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Sir Keir Starmer suffers from electoral dysfunction, again – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,736
edited March 12 in General
Sir Keir Starmer suffers from electoral dysfunction, again – politicalbetting.com

Rochdale parliamentary by-election, result: WPB: 39.7% (+39.7) IND: 21.3% (+21.3) CON: 12.0% (-22.0) LAB: 7.7% (-48.4) LDEM: 7.0% (-0.6) REF: 6.3% (+6.3) Workers Party of Britain (George Galloway) GAIN from Labour.

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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    Hopefully he will lose the seat at the general election like he did with Bradford West.
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    swing_voterswing_voter Posts: 1,437

    Hopefully he will lose the seat at the general election like he did with Bradford West.

    it'll make a decent bet... reckon if election happens soon (May) George may just hold it
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,620
    edited March 1
    Fourth, like... whoever was fourth.

    Labour.
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,589
    Well that’s a depressing headline to wake up to, that’s for sure.
    Makes me want to turn over and go to sleep again but the day must be faced.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    New polling by Survation on behalf of Quantum Communications has found that support for the Tory party in Scotland is at 15 per cent, down one point since January and now at its lowest since Liz Truss was prime minister.

    The survey put the SNP on 38 per cent (up two points), Labour on 33 per cent (down one point) and the Liberal Democrats on 8 per cent (no change).


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scottish-tories-keep-the-faith-as-they-sink-to-new-low-in-polls-xmfnfqrqd
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,757
    Betfair still has not settled. I need my £25.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    DavidL said:

    Well that’s a depressing headline to wake up to, that’s for sure.
    Makes me want to turn over and go to sleep again but the day must be faced.

    I am glad that I am off to the cinema today to watch Dune, Part II.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,757
    OT tried to get money from my pension yesterday but it is like voting and I have neither passport nor driving licence. It's surely a plot to introduce ID cards.
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803
    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Hamas seem quite cool with it all.
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,589

    DavidL said:

    Well that’s a depressing headline to wake up to, that’s for sure.
    Makes me want to turn over and go to sleep again but the day must be faced.

    I am glad that I am off to the cinema today to watch Dune, Part II.
    Oh it’s finally out. I will see it at the weekend. The first one was excellent, by far the best depiction of Dune to date.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Well that’s a depressing headline to wake up to, that’s for sure.
    Makes me want to turn over and go to sleep again but the day must be faced.

    I am glad that I am off to the cinema today to watch Dune, Part II.
    Oh it’s finally out. I will see it at the weekend. The first one was excellent, by far the best depiction of Dune to date.
    Totally agree, run time of 167 minutes as well.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Technically speaking shelling is a form of rocket science.
    That actually made me LOL. A proper belly laugh

    And it’s a dismal wet morning in late winter and Geo Galloway is a new sectarian MP

    But you made me laugh so 👍
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    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,745
    edited March 1
    Given the result, maybe Labour dodged a bullet here. Bad as this result was for them, losing with an endorsed Labour candidate would have been even worse.

    Even more than BoJo, Galloway has the charisma to get people to vote for him once... If not to keep them voting for him, or maintain any other sort of relationship.

    We should probably all be grateful for that.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,053
    Good morning, everyone.

    F1: practice results not as anticipated. Still think Verstappen's likely the man to beat in the race but qualifying could certainly be very close.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,937
    On Topic

    SKS has lost more Parliamentary By Elections in his 4 year tenure than Jezza in his 4 year tenure as LOTO has he not?
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,976
    Does anyone know anything about the candidate/Party who came second?
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913
    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    AI is poorly understood and hyped. It’s easy to be sceptical.

    For all that, and perhaps even because of it, AI is going to be hugely disruptive.

    We’ve not seen the start of it. Brace indeed.
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    TimSTimS Posts: 10,056
    Labour needs to hope the Gaza situation sorts itself out before they’re in power, because it is an impossible political challenge for any British government with very limited influence. A sometime ally and vulnerable state is going postal and acting like a thug, and the West doesn’t know what to do.

    I think Labour’s position on this is reasonable diplomatically although I think the Lib Dems have the positioning best worked out. But nobody will thank them.

    The one silver lining, considering the by-election stats, is that the conservatives were down 22%.
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    El_CapitanoEl_Capitano Posts: 3,907
    “It is also a flawed strategy as there is, thankfully, only one George Galloway”

    This is true, but Jeremy Corbyn isn’t far off being a second.
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    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,090

    Given the result, maybe Labour dodged a bullet here. Bad as this result was for them, losing with an endorsed Labour candidate would have been even worse.

    Even more than BoJo, Galloway has the charisma to get people to vote for him once... If not to keep them voting for him, or maintain any other sort of relationship.

    We should probably all be grateful for that.

    We don’t know what would’ve happened with an endorsed candidate.
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    WhisperingOracleWhisperingOracle Posts: 8,503

    “It is also a flawed strategy as there is, thankfully, only one George Galloway”

    This is true, but Jeremy Corbyn isn’t far off being a second.

