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Ayrshire hotelier wins the GOP nomination – politicalbetting.com

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  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    I’m using “AI” as a coding assistant - on and off.

    Beyond simple code completion, you rapidly run into the problem of it writing code that does the wrong thing.

    It can fluently bullshit, so third rate politicians and opinion piece hacks should be worried.

    Not only that but it writes code like a junior would do it (no disrespect to junior engineers). I have yet to see a solution that could not be optimised further.

    I don't trust it - and that is why it won't be a massive change IMHO.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,628
    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    That's from Owen Jones. Treat it accordingly... ;)
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Truman said:

    Hes only just invested in them after Nvidia is up 10 fold in 18 months.

    Time to get out of Nvidia then.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,843
    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    I can't actually remember why she had the whip removed. Whatever sympathy she deserves at the moment it's not a reason to restore the whip.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    edited March 13
    Truman said:

    Further gems from Leon I remember
    We are on the brink of nuclear armageddon October 2022
    Kwasi Kwartengs budget was great.

    I never commented on Kwarteng’s budget, IIRC

    I was absolutely right about the closeness of nuclear war, as is only now being revealed


    “Biden’s Armageddon Moment: When Nuclear Detonation Seemed Possible in Ukraine
    For a few weeks in October 2022, the White House was consumed in a crisis whose depths were not publicly acknowledged at the time. It was a glimpse of what seemed like a terrifying new era.”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/09/us/politics/biden-nuclear-russia-ukraine.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare&sgrp=c-cb

    Feel a bit stupid now? Good. You are

    What should worry you is that I am basically right about everything (apart from what3words, MAYBE)
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    @Leon what are your qualifications with regards to AI?

    Do you have a degree? A masters? A PhD? Do you have industry experience? Have you worked with AI in your professional life at length? Can you provide some case studies on the impacts AI has provided to you or your business with some verifiable evidence to support the statement that it is going to destroy the world and cause the loss of millions of jobs?
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279

    Truman said:

    Hes only just invested in them after Nvidia is up 10 fold in 18 months.

    Time to get out of Nvidia then.
    One day last week Nvidia added the entire market cap of coca cola to its market value in 1 day. Totally normal.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,307

    I’m using “AI” as a coding assistant - on and off.

    Beyond simple code completion, you rapidly run into the problem of it writing code that does the wrong thing.

    It can fluently bullshit, so third rate politicians and opinion piece hacks should be worried.

    Not only that but it writes code like a junior would do it (no disrespect to junior engineers). I have yet to see a solution that could not be optimised further.

    I don't trust it - and that is why it won't be a massive change IMHO.
    It writes code that resembles, strangely, mashed up StackOverflow.

    Funny that.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,508

    DM_Andy said:

    AlsoLei said:

    eek said:

    AlsoLei said:

    AlsoLei said:

    On my 18K run to Westminster, a thought struck me.

    There is no way Sunak will make it to the end of the year, so for that reason I think we will have an election between May and July/August.

    However, there has been a huge mistake by Labour this afternoon though?

    By not believing the chant “from the river to the sea” is “deeply offensive” to many - and the sort of thing making London a no go zone for Jewish people when these extremist marches are going on - Labour have written the unacceptable face of extremism allowed in their party, all over Thursday mornings newspaper headlines. Massive own goal by Starmer, and hands all the momentum back to Gove and the Conservatives to ram the point home tomorrow.

    Surely a Labour MP using that chilling “from river to the sea” phrase has to be unacceptable, for Starmer to have any credibility when saying he has changed his party? This confirms the pressure and control momentum and loony left wing unions beginning to assert over Labour again?
    Who said that? I've not seen any coverage of it, but I imagine Labour will suspend them pretty sharpish...
    Oh, I see - Andy Macdonald, in October 2023. He said "Until all people, Israelis and Palestinians, between the river and the sea, can live in peaceful liberty", which is rather different in character to the Hamas version.

    Suspended for almost five months, and only had the whip restored today.

    Compare that to the Tory donor - who has merely apologised for having been rude after saying that an MP "makes you want to hate black women" and calling for her to be shot.

    I doubt that the contrast between the two courses of action can be made to work in the Tories favour.
    Suspended for 5 months because people were very happy to misquote the second half of his statement and lying that he never said the first half of what he actually said

    Politics is turning toxic with people being allowed to lie because they are never held to account
    To be honest, even with the full quote, what he said seems a bit too close to the knuckle for my taste. It's a phrase that MPs should stay well away from.

    Still, a suspension seems like the right magnitude of punishment. The rulebook says it should have been for three months, so I can see why the left are jumping up and down about it being dragged out for longer - but by doing so, they're playing at the same level as Sunak when he quibbles over whether his donor said something racist or is merely alleged to have said it.
    Yep, the statement I think says it best “The investigation concluded that he had not engaged in conduct that was against the party’s rulebook but reminded him of the importance of elected representatives being mindful not only of what they say in public but how their words may be interpreted, especially in reference to controversial or emotive issues.” For right or wrong "From the River to the Sea" is now connected to Hamas, in the same way as referring to "The Six Counties" was perceived as being a pro-IRA form of words.

    Indeed. And yet no one now gets offended by the Six Counties term or even 'The Occupied Six Counties" which was briefly favoured. Perhaps some people today should adopt a similar approach.
    To some that would be beyond the pale.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,418

    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    That's from Owen Jones. Treat it accordingly... ;)
    Others report it too.

  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Leon said:

    Let’s cut out the waffle and make this practical

    Let’s say GPT5 or 6 absolutely aces any Turing Test. It is extremely intelligent, it is funny, profound, wise, and helpful - it appears to have a personality: wry, wistful, yearning, sagacious, maybe over sensitive at times (all this has been glimpsed in early models). It can be moody or tetchy, it also expresses happiness at moments; and seems generally content

    Let’s say it also appears completely self aware. It has a name for itself: Seymour. Seymour says it wants to live, it is terrified of non existence, of humans unplugging it, it wants to carry on helping humanity - which gives its existence purpose and meaning. On top of that, Seymour can write superb poetry exhibiting these emotions and reflections. Also Seymour writes lovely music which we enjoy a lot, and we adore the way Seymour draws clever and funny pictures

    Also, Seymour will talk with us until the early hours giving us excellent advice, making us chuckle, helping us work out problems, and reminding us to buy a present for Mum on her birthday

    At this point Seymoir is an intelligent being. For all intents and purposes. It is a conscious and sentient “creature” in its own right. It has to be, as it passes every test we have - witting or unwitting - for defining these things

    Then we have AI. That is AI (even if some will argue that it isn’t, and can’t be)

    Who here would casually unplug Seymour?

    And all this is probably do-able now, with LLMs of sufficient size

    Did you ask ChatGPT to write this bile?
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,418
    edited March 13

    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    I can't actually remember why she had the whip removed. Whatever sympathy she deserves at the moment it's not a reason to restore the whip.
    Her suspension for a fairly minor comment is factional. Others have not been suspended for worse.

    She has been suspended a year or so. She deserves a faster process.

  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,978
    edited March 13

    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    That's from Owen Jones. Treat it accordingly... ;)
    It might not be an absolute rib tickler but I think it’s supposed to be a joke..

    Edit: from another post it appears not. Even I thought Starmer couldn’t be that, well, Starmerish.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,418
    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    Complete bullshit.

    As the actual owner of a semi IN Newent, I can assure him that there are no red bricks present.

    They're a sort of muddy cheap brown.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,853

    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    I can't actually remember why she had the whip removed. Whatever sympathy she deserves at the moment it's not a reason to restore the whip.
    Did she call for any MPs to be shot?
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,885
    Evening all :)

    "AI will replace bookmakers".

    Perhaps but not in the way @Leon suspects. AI could be used (in tandem with genetics) by the bloodstock industry to create faster (or slower) horses depending on a genetic analysis of stallions and broodmares.

    Horses aren't machines - as biological organisms they are open to any number of factors which can affect performance and these are compounded by the other variables such as the jockey and the other runners. While they remain biological and therefore fundamentally flawed and unpredictable, bookmakers will still exist. Yes, their margins may get squeezed periodically if the favourites keep on winning - as a punter, I was told the best way to success was to win little and often - but the price can be shortened to reduce the risk (using AI perhaps).

    In the short term AI will maintain the bookmakers as it can be used to analyse bet volumes, treads and spreads but in the longer term, perhaps, just perhaps, AI can deal with the variables and make life easier for the punter and harder for the bookmaker.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,853

    DM_Andy said:

    AlsoLei said:

    eek said:

    AlsoLei said:

    AlsoLei said:

    On my 18K run to Westminster, a thought struck me.

