just Labour, *everyone* is having a field day about genuine real verified Tory corruption. For massive sums of money. Dodgy donors, dodgy contracts, dodgy peerages. Go ask normals what exercises them - it isn't Rayner.

    This is my point. If Tories want to focus on Rayner thats fine, as long as you're comfortable with the spotlight on the vastly worse Tory scandals.
    I am not a member of the conservative party and am politically homeless

    I am comfortable with the spotlight on conservative scandals and justice being achieved

    Rayner is likely a non story but I would not be surprised if Starmer hopes it is a story so he and Reeves can remain on the centre ground and not turned left by Rayner
    This wasn't specifically about you. But as you touched on it my view is that you're not a Tory member. But you do project the Tory propaganda. Exclusively. You may not vote for them, but you remain travelling in their direction. Happy to be corrected, but you can't just say it isn't true, you need to stop focusing on these pitiful Tory attempts to deflect.

    There are some genuine serious outrageous scandals out there, happening right now. Raynergate is not one of them, just as Beergate was also not one of them.
    I am firmly a one nation conservative and frankly have few issues with Sunak and Hunt other than they are not politicians

    There are some shocking outrages out there including Mone and Starmer needs to deal with them

    Whilst I do not fear Starmer I do not trust him once elected not to be taken down a left wing agenda so I will not vote Labour until he proves he is a one nation fiscal conservative leader

    Mind you in Wales labour will win a whitewash no matter what I do
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,146

    Taz said:

    ...

    ...

    I have just returned from hospital and seen Greater Manchester police are investigating Rayner over her registration for election purposes

    I couldn't understand why it was said they were investigating her CGT liabilities as that is a HMRC matter so at least we now know why the police are involved

    I have no idea how this will pan out but at least it should be resolved one way or another

    Fantastic work by James Daly! This would be a massive scalp for the Conservatives. There could be a custodial sentence at the end of this rainbow. It's about time, with all the political corruption that has gone on over the last 5 years!
    Broken, sleazy Labour on the slide!
    There is a magnificent irony if Rayner ends up in Holloway whilst Johnson's PPE friends can enjoy their ill gotten gains.
    Michelle Mone still seems to have plenty of questions to answer. I hope it’s not been swept under the carpet.
    A Chancellor with allegedly seven properties exempt of duty, a health secretary whose sister allegedly made PPE cash, a PM whose wife allegedly operated as a non-dom, a Foreign Secretary allegedly lobbying Government for Rex Greensill.

    To be honest I feel for Michelle. The Tory public schoolboy brethren throw some Glaswegian tenament dweller to the dogs. One rule for them etc...
    How very dare you, a long time since Michelle bided in a tenement. She claimed her Glasgow house was once lived in by Einstein, that's more her millieu.
  • PhilPhil Posts: 2,335

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    Unleaded moved to E10 a couple of years ago.
    Ethanol in petrol really is one of those bits of pointless green crap that Cameron actually should have ditched.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145
    Carnyx said:

    Tres said:

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    Indeed. If Rayner has broken electoral registration law, which has yet to be determined, it wouldn’t pass a threshold for prosecution as far as I can see from reading about the case. This is all just weak sauce.

    Rishi Sunak has twice been fined by the police for breaking the law and he didn’t resign. The idea that this is a resigning matter for Rayner… I’m not remotely convinced.
    It seems spurious to me. Does your main residence for electoral purposes have to be the same as your main residence for tax purposes?
    no
    There is not even a main residence for electoral purposes. It is perfectly acceptable to be registered in multiple places as long as you only vote once (in national and London elections, others you can vote more than once). You can be registered places other than your main home as long as you have a reasonable connection to the property.

    Unless she has voted twice, which afaik no one has even suggested, it is a complete non issue and utter waste of police time.
    So this is about her address for her own vote?? Not address as a candidate?? I had assumed the latter.

    Bloody hell, I hope Labour make all MPs' tax and wealth records open access once they get in.
    She wasnt a candidate until two months after the house sale afaik.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890

    Carnyx said:

    Tres said:

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    Indeed. If Rayner has broken electoral registration law, which has yet to be determined, it wouldn’t pass a threshold for prosecution as far as I can see from reading about the case. This is all just weak sauce.

    Rishi Sunak has twice been fined by the police for breaking the law and he didn’t resign. The idea that this is a resigning matter for Rayner… I’m not remotely convinced.
    It seems spurious to me. Does your main residence for electoral purposes have to be the same as your main residence for tax purposes?
    no
    There is not even a main residence for electoral purposes. It is perfectly acceptable to be registered in multiple places as long as you only vote once (in national and London elections, others you can vote more than once). You can be registered places other than your main home as long as you have a reasonable connection to the property.

    Unless she has voted twice, which afaik no one has even suggested, it is a complete non issue and utter waste of police time.
    So this is about her address for her own vote?? Not address as a candidate?? I had assumed the latter.

    Bloody hell, I hope Labour make all MPs' tax and wealth records open access once they get in.
    As far as I am aware, the complaint is before she was an MP so it’s alleged she voted in the wrong place or was registered to vote in the wrong place.
    Reading any blog other than a Conservative one, the vitriol is aimed at Conservative corruption and there seems to be empathy with Rayner. Even if James Daly gets his scalp the notion of the finger pointer pointing three fingers at themselves seems apt.

  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,668
    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world

    Yep, I was surprised. I just assumed the upward rise was still happening. But we may have reached the point where London is too widely unaffordable for prices to keep on going up. That flat was, I think, £450,000. You'd need an income of at least £100,000 a year plus a hefty deposit to afford it. There just aren't enough people out there who can, let alone pay more.

