If this is a spoof it's one of the best I've yet seen on PB. Which is saying something Sammy.
Petal, Sammy... You know how to hurt a man
no spoof, I didn't criticise the Guardian, or the Mail, or say that I think all Muslims should sign some form to show they they're not terrorists, yet you keep on implying that I did.
It is madness, especially as it is there for all to see that I didn't say it, hence you are making a fool of yourself
Someone on UKPR says there are 455 days to the election and as such the Conservatives need to find 6,000 votes a day in order to secure a bare majority (mostly, but not entirely, from people who have never voted Conservative).
P.S. I have no idea if this calculation is in any way accurate.
SeanT is quite capable of defending himself. He doesn't need me.
I also thought OGH had instituted a rule that commenters were not allowed to speculate on the identity of other posters? In which case I suggest he looks to the remarks by uniondivvie.
Who was speculating? In any case I'm sure Seant wouldn't go snivelling to the moderators, would he?
No, from what I know of him, I don't think he would. But I will. As a new contributor, it is a pain for everyone to snidely assume you are someone else. And quite off putting. I suggest OGH applies his own rule.
I'm confident that Seant, even by his potboilery standards, would be capable of creating a reasonably convincing and discrete persona rather than a pallid facsimile of his own florid presence.
In which case, you clearly accept that I am very unlikely to be a sockpuppet created by your apparent hero SeanT, and you will withdraw all insinuations thereto.
I suggest we end the argument at this happy juncture, and talk instead about the eerie marital status of Alex Salmond.
They said the rail line's only been breached twice before in the 1850s: wrong. They also claimed that people are amazed it happened: well, they're obviously fairly ignorant.
Who cares about facts if it gets in the way of a good story?
Posturing for the moment but it's one of the few things that could help mitigate the damage of having Clegg in a leaders debate. Someone far more right wing to contrast against as well as diluting the impact of the debates by having that much less time for each of them.Now that is a surprise.
I suppose the LDs think UKIP would eat into the Conservative vote, which would be good for the LDs. The LDs don't seem able to increase their own numbers, so hoping the Conservatives have a bad night is all that's left.
The latest newsletter from the Lib Dems in the East Midlands makes it clear they are intending to target EU migrants in the region as a means of bolstering their Euro vote with the main argument being deployed being that their positions are at risk if UKIP win.
Indeed. Entirely to be expected and unless I'm very much mistaken perfectly reasonable behaviour. The lib dems still have the know-how to mount a focused operation on the ground targeting those groups they identify as most likely to vote for them. I would think they still have much of the technical apparatus deployed at large scale elections. The question is boots on the ground. Well staffed phonebanks and mass emails are fairly unlikely to reach that group. That needs pavement pounding.
Big Madrid derby in the Copa Del Rey tonight with Real at home.
Ronaldo is banned for three games after tonight having been sent off at the weekend, he will want to sign off with a goal. He is as low as 1.57 to score anytime but inexplicably Spreadex have him at evens on their fixed odds. Too good to resist for me.
The latest newsletter from the Lib Dems in the East Midlands makes it clear they are intending to target EU migrants in the region as a means of bolstering their Euro vote with the main argument being deployed being that their positions are at risk if UKIP win.
Indeed. Entirely to be expected and unless I'm very much mistaken perfectly reasonable behaviour. The lib dems still have the know-how to mount a focused operation on the ground targeting those groups they identify as most likely to vote for them. I would think they still have much of the technical apparatus deployed at large scale elections. The question is boots on the ground. Well staffed phonebanks and mass emails are fairly unlikely to reach that group. That needs pavement pounding.
It was interesting that the overall tone of the letter was an appeal for support in getting the message out. Particularly if dealing with communities who may not believe they are entitled to vote or who may not know much about the relative merits of the various parties, a good ground game might make all the difference.
Posturing for the moment but it's one of the few things that could help mitigate the damage of having Clegg in a leaders debate. Someone far more right wing to contrast against as well as diluting the impact of the debates by having that much less time for each of them.
Now that is a surprise.
I suppose the LDs think UKIP would eat into the Conservative vote, which would be good for the LDs. The LDs don't seem able to increase their own numbers, so hoping the Conservatives have a bad night is all that's left.
You have the crux of it. If you can't change your own vote - and flatlining at 10% since late 2010 tends to speak for itself - change the vote of someone else. Someone you dearly want to be as low as possible in marginals where you are fighting for every vote.
SeanT is quite capable of defending himself. He doesn't need me.
I also thought OGH had instituted a rule that commenters were not allowed to speculate on the identity of other posters? In which case I suggest he looks to the remarks by uniondivvie.
