politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » In the past 6 weeks EU referendum polls have ranged from a
politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » In the past 6 weeks EU referendum polls have ranged from a 3% LEAVE lead to a 19% REMAIN one
The chart above is based on the difference between the REMAIN and LEAVE figures, before netting off the don’t knows, in all the EU referendum polls since the beginning of September.
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First, glorious first!0
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One explanation for the wild swings in polling returns might be that no-one outside of us policy nerds has really focused on the issue and the public are broadly ambivalent about membership, thus the day's latest EU news (blunder or smaller snafu) can be having a large but temporary affect on how the public responds to the polling questions.0
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I think there's a lot of truth in that:MTimT said:One explanation for the wild swings in polling returns might be that no-one outside of us policy nerds has really focused on the issue and the public are broadly ambivalent about membership, thus the day's latest EU news (blunder or smaller snafu) can be having a large but temporary affect on how the public responds to the polling questions.
Greece and/or migrant crisis = Leave...
All quiet on the Eurozone front = Stay...0 -
As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.0
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I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").0 -
Possibly true but I think the turnout will be relatively high either way - this is not like the AV referendumrcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").
On another topi the Spanish GE polling very interesting with Ciudadanos as king-makers - which way will they swing? Hopefully with the PP provided they clean up their act because the ir economic policies have in fact begun to work.0 -
That graph reminds me very much of the sort of graphs we saw in the run up to the GE with a whole series of polls indicating that there was basically a tie and the odd, obviously rogue, poll showing a big tory lead. I think we have yet to have an adequate or even vaguely coherent explanation of that from the pollsters themselves so they are selling wares of very dubious quality and provenance.
All that said this is a genuinely difficult question in which neither the remain or the leave options are even close to being adequately defined as yet. Whether they ever will be in moot but right now this policy geek is probably a don't know.
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My feeling is that Citizen's are regarded as centre-right and not corrupt. I also suspect that they will go with whichever of the PP and PSOE ends up on top, which will almost certainly be the PP. (The last 10 opinion polls range from a 9% PP lead to a 0.1% PSOE lead.)felix said:
Possibly true but I think the turnout will be relatively high either way - this is not like the AV referendumrcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").
On another topi the Spanish GE polling very interesting with Ciudadanos as king-makers - which way will they swing? Hopefully with the PP provided they clean up their act because the ir economic policies have in fact begun to work.
It's nice that the Spanish electorate seem to have given up on the nutters Podemos.0 -
Moi aussiDavidL said:That graph reminds me very much of the sort of graphs we saw in the run up to the GE with a whole series of polls indicating that there was basically a tie and the odd, obviously rogue, poll showing a big tory lead. I think we have yet to have an adequate or even vaguely coherent explanation of that from the pollsters themselves so they are selling wares of very dubious quality and provenance.
All that said this is a genuinely difficult question in which neither the remain or the leave options are even close to being adequately defined as yet. Whether they ever will be in moot but right now this policy geek is probably a don't know.
Mind you, if I think that STAY has a 3:2 lead come the referendum itself, I'll probably take that as a free pass to QUIT.
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ICM Online is pretty stable.
Status Quo will win.0 -
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Even within this group of policy nerds, there is a considerable degree of Leave but Stay but Leave but.... Heart says Leave, head says mebbe......MTimT said:One explanation for the wild swings in polling returns might be that no-one outside of us policy nerds has really focused on the issue and the public are broadly ambivalent about membership, thus the day's latest EU news (blunder or smaller snafu) can be having a large but temporary affect on how the public responds to the polling questions.
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The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd80 -
Prime Minister Miliband approves of your basing the vote on polling.Innocent_Abroad said:
Moi aussiDavidL said:That graph reminds me very much of the sort of graphs we saw in the run up to the GE with a whole series of polls indicating that there was basically a tie and the odd, obviously rogue, poll showing a big tory lead. I think we have yet to have an adequate or even vaguely coherent explanation of that from the pollsters themselves so they are selling wares of very dubious quality and provenance.
All that said this is a genuinely difficult question in which neither the remain or the leave options are even close to being adequately defined as yet. Whether they ever will be in moot but right now this policy geek is probably a don't know.
Mind you, if I think that STAY has a 3:2 lead come the referendum itself, I'll probably take that as a free pass to QUIT.