    This is making me think of football chants, for some reason.

    The other thing about Galloway is that, despite his many and manifold flaws, he knows how to work a crowd.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,170
    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    Good morning everybody!
    I suggest that if your daughter is doing a degree, which would encourage her to think, and to question, then the degree, she takes will stand in good state, whether or not technology has overtaken her particular subject.
    The very best of luck to her; granddaughter number two has this morning sent off two uni applications. They are Australian universities so they don’t start until February next year, by which time she will have her IB results.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,620
    Roger said:

    Does anyone know anything about the candidate/Party who came second?

    local businessman.
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    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,090
    Looking for some good news on this dreary morning, I saw this: https://www.cnbc.com/2024/02/29/trump-media-sued-over-dwac-merger-share-dilution.html

    Trump was hoping to make bigly money from Truth Social, but his co-founders are suing him.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913
    Labour in trying to learn from and recapture the successes of New Labour seems also to be repeating its mistakes. Reincarnating Galloway was avoidable IMO.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327
    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    I'd remind her of a rather unwise fellow who, over a decade ago, said that there would be no lorry drivers in a decade because of autonomous vehicles.

    Some posters have a rather poor history of predictions, however much they hype themselves (and their predictions) up.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,869
    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    Good morning everybody!
    I suggest that if your daughter is doing a degree, which would encourage her to think, and to question, then the degree, she takes will stand in good state, whether or not technology has overtaken her particular subject.
    The very best of luck to her; granddaughter number two has this morning sent off two uni applications. They are Australian universities so they don’t start until February next year, by which time she will have her IB results.
    Without going into details, she chose a degree she thought she would quite enjoy, BUT also because it was likely to lead to a good career: it wasn't her first choice emotionally, it wasn't the degree she would choose if nothing else mattered

    She is very bright and she'd now genned up on AI and she is convinced that career could very easily not happen: it's in a cognitive field ripe for automation. She's correct, to my mind

    Her passion is Classics. Totally pointless, totally non vocational, but she REALLY likes it. I've told her to go for that. Better to spend three years having intellectual fun, and let the future go hang, there's a 40% chance the computers will turn us all into pets by 2033, anyway
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054
    edited March 1
    TimS said:

    Labour needs to hope the Gaza situation sorts itself out before they’re in power, because it is an impossible political challenge for any British government with very limited influence. A sometime ally and vulnerable state is going postal and acting like a thug, and the West doesn’t know what to do.

    I think Labour’s position on this is reasonable diplomatically although I think the Lib Dems have the positioning best worked out. But nobody will thank them.

    The one silver lining, considering the by-election stats, is that the conservatives were down 22%.

    Yes, while Rochdale is anomalous for most parties, that is in line for the Conservatives with other by-elections.

    Not much to get excited about for REFUK, LDs or Greens either, but also in line with recent polls and by-elections.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913
    Foxy said:



    Galloway is a charismatic campaigner, in the same league as Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn.

    I am reminded of a quotation from some years ago "the problem of Atheism is not that people believe in nothing, it's that they will believe in anything".

    The dull politics that we have at the moment over important issues like the economy and public services is very uninspiring, with little to choose between parties. Neither side shows any vision as an alternative.

    So we are left with different forms of Populism, whether from the left with Galloway, or from the Culture War of Braverman. People want something more interesting than the grey blob that is Starmer or Sunak, even when sold by a snake oil salesman.

    Are you making an argument for Boris? You have a short memory.


    Or are you referring to the rizz meister Ed Davey? Definitely not a gray man.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,937

    On Topic

    SKS has lost more Parliamentary By Elections in his 4 year tenure than Jezza in his 4 year tenure as LOTO has he not?

    He's also made a lot more gains in by-elections than Corbyn.
    In Jezzas reign Labour won 10 of the 15 By Elections 66.67%

    Under SKS Lab won 12/22 ie 54.54% including 2 horrendous losses of seats won easily by Jezza
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    booksellerbookseller Posts: 423
    Jonathan said:

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    AI is poorly understood and hyped. It’s easy to be sceptical.

    For all that, and perhaps even because of it, AI is going to be hugely disruptive.

    We’ve not seen the start of it. Brace indeed.
    I went to a publishing conference this week. You can now produce an audiobook with AI (they prefer the term 'synthetic voice' which made me think of the scene in Aliens) and one company is offering something called 'voiceswitcher' which allows the listener to switch between different voices, accents, dialects for a single audiobook.

    I agree: it's coming and in spite of the hype and misunderstanding it's impact will be profound and far-reaching (like web 1.0). William Gibson referred ambiguously to 'The Jackpot' in his book The Peripheral and in the book (not the Netflix series), this was never explained but hinted at whole swathes of humanity essentially made redundant (in every sense).
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    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,745
    Foxy said:



    Galloway is a charismatic campaigner, in the same league as Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn.