Who was speculating? In any case I'm sure Seant wouldn't go snivelling to the moderators, would he?
No, from what I know of him, I don't think he would. But I will. As a new contributor, it is a pain for everyone to snidely assume you are someone else. And quite off putting. I suggest OGH applies his own rule.
I'm confident that Seant, even by his potboilery standards, would be capable of creating a reasonably convincing and discrete persona rather than a pallid facsimile of his own florid presence.
In which case, you clearly accept that I am very unlikely to be a sockpuppet created by your apparent hero SeanT, and you will withdraw all insinuations thereto.
I suggest we end the argument at this happy juncture, and talk instead about the eerie marital status of Alex Salmond.
Mr Gildas welcome to PB.
we have some pretty sharp cybernats on this board, may I suggest if you're going to debate Scotland you keep yourself informed of events; these sites may help
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Without reopening the argument with Charles from earlier today, in spite of my atheist position, this is a stupid waste of time and the magistrate should be hauled up by the authorities for issuing the summons.
I was in fact wondering how far you saw the necessary agreements as being for legislative detail of Acts of Parliament, rather than administrative action by fiat.
Oh, I'm sure a lot of the real nitty-gritty will be in statutory instruments and regulations rather than in the Act itself, but the overall point still remains, that parliament has to approve the package.
However, the pre-1707 Scottish parliament wasn't 'reconvened' in 1998. The original parliament of Scotland ceased to exist as a separate body in 1707, and was subsumed (as was the English parliament) into what we now know as the UK parliament. The 1998 Scottish parliament is a completely new and unrelated body, which has been granted some delegated powers but is still subject to Westminster; the Westminster parliament could abolish it at any time in exactly the same way that it could abolish Brighton Council if it was pleased to do so. Scottish independence can legally only occur if parliament wills it, or I suppose if Soctland declares UDI and successfully seeks international recognition as an independent country.
Many thanks. It was of course described as the 'reconvened' parliament as the first item of business in 1998, and Scottish doctrine on sovereignty is not uniform with Westminster's, as you probably know in view of recent case law, but the basic conclusion is the same - no point in fouling things up unnecessarily.
With global warming now causing a relatively rapid sea-level rise it is recognised that in within about 50 years this line may be doomed. There is at present (2008) consideration taking place of a scheme for the future of using a railway line from Okehampton to Plymouth
Happening quicker than expected. Better get building that alternative.
One for Ed to look at perhaps.
Why would Ed look at it ? These are rural communities, Chris Smith says let them flood.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
Can I suggest that the suggestions that a poster is really another poster under a different name are rather tiresome.
Best to take posters at their username, even if you do believe that they are not in actuality, a Llama/Morris Dancer/etc as their name suggests, or believed they previously called themselves that before undergoing an identity shift.
Looks like Welsh Labour think devolution has gone far enough in Wales. Shadow Welsh Secretary Owen Smith told Welsh Grand Committee that, "the Welsh govt did not seek powers to vary income tax and will not do so in the future."
Burley's seat is a marginal that will almost certainly go Labour next year, so he's probably making plans ahead, that's all. I suspect he thinks the seat is unwinnable.
With global warming now causing a relatively rapid sea-level rise it is recognised that in within about 50 years this line may be doomed. There is at present (2008) consideration taking place of a scheme for the future of using a railway line from Okehampton to Plymouth
Happening quicker than expected. Better get building that alternative.
That story has disappeared off the news front pages completely. Genuinely curious.
The main thing those stories do is advertise PC double standards so one possibility is the papers found this out via their comment sections - whether published or not - and dropped it quick before it helped Ukip too much.
Looks like Welsh Labour are running scared of accountability.
The reason they are opposing it is that the government might actually expect Wales to start paying its way, as opposed to being essentially a vassal, handout state.
Mr. Hugh, two points in response to 'salting the earth': 1) It was Labour that gave the Coalition the hospital pass of picking up the pieces after the longest, deepest and worst recession in British history. Complaining Osborne won't be handing over a sparkly economy is like complaining when a juvenile delinquent breaks a window in Dresden after it was bombed.
2) Labour had the policy to reduce the NHS' budget.
[As an aside, the archetypical 'salted earth' city, Carthage, was destroyed but made a pretty good comeback as a Romanised city].
I don't deny the Govt inherited an economy knackered by the global financial crisis (although it was growing, something Osborne promptly put an end to).
Problem is, they haven't fixed it, and will hand over a mess. I don't envy the job Ed and Ed will face.
Will they inherit a better or worse economy than the coalition?
Tough one. They'll inherit dangerously unbalanced growth and high but falling unemployment and underemployment, I should think, but so did the Tories.