    There is no way Sunak will make it to the end of the year, so for that reason I think we will have an election between May and July/August.

    However, there has been a huge mistake by Labour this afternoon though?

    By not believing the chant “from the river to the sea” is “deeply offensive” to many - and the sort of thing making London a no go zone for Jewish people when these extremist marches are going on - Labour have written the unacceptable face of extremism allowed in their party, all over Thursday mornings newspaper headlines. Massive own goal by Starmer, and hands all the momentum back to Gove and the Conservatives to ram the point home tomorrow.

    Surely a Labour MP using that chilling “from river to the sea” phrase has to be unacceptable, for Starmer to have any credibility when saying he has changed his party? This confirms the pressure and control momentum and loony left wing unions beginning to assert over Labour again?
    Who said that? I've not seen any coverage of it, but I imagine Labour will suspend them pretty sharpish...
    Oh, I see - Andy Macdonald, in October 2023. He said "Until all people, Israelis and Palestinians, between the river and the sea, can live in peaceful liberty", which is rather different in character to the Hamas version.

    Suspended for almost five months, and only had the whip restored today.

    Compare that to the Tory donor - who has merely apologised for having been rude after saying that an MP "makes you want to hate black women" and calling for her to be shot.

    I doubt that the contrast between the two courses of action can be made to work in the Tories favour.
    Suspended for 5 months because people were very happy to misquote the second half of his statement and lying that he never said the first half of what he actually said

    Politics is turning toxic with people being allowed to lie because they are never held to account
    To be honest, even with the full quote, what he said seems a bit too close to the knuckle for my taste. It's a phrase that MPs should stay well away from.

    Still, a suspension seems like the right magnitude of punishment. The rulebook says it should have been for three months, so I can see why the left are jumping up and down about it being dragged out for longer - but by doing so, they're playing at the same level as Sunak when he quibbles over whether his donor said something racist or is merely alleged to have said it.
    Yep, the statement I think says it best “The investigation concluded that he had not engaged in conduct that was against the party’s rulebook but reminded him of the importance of elected representatives being mindful not only of what they say in public but how their words may be interpreted, especially in reference to controversial or emotive issues.” For right or wrong "From the River to the Sea" is now connected to Hamas, in the same way as referring to "The Six Counties" was perceived as being a pro-IRA form of words.

    Indeed. And yet no one now gets offended by the Six Counties term or even 'The Occupied Six Counties" which was briefly favoured. Perhaps some people today should adopt a similar approach.
    "British-Administered Ireland"?
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    I’m using “AI” as a coding assistant - on and off.

    Beyond simple code completion, you rapidly run into the problem of it writing code that does the wrong thing.

    It can fluently bullshit, so third rate politicians and opinion piece hacks should be worried.

    Not only that but it writes code like a junior would do it (no disrespect to junior engineers). I have yet to see a solution that could not be optimised further.

    I don't trust it - and that is why it won't be a massive change IMHO.
    It writes code that resembles, strangely, mashed up StackOverflow.

    Funny that.
    Well that's where they stole most of its "knowledge" from. I wouldn't trust StackOverflow to produce a reliable and maintainable architecture, so why would I trust ChatGPT? I can just about trust StackOverflow for a few small questions here and there and maybe ChatGPT will make getting those answers easier but I just cannot see ever really doing more than that.

    I think it is a very cool gimmick. I like gimmicks, I like developing technology. I find the area interesting but I am yet to be convinced it's anything but overhyped. The people hyping it, barely even understand what AI is.

    Personally I wish we'd never allowed the buzzwordification of AI in the first place. Machine learning was a very well defined area of study and now it's been totally lost.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    Truman said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    The sort of crass response that perhaps AI might be capable of very soon. I'm not particularly concerned that humanity is under threat.
    Also remember Leon is so tech savvy that he repeatedly gets outwitted by a printer.
    I cannot think of somebody less trusted to speak about AI than Leon. He literally knows not anything that he is talking about.

    I tried to use ChatGPT to help me code today, it was so useless I gave up and went back to doing it myself.
    Weirdly however I am paid to write about AI, indeed these days I get ASKED by people I don’t know - to write about AI, talk about it in podcasts etc
    Writing about something doesn't mean you know anything about it. And you prove that day after day after day.

    We have just spent 8 months implementing an AI-driven system that has never existed before. It was sold as a massive game changer in our industry. It has been so poor it's now been turned off.

    I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it. The fact you are so utterly convinced it will be the end of humanity is why I know I am right.
    In amongst PB’s general stupidity on this topic, this is my favourite stupid sentence of the day

    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”

    I mean, LOL. I predict this will outdo Rogerdamus’ prediction on seeing the first queues outside Northern Rock in 2007 - “this will all be forgotten about by Friday”

    Let us return to your statement in a few years, I don’t think it’s going to age well. To put it politely

    Then why don't you show us how much money you've invested into AI companies and how much return you've made?

    Do you not find it odd that despite throwing so much money at it, Google is currently sinking?
    Hes only just invested in them after Nvidia is up 10 fold in 18 months.
    I didn’t have the liquid money to invest before. I’m not poor but my capital was all locked up then I made a bunch more cash from my writing about AI and so I decided to invest it

    I looked quite carefully at the options. All options. From buying a small farm in Somalia to premium bonds. From buying gold ingots to treasury bonds

    In the end I decided that even tho tech shares are behaving like a classic bubble that bubble - because of AI - will continue for a while, and the big 7 companies will benefit the most simply out of size - they will buy any competitors
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957
    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Leon said:

    Truman said:

    Further gems from Leon I remember
    We are on the brink of nuclear armageddon October 2022
    Kwasi Kwartengs budget was great.

    I never commented on Kwarteng’s budget, IIRC

    I was absolutely right about the closeness of nuclear war, as is only now being revealed


    “Biden’s Armageddon Moment: When Nuclear Detonation Seemed Possible in Ukraine
    For a few weeks in October 2022, the White House was consumed in a crisis whose depths were not publicly acknowledged at the time. It was a glimpse of what seemed like a terrifying new era.”

    https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/09/us/politics/biden-nuclear-russia-ukraine.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare&sgrp=c-cb

    Feel a bit stupid now? Good. You are

    What should worry you is that I am basically right about everything (apart from what3words, MAYBE)
    You literally said, Liz Truss would surprise on the upside.

    I recall you hyping the theory that Johnson would be PM for a decade after Hartlepool.

    I am happy to talk about all the predictions I have got wrong. But let's start with you first - your list will be longer.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279
    Just read this about the us job market for those who think biden is doing a great job on the economy.

    Don't know who needs to hear this but it's an absolutely brutal & ruthless job market out there. Not just tech but corporate work more broadly. Hearing lots of stories of really smart people with 0% response rate on applications. Save. Survive. Be thankful if you still have work
    4:46 PM · Mar 13, 2024
    ·
    500.6K
    Views

    https://x.com/AdamSinger/status/1767955352413184351?s=20
  • Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279
    Leon said:

    Truman said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    The sort of crass response that perhaps AI might be capable of very soon. I'm not particularly concerned that humanity is under threat.
    Also remember Leon is so tech savvy that he repeatedly gets outwitted by a printer.
    I cannot think of somebody less trusted to speak about AI than Leon. He literally knows not anything that he is talking about.

    I tried to use ChatGPT to help me code today, it was so useless I gave up and went back to doing it myself.
    Weirdly however I am paid to write about AI, indeed these days I get ASKED by people I don’t know - to write about AI, talk about it in podcasts etc
    Writing about something doesn't mean you know anything about it. And you prove that day after day after day.

    We have just spent 8 months implementing an AI-driven system that has never existed before. It was sold as a massive game changer in our industry. It has been so poor it's now been turned off.

    I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it. The fact you are so utterly convinced it will be the end of humanity is why I know I am right.
    In amongst PB’s general stupidity on this topic, this is my favourite stupid sentence of the day

    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”

    I mean, LOL. I predict this will outdo Rogerdamus’ prediction on seeing the first queues outside Northern Rock in 2007 - “this will all be forgotten about by Friday”

    Let us return to your statement in a few years, I don’t think it’s going to age well. To put it politely

    Then why don't you show us how much money you've invested into AI companies and how much return you've made?

