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Ahead of the Gray report 2022 moves up in the PM exit betting – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,019
edited June 2022 in General
imageAhead of the Gray report 2022 moves up in the PM exit betting – politicalbetting.com

This is not a market I am betting on but I show it here because it is the issue of the moment. Tonight there’s a BBC documentary with reportedly quite remarkable reports of what was happening in Number 10 when the rest of the nation was locked down. This is from the BBC:

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190
    First.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,585
    This too is an interesting, somewhat counterintuitive result from Ukrainian polling.

    https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1512528415286513664
    A new poll by the Rating sociological group shows the level of support for Ukraine’s EU accession has reached a new historic maximum of 91% among Ukrainians

    Meanwhile, support for NATO membership keeps declining (68%) and almost reached pre-war levels


    Ukraine clearly has a more nuanced view of the EU than do we.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991
    I doubt the Gray report makes the slightest difference, most Tory voters remaining have already decided they could not care less about partygate.

    Far more significant would be a poll showing a Hunt or Sunak or Truss or Wallace led Tories leading Starmer Labour while Johnson's Tories continue to trail. It was polls in 1990 showing a Heseltine or Major led Tories leading Kinnock Labour while a Thatcher led Tories trailed that did for Maggie. Similarly in 2019 it was polls showing a Johnson led Tories leading Corbyn Labour while the May led Tories trailed that did for Theresa. Equally polls in 2007 showing a Brown led Labour briefly doing better than Blair led Labour led to Labour MPs pressure to push Blair to name a resignation date.

    At the end of the day a majority of Tory MPs will only care about removing Johnson if they think it will save their seats, whatever Gray says.
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,938
    HYUFD said:

    I doubt the Gray report makes the slightest difference

    Which is why BoZo tried to quash it at the last minute...
  • Options

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Well said TSE.

    NI wouldn't be going up if the parasites had to pay it too.

    Unfortunately no party advocates standing up to the parasites and ensuring people who work for a living get to keep their own wages instead of getting it all taken off them by parasites.

    Workers need an Atlas Shrugged moment to rid themselves of the parasites trying to live off other people's backs, but who is going to be prepared to stand up to the grey vote?
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,417

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    How about make parasitical lawyers pay more tax ;-)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2022/05/24/graduates-earn-125000-london-battles-america-top-legal-talent/
    They already do.

    Having seen the student loan repayment plans, wow!
  • Options
    FishingFishing Posts: 4,561
    Nigelb said:

    This too is an interesting, somewhat counterintuitive result from Ukrainian polling.

    https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1512528415286513664
    A new poll by the Rating sociological group shows the level of support for Ukraine’s EU accession has reached a new historic maximum of 91% among Ukrainians

    Meanwhile, support for NATO membership keeps declining (68%) and almost reached pre-war levels


    Ukraine clearly has a more nuanced view of the EU than do we.

    Not surprisng given that they will receive huge sums from the EU instead of paying billions in and their lower classes will get better job opportunities in other countries rather than being outcompeted for their own.

    I'm surprised it's only 91% frankly.
  • Options
    Students get a discount on their uni fees?

    Oh no, they're still pegged to inflation.

    Vote them out
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,585
    edited May 2022

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Boris sending a bung to his core vote.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited May 2022
    More seriously, Boris clearly going core vote strategy is they are going to bung the oldies money while everybody else gets taxed more. I can't imagine blue wall (or red wall for that matter) voters are going to be very impressed. All we need now is a party who isn't going to propose ever higher taxes.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847
    edited May 2022
    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,289
    HYUFD said:

    I doubt the Gray report makes the slightest difference, most Tory voters remaining have already decided they could not care less about partygate.

    Far more significant would be a poll showing a Hunt or Sunak or Truss or Wallace led Tories leading Starmer Labour while Johnson's Tories continue to trail. It was polls in 1990 showing a Heseltine or Major led Tories leading Kinnock Labour while a Thatcher led Tories trailed that did for Maggie. Similarly in 2019 it was polls showing a Johnson led Tories leading Corbyn Labour while the May led Tories trailed that did for Theresa. Equally polls in 2007 showing a Brown led Labour briefly doing better than Blair led Labour led to Labour MPs pressure to push Blair to name a resignation date.

    At the end of the day a majority of Tory MPs will only care about removing Johnson if they think it will save their seats, whatever Gray says.

    You really do not get the optics of this

    Read the Panorama report and realise his mps have only one choice, vote him out
  • Options
    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    Lots of fighter jet activity over downtown Baku yesterday and today. And so you can imagine how relieved I was to find out that the banners proclaiming Teknofest over the roads refer not to a concert of heavy beats, but to an exhibition of military hardware.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,585
    Fishing said:

    Nigelb said:

    This too is an interesting, somewhat counterintuitive result from Ukrainian polling.

    https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1512528415286513664
    A new poll by the Rating sociological group shows the level of support for Ukraine’s EU accession has reached a new historic maximum of 91% among Ukrainians

    Meanwhile, support for NATO membership keeps declining (68%) and almost reached pre-war levels


    Ukraine clearly has a more nuanced view of the EU than do we.

    Not surprisng given that they will receive huge sums from the EU instead of paying billions in and their lower classes will get better job opportunities in other countries rather than being outcompeted for their own.

    I'm surprised it's only 91% frankly.
    Net migration is likely to be in the other direction for the rest of the decade.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847
    The Panorama stuff is explosive.
    Boris demeans everybody.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,282
    FPT

    Took a little Day 1 trip on the central section of the Elizabeth Line in my lunch hour. Wow. Really incredible. It even smells new. Next time I will take the crazy funicular style lift at Liverpool Street.
    With interchanges at Farringdon and Whitechapel both providing access to our patch of SE London, this will be our new way of getting to the West End. It was worth the wait.

    No spoliers!!!

    I'm making a shellfish strategic decision to delay my trip until tomorrow!
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    Nigelb said:

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Boris sending a bung to his core vote.
    When the triple lock was suspended for a year all the other parties cried havoc and objecting to that, instead of saying it should be permanently stopped.

    When Theresa May proposed abolishing the triple lock, all other parties cried havoc then.