A lot hasn't changed much. The financial sector is still dangerously unreformed, the deficit is still a problem and a lot of tax rises / spending cuts need to be inflicted etc.
Elsewhere, the Tories have created a lot of unnecessary mess like the chaos in the NHS and IDS's Universal Credit disaster that Labour will have to clean up.
Economy - about the same inheritance as the Tories. Overall - worse inheritance than the Tories.
It should give Tories cause for hope though, because if they modernise in opposition and Labour get it wrong in Government, they could walk 2020.
I like you, you're very funny, or deluded, but either way you amuse me.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
Sadly you'll need someone to coddle and protect you against the vicious and deeply upsetting onslaught of mockery such a guise will inevitably bring.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
You shouldn't jest. Cybernats are viewed with ever growing suspicion by the SNP elite;
''The main thing those stories do is advertise PC double standards so one possibility is the papers found this out via their comment sections - whether published or not - and dropped it quick before it helped Ukip too much.''
Indeed.
The Express ran a story today about 'extreme right wingers' handing out booze and fags on predominantly muslim Brick Lane in response to the Choudhary nonsense there. The language the report was couched in was openly condemnatory in tone.
I know its the Express, but every comment I counted below this story was supportive of this mob. Every one. And there were a number.
A standard game with one exception, there can only be one winner alliances are not allowed. One player has to make 18 centres to win. Anyone can join but be aware this is going to be a devious, vicious, no holds barred, bring a gun to a knife fight sort of game. Not really for novices, the feint-hearted or anyone who likes their gaming fair and honest. To give a clue as to the type of game I expect, I am trying to tempt Andy Cooke back to play (and hopefully to comment on the site again).
Those who are interested in either game should email me at HurstLlama at gmail dot com for details.
I stick my head in for old times sake and see HurstLlama dangling a Diplomacy game in front of me ... Oh, I may be persuaded. Pencil me in, old chap.
With global warming now causing a relatively rapid sea-level rise it is recognised that in within about 50 years this line may be doomed. There is at present (2008) consideration taking place of a scheme for the future of using a railway line from Okehampton to Plymouth
Happening quicker than expected. Better get building that alternative.
One for Ed to look at perhaps.
Nah,. Ed won't do that - it's infrastructure. He'll announce it, work out the cost, then cancel it and put the money into a non-infrastructure project such as tax credits.
I have been reading a number of blogs where people are blaming the government for not protecting these seaside towns enough. Why do people in this country always look to blame someone. The seawall at Dawlish has been there for 150 years and if you look how the sea has destroyed it overnight it just demonstrates the enormous power of nature. How can people think that it is the governments fault?
Not very relevant to the current government maybe but all the money wasted on carbon reduction could have been going into sea defenses and draining channels instead.
I wonder how LD councillor candidates feel about this 'party of in' campaign?
Why on earth would they be consulted? Clegg's ostrich faction know best. They're likely doing it to protect those lib dem marginals and areas where the tories are a threat by pushing IN and OUT to the centre of the EU election. That will just boost the kippers and they presumably think help them by pushing down the tory vote. If that hurts them elsewhere then tough. Hence the hilarity of seeing Rennie telling the scottish public to fear the tories will take us OUT of Europe when that's what the Yes campaign have been saying for months. Joined up thinking they probably call it.
They also appear to have one 'official' set of clothing for lib dem PPBs. Unfortunate that it just makes Rennie appear even more like a Clegg mini-me than usual.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
You shouldn't jest. Cybernats are viewed with ever growing suspicion by the SNP elite;
Still, I don't think there's any evidence of even the most crazed Nat issuing death threats yet. I'm sure you can point me to the statements issued by the various elements of Bettertogether distancing themselves from this type of thing (just the latest of many):
Farage distances himself from MEP http://gu.com/p/3mftc/tw via @guardian How many people can Farage distance himself from and remain in UKIP?
Helping too much I take it. Just like with Bloom.
Do carry on.
Ukip's response to all these kind of stories - which will be endless as the Europhile political class increasingly gang up against that part of the public they want rid of - is to spin them round and use them to point out how PC is just one big double standard.
For example, how would the Guardian react to a Christian denomination that said apostates should be executed?
Any PC-based attack is guaranteed to be a double-standard so ignore the attack and just turn it round.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
You shouldn't jest. Cybernats are viewed with ever growing suspicion by the SNP elite;
Still, I don't think there's any evidence of even the most crazed Nat issuing death threats yet. I'm sure you can point me to the statements issued by the various elements of Bettertogether distancing themselves from this type of thing (just the latest of many):
Perhaps you'd like to take this opportunity to speak on their behalf?