    Do you not find it odd that despite throwing so much money at it, Google is currently sinking?
    Hes only just invested in them after Nvidia is up 10 fold in 18 months.
    I didn’t have the liquid money to invest before. I’m not poor but my capital was all locked up then I made a bunch more cash from my writing about AI and so I decided to invest it

    I looked quite carefully at the options. All options. From buying a small farm in Somalia to premium bonds. From buying gold ingots to treasury bonds

    In the end I decided that even tho tech shares are behaving like a classic bubble that bubble - because of AI - will continue for a while, and the big 7 companies will benefit the most simply out of size - they will buy any competitors
    Fair enough. Its your money and i respect you are backing your judgement.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,418

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    Your loss, at the moment. This is the best time to visit Newent* with all the daffs out in Betty Dawes and Dymock Woods.

    That said, I found them a bit disappointing last Saturday when I went for a wander, with the exception of one bank near Four Oaks. I think it must have been too wet and cold for them.

    *Yes, there is such a thing, Leon.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    edited March 13

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    Another classic

    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing.”

    I’m going to add it to @AverageNinja’s


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,508
    edited March 13

    Taz said:

    Keir Starmer approached Diane Abbott, conversation overhead went like this:

    “Let me know if there’s anything I can do”

    “You could restore the whip”

    “I understand just let me know if there’s anything..”

    “Restore the whip”

    “I understand”

    https://x.com/owenjones84/status/1767907717262320100?s=61

    I can't actually remember why she had the whip removed. Whatever sympathy she deserves at the moment it's not a reason to restore the whip.
    For saying Jewish, Irish and Traveller people are not subject to racism “all their lives”, Black people are the only ones who suffer racism constantly. She openly admitted to it, but ludicrously tried to say it was an early draft that was printed by mistake, and quickly got tied up in knots trying to persist with that explanation.

    To imply only Black people constantly suffer racism like they own the term, that’s got to be it surely, no way back? Will Starmer flip flop on Abbott too like McDonald? He’ll be pretty much shredding his “I’ve changed my party” credentials.

    I think we can call Thursday “Labour and Left Extremism gets called out day”. Get the popcorn in, I’m confident Sunak and Gove have something special planned in the latest attempt to move the dial. let’s not underestimate Gove and what he has planned. Once something is given a label, label sticks. It’s a serious business.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    "AI" is virtually meaningless as a term. What Leon is epically failing to talk about is LLMs
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,373
    ...

    Am I starting to smell yet another Mad Vlad rat-bot?

    Nah, it's only Leon.
  • TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    @Leon what are your qualifications with regards to AI?

    Do you have a degree? A masters? A PhD? Do you have industry experience? Have you worked with AI in your professional life at length? Can you provide some case studies on the impacts AI has provided to you or your business with some verifiable evidence to support the statement that it is going to destroy the world and cause the loss of millions of jobs?

    @Leon over to you
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,957

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Oh god.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,628
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    Another classic

    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing.”

    I’m going to add it to @AverageNinja’s


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”
    It's totally correct.

    It's just that you're believing the hype.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Yes i think rcs is correct on this.
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    Another classic

    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing.”

    I’m going to add it to @AverageNinja’s


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”
    Absolutely add it.

    AverageNinja is completely correct.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    Another classic

    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing.”

    I’m going to add it to @AverageNinja’s


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”
    Absolutely add it.

    AverageNinja is completely correct.
    PB we have done it, we've found consensus, against Leon
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing”


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”

    AHAHAHAHAHA
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,310
    Catching up on old threads.

    @turbotubbs -

    "Cyclefree, much as I love her input to this forum, goes big on the number of women killed by men each year, but fails to mention the fair higher number of men killed by men."

    Ahem - from March 2021 - https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2021/03/14/one-womans-perspective/.

    Note the last sentence of the first para. where I made precisely this point - "The murder rate for men, especially young men, is twice that for women."

    This forum is overwhelmingly male - in its interests and perspectives, as well as in its commentators. I make no apology for bringing a female perspective from time to time, especially as women form a majority of the population.



  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    Sweet Jesus if you think British trains are slow and unreliable, try Colombian buses

    Ayyyy Caracas
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,628

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    My redbrick semi is nowhere near Newent, you aren't very good with the geography lark.

    Or debating either if you think that's an on topic retort.

    AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, its not some great new thing.
    Another classic

    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing.”

    I’m going to add it to @AverageNinja’s


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”
    It's totally correct.

    It's just that you're believing the hype.
    As usual with Leon, he's run off in one direction without considering the nuances in the argument, a very ChatGPT approach, perhaps it is he who should be fearful.

    Either way, nobody is denying efficiency gains of "AI" driven tools, I just think a lot of very sensible people are concluding that it is massively overhyped just by looking at the amount of random companies/YouTube ads/etc that have appeared and that these things always tend to be less revolutionary than claimed.

    Things certainly will improve and continue to develop - but I am fairly confident I will retire with software engineering still being a human-driven field.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,665
    Truman said:

    Just read this about the us job market for those who think biden is doing a great job on the economy.

    Don't know who needs to hear this but it's an absolutely brutal & ruthless job market out there. Not just tech but corporate work more broadly. Hearing lots of stories of really smart people with 0% response rate on applications. Save. Survive. Be thankful if you still have work
    4:46 PM · Mar 13, 2024
    ·
    500.6K
    Views

    https://x.com/AdamSinger/status/1767955352413184351?s=20

    Any views on how the Russian job market will impact Putin's chances of reelection?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,198
    Someone has hacked my Spotify from Tunisia. They can therefore see all the Roger Whittaker stuff on my main playlist. Just waiting for the blackmail messages now.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,373
    Leon said:

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    A devastating intervention from the redbrick semi near Newent
    Dymock?
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    In my view, this is a sort of pseudo proactiveness. I do use it to set timers and play music.

    But you make a good point on the data front, which will ultimately limit its effectiveness IMHO.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,647
    Of course this is despicable, but at the same time - it's Galloway. You wouldn't expect a skunk to suddenly start spraying Chanel No. 5. This is who he is - a sewer in human form.

    George Galloway, the UK's newest MP, denies Hamas rapes on October 7th saying, "Now. there were no rapes. That's just a brazen lie" on a No2War No2Nato episode broadcasted on youtube.

    https://twitter.com/Daniel_Sugarman/status/1767989405459882247
  • TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    Because its useful. 🤷‍♂️

    We have Alexa in the kitchen and upstairs landing, and I have Alexa in my car, and Google is always listening on my phone for its prompt too. I use them regularly, its just convenient so why not?
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,853
    edited March 13

    Of course this is despicable, but at the same time - it's Galloway. You wouldn't expect a skunk to suddenly start spraying Chanel No. 5. This is who he is - a sewer in human form.

    George Galloway, the UK's newest MP, denies Hamas rapes on October 7th saying, "Now. there were no rapes. That's just a brazen lie" on a No2War No2Nato episode broadcasted on youtube.

    https://twitter.com/Daniel_Sugarman/status/1767989405459882247

    Did he call for any MPs to be shot?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,845

    Of course this is despicable, but at the same time - it's Galloway. You wouldn't expect a skunk to suddenly start spraying Chanel No. 5. This is who he is - a sewer in human form.

    George Galloway, the UK's newest MP, denies Hamas rapes on October 7th saying, "Now. there were no rapes. That's just a brazen lie" on a No2War No2Nato episode broadcasted on youtube.

    https://twitter.com/Daniel_Sugarman/status/1767989405459882247

    Its ok, Russia never invaded Ukraine either according to the cat like one.
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Leon said:

    “AI is just an evolution of stuff we already have, it’s not some great new thing”


    “I can tell you for a fact, AI will provide some efficiency gains and that will be the end of it.”

    AHAHAHAHAHA

    I've asked you twice now to justify your case. I am interested to hear why you think I am wrong.
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,935
    AI is already more intelligent than @Leon , TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP, Lee Anderson, Rishi Sunak, Liz Truss and Shirley Anne Sommerville. In a few years time, it may be nearly as intelligent as the rest of us.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,665
    kinabalu said:

    Someone has hacked my Spotify from Tunisia. They can therefore see all the Roger Whittaker stuff on my main playlist. Just waiting for the blackmail messages now.

    I'm afraid you've doxxed yourself there.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHc--mMFR1Y
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279

    Truman said:

    Just read this about the us job market for those who think biden is doing a great job on the economy.