    The Tories are pandering to the grey vote yes, but all the other parties are even worse. At least the Tories sometimes grasp that it is a problem, unlike everyone else it seems.
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    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,289

    The Panorama stuff is explosive.
    Boris demeans everybody.

    It is shocking and Boris has to pay the price

    No ifs, no buts
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991
    edited May 2022

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Well said TSE.

    NI wouldn't be going up if the parasites had to pay it too.

    Unfortunately no party advocates standing up to the parasites and ensuring people who work for a living get to keep their own wages instead of getting it all taken off them by parasites.

    Workers need an Atlas Shrugged moment to rid themselves of the parasites trying to live off other people's backs, but who is going to be prepared to stand up to the grey vote?
    Most pensioners relying on the state pension are not well off. Workers earning under £35,000 have got a NI cut this year. They are the 2 core Tory target voters ie pensioners and low to average earning redwall voters.

    Yes voters earning over £35,000 a year will see a NI rise but most of them live in London and after Westminster, Wandsworth and Barnet went Labour in the local elections along with the majority of London that already was Labour why should the Tories be that bothered about them? I myself fall into that category now but as a Tory strategist would prefer to pay a bit more NI rather than increase it for redwall voters and pensioners who we need to be re elected
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,289

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,964
    The state pension is a pittance, and it would be unfair that the poorest pensioners had a real term cut. Those living on cushy final salary pensions, however…
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991

    HYUFD said:

    I doubt the Gray report makes the slightest difference, most Tory voters remaining have already decided they could not care less about partygate.

    Far more significant would be a poll showing a Hunt or Sunak or Truss or Wallace led Tories leading Starmer Labour while Johnson's Tories continue to trail. It was polls in 1990 showing a Heseltine or Major led Tories leading Kinnock Labour while a Thatcher led Tories trailed that did for Maggie. Similarly in 2019 it was polls showing a Johnson led Tories leading Corbyn Labour while the May led Tories trailed that did for Theresa. Equally polls in 2007 showing a Brown led Labour briefly doing better than Blair led Labour led to Labour MPs pressure to push Blair to name a resignation date.

    At the end of the day a majority of Tory MPs will only care about removing Johnson if they think it will save their seats, whatever Gray says.

    You really do not get the optics of this

    Read the Panorama report and realise his mps have only one choice, vote him out
    They don't unless someone else polls better
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    Sir Alastair Cook made his annual appearance for Bedfordshire Farmers CC this evening. He was clean bowled by 15-year-old Kyran Shackleton, who wasn’t even born when Cook made his Test debut.

    https://twitter.com/cricketdistrict/status/1528849766796431360?s=20&t=Ry1oAc-kzKVpu0SCiqT42g
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,173
    HYUFD said:

    I doubt the Gray report makes the slightest difference, most Tory voters remaining have already decided they could not care less about partygate.

    Far more significant would be a poll showing a Hunt or Sunak or Truss or Wallace led Tories leading Starmer Labour while Johnson's Tories continue to trail. It was polls in 1990 showing a Heseltine or Major led Tories leading Kinnock Labour while a Thatcher led Tories trailed that did for Maggie. Similarly in 2019 it was polls showing a Johnson led Tories leading Corbyn Labour while the May led Tories trailed that did for Theresa. Equally polls in 2007 showing a Brown led Labour briefly doing better than Blair led Labour led to Labour MPs pressure to push Blair to name a resignation date.

    At the end of the day a majority of Tory MPs will only care about removing Johnson if they think it will save their seats, whatever Gray says.

    Well shame on them!
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,938
    ** In today's Chopper's Politics Newsletter - three 'no confidence' letters in Boris Johnson have been submitted since the local elections.
    The number submitted to 1922 chairman Sir Graham Brady now stands in the high 40s, according to one rebel Tory. ** http://telegraph.co.uk/tw-chopper-nl https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1529094971936190464/photo/1
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,585

    Nigelb said:

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Boris sending a bung to his core vote.
    When the triple lock was suspended for a year all the other parties cried havoc and objecting to that, instead of saying it should be permanently stopped.

    When Theresa May proposed abolishing the triple lock, all other parties cried havoc then.

    The Tories are pandering to the grey vote yes, but all the other parties are even worse. At least the Tories sometimes grasp that it is a problem, unlike everyone else it seems.
    It is the differential treatment of the old and young that’s so objectionable about this.
    There is no ‘at least’.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,173

    The Panorama stuff is explosive.
    Boris demeans everybody.

    It is shocking and Boris has to pay the price

    No ifs, no buts
    BUT IF he survives until the GE he will get your vote.
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,282

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
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    CookieCookie Posts: 11,443
    Another massive and apparently random bill from British Gas.

    Heart sinks as I realise that yet again I am going to have to go through the painful process of speaking to them.

    And then, after comfortably less than 10 minutes the phone is answered. And the (South African, it turns out) fella on the other end of the phone is entirely audible, friendly, helpful, initially as baffled by my bill as me, able to pick through the details of what has happened when, patient as I go through my records, understands what typical and unusual domestic usages are, and brings me to the conclusion that, er, while I have been getting a succession of massive bills from British Gas, I haven't actually been paying them. Apart from in a couple of instances in quite a limited way.

    In my defence, my bills have been confused by a rebate from my previous supplier which went bust and which was applied, disapplied and reapplied. So some of my bills have been covered by that.

    Still - while energy bills are a big problem, it turns out the main reason they have been horrific in my own case is that I've only actually paid out about £400 in the last 8 months so have been building up a big debit. Phew. Never been so relieved to pay a bill.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,653
    To be fair to Kissinger, he built his career on negotiations telling ostensibly weaker powers they had to give up territory to make peace with larger ones. The Ukrainians will probably pay him as much attention as did the Vietnamese.

    https://twitter.com/PhillipsPOBrien/status/1529095974861344768
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,964

    RobD said:

    The state pension is a pittance, and it would be unfair that the poorest pensioners had a real term cut. Those living on cushy final salary pensions, however…

    What is a cushy final salary pension anyway? My final salary teaching pension is barely 250 a week for 32 years in the scheme. I won't get my state pension for 6 years so that's my lot. Out of that I have to find 50 a week for energy, so we are hardly cushy.
    Yes, that certainly isn't cushy. I didn't say every person on a final salary scheme was in a good financial position, did I?
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    So that's ok then.....so much for governing for the whole nation on what is best.
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    BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 18,725
    edited May 2022
    HYUFD said:

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Well said TSE.

