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How Sunak’s PMQ record compares with predecessors – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,032
edited July 2023 in General
imageHow Sunak’s PMQ record compares with predecessors – politicalbetting.com

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  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 42,452
    First! Unlike Ms Truss and missed PMQs.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    edited July 2023
    Internal polling has conservatives on just 11% in Dorries seat according to the Sun

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1677732598150201354?t=rS-vykpDF1KiehcynrQqeA&s=19
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497
    Well, Leon wasn't far out. 27-0.

    But it wasn't boring.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,266
    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855
    Yay
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411

    Internal polling has conservatives on just 11% in Dorries seat according to the Sun

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1677732598150201354?t=rS-vykpDF1KiehcynrQqeA&s=19

    Christ. It's either real in which case Rishi is praying for a 1997 result come next GE or a sneaky attempt to split the opposition vote
  • LeonLeon Posts: 52,899
    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,607
    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411
    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Ye we might as well give up if we can't do that
    Expect Stokes will probably have to haul us over the line mind
  • I'd immediately take a ten wicket win to keep the Ashes alive, but I have a feeling we're going to watch a much closer game than that

    And it'll be better viewing than us winning easily; win, lose or tie
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,834
    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,871
    Well Liz Truss may arguably have been the worst PM in UK history but she can always say she had a 100% PMQs attendance record
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,006

    Internal polling has conservatives on just 11% in Dorries seat according to the Sun

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1677732598150201354?t=rS-vykpDF1KiehcynrQqeA&s=19

    She's been absent from representing her constituents for ages, it's not really surprising that the locals might be a bit hesitant to supporting her party

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jun/22/nadine-dorries-completely-gave-up-on-job-as-mp-long-before-announcing-exit
  • LeonLeon Posts: 52,899
    One of the great unspoken benefits of Bazball is that you lose far fewer games to poor weather. Even if rain takes one whole day you still generally get a result. Making Test cricket in general more appealing, because draws are so boring
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,137
    AP (via Sea Times) - Trump blasts DeSantis in Iowa, says GOP rival ‘despises’ the state’s ethanol

    Campaigning in Iowa, former President Donald Trump attacked Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis as an enemy of corn-based ethanol in his largest campaign event in the leadoff caucus state in nearly four months.

    Trump, appearing Friday in Council Bluffs in the western part of the state, criticized his top 2024 Republican presidential rival for voting as a member of Congress to oppose the federal mandate for the fuel additive that Iowa leads the nation in producing.

    Trump declared himself “the most pro-farmer president that you’ve ever had” at the event, which was aimed at promoting his administration’s agricultural record and touting his oversight of clawbacks of regulations on farmers. “I fought for Iowa ethanol like no president in history,” he said.

    On a rainy Friday, Trump spoke to more than 1,000 Iowans and Nebraskans packed into the event hall inside Mid-America Center, with hundreds more huddled under umbrellas in line outside the arena.

    As a congressman from Florida, DeSantis co-sponsored a bill in 2017 that would have immediately ended the renewable fuel standard, a position consistent with fiscal conservatives who see such mandates as government overreach.

    “Iowa also needs to know that Ron DeSanctus totally despises Iowa ethanol and ethanol generally,” Trump said, intentionally mispronouncing his rival’s name as he routinely does. “He’s been fighting it for years. Don’t forget, as a congressman he was voting against it, and fighting for years to kill every single job.” . . .

    Trump spoke for 80 minutes, starting with the agriculture theme but blending his attacks on DeSantis and President Joe Biden with asides on such subjects as Russian President Vladimir Putin’s invasion of Ukraine — “I told him: Don’t do it.” — an impression of French President Emmanuel Macron and a dismissal of climate change science, saying during the hottest week in history that global warming is just going to give more people beachfront property.

    He touted his three picks for the Supreme Court, who helped make up the majority that voted to overturn Roe v. Wade on abortion last year and to end affirmative action in college admissions last week. . . .

    Ethanol is a fuel additive blended with gasoline and sold across the country that is usually produced by fermenting corn. The ethanol industry consumes about half of Iowa’s corn crop, and the state leads the nation in corn and ethanol production.

    As a candidate, Trump has promoted the executive order he signed as president increasing the retail sale of fuel containing 15% ethanol.

    Recent history, however, suggests a lack of support for ethanol may not be disqualifying. In 2016, Texas Sen. Ted Cruz, who opposes the mandate, won Iowa’s Republican caucuses, handing Trump an early defeat in his ultimately successful White House campaign. Trump carried Iowa by more than 9 percentage points in 2016 and 8.2 points in 2020. . .
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,813
    Pulpstar said:

    Internal polling has conservatives on just 11% in Dorries seat according to the Sun

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1677732598150201354?t=rS-vykpDF1KiehcynrQqeA&s=19

    Christ. It's either real in which case Rishi is praying for a 1997 result come next GE or a sneaky attempt to split the opposition vote
    You can never be sure, but it would hardly be a surprise if the Conservative vote was completely down the toilet. It's not merely about the Government's manifold failings in this seat, it's also about Dorries herself. If the sitting MP has reportedly lost all interest in her job and is just squatting because of a tantrum over not being given a peerage, then it would be unsurprising if the urge to kick the Tories there was even stronger than elsewhere. Assuming, of course, that the voters get a chance this side of a GE.