You're out of touch;
"The phenomenon of the so-called Cybernats – SNP supporters who use the internet to attack anyone who disagrees with them – has been well aired before, but of late it has taken on a new viciousness. After appearing on the BBC’s Question Time, Kezia Dugdale, a Labour MSP for the Lothians and staunch defender of the United Kingdom, was subjected to a veritable barrage of hate mail via Twitter. One accused her of being a “blackshirt”, evoking memories of the Thirties fascists. Another tweet said the sender would like to see what she looked like “on the end of a bayonet”. When Ms Dugdale reported this to the police, she says she was told the tweet was “not directly threatening enough” and that too much police manpower would be required to track down the miscreant."
which will be endless as the Europhile political class increasingly gang up against that part of the public they want rid of
Dare we ask as to how this dastardly conspiracy to get "rid of" part of the public will occur? Is the evil EUSSR octopus of doom going to eat them all again? Or was it a squid?
Nope, that's an octopus. Can't see Farage using that again somehow.
Getting rid of huge parts of the population?? It's political correctness gone mad. Well it's something gone mad, that's for sure.
Being a protest party at the EU elections is fine. It's also why the lib dems are reaching so desperately since they used to be a big protest party. However, pretending that UKIP being in receipt of that protest somehow means you personally speak for all those who are pissed off with the other parties is laughable hubris. Bloom certainly didn't. Nor did Batten. So there Farage would seem to have far more sense than you since his actions to distance himself and UKIP from them both speaks for itself. His actions to distance UKIP from and get rid of the extremists and BNP parasites who have tried to jump on the kipper bandwagon also speaks of someone who is at the very least in touching distance from becoming a more serious party.
Isn't it now the time for Cameron to really take a torch to the quango's starting with the EA? The leftie tiny tears over Sally Morgan not being reappointed has exposed the vast army of Blair/Brown sleepers still around.
There is a risk that daddies boy Marxist Milli might get in next year. Why not return the Brown gift?
which will be endless as the Europhile political class increasingly gang up against that part of the public they want rid of
Dare we ask as to how this dastardly conspiracy to get "rid of" part of the public will occur? Is the evil EUSSR octopus of doom going to eat them all again? Or was it a squid?
Nope, that's an octopus. Can't see Farage using that again somehow.
Getting rid of huge parts of the population?? It's political correctness gone mad. Well it's something gone mad, that's for sure.
Being a protest party at the EU elections is fine. It's also why the lib dems are reaching so desperately since they used to be a big protest party. However, pretending that UKIP being in receipt of that protest somehow means you personally speak for all those who are pissed off with the other parties is laughable hubris. Bloom certainly didn't. Nor did Batten. So there Farage would seem to have far more sense than you since his actions to distance himself and UKIP from them both speaks for itself. His actions to distance UKIP from and get rid of the extremists and BNP parasites who have tried to jump on the kipper bandwagon also speaks of someone who is at the very least in touching distance from becoming a more serious party.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
James Landale (@BBCJLandale) 05/02/2014 19:35 Owen Paterson had been having trouble with his eyes for some days. But doctors tonight said immediate surgery necessary to save his sight
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
You shouldn't jest. Cybernats are viewed with ever growing suspicion by the SNP elite;
Still, I don't think there's any evidence of even the most crazed Nat issuing death threats yet. I'm sure you can point me to the statements issued by the various elements of Bettertogether distancing themselves from this type of thing (just the latest of many):
Perhaps you'd like to take this opportunity to speak on their behalf?
You're out of touch;
"The phenomenon of the so-called Cybernats – SNP supporters who use the internet to attack anyone who disagrees with them – has been well aired before, but of late it has taken on a new viciousness. After appearing on the BBC’s Question Time, Kezia Dugdale, a Labour MSP for the Lothians and staunch defender of the United Kingdom, was subjected to a veritable barrage of hate mail via Twitter. One accused her of being a “blackshirt”, evoking memories of the Thirties fascists. Another tweet said the sender would like to see what she looked like “on the end of a bayonet”. When Ms Dugdale reported this to the police, she says she was told the tweet was “not directly threatening enough” and that too much police manpower would be required to track down the miscreant."
That Record article you cited was last September. And you don't give a source for the latest quotation. Checking shows that it was in fact from an article in the DT claiming that Scotland'd be in (metaphorical, I trust) civil war - and it is by Mr Alan Cochrane who has for a long time, let's say, not been a beacon of peace and respect where individual named persons he doesn't like are concerned. His personalisation of the indy debate is a classic deflective strategy - and I am being deliberately kind out of politeness.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
In the event of a "Yes" I would certainly change my bank account from RBS,and move my SIPP from a well known Edinburgh company,and divest from other Scottish investments. Too uncertain to stay.