    NI wouldn't be going up if the parasites had to pay it too.

    Unfortunately no party advocates standing up to the parasites and ensuring people who work for a living get to keep their own wages instead of getting it all taken off them by parasites.

    Workers need an Atlas Shrugged moment to rid themselves of the parasites trying to live off other people's backs, but who is going to be prepared to stand up to the grey vote?
    Most pensioners relying on the state pension are not well off. Workers earning under £35,000 have got a NI cut this year. They are the 2 core Tory target voters ie pensioners and low to average earning redwall voters.

    Yes voters earning over £35,000 a year will see a NI rise but most of them live in London and after Westminster, Wandsworth and Barnet went Labour in the local elections along with the majority of London that already was Labour why should the Tories be that bothered about them? I myself fall into that category now but as a Tory strategist would prefer to pay a bit more NI rather than increase it for redwall voters and pensioners who we need to be re elected
    Because - and this is the difference between you and me - the Government is supposed to represent all the population, not just those that put it in power. And if the only way to win power is to betray everything you stand for, then what is the purpose of winning power anyway.

    Taxes should be equally payable by all, a proportion of society voting to exempt themselves from taxation and burden those who are paying with an even greater share isn't right, it isn't reasonable and it isn't good economics either. The Conservative Party of Thatcher understood that, even if you don't.

    If 70% of the population decided only 10% of the population should pay taxes, they could decide that democratically, but it wouldn't make it the right thing to do.

    If you want to engage in socialist welfare where taxes are burdened upon people who work for a living, in order to further featherbed the welfare state for providing generous and unfunded welfare for those who aren't working then feel free to do so. Its not the right thing to do though.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847
    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
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    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373
    edited May 2022

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
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    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,386
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    The state pension is a pittance, and it would be unfair that the poorest pensioners had a real term cut. Those living on cushy final salary pensions, however…

    What is a cushy final salary pension anyway? My final salary teaching pension is barely 250 a week for 32 years in the scheme. I won't get my state pension for 6 years so that's my lot. Out of that I have to find 50 a week for energy, so we are hardly cushy.
    Yes, that certainly isn't cushy. I didn't say every person on a final salary scheme was in a good financial position, did I?
    True, but the way some people speak they assume that all pensioners are rich as cresus and go on cruises every season.
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    Now do the maths again and account for wealth, including housing assets.

    Pensioners are, as a class, fucking loaded.
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847
    The average pensioner also earns more than the average worker.

    How on earth do you end up with a country like that?
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    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited May 2022
    I get the feeling if HYUFD had his way there would be a special extra tax for those who couldn't prove they voted Tory at the last election. You have to return your self assessment form with a photo of your Tory membership card next to your voting slip from the GE.
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    FishingFishing Posts: 4,561
    Off topic

    I was in town today and took the opportunity to ride Crossrail on its first official day, as I was mildly curious to discover what £20 billion buys you in 2022. On the whole I was moderately impressed, at least compared to other government procurement cockups or wastes of similar magnitude, like the Olympics or Northern Ireland.

    It is fast and fairly smooth, apart from the need to change at Paddington and Liverpool Street. Hopefully those will be sorted out next year. And it obviously isn't great that Bond Street isn't open yet.

    A distinctly weird touch was just outside Paddington station, where a group of young lovelies in Crossrail t-shirts were singing "Purple Train, Purple Train, Purple Train".
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    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,105

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    It's chilling isn't it.
  • Options

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    £185.15 a week of relatively untaxed and potentially disposable income is more than many working families take home though. Especially when considering that working families normally have to pay rent or a mortgage whereas many pensioners do not.

    Why should workers be seeing their pay potentially stagnate while taxes rise, while pensioners not paying taxes get welfare improved for them?
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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    It's chilling isn't it.
    It is.
    I find it repulsive.
  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,386
    Cookie said:

    Another massive and apparently random bill from British Gas.

    Heart sinks as I realise that yet again I am going to have to go through the painful process of speaking to them.

    And then, after comfortably less than 10 minutes the phone is answered. And the (South African, it turns out) fella on the other end of the phone is entirely audible, friendly, helpful, initially as baffled by my bill as me, able to pick through the details of what has happened when, patient as I go through my records, understands what typical and unusual domestic usages are, and brings me to the conclusion that, er, while I have been getting a succession of massive bills from British Gas, I haven't actually been paying them. Apart from in a couple of instances in quite a limited way.

    In my defence, my bills have been confused by a rebate from my previous supplier which went bust and which was applied, disapplied and reapplied. So some of my bills have been covered by that.

    Still - while energy bills are a big problem, it turns out the main reason they have been horrific in my own case is that I've only actually paid out about £400 in the last 8 months so have been building up a big debit. Phew. Never been so relieved to pay a bill.

    Relief is nice, it might be worth trying to build up a few pounds credit a month. Luckily my 50 a week would be more like 60 if I hadn't accrued some credit last year.
  • Options
    OnlyLivingBoyOnlyLivingBoy Posts: 15,105

    The average pensioner also earns more than the average worker.

    How on earth do you end up with a country like that?

    You have a government that relies on pensioners' votes and have pensioners that are more likely to vote.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    Now do the maths again and account for wealth, including housing assets.

    Pensioners are, as a class, fucking loaded.
    £185.15 a week is not maths. It is looking at the government web site that tells you what the state pension pays.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get

    That many pensioners are loaded should not hide that lots more are struggling.
  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,386

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    In 6 years time I can claim about 170 per week to add to my teacher pension.

    The older rate is much less mind.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,718

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £140 per week, but rises depending on what you earned when you were working (if employed)
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    Now do the maths again and account for wealth, including housing assets.