    The Sun piece repeats the oft-mentioned rumour that Dorries wants to quite at a time that will make it hard for Sunak to avoid calling the by-election during party conference season, but if she just wants to stay put and collect her salary for doing nothing then no means exist to force her to go.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,607

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    CatMan said:

    Internal polling has conservatives on just 11% in Dorries seat according to the Sun

    https://twitter.com/kateferguson4/status/1677732598150201354?t=rS-vykpDF1KiehcynrQqeA&s=19

    She's been absent from representing her constituents for ages, it's not really surprising that the locals might be a bit hesitant to supporting her party

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jun/22/nadine-dorries-completely-gave-up-on-job-as-mp-long-before-announcing-exit
    Why would anyone vote conservative in that constituency ?

    These Johnson disciples need to be given a resounding 'out' verdict from the electorate
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 77,411
    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
    At 50-1, certainly. True odds are in the hundreds still
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 50,526
    Sean_F said:

    ‘We need more EU workers, admits leading Tory Brexiter’

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/jul/08/tory-brexiter-george-eustice-visas-young-eu-workers-labour-shortage

    “This idea of having no temporary visa schemes was not from the Vote Leave campaign,” Eustice said. “It came predominantly from Theresa May. It was a remainer’s interpretation of what Brexit was about. That was not what Brexit was about. People wanted controlled immigration and not to pull up the drawbridge and allow no one in at all.”

    ‘Not the Brexit I voted for’, part 964.

    Here’s a radical proposal.

    Why not invest, rather than rely upon minimum wage labour?
    The next Clive Sinclair could be doing things like this:

    https://twitter.com/byteecosystem/status/1677662389502902273
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,871
    edited July 2023
    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 16,405
    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:

    Well Liz Truss may arguably have been the worst PM in UK history but she can always say she had a 100% PMQs attendance record

    If I had to find a good point in Liz Truss I would say that she was very good at PMQs. She took the rather unusual approach of actually answering the questions. Something that neither her predecessor or successor ever seem to attempt.
    She was also admirably prompt in ditching wrong'uns. Shame her policy plan was bonkers and her political approach was cliquey and secretive.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 61,830
    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Johnson yet again on the wrong side of public opinion

    I give Sunak credit for criticising the deployment of these weapons

    Canada, Spain and many others are right to attack Biden's decision
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,519
    HYUFD said:

    Well Liz Truss may arguably have been the worst PM in UK history but she can always say she had a 100% PMQs attendance record

    When she comes back will they aggregate the PMQs of her two terms for this purpose or will she have to start again?
  • northern_monkeynorthern_monkey Posts: 1,639
    ‘How Brexit crippled touring for UK musicians’

    https://apple.news/ASslvL49lRnWEO_DrRsRBvw
  • There's a lot to criticise Sunak over but I'm not sure this is a big one.

    Firstly it's a small sample. I seem to recall people making a big deal early with Boris too saying he was missing them too much, yet oddly from the chart he has the second lowest rate missed despite that.

    Secondly there's a war on at the moment etc and so yes sometimes the PM will have other things to do. The danger you have in the LOTO turning up or making a big deal about it when the PM is elsewhere is it can backfire by suggesting you don't think whatever else the PM is doing is important.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914
    edited July 2023

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Johnson yet again on the wrong side of public opinion

    I give Sunak credit for criticising the deployment of these weapons

    Canada, Spain and many others are right to attack Biden's decision
    I don't think public opinion should be the driver of what constitutes appropriate military asset transfers.

    It's important in the sense that high public opinion for supporting Ukraine makes it politically easier to continue on, but on a tactical level we're poorly placed to make such a judgement on specific assets.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,507
    kle4 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Johnson yet again on the wrong side of public opinion

    I give Sunak credit for criticising the deployment of these weapons

    Canada, Spain and many others are right to attack Biden's decision
    I don't think public opinion should be the driver of what constitutes appropriate military asset transfers.

    It's important in the sense that high public opinion for supporting Ukraine makes it politically easier to do, but on a tactical level we're poorly placed to make such a judgement on specific assets.
    Yes, the only thing that matters is whether the Ukrainians think they can be useful

  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,871
    edited July 2023

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Johnson yet again on the wrong side of public opinion

    I give Sunak credit for criticising the deployment of these weapons

    Canada, Spain and many others are right to attack Biden's decision
    Churchill like Boris was of course on the wrong side of public opinion too in the late 1930s which strongly backed appeasement. Indeed some Epping and Chigwell Tories tried to deselect him in 1938 for refusing to back Neville Chamberlain.