  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145
    Phil said:

    DavidL said:

    The legal fiction should be followed so long as it doesn't violate safeguarding.

    Competitive sport for instance, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    Similarly rape centres etc, even if someone has a certificate, they're not a member of the female sex.

    The GRA may need amending to reflect that in my view, if its too broadbrush, but it seems a reasonable compromise.

    Treat anyone with a certificate as their new sex, unless it matters for safeguarding reasons (and single sex sport for instance I'd count as a safeguarding reason).

    On sports, I think it's best left to the individual bodies.

    To take a silly example, I can't believe anyone would have an issue with a trans woman competing in female chess?
    I can't see a reason to have single sex chess.

    But if single sex chess exists, then it should remain single sex.
    Then where should trans people go?
    E4
    E5
    Unleaded moved to E10 a couple of years ago.
    Ethanol in petrol really is one of those bits of pointless green crap that Cameron actually should have ditched.
    Saves a trip to the pub for me.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    edited April 12

    Taz said:

    ...

    ...

    I have just returned from hospital and seen Greater Manchester police are investigating Rayner over her registration for election purposes

    I couldn't understand why it was said they were investigating her CGT liabilities as that is a HMRC matter so at least we now know why the police are involved

    I have no idea how this will pan out but at least it should be resolved one way or another

    Fantastic work by James Daly! This would be a massive scalp for the Conservatives. There could be a custodial sentence at the end of this rainbow. It's about time, with all the political corruption that has gone on over the last 5 years!
    Broken, sleazy Labour on the slide!
    There is a magnificent irony if Rayner ends up in Holloway whilst Johnson's PPE friends can enjoy their ill gotten gains.
    Michelle Mone still seems to have plenty of questions to answer. I hope it’s not been swept under the carpet.
    A Chancellor with allegedly seven properties exempt of duty, a health secretary whose sister allegedly made PPE cash, a PM whose wife allegedly operated as a non-dom, a Foreign Secretary allegedly lobbying Government for Rex Greensill.

    To be honest I feel for Michelle. The Tory public schoolboy brethren throw some Glaswegian tenament dweller to the dogs. One rule for them etc...
    How very dare you, a long time since Michelle bided in a tenement. She claimed her Glasgow house was once lived in by Einstein, that's more her millieu.
    TBF that was a later house, not the family seat in a single end. But she got very upset when the National begged to differ re old Albert.

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/entertainment/celebrity/video-michelle-mone-takes-cameras-2851734
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    I was going to comment, the Tory who got the Police to re-investigate SKS should have been fined for wasting Police time.
    That was Ric Holden, who is quite a piece of work. But it took the heat off Boris-Rishi cake gate. It got Big G very excited too!
    Nothing gets me excited - indeed I need to look after my pacemaker

    Mind you on Rayner, it would seem to be a minor story but only if she had not demanded such high standards from conservative politicians, and she and many others in Labour will see increasing scrutiny as they close in on power
    Glad to hear you are taking all of this excitement with calm!

    What truly bemuses me about Raynergate is that the Tories don't understand that the deeper they probe the worse they look.

    Polls show that most voters see politics - and specifically the Tory party / government - as corrupt. Endless scandals over very large amounts of money. Peerages and gongs openly being sold. PPE money accidentally deposited in Tory pockets. So from this position of propriety they have decided to go into bat over £1,500 of alleged CGT which HMRC have already said isn't due. Which reopens the floodgates of people on social media highlighting the real (Tory) scandals.

    I genuinely don't get it. People in glass houses are told not to throw stones. And yet here are the Tories being showered with glass whilst people encourage them to throw more stones.
    You may be right and it is a non story, but turn it round and Labour would be having a field day

    It is called politics
    Not just Labour, *everyone* is having a field day about genuine real verified Tory corruption. For massive sums of money. Dodgy donors, dodgy contracts, dodgy peerages. Go ask normals what exercises them - it isn't Rayner.

    This is my point. If Tories want to focus on Rayner thats fine, as long as you're comfortable with the spotlight on the vastly worse Tory scandals.
    There is the suggestion Rayner is being used to keep William Wragg off the front pages.
    If its to keep certain photos off the front pages, I shall happily switch to lock her up.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890
    Point of order. I thought GMP had announced last month that a DSI had been allocated to the Rayner case. Is this a second investigation or a scaling up of the first?
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    Leon said:

    Going back to property prices, a very quick check suggests Parisian apartments are almost twice as expensive as London equivalents

    That’s a massive gap. It surely cannot last, either Paris will go down or London will go up

    I would have thought there was more price interaction between each city and others within their respective economic zone albeit that said cities might be less proximate than London and Paris are to each other. It’s equally likely the gap will widen as narrow especially given the factors impacting the respective pricings are not particularly interlinked.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145
    edited April 12

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world

    Yep, I was surprised. I just assumed the upward rise was still happening. But we may have reached the point where London is too widely unaffordable for prices to keep on going up. That flat was, I think, £450,000. You'd need an income of at least £100,000 a year plus a hefty deposit to afford it. There just aren't enough people out there who can, let alone pay more.

    Too expensive, wfh, leasehould, end of help to buy (i.e. ramp up prices with public funds), other once undesirable neighbourhoods rapidly catching up and often better suited for young families all playing a part.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,046
    kjh said:

    @Leon I didn't see your final post last night to me until today. Thank you (I think). It was rather sweet. I think it was a compliment but I'm not sure. Quote: 'I'm actually quite fond of you in a "fond of Radio 4 comedy" kind of way, I hope that is returned'. As I do like Radio 4 comedies and, in particular, you hoped it was returned, I'm interpreting it as such.