Gor blimey, that's put me in a right two & eight and no mistake. I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
As I thought you live in London. :-)
Only when I go Cybernat deep cover. My pearly king outfit appears to have gone unnoticed.
You shouldn't jest. Cybernats are viewed with ever growing suspicion by the SNP elite;
Still, I don't think there's any evidence of even the most crazed Nat issuing death threats yet. I'm sure you can point me to the statements issued by the various elements of Bettertogether distancing themselves from this type of thing (just the latest of many):
Perhaps you'd like to take this opportunity to speak on their behalf?
You're out of touch;
"The phenomenon of the so-called Cybernats – SNP supporters who use the internet to attack anyone who disagrees with them – has been well aired before, but of late it has taken on a new viciousness. After appearing on the BBC’s Question Time, Kezia Dugdale, a Labour MSP for the Lothians and staunch defender of the United Kingdom, was subjected to a veritable barrage of hate mail via Twitter. One accused her of being a “blackshirt”, evoking memories of the Thirties fascists. Another tweet said the sender would like to see what she looked like “on the end of a bayonet”. When Ms Dugdale reported this to the police, she says she was told the tweet was “not directly threatening enough” and that too much police manpower would be required to track down the miscreant."
This tweet you mean?
@ThereWasACoo: '...dancing on the head of a pin'? I wish Kezia Dugdale would dance on the end of a bayonet! #scotnight”
Fifi is certainly right about being “not directly threatening enough” (said with a regretful tone no doubt), kind of on a par with Ian Davidson's 'bayonetting the wounded'. However for the record I deplore lazy, crappy 'killing' metaphors, and certainly direct death threats towards people with whose political views one disagrees. Your turn.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
Farage would seem to have far more sense than you since his actions to distance himself and UKIP from them both speaks for itself. His actions to distance UKIP from and get rid of the extremists and BNP parasites who have tried to jump on the kipper bandwagon also speaks of someone who is at the very least in touching distance from becoming a more serious party.
Farage seems to me a basically mainstream politician who is profoundly uncomfortable with leading a populist insurgency - what he wants to be is a sort of Boris, making unvarnished homespun comments but not really any kind of pitchfork-wielder. In that way, it's probably fair to say we have the least repellent of Europe's right-wing insurgencies - I'd be perfectly happy to have a drink with him, whereas Ms Le Pen or Mr Wilders would IMO be marginally less welcome company than Attila the Hun. But I wonder if he won't get fed up at some point, and UKIP minus Farage would be in deep trouble.
* For the "challenged": The first three do not equate freedom-of-movement with Euro quasi-Socialism. Mr antifrank is very much a law [sic] to himself...
To stick to the subject. I only bet every 5th year. Always on the most exciting election on the planet - the UK general election. It is a fantastic drama. Nationalists, insurgent 3rd parties, marginals, sectarian parties, four-way marginals. I can't wait for the next show. I love it. In 2005 I got the Lib Dem seats right. In 2010 I lost money on several seats where LibDem was favourite to gain seats. The lessons: Entrenched incumbents are hard to unseat. My projection is UKIP votes will as a minimum double, continued labour tactical voting will keep most Lib dems in the commons. Factor in that many southern LibDem voters are centre right and natural Cleggish. They will suffer in all the constituencies where they went from 5% to a respectable 20% in 2005 and 2010, but it will not matter seat wise. go for the 50-59 seats, where there is good money to be made. Danish elections are over after 2 hours-so boring
Farage would seem to have far more sense than you since his actions to distance himself and UKIP from them both speaks for itself. His actions to distance UKIP from and get rid of the extremists and BNP parasites who have tried to jump on the kipper bandwagon also speaks of someone who is at the very least in touching distance from becoming a more serious party.
Farage seems to me a basically mainstream politician who is profoundly uncomfortable with leading a populist insurgency - what he wants to be is a sort of Boris, making unvarnished homespun comments but not really any kind of pitchfork-wielder. In that way, it's probably fair to say we have the least repellent of Europe's right-wing insurgencies - I'd be perfectly happy to have a drink with him, whereas Ms Le Pen or Mr Wilders would IMO be marginally less welcome company than Attila the Hun. But I wonder if he won't get fed up at some point, and UKIP minus Farage would be in deep trouble.
I agree, but doesn't "the polling" say he is less popular than his party?
On topic I think Iain Dale is being optimistic calling Leeds North-West a "DEAD CERT LIBDEM HOLD". Half of it is university territory and Greg Mulholland will do well to hang on there.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
I'm talking in general terms about tactics. You seem to be talking about a version of reality where those two specific Guardian headlines mean something.