    Now I am not saying this is comparable and cluster bombs are a particularly brutal weapon but nonetheless public opinion is not always right when it comes to standing up to dictators threatening their neighbours.

    I am sure Boris tonight though would very much love a comparison between him as Churchill and Rishi as Neville Chamberlain
  • HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Johnson yet again on the wrong side of public opinion

    I give Sunak credit for criticising the deployment of these weapons

    Canada, Spain and many others are right to attack Biden's decision
    Sorry but I totally disagree. Ukraine are defending themselves and fighting in their own country, a war they didn't start, against an enemy using these munitions.

    They should not have one arm tied behind their back. They need to be given whatever support can work. If it's these weapons its by far the lesser evil.

    There's also the fact the reason why these weapons are frowned upon doesn't really apply here. The danger of these weapons is they can fail to go off so be left behind essentially as mines that can go off against unintended victims. However Russia have used so many of these munitions and used landmines so frequently that there'll need to be a massive demining operation after Russia is driven out anyway.

    The sooner Russia can be driven out, the sooner that the killings can end.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    5 overs at the end of a day with a better forecast tomorrow and plenty of time. Most teams would have ducked and dived and focused on survival. England went seriously close to a run a ball. I just can't overstate how fantastic this is. We are living through a golden age of test match cricket. An English team with many flaws is taking on the best team in the world with home advantage and generally favourable weather and coming out all guns blazing. It's just magic.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,322
    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Not sure it’s about “hawkishness” - UK more happy to back provision of F16’s etc. everyone is playing a nudge and wink game where you give what you can, get away with what you can. Can you imagine the shitstorm if Sunak agreed cluster munitions? The US can, who is going to argue?

    So we are too hawkish so Baldy Ben loses NATO top job but we aren’t Hawkish enough. Weird.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,322
    DavidL said:

    5 overs at the end of a day with a better forecast tomorrow and plenty of time. Most teams would have ducked and dived and focused on survival. England went seriously close to a run a ball. I just can't overstate how fantastic this is. We are living through a golden age of test match cricket. An English team with many flaws is taking on the best team in the world with home advantage and generally favourable weather and coming out all guns blazing. It's just magic.

    Listening to TMS this morning where they were filling air time the very valid point was made that whilst the ashes, this ashes, is box office, it doesn’t matter if all other major cricket nations don’t play along and can’t make money from it.

    If every other test nation goes with the bazball smash game it will be good but otherwise Test cricket will become a curio that’s maybe only played in the ashes.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914
    boulay said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Not sure it’s about “hawkishness” - UK more happy to back provision of F16’s etc. everyone is playing a nudge and wink game where you give what you can, get away with what you can. Can you imagine the shitstorm if Sunak agreed cluster munitions? The US can, who is going to argue?

    So we are too hawkish so Baldy Ben loses NATO top job but we aren’t Hawkish enough. Weird.
    I would have thought the EU bloc wanting an EU Sec-Gen of NATO was probably a bigger block to Ben.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,504
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Johnson yet again on the wrong side of public opinion

    I give Sunak credit for criticising the deployment of these weapons

    Canada, Spain and many others are right to attack Biden's decision
    Churchill like Boris was of course on the wrong side of public opinion too in the late 1930s which strongly backed appeasement. Indeed some Epping and Chigwell Tories tried to deselect him in 1938 for refusing to back Neville Chamberlain.

    Now I am not saying this is comparable and cluster bombs are a particularly brutal weapon but nonetheless public opinion is not always right when it comes to standing up to dictators threatening their neighbours.

    I am sure Boris tonight though would very much love a comparison between him as Churchill and Rishi as Neville Chamberlain
    What Johnson thinks now doesn’t really matter.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,322
    kle4 said:

    boulay said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Not sure it’s about “hawkishness” - UK more happy to back provision of F16’s etc. everyone is playing a nudge and wink game where you give what you can, get away with what you can. Can you imagine the shitstorm if Sunak agreed cluster munitions? The US can, who is going to argue?

    So we are too hawkish so Baldy Ben loses NATO top job but we aren’t Hawkish enough. Weird.
    I would have thought the EU bloc wanting an EU Sec-Gen of NATO was probably a bigger block to Ben.
    I think Ben was ultimately the biggest block to Ben but there you go.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,507
    kle4 said:

    boulay said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Not sure it’s about “hawkishness” - UK more happy to back provision of F16’s etc. everyone is playing a nudge and wink game where you give what you can, get away with what you can. Can you imagine the shitstorm if Sunak agreed cluster munitions? The US can, who is going to argue?