    I hope I am correct. It was a bit cryptic.

    Phew. Just when we thought that the trans debate is getting heated on here we can at least all agree that Radio 4 comedy, that infamous 6.30pm slot in particular, is not comedy as anyone sane would recognise it.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,472
    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,668

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world

    Yep, I was surprised. I just assumed the upward rise was still happening. But we may have reached the point where London is too widely unaffordable for prices to keep on going up. That flat was, I think, £450,000. You'd need an income of at least £100,000 a year plus a hefty deposit to afford it. There just aren't enough people out there who can, let alone pay more.

    Too expensive, wfh, leasehould, end of help to buy (i.e. ramp up prices with public funds), other once undesirable neighbourhoods rapidly catching up and often better suited for young families all playing a part.

    Yep, leaseholds are now also seen as very problematic. My first flat (two bedroom garden place in Archway for £60,000 (!!!!)) came with 89 years left on a lease. You'd be mad to go near one like that now - and that's before you factor in the extortionate service charges.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,109

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world

    Yep, I was surprised. I just assumed the upward rise was still happening. But we may have reached the point where London is too widely unaffordable for prices to keep on going up. That flat was, I think, £450,000. You'd need an income of at least £100,000 a year plus a hefty deposit to afford it. There just aren't enough people out there who can, let alone pay more.

    That's a bingo.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890
    ...
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,167
    Irony:

    LONGHORN
    Darren James (address in Cumberland) Yorkshire Party
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417

    Carnyx said:

    Tres said:

    kjh said:

    I have no idea about the Rayner case, but one thing I am aware of (having been involved in an election case [as a witness I hasten to add for the prosecution]) is that the police are fed up to the back teeth of people being reported to them for petty stuff for electioneering purposes. This has the consequence that when something is serious it often gets ignored by the police (at least initially) as being 'not this crap again'.

    My view is the police should start charging people with wasting police time to get rid of the dross that is thrown at them by all parties particularly at election time such that when a proper election offence is committed it is not lost in the dross.

    I would also like to add that the election laws need updating. They are a mess. Not enough time to list out here.

    Indeed. If Rayner has broken electoral registration law, which has yet to be determined, it wouldn’t pass a threshold for prosecution as far as I can see from reading about the case. This is all just weak sauce.

    Rishi Sunak has twice been fined by the police for breaking the law and he didn’t resign. The idea that this is a resigning matter for Rayner… I’m not remotely convinced.
    It seems spurious to me. Does your main residence for electoral purposes have to be the same as your main residence for tax purposes?
    no
    There is not even a main residence for electoral purposes. It is perfectly acceptable to be registered in multiple places as long as you only vote once (in national and London elections, others you can vote more than once). You can be registered places other than your main home as long as you have a reasonable connection to the property.

    Unless she has voted twice, which afaik no one has even suggested, it is a complete non issue and utter waste of police time.
    So this is about her address for her own vote?? Not address as a candidate?? I had assumed the latter.

    Bloody hell, I hope Labour make all MPs' tax and wealth records open access once they get in.
    She wasnt a candidate until two months after the house sale afaik.
    According to Patrick Maguire on Times Radio, the allegation does concern the home declared when Rayner stood for election (and parenthetically, this does seem to support Rayner's claim on the CGT story).

    Angela Rayner under police investigation | Patrick Maguire
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JOu1yfFXuQ
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,231

    kinabalu said:

    Cyclefree said:

    I

    FPT

    @StillWaters in response to your point on the other thread that when people have medically transitioned they are not really women. That is the position of JK Rowling and Kathleen Stock.

    Its a perfectly respectable position.

    Rowling, Stock, Cyclefree etc are real women, they were born women, they are women.

    A man who transitions to "become" a woman may be a transwoman but they're not a real woman. They'll never be.

    That's not dehumanising. They're a real human. For all intents and purposes, unless it violates safeguarding, they can be treated as women, but the distinction still needs to exist.

    Competitive female sport for example should belong to real women. A transwoman should never be entitled to play in
    While the substance of what you say is correct, I would use the term "sex" rather than "real woman" because that could be used by some in a way which is insulting. And, having seen the insults hurled at women (including me - and by some on this forum) I think it best to try and avoid this.

    A man can never - even with surgery - become a member of the female sex. And since sex is relevant in so many situations - sport, safeguarding etc - a transitioned man has to be regarded as a member of the male sex. But for social purposes - like @Leon's friend, Julia - there is no reason why he can't live, dress, call himself however he wants etc. How his friends and family respond is up to them but it is not a matter of compulsion. You cannot force others to share your own views about yourself and it is the height of narcissism to think that you can or should.

    Gender to me is no different to a soul. It is some undefinable essence that some people believe in and others don't. Far too much of what people call "gender" seems to me to be no more than stereotypes and it is bizarre to me that so many on the gender side seem so intent on reinforcing very old-fashioned stereotypes.

    But I do not believe in gender. I am of the female sex. Discrimination has happened to me because of my sex. Sexual assault has happened to me because of my sex. It happens to every woman because of her sex. My health, how my body develops and ages is affected by my sex.There is no getting away from that. Women cannot identify out of their sex. If we could we'd all be earning 40% more and having our bullshit treated with undeserved respect.

    Men are of the male sex - and since sex matters in so many situations - there are very good reasons why separation on the basis of sex has to happen in those situations. And why clear language about sex matters. It is absurd that anyone thinks otherwise.