;-)0 -
On constitutional and social issues Ciudadanos is far closer to PSOE. Economically they are closer to PP. it's always worth remembering the party has its roots in Catalonia and there the PP is regarded, quite rightly, as a major impediment to getting the changes needed to resolve the current stand-off. PP has also said that the continuation of Rajoy as Spanish PM in a coalition is a non-negotiable.rcs1000 said:
My feeling is that Citizen's are regarded as centre-right and not corrupt. I also suspect that they will go with whichever of the PP and PSOE ends up on top, which will almost certainly be the PP. (The last 10 opinion polls range from a 9% PP lead to a 0.1% PSOE lead.)felix said:
Possibly true but I think the turnout will be relatively high either way - this is not like the AV referendumrcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").
On another topi the Spanish GE polling very interesting with Ciudadanos as king-makers - which way will they swing? Hopefully with the PP provided they clean up their act because the ir economic policies have in fact begun to work.
It's nice that the Spanish electorate seem to have given up on the nutters Podemos.
PP has lost a huge amount of support since the last GE and to stay in power will have to compromise hugely. It's never given the impression of being able or willing to do that - especially when it comes to its Spanish nationalism.
Post-December will be a big test for C's. And for the PP. Spain needs a stable government, it desparately needs to put its constitutional issues to bed, there is corruption on the left and right to tackle, and the recovery has to be maintained. A deal is possible, but will need PP to be grown-up in a way that it often struggles to be.
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Despite England crashing out of the World Cup some very good news at last. Englishman wins major international tournament .
Must be a front runner for SPOTY ( do your own research etc)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-344862800 -
Good morning, everyone.
I still hold the view that In will won by a fairly comfortable margin (I previously thought the margin would be larger, but Merkel's doing her best to help Out).0 -
Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.
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The "rich" countries in the Gulf, the US and UK protectorates created the IS problem. An organisation does not come out of nowhere and occupy a third of an entire country. It needs resources to begin with.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.
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The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
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That may well be so. But that does not mean that Britain has an obligation to let people into this country. My point was that the person being interviewed seemed to think that this was primarily Britain's problem to resolve and that we were not doing our "fair" share without really explaining how she was determining what was "fair".surbiton said:
The "rich" countries in the Gulf, the US and UK protectorates created the IS problem. An organisation does not come out of nowhere and occupy a third of an entire country. It needs resources to begin with.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.0 -
I think that's right. I'm also not sure this polling will be particularly valuable until the renegotiation deal is on the table with Cameron's endorsement.rcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").0 -
So, in other words, she offered nothing new.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.0 -
Mr. Royale, not sure I agree. The negotiated deal (assuming we don't have the surprise of Cameron going for Out, which I think very unlikely) will be seen through the prism that's been created by the debate up to that point.0
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I thought judges were supposed to be impartial. How old fashioned I am.
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Cyclefree
"There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more."
She was a British retired judge. Why on earth should she be talking about what other countries should do? That's what Farage does.
Passing humanitarian responsibilities to others is not actually very humanitarian0 -
Until the proximity of the ballot paper is imminent I would be sceptical of the polling. While there is a certain weariness with Europe, this is a country much more at ease with European cultures and peoples than it was 40 years ago. The prospect of stag weekends in Talinn or Hen weekends in Barcelona would have seemed absurd then, but are unremarkeable now.Casino_Royale said:
I think that's right. I'm also not sure this polling will be particularly valuable until the renegotiation deal is on the table with Cameron's endorsement.rcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").0 -
There is a strong natural default to Remain amongst floating voters. Because the economy is doing ok, it will be easy to produce a list attributing the threat to that if we leave the EU (although I disagree) - conversely, Leave is a many headed beast and it will be hard to paint a clear picture of the alternative. Instead, there will be several, and Remain will try and exploit that as unclear and risky.rcs1000 said:
I think there's a lot of truth in that:MTimT said:One explanation for the wild swings in polling returns might be that no-one outside of us policy nerds has really focused on the issue and the public are broadly ambivalent about membership, thus the day's latest EU news (blunder or smaller snafu) can be having a large but temporary affect on how the public responds to the polling questions.
Greece and/or migrant crisis = Leave...
All quiet on the Eurozone front = Stay...
The best bet for Leave is to paint Remain as more risky by showing what we are really voting for down the road if we do stay, and the EU's record - its past "form" - towards the UK on promises, including the language used.0 -
But then I thought the police were supposed to be impartial as well. Oh well.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3268770/Scotland-Yard-faces-questions-police-used-Tom-Watson-s-office-interview-child-abuse-informant.html0 -
I agree totally with Mr Royale. If Mr Cameron comes up with a deal that satisfies his hard-line Tories, he will put me firmly into the LEAVE column.Casino_Royale said:I think that's right. I'm also not sure this polling will be particularly valuable until the renegotiation deal is on the table with Cameron's endorsement.