    I am reminded of a quotation from some years ago "the problem of Atheism is not that people believe in nothing, it's that they will believe in anything".

    The dull politics that we have at the moment over important issues like the economy and public services is very uninspiring, with little to choose between parties. Neither side shows any vision as an alternative.

    So we are left with different forms of Populism, whether from the left with Galloway, or from the Culture War of Braverman. People want something more interesting than the grey blob that is Starmer or Sunak, even when sold by a snake oil salesman.

    The trouble for normal politicians is the one expressed by That Belgian in 2008; "we know what needs to be done, just not how to get re-elected after doing it".

    And in the short term, it's going to be boring and fairly unpleasant for a lot of us. Much like @Leon's weight loss plan.
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    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,701
    edited March 1
    Roger said:

    Does anyone know anything about the candidate/Party who came second?

    David Tully. Very much a local lad. Family business. Involvement in local organisations - rugby team, volunteering. Normal sort of laundry list of policies - return maternity unit to the local hospital, etc. Absence of any of the normal right-wing dog whistles from what I could see from a brief look online.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,869
    I don't give a flying fuck about Gaza, Palestine, Israel or Netanyahu. Neither do most of their closest neighbours.

    I do care about the threat from Iran, Russia and China.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789

    On Topic

    SKS has lost more Parliamentary By Elections in his 4 year tenure than Jezza in his 4 year tenure as LOTO has he not?

    He's also made a lot more gains in by-elections than Corbyn.
    In Jezzas reign Labour won 10 of the 15 By Elections 66.67%

    Under SKS Lab won 12/22 ie 54.54% including 2 horrendous losses of seats won easily by Jezza
    Okay, you comfort yourself with that.

    PB will be here for you when Starmer does what Corbyn never achieved, winning a general election.
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Last night's result does not support that.

    Neither you nor I think it should weigh in voters minds, but it clearly does.
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327
    edited March 1
    On F1:

    It's looking as though at least some of the leak yesterday wrt Horner is real.

    And if the data is real, then either:
    *) He is bang to rights, and Red Bull covered it up.
    *) Red Bull's employment rules are so lax as to allow some fairly egregious behaviour.

    I daresay we'll hear more over this weekend and the next; but it's not looking good for Horner, and by extension, Red Bull.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484

    I'm writing a thread. And need a new username.

    You live in Caithness, right? At least you aren’t in Galloway!
    Not Caithness
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    booksellerbookseller Posts: 423

    On Topic

    SKS has lost more Parliamentary By Elections in his 4 year tenure than Jezza in his 4 year tenure as LOTO has he not?

    He's also made a lot more gains in by-elections than Corbyn.
    In Jezzas reign Labour won 10 of the 15 By Elections 66.67%

    Under SKS Lab won 12/22 ie 54.54% including 2 horrendous losses of seats won easily by Jezza
    How many of those seats were lost at subsequent GEs? That's the important (if slightly depressing) metric and reality of a strategy in FPTP.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,684
    Foxy said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Last night's result does not support that.

    Neither you nor I think it should weigh in voters minds, but it clearly does.
    It does in constituencies which have 40k+ Muslim voters. Elsewhere it doesn't.
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    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
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    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,701
    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Labour and Starmer have called for a ceasefire, but it didn't do them any good because Galloway has misrepresented their position and cast then as apologists for Netanyahu, and a crucial cog in the Israeli war machine.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484
    Roger said:

    Does anyone know anything about the candidate/Party who came second?

    Apparently he was pro business and for Rochdale and did not become involved in the Palestine debate
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,869
    Foxy said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Last night's result does not support that.

    Neither you nor I think it should weigh in voters minds, but it clearly does.
    It's not in "voters minds". It was one of the tiny handful of constituencies in the country where a small demographic feels very strongly about this one issue.

    Don't extrapolate.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054
    edited March 1

    Foxy said:



    Galloway is a charismatic campaigner, in the same league as Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn.

    I am reminded of a quotation from some years ago "the problem of Atheism is not that people believe in nothing, it's that they will believe in anything".

    The dull politics that we have at the moment over important issues like the economy and public services is very uninspiring, with little to choose between parties. Neither side shows any vision as an alternative.

    So we are left with different forms of Populism, whether from the left with Galloway, or from the Culture War of Braverman. People want something more interesting than the grey blob that is Starmer or Sunak, even when sold by a snake oil salesman.

    The trouble for normal politicians is the one expressed by That Belgian in 2008; "we know what needs to be done, just not how to get re-elected after doing it".

    And in the short term, it's going to be boring and fairly unpleasant for a lot of us. Much like @Leon's weight loss plan.
    The one to watch is Agentina. Thats the only democracy departing from the stodgy democratic consensus on welfare, and government.