    And - let me absolutely blunt here - any man who seeks to breach a woman's boundaries against her consent, whatever his reasons, is a predator, has the mentality of a predator. It is a giant red flag. "No means no" and, no, women do not have to justify this.

    The vast majority of men claiming to be women do not make surgical or hormonal changes. They are men - whatever they wear - because - and does this really need saying again? - womanhood is a reality not a costume.

    As for Rowling she has put her money where her mouth is and financed a female only rape refuge in Edinburgh - Beira Place - after the utterly disgraceful behaviour by Rape Crisis and its cheating boss.
    If you don't believe in gender it surely follows that you don't believe that changing it, surgery or not, seld-id or not, is valid or meaningful. But we have provided, with the GRA, a route for a person to do this and for it to be legally recognised. How to square that?
    There's a bit of sleight of hand at play.

    First people insist that gender and sex are two completely different concepts, and so, of course, one can change your gender because gender is a social construct and has nothing to do with sex.

    But, then, these same people, then conflate gender with sex and insist that a change of gender must be treated exactly as a change in sex, with all that entails in terms of prisons, sex-based safeguarding and equality law, etc.

    So which is it? Are gender and sex two different things, and a person can have a legally-recognised gender that is different to their sex, and it is legitimate to settle some things in society on the basis of sex rather than gender? Or are the two different words for the same thing, and if someone has changed their gender they must be treated as having changed their sex, in all ways?
    Good post. The first has stealthily been parlayed into the second. 'I am going to identify as a woman' becomes 'I AM female', and this is the point at which people with at least a toe-hold on reality wake up and squeal foul.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    I would like to understand why police will investigate a non crime, almost historic, maliciously reported by an MP but are often too busy to investigate car thefts, rapes and assaults?

    HMRC deal with tax, the electoral stuff is just nonsense. Think of students, they can register at term address, home address or both.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,668

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    Even if she did put the wrong address down a decade ago are they really going to prosecute? There would have to be proof of fraud to make that justifiable. I don't think there's any suggestion of that at this stage, is there?

  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,058

    Taz said:

    ...

    ...

    I have just returned from hospital and seen Greater Manchester police are investigating Rayner over her registration for election purposes

    I couldn't understand why it was said they were investigating her CGT liabilities as that is a HMRC matter so at least we now know why the police are involved

    I have no idea how this will pan out but at least it should be resolved one way or another

    Fantastic work by James Daly! This would be a massive scalp for the Conservatives. There could be a custodial sentence at the end of this rainbow. It's about time, with all the political corruption that has gone on over the last 5 years!
    Broken, sleazy Labour on the slide!
    There is a magnificent irony if Rayner ends up in Holloway whilst Johnson's PPE friends can enjoy their ill gotten gains.
    Michelle Mone still seems to have plenty of questions to answer. I hope it’s not been swept under the carpet.
    A Chancellor with allegedly seven properties exempt of duty, a health secretary whose sister allegedly made PPE cash, a PM whose wife allegedly operated as a non-dom, a Foreign Secretary allegedly lobbying Government for Rex Greensill.

    To be honest I feel for Michelle. The Tory public schoolboy brethren throw some Glaswegian tenament dweller to the dogs. One rule for them etc...
    How very dare you, a long time since Michelle bided in a tenement. She claimed her Glasgow house was once lived in by Einstein, that's more her millieu.
    Another of her lies. She lived in 6 Park Circus, Glasgow. When Einstein visited Glasgow in 1933, he was hosted by Archibald Young, who was Professor of Surgery at Glasgow University, at his home in 5 Park Circus.
  • I think it says a lot that the Police will investigate an alleged crime from a decade ago but won’t even come round with CCTV evidence showing a bike being stolen.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,240
    edited April 12

    Sir Keir Starmas was investigated because the Tories got annoyed and got the Police to open one. They thought they'd played a masterstroke until as usual, he took them to the cleaners with his "I will resign" speech. He outplayed and outgunned them at every turn.

    Frankly if Rayner is that sure she is innocent, in hindsight she should have said "I am innocent, if I am found guilty I will resign" and put the issue to bed.

    Two things are being conflated usefully for Rayner's enemies: whether Rayner is liable for an unpaid CGT bill; whether she registered the wrong residence on the electoral register.

    The issue is irrelevant for CGT because you can choose whichever residence you want or not choose in which case the tax will be applied to one of them.

    The issue for the electoral roll probably isn't that she was registered at the first property. It is that she might need to be registered at the second one.

    I think it would hard to claim fraud on the second point. Rayner should be clear I think.
  • sladeslade Posts: 2,080

    Independence wins Inverness South!

    Sorry, that should be Independent.



    13.5% SNP -> LibDem swing

    Independence wins Inverness South!

    Sorry, that should be Independent.



    13.5% SNP -> LibDem swing
    Don't we love Scottish local by-elections. There is a big swing from SNP to Lib Dem but it ends up as a Lib Dem loss. Note that the Ind winner was called Duncan Cameron McDonald (the gathering of the clans?) while the Lib Dem was Jonathon Chartier.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,046

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    Even if she did put the wrong address down a decade ago are they really going to prosecute? There would have to be proof of fraud to make that justifiable. I don't think there's any suggestion of that at this stage, is there?

    Aren't there two issues here:

    tax due/not due = HMRC no prosecution
    electoral fraud = plod potential prosecution

    I have no idea what the electoral fraud allegations consist of in terms of what she said and where she said she was to do what.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145

    I think it says a lot that the Police will investigate an alleged crime from a decade ago but won’t even come round with CCTV evidence showing a bike being stolen.