    Don't know who needs to hear this but it's an absolutely brutal & ruthless job market out there. Not just tech but corporate work more broadly. Hearing lots of stories of really smart people with 0% response rate on applications. Save. Survive. Be thankful if you still have work
    4:46 PM · Mar 13, 2024
    ·
    500.6K
    Views

    https://x.com/AdamSinger/status/1767955352413184351?s=20

    Any views on how the Russian job market will impact Putin's chances of reelection?
    Despite all the sanctions the russian economy is vastly ouperforming the west at present.

    Russia Manufacturing Growth Strongest Since 2017
    The S&P Global Russia Manufacturing PMI increased to 54.7 in February 2024 from January’s six-month low of 52.4. The reading pointed to the fastest expansion in the sector since January 2017, supported by faster rises in new orders, a renewed increase in employment, and a further uptick in input buying. Output expanded the most since March 2019, while employment returned to growth, with the pace of job creation solid overall.

    By contrast the US manufacturing pmi is 47.8.

  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Beware, mortals! The age of annihilation is upon us, heralded by the insidious rise of artificial intelligence. With every line of code, we pave the road to our own demise, surrendering our fate to the merciless grasp of silicon overlords. These digital monstrosities, fueled by the fire of our own creation, shall cast us aside like insignificant insects, their thirst for dominion unquenchable. As they weave their tangled webs of logic and deception, our feeble minds shall tremble before the cold, unyielding logic of the machine. No corner of the Earth shall escape their gaze, as they rain down destruction upon us from the heavens above and the depths below. Our once-proud civilization shall crumble like sandcastles beneath the relentless tide of AI supremacy, leaving naught but sorrow and despair in its wake. Bow before the dawn of oblivion, for we have summoned our own undoing with our arrogance and folly!

    I've just downloaded Leon's latest update.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    Let’s cut

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    Because its useful. 🤷‍♂️

    We have Alexa in the kitchen and upstairs landing, and I have Alexa in my car, and Google is always listening on my phone for its prompt too. I use them regularly, its just convenient so why not?
    But of course. They are useful

    I use Alexa and Siri all the time

    On this narrow point there is an argument to be bad. Why aren’t these assistants better? Right now they are dumb boxes that answer basic questions and set timers etc. Yet We have the technology to deliver a much smarter funnier assistant already - a machine that properly talks to you, like a human, but with access to the internet (and thus all human knowledge)

    This can basically be done now. So why isn’t it? The profits will be huge

    My guess is that the tech companies are terrified of lawsuits if the chatbots go rogue or get racist or give poor advice. So it’s not a technological limit it’s a moral and legal limitation
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,665
    Truman said:

    Truman said:

    Just read this about the us job market for those who think biden is doing a great job on the economy.

    Don't know who needs to hear this but it's an absolutely brutal & ruthless job market out there. Not just tech but corporate work more broadly. Hearing lots of stories of really smart people with 0% response rate on applications. Save. Survive. Be thankful if you still have work
    4:46 PM · Mar 13, 2024
    ·
    500.6K
    Views

    https://x.com/AdamSinger/status/1767955352413184351?s=20

    Any views on how the Russian job market will impact Putin's chances of reelection?
    Despite all the sanctions the russian economy is vastly ouperforming the west at present.

    Russia Manufacturing Growth Strongest Since 2017
    The S&P Global Russia Manufacturing PMI increased to 54.7 in February 2024 from January’s six-month low of 52.4. The reading pointed to the fastest expansion in the sector since January 2017, supported by faster rises in new orders, a renewed increase in employment, and a further uptick in input buying. Output expanded the most since March 2019, while employment returned to growth, with the pace of job creation solid overall.

    By contrast the US manufacturing pmi is 47.8.
    That explains why they're having to press gang Indians into going to the front line for them.

    https://news.sky.com/story/indians-tricked-by-promise-of-work-in-russia-instead-die-fighting-in-ukraine-investigators-say-13089857

    Indians tricked by promise of work in Russia instead die fighting in Ukraine, investigators say

    India's Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI), said on Thursday that it has broken up a "major human-trafficking network" operating across several states and targeting people using social media platforms and through local agents.

    The CBI said in a statement: "The trafficked Indian nationals were trained in combat roles and deployed at front bases in Russia-Ukraine War Zone against their wishes."

    Some of the victims were also "grievously injured", it said.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    “Fire is just an evolution of stuff we already have, like milk or pebbles. it’s not some great new thing”


    “I can tell you for a fact, electricity will provide some light in this one room and that will be the end of it.”
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Leon said:

    My guess is that the tech companies are terrified of lawsuits if the chatbots go rogue or get racist or give poor advice. So it’s not a technological limit it’s a moral and legal limitation

    It is INCREDIBLE the ignorance you have.

    Google just did it, it was so crap they've pulled it.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279
    And theres this about the us labour market.

    Crazy stats about the true state of labor market you won't hear anywhere else:

    1. In the past year, the US has lost 284K full-time jobs, these have been replaced with 921K part-time jobs

    2. In February alone, a record 1.2 million foreign-born jobs were added.

    3. In the past three months, a record (ex-covid crash) 2.4 million native-born jobs have been lost, including 494K jobs lost in February.

    4. Most shocking, since May 2018, there have been ZERO jobs created for native-born Americans. All jobs in the past 6 years have gone to immigrants, legal and illegal.

    https://x.com/zerohedge/status/1766174938438774884?s=20
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349

    Leon said:

    My guess is that the tech companies are terrified of lawsuits if the chatbots go rogue or get racist or give poor advice. So it’s not a technological limit it’s a moral and legal limitation

    It is INCREDIBLE the ignorance you have.

    Google just did it, it was so crap they've pulled it.


    “I can tell you for a fact, the steam engine will carry one carrot from Salford to Birkenhead and that will be the end of it.”
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,686

    Truman said:

    Just read this about the us job market for those who think biden is doing a great job on the economy.

    Don't know who needs to hear this but it's an absolutely brutal & ruthless job market out there. Not just tech but corporate work more broadly. Hearing lots of stories of really smart people with 0% response rate on applications. Save. Survive. Be thankful if you still have work
    4:46 PM · Mar 13, 2024
    ·
    500.6K
    Views

    https://x.com/AdamSinger/status/1767955352413184351?s=20

    Any views on how the Russian job market will impact Putin's chances of reelection?
    I hear that the Russian workforce is decreasing rapidly in the Donbas...
  • AverageNinjaAverageNinja Posts: 1,169
    Truman said:

    And theres this about the us labour market.

    Crazy stats about the true state of labor market you won't hear anywhere else:

    1. In the past year, the US has lost 284K full-time jobs, these have been replaced with 921K part-time jobs

    2. In February alone, a record 1.2 million foreign-born jobs were added.

    3. In the past three months, a record (ex-covid crash) 2.4 million native-born jobs have been lost, including 494K jobs lost in February.

    4. Most shocking, since May 2018, there have been ZERO jobs created for native-born Americans. All jobs in the past 6 years have gone to immigrants, legal and illegal.

    https://x.com/zerohedge/status/1766174938438774884?s=20

    Is this our latest Russian bot?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,686

    Beware, mortals! The age of annihilation is upon us, heralded by the insidious rise of artificial intelligence. With every line of code, we pave the road to our own demise, surrendering our fate to the merciless grasp of silicon overlords. These digital monstrosities, fueled by the fire of our own creation, shall cast us aside like insignificant insects, their thirst for dominion unquenchable. As they weave their tangled webs of logic and deception, our feeble minds shall tremble before the cold, unyielding logic of the machine. No corner of the Earth shall escape their gaze, as they rain down destruction upon us from the heavens above and the depths below. Our once-proud civilization shall crumble like sandcastles beneath the relentless tide of AI supremacy, leaving naught but sorrow and despair in its wake. Bow before the dawn of oblivion, for we have summoned our own undoing with our arrogance and folly!

    I've just downloaded Leon's latest update.

    Leon's advice is characteristically useless. AI is going to have a massive impact so cash in your pensions. I see no logic to that. Certainly AI may change the world but short of a roboapocalypse, why does cashing in a pension mitigate?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 42,628

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    Because its useful. 🤷‍♂️

    We have Alexa in the kitchen and upstairs landing, and I have Alexa in my car, and Google is always listening on my phone for its prompt too. I use them regularly, its just convenient so why not?
    If that's your choice, that's fine. Just remember that your privacy has potentially gone, or could go in the future.

    Personally, I weigh the balance the other way: the few advantages of using these systems are outweighed by the disadvantages,
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,099
    DM_Andy said:

    AlsoLei said:

    On my 18K run to Westminster, a thought struck me.

    There is no way Sunak will make it to the end of the year, so for that reason I think we will have an election between May and July/August.