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The idea that euroscepticism is based on an ignorance or xenophobia towards European countries and cultures is a fallacy IMHO, and the language of the Eurocrats.foxinsoxuk said:
Until the proximity of the ballot paper is imminent I would be sceptical of the polling. While there is a certain weariness with Europe, this is a country much more at ease with European cultures and peoples than it was 40 years ago. The prospect of stag weekends in Talinn or Hen weekends in Barcelona would have seemed absurd then, but are unremarkeable now.Casino_Royale said:
I think that's right. I'm also not sure this polling will be particularly valuable until the renegotiation deal is on the table with Cameron's endorsement.rcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").0 -
Indeed, but it's only then that people will be offering a voting opinion based on the facts.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Royale, not sure I agree. The negotiated deal (assuming we don't have the surprise of Cameron going for Out, which I think very unlikely) will be seen through the prism that's been created by the debate up to that point.
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At the same time, is it the interviewee's business to decide who should take the refugees ? Why not Argentina or, dare I say, Australia ? There, they would be transported shipped to a remote island.Cyclefree said:
That may well be so. But that does not mean that Britain has an obligation to let people into this country. My point was that the person being interviewed seemed to think that this was primarily Britain's problem to resolve and that we were not doing our "fair" share without really explaining how she was determining what was "fair".surbiton said:
The "rich" countries in the Gulf, the US and UK protectorates created the IS problem. An organisation does not come out of nowhere and occupy a third of an entire country. It needs resources to begin with.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.0 -
Er, but on the other hand there's no guarantee that the EU in the future will maintain those rights, or indeed it may continue to extend workers' rights to the extent that it damages the economy.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
In any case, I really hate the argument that "we have X Y Z rights/regulations" (in the environment, employment, consumers, etc) thanks only to the EU and once we leave they'll go. Many of those rights are also enjoyed by - shock horror - Western countries outside the EU, including right-wing countries like Australia.
The LEAVE campaign needs to spell out exactly that. We enjoy rights which may or may not remain whether we stay in or leave the EU. The difference being with leaving is that what rights exist will be up to our own Parliament. And of course point out that countries outside the EU have similar rights and also that the UK, had it never joined the EU, would in all likelihood also have developed a similar set of rights.
It's almost up there with the "EU has created European peace" nonsense. Though that really is the cream of nonsense. I'll spell it out for anyone who doesn't get reality: the EU is a product of peace, not the cause of it. Golly...0 -
Comres looks like an outlier.
Then again....Pulpstar said:The Comres SW poll showed Con Gain Bath & Yeovil.
JackW said:Not so.
The ComRes polling was LibDem regional and not individual seat specific and accordingly did not have named candidates.
PBers need to be more astute when assessing these polls.Pulpstar said:No incumbency in Bath.
I could cash out my fiver for a guaranteed profit on the Lib Dems there now, but is it worth it ?Casino_Royale said:No.
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All we need to REMAIN is for Farage to campaign to LEAVE.Casino_Royale said:
There is a strong natural default to Remain amongst floating voters. Because the economy is doing ok, it will be easy to produce a list attributing the threat to that if we leave the EU (although I disagree) - conversely, Leave is a many headed beast and it will be hard to paint a clear picture of the alternative. Instead, there will be several, and Remain will try and exploit that as unclear and risky.rcs1000 said:
I think there's a lot of truth in that:MTimT said:One explanation for the wild swings in polling returns might be that no-one outside of us policy nerds has really focused on the issue and the public are broadly ambivalent about membership, thus the day's latest EU news (blunder or smaller snafu) can be having a large but temporary affect on how the public responds to the polling questions.
Greece and/or migrant crisis = Leave...
All quiet on the Eurozone front = Stay...