    Pensioners are, as a class, fucking loaded.
    Most pensioners reliant solely on the state pension without a private workplace pension will be in social housing or renting
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,443
    Fishing said:

    Off topic

    I was in town today and took the opportunity to ride Crossrail on its first official day, as I was mildly curious to discover what £20 billion buys you in 2022. On the whole I was moderately impressed, at least compared to other government procurement cockups or wastes of similar magnitude, like the Olympics or Northern Ireland.

    It is fast and fairly smooth, apart from the need to change at Paddington and Liverpool Street. Hopefully those will be sorted out next year. And it obviously isn't great that Bond Street isn't open yet.

    A distinctly weird touch was just outside Paddington station, where a group of young lovelies in Crossrail t-shirts were singing "Purple Train, Purple Train, Purple Train".

    Can we have £20bn in the north for rail perhaps? Northern Powerhouse Rail* would be lovely. Or four-tracking the Castlefield corridor. Or a Metro tunnel under Manchester. You could approach getting all three done for £20bn, as well as whatever schemes Leeds and Liverpool and Sheffield have in mind. OK, thought not.

    *The point of which, as I never tire of pointing out, isn't to get from Manchester to Leeds 20 minutes quicker - although that would be nice - it's to separate out fast trains and stopping trains - the combination of which on a two-track railway kills capacity and reliability, due to the need to leave such a long gap between the stopping train and the fast train. So NPR gives us the potential for frequent and reliable suburban services.
  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,386

    The average pensioner also earns more than the average worker.

    How on earth do you end up with a country like that?

    I wish....
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991

    HYUFD said:

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Well said TSE.

    NI wouldn't be going up if the parasites had to pay it too.

    Unfortunately no party advocates standing up to the parasites and ensuring people who work for a living get to keep their own wages instead of getting it all taken off them by parasites.

    Workers need an Atlas Shrugged moment to rid themselves of the parasites trying to live off other people's backs, but who is going to be prepared to stand up to the grey vote?
    Most pensioners relying on the state pension are not well off. Workers earning under £35,000 have got a NI cut this year. They are the 2 core Tory target voters ie pensioners and low to average earning redwall voters.

    Yes voters earning over £35,000 a year will see a NI rise but most of them live in London and after Westminster, Wandsworth and Barnet went Labour in the local elections along with the majority of London that already was Labour why should the Tories be that bothered about them? I myself fall into that category now but as a Tory strategist would prefer to pay a bit more NI rather than increase it for redwall voters and pensioners who we need to be re elected
    Because - and this is the difference between you and me - the Government is supposed to represent all the population, not just those that put it in power. And if the only way to win power is to betray everything you stand for, then what is the purpose of winning power anyway.

    Taxes should be equally payable by all, a proportion of society voting to exempt themselves from taxation and burden those who are paying with an even greater share isn't right, it isn't reasonable and it isn't good economics either. The Conservative Party of Thatcher understood that, even if you don't.

    If 70% of the population decided only 10% of the population should pay taxes, they could decide that democratically, but it wouldn't make it the right thing to do.

    If you want to engage in socialist welfare where taxes are burdened upon people who work for a living, in order to further featherbed the welfare state for providing generous and unfunded welfare for those who aren't working then feel free to do so. Its not the right thing to do though.
    Hence this government has correctly cut National Insurance for the majority of workers who earn less than £35k a year
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,706

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,443
    Cookie said:

    Another massive and apparently random bill from British Gas.

    Heart sinks as I realise that yet again I am going to have to go through the painful process of speaking to them.

    And then, after comfortably less than 10 minutes the phone is answered. And the (South African, it turns out) fella on the other end of the phone is entirely audible, friendly, helpful, initially as baffled by my bill as me, able to pick through the details of what has happened when, patient as I go through my records, understands what typical and unusual domestic usages are, and brings me to the conclusion that, er, while I have been getting a succession of massive bills from British Gas, I haven't actually been paying them. Apart from in a couple of instances in quite a limited way.

    In my defence, my bills have been confused by a rebate from my previous supplier which went bust and which was applied, disapplied and reapplied. So some of my bills have been covered by that.

    Still - while energy bills are a big problem, it turns out the main reason they have been horrific in my own case is that I've only actually paid out about £400 in the last 8 months so have been building up a big debit. Phew. Never been so relieved to pay a bill.

    While I'm on about giving credit to surprising people, hooray for the French, who are apparently just as disgusted with the West Ham cat torturers as we are.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/05/24/west-ham-defender-kurt-zouma-admits-kicking-cat/

    "Trevor Burke QC, defending Kurt, said he had lost his Adidas sponsorship as a result of the incident and has not returned to his home country of France as "there has been equal hostility" towards him there as there has been in the UK."

    Yoan responded: "We never had animals before. Maybe that's why we don't know how to manage these cats."
    Utter filth, the pair of them.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 32,938
    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104
  • Options
    BurgessianBurgessian Posts: 2,438
    I heard Andrew Neil opining on the radio a few days ago that three contemporary politicians defy normal conventions when it comes to their record and electoral success: Trump, Boris and Sturgeon. Actually, I think he's wrong. Really, only Sturgeon fits the bill.

    This thread from former Scots Labour leader Jim Murphy, in which he looks at Sturgeon's "defining" mission to improve education, perfectly illustrates the point. The stats are irrefutable.

    https://twitter.com/glasgowmurphy/status/1529078734539595780

    "As Scotland tumbled down international league tables on every area measured by PISA, the SNP withdrew Scotland from international education league tables incl. Trends in International Maths & Science Study & Progress in International Reading Literacy Studies..."
  • Options
    Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 2,746

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    The state pension is a pittance, and it would be unfair that the poorest pensioners had a real term cut. Those living on cushy final salary pensions, however…

    What is a cushy final salary pension anyway? My final salary teaching pension is barely 250 a week for 32 years in the scheme. I won't get my state pension for 6 years so that's my lot. Out of that I have to find 50 a week for energy, so we are hardly cushy.
    Yes, that certainly isn't cushy. I didn't say every person on a final salary scheme was in a good financial position, did I?
    True, but the way some people speak they assume that all pensioners are rich as cresus and go on cruises every season.
    Once people have decided "most people on cruises are pensioners" = "most pensioners go on cruises" it's hard to talk them back down to reality.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    £185.15 a week of relatively untaxed and potentially disposable income is more than many working families take home though. Especially when considering that working families normally have to pay rent or a mortgage whereas many pensioners do not.