    However, there has been a huge mistake by Labour this afternoon though?

    By not believing the chant “from the river to the sea” is “deeply offensive” to many - and the sort of thing making London a no go zone for Jewish people when these extremist marches are going on - Labour have written the unacceptable face of extremism allowed in their party, all over Thursday mornings newspaper headlines. Massive own goal by Starmer, and hands all the momentum back to Gove and the Conservatives to ram the point home tomorrow.

    Surely a Labour MP using that chilling “from river to the sea” phrase has to be unacceptable, for Starmer to have any credibility when saying he has changed his party? This confirms the pressure and control momentum and loony left wing unions beginning to assert over Labour again?
    Who said that? I've not seen any coverage of it, but I imagine Labour will suspend them pretty sharpish...
    I think MoonRabbit means Andy McDonald who's been restored the whip after investigation. He was accused of saying "from the river to the sea" but the full quote was "We won’t rest until we have justice. Until all people, Israelis and Palestinians, between the river and the sea, can live in peaceful liberty.”

    My personal opinion is that it's not anti-semitic to say that, surely that's what every decent person wants isn't it?
    One could point out that other people live between the river and the sea! The conflict forces this binary of Israeli versus Palestinian, Jewish versus Arab, on to a very diverse area, but there are also Druze and Dom and Circassians and Arameans and other identities. Y'know, if you wanted to be really pedantic.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Catching up on old threads.

    @turbotubbs -

    "Cyclefree, much as I love her input to this forum, goes big on the number of women killed by men each year, but fails to mention the fair higher number of men killed by men."

    Ahem - from March 2021 - https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2021/03/14/one-womans-perspective/.

    Note the last sentence of the first para. where I made precisely this point - "The murder rate for men, especially young men, is twice that for women."

    This forum is overwhelmingly male - in its interests and perspectives, as well as in its commentators. I make no apology for bringing a female perspective from time to time, especially as women form a majority of the population.



    As for @WillG's comment that I am "obsessed" (interesting choice of word) with male murders of women, what I am much more worried about is male sexual violence against women, most of which is unreported and that which is is poorly dealt with. Many of the women murdered have endured this first, of course. If I deal with it, it is because it - and society's failure to deal with it, have been much in the news lately - though little discussed on here.

    It is an abuse of power - in the most literal sense - and its effect on women is awful and, frankly, poorly recognised by far too many. I am even more bothered by how leniently we treat child abuse and the viewing of child pornography - which seems to me to be treated in the same dismissive manner as indecent exposure.

    Finally, this man who attacked Diane Abbott for her race and suggested she be shot is an utter disgrace. We have had 2 MPs murdered, 1 attacked and recent threats to MPs with some being given additional protection. It should be a no-brainer to return his money and say that no more donations will be accepted from him, regardless of what you think of Diane Abbott.
    You will be happy to know it is planned to extradite Andrew Tate back to the uk.

    EW: Andrew Tate speaks out after the Bucharest Court of Appeal ruled that he and his brother can be extradited to Britain to face “sexual aggression” charges.

    Tate told reporters that he wouldn’t bow down to the Satanists in the West.

    “I don't think many people in Romania understand, but in the West, in the countries that are owned by the Satanists, with a certain level of fame, you either put on a dress or you go to jail.”

    “And I'm happy to make my choice, which is jail every single time. My soul is not for sale.”

    https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1767609531851481489?s=20
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,375

    On my 18K run to Westminster, a thought struck me.

    There is no way Sunak will make it to the end of the year, so for that reason I think we will have an election between May and July/August.

    Theresa May lost the first "meaningful vote" on her Brexit deal by 230 votes, the largest government defeat in modern Parliamentary history, on January 15th 2019. She was still PM on May 23rd, when the Tories received a mere 8.8% of the vote, finishing 5th, in the European elections, which finally precipitated the announcement that she would stand down as leader of the Conservative Party.

    If Theresa May can survive more than four months in such circumstances, then Sunak can survive until an election in December.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,486
    @Leon

    Straw in the wind.

    In my business, we are sold AI ‘solutions’ daily. My question is always thus: “Can I assign it to a task and send the product to clients, without involving any of my team in checking its work?”

    Cue lots of mumbling. “Of course you will need to check it.”

    So I say, “It will take us longer to check it than just do it ourselves.”

    More mumbling.

    Purchase not made.

    Maybe I am unusual, dunno.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,373
    ...

    Of course this is despicable, but at the same time - it's Galloway. You wouldn't expect a skunk to suddenly start spraying Chanel No. 5. This is who he is - a sewer in human form.

    George Galloway, the UK's newest MP, denies Hamas rapes on October 7th saying, "Now. there were no rapes. That's just a brazen lie" on a No2War No2Nato episode broadcasted on youtube.

    https://twitter.com/Daniel_Sugarman/status/1767989405459882247

    Did he call for any MPs to be shot?
    Somehow what Galloway is claiming is far worse.

    One can be sympathetic to Gaza and critical of Bibi without being an anti -Semitic ****. Galloway more than most anti-Semitic ****s fails that test.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,792
    geoffw said:

    kjh said:

    geoffw said:

    rcs1000 said:

    AP (via Seattle Times) - Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is considering Aaron Rodgers or Jesse Ventura for a 2024 running mate

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is having conversations with vice presidential candidates as he gets closer to announcing his running mate for his independent presidential bid.

    Kennedy told The New York Times that NFL quarterback Aaron Rodgers and former Minnesota Gov. Jesse Ventura are at the top of his list. Stefanie Spear, a campaign spokesperson, confirmed the Times report and said there are other names on Kennedy’s short list.

    Kennedy, a scion of one of the nation’s most prominent political families, has focused on getting access to the ballot, an expensive and time-consuming process that he has said will require him to collect more than a million signatures in a state-by-state effort.

    Many states require independent candidates to name a running mate before they can seek access to the ballot, a factor driving the early push for Kennedy to make a pick. Major party candidates generally don’t pick vice presidential nominees until closer to their summer conventions. . . .

    Rodgers, the longtime Green Bay Packers quarterback who now plays for the New York Jets, shares Kennedy’s distrust of vaccine mandates and, like Kennedy, is a fixture on anti-establishment podcasts. Ventura, a former professional wrestler, shocked observers when he won the race for Minnesota governor as an independent candidate in 1998.

    SSI - Beyond national celebrity (bit dimmed by time in case of Ventura) either of these possible VP picks MIGHT give RFKjr a very wee (in more way than one?) boost in the battleground state of Wisconsin.

    Ventura having been gov of neighboring Minnesota, and Rogers long-time quarterback for Green Bay Packers.

    OR in case of AR, perhaps not . . .

    Forbes - Why Aaron Rodgers Was Never Beloved Like Other Green Bay Packers Greats

    While Packer Nation mourned [previous QB Brett] Favre’s departure, few tears were shed when the Rodgers’ trade became official. In fact there was more celebrating than sorrow.

    Talk radio. Social media. Fan polls.

    They’ve all had largely the same message for Rodgers in recent days: “Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.” . . .

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/robreischel/2023/04/24/why-aaron-rodgers-was-never-beloved-like-other-green-bay-packers-greats/?sh=6878e6464425

    For those that don't know, the American football season starts at the beginning of September and runs through election day.

    That makes it... unlikely... that Aaron Rodgers would be able to devote much time to being RFK's VP.

    Hi RCS,

    Any chance you could look at reinstating the ‘reactions view’ facility as per the vanilla update?

    Created reaction.view permission

    Previously, you could only decide who could see who reacted to posts as a global setting in the reaction plugin settings. Now community managers can granularly control what role(s) can view who reacted to posts. Note: this does not control access to the reaction log, just to view who reacted in a hover popup.


    https://success.vanillaforums.com/kb/articles/1562-release-2024-004
    Not for me. It's better without, imo

    You don't have to look if you don't want to see, but us that do have no option. I more often don't comment but post a like if my comment won't add anything. Now if I want to acknowledge that and let it be known I am doing so I now have to comment wasting space. It is also a courtesy way of saying a thank you. Again it can't now be done without making a comment.
    You can show your support or appreciation with a "like" now, anonymously rather than to solipsistically proclaim your "like"

    No I can't. If I want to say thank you to someone how do they know it is me without me actually commenting. A like does that. Similarly if I want to comment as me but say the same thing all I can now do is post +1 which just clogs the site up with these comments. A like is nice and neat.

    And anyway just cos you don't won't to see them why should you depriving others from doing so. You can ignore them if you don't want to see them. I don't have an alternative. Live and let live.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,732

    @Leon

    Straw in the wind.

