Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory. In any case Charles has already made clear he will have a more scaled down monarchy when he becomes King
I admire your energy at defining fellow PBers’ political tribe. How would you define me, out of interest?
Libertarian leaning
In the dictionary definition of the word, perhaps. Small l (as in the opposite of authoritarian).
Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory
Swing voter who has only voted Labour twice
And I am not centre right and Boris move to the left is nearer my politics then he is to yours
Centre left non Tory republican then, your politics now are even closer to Starmer's than Boris'
I am not near Starmer but Boris has left you behind and your attitude belongs to the 1950s and is very unattractive
You do the party no service by your narrow minded attitudes that are frankly embarrassing
You are certainly closer to Starmer in your views than you are to the views of most Tory members and indeed most Tory voters now.
If we're going to pick a single time then surely the only sensible thing to do is keep GMT all year around.
If you want to get up earlier or later, that's your choice. But kids going to school in daylight hours rather than when its dark is sensible.
GMT all year round for me too!
It already gets light far too early for partying in the summer months. Why on Earth would you want it to get light even earlier? Better to be light in the evenings when you can enjoy it, rather than wrecking the vibe by getting light at 3am!
You can just get up earlier and then start partying earlier. You can change the time of the alarm on your clock more easily than changing all the times on all the clocks.
I like the clock change. It's quirky and pointless, an 'art for art's sake' sort of thing. Also what's good, and what I do, is you can save that hour created from thin air at 2 am today and use it when you really need it, a bit like the joker in It's a Knockout. As yet I haven't used this one and I might not for ages. Point is to wait until I really need it, eg when I'm running late for something important. That could easily not be until next year since I rarely have important appointments and when I do I'm obsessively punctual. But it will happen and when it does, whoosh, I'll whip out my hour and save the day. It becomes real time if you do this. There's a deadline, though, which is March when the clocks go forward. If you don't use it by then you lose it. So I make sure not to get caught out by that. None of this would be possible if we didn't move the clocks, so I'm a fan of it. I'd even vote for doing it more often.
Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory
Swing voter who has only voted Labour twice
And I am not centre right and Boris move to the left is nearer my politics then he is to yours
Centre left non Tory republican then, your politics now are even closer to Starmer's than Boris'
I am not near Starmer but Boris has left you behind and your attitude belongs to the 1950s and is very unattractive
You do the party no service by your narrow minded attitudes that are frankly embarrassing
Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory
Swing voter who has only voted Labour twice
And I am not centre right and Boris move to the left is nearer my politics then he is to yours
Centre left non Tory republican then, your politics now are even closer to Starmer's than Boris'
You’re not a conservative, either, more a dogmatic reactionary.
Though you are a Tory, it’s more tribal than ideological.
UK steel makers 'left behind' as US ends trade war https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59113868 President Biden has signed a deal to end tariffs on steel imports from the EU, which were imposed by his predecessor Donald Trump. But the agreement does not cover exports from the UK, putting British steelmakers at a disadvantage. Trade body UK Steel said a deal for British producers was "sorely needed". The tariffs, which came into force in 2018, nearly halved British steel exports to the US, Gareth Stace, director general of UK Steel, said. The US is the second-largest market for British-made steel. But the new deal will put UK producers at a competitive disadvantage compared to European rivals who will be able to ship their products to the US without paying import taxes.…
I like the clock change. It's quirky and pointless, an 'art for art's sake' sort of thing. Also what's good, and what I do, is you can save that hour created from thin air at 2 am today and use it when you really need it, a bit like the joker in It's a Knockout. As yet I haven't used this one and I might not for ages. Point is to wait until I really need it, eg when I'm running late for something important. That could easily not be until next year since I rarely have important appointments and when I do I'm obsessively punctual. But it will happen and when it does, whoosh, I'll whip out my hour and save the day. It becomes real time if you do this. There's a deadline, though, which is March when the clocks go forward. If you don't use it by then you lose it. So I make sure not to get caught out by that. None of this would be possible if we didn't move the clocks, so I'm a fan of it. I'd even vote for doing it more often.
Your quirky clock change has a large negative effect on people's health.
Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism
and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory
Swing voter who has only voted Labour twice
And I am not centre right and Boris move to the left is nearer my politics then he is to yours
Centre left non Tory republican then, your politics now are even closer to Starmer's than Boris'
You’re not a conservative, either, more a dogmatic reactionary.
Though you are a Tory, it’s more tribal than ideological.
In Britain of course a conservative is defined as a Tory.
That is what differentiates a UK conservative from a US conservative. A UK conservative is a monarchist whereas a US conservative is a republican just sharing some pro small government and socially conservative principles with their UK conservative cousins. Typically too a UK conservative will be Anglican by practice or heritage while most US conservatives will now be evangelical.
In the same way a Canadian conservative can also be a Tory like a UK conservative as some of the loyalists to the crown after the War of Independence was lost fled to Canada, which still has a monarchy unlike the US. Similarly supporters and representatives of the Australian conservative coalition of Liberals and Nationals given Australia also retains the Crown are too sometimes referred to as Tories by their Labor opponents
I found one article that advocated permanent summer time, but then it said that school start times would have to be changed to later so children wouldn't have to travel to school in the dark, and work times also moved later so that their parents would be able to take their children to school and that is exactly what I said would happen, and would negate entirely the supposed point of being on summer time.
Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism
and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory
Swing voter who has only voted Labour twice
And I am not centre right and Boris move to the left is nearer my politics then he is to yours
Centre left non Tory republican then, your politics now are even closer to Starmer's than Boris'
You’re not a conservative, either, more a dogmatic reactionary.
Though you are a Tory, it’s more tribal than ideological.
In Britain of course a conservative is defined as a Tory.
That is what differentiates a UK conservative from a US conservative, a UK conservative is monarchist whereas a US conservative is just pro small government and socially conservative.
In the same way a Canadian conservative can also be a Tory like a UK conservative as some of the loyalists to the crown after the War of Independence was lost fled to Canada (which still has a monarchy) unlike the US. Similarly supporters and representatives of the Australian conservative coalition of Liberals and Nationals given Australia also retains the Crown are too sometimes referred to as Tories by their Labor opponents
No, you’re just talking about party labels. As I said, you’re a tribalist.
Blimey, HYUFD, are you trying to cancel everyone who 'isn't a conservative'? That's going to be a very long list for people who don't meet your high standards.
I don't think the abolition of the monarchy after the queen is a particularly fringe opinion. My guess is that around 30-40% of this board would agree with it, along with a good number of Conservative voters.
Being a monarchist is one of the core principles of being a British conservative. If you do not support the monarchy then by definition you can never be a conservative in the UK and never be a Tory.
30-40% of the electorate may become republicans once the Queen goes, not a single one of them will be a conservative. Most of will be socialists, the minority who happen to support the Conservative Party are not conservatives, merely centre right libertarians or liberals just voting for the Conservative Party to keep Labour out
Utter and complete nonsense
I have been a republican most of my life though I an very fond of the Queen
After the Queen passes we need a much scaled own monarchy
And I have been a conservative many years more than you have been on this planet
Yes and as a former New Labour voter who voted for Blair twice and is no longer a committed Tory supporter you are not a conservative either, so thanks for proving my point.
You are just a centre right leaning swing voter who dislikes socialism
and likes the Queen but has no loyalty to monarchy as an institution. By definition therefore you are not a Tory
Swing voter who has only voted Labour twice
And I am not centre right and Boris move to the left is nearer my politics then he is to yours
Centre left non Tory republican then, your politics now are even closer to Starmer's than Boris'
You’re not a conservative, either, more a dogmatic reactionary.
Though you are a Tory, it’s more tribal than ideological.
In Britain of course a conservative is defined as a Tory.
That is what differentiates a UK conservative from a US conservative, a UK conservative is monarchist whereas a US conservative is just pro small government and socially conservative.
In the same way a Canadian conservative can also be a Tory like a UK conservative as some of the loyalists to the crown after the War of Independence was lost fled to Canada (which still has a monarchy) unlike the US. Similarly supporters and representatives of the Australian conservative coalition of Liberals and Nationals given Australia also retains the Crown are too sometimes referred to as Tories by their Labor opponents
No, you’re just talking about party labels. As I said, you’re a tribalist.