Yeah, they don't spin out the evening properly. But Danish election *campaigns* rock though - I used to love the way the most obscure little parties would get exactly the same TV broadcast length as the big boys - is that still true? Anyway, Borgen is so much better than In the Thick of It...
Farage would seem to have far more sense than you since his actions to distance himself and UKIP from them both speaks for itself. His actions to distance UKIP from and get rid of the extremists and BNP parasites who have tried to jump on the kipper bandwagon also speaks of someone who is at the very least in touching distance from becoming a more serious party.
Farage seems to me a basically mainstream politician who is profoundly uncomfortable with leading a populist insurgency - what he wants to be is a sort of Boris, making unvarnished homespun comments but not really any kind of pitchfork-wielder. In that way, it's probably fair to say we have the least repellent of Europe's right-wing insurgencies - I'd be perfectly happy to have a drink with him, whereas Ms Le Pen or Mr Wilders would IMO be marginally less welcome company than Attila the Hun. But I wonder if he won't get fed up at some point, and UKIP minus Farage would be in deep trouble.
I wouldn't say he's uncomfortable with the attention but the minutia of policy and the party management side is most definitely giving him headaches and sleepless nights. He has to have people he can trust to delegate to and given the kipper history of coups and infighting that won't come easy. However, he won't give up till he sees the fallout from 2015 and that could involve some of the most important decisions for his party in it's history. If the tories lose and pacts are being talked about he'll want to be there making those decisions.
I'm not quite so sure Farage is carrying the kippers any more though. I seem to recall some recent poll that showed the party was more popular then he.
The ultra-Maoist tube strikers of the Bob Crow Rouge - who are not content with their £52,000 per year - should have custard squirted into their ears until they learn to appreciate the benefits of capitalism. Then they should have their toes bitten off by a smelly goat. Then they might learn to be reasonable.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
I'm talking in general terms about tactics. You seem to be talking about a version of reality where those two specific Guardian headlines mean something.
You're still talking about your tactics. You are not UKIP. Farage has just a touch more claim to that than you and pretending you always know best is amusing but in the real world Farage just isn't doing what you are pretending he is. Farage distancing himself from eccentrics and fruitcakes self-evidently means something or he wouldn't be doing it. Your bluster that you somehow have secret knowledge of what Farage thinks in private is about as telling as it gets.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
Do you think he is as angry with Batten?
Not yet. He wasn't furious with Bloom to begin with either in case you have forgotten.
I agree, but doesn't "the polling" say Farage is less popular than his party?
I don't think I've seen any comparable polling? There were polls showing him with a marginally negative rating from the electorate as a whole, but that's true of everyone except Mandela and Mother Teresa. I should think UKIP's rating (i.e. "Do you like UKIP?", asked of non-UKIP voters) from the whole electorate is lower.
Nick Palmer@ In the big televised debates all eligible parties (usually around 10) get equal time. They have however eliminated the stop watches of the 80's and 90's, when you had trotskyites and far right parties reading from manifestos. Now it is more like "Borgen". However we have much more drama between elections with three and four party minority governments scramble to survive. Most major reforms are made with the participation of all major mainstream parties lasting 10-20 years. (basically gentleman agreements)
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
I'm talking in general terms about tactics. You seem to be talking about a version of reality where those two specific Guardian headlines mean something.
You're still talking about your tactics. You are not UKIP. Farage has just a touch more claim to that than you and pretending you always know best is amusing but in the real world Farage just isn't doing what you are pretending he is. Farage distancing himself from eccentrics and fruitcakes self-evidently means something or he wouldn't be doing it. Your bluster that you somehow have secret knowledge of what Farage thinks in private is about as telling as it gets.
The important point is - from a tactical point of view - when these attacks come just spin them round as they are 100% guaranteed to have a double standard buried in them somewhere.
Your tactics maybe but not Farage. At least he knows he has to distance himself from the most blatant fruitcakery. Nor is he going to stop now. He can't announce a slew of target seats where the kippers intend to mount a serious campaign operation at the General Election while still fighting against a bunch of eccentrics. If they don't understand that party unity and discipline are not optional extras then he'll either make them understand or pay a very heavy price. Some of the more sensible kippers on here understand that perfectly well and have welcomed moves towards it.
What Farage does in private is a different matter. In public - when these attacks come - just spin them round and point out the double standards as they will always be there.
What on earth are you talking about now? Farage has made no secret of distancing himself from the biggest fruitcakes and if you have to reach for the excuse "but what he REALLY thinks" then you are actively damaging the kippers by implying he readily lies to the public and media. Again you're confusing what you think he should do with what actually happened. Farage was furious with Bloom. That wasn't an act. The jovial pint drinking persona vanished in anger at the kipper conference being totally derailed by Bloom.