    So we are too hawkish so Baldy Ben loses NATO top job but we aren’t Hawkish enough. Weird.
    I would have thought the EU bloc wanting an EU Sec-Gen of NATO was probably a bigger block to Ben.
    UvdL's record as German defence minister clearly putting her in the running …

  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,248
    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
    Tie is definitely the value. It's sure to be a close finish so it's much more than a 2% chance.

    It's about the only thing we haven't had in the series so far.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    Scott_xP said:

    @CraigRussell80
    Nadine Dorries has now been quitting longer than Liz Truss was ‘leading’

    Nice one
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,519
    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Who gives a monkeys what a Daily Mail columnist thinks? You may as well ask Jan Moir.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,019
    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    I have loved @stodge's reports from Estonia but this just blew me away: https://twitter.com/i/status/1677173760493756420

    And Zeleniskyy's address in Bulgaria today, just wow.
  • Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 3,025
    Leon said:

    One of the great unspoken benefits of Bazball is that you lose far fewer games to poor weather. Even if rain takes one whole day you still generally get a result. Making Test cricket in general more appealing, because draws are so boring

    England v Australia, Cardiff, 2009. Anderson and Panesar bat out 69 deliveries from a new ball to save the draw. It really wasn't boring. Poor Monty was dropped for the rest of the series!
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,507
    DavidL said:

    I have loved @stodge's reports from Estonia but this just blew me away: https://twitter.com/i/status/1677173760493756420

    And Zeleniskyy's address in Bulgaria today, just wow.

    Dunno about Estonia, I thought he reported from East London
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,834
    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
    Two tied matches in nearly 2,500 matches says the odds ain’t good enough.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,019
    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Who gives a monkeys what a Daily Mail columnist thinks? You may as well ask Jan Moir.
    Or even Jim Moir :lol:
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.

    Labour: 43% (-1)

    Conservatives: 28% (+3)

    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)

    SNP: 3% (n/c)

    Green: 6% (-1)

    Reform UK: 8% (+1)

    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)

    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,338

    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!

    Frit, more like.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    geoffw said:

    DavidL said:

    I have loved @stodge's reports from Estonia but this just blew me away: https://twitter.com/i/status/1677173760493756420

    And Zeleniskyy's address in Bulgaria today, just wow.

    Dunno about Estonia, I thought he reported from East London
    Sorry, have I got the name wrong? Who has been giving us posts from Estonia?
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.

    Labour: 43% (-1)

    Conservatives: 28% (+3)

    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)

    SNP: 3% (n/c)

    Green: 6% (-1)

    Reform UK: 8% (+1)

    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)

    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    It was 26 last time, so I would query +3.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,507
    DavidL said:

    geoffw said:

    DavidL said:

    I have loved @stodge's reports from Estonia but this just blew me away: https://twitter.com/i/status/1677173760493756420

    And Zeleniskyy's address in Bulgaria today, just wow.

    Dunno about Estonia, I thought he reported from East London
    Sorry, have I got the name wrong? Who has been giving us posts from Estonia?
    Cicero no less

  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!

    Oliver Dowden: "I'll go. I mean, I'm the only one qualified to remote-pilot Angela Rayner anyway."
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 16,405
    A better poll for the Conservatives, but it comes to something when 28% is better:

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.
    Labour: 43% (-1)
    Conservatives: 28% (+3)
    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)
    SNP: 3% (n/c)
    Green: 6% (-1)
    Reform UK: 8% (+1)
    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)


    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    Scottish subsample klaxon, Opinium edition.

    SNP in danger of finishing third in Scotland behind the Tories.

    Labour 31%

    SNP 31%

    SCons 28%

    I mean it is a subsample so as about as accurate as an American war movie.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,871
    edited July 2023

    A better poll for the Conservatives, but it comes to something when 28% is better:

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.
    Labour: 43% (-1)
    Conservatives: 28% (+3)
    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)
    SNP: 3% (n/c)
    Green: 6% (-1)
    Reform UK: 8% (+1)
    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)


    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    And with 8% RefUK vote to squeeze too
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,143
    DavidL said:

    geoffw said:

    DavidL said:

    I have loved @stodge's reports from Estonia but this just blew me away: https://twitter.com/i/status/1677173760493756420

    And Zeleniskyy's address in Bulgaria today, just wow.

    Dunno about Estonia, I thought he reported from East London
    Sorry, have I got the name wrong? Who has been giving us posts from Estonia?
    Anyone else associate Latvia with Farmer Tupac and his thing about The Latvian SS Homophobes?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    5 overs at the end of a day with a better forecast tomorrow and plenty of time. Most teams would have ducked and dived and focused on survival. England went seriously close to a run a ball. I just can't overstate how fantastic this is. We are living through a golden age of test match cricket. An English team with many flaws is taking on the best team in the world with home advantage and generally favourable weather and coming out all guns blazing. It's just magic.

    gr
    Listening to TMS this morning where they were filling air time the very valid point was made that whilst the ashes, this ashes, is box office, it doesn’t matter if all other major cricket nations don’t play along and can’t make money from it.