    Whether Argentina revives or collapses into Mad Max failed state chaos is yet to be seen.
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    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,246

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Plenty of people give a shit about Gaza. Palestinians face famine. Kids are getting blown to pieces. Yesterday the IDF slaughtered 120 people waiting for food. Plenty of people give a shit about this, believe me.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,937
    There are a number of high profile shadow cabinet members in trouble in Constituencies with similar demographics due to their apparent support for a "plausible genocide"

    Wes Streeting will go if Israel is still genociding at the next GE and Cooper is under serious pressure.

    Great acceptance speech by GG btw love the way he tells SKS how it is and the reason why he won.
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    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,897
    edited March 1
    Not sure you can make generalisations out of this strange election.

    Labour was very unlucky/careless to be represented by a candidate it had banned.

    Edit except that Labour has a problem on Palestine/Gaza, which Starmer could have at least partially avoided if he had been lighter of foot at the start.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    Do the degree.

    We'll have all jobs in 10 years time, and you don't want her disqualified out of the good ones because she didn't bother to get a tertiary education.
    Yes, I am telling her to do a degree, I am also telling her to avoid a field which is extremely ripe for automation, and a field she doesn't like THAT much, anyway - this is after her asking me my opinion, not me pressing my Pdooms on her

    Sadly, I am not at all sure we will "all have jobs in ten years". We will see unemployment in certain jobs begin to pick up in the next 2-4 years as AI kicks in, and it will speedily spread and accelerate from there


    eg

    "Klarna started using AI last month for customer support. Here's how it went:

    -The AI assistant has had 2.3 million conversations, two-thirds of Klarna’s customer service chats

    -It is doing the equivalent work of 700 full-time agents

    -It is on par with human agents in regard to customer satisfaction score

    -It is more accurate in errand resolution, leading to a 25% drop in repeat inquiries

    -Customers now resolve their errands in less than 2 mins compared to 11 mins previously

    -It’s available in 23 markets, 24/7 and communicates in more than 35 languages

    -It’s estimated to drive a $40 million USD in profit improvement to Klarna in 2024"

    https://x.com/JamesPelton18/status/1763347278637531226?s=20


    One computer taking 700 jobs. Klarna were so shocked by this they made the announcement as a kind of warning
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,460

    On Topic

    SKS has lost more Parliamentary By Elections in his 4 year tenure than Jezza in his 4 year tenure as LOTO has he not?

    No. Labour endorsed no candidate in this one. Do keep up.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,869
    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
    Yeah, bollocks do they. Never heard a single person mention it.

    To an extent there's a bit of social media hype about it as the latest big thing, that follows from #metoo, #BLM, etc., but there's no serious substance to it.
  • Options
    PJHPJH Posts: 509
    Difficult to read much into this result. But one little clue stands out - once again Reform underpolled in a real election compared to their opinion poll ratings.

    In 2015 UKIP polled nearly 19% so par in line with polls would have been at least 15% and they should really have done a lot better than that with an open door. In reality they did even worse than 2019, down 2%.

    One thought I have is that the 2019 Brexit Party vote in Labour areas might partly returned to Labour, and there is less of a Consrvative vote to leak away to them to compensate. Which means their support is proportionately higher in Tory areas. But in the last two by-elections in Tory seats the Reform vote was also below par for polling. So I'm inclined to think that much of their support is soft and will revert to Conservative by the GE and they will be at about 5% when votes are counted.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,937

    Roger said:

    Does anyone know anything about the candidate/Party who came second?

    Apparently he was pro business and for Rochdale and did not become involved in the Palestine debate
    He is seen as a possible saviour of Rochdale FC that is on the verge of going out of business.
  • Options
    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
    Yeah, bollocks do they. Never heard a single person mention it.

    To an extent there's a bit of social media hype about it as the latest big thing, that follows from #metoo, #BLM, etc., but there's no serious substance to it.
    You’re not hearing, because you’re not listening. You made you mind up ages ago that it’s just another culture war.
  • Options
    CleitophonCleitophon Posts: 260
    For me the takehome here is that conservatives and reform can only muster 18.6%. The rest are left leaning votes. Ok a radical lefftist, communist even, component to the composition of the next parliament. But I don't see the workers party of britain to compromise labour in government.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Plenty of people give a shit about Gaza. Palestinians face famine. Kids are getting blown to pieces. Yesterday the IDF slaughtered 120 people waiting for food. Plenty of people give a shit about this, believe me.
    I understand yesterday's tragedy was sparked by attempts to take goods off the aid trucks and the IDF firing warning shots over their heads
  • Options
    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    Do the degree.