The best bet for Leave is to paint Remain as more risky by showing what we are really voting for down the road if we do stay, and the EU's record - its past "form" - towards the UK on promises, including the language used.0 -
If a government stripped workers of their rights and did not have widespread support, they would be replaced and the incoming government could reintroduce those rights. It just shows how weak the In side's case is if they have to resort to arguing that outside of the EU we will become a dictatorship.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd80 -
Euroscepticism is not entirely down to xenophobia, but Britain is a very much more European culture than it was in the Seventies. Britons seem to like it that way, but we shall see how they vote. Younger people in particular are far more pro-Europe.Casino_Royale said:
The idea that euroscepticism is based on an ignorance or xenophobia towards European countries and cultures is a fallacy IMHO, and the language of the Eurocrats.foxinsoxuk said:
Until the proximity of the ballot paper is imminent I would be sceptical of the polling. While there is a certain weariness with Europe, this is a country much more at ease with European cultures and peoples than it was 40 years ago. The prospect of stag weekends in Talinn or Hen weekends in Barcelona would have seemed absurd then, but are unremarkeable now.Casino_Royale said:
I think that's right. I'm also not sure this polling will be particularly valuable until the renegotiation deal is on the table with Cameron's endorsement.rcs1000 said:
I think the EU referendum is a very interesting one from a betting perspective. I would estimate that perhaps 10% of the population is fervently in, while 30% is fervently out. In a low turnout scenario, I would reckon out would win it.felix said:As with the GE I'd suggest that the online polls are more suspect at getting a clear picture - but I doubt if the lead for stay is quite so high as the CD figures. Online polls I think remain problematic in achieving a fair balance of the population as a whole and this may be especially true with single issue polls.
The question is, therefore, whether we have 55% turnout (an "out"), 65% (roughly a tie), or 75% (almost certainly "in").
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:-) Bath was a nice little earner!Pulpstar said:Comres looks like an outlier.
Then again....Pulpstar said:The Comres SW poll showed Con Gain Bath & Yeovil.
JackW said:Not so.
The ComRes polling was LibDem regional and not individual seat specific and accordingly did not have named candidates.
PBers need to be more astute when assessing these polls.Pulpstar said:No incumbency in Bath.
I could cash out my fiver for a guaranteed profit on the Lib Dems there now, but is it worth it ?Casino_Royale said:No.
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Could the EU referendum have the same results as the Rugby WC ?
England OUT
Scotland IN
Wales IN
[ N ] Ireland IN
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A Tory dictatorship with 37% of the votes.MP_SE said:
If a government stripped workers of their rights and did not have widespread support, they would be replaced and the incoming government could reintroduce those rights. It just shows how weak the In side's case is if they have to resort to arguing that outside of the EU we will become a dictatorship.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd80 -
Better than a Labour one with lesssurbiton said:
A Tory dictatorship with 37% of the votes.MP_SE said:
If a government stripped workers of their rights and did not have widespread support, they would be replaced and the incoming government could reintroduce those rights. It just shows how weak the In side's case is if they have to resort to arguing that outside of the EU we will become a dictatorship.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
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Mr. Surbiton, unlike a democratically mandated (and larger) Labour majority on 36%?
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@Casino_Royale Thanks for the SW advice indeed...
Comres might be correct here though. An inconvenient potential truth to BOOers, but just because it is an outlier we shouldn't dismiss it out of hand. The next Comres will be interesting.
Do they have a methodological difference to the others ?0 -
Great minds Mr. DMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Surbiton, unlike a democratically mandated (and larger) Labour majority on 36%?
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You can insure against that by going for PR.RobD said:
Better than a Labour one with lesssurbiton said:
A Tory dictatorship with 37% of the votes.MP_SE said:
If a government stripped workers of their rights and did not have widespread support, they would be replaced and the incoming government could reintroduce those rights. It just shows how weak the In side's case is if they have to resort to arguing that outside of the EU we will become a dictatorship.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
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Has Helen Goodman apologised directly to The Hunts, or is she just apologising because she was caught out on Twitter?0
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I'm happy with FPTP.surbiton said:
You can insure against that by going for PR.RobD said:
Better than a Labour one with lesssurbiton said:
A Tory dictatorship with 37% of the votes.MP_SE said:
If a government stripped workers of their rights and did not have widespread support, they would be replaced and the incoming government could reintroduce those rights. It just shows how weak the In side's case is if they have to resort to arguing that outside of the EU we will become a dictatorship.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd80 -
Which do you think has the greater probability ?CornishBlue said:
Er, but on the other hand there's no guarantee that the EU in the future will maintain those rights, or indeed it may continue to extend workers' rights to the extent that it damages the economy.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
In any case, I really hate the argument that "we have X Y Z rights/regulations" (in the environment, employment, consumers, etc) thanks only to the EU and once we leave they'll go. Many of those rights are also enjoyed by - shock horror - Western countries outside the EU, including right-wing countries like Australia.
The LEAVE campaign needs to spell out exactly that. We enjoy rights which may or may not remain whether we stay in or leave the EU. The difference being with leaving is that what rights exist will be up to our own Parliament. And of course point out that countries outside the EU have similar rights and also that the UK, had it never joined the EU, would in all likelihood also have developed a similar set of rights.
It's almost up there with the "EU has created European peace" nonsense. Though that really is the cream of nonsense. I'll spell it out for anyone who doesn't get reality: the EU is a product of peace, not the cause of it. Golly...