    If every other test nation goes with the bazball smash game it will be good but otherwise Test cricket will become a curio that’s maybe only played in the ashes.
    The Indians, in fairness, have been moving the same way on the back of their incredible strength from the IPL. The Pakistan series was just great and seemed very popular there as well as here. But test match cricket, as great as it is, cannot take its position for granted. It needs to entertain and bring in the crowds. If it doesn't it will die.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,834
    boulay said:

    DavidL said:

    5 overs at the end of a day with a better forecast tomorrow and plenty of time. Most teams would have ducked and dived and focused on survival. England went seriously close to a run a ball. I just can't overstate how fantastic this is. We are living through a golden age of test match cricket. An English team with many flaws is taking on the best team in the world with home advantage and generally favourable weather and coming out all guns blazing. It's just magic.

    Listening to TMS this morning where they were filling air time the very valid point was made that whilst the ashes, this ashes, is box office, it doesn’t matter if all other major cricket nations don’t play along and can’t make money from it.

    If every other test nation goes with the bazball smash game it will be good but otherwise Test cricket will become a curio that’s maybe only played in the ashes.
    Rumours of the death of test cricket are vastly exaggerated. It’s a crowded calendar, but as long as the best players get rich some of the year with the slog fest shit, they will always want to play at the highest, hardest version of the game.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,337
    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,834

    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
    Tie is definitely the value. It's sure to be a close finish so it's much more than a 2% chance.

    It's about the only thing we haven't had in the series so far.
    It’s not more than a 2% chance, history of cricket says that. Two in nearly 2,500.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 120,871

    Scottish subsample klaxon, Opinium edition.

    SNP in danger of finishing third in Scotland behind the Tories.

    Labour 31%

    SNP 31%

    SCons 28%

    I mean it is a subsample so as about as accurate as an American war movie.

    Indeed but if the SNP finished third in Scotland on votes and seats that would be even more humiliating for Yousaf than the next election is likely to be for Rishi.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    geoffw said:

    DavidL said:

    geoffw said:

    DavidL said:

    I have loved @stodge's reports from Estonia but this just blew me away: https://twitter.com/i/status/1677173760493756420

    And Zeleniskyy's address in Bulgaria today, just wow.

    Dunno about Estonia, I thought he reported from East London
    Sorry, have I got the name wrong? Who has been giving us posts from Estonia?
    Cicero no less

    Thanks, and apologies to @Cicero.
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202
    HYUFD said:

    A better poll for the Conservatives, but it comes to something when 28% is better:

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.
    Labour: 43% (-1)
    Conservatives: 28% (+3)
    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)
    SNP: 3% (n/c)
    Green: 6% (-1)
    Reform UK: 8% (+1)
    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)


    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    And with 8% RefUK vote to squeeze too
    It has pro Tory government swingback built into it though.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.

    Labour: 43% (-1)

    Conservatives: 28% (+3)

    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)

    SNP: 3% (n/c)

    Green: 6% (-1)

    Reform UK: 8% (+1)

    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)

    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    It was 26 last time, so I would query +3.
    Wrong, there was a poll last weekend which had the Tories on 25%

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/jul/02/labour-under-pressure-to-axe-two-child-benefit-limit
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914
    Scott_xP said:

    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023

    UK more popular than ever!
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.

    Labour: 43% (-1)

    Conservatives: 28% (+3)

    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)

    SNP: 3% (n/c)

    Green: 6% (-1)

    Reform UK: 8% (+1)

    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)

    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    It was 26 last time, so I would query +3.
    Wrong, there was a poll last weekend which had the Tories on 25%

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/jul/02/labour-under-pressure-to-axe-two-child-benefit-limit
    Not up on the Wikipedia page though.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249

    Scottish subsample klaxon, Opinium edition.

    SNP in danger of finishing third in Scotland behind the Tories.

    Labour 31%

    SNP 31%

    SCons 28%

    I mean it is a subsample so as about as accurate as an American war movie.

    Or a Mel Gibson movie.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.

    Labour: 43% (-1)

    Conservatives: 28% (+3)

    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)

    SNP: 3% (n/c)

    Green: 6% (-1)

    Reform UK: 8% (+1)

    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)

    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    It was 26 last time, so I would query +3.
    Wrong, there was a poll last weekend which had the Tories on 25%

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/jul/02/labour-under-pressure-to-axe-two-child-benefit-limit
    Not up on the Wikipedia page though.
    Wikipedia is wrong, I trust Opinium to know their own polls better than Wikipedia.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,337
    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,248

    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
    Two tied matches in nearly 2,500 matches says the odds ain’t good enough.
    You have to qualify that though for a situation where a close finish is likely.