    We'll have all jobs in 10 years time, and you don't want her disqualified out of the good ones because she didn't bother to get a tertiary education.
    Yes, I am telling her to do a degree, I am also telling her to avoid a field which is extremely ripe for automation, and a field she doesn't like THAT much, anyway - this is after her asking me my opinion, not me pressing my Pdooms on her

    Sadly, I am not at all sure we will "all have jobs in ten years". We will see unemployment in certain jobs begin to pick up in the next 2-4 years as AI kicks in, and it will speedily spread and accelerate from there


    eg

    "Klarna started using AI last month for customer support. Here's how it went:

    -The AI assistant has had 2.3 million conversations, two-thirds of Klarna’s customer service chats

    -It is doing the equivalent work of 700 full-time agents

    -It is on par with human agents in regard to customer satisfaction score

    -It is more accurate in errand resolution, leading to a 25% drop in repeat inquiries

    -Customers now resolve their errands in less than 2 mins compared to 11 mins previously

    -It’s available in 23 markets, 24/7 and communicates in more than 35 languages

    -It’s estimated to drive a $40 million USD in profit improvement to Klarna in 2024"

    https://x.com/JamesPelton18/status/1763347278637531226?s=20


    One computer taking 700 jobs. Klarna were so shocked by this they made the announcement as a kind of warning
    @Leon i wish I had a link,but there are some serious studies out there about which industries and professions will benefit from AI and which will be destroyed. There’s still room for a young person to thread the needle through this revolution.
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,460

    There are a number of high profile shadow cabinet members in trouble in Constituencies with similar demographics due to their apparent support for a "plausible genocide"

    Wes Streeting will go if Israel is still genociding at the next GE and Cooper is under serious pressure.

    Great acceptance speech by GG btw love the way he tells SKS how it is and the reason why he won.

    He pointed out that he won because Labour withdrew support from their candidate so Labour had, effectively, no skin in the game? Is Labour doing to withdraw support from Streeting and Cooper? Who will win their seats?

    You really are not only a nasty sectarian you also are an idiot.
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,976
    edited March 1

    Given the result, maybe Labour dodged a bullet here. Bad as this result was for them, losing with an endorsed Labour candidate would have been even worse.

    Even more than BoJo, Galloway has the charisma to get people to vote for him once... If not to keep them voting for him, or maintain any other sort of relationship.

    We should probably all be grateful for that.

    This was clearly a single issue election. It was always going to be. The events of yesterday just made it more so. Galloway to be fair has been fighting the Palestinian cause for long before this latest incident. I think his wife is Palestinian.

    This is a serious moment for Starmer. He has put all his eggs in one basket. He is the champion of all things Israeli. A word out of place and your career as a Labour candidate is over. To the outsider he appears to have as little interest in the Palestinians as Sunak. The Israelis have put him in a very difficult place. Thanks to the last three months the plight of the Palestinians is now becoming widely known. Hamas have in many ways acted as a cover for it. It is more obvious in the West Bank where there is no Hamas. Israel is quite simply an apartheid state and to be on the wrong side of it is not a good look for a Labour leader
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,937
    Haven't enjoyed a night of Politics so much since GE 2017 when Lab achieved it largest favourable swing since WW2 despite it being led by their "worst ever leader"
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
    Yeah, bollocks do they. Never heard a single person mention it.

    To an extent there's a bit of social media hype about it as the latest big thing, that follows from #metoo, #BLM, etc., but there's no serious substance to it.
    I've got to agree with Casino on this one. Never gets a mention amongst my acquaintances, beyond "It's awful but God knows what the solution is". I can understand that muslim and jewish voters are likely to be more motivated by it. That's 7% of the population though.
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,460

    Haven't enjoyed a night of Politics so much since GE 2017 when Lab achieved it largest favourable swing since WW2 despite it being led by their "worst ever leader"

    Did you enjoy 2019 as much?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881

    Jonathan said:

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    AI is poorly understood and hyped. It’s easy to be sceptical.

    For all that, and perhaps even because of it, AI is going to be hugely disruptive.

    We’ve not seen the start of it. Brace indeed.
    I went to a publishing conference this week. You can now produce an audiobook with AI (they prefer the term 'synthetic voice' which made me think of the scene in Aliens) and one company is offering something called 'voiceswitcher' which allows the listener to switch between different voices, accents, dialects for a single audiobook.

    I agree: it's coming and in spite of the hype and misunderstanding it's impact will be profound and far-reaching (like web 1.0). William Gibson referred ambiguously to 'The Jackpot' in his book The Peripheral and in the book (not the Netflix series), this was never explained but hinted at whole swathes of humanity essentially made redundant (in every sense).
    It's going to be even bigger than web 1.0. It may be so profound we don't have a true historical analogy to employ

    It could be like the advent of the car, electricity, the industrial revolution, the Renaissance, and fire, all at once, with extra scary bits as we wonder if the robots will kill us

    OR it may all a load of hype and it will be more like the first Blackberry

    Truth is probably nearer the more epochal scenarios
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,460
    Roger said:

    Given the result, maybe Labour dodged a bullet here. Bad as this result was for them, losing with an endorsed Labour candidate would have been even worse.

    Even more than BoJo, Galloway has the charisma to get people to vote for him once... If not to keep them voting for him, or maintain any other sort of relationship.