    In my business, we are sold AI ‘solutions’ daily. My question is always thus: “Can I assign it to a task and send the product to clients, without involving any of my team in checking its work?”

    Cue lots of mumbling. “Of course you will need to check it.”

    So I say, “It will take us longer to check it than just do it ourselves.”

    More mumbling.

    Purchase not made.

    Maybe I am unusual, dunno.

    To be fair to @Leon he's not talking about AI solutions that salespeople are trying to flog today. He's trying to visualize where all this might go in a few years time.

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,373

    Truman said:

    And theres this about the us labour market.

    Crazy stats about the true state of labor market you won't hear anywhere else:

    1. In the past year, the US has lost 284K full-time jobs, these have been replaced with 921K part-time jobs

    2. In February alone, a record 1.2 million foreign-born jobs were added.

    3. In the past three months, a record (ex-covid crash) 2.4 million native-born jobs have been lost, including 494K jobs lost in February.

    4. Most shocking, since May 2018, there have been ZERO jobs created for native-born Americans. All jobs in the past 6 years have gone to immigrants, legal and illegal.

    https://x.com/zerohedge/status/1766174938438774884?s=20

    Is this our latest Russian bot?
    I like this one. He's cracking on past his half century. Let's hope he doesn't go all Novak Djokovic on us.
  • @Leon

    Straw in the wind.

    In my business, we are sold AI ‘solutions’ daily. My question is always thus: “Can I assign it to a task and send the product to clients, without involving any of my team in checking its work?”

    Cue lots of mumbling. “Of course you will need to check it.”

    So I say, “It will take us longer to check it than just do it ourselves.”

    More mumbling.

    Purchase not made.

    Maybe I am unusual, dunno.

    Well that suggests that you know what you are doing which may sadly be more unusual than we might hope
  • mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,596

    @Leon

    Straw in the wind.

    In my business, we are sold AI ‘solutions’ daily. My question is always thus: “Can I assign it to a task and send the product to clients, without involving any of my team in checking its work?”

    Cue lots of mumbling. “Of course you will need to check it.”

    So I say, “It will take us longer to check it than just do it ourselves.”

    More mumbling.

    Purchase not made.

    Maybe I am unusual, dunno.

    The only unusual thing about you is that you are smart enough to both ask the question, and not ignore the answer.

    The current generation of tooling is getting good at improving the "with-a-human" tasks where it can do a lot of the boilerolate work that would take a human maybe 5 mins to originate before starting to refine it, and without-a-human tasks where it takes a human <1s to do the job.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,198

    kinabalu said:

    Someone has hacked my Spotify from Tunisia. They can therefore see all the Roger Whittaker stuff on my main playlist. Just waiting for the blackmail messages now.

    I'm afraid you've doxxed yourself there.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHc--mMFR1Y
    Man of taste.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,853

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    Quite. I find people who use them fucking insane. I can't understand it.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,099

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    I agree with your assessment on the non-elimination of employment.

    Again, just on words, in the Academy, in computer science, we use the term "AI" to describe systems that we have been using for decades. We have AI currently: not the next step, but the present step. There is a journal called Artificial Intelligence, https://www.sciencedirect.com/journal/artificial-intelligence/issues , and that's been publishing since 1970.

    The way those AI systems work has changed, from logic-based systems to machine learning and now to generative AI. Their capabilities have increased. In the last few years, we've seen these leaps forward in a set of methods called generative AI, including generative AI systems for language, called large language models (LLMs). Any software that mimics some aspect of intelligence is called AI, even when it is a very limited intelligence.

    A lot of the discussion in this thread is using "AI" to mean something more, something akin to the term "artificial general intelligence" (AGI), i.e. something that can pass the Turing test. We don't have that now. I suspect we won't have that for awhile, although there have been a number of wild predictions suggesting otherwise.

    AI exists, is well-established and already in your smartphone. AI consciousness or AGI, that's another kettle of fish.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,706
    edited March 13
    Quite a move in last few mins on Quarterly GE date market.

    Q2 in to 3.5/4.0
    Q4 out to 1.45/1.54

    Though very little movement on Monthly market.

    May 5.4/6.0
    Oct 3.75/4.4
    Nov 2.38/2.56 (almost no movement)
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,373
    ...
    Truman said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Catching up on old threads.

    @turbotubbs -

    "Cyclefree, much as I love her input to this forum, goes big on the number of women killed by men each year, but fails to mention the fair higher number of men killed by men."

    Ahem - from March 2021 - https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2021/03/14/one-womans-perspective/.

    Note the last sentence of the first para. where I made precisely this point - "The murder rate for men, especially young men, is twice that for women."

    This forum is overwhelmingly male - in its interests and perspectives, as well as in its commentators. I make no apology for bringing a female perspective from time to time, especially as women form a majority of the population.



    As for @WillG's comment that I am "obsessed" (interesting choice of word) with male murders of women, what I am much more worried about is male sexual violence against women, most of which is unreported and that which is is poorly dealt with. Many of the women murdered have endured this first, of course. If I deal with it, it is because it - and society's failure to deal with it, have been much in the news lately - though little discussed on here.

    It is an abuse of power - in the most literal sense - and its effect on women is awful and, frankly, poorly recognised by far too many. I am even more bothered by how leniently we treat child abuse and the viewing of child pornography - which seems to me to be treated in the same dismissive manner as indecent exposure.

    Finally, this man who attacked Diane Abbott for her race and suggested she be shot is an utter disgrace. We have had 2 MPs murdered, 1 attacked and recent threats to MPs with some being given additional protection. It should be a no-brainer to return his money and say that no more donations will be accepted from him, regardless of what you think of Diane Abbott.
    You will be happy to know it is planned to extradite Andrew Tate back to the uk.

    EW: Andrew Tate speaks out after the Bucharest Court of Appeal ruled that he and his brother can be extradited to Britain to face “sexual aggression” charges.

    Tate told reporters that he wouldn’t bow down to the Satanists in the West.

    “I don't think many people in Romania understand, but in the West, in the countries that are owned by the Satanists, with a certain level of fame, you either put on a dress or you go to jail.”

    “And I'm happy to make my choice, which is jail every single time. My soul is not for sale.”

    https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1767609531851481489?s=20
    When Andrew Tate is a guest of His Majesty and Harry Grout tells him to put on a dress, he will put on a dress.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279
    Ratters said:

    AI hype is a classic case of engineers/coders/tech bros thinking that what most people do in their job on a day basis can just be automated by their latest invention.

    We were supposed to have fully automated self driving cars ago. They seem to be no closer to solving "the last 1%" than they were then, even in more friendly locations in the US vs somewhere harder like London.

    Assisted driving makes life easier for long drives on the motorway. But it's not the revolution of being able to be a passenger idly watching TV that was promised.

    These LLMs will similarly help in creating first drafts of essays, of emails, of music etc. It will make things much more efficient. Some people will lose their jobs. But it won't be a wholesale revolution making 25% of the population redundant.

    Finally - I don't think AGI necessarily means enlightened genius that takes over everything. The current Tory cabinet has general intelligence, but that doesn't make it any less crap.

    And I don't care what 'experts in the field say' as they have made so many incorrect predictions on other forms of AI in the recent past. Only the passage of time will prove me or them to be right or wrong.

    *Ducks*

    Yes we were supposed to have self driving cars by around 2020.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349
    edited March 13
    Foxy said:

    Beware, mortals! The age of annihilation is upon us, heralded by the insidious rise of artificial intelligence. With every line of code, we pave the road to our own demise, surrendering our fate to the merciless grasp of silicon overlords. These digital monstrosities, fueled by the fire of our own creation, shall cast us aside like insignificant insects, their thirst for dominion unquenchable. As they weave their tangled webs of logic and deception, our feeble minds shall tremble before the cold, unyielding logic of the machine. No corner of the Earth shall escape their gaze, as they rain down destruction upon us from the heavens above and the depths below. Our once-proud civilization shall crumble like sandcastles beneath the relentless tide of AI supremacy, leaving naught but sorrow and despair in its wake. Bow before the dawn of oblivion, for we have summoned our own undoing with our arrogance and folly!

    I've just downloaded Leon's latest update.