1. 27 governments agreeing on something
2. 1 government deciding
Even you can work that out, I am sure.0 -
Procrastinating (bit sleepy to get working just yet), and seen Cumberbatch thinks he should have talks with May over immigration.
.....
Outrageous. I've been asking to determine Defence policy for far longer, and *I've* never had a meeting.0 -
How many decisions require unanimity? Not many more, I don't think.surbiton said:
Which do you think has the greater probability ?CornishBlue said:
Er, but on the other hand there's no guarantee that the EU in the future will maintain those rights, or indeed it may continue to extend workers' rights to the extent that it damages the economy.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
In any case, I really hate the argument that "we have X Y Z rights/regulations" (in the environment, employment, consumers, etc) thanks only to the EU and once we leave they'll go. Many of those rights are also enjoyed by - shock horror - Western countries outside the EU, including right-wing countries like Australia.
The LEAVE campaign needs to spell out exactly that. We enjoy rights which may or may not remain whether we stay in or leave the EU. The difference being with leaving is that what rights exist will be up to our own Parliament. And of course point out that countries outside the EU have similar rights and also that the UK, had it never joined the EU, would in all likelihood also have developed a similar set of rights.
It's almost up there with the "EU has created European peace" nonsense. Though that really is the cream of nonsense. I'll spell it out for anyone who doesn't get reality: the EU is a product of peace, not the cause of it. Golly...
1. 27 governments agreeing on something
2. 1 government deciding
Even you can work that out, I am sure.0 -
Cumberbatch...an actor..someone who inhabits a fictional,fantasy world...figures..0
-
The UnCut piss take on Corbynism is rather funny http://labour-uncut.co.uk/2015/10/11/the-a-z-of-corbsplaining/
Milliband – Previous leader of the Labour party, whose ideas were insufficiently leftist, causing the electorate to vote Conservative in protest.
Prior diary commitment – What you organise quickly just after the Labour party press office schedule a tricky interview.
Campaign Group – A group of MPs who do not campaign but do tweet a lot.0 -
Roger said:
"The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start."
Great ad. The humour complements one's desire to peel up the gym-slip.0 -
Rob, could also be the other one , "F***s seldom differ"RobD said:
Great minds Mr. DMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Surbiton, unlike a democratically mandated (and larger) Labour majority on 36%?
0 -
Try as I might, I could not fit the word "turnip" in that censored word.malcolmg said:
Rob, could also be the other one , "F***s seldom differ"RobD said:
Great minds Mr. DMorris_Dancer said:Mr. Surbiton, unlike a democratically mandated (and larger) Labour majority on 36%?
0 -
I'm still struggling to understand what point she was making - it was just bizarre.dr_spyn said:
Has Helen Goodman apologised directly to The Hunts, or is she just apologising because she was caught out on Twitter?
0 -
... and that's from Labour ...Plato_Says said:The UnCut piss take on Corbynism is rather funny http://labour-uncut.co.uk/2015/10/11/the-a-z-of-corbsplaining/
Milliband – Previous leader of the Labour party, whose ideas were insufficiently leftist, causing the electorate to vote Conservative in protest.
Prior diary commitment – What you organise quickly just after the Labour party press office schedule a tricky interview.
Campaign Group – A group of MPs who do not campaign but do tweet a lot.
oof0 -
The Prime Minister – What the leader of Conservative party is called until at least 2025.
lol0 -
He's so full of himself - I can't stand the chap. I saw him intvd about playing Macbeth, you'd think he'd written it.Morris_Dancer said:
Procrastinating (bit sleepy to get working just yet), and seen Cumberbatch thinks he should have talks with May over immigration.
.....
Outrageous. I've been asking to determine Defence policy for far longer, and *I've* never had a meeting.0 -
... and that's from Labour ...BannedInParis said:Plato_Says said:The UnCut piss take on Corbynism is rather funny http://labour-uncut.co.uk/2015/10/11/the-a-z-of-corbsplaining/
Milliband – Previous leader of the Labour party, whose ideas were insufficiently leftist, causing the electorate to vote Conservative in protest.
Prior diary commitment – What you organise quickly just after the Labour party press office schedule a tricky interview.
Campaign Group – A group of MPs who do not campaign but do tweet a lot.
oof
Burnhamite – A malleable substance that can bend and merge to form any shape required of it before ultimately imploding.
I like this one...too true.0 -
I at that one too. BannedInParis said:
The Prime Minister – What the leader of Conservative party is called until at least 2025.
lol0 -
Miss Plato, well, quite. Why he thinks he ought to meet the Home Secretary to discuss the migrant crisis is beyond me.