    We should probably all be grateful for that.

    This was clearly a single issue election. It was always going to be. The events of yesterday just made it more so. Galloway to be fair has been fighting the Palestinian cause for long before this latest incident. I think his wife is Palestinian.

    This is a serious moment for Starmer. He has put all his eggs in one basket. He is the champion of all things Israeli. A word out of place and your career as a Labour candidate is over. To the outsider he appears to have as little interest in the Palestinians as Sunak. The Israelis have put him in a very difficult place. Thanks to the last three months the plight of the Palestinians is now becoming widely known. Hamas have in many ways acted as a cover for it. It is more obvious in the West Bank where there is no Hamas. Israel is quite simply an apartheid state and to be on the wrong side of it is not a good look for a Labour leader
    What would have happened if Labour had continued to support their candidate in Rochdale do you think?
  • Options
    StaffordKnotStaffordKnot Posts: 85
    The bad news from last night is that a sizeable number of people cast their vote based on their religion - that never leads to any good.

    The good news is that the recipient of that was George Galloway - a political Mayfly who emerges for a couple of days before disappearing back into the deep to await the next opportunity to breed his version of discord.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
    Yeah, bollocks do they. Never heard a single person mention it.

    To an extent there's a bit of social media hype about it as the latest big thing, that follows from #metoo, #BLM, etc., but there's no serious substance to it.
    No, you are wrong.

    Fox jr2 is neither Islamist nor anti-semite, but won't be voting Labour in his East London constituency because of Starmers policy on Gaza. He is inclined to LD or possibly Greens.

    I am very uninspired by Starmer, and highly suspicious of Streeting, so no Labour supporter but it is not over Gaza. I have been given pause for thought in terms of voting because even shire Leics which has been blue for a century may turn red at the GE on recent polling, and it would be fun to bury the Tories as a party here.
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,589
    Our local media is currently gripped by the murder of a dog walker in Aberfeldy, a place where murders are not exactly commonplace. He died on 17th February but the murder inquiry only began a week later when they got around to doing the autopsy and found the bullet.

    I mean, how the f*** does that happen?
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,329
    Leon said:

    Her passion is Classics. Totally pointless, totally non vocational, but she REALLY likes it. I've told her to go for that. Better to spend three years having intellectual fun, and let the future go hang, there's a 40% chance the computers will turn us all into pets by 2033, anyway

    While I don't agree with your AI doomporn, I do agree with the idea she should follow her passion at university, not do a degree with a specific job in mind.

    I had my whole career planned in high school, did the degree, didn't get the job (my buddy did as it happens)

    I did meet people at university who offered me various jobs and haven't had a day out of work since
  • Options
    JonathanJonathan Posts: 20,913
    Leon said:

    Jonathan said:

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    AI is poorly understood and hyped. It’s easy to be sceptical.

    For all that, and perhaps even because of it, AI is going to be hugely disruptive.

    We’ve not seen the start of it. Brace indeed.
    I went to a publishing conference this week. You can now produce an audiobook with AI (they prefer the term 'synthetic voice' which made me think of the scene in Aliens) and one company is offering something called 'voiceswitcher' which allows the listener to switch between different voices, accents, dialects for a single audiobook.

    I agree: it's coming and in spite of the hype and misunderstanding it's impact will be profound and far-reaching (like web 1.0). William Gibson referred ambiguously to 'The Jackpot' in his book The Peripheral and in the book (not the Netflix series), this was never explained but hinted at whole swathes of humanity essentially made redundant (in every sense).
    It's going to be even bigger than web 1.0. It may be so profound we don't have a true historical analogy to employ

    It could be like the advent of the car, electricity, the industrial revolution, the Renaissance, and fire, all at once, with extra scary bits as we wonder if the robots will kill us

    OR it may all a load of hype and it will be more like the first Blackberry

    Truth is probably nearer the more epochal scenarios
    Even the first blackberry changed the world. I think possibly the safest bet on PB that AI is going to disrupt us, probably in ways we cannot anticipate ,understand or control.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,620
    edited March 1
    Leon said:



    ...indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions


    Tell her that she'll clearly go far.

    Edit/ Or, on second thoughts, don't.

  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
    Yeah, bollocks do they. Never heard a single person mention it.