Surprised that most people care. If you live in an urban area it's generally illuminated when it's not natural daylight. If you can see where you're going, who cares if it's daylight?
Surprised that most people care. If you live in an urban area it's generally illuminated when it's not natural daylight. If you can see where you're going, who cares if it's daylight?
Will no one think of the overburdened cats's eyes?
Surprised that most people care. If you live in an urban area it's generally illuminated when it's not natural daylight. If you can see where you're going, who cares if it's daylight?
Well 1) I don't know about the streetlights where you are, but even with the streetlights on it's usually a lot darker at night. I was out briefly tonight and I really struggled to see anything at all. Halloween costumes largely lost on me. And if safety is a concern, we are much less safe when it's dark. Was a filthy night tonight though, but also 2) even if the streets were perfectly illuminated, it's simply unpleasant to rise before it gets light. As a new parent, I could cope reasonably happily when the day started at 5am in the summer. But starting at 5am in the winter is bleak and hard.
Surprised that most people care. If you live in an urban area it's generally illuminated when it's not natural daylight. If you can see where you're going, who cares if it's daylight?
Will no one think of the overburdened cats's eyes?
Are there countries in Europe that do not yet use cats' eyes?
(It's a new one to get the apostrophe correct and doubling the s )
I've just seen that the French government has started raising the possibility of postponing the independence referendum in New Caledonia "for health reasons".
What's the point of having constant referenda on New Caledonian independence which always results (for demographic reasons) in a vote to remain part of France.
The last one was 53/47 so it's not unwinnable for the pro-independence side.
If Macron wants to keep them he will be sweating.
They set up a series of three at couple of year intervals, and the first two have gone 56/44 and 53/47 ...
Surprised that most people care. If you live in an urban area it's generally illuminated when it's not natural daylight. If you can see where you're going, who cares if it's daylight?
The quality of light is massively different, which has a direct bearing on things like trying to avoid broken glass when cycling, etc. Streetlights don't help you generate vitamin D either. It's generally warmer when there's sunlight. It's very important for mood.
The clock is, of course, entirely arbitrary. We could have a day of 60 (shorter) hours if we wanted, etc, but the clock we have is defined with noon when the sun is at its zenith, since the railways this modified for everyone in a common area to have the same time as a reference point.
So it would be really bizarre never to have our time to match that definition.
Aside from that, changing the clocks is shown to have many negative impacts and the argument in favour of summer time, or CET, or single-double summertime essentially amounts to wanting the government to trick people into setting their alarm clocks earlier, instead of doing it themselves, which is pathetic, and I'm embarrassed so much of the country holds that opinion.
Surprised that most people care. If you live in an urban area it's generally illuminated when it's not natural daylight. If you can see where you're going, who cares if it's daylight?
Will no one think of the overburdened cats's eyes?
Are there countries in Europe that do not yet use cats' eyes?
(It's a new one to get the apostrophe correct and doubling the s )
It's late. And it's been dark since, like, four o'clock.
One joyous occasion which I missed last year was the first day in February of leaving work in the daylight. On the other hand, some years the only thing which gets me through the first two weeks of January is tracking the achingly slow progress by which the sunrise time edges back to 8am. I don't think I'm unusual in this - coinciding properly with daylight is hugely beneficial to mood. Our GMT/BST arrangement essentially maximises this.
Ooh, rabbits! Happy All Saints' Day. Let's put October behind us.
I think I am the only person left who properly looks forward to bonfire night. Since the kids were very small we've been doing a fireworks party in the back garden with seven or eight other families. Missed it last year for covid reasons. Looking forward to restarting that particular November tradition. Also looking forward to restarting the November tradition of a sunset family walk up Arnside Knott, followed by tea at the Albion. Missed that last year too. And looking forward to making the Christmas cake. Also looking forward in November to my first weekend free of parental responsibilities since (good grief) May 2018. Seeing some friends I haven't seen since before the pandemic. Feels like life is back on track...
If we're going to pick a single time then surely the only sensible thing to do is keep GMT all year around.
If you want to get up earlier or later, that's your choice. But kids going to school in daylight hours rather than when its dark is sensible.
GMT all year round for me too!