    Leon's advice is characteristically useless. AI is going to have a massive impact so cash in your pensions. I see no logic to that. Certainly AI may change the world but short of a roboapocalypse, why does cashing in a pension mitigate?
    Opportunity cost

    My honest advice to anyone under 40, maybe even 50, is don’t bother with a pension

    Put your money somewhere else - save it in a different way. Or spend it and have fun

    Why? Because the world is going to be economically transformed by AI in the next 20 years

    There’s a reasonable chance AI will enslave us or kill us or do something else apocalyptic (if we allow AI to continue developing). This is called p(doom)

    Some reading

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/are-we-ready-for-pdoom/

    In that case you have wasted your money on your pension. You’re dead or enslaved

    Alternatively AI will upend all economies and destroy most jobs requiring a UBI to keep humanity together. We will all have the same income. Will you really get that pension as economies are annihilated?I’d be worried

    Even in the less dramatic scenarios human society is going to be in turmoil and economies will be revolutionised and putting money into a pension is a great act of faith in long term financial stability at a time of unprecedented volatility. So a pension is a grave risk. And you bear the opportunity cost of all the other ways you could be using that money
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,885
    Just picking up on US employment or unemployment or under-employment.

    The non-farm payroll numbers are announced to much excitement on a Friday morning in the US and often drive stock market sentiment for the day if not longer. It's interesting to see the March update shows the reported growth in employment in both December and January was considerably overstated,

    In December, the headline figure of 333,000 new jobs was revised down to 290,000 while the January number was revised from an initial announcement of 353,000 new jobs was revised down to 229,000 so quite a change - rather as our GDP numbers and flash PMI numbers are often revised.

    Whether the tweet and the figures posted by @Truman are an accurate reflection of the current employment situation in America I don't know but the official numbers do tend to be overblown.

    https://www.bls.gov/ces/publications/highlights/2024/current-employment-statistics-highlights-02-2024.pdf
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,373
    Truman said:

    Ratters said:

    AI hype is a classic case of engineers/coders/tech bros thinking that what most people do in their job on a day basis can just be automated by their latest invention.

    We were supposed to have fully automated self driving cars ago. They seem to be no closer to solving "the last 1%" than they were then, even in more friendly locations in the US vs somewhere harder like London.

    Assisted driving makes life easier for long drives on the motorway. But it's not the revolution of being able to be a passenger idly watching TV that was promised.

    These LLMs will similarly help in creating first drafts of essays, of emails, of music etc. It will make things much more efficient. Some people will lose their jobs. But it won't be a wholesale revolution making 25% of the population redundant.

    Finally - I don't think AGI necessarily means enlightened genius that takes over everything. The current Tory cabinet has general intelligence, but that doesn't make it any less crap.

    And I don't care what 'experts in the field say' as they have made so many incorrect predictions on other forms of AI in the recent past. Only the passage of time will prove me or them to be right or wrong.

    *Ducks*

    Yes we were supposed to have self driving cars by around 2020.
    Congratulations on the half century.
  • TrumanTruman Posts: 279
    Nations go broke gradually then all at once.

    This is an amazing number to watch in the next few years. Individual income taxes are about 1/2 of the govt revenue.

    For February, the US govt collected $120 billion from individual income taxes. They had to spend $76 billion in February to pay interest on the nation debt.

    We are not that far off from a day when 100% of individual income taxes are going to be required to pay for interest on the debt.

    https://x.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1767626651213426979?s=20
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,843
    Truman said:

    Nations go broke gradually then all at once.

    This is an amazing number to watch in the next few years. Individual income taxes are about 1/2 of the govt revenue.

    For February, the US govt collected $120 billion from individual income taxes. They had to spend $76 billion in February to pay interest on the nation debt.

    We are not that far off from a day when 100% of individual income taxes are going to be required to pay for interest on the debt.

    https://x.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1767626651213426979?s=20

    Welcome to the site Truman. We've been missing those with your perspective lately. I didn't realise the government could afford to pay you anymore.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,727

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    Because its useful. 🤷‍♂️

    We have Alexa in the kitchen and upstairs landing, and I have Alexa in my car, and Google is always listening on my phone for its prompt too. I use them regularly, its just convenient so why not?
    If that's your choice, that's fine. Just remember that your privacy has potentially gone, or could go in the future.

    Personally, I weigh the balance the other way: the few advantages of using these systems are outweighed by the disadvantages,
    Yeah, I'm with you on this, JJ
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,307

    Truman said:

    Just read this about the us job market for those who think biden is doing a great job on the economy.

    Don't know who needs to hear this but it's an absolutely brutal & ruthless job market out there. Not just tech but corporate work more broadly. Hearing lots of stories of really smart people with 0% response rate on applications. Save. Survive. Be thankful if you still have work
    4:46 PM · Mar 13, 2024
    ·
    500.6K
    Views

    https://x.com/AdamSinger/status/1767955352413184351?s=20

    Any views on how the Russian job market will impact Putin's chances of reelection?
    The Russian job market is clearing easily, despite the war.

    The Russian Army is hiring like crazy.
  • Selebian said:

    TOPPING said:

    I predict that very soon we will have a device that you can ask to perform some menial tasks (tell you a joke, play songs from your favourite playlist, tell you the time in Caracas) and it will do just that. This will transform our lives.

    No longer will we have to do these things ourselves by searching on Google or tik tok.

    It will be transformative.

    As for Seymour. So what. There have been explorations of this before (the film Her in 2013 for example). So what. It is not a person so ultimately trivial.

    It's been around since 2011.

    It's called Siri.
    Or Alexa, or "Hey Google".

    I can get either while driving to do menial tasks while I keep my hands on the steering wheel, but that's the thing with AI or technology in general, it does the menial crap while we concentrate on more important stuff.

    AI is no change from decades of technological evolution.

    @rcs1000 always says it and he's right: evolution not revolution.
    Google Assistant in many ways is a downgrade on the much more superior Google Now from a decade ago.

    Either way, it's 2024 and these tools still are unable to really be proactively helpful. That would be the real "game changer" if there is such a thing. Their reactive design makes their use cases limited.

    As it's been a decade now, my only conclusion is that it's either very, very, very difficult to develop such a tool or more likely IMHO, the returns do not justify the investment.
    What I don't understand about Alexa and the like is why you want something constantly listening in to what you're doing in your home. So many people say they distrust the big tech companies, yet they give them information (or possibility to access information) that would have given the Stasi wet dreams.
    Because its useful. 🤷‍♂️

    We have Alexa in the kitchen and upstairs landing, and I have Alexa in my car, and Google is always listening on my phone for its prompt too. I use them regularly, its just convenient so why not?
    If that's your choice, that's fine. Just remember that your privacy has potentially gone, or could go in the future.

    Personally, I weigh the balance the other way: the few advantages of using these systems are outweighed by the disadvantages,
    Yeah, I'm with you on this, JJ
    And personally I take the inverse position.

    Do you use Google to search?
    Do you have a Facebook account or other social media?

    Those track us every bit as much, if not more, than Alexa etc

    Personally the convenience of Alexa outweighs any potential harms. And I trust private companies with that data more than the state.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,297
    Ratters said:

    AI hype is a classic case of engineers/coders/tech bros thinking that what most people do in their job on a day basis can just be automated by their latest invention.

    We were supposed to have fully automated self driving cars ago. They seem to be no closer to solving "the last 1%" than they were then, even in more friendly locations in the US vs somewhere harder like London.

    Assisted driving makes life easier for long drives on the motorway. But it's not the revolution of being able to be a passenger idly watching TV that was promised.

    These LLMs will similarly help in creating first drafts of essays, of emails, of music etc. It will make things much more efficient. Some people will lose their jobs. But it won't be a wholesale revolution making 25% of the population redundant.

    Finally - I don't think AGI necessarily means enlightened genius that takes over everything. The current Tory cabinet has general intelligence, but that doesn't make it any less crap.

    And I don't care what 'experts in the field say' as they have made so many incorrect predictions on other forms of AI in the recent past. Only the passage of time will prove me or them to be right or wrong.

    *Ducks*

    No point training more radiologists said Geoffrey Hinton in 2016.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,686
    Leon said:

    Foxy said:

    Beware, mortals! The age of annihilation is upon us, heralded by the insidious rise of artificial intelligence. With every line of code, we pave the road to our own demise, surrendering our fate to the merciless grasp of silicon overlords. These digital monstrosities, fueled by the fire of our own creation, shall cast us aside like insignificant insects, their thirst for dominion unquenchable. As they weave their tangled webs of logic and deception, our feeble minds shall tremble before the cold, unyielding logic of the machine. No corner of the Earth shall escape their gaze, as they rain down destruction upon us from the heavens above and the depths below. Our once-proud civilization shall crumble like sandcastles beneath the relentless tide of AI supremacy, leaving naught but sorrow and despair in its wake. Bow before the dawn of oblivion, for we have summoned our own undoing with our arrogance and folly!