    Why should workers be seeing their pay potentially stagnate while taxes rise, while pensioners not paying taxes get welfare improved for them?
    Yes there are lots of poor people despite a dozen years of Tory hegemony. Who said workers should see their pay stagnate (aside from the government)?
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,706
    edited May 2022
    Cookie said:

    Cookie said:

    Another massive and apparently random bill from British Gas.

    Heart sinks as I realise that yet again I am going to have to go through the painful process of speaking to them.

    And then, after comfortably less than 10 minutes the phone is answered. And the (South African, it turns out) fella on the other end of the phone is entirely audible, friendly, helpful, initially as baffled by my bill as me, able to pick through the details of what has happened when, patient as I go through my records, understands what typical and unusual domestic usages are, and brings me to the conclusion that, er, while I have been getting a succession of massive bills from British Gas, I haven't actually been paying them. Apart from in a couple of instances in quite a limited way.

    In my defence, my bills have been confused by a rebate from my previous supplier which went bust and which was applied, disapplied and reapplied. So some of my bills have been covered by that.

    Still - while energy bills are a big problem, it turns out the main reason they have been horrific in my own case is that I've only actually paid out about £400 in the last 8 months so have been building up a big debit. Phew. Never been so relieved to pay a bill.

    While I'm on about giving credit to surprising people, hooray for the French, who are apparently just as disgusted with the West Ham cat torturers as we are.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/05/24/west-ham-defender-kurt-zouma-admits-kicking-cat/

    "Trevor Burke QC, defending Kurt, said he had lost his Adidas sponsorship as a result of the incident and has not returned to his home country of France as "there has been equal hostility" towards him there as there has been in the UK."

    Yoan responded: "We never had animals before. Maybe that's why we don't know how to manage these cats."
    Utter filth, the pair of them.
    Funny, isn't it? One day it's moggy-being-unkind-to, the next it's saving moggies and doggies that hit the headlines.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
    Where do you think the rise in NI for those earning over £35k is going? The NHS and social care
  • Options
    FishingFishing Posts: 4,561
    Cookie said:

    Fishing said:

    Off topic

    I was in town today and took the opportunity to ride Crossrail on its first official day, as I was mildly curious to discover what £20 billion buys you in 2022. On the whole I was moderately impressed, at least compared to other government procurement cockups or wastes of similar magnitude, like the Olympics or Northern Ireland.

    It is fast and fairly smooth, apart from the need to change at Paddington and Liverpool Street. Hopefully those will be sorted out next year. And it obviously isn't great that Bond Street isn't open yet.

    A distinctly weird touch was just outside Paddington station, where a group of young lovelies in Crossrail t-shirts were singing "Purple Train, Purple Train, Purple Train".

    Can we have £20bn in the north for rail perhaps? Northern Powerhouse Rail* would be lovely. Or four-tracking the Castlefield corridor. Or a Metro tunnel under Manchester. You could approach getting all three done for £20bn, as well as whatever schemes Leeds and Liverpool and Sheffield have in mind. OK, thought not.

    *The point of which, as I never tire of pointing out, isn't to get from Manchester to Leeds 20 minutes quicker - although that would be nice - it's to separate out fast trains and stopping trains - the combination of which on a two-track railway kills capacity and reliability, due to the need to leave such a long gap between the stopping train and the fast train. So NPR gives us the potential for frequent and reliable suburban services.
    In fairness to the government, I think only about a third of the funding is a direct government grant. About a third was meant to come from the London city government, who would be less likely to contribute to the projects you suggest. And the remaining third is bonds to be paid back by passengers through ticket revenue.

    Of course, those were the original assumptions, and the overruns, delays and fall in passenger numbers will have changed them.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,628
    The foxes brought a new present today; a coconut. They have never done that before. They send our dog bonkers.

    I would like to load a short video, but can't seem to do it. Help needed please? It will let me load a picture.

    @Leon Did you see my post at the end of the last thread re train from Lisbon to Faro and then train along the coast.

    Re legs - having got frustrated at the lack of progress I seem to have had a sudden leap (not literally). I walked about 500m with a crutch today and now walk around the house without one. Coming down stairs is a bugger. These improvements continue as I have a fair bit of walking planned for Portugal.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
    Where do you think the rise in NI for those earning over £35k is going? The NHS and social care
    We need to train more dentists and perhaps subsidise dental practices in less affluent areas.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 53,985
    Fishing said:

    Off topic

    I was in town today and took the opportunity to ride Crossrail on its first official day, as I was mildly curious to discover what £20 billion buys you in 2022. On the whole I was moderately impressed, at least compared to other government procurement cockups or wastes of similar magnitude, like the Olympics or Northern Ireland.

    It is fast and fairly smooth, apart from the need to change at Paddington and Liverpool Street. Hopefully those will be sorted out next year. And it obviously isn't great that Bond Street isn't open yet.

    A distinctly weird touch was just outside Paddington station, where a group of young lovelies in Crossrail t-shirts were singing "Purple Train, Purple Train, Purple Train".

    How easy is it to get between the Heathrow Express and Elizabeth Line platforms?
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,628
    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    Now do the maths again and account for wealth, including housing assets.

    Pensioners are, as a class, fucking loaded.
    Most pensioners reliant solely on the state pension without a private workplace pension will be in social housing or renting
    Cough. I think you will find there are quite a few of us who don't have that and have other plans and who aren't renting or in social housing.
  • Options
    novanova Posts: 525
    Scott_xP said:

    ** In today's Chopper's Politics Newsletter - three 'no confidence' letters in Boris Johnson have been submitted since the local elections.
    The number submitted to 1922 chairman Sir Graham Brady now stands in the high 40s, according to one rebel Tory. ** http://telegraph.co.uk/tw-chopper-nl https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1529094971936190464/photo/1

    I wonder if the Tories ever regret this system.