    It is very unlikely Australia will win by more than 50 runs, or England by more than a few wickets, so the prospect of a tie is much higher than in most normal games where the result is usually predictable some way out.

    Anyway, I just had a couple of quid on it at 120/1. At the very least I expect to be able to lay it off at a profit at some point.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    Quite day in Leeds for me today, hopefully quite day tomorrow as well.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,631
    Scott_xP said:

    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023

    I have been assured on this very forum that despite STOP THE BOATS being the entire pledge, and being emblazoned on the podium, the pledge is not to stop the boats. Merely to pass legislation.

    If more boats come, but they passed legislation, then huzzah. People will say "ok so we're drowning in the forrin invaders, but they passed a law to stop that happening so I am satisfied"

    Tories will win a 704 seat majority at the next election
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,834

    stodge said:

    stodge said:

    Leon said:

    dixiedean said:

    224 to win.
    Sounds much better than 251.

    224 with all 10 wickets in hand on a sunny day. If we can’t win that then England are definitely at fault
    Paddy have England at 1/4, Australia at 13/5 and 35s the tie.

    That seems short enough to me - the Australians will be fired up and if they take a couple of early wickets, it'll be interesting.

    Just had £10 on the convicts. Seriously good bowling line up, decent pitch where not many have looked set, lot more runs to go.
    Plus the £40 will sooth the pain if the series is over by lunch…

    Series needs an England win. Cricket needs an England win.
    So that's why it's now 3/1 Australia and 50s the tie.

    Knowing how dramatic cricket has become, a tie - could you rule it out?
    Two tied matches in nearly 2,500 matches says the odds ain’t good enough.
    You have to qualify that though for a situation where a close finish is likely.

    It is very unlikely Australia will win by more than 50 runs, or England by more than a few wickets, so the prospect of a tie is much higher than in most normal games where the result is usually predictable some way out.

    Anyway, I just had a couple of quid on it at 120/1. At the very least I expect to be able to lay it off at a profit at some point.
    As a trade it’s not bad, but dont hesitate to cash in if you can.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    I know people don't like bringing up his height but it is an issue for the voters.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914
    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    The short stuff is just mean, but this is the key part - he needed to be able to show things had turned around by now.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,322
    Miklosvar said:

    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!

    Oliver Dowden: "I'll go. I mean, I'm the only one qualified to remote-pilot Angela Rayner anyway."
    Angela Rayner is on her way out, SKS was trolling and signposting with his “oracy” plan.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 16,834

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    I know people don't like bringing up his height but it is an issue for the voters.
    It’s both an issue for voters and something that really shouldn’t be. It’s like being against a pm with red hair. He really can’t control his height.

    He should probably screen his photo ops better, mind…
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    I know people don't like bringing up his height but it is an issue for the voters.
    He needs to remind people of all the powerful people of history who were even shorter than him. Joseph Stalin was like 5ft 6, and he was powerful!
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 16,405
    Scott_xP said:

    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023

    A former Home Secretary writes:

    Stopping the boats is much harder than the Govt thought it would be….

    https://twitter.com/pritipatel/status/1677735811494694912

    It's all a bit "man the lifeboats, every MP for themselves" now.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,813
    HYUFD said:

    A better poll for the Conservatives, but it comes to something when 28% is better:

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.
    Labour: 43% (-1)
    Conservatives: 28% (+3)
    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)
    SNP: 3% (n/c)
    Green: 6% (-1)
    Reform UK: 8% (+1)
    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)


    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    And with 8% RefUK vote to squeeze too
    Quite. There's no way on God's Earth that RefUK are going to poll 8% in a General Election, or anywhere remotely close. Most of that lot are pissed off Tory supporters who have a tantrum when talking to pollsters, but will traipse back home again when the Government of the country is at stake.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 118,367
    boulay said:

    Miklosvar said:

    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!

    Oliver Dowden: "I'll go. I mean, I'm the only one qualified to remote-pilot Angela Rayner anyway."
    Angela Rayner is on her way out, SKS was trolling and signposting with his “oracy” plan.
    He's just following Bill Clinton's lead.

    No wait that wasn't oracy.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    I know people don't like bringing up his height but it is an issue for the voters.
    It’s both an issue for voters and something that really shouldn’t be. It’s like being against a pm with red hair. He really can’t control his height.

    He should probably screen his photo ops better, mind…
    Allowing himself to be photographed with the tallest MP in parliament was brave and bold, compared to some of his creative angles used before.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 53,249
    HYUFD said:

    Scottish subsample klaxon, Opinium edition.