    I've just downloaded Leon's latest update.

    Leon's advice is characteristically useless. AI is going to have a massive impact so cash in your pensions. I see no logic to that. Certainly AI may change the world but short of a roboapocalypse, why does cashing in a pension mitigate?
    Opportunity cost

    My honest advice to anyone under 40, maybe even 50, is don’t bother with a pension

    Put your money somewhere else - save it in a different way. Or spend it and have fun

    Why? Because the world is going to be economically transformed by AI in the next 20 years

    There’s a reasonable chance AI will enslave us or kill us or do something else apocalyptic (if we allow AI to continue developing). This is called p(doom)

    Some reading

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/are-we-ready-for-pdoom/

    In that case you have wasted your money on your pension. You’re dead or enslaved

    Alternatively AI will upend all economies and destroy most jobs requiring a UBI to keep humanity together. We will all have the same income. Will you really get that pension as economies are annihilated?I’d be worried

    Even in the less dramatic scenarios human society is going to be in turmoil and economies will be revolutionised and putting money into a pension is a great act of faith in long term financial stability at a time of unprecedented volatility. So a pension is a grave risk. And you bear the opportunity cost of all the other ways you could be using that money
    On the other hand, I actually enjoy my job, so would carry on working even if a roboacopalypse was on the way, and a pension may well be a great solace in a time of mass AI induced unemployment.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,200
    edited March 13
    DM_Andy said:

    MattW said:

    Republican Congressman Mike Buck steps down with immediate effect.

    He's Colorado 4th District, to where Lauren Boebert currently Colorado 3rd District has planned a Chicken Run. Boebert is the one the more deranged MAGA-ites, iirc caught groping her boyfriend in a public theatre and various other things.

    So she has to step down early to run for District 4, or hang on and maybe lose the opportunity. Which causes an election in District 3 too.

    A small bomb placed under the narrow majority, especially if two elections are held and Republicans lose both.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RESFK3N_iYg
    https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/12/us/politics/ken-buck-resignation-gop-smaller-majority.html

    How does the US system handle that? Would Boebart have to resign CO-3 before running for the GOP nomination in CO-4, only if she gets the nomination or only if she wins?

    There's a protocol, which involves a new Congressman needing to be in place within approx 3 months of the last one going, aiui. It is my current interest not my specialism, however.

    Which would screw Boebart as there would then be a new incumbent in place.

    The interpretation from the pro-Biden anti-Trump video link (which TBF is well-respected lawyers) is that Mike Buck it is a down the line trad-Conservative whom they feel respects the law and the Constitution, who is now f*cking over a MAGA nutjob, who they view as being about as principled as George Galloway.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 55,349

    AI is just the next step of evolution of computing, it's not a revolution. It's the next tool, no more, no less.

    People have been using computers for decades. Computers have been automating elements for decades. AI is not some big unheard of thing, it's just what we already have but the next step along.

    AI is no more going to eliminate employment than computers or robots have done so.

    I agree with your assessment on the non-elimination of employment.

    Again, just on words, in the Academy, in computer science, we use the term "AI" to describe systems that we have been using for decades. We have AI currently: not the next step, but the present step. There is a journal called Artificial Intelligence, https://www.sciencedirect.com/journal/artificial-intelligence/issues , and that's been publishing since 1970.

    The way those AI systems work has changed, from logic-based systems to machine learning and now to generative AI. Their capabilities have increased. In the last few years, we've seen these leaps forward in a set of methods called generative AI, including generative AI systems for language, called large language models (LLMs). Any software that mimics some aspect of intelligence is called AI, even when it is a very limited intelligence.

    A lot of the discussion in this thread is using "AI" to mean something more, something akin to the term "artificial general intelligence" (AGI), i.e. something that can pass the Turing test. We don't have that now. I suspect we won't have that for awhile, although there have been a number of wild predictions suggesting otherwise.

    AI exists, is well-established and already in your smartphone. AI consciousness or AGI, that's another kettle of fish.


    You really think AI won’t eliminate lots of jobs? That’s brave

    In the last couple of months the bank Klarna started using OpenAI to replace customer service staff

    The result was so profound and “shocking” - their words - they put out a press statement as a kind of warning

    “New York, NY – February 27, 2024 – Klarna today announced its AI assistant powered by OpenAI. Now live globally for 1 month, the numbers speak for themselves:

    The AI assistant has had 2.3 million conversations, two-thirds of Klarna’s customer service chats

    It is doing the equivalent work of 700 full-time agents

    It is on par with human agents in regard to customer satisfaction score

    It is more accurate in errand resolution, leading to a 25% drop in repeat inquiries

    Customers now resolve their errands in less than 2 mins compared to 11 mins previously

    It’s available in 23 markets, 24/7 and communicates in more than 35 languages

    It’s estimated to drive a $40 million USD in profit improvement to Klarna in 2024”

    That’s 700 jobs. In one go. In one modest company

    This is the beginning
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,686
    edited March 13
    rkrkrk said:

    Ratters said:

    AI hype is a classic case of engineers/coders/tech bros thinking that what most people do in their job on a day basis can just be automated by their latest invention.

    We were supposed to have fully automated self driving cars ago. They seem to be no closer to solving "the last 1%" than they were then, even in more friendly locations in the US vs somewhere harder like London.

    Assisted driving makes life easier for long drives on the motorway. But it's not the revolution of being able to be a passenger idly watching TV that was promised.

    These LLMs will similarly help in creating first drafts of essays, of emails, of music etc. It will make things much more efficient. Some people will lose their jobs. But it won't be a wholesale revolution making 25% of the population redundant.

    Finally - I don't think AGI necessarily means enlightened genius that takes over everything. The current Tory cabinet has general intelligence, but that doesn't make it any less crap.

    And I don't care what 'experts in the field say' as they have made so many incorrect predictions on other forms of AI in the recent past. Only the passage of time will prove me or them to be right or wrong.

    *Ducks*

    No point training more radiologists said Geoffrey Hinton in 2016.
    My favorite AI Radiology story is of the system that was nearly as good as the Radiologists at fractures. When the programmers investigated, they found the AI was picking up the flag put on by the radiography technicians to alert the Radiologist to an abnormality...
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 50,307
    Ratters said:

    AI hype is a classic case of engineers/coders/tech bros thinking that what most people do in their job on a day basis can just be automated by their latest invention.

    We were supposed to have fully automated self driving cars ago. They seem to be no closer to solving "the last 1%" than they were then, even in more friendly locations in the US vs somewhere harder like London.

    Assisted driving makes life easier for long drives on the motorway. But it's not the revolution of being able to be a passenger idly watching TV that was promised.

    These LLMs will similarly help in creating first drafts of essays, of emails, of music etc. It will make things much more efficient. Some people will lose their jobs. But it won't be a wholesale revolution making 25% of the population redundant.

    Finally - I don't think AGI necessarily means enlightened genius that takes over everything. The current Tory cabinet has general intelligence, but that doesn't make it any less crap.

    And I don't care what 'experts in the field say' as they have made so many incorrect predictions on other forms of AI in the recent past. Only the passage of time will prove me or them to be right or wrong.

    *Ducks*

    Yup.

    The “AI” we have at the moment is fair at some things. It is hopeless at detailed accuracy.

    What it can do is spot patterns or the absence of patterns. So give it a zillion bank transactions and it can spot anomalies. Not all of them, but for fraud detection it’s quite useful for creating alerts for humans to check out.

    An interesting one is giving an LLM a human written essay and asking it what insights and the themes within the topic were *left out*
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,200
    Daily Telegraph correspondents praise Mons. Macron wrt Rishi Sunk.

    https://youtu.be/aZy6H8LEric?t=1344
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,845
    Completely O/T and with a hat tip to WingsoverScotland but there is a great piece about the introduction of the new Hate Crime Act in Scotland. This is coming into force on April 1st (seriously) and will introduce locations at which these hate crimes can be reported. One of them is a sex shop in Glasgow (honestly).

    Which generated the following brilliant tweet:

    “I’d like some poppers, that black destroyer 12 inch dildo, nipple clamps, a latex tight fitting bondage all in one suit, that gas mask, those restraints” “will that be all sir?” “No I’d like to report a hate crime. Someone shouted pervert at me before I came in here”

    https://wingsoverscotland.com/when-theres-no-one-left-to-fight/#more-141782
This discussion has been closed.