    It seems that with the trickle of letters, discussions about no confidence votes are nearly always around.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,735
    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    Not a fan of that approach. Politicians getting involved in how the police deal with other politicians should be reserved for the most serious offences only.

    It is clear he broke the rules on multiple occasions and lied on even more. It is clear the Tory party will do nothing about it. Let's see what the electorate do (and I don't think it is a slam dunk either way).
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    State pension is set to soar 10 PER CENT after Government confirms triple lock will be restored... but No10 warns public sector workers not to expect pay hikes to match inflation

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10849513/State-pension-set-soar-10-CENT-No10-warns-public-sector-workers-pay-rises.html

    What a parasitical generation of pensioners we have.

    Make them pay NI.
    Well said TSE.

    NI wouldn't be going up if the parasites had to pay it too.

    Unfortunately no party advocates standing up to the parasites and ensuring people who work for a living get to keep their own wages instead of getting it all taken off them by parasites.

    Workers need an Atlas Shrugged moment to rid themselves of the parasites trying to live off other people's backs, but who is going to be prepared to stand up to the grey vote?
    Most pensioners relying on the state pension are not well off. Workers earning under £35,000 have got a NI cut this year. They are the 2 core Tory target voters ie pensioners and low to average earning redwall voters.

    Yes voters earning over £35,000 a year will see a NI rise but most of them live in London and after Westminster, Wandsworth and Barnet went Labour in the local elections along with the majority of London that already was Labour why should the Tories be that bothered about them? I myself fall into that category now but as a Tory strategist would prefer to pay a bit more NI rather than increase it for redwall voters and pensioners who we need to be re elected
    Because - and this is the difference between you and me - the Government is supposed to represent all the population, not just those that put it in power. And if the only way to win power is to betray everything you stand for, then what is the purpose of winning power anyway.

    Taxes should be equally payable by all, a proportion of society voting to exempt themselves from taxation and burden those who are paying with an even greater share isn't right, it isn't reasonable and it isn't good economics either. The Conservative Party of Thatcher understood that, even if you don't.

    If 70% of the population decided only 10% of the population should pay taxes, they could decide that democratically, but it wouldn't make it the right thing to do.

    If you want to engage in socialist welfare where taxes are burdened upon people who work for a living, in order to further featherbed the welfare state for providing generous and unfunded welfare for those who aren't working then feel free to do so. Its not the right thing to do though.
    Hence this government has correctly cut National Insurance for the majority of workers who earn less than £35k a year
    Rishi is a political genius, aside from getting kneecapped by Number 10. As you say, many will see more pound coins in their July pay packets. Shame about inflation but more cash still counts.
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,443
    Fishing said:

    Cookie said:

    Fishing said:

    Off topic

    I was in town today and took the opportunity to ride Crossrail on its first official day, as I was mildly curious to discover what £20 billion buys you in 2022. On the whole I was moderately impressed, at least compared to other government procurement cockups or wastes of similar magnitude, like the Olympics or Northern Ireland.

    It is fast and fairly smooth, apart from the need to change at Paddington and Liverpool Street. Hopefully those will be sorted out next year. And it obviously isn't great that Bond Street isn't open yet.

    A distinctly weird touch was just outside Paddington station, where a group of young lovelies in Crossrail t-shirts were singing "Purple Train, Purple Train, Purple Train".

    Can we have £20bn in the north for rail perhaps? Northern Powerhouse Rail* would be lovely. Or four-tracking the Castlefield corridor. Or a Metro tunnel under Manchester. You could approach getting all three done for £20bn, as well as whatever schemes Leeds and Liverpool and Sheffield have in mind. OK, thought not.

    *The point of which, as I never tire of pointing out, isn't to get from Manchester to Leeds 20 minutes quicker - although that would be nice - it's to separate out fast trains and stopping trains - the combination of which on a two-track railway kills capacity and reliability, due to the need to leave such a long gap between the stopping train and the fast train. So NPR gives us the potential for frequent and reliable suburban services.
    In fairness to the government, I think only about a third of the funding is a direct government grant. About a third was meant to come from the London city government, who would be less likely to contribute to the projects you suggest. And the remaining third is bonds to be paid back by passengers through ticket revenue.

    Of course, those were the original assumptions, and the overruns, delays and fall in passenger numbers will have changed them.
    That's a fair point.
    No problem with local funding. Funding from ticket sales is trickier outside London. The value realised will be in increased viabailty of business and value of land in a better-connected North - there are ways to realise this, though you have to be very very careful in order to do it in such a way that you skim some of the value off, rather than simply eliminate it.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,417
    RobD said:

    The state pension is a pittance, and it would be unfair that the poorest pensioners had a real term cut. Those living on cushy final salary pensions, however…

    My father gets his state pension every four weeks, he transfers the entirety of it into a savings account he has set up for his grandkids.

    He's doing more for intergenerational fairness than Boris Johnson's government ever has and ever will.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,231
    If inflation is 10% someone earning at the top of the basic rate of income tax band will need a pay increase above 14% in order to see their post-tax income stay the same in real terms.

    The effect of fiscal drag at these high inflation rates is huge.

    There is going to be a large drop in real household disposable incomes, at the same time that government propaganda will be about tax cuts.

    I'm not sure how this is going to go. Will voters be grateful for the tax cuts, and not realise the effect of fiscal drag, or will the propaganda rile people up as they contrast it with the reality of having less money to spend?

    I know that if Osborne was the shadow Chancellor he'd be hammering home the message on fiscal drag. Are Labour letting the Tories get away with this?
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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,010
    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,417

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    During the pandemic we marked it online, because you know, we're not arseholes, and didn't want to spread Covid-19.

    We had most of them when restrictions ended.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,706
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
    Where do you think the rise in NI for those earning over £35k is going? The NHS and social care
    I have a nice gardeny bridge with flowers for you to buy.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,735
    nova said:

    Scott_xP said:

    ** In today's Chopper's Politics Newsletter - three 'no confidence' letters in Boris Johnson have been submitted since the local elections.
    The number submitted to 1922 chairman Sir Graham Brady now stands in the high 40s, according to one rebel Tory. ** http://telegraph.co.uk/tw-chopper-nl https://twitter.com/christopherhope/status/1529094971936190464/photo/1

    I wonder if the Tories ever regret this system.