    I bet they would come round if an MPs bike was stolen. And it would be a DCI or higher not a PCSO.
  • FF43 said:

    Sir Keir Starmas was investigated because the Tories got annoyed and got the Police to open one. They thought they'd played a masterstroke until as usual, he took them to the cleaners with his "I will resign" speech. He outplayed and outgunned them at every turn.

    Frankly if Rayner is that sure she is innocent, in hindsight she should have said "I am innocent, if I am found guilty I will resign" and put the issue to bed.

    Two things are being conflated usefully for Rayner's enemies: whether Rayner is liable for an unpaid CGT bill; whether she registered the wrong residence on the electoral register.

    The issue is irrelevant for CGT because you can choose whichever residence you want or not choose in which case the tax will be applied to one of them.

    The issue for the electoral roll probably isn't that she was registered at the first property. It is that she might need to be registered at the second one.
    I thought the allegation was that she voted at the wrong one? Is not being registered at one and voting at the one you’re registered at fraud?
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    slade said:

    Independence wins Inverness South!

    Sorry, that should be Independent.



    13.5% SNP -> LibDem swing

    Independence wins Inverness South!

    Sorry, that should be Independent.



    13.5% SNP -> LibDem swing
    Don't we love Scottish local by-elections. There is a big swing from SNP to Lib Dem but it ends up as a Lib Dem loss. Note that the Ind winner was called Duncan Cameron McDonald (the gathering of the clans?) while the Lib Dem was Jonathon Chartier.
    Wrong part of Scotland for Camerons or Macdonalds, though. Now if he had been a Fraser or Mackenzie ...
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,766

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,240

    FF43 said:

    Sir Keir Starmas was investigated because the Tories got annoyed and got the Police to open one. They thought they'd played a masterstroke until as usual, he took them to the cleaners with his "I will resign" speech. He outplayed and outgunned them at every turn.

    Frankly if Rayner is that sure she is innocent, in hindsight she should have said "I am innocent, if I am found guilty I will resign" and put the issue to bed.

    Two things are being conflated usefully for Rayner's enemies: whether Rayner is liable for an unpaid CGT bill; whether she registered the wrong residence on the electoral register.

    The issue is irrelevant for CGT because you can choose whichever residence you want or not choose in which case the tax will be applied to one of them.

    The issue for the electoral roll probably isn't that she was registered at the first property. It is that she might need to be registered at the second one.
    I thought the allegation was that she voted at the wrong one? Is not being registered at one and voting at the one you’re registered at fraud?
    How can you vote at a constituency where you're not on the electoral register?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997

    I think it says a lot that the Police will investigate an alleged crime from a decade ago but won’t even come round with CCTV evidence showing a bike being stolen.

    Wait until you hear how much time they spent investigating a birthday cake in Downing St.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    edited April 12
    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Oddly enough I was watching this video last night about a flight in one of those planes owned and operated by that hybrid of CrabAir and some sort of civilian charter business I can't make sense of. It's not obvious to me that civilian airline pilots normally have assault rifles and flak jackets in the cockpit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl-Fl66Jfao
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world

    Yep, I was surprised. I just assumed the upward rise was still happening. But we may have reached the point where London is too widely unaffordable for prices to keep on going up. That flat was, I think, £450,000. You'd need an income of at least £100,000 a year plus a hefty deposit to afford it. There just aren't enough people out there who can, let alone pay more.

    Too expensive, wfh, leasehould, end of help to buy (i.e. ramp up prices with public funds), other once undesirable neighbourhoods rapidly catching up and often better suited for young families all playing a part.

    Yep, leaseholds are now also seen as very problematic. My first flat (two bedroom garden place in Archway for £60,000 (!!!!)) came with 89 years left on a lease. You'd be mad to go near one like that now - and that's before you factor in the extortionate service charges.

    However, London - for all its problems - is still a compelling city, on a par with Paris and NYC. Incredible culture, architecture, history, parks all that (and English speaking). This hasn't changed. If you are a foreigner and you want to live in a world city you can live in central Paris in a two bed Haussman apartment for £1m or in London in a Georgian townhouse in Hampstead for £600,000. That's a massive and surprising gap
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963
    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    What Kigali Express? Remember the barriers:
    1. We don't catch all the boats
    2. We have nowhere to securely intern all the people from the boats
    3. We don't have the Home Office staff to process their claims
    4. We don't have courts capacity to hold the hearings to declare them illegal

    Only then do we get to the Kigali Express which in itself fails because
    6. Rwanda has sold the accommodation built to house refugees
    7. Rwanda only built for - and said it would only ever take - a few hundred

    Starmer won't need to stop something that isn't happening.
  • Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Or if he does can it, it will then be brought back before long.

    That's what happened in Australia. Now this scheme is the settled will of both parties.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,360
    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Happy to take that bet. No way will SKS keep sending people to Rwanda.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,046
    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,360

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    I would like to understand why police will investigate a non crime, almost historic, maliciously reported by an MP but are often too busy to investigate car thefts, rapes and assaults?

    HMRC deal with tax, the electoral stuff is just nonsense. Think of students, they can register at term address, home address or both.
    Pretty worrying to see them being politicised like this to be honest. Another small chisel in the wall of our democracy.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,792
    ....
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,360
    TOPPING said:

    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.

    Plain clothes policeman/woman walking around hotspots, phone with a tracker, try to wrap up the whole gang.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890

    I think it says a lot that the Police will investigate an alleged crime from a decade ago but won’t even come round with CCTV evidence showing a bike being stolen.