It already gets light far too early for partying in the summer months. Why on Earth would you want it to get light even earlier? Better to be light in the evenings when you can enjoy it, rather than wrecking the vibe by getting light at 3am!
You can just get up earlier and then start partying earlier. You can change the time of the alarm on your clock more easily than changing all the times on all the clocks.
Comments
https://lovin.ie/amp/news/did-you-know-ireland-had-its-very-own-time-zone-until-not-so-long-ago
Boris is of course a committed monarchist too
The rest of your post is correct.
Though you are a Tory, it’s more tribal than ideological.
The Netherlands was on Amsterdam time until they were occupied.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59113868
President Biden has signed a deal to end tariffs on steel imports from the EU, which were imposed by his predecessor Donald Trump.
But the agreement does not cover exports from the UK, putting British steelmakers at a disadvantage.
Trade body UK Steel said a deal for British producers was "sorely needed".
The tariffs, which came into force in 2018, nearly halved British steel exports to the US, Gareth Stace, director general of UK Steel, said.
The US is the second-largest market for British-made steel. But the new deal will put UK producers at a competitive disadvantage compared to European rivals who will be able to ship their products to the US without paying import taxes.…
https://www.euractiv.com/section/social-europe-jobs/news/killer-clocks-scientists-count-the-health-and-economic-costs-of-changing-the-time/
That is what differentiates a UK conservative from a US conservative. A UK conservative is a monarchist whereas a US conservative is a republican just sharing some pro small government and socially conservative principles with their UK conservative cousins. Typically too a UK conservative will be Anglican by practice or heritage while most US conservatives will now be evangelical.
In the same way a Canadian conservative can also be a Tory like a UK conservative as some of the loyalists to the crown after the War of Independence was lost fled to Canada, which still has a monarchy unlike the US. Similarly supporters and representatives of the Australian conservative coalition of Liberals and Nationals given Australia also retains the Crown are too sometimes referred to as Tories by their Labor opponents
https://theconversation.com/amp/heres-what-happens-the-day-after-the-clocks-change-106243
As I said, you’re a tribalist.
Sunder Katwala
@sundersays
PM's net zero messaging. This would seem well pitched to the themes that resonate in Billericay (and broad public, including Conservative, opinion).
https://twitter.com/sundersays/status/1454922878252617731
Politics For All
@PoliticsForAlI
NEW: White House press secretary Jen Psaki - who works closely with Biden - has Covid
2) even if the streets were perfectly illuminated, it's simply unpleasant to rise before it gets light. As a new parent, I could cope reasonably happily when the day started at 5am in the summer. But starting at 5am in the winter is bleak and hard.
(It's a new one to get the apostrophe correct and doubling the s
They set up a series of three at couple of year intervals, and the first two have gone 56/44 and 53/47 ...
The clock is, of course, entirely arbitrary. We could have a day of 60 (shorter) hours if we wanted, etc, but the clock we have is defined with noon when the sun is at its zenith, since the railways this modified for everyone in a common area to have the same time as a reference point.
So it would be really bizarre never to have our time to match that definition.
Aside from that, changing the clocks is shown to have many negative impacts and the argument in favour of summer time, or CET, or single-double summertime essentially amounts to wanting the government to trick people into setting their alarm clocks earlier, instead of doing it themselves, which is pathetic, and I'm embarrassed so much of the country holds that opinion.
On the other hand, some years the only thing which gets me through the first two weeks of January is tracking the achingly slow progress by which the sunrise time edges back to 8am.
I don't think I'm unusual in this - coinciding properly with daylight is hugely beneficial to mood.
Our GMT/BST arrangement essentially maximises this.
THIS THREAD's CLOCK HAS BEEN MOVED FORWARD.
I think I am the only person left who properly looks forward to bonfire night. Since the kids were very small we've been doing a fireworks party in the back garden with seven or eight other families. Missed it last year for covid reasons. Looking forward to restarting that particular November tradition.
Also looking forward to restarting the November tradition of a sunset family walk up Arnside Knott, followed by tea at the Albion. Missed that last year too. And looking forward to making the Christmas cake.
Also looking forward in November to my first weekend free of parental responsibilities since (good grief) May 2018. Seeing some friends I haven't seen since before the pandemic. Feels like life is back on track...