Perhaps he's becoming akin to Russell Brand.0 -
At a certain point in an actors climb to fame they begin to believe they are the person the script tells them they are.. and no one tells them they are still just actors..repeating someone else s words0
-
Whose office should they have used? Clearly there was a lot wrong with the way these and similar allegations were handled but does the room really matter?runnymede said:But then I thought the police were supposed to be impartial as well. Oh well.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3268770/Scotland-Yard-faces-questions-police-used-Tom-Watson-s-office-interview-child-abuse-informant.html
It will be interesting to see if any of the celebrity convictions are reviewed, as some seemed to have more evidence than others, though once the jury has decided, perhaps that is the end of it.0 -
Mr. L, why was Watson's office used? The individual's home, or the police station seem the only obvious places for questioning. What's it got to do with the Witchsmeller Pursuivant?0
-
DecrepitJohn..That is why we don't have the death penalty..0
-
Shouldn't police interviews be held in a police station? Where they can be properly documented/recorded?DecrepitJohnL said:
Whose office should they have used? Clearly there was a lot wrong with the way these and similar allegations were handled but does the room really matter?runnymede said:But then I thought the police were supposed to be impartial as well. Oh well.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3268770/Scotland-Yard-faces-questions-police-used-Tom-Watson-s-office-interview-child-abuse-informant.html
It will be interesting to see if any of the celebrity convictions are reviewed, as some seemed to have more evidence than others, though once the jury has decided, perhaps that is the end of it.0 -
Er........14 is more than 1. I am sure even you can work that out !RobD said:
How many decisions require unanimity? Not many more, I don't think.surbiton said:
Which do you think has the greater probability ?CornishBlue said:
Er, but on the other hand there's no guarantee that the EU in the future will maintain those rights, or indeed it may continue to extend workers' rights to the extent that it damages the economy.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
In any case, I really hate the argument that "we have X Y Z rights/regulations" (in the environment, employment, consumers, etc) thanks only to the EU and once we leave they'll go. Many of those rights are also enjoyed by - shock horror - Western countries outside the EU, including right-wing countries like Australia.
The LEAVE campaign needs to spell out exactly that. We enjoy rights which may or may not remain whether we stay in or leave the EU. The difference being with leaving is that what rights exist will be up to our own Parliament. And of course point out that countries outside the EU have similar rights and also that the UK, had it never joined the EU, would in all likelihood also have developed a similar set of rights.
It's almost up there with the "EU has created European peace" nonsense. Though that really is the cream of nonsense. I'll spell it out for anyone who doesn't get reality: the EU is a product of peace, not the cause of it. Golly...
1. 27 governments agreeing on something
2. 1 government deciding
Even you can work that out, I am sure.0 -
Isn't it up to the voters of Britain to decide the level of worker protections they want? Why do we need them to be decided by the votes of others?surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd80 -
Getting 14/27 is much, much easier than getting 27/27.surbiton said:
Er........14 is more than 1. I am sure even you can work that out !RobD said:
How many decisions require unanimity? Not many more, I don't think.surbiton said:
Which do you think has the greater probability ?CornishBlue said:
Er, but on the other hand there's no guarantee that the EU in the future will maintain those rights, or indeed it may continue to extend workers' rights to the extent that it damages the economy.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
In any case, I really hate the argument that "we have X Y Z rights/regulations" (in the environment, employment, consumers, etc) thanks only to the EU and once we leave they'll go. Many of those rights are also enjoyed by - shock horror - Western countries outside the EU, including right-wing countries like Australia.
The LEAVE campaign needs to spell out exactly that. We enjoy rights which may or may not remain whether we stay in or leave the EU. The difference being with leaving is that what rights exist will be up to our own Parliament. And of course point out that countries outside the EU have similar rights and also that the UK, had it never joined the EU, would in all likelihood also have developed a similar set of rights.
It's almost up there with the "EU has created European peace" nonsense. Though that really is the cream of nonsense. I'll spell it out for anyone who doesn't get reality: the EU is a product of peace, not the cause of it. Golly...
1. 27 governments agreeing on something
2. 1 government deciding
Even you can work that out, I am sure.0 -
A great example of that was the bloke who played Josh Lyman in West Wing - I saw him intved and he carried on like he was a White House big shot.
It was bizarre viewing - I kept thinking You're Just An ActorrichardDodd said:At a certain point in an actors climb to fame they begin to believe they are the person the script tells them they are.. and no one tells them they are still just actors..repeating someone else s words
0 -
Isn't it up to the voters of Britain to decide the level of worker protections they want? Why do we need them to be decided by the votes of others?