    Or Johnson and his Abba Karaoke work event.
  • rkrkrk said:

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    I would like to understand why police will investigate a non crime, almost historic, maliciously reported by an MP but are often too busy to investigate car thefts, rapes and assaults?

    HMRC deal with tax, the electoral stuff is just nonsense. Think of students, they can register at term address, home address or both.
    Pretty worrying to see them being politicised like this to be honest. Another small chisel in the wall of our democracy.
    Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember you saying the same during Partygate.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145

    Leon said:

    NEW: London's suburbs can accommodate 900,000 new homes

    This groundbreaking report from
    @russellcurtis
    confirms what many of us already knew:

    We can - and should - be building more in London.

    https://x.com/PricedOutUK/status/1777270105497329868

    so whats stopping you ?
    Probably about £200-300bn? Same as most of us.
    London house prices are bad, but if someone is quoting you £200-300bn for a house, I would suggest changing your estate agent.

    This is a variation on the classic "Brownfield Sites" skit. As in, if every brownfield site had a tower block on it, then we don't need to build anything else.

    It's avoidance of the issue of building anything on a nice green field.
    This is not so true any more. London prices have, in general, either flatlined or actually declined for years

    It’s getting to the stage where you could almost call them ‘cheap’, in terms of living in a great world city. eg the other day @SouthamObserver was surprised at how LITTLE you would have to pay for a nice two bed in Hampstead, which must be one of the most desirable urban districts in the world

    Yep, I was surprised. I just assumed the upward rise was still happening. But we may have reached the point where London is too widely unaffordable for prices to keep on going up. That flat was, I think, £450,000. You'd need an income of at least £100,000 a year plus a hefty deposit to afford it. There just aren't enough people out there who can, let alone pay more.

    Too expensive, wfh, leasehould, end of help to buy (i.e. ramp up prices with public funds), other once undesirable neighbourhoods rapidly catching up and often better suited for young families all playing a part.

    Yep, leaseholds are now also seen as very problematic. My first flat (two bedroom garden place in Archway for £60,000 (!!!!)) came with 89 years left on a lease. You'd be mad to go near one like that now - and that's before you factor in the extortionate service charges.

    Its not so much the lease lengths but the service charges and their unpredictability, especially post grenfell. A flat I was renting for 20k per year in 2010 now has service charges of 9k. That would still about a third of the rent now so caps the value for BTLers as well as homeowners paying a mortage and hefty service charge.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    edited April 12
    Carnyx said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Oddly enough I was watching this video last night about a flight in one of those planes owned and operated by that hybrid of CrabAir and some sort of civilian charter business I can't make sense of. It's not obvious to me that civilian airline pilots normally have assault rifles and flak jackets in the cockpit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl-Fl66Jfao
    Military pilots and crew, with civilian training and type ratings on the A330. Used for transporting soldiers, air-to-air refuelling, but also able to be chartered out for civilian use when free. One of them has the flag livery, and is used for VIP travel by ministers and royals.

    It’s a weird video because the report came from an RAF Board of Inquiry, rather than the usual civvy AAIB report, and they look at things from different angles.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    edited April 12

    rkrkrk said:

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    I would like to understand why police will investigate a non crime, almost historic, maliciously reported by an MP but are often too busy to investigate car thefts, rapes and assaults?

    HMRC deal with tax, the electoral stuff is just nonsense. Think of students, they can register at term address, home address or both.
    Pretty worrying to see them being politicised like this to be honest. Another small chisel in the wall of our democracy.
    Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember you saying the same during Partygate.
    ...
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,046

    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    What Kigali Express? Remember the barriers:
    1. We don't catch all the boats
    2. We have nowhere to securely intern all the people from the boats
    3. We don't have the Home Office staff to process their claims
    4. We don't have courts capacity to hold the hearings to declare them illegal

    Only then do we get to the Kigali Express which in itself fails because
    6. Rwanda has sold the accommodation built to house refugees
    7. Rwanda only built for - and said it would only ever take - a few hundred

    Starmer won't need to stop something that isn't happening.
    You only need one person (or planeload) to happen and then it will have become a thing and SKS, just as with defence today, will want to be seen as the guardian of our borders.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963

    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Or if he does can it, it will then be brought back before long.

    That's what happened in Australia. Now this scheme is the settled will of both parties.
    Its just a pity that it isn't the settled will of the Rwandans...
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,145
    edited April 12

    rkrkrk said:

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    I would like to understand why police will investigate a non crime, almost historic, maliciously reported by an MP but are often too busy to investigate car thefts, rapes and assaults?

    HMRC deal with tax, the electoral stuff is just nonsense. Think of students, they can register at term address, home address or both.
    Pretty worrying to see them being politicised like this to be honest. Another small chisel in the wall of our democracy.
    Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember you saying the same during Partygate.
    There were about half a dozen inquiries and investigations going on, each using other ones as a reason to limit scope, avoid or delay reporting, it was absurd. Should have been one civil service inquiry, well actually should have been a simple apology but hey ho.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568
    edited April 12
    TOPPING said:

    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.

    Yes, happened to me in my own street, about 6pm, last year, midsummer. A guy on a bike come from behind me and sailed past, grabbing the phone in one go and cycling speedily away. He did it with astonishing skill, the ratfaced wanker. Luckily my phone was insured, I now insure all my phones - because of this

    It is wearisome. It is the same in all big western cities, you cannot afford to leave your phone lying about on outdoor tables, you cannot walk down a road looking at it without the risk of its being snatched

    When you go to a city where this simply does not happen (generally in east Asia) the feeling of relief is palpable
  • Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    What Kigali Express? Remember the barriers:
    1. We don't catch all the boats
    2. We have nowhere to securely intern all the people from the boats
    3. We don't have the Home Office staff to process their claims
    4. We don't have courts capacity to hold the hearings to declare them illegal

    Only then do we get to the Kigali Express which in itself fails because
    6. Rwanda has sold the accommodation built to house refugees
    7. Rwanda only built for - and said it would only ever take - a few hundred

    Starmer won't need to stop something that isn't happening.
    1 - 4 we don't need to.