I'm talking in general terms about tactics. You seem to be talking about a version of reality where those two specific Guardian headlines mean something.
You're still talking about your tactics. You are not UKIP. Farage has just a touch more claim to that than you and pretending you always know best is amusing but in the real world Farage just isn't doing what you are pretending he is. Farage distancing himself from eccentrics and fruitcakes self-evidently means something or he wouldn't be doing it. Your bluster that you somehow have secret knowledge of what Farage thinks in private is about as telling as it gets.
"You're still talking about your tactics."
Duh.
An apt summation of your entire contribution I'd say. You will tell us when Farage let's you in on any more of his 'secret' thinking won't you?
Ian Dale does not like David Ward! But I would not write him off in Bradford East. He is well-entrenched in the community, his views on Palestine have gone down well amongst his Muslim constituents, and Labour have not yet chosen a candidate.
I am afraid Dale is kidding himself. Bermondsey will fall to Labour now that its two faced MP has got into bed with the Tories. and Slade's prophecy is doomed. I live next door to the seat and I can tell you the David Ward is out
Comments
LOL
no spoof, I didn't criticise the Guardian, or the Mail, or say that I think all Muslims should sign some form to show they they're not terrorists, yet you keep on implying that I did.
It is madness, especially as it is there for all to see that I didn't say it, hence you are making a fool of yourself
P.S. I have no idea if this calculation is in any way accurate.
I suggest we end the argument at this happy juncture, and talk instead about the eerie marital status of Alex Salmond.
They said the rail line's only been breached twice before in the 1850s: wrong. They also claimed that people are amazed it happened: well, they're obviously fairly ignorant.
Who cares about facts if it gets in the way of a good story?
See the recent collapse in the photo below:
http://www.devonheritage.org/Places/Dawlish/GWRSeawallcollapse1855.htm
And more occasions listed below (for just one stretch of the line, search for 'breaches'):
http://www.greatcliff.co.uk/pages/railway_history.php
Are their researchers on strike?
I suppose the LDs think UKIP would eat into the Conservative vote, which would be good for the LDs. The LDs don't seem able to increase their own numbers, so hoping the Conservatives have a bad night is all that's left.
Ronaldo is banned for three games after tonight having been sent off at the weekend, he will want to sign off with a goal. He is as low as 1.57 to score anytime but inexplicably Spreadex have him at evens on their fixed odds. Too good to resist for me.
I suppose the LDs think UKIP would eat into the Conservative vote, which would be good for the LDs. The LDs don't seem able to increase their own numbers, so hoping the Conservatives have a bad night is all that's left.
You have the crux of it. If you can't change your own vote - and flatlining at 10% since late 2010 tends to speak for itself - change the vote of someone else. Someone you dearly want to be as low as possible in marginals where you are fighting for every vote.
Via another site.
http://www.southampton.ac.uk/~imw/Dawlish-Warren.htm
we have some pretty sharp cybernats on this board, may I suggest if you're going to debate Scotland you keep yourself informed of events; these sites may help
http://www.heraldscotland.com/
http://www.scotsman.com/
http://www.thewurzels.com/
Too uncertain to stay.
http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/cybernats-scaring-pro-union-voters-carmichael-1-3295541
He seems so fragile and meek.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/10619538/Head-of-Mormon-church-Thomas-Monson-summoned-by-British-magistrates-court-over-Adam-and-Eve-teaching.html
I may have to rethink my whole position on Scottish independence.
Best to take posters at their username, even if you do believe that they are not in actuality, a Llama/Morris Dancer/etc as their name suggests, or believed they previously called themselves that before undergoing an identity shift.
Or in short, no more thank you.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-26052652
Contrast to Welsh Tories who tonight announced they would abolish stamp duty on houses up to 250,000 if they were to win the next assembly election.
http://www.itv.com/news/wales/update/2014-02-05/stamp-duty-wales-conservatives-brain-drain/
Looks like Welsh Labour are running scared of accountability.
I fear you will be hugely disappointed.
A duller alternative would be legal issues.
The reason they are opposing it is that the government might actually expect Wales to start paying its way, as opposed to being essentially a vassal, handout state.
Funny if it wasn;t so sad.
Wales. Labour in action.
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/yes-campaign-distance-themselves-pro-independence-2266858
Indeed.
The Express ran a story today about 'extreme right wingers' handing out booze and fags on predominantly muslim Brick Lane in response to the Choudhary nonsense there. The language the report was couched in was openly condemnatory in tone.