    It seems that with the trickle of letters, discussions about no confidence votes are nearly always around.
    On the contrary it allows them to pretend they sympathise with the voters. Polling bad, brief to the media "oh we are nearly, nearly at the required number of votes because we really share your concerns". When the whole point of the anonymous system is no-one knows how many there actually are, Brady could even be making it up himself.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991
    edited May 2022
    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    Now do the maths again and account for wealth, including housing assets.

    Pensioners are, as a class, fucking loaded.
    Most pensioners reliant solely on the state pension without a private workplace pension will be in social housing or renting
    Cough. I think you will find there are quite a few of us who don't have that and have other plans and who aren't renting or in social housing.
    If you have any private pension plan you also do not rely solely on the state pension
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    Some were fined for this leaving do. And from the Panorama previews, it was more than thanks and goodbye. BBC2 7pm tonight.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61566410
  • Options
    FishingFishing Posts: 4,561
    edited May 2022
    rcs1000 said:

    Fishing said:

    Off topic

    I was in town today and took the opportunity to ride Crossrail on its first official day, as I was mildly curious to discover what £20 billion buys you in 2022. On the whole I was moderately impressed, at least compared to other government procurement cockups or wastes of similar magnitude, like the Olympics or Northern Ireland.

    It is fast and fairly smooth, apart from the need to change at Paddington and Liverpool Street. Hopefully those will be sorted out next year. And it obviously isn't great that Bond Street isn't open yet.

    A distinctly weird touch was just outside Paddington station, where a group of young lovelies in Crossrail t-shirts were singing "Purple Train, Purple Train, Purple Train".

    How easy is it to get between the Heathrow Express and Elizabeth Line platforms?
    The temporary westbound crossrail platforms at Paddington are right next to the HEx platforms if you want to head back to the airport.

    But the eastbound platforms are a completely different matter - across the station, down a couple of escalators and through two sets of ticket barriers. Allow ten minutes.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,628

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    My wife retired during the pandemic from a job she had been in for over a decade. Her leaving do was over zoom (and it was done well) with presents delivered to the house.
  • Options
    CookieCookie Posts: 11,443

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    Which would be fair enough were it not for the fact that we were being told not to see each other under pretty much any circumstances.
    There were more serious things that changing jobs which were prohibited from being marked in some way.

    The drinks is not the problem, for me. The problem is the rules and messaging and nudging which the rest of us were subject to.
    That's just me, though. Some were fine with the rules and are annoyed with Boris for breaking them. Which is an equally coherent position to take.
    See, partygate really does give something for everyone.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited May 2022

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    During the pandemic we marked it online, because you know, we're not arseholes, and didn't want to spread Covid-19.

    We had most of them when restrictions ended.
    Personally, I actually kinda of not that outraged by singing happy birthday or 10 mins saying goodbye to a colleague, or now the "horror" they weren't sitting there wearing masks 12hrs a day....when they were locked in the same small rooms for months on end and all gave each other covid.

    HOWEVER, that wasn't the situation, where they had a couple of minor gathering. It was clear that basically they had transported their usual weekend activities into Downing street and just boozed away the evenings...when a) against the rules and b) the situation was constantly evolving and required people to be making clear headed decisions around the clock, not be pissed up and then hung over in the morning. Lives were on the line.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,706
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
    Where do you think the rise in NI for those earning over £35k is going? The NHS and social care
    You were telling us many, many, many times that NI is not a 'tax' but a contribution to state pension.
  • Options
    ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    Not a fan of that approach. Politicians getting involved in how the police deal with other politicians should be reserved for the most serious offences only.

    It is clear he broke the rules on multiple occasions and lied on even more. It is clear the Tory party will do nothing about it. Let's see what the electorate do (and I don't think it is a slam dunk either way).
    Yes, it's interesting that politicians putting political pressure on the police is suddenly OK again.
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    The raging grey hypocrite SKS is in no position to moan about the Sue Gray report until Lab release of the Forde report, with no redactions.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,991
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
    Where do you think the rise in NI for those earning over £35k is going? The NHS and social care
    You were telling us many, many, many times that NI is not a 'tax' but a contribution to state pension.
    And to healthcare which is what it was also created to fund as well as contributory unemployment insurance and the state pension
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,417

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    During the pandemic we marked it online, because you know, we're not arseholes, and didn't want to spread Covid-19.

    We had most of them when restrictions ended.
    Personally, I actually kinda of not that outraged by singing happy birthday or 10 mins saying goodbye to a colleague, or now the "horror" they weren't sitting there wearing masks 12hrs a day....when they were locked in the same small rooms for months on end and all gave each other covid.

    HOWEVER, that wasn't the situation, where they had a couple of minor gathering. It was clear that basically they had transported their usual weekend activities into Downing street and just boozed away the evenings...when a) against the rules and b) the situation was constantly evolving and required people to be making clear headed decisions around the clock, not be pissed up and then hung over in the morning. Lives were on the line.
    The thing that annoys me no end, I could live with the occasional one off, but the sheer volume of them.

    I did like a comment a friend made, Boris Johnson delayed the obvious decisions on Covid-19 until it was the only option, why?

    I think we have a reason, he was pissed all the time.
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,735

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    I can just imagine the following Covid press conference:

    We have a question from a member of the audience. Bob is a manager of a call centre and Claire is leaving to go to another job. Bob wants to know if he can have a party to the early hours without social distancing as it would be quite sad if Claire did not get a boozy leaving do?

    Whitty: Yes, I think the covid virus would skip such an event and not transmit, as it would be very unfair on Claire otherwise.

    Vallance: Sounds completely essential for work to me.

    Johnson: Party like it's 1999, have one, or errrm, six for me!
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,735
    Applicant said:

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    Not a fan of that approach. Politicians getting involved in how the police deal with other politicians should be reserved for the most serious offences only.