    To an extent there's a bit of social media hype about it as the latest big thing, that follows from #metoo, #BLM, etc., but there's no serious substance to it.
    I've got to agree with Casino on this one. Never gets a mention amongst my acquaintances, beyond "It's awful but God knows what the solution is". I can understand that muslim and jewish voters are likely to be more motivated by it. That's 7% of the population though.
    I thinl where it may hurt Starmer is where the Palestinian vote is the strongest and in that respect some of his London seats will be interesting if the conflict is ongoing at the GE

    To those labour supporters who say it was a terrible night for the conservatives I think labour have more to be worried about not least as Reform did very poorly
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,090

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Plenty of people give a shit about Gaza. Palestinians face famine. Kids are getting blown to pieces. Yesterday the IDF slaughtered 120 people waiting for food. Plenty of people give a shit about this, believe me.
    I understand yesterday's tragedy was sparked by attempts to take goods off the aid trucks and the IDF firing warning shots over their heads
    IDF have admitted they shot *at* people. The shooting appears to have caused panic, which included trucks driving off and running people over.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,553
    DougSeal said:

    Roger said:

    Given the result, maybe Labour dodged a bullet here. Bad as this result was for them, losing with an endorsed Labour candidate would have been even worse.

    Even more than BoJo, Galloway has the charisma to get people to vote for him once... If not to keep them voting for him, or maintain any other sort of relationship.

    We should probably all be grateful for that.

    This was clearly a single issue election. It was always going to be. The events of yesterday just made it more so. Galloway to be fair has been fighting the Palestinian cause for long before this latest incident. I think his wife is Palestinian.

    This is a serious moment for Starmer. He has put all his eggs in one basket. He is the champion of all things Israeli. A word out of place and your career as a Labour candidate is over. To the outsider he appears to have as little interest in the Palestinians as Sunak. The Israelis have put him in a very difficult place. Thanks to the last three months the plight of the Palestinians is now becoming widely known. Hamas have in many ways acted as a cover for it. It is more obvious in the West Bank where there is no Hamas. Israel is quite simply an apartheid state and to be on the wrong side of it is not a good look for a Labour leader
    What would have happened if Labour had continued to support their candidate in Rochdale do you think?
    If Pussy Galore had won against the official Labour Party candidate, which appears not to be beyond the realms of probability, today might be even more embarrassing for Starmer than it already is.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,329
    IanB2 said:

    Leon said:



    ...indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions


    Tell her that she'll clearly go far.

    Edit/ Or, on second thoughts, don't.

    As long as she doesn't use ///what.three.words to work out where that is...
  • Options
    bigglesbiggles Posts: 4,370

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Technically speaking shelling is a form of rocket science.
    As a pedant I have to tell you it is absolutely not. No rocketry involved in artillery shells.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    Plenty of people give a shit about Gaza. Palestinians face famine. Kids are getting blown to pieces. Yesterday the IDF slaughtered 120 people waiting for food. Plenty of people give a shit about this, believe me.
    I understand yesterday's tragedy was sparked by attempts to take goods off the aid trucks and the IDF firing warning shots over their heads
    That's the IDF position.

    Starving people are desperate, and do desperate things. It wouldn't have been a panic without that factor, and the IDF set that up.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    Congratulations to your daughter. I agree with you, she should do the course that she's most excited by, she'll have a better time and get a better degree. The labour market is so uncertain I think it makes less sense than it did before to try to tailor your degree to make yourself more employable. I hope she gets the grades to take up her preferred choice - my eldest daughter is also doing A levels in May/June then heading to Uni. Fingers crossed for all of them. Being young right now isn't easy, but they're doing a great job of it in the main.
    Being 17-18 is always hard, if exciting, but this present cohort have it incredibly hard. I read an impassioned, eloquent reddit essay by a very bright 18 year old the other day. He is facing the same dilemma as my older daughter, he believes his chosen career is deeply menaced by AI and will not exist in a decade, he confessed to deep depression, and it was not hard to understand why

    And so many areas of human life are gonne be impacted, it's not just a few white collar jobs, it is millions and millions of jobs, from call centre workers to accountants and laywers and bankers, to aspiring actors, writers, musicians - almost anyone

    What the F are we all gonna do?!
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054
    biggles said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Technically speaking shelling is a form of rocket science.
    As a pedant I have to tell you it is absolutely not. No rocketry involved in artillery shells.
    Yes, it's ballistics but does have a fair amount in common with rocket science.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,937
    DougSeal said:

    There are a number of high profile shadow cabinet members in trouble in Constituencies with similar demographics due to their apparent support for a "plausible genocide"

    Wes Streeting will go if Israel is still genociding at the next GE and Cooper is under serious pressure.

    Great acceptance speech by GG btw love the way he tells SKS how it is and the reason why he won.

    He pointed out that he won because Labour withdrew support from their candidate so Labour had, effectively, no skin in the game? Is Labour doing to withdraw support from Streeting and Cooper? Who will win their seats?

    You really are not only a nasty sectarian you also are an idiot.
    I don't think you listened to his speech. He said he won because of SKS and his stance on Gaza.

    Only an idiot would think that were not so. Wesley is in serious danger trust me for the same reason with an excellent pro Palestinian independent already in place as his main rival.

    Last night was very profitable for me from a betting point of view but in hindsight I shouldn't have covered my winnings by going green on Lab too as they only came 4th.

    SKS is the only leader of the opposition in history to hand pick his shortlist in a safe seat and finish 4th
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    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,589

    Jonathan said:

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    AI is poorly understood and hyped. It’s easy to be sceptical.