Perhaps the EU will make the trains run on time as well0 -
She was on the BBC FFS what did you expect - a balanced discussion?Casino_Royale said:
So, in other words, she offered nothing new.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.0 -
Miss Plato, it reminds of Team America: World Police, and the Film Actors' Guild.0
-
Re Cumberbatch, he was filming at a hospice recently, and unlike other cast members, he took time to talk to those under the place's care including one of my relatives. A small gesture, but one which was appreciated.
0 -
And free from pressure? I can think of lots of reasons why it's completely inappropriate to conduct statement taking in the office of a campaigning MP.RobD said:
Shouldn't police interviews be held in a police station? Where they can be properly documented/recorded?DecrepitJohnL said:
Whose office should they have used? Clearly there was a lot wrong with the way these and similar allegations were handled but does the room really matter?runnymede said:But then I thought the police were supposed to be impartial as well. Oh well.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3268770/Scotland-Yard-faces-questions-police-used-Tom-Watson-s-office-interview-child-abuse-informant.html
It will be interesting to see if any of the celebrity convictions are reviewed, as some seemed to have more evidence than others, though once the jury has decided, perhaps that is the end of it.0 -
The implication is that the UK has a natural right-wing majority, which only the EU can hold in check.Charles said:
Isn't it up to the voters of Britain to decide the level of worker protections they want? Why do we need them to be decided by the votes of others?surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd80 -
Don't forget that "asylum judge" probably doesn't mean what you think it does.Cyclefree said:
That may well be so. But that does not mean that Britain has an obligation to let people into this country. My point was that the person being interviewed seemed to think that this was primarily Britain's problem to resolve and that we were not doing our "fair" share without really explaining how she was determining what was "fair".surbiton said:
The "rich" countries in the Gulf, the US and UK protectorates created the IS problem. An organisation does not come out of nowhere and occupy a third of an entire country. It needs resources to begin with.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.
Under Labour's reforms immigration panel members are entitled to call themselves "judge" even if they don't have any legal training0 -
Let's hope it ends as messily....Morris_Dancer said:Miss Plato, it reminds of Team America: World Police, and the Film Actors' Guild.
0 -
The left used to think in 100% opposite terms in the 60s and 70s i.e that the EU would prevent them establishing 'socialism'. While people like Ken Clarke in the 70s favoured the EU as it would make Labour's then policies 'illegal'.
Can anyone spot the common thread here?0 -
It seems to me INs biggest problem is that it will be backed foursquare by 'the establishment' and right now the voters are pretty anti-establishment.0
-
It was the only one that had that ultimate tool of the Spanish Inquisition for extracting confessions:Morris_Dancer said:Mr. L, why was Watson's office used? The individual's home, or the police station seem the only obvious places for questioning. What's it got to do with the Witchsmeller Pursuivant?
the Comfy Chair....0 -
Of course, the opposite argument was made by Labour in the 1970s and early 1980s.Sean_F said:
The implication is that the UK has a natural right-wing majority, which only the EU can hold in check.Charles said:
Isn't it up to the voters of Britain to decide the level of worker protections they want? Why do we need them to be decided by the votes of others?surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
If you're relying on a supernational body to override the democratic wishes of the domestic electorate you will reap the whirlwind in the long-term IMHO.0 -
Dr Spyn That is not unusual..the other cast members were probably not as recogniseable and would let the STAR do all the talking.. I bet the crew members talked to the patients tho..0
-
Mr. Royale, and that's why there'll be civil strife, or possibly even war, when the EU finally collapses.0
-
The EU. If it is successful in its aims it will ultimately automatically self destruct, in either a peaceful or violent way.
If it is unsuccessful (or we depart) we will probably all carry on regardless, until we find some conflict, which may be resolved either peacefully or violently.0 -
Mr Rose is really not giving a good starting impression. Having launched the Remain campaign last week mainly based on scaremongering, he is now branding anyone supporting Leave as "quitters".
Listen mate, I'm considering voting Leave and if I do, it's not because I'm a Quitter but because a multimillionaire has failed to set out a positive platform for the UK changing the existing dynamic in the EU. Insulting half the electorate generally isn't a good approach.0 -
... and that's from Labour ...BannedInParis said:Plato_Says said:The UnCut piss take on Corbynism is rather funny http://labour-uncut.co.uk/2015/10/11/the-a-z-of-corbsplaining/
Milliband – Previous leader of the Labour party, whose ideas were insufficiently leftist, causing the electorate to vote Conservative in protest.