    6 is their issue, I'm sure they can find temporary accommodation if need be (which is exactly how we're housing people now currently anyway).
    Can I get a citation on 7, because I think that's bullshit personally.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890
    edited April 12

    rkrkrk said:

    Starmer sounds pretty convinced that Rayner will be cleared of any wrongdoing. If there were a scintilla of doubt, I reckon he'd be more cautious.

    I would like to understand why police will investigate a non crime, almost historic, maliciously reported by an MP but are often too busy to investigate car thefts, rapes and assaults?

    HMRC deal with tax, the electoral stuff is just nonsense. Think of students, they can register at term address, home address or both.
    Pretty worrying to see them being politicised like this to be honest. Another small chisel in the wall of our democracy.
    Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I don't remember you saying the same during Partygate.
    Partygate was an odd investigation, Johnson was not investigated for his most egregious breaches yet Con Spad Interns attending the same events got fines.

    I also feel for the students who got ten grand fines.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    Apparently the PO former boss didn't know they brought prosecutions !

    So it's reached the desperate defense method Boris employed for all the COVID stuff of pleading that the person in charge was effectively a prize bull being led round by helpers and advisers and didn't understand anything themselves.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.

    Yes, happened to me in my own street, about 6pm, last year, midsummer. A guy on a bike come from behind me and sailed past, grabbing the phone in one go and cycling speedily away. He did it with astonishing skill, the ratfaced wanker. Luckily my phone was insured, I now insure all my phones - because of this

    It is wearisome. It is the same in all big western cities, you cannot afford to leave your phone lying about on outdoor tables, you cannot walk down a road looking at it without the risk of its being snatched

    When you go to a city where this simply does not happen (generally in east Asia) the feeling of relief is palpable
    I need to remember next time I’m in London, that one doesn’t leave one’s ipad and wallet on the bar when going for a leak.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,766
    Carnyx said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Oddly enough I was watching this video last night about a flight in one of those planes owned and operated by that hybrid of CrabAir and some sort of civilian charter business I can't make sense of. It's not obvious to me that civilian airline pilots normally have assault rifles and flak jackets in the cockpit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl-Fl66Jfao
    Standard issue on NCL - ACL flights.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177
    .
    kjh said:

    @Leon I didn't see your final post last night to me until today. Thank you (I think). It was rather sweet. I think it was a compliment but I'm not sure. Quote: 'I'm actually quite fond of you in a "fond of Radio 4 comedy" kind of way, I hope that is returned'. As I do like Radio 4 comedies and, in particular, you hoped it was returned, I'm interpreting it as such.

    I hope I am correct. It was a bit cryptic.

    A few are good; some are utterly dire.



    I'm sure he meant the former.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177
    Pulpstar said:

    Apparently the PO former boss didn't know they brought prosecutions !

    So it's reached the desperate defense method Boris employed for all the COVID stuff of pleading that the person in charge was effectively a prize bull being led round by helpers and advisers and didn't understand anything themselves.

    He was only paid a million quid, so you can't expect too much in the way of brains or diligence.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    Sandpit said:

    Carnyx said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Oddly enough I was watching this video last night about a flight in one of those planes owned and operated by that hybrid of CrabAir and some sort of civilian charter business I can't make sense of. It's not obvious to me that civilian airline pilots normally have assault rifles and flak jackets in the cockpit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl-Fl66Jfao
    Military pilots and crew, with civilian training and type ratings on the A330. Used for transporting soldiers, air-to-air refuelling, but also able to be chartered out for civilian use when free. One of them has the flag livery, and is used for VIP travel by ministers and royals.

    It’s a weird video because the report came from an RAF Board of Inquiry, rather than the usual civvy AAIB report, and they look at things from different angles.
    Thanks. And 'different angles' is certainly a good description of the flight!
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568
    Sandpit said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.

    Yes, happened to me in my own street, about 6pm, last year, midsummer. A guy on a bike come from behind me and sailed past, grabbing the phone in one go and cycling speedily away. He did it with astonishing skill, the ratfaced wanker. Luckily my phone was insured, I now insure all my phones - because of this

    It is wearisome. It is the same in all big western cities, you cannot afford to leave your phone lying about on outdoor tables, you cannot walk down a road looking at it without the risk of its being snatched

    When you go to a city where this simply does not happen (generally in east Asia) the feeling of relief is palpable
    I need to remember next time I’m in London, that one doesn’t leave one’s ipad and wallet on the bar when going for a leak.
    It is tiring. You don't get that in the Sandpit or Singapore, you don't even get it in dirtpoor Phnom Penh

    Petty crime, littering, graffiti, shoplifting, drug use, homelessness, migrants rough sleeping - these are afflicting all major western cities I have visited in recent years. I wonder how long the voters will tolerate it before they rebel
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177
    This can't be repeated often enough.

    How Donald Trump Gets Special Treatment in the Legal System
    The former president rails against a “two-tiered system of justice.” But he’s the one benefiting from it.
    https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/04/12/trump-trial-special-treatment-justice-system-00151814

    A good article.
  • kyf_100kyf_100 Posts: 4,951
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.