    SNP in danger of finishing third in Scotland behind the Tories.

    Labour 31%

    SNP 31%

    SCons 28%

    I mean it is a subsample so as about as accurate as an American war movie.

    Indeed but if the SNP finished third in Scotland on votes and seats that would be even more humiliating for Yousaf than the next election is likely to be for Rishi.
    100+ seats lost in England and Wales and 2 or 3 gains in Scotland for the Tories? Looks on to me.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,322
    I was delighted to hear the sport news on Radio 6 just now, the retirement of a US women’s footballer was higher up the list than the England U21s winning the Euros, the second highest level of international football.
  • MiklosvarMiklosvar Posts: 1,855

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    I know people don't like bringing up his height but it is an issue for the voters.
    It's what he weighs that concerns me. 7 stone? Mene mene tekel upharsin indeed.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,813

    Scott_xP said:

    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023

    A former Home Secretary writes:

    Stopping the boats is much harder than the Govt thought it would be….

    https://twitter.com/pritipatel/status/1677735811494694912

    It's all a bit "man the lifeboats, every MP for themselves" now.
    Nobody can "stop the boats" because the only practical means of doing so is to deploy lethal force, and however degenerate our Government becomes it seems highly improbable that it will resort to machine gunning the dinghies in the Channel as a means of persuading the boat people to give up.

    The politicians simply don't want to admit their powerlessness, that's all.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,248
    edited July 2023
    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    The short stuff is just mean, but this is the key part - he needed to be able to show things had turned around by now.
    It's absurd too.

    The man is 5'6", a little below average but no pigmy, and who the hell cares anyway? What kind of a voter is preoccupied with height?

    It reminds one of the remark attributed to Churchill that one's belief in Democracy is unlikely to withstand more than five minutes conversation with a constituent.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 70,497
    edited July 2023

    boulay said:

    Miklosvar said:

    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!

    Oliver Dowden: "I'll go. I mean, I'm the only one qualified to remote-pilot Angela Rayner anyway."
    Angela Rayner is on her way out, SKS was trolling and signposting with his “oracy” plan.
    He's just following Bill Clinton's lead.

    No wait that wasn't oracy.
    Bill Clinton was an amazing politician who could have been America's finest president.

    But alas, he blew it.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 48,143

    DougSeal said:

    HYUFD said:

    Boris backs Biden sending cluster bombs to Ukraine and Zelensky after Sunak expressed concerns over it.

    First evidence of Sunak taking a less hawkish approach to Ukraine than Boris and Truss, his predecessors and the US now starting to be more hawkish under Biden than the UK on Ukraine. Canada and Spain like the UK opposed to sending cluster bombs to Ukraine

    'Joe Biden has taken a difficult but brave decision to supply cluster munitions to Ukraine. He is right. These are terrible weapons. But they have been used by Putin for over a year in his programme of indiscriminate slaughter of an entirely innocent people. The faster we help the Ukrainians to win, the more lives we will save all round. And never forget - it is the Ukrainians who will use these weapons on their own soil, and to protect themselves.'

    https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/1677725588344254464?s=20
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-66142554

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-66144153

    Who gives a monkeys what a Daily Mail columnist thinks? You may as well ask Jan Moir.
    Or even Jim Moir :lol:
    Anyway - once again, we need to arm the Ukrainians with nuclear weapons. And none of those Woke Vegan “tactical” nuclear weapons. Big, fuck off, nuclear weapons.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914

    Scott_xP said:

    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023

    I have been assured on this very forum that despite STOP THE BOATS being the entire pledge, and being emblazoned on the podium, the pledge is not to stop the boats. Merely to pass legislation.

    If more boats come, but they passed legislation, then huzzah. People will say "ok so we're drowning in the forrin invaders, but they passed a law to stop that happening so I am satisfied"

    Tories will win a 704 seat majority at the next election
    In fairness the Tories have failed on their immigration pledges for more than a decade, and it hasn't hurt their election prospects, I guess as people felt they were trying at least, and there were other issues of importance.

    Now the people who care about it seem to have lost hope it will be addressed, and do not fear Labour enough to stick with the Tories regardless.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 47,618
    Scott_xP said:

    stop the boats

    @charleshymas
    Channel migrant crossings hit new daily record for 2023

    Yes, but Friday was the only day with any arrivals at all.

    So Rishi successfully stopped the boats 6 days out of 7.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/migrants-detected-crossing-the-english-channel-in-small-boats/migrants-detected-crossing-the-english-channel-in-small-boats-last-7-days
  • MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 13,202

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.