    For all that, and perhaps even because of it, AI is going to be hugely disruptive.

    We’ve not seen the start of it. Brace indeed.
    I went to a publishing conference this week. You can now produce an audiobook with AI (they prefer the term 'synthetic voice' which made me think of the scene in Aliens) and one company is offering something called 'voiceswitcher' which allows the listener to switch between different voices, accents, dialects for a single audiobook.

    I agree: it's coming and in spite of the hype and misunderstanding it's impact will be profound and far-reaching (like web 1.0). William Gibson referred ambiguously to 'The Jackpot' in his book The Peripheral and in the book (not the Netflix series), this was never explained but hinted at whole swathes of humanity essentially made redundant (in every sense).
    The netflix series of The Peripheral was absolutely superb and frankly made a lot more sense than the book which was very hard to follow if obviously very clever. Probably my favourite series of the year before last.
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    nico679nico679 Posts: 5,112
    Not convinced Labour would have held this seat even if Ali had the support of Labour .

    Certainly Starmer made a mistake with his messaging initially . Luckily for Labour there’s only one Galloway .
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967

    Jonathan said:

    Jonathan said:

    Turns out people are decent and don’t much like watching the shelling and mass displacement of a civilian population.

    If you don’t represent that view, you unlock the door for people like Galloway. People want the leading parties to take a different position on Gaza. Why on Earth leaders couldn’t call for a ceasefire and peaceful remedies is quite beyond me.

    This is not rocket science.

    Nah, Galloway is exploiting the prejudices of a certain demographic of the population that's heavily concentrated in Rochdale.

    No-one seriously gives a shit about Gaza.
    I am not sure what the polls say , but anecdotally I think your wrong, I know quite a few people of various ages and political persuasions (inc old skool Tories) that take the situation in Gaza seriously and are troubled by the suffering of civilians.
    Yeah, bollocks do they. Never heard a single person mention it.

    To an extent there's a bit of social media hype about it as the latest big thing, that follows from #metoo, #BLM, etc., but there's no serious substance to it.
    I've got to agree with Casino on this one. Never gets a mention amongst my acquaintances, beyond "It's awful but God knows what the solution is". I can understand that muslim and jewish voters are likely to be more motivated by it. That's 7% of the population though.
    I thinl where it may hurt Starmer is where the Palestinian vote is the strongest and in that respect some of his London seats will be interesting if the conflict is ongoing at the GE

    To those labour supporters who say it was a terrible night for the conservatives I think labour have more to be worried about not least as Reform did very poorly
    I still don't understand why Starmer didn't extract a big public abject apology from Ali over his Israeli conspiracy comments in return for continued Labour backing.
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,976
    edited March 1

    Haven't enjoyed a night of Politics so much since GE 2017 when Lab achieved it largest favourable swing since WW2 despite it being led by their "worst ever leader"

    After what we saw yeaterday (Hillsborough but with starving people and soldiers shooting at them) it's not a good time to gloat though I must say yesterday brought home what feeble self interested leadership we've got in this country at the moment
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    FoxyFoxy Posts: 45,054
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Here’s a troubling anecdote to brighten up a dismal day

    My eldest daughter has got offers from all the universities she wanted. Including some very very good ones

    Normally that’s a Yay, right?

    Except she is now convinced the career she wanted to do will be automated by AI within 5-10 years so her degree will be useless

    This is not my doing btw. She’s been a total AI skeptic until very recently, indeed she’s scoffed at some of my predictions

    I don’t know what to advise her. I’ve told her to do the degree that will make her happy - engage her intellectually - maybe no one will have a job in 10 years, we just don’t know

    So AI is now seriously impacting human lives and crucial decisions and it hasn’t even really arrived yet

    Brace

    Congratulations to your daughter. I agree with you, she should do the course that she's most excited by, she'll have a better time and get a better degree. The labour market is so uncertain I think it makes less sense than it did before to try to tailor your degree to make yourself more employable. I hope she gets the grades to take up her preferred choice - my eldest daughter is also doing A levels in May/June then heading to Uni. Fingers crossed for all of them. Being young right now isn't easy, but they're doing a great job of it in the main.
    Being 17-18 is always hard, if exciting, but this present cohort have it incredibly hard. I read an impassioned, eloquent reddit essay by a very bright 18 year old the other day. He is facing the same dilemma as my older daughter, he believes his chosen career is deeply menaced by AI and will not exist in a decade, he confessed to deep depression, and it was not hard to understand why

    And so many areas of human life are gonne be impacted, it's not just a few white collar jobs, it is millions and millions of jobs, from call centre workers to accountants and laywers and bankers, to aspiring actors, writers, musicians - almost anyone

    What the F are we all gonna do?!
    Do a manual job. Those will always exist in a world of AI. She should do plumbing, carpentry or health and social care.
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