    Yes, happened to me in my own street, about 6pm, last year, midsummer. A guy on a bike come from behind me and sailed past, grabbing the phone in one go and cycling speedily away. He did it with astonishing skill, the ratfaced wanker. Luckily my phone was insured, I now insure all my phones - because of this

    It is wearisome. It is the same in all big western cities, you cannot afford to leave your phone lying about on outdoor tables, you cannot walk down a road looking at it without the risk of its being snatched

    When you go to a city where this simply does not happen (generally in east Asia) the feeling of relief is palpable
    One thing I noticed in France last year is the sheer number of people on public transport using their phone with a lanyard style case that is physically attached to their clothing or across their shoulders like a crossbody bag.

    I did wonder how long it'd be before that caught on over here.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,109
    a
    Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Apparently the PO former boss didn't know they brought prosecutions !

    So it's reached the desperate defense method Boris employed for all the COVID stuff of pleading that the person in charge was effectively a prize bull being led round by helpers and advisers and didn't understand anything themselves.

    He was only paid a million quid, so you can't expect too much in the way of brains or diligence.
    And that was only one of his jobs, probably. Can't expect someone at his level to actually read documents and things.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,109
    Pulpstar said:

    Apparently the PO former boss didn't know they brought prosecutions !

    So it's reached the desperate defense method Boris employed for all the COVID stuff of pleading that the person in charge was effectively a prize bull being led round by helpers and advisers and didn't understand anything themselves.

    I think the charge against Boris was that he was trying to understand things and getting them wrong.

    The equivalent to this would have been Boris saying that he was unaware that the NHS had ventilators.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 56,568
    kyf_100 said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    While my interest in it does not quite approach Leon AI status nevertheless the London phone snatching phenomenon grows apace. Everywhere you look there are notices warning against it and everyone you speak to has experience of (seeing) it. I have seen it twice in the recent past (1x Piccadilly, 1x Sloane Square).

    The overriding element is how blatant it is, how powerless (to chase after those electric bikes) the victims are, and how dexterous the perps are, swooping in, grabbing, and then racing away.

    Yes, happened to me in my own street, about 6pm, last year, midsummer. A guy on a bike come from behind me and sailed past, grabbing the phone in one go and cycling speedily away. He did it with astonishing skill, the ratfaced wanker. Luckily my phone was insured, I now insure all my phones - because of this

    It is wearisome. It is the same in all big western cities, you cannot afford to leave your phone lying about on outdoor tables, you cannot walk down a road looking at it without the risk of its being snatched

    When you go to a city where this simply does not happen (generally in east Asia) the feeling of relief is palpable
    One thing I noticed in France last year is the sheer number of people on public transport using their phone with a lanyard style case that is physically attached to their clothing or across their shoulders like a crossbody bag.

    I did wonder how long it'd be before that caught on over here.
    That's a damn good idea. I've seen them in the USA but never thought to buy one

    I'm gonna buy one

    Ta!
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,766
    Sandpit said:

    Carnyx said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Good news! Government threatening an MoD contractor to pony up some flights to Kigali

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/apr/12/rwanda-deportation-flights-airtanker-charter-airline-talks

    What the article doesn't explain is that following Rwanda's sale of refugee accommodation, anyone who gets flown to Rwanda will have to live on the plane.

    Once they get to German East Africa, I doubt anyone involved is going to give a fuck where they are or are not living.

    AirTanker is probably the right operator for this caper because those A330s in the surge fleet are starting to age out of viability in the lease market. Also they can make reservists crew them. It does look like somebody who vaguely knows what they are doing is starting to think about this.

    If they do get the Kigali Express running I fully expect SKS won't can it after the GE.
    Oddly enough I was watching this video last night about a flight in one of those planes owned and operated by that hybrid of CrabAir and some sort of civilian charter business I can't make sense of. It's not obvious to me that civilian airline pilots normally have assault rifles and flak jackets in the cockpit.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dl-Fl66Jfao
    Military pilots and crew, with civilian training and type ratings on the A330. Used for transporting soldiers, air-to-air refuelling, but also able to be chartered out for civilian use when free. One of them has the flag livery, and is used for VIP travel by ministers and royals.

    It’s a weird video because the report came from an RAF Board of Inquiry, rather than the usual civvy AAIB report, and they look at things from different angles.
    They very rarely use the Brexit Belle for VVIP movements because the interior fit is fucking horrible. Hence 2 x A321 and 3 x F900 leased and painted in National Front Airlines livery. It's only money.

    There are also weird crew who are AirTanker employees but breveted to FLT rank and given wings despite zero military background much to the existential despair of our chubby friends in light blue. It's probably these fuckers who will be tasked with the Extraordinary Renditions.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,177
    Law enforcement sources say Russia used five Kh-69 missiles to hit the Trypilska power plant; an energy company suggests potential EU-supported rebuilding, but ongoing Russian threats render reconstruction without air defenses "futile."
    https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1778732293756002624

    Stealthed cruise missile.

    You wouldn't need Patriot to shot it down, but you'd need good radar.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,919
    edited April 12
    In principle, I see nothing wrong with Rayner being investigated. Or SKS, or Rishi, or Boris for that matter. People are entitled to take their concerns of wrongdoing to the police, the police are entitled to investigate. There are laws in place that give protection against frivolous and vexatious complaints.

    Now that does not mean the system works exactly as it should and as described above, and I also acknowledge that we sadly live in a society where the police do not investigate every crime. But in principle I have no issue. For what it’s worth I expect nothing will come of it, and if so Rayner is then perfectly entitled to raise whatever grievances she may have about the process or her treatment.
This discussion has been closed.