    Labour: 43% (-1)

    Conservatives: 28% (+3)

    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)

    SNP: 3% (n/c)

    Green: 6% (-1)

    Reform UK: 8% (+1)

    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)

    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    It was 26 last time, so I would query +3.
    Wrong, there was a poll last weekend which had the Tories on 25%

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/jul/02/labour-under-pressure-to-axe-two-child-benefit-limit
    Not up on the Wikipedia page though.
    Wikipedia is wrong, I trust Opinium to know their own polls better than Wikipedia.
    I also looked through the observer last week and don’t remember seeing it. Was it a voting intention they did for observer, or someone else? Or a different type of poll?

    Anyway, I’m not going to quibble over a +1. 😁

    I don’t think Opinium are getting it right though. When they changed their methodology to build in perceived swingback to the Tory government February last year, did it account for any sort of tactical vote in the election. Despite Tories as low as 28, despite what we saw in Blue Wall in local elections, This poll has Lib Dem’s stuck on 9, not too far ahead of reform and greens. Do any of us think Lib Dem’s will get a PV as low as 9 at the general election?

    They could be “over selling” their poll as a GE indicator.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,338
    pigeon said:

    HYUFD said:

    A better poll for the Conservatives, but it comes to something when 28% is better:

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.
    Labour: 43% (-1)
    Conservatives: 28% (+3)
    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)
    SNP: 3% (n/c)
    Green: 6% (-1)
    Reform UK: 8% (+1)
    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)


    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    And with 8% RefUK vote to squeeze too
    Quite. There's no way on God's Earth that RefUK are going to poll 8% in a General Election, or anywhere remotely close. Most of that lot are pissed off Tory supporters who have a tantrum when talking to pollsters, but will traipse back home again when the Government of the country is at stake.
    I think a large number will abstain, on the basis that the cause is lost (this time).
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 47,618
    edited July 2023
    ydoethur said:

    boulay said:

    Miklosvar said:

    One in 5 PMQs? Lazy Bugger Rishi!

    Oliver Dowden: "I'll go. I mean, I'm the only one qualified to remote-pilot Angela Rayner anyway."
    Angela Rayner is on her way out, SKS was trolling and signposting with his “oracy” plan.
    He's just following Bill Clinton's lead.

    No wait that wasn't oracy.
    Bill Clinton was an amazing politician who could have been America's finest president.

    But alas, he blew it.
    I thought someone blew it for him.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,322

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    The short stuff is just mean, but this is the key part - he needed to be able to show things had turned around by now.
    It's absurd too.

    The man is 5'6", a little below average but no pigmy, and who the hell cares anyway? What kind of a voter is preoccupied with height?

    It reminds one of the remark attributed to Churchill that one's belief in Democracy is unlikely to withstand more than five minutes conversation with a constituent.
    It’s the Tory election campaign “i might seem far away but I’m I'm actually right alongside you.”
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 61,335

    A better poll for the Conservatives, but it comes to something when 28% is better:

    🚨 Latest poll for @ObserverUK Labour lead at 15 points.
    Labour: 43% (-1)
    Conservatives: 28% (+3)
    Lib Dems: 9% (n/c)
    SNP: 3% (n/c)
    Green: 6% (-1)
    Reform UK: 8% (+1)
    (Changes are from a poll released in the Observer last week)


    https://twitter.com/OpiniumResearch/status/1677758557029105664

    Oracy for all has gone down well then.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 94,914

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Coreta, 47, a manager from Somerton, called the prime minister “a weak dog”. Ann, 72, from Selby, focused on his small physical stature. “He is a little mouse to look at,” she said. “I hate seeing him alongside other statesmen because he looks so tiny.” Craig, 39, a software tester from Selby, was blunter still: “I’d probably say a dodo for Rishi, because he’s pretty much dead to me like a dodo.”

    Tryl, who acted as the moderator, said: “These were by far the worst set of groups we’ve done on impressions of Rishi Sunak. Whereas previously people have been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, and usually fell back on the fact that even if he’s out of touch he’s competent and the best person to clear up the mess from Boris Johnson and Liz Truss, things have shifted. The cost of living crisis being compounded with the mortgage crisis has exacerbated Sunak’s personal weaknesses.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/dead-like-a-dodo-by-election-voters-are-giving-rishi-sunak-both-barrels-pbz5zpvfb

    The short stuff is just mean, but this is the key part - he needed to be able to show things had turned around by now.
    It's absurd too.

    The man is 5'6", a little below average but no pigmy, and who the hell cares anyway? What kind of a voter is preoccupied with height?

    It reminds one of the remark attributed to Churchill that one's belief in Democracy is unlikely to withstand more than five minutes conversation with a constituent.
    I make fun of his height on here because I'm only like half an inch taller so I feel fine doing so, but it is absurd.

    I'd hope it is really just a consequence of seeing him as weak and therefore finding any outlet to criticise, but as Dr Palmer has revealed, some voters will openly say they will vote for the person who is taller! (In that case, him, so all was well).
This discussion has been closed.