    It is clear he broke the rules on multiple occasions and lied on even more. It is clear the Tory party will do nothing about it. Let's see what the electorate do (and I don't think it is a slam dunk either way).
    Yes, it's interesting that politicians putting political pressure on the police is suddenly OK again.
    Probably noticed it worked for Patel.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,706
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    And the suffering of those on low incomes? All those earning under £35k have now got a NI cut this year, only those earning over £35k will see a NI rise. Median salary in the UK? £31k so most workers will benefit from Sunak's NI plans. Median salary in London? £39k. So most Londoners will be hit but most of them vote Labour anyway.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/416139/full-time-annual-salary-in-the-uk-by-region/

    The poorest pensioners too will benefit from a state pension rise
    The idea that because some voters “vote Labour anyway” and can therefore be ignored by the government just tells me you’re an absolute moral nullity.
    Are those the people who don't get dental treatment any more because they don't matter? And it's their fault for being too poor to go private?

    https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/may/24/one-woman-took-out-13-of-her-own-teeth-the-terrifying-truth-about-britains-dental-crisis
    Where do you think the rise in NI for those earning over £35k is going? The NHS and social care
    You were telling us many, many, many times that NI is not a 'tax' but a contribution to state pension.
    And to healthcare which is what it was also created to fund as well as contributory unemployment insurance and the state pension
    Today is what today is, not what happened in the 1930s. This is what your favourite Tory party governm,ent says right today.

    https://www.gov.uk/national-insurance/what-national-insurance-is-for

    It's about pension and the dole. No mention of health or social care, the mobility allowance aside. And it's not enough to cover pensions. So you are talking, erm, terminological inexactitudes.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,628
    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    The news that pensioners are to get a 10% rise is downright disturbing.

    Are Labour or Lib Dens going to oppose it ?
    Doubt it. Very hard to oppose a giveaway.
    It stinks though, it can’t be defended, given the state of public services, government finances, and the suffering of those on low incomes.
    How much is the State Pension these days, out of interest?
    £185.15 a week. Lower than our continental friends. That is why the many pensioners without second incomes or massive private pensions (so no-one on pb) have to choose between heating and eating.
    https://www.gov.uk/new-state-pension/what-youll-get
    Now do the maths again and account for wealth, including housing assets.

    Pensioners are, as a class, fucking loaded.
    Most pensioners reliant solely on the state pension without a private workplace pension will be in social housing or renting
    Cough. I think you will find there are quite a few of us who don't have that and have other plans and who aren't renting or in social housing.
    If you have any private pension plan you also do not rely solely on the state pension
    I was being pedantic, but you shouldn't assume the options are state and workplace pensions only. In my circle of friends nearly all are retired, none are financial struggling, but I can't think of any that have a workplace pension. Most workplace pensions, except for public sector and the very high earners, are not likely to provide a good retirement these days due to longevity. For a comfortable retirement it has to be topped up in someway and some of us rely entirely on that top up.

    The downside is it is now a bugger to get a new credit card when asked what your income is. They can't cope with asset rich, income poor people.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,373

    The raging grey hypocrite SKS is in no position to moan about the Sue Gray report until Lab release of the Forde report, with no redactions.

    Was that the inquiry into look squirrels?
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,285
    edited May 2022

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    During the pandemic we marked it online, because you know, we're not arseholes, and didn't want to spread Covid-19.

    We had most of them when restrictions ended.
    Personally, I actually kinda of not that outraged by singing happy birthday or 10 mins saying goodbye to a colleague, or now the "horror" they weren't sitting there wearing masks 12hrs a day....when they were locked in the same small rooms for months on end and all gave each other covid.

    HOWEVER, that wasn't the situation, where they had a couple of minor gathering. It was clear that basically they had transported their usual weekend activities into Downing street and just boozed away the evenings...when a) against the rules and b) the situation was constantly evolving and required people to be making clear headed decisions around the clock, not be pissed up and then hung over in the morning. Lives were on the line.
    The thing that annoys me no end, I could live with the occasional one off, but the sheer volume of them.

    I did like a comment a friend made, Boris Johnson delayed the obvious decisions on Covid-19 until it was the only option, why?

    I think we have a reason, he was pissed all the time.
    This is why I have said from the start I think this focus on individual incidents misses the point, and which seems to have finally been made in that BBC whistle blower interview, which is the Big Dog fostered a culture where it was seen the thing you should to be to doing to let off stream with regular piss-ups.

    Not was the cake in or out the tupperware, or just how many minutes was Boris at the leaving do, that is irrelevant, it is the fact he was saying right chaps and chapesses, you are all working jolly hard, make sure you let your hair down, and clearly coming in when they were doing it, having a drink and then saying jolly good, carry on, which they did to excess....and obviously then claiming well I don't know anything about parties, all rules were followed.
  • Options
    ChelyabinskChelyabinsk Posts: 488
    edited May 2022

    RobD said:

    The state pension is a pittance, and it would be unfair that the poorest pensioners had a real term cut. Those living on cushy final salary pensions, however…

    What is a cushy final salary pension anyway? My final salary teaching pension is barely 250 a week for 32 years in the scheme. I won't get my state pension for 6 years so that's my lot. Out of that I have to find 50 a week for energy, so we are hardly cushy.
    A cushy final salary pension is one where employer contributions of almost 25% of your wage let you retire at 60 with a pension of a thousand pounds a month. No doubt it seems like a come-down for you, given that the fraction of 32/80 suggests you were on c.£48,000 per year before you retired - but most people in the private sector will work a lot longer than from age 28 to age 60 and retire on much less.
  • Options
    ApplicantApplicant Posts: 3,379

    Scott_xP said:

    BREAKING: Sadiq Khan has written to Acting Met Commissioner Sir Steve House demanding a public explanation as to why Boris was not fined for attending the Lee Cain leaving party. 1/
    https://twitter.com/evansma/status/1529102628155695104

    The obvious answer is that a leaving do was deemed reasonably necessary for work. Would you really see an employee leave without marking it in some way?
    During the pandemic we marked it online, because you know, we're not arseholes, and didn't want to spread Covid-19.

    We had most of them when restrictions ended.
    But you were all WFH anyway, right?
This discussion has been closed.