I know its the Express, but every comment I counted below this story was supportive of this mob. Every one. And there were a number.
Labour Councillor Found Guilty Of Reckless Racism Slurs
http://www.tottenhamjournal.co.uk/news/wood_green_councillor_found_guilty_of_reckless_racism_slur_pauline_gibson_labour_noel_park_1_3283935
http://youtu.be/cqCtnKrTFV4
I wonder how LD councillor candidates feel about this 'party of in' campaign?
Particularly because, with the election little more than a year away, we haven't the faintest idea of what form the clean up operation will take
Indeed, its astonishing how much of the 'mess' labour inherits they intend...er....not to change.
He's a very nice chap - I've corresponded with him in the past. Knows his onions.
Sorry, Nick.
The motto: don't trust Labour with the future.
They also appear to have one 'official' set of clothing for lib dem PPBs. Unfortunate that it just makes Rennie appear even more like a Clegg mini-me than usual.
http://tinyurl.com/q5m9ykp
Perhaps you'd like to take this opportunity to speak on their behalf?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10619513/Policeman-who-smashed-up-pensioners-car-receives-400000-compensation.html
wimmen, wimmen, wimmen = 35% voter target
x100
Do carry on.
Ukip's response to all these kind of stories - which will be endless as the Europhile political class increasingly gang up against that part of the public they want rid of - is to spin them round and use them to point out how PC is just one big double standard.
For example, how would the Guardian react to a Christian denomination that said apostates should be executed?
Any PC-based attack is guaranteed to be a double-standard so ignore the attack and just turn it round.
imo
Crick's back. Cool. I've been looking forward to seeing him and Channel 4 giving Hancock the full Bloom treatment.
Nevertheless, the prediction seem's about right to me, a bad night for the Libs (losing half their seats) but probably not a meltdown.
"The phenomenon of the so-called Cybernats – SNP supporters who use the internet to attack anyone who disagrees with them – has been well aired before, but of late it has taken on a new viciousness. After appearing on the BBC’s Question Time, Kezia Dugdale, a Labour MSP for the Lothians and staunch defender of the United Kingdom, was subjected to a veritable barrage of hate mail via Twitter. One accused her of being a “blackshirt”, evoking memories of the Thirties fascists. Another tweet said the sender would like to see what she looked like “on the end of a bayonet”. When Ms Dugdale reported this to the police, she says she was told the tweet was “not directly threatening enough” and that too much police manpower would be required to track down the miscreant."
Is the evil EUSSR octopus of doom going to eat them all again? Or was it a squid?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgfQwhKkVR8
Nope, that's an octopus. Can't see Farage using that again somehow.
Getting rid of huge parts of the population?? It's political correctness gone mad.
Well it's something gone mad, that's for sure.
Being a protest party at the EU elections is fine. It's also why the lib dems are reaching so desperately since they used to be a big protest party. However, pretending that UKIP being in receipt of that protest somehow means you personally speak for all those who are pissed off with the other parties is laughable hubris. Bloom certainly didn't. Nor did Batten. So there Farage would seem to have far more sense than you since his actions to distance himself and UKIP from them both speaks for itself. His actions to distance UKIP from and get rid of the extremists and BNP parasites who have tried to jump on the kipper bandwagon also speaks of someone who is at the very least in touching distance from becoming a more serious party.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/New-Europeans/266650933471113
There is a risk that daddies boy Marxist Milli might get in next year. Why not return the Brown gift?
05/02/2014 19:35
Owen Paterson had been having trouble with his eyes for some days. But doctors tonight said immediate surgery necessary to save his sight
@ThereWasACoo: '...dancing on the head of a pin'? I wish Kezia Dugdale would dance on the end of a bayonet! #scotnight”
Fifi is certainly right about being “not directly threatening enough” (said with a regretful tone no doubt), kind of on a par with Ian Davidson's 'bayonetting the wounded'. However for the record I deplore lazy, crappy 'killing' metaphors, and certainly direct death threats towards people with whose political views one disagrees. Your turn.
That excludes:
- Moi,
- Junior,
- Richard Tyndeall
, but [might] include:- Your future Norwegian self, and
- antifrank?*
:happy-homes-under-tromso-bridges-hunting[2015]:* For the "challenged": The first three do not equate freedom-of-movement with Euro quasi-Socialism. Mr antifrank is very much a law [sic] to himself...
vine.co/v/Mz3nAKXEtmt
'PB Hodges look away now'
Do the PB Kinnocks think that's funny?
I'm not quite so sure Farage is carrying the kippers any more though. I seem to recall some recent poll that showed the party was more popular then he.
Duh.
LOL