Prior diary commitment – What you organise quickly just after the Labour party press office schedule a tricky interview.
Campaign Group – A group of MPs who do not campaign but do tweet a lot.
oof
First they came for those with a sense of humour....
Now nobody's laughing.0 -
Better a quitter than a bull-shitter.....JEO said:Mr Rose is really not giving a good starting impression. Having launched the Remain campaign last week mainly based on scaremongering, he is now branding anyone supporting Leave as "quitters".
Listen mate, I'm considering voting Leave and if I do, it's not because I'm a Quitter but because a multimillionaire has failed to set out a positive platform for the UK changing the existing dynamic in the EU. Insulting half the electorate generally isn't a good approach.0 -
I do. A victory of hope over experience.weejonnie said:
She was on the BBC FFS what did you expect - a balanced discussion?Casino_Royale said:
So, in other words, she offered nothing new.Cyclefree said:Interesting interview on the Today programme this morning with a retired asylum judge about what Britain is doing re refugees from the Middle East.
Two initial thoughts: (1) she was assuming that all those who wanted to come were refugees. Not the case and one would have thought that an asylum judge would know the difference between refugees and migrants; and (2) the underlying assumption was that a problem created by civil war in the Middle East was the responsibility of Europe to sort out. There seemed to be no thought that, maybe - just maybe - some of the rich countries in the Middle East which are doing nothing (and there are those countries which are bearing the greatest burden) should also take their proportionate share and do far far more.
0 -
So what? That's up to the Commons and the British electorate to determine.surbiton said:
The 48 hour directive for a start. All those maternity, paternity leave came from the EU. Part-time workers rights [ there are many now ] all enshrined in EU directives. There is no guarantee that an "Out" UK will keep those rights.Roger said:The benefits of the EU are many but not immediately obvious. I just heard someone on radio try to explain why we should stay in but it all sounded business orientated and not someting that touched most people. The 'stay in' side need to build a shopping list of how it benefits us all.
Something like a modern version of this very dated Dunlop commercial would be a good start.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NebZb7dnd8
The EU serves a very good purpose in breaking down barriers between EU nations. But internal UK only issues like relations between employer and employee can be determined by the British government and the British electorate. The EU is overstretched meddling in those issues.0 -
You missed the memo. This week's EU referendum debate is brought to you by the letter Q: quitters and Quislings.JEO said:Mr Rose is really not giving a good starting impression. Having launched the Remain campaign last week mainly based on scaremongering, he is now branding anyone supporting Leave as "quitters".
Listen mate, I'm considering voting Leave and if I do, it's not because I'm a Quitter but because a multimillionaire has failed to set out a positive platform for the UK changing the existing dynamic in the EU. Insulting half the electorate generally isn't a good approach.
0 -
Why should we particularly listen to Stuart Rose by the way ?
His performance at M&S looks to have been modest to me.0 -
The Stay team need to focus on the reasons for staying in.. not denigrate the ones who may consider leaving..enough of the nonsense Rose..the UK population need really good reasons from both teams.. and are completely peed off with the rumour mongers0
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Having seen Will Straw on Sky News this morning, the Remain camp need to think about how to engage the heart and not just the head. It's all a bit mechanical.
Remainers should be focussing on where the EU has been a force for good and where the UK has been an effective force for change within the EU. Numbers leave most of us number.0 -
Rose said this morning everybody is better off by £450 pa via the EU, I would love to see how he established this scaremongering figurerichardDodd said:The Stay team need to focus on the reasons for staying in.. not denigrate the ones who may consider leaving..enough of the nonsense Rose..the UK population need really good reasons from both teams.. and are completely peed off with the rumour mongers
0 -
Perhaps when the lawyers sign in later, they can clear this up.RobD said:
Shouldn't police interviews be held in a police station? Where they can be properly documented/recorded?DecrepitJohnL said:
Whose office should they have used? Clearly there was a lot wrong with the way these and similar allegations were handled but does the room really matter?runnymede said:But then I thought the police were supposed to be impartial as well. Oh well.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3268770/Scotland-Yard-faces-questions-police-used-Tom-Watson-s-office-interview-child-abuse-informant.html
It will be interesting to see if any of the celebrity convictions are reviewed, as some seemed to have more evidence than others, though once the jury has decided, perhaps that is the end of it.0 -
As an IN supporter perhaps you could help us with this?antifrank said:Having seen Will Straw on Sky News this morning, the Remain camp need to think about how to engage the heart and not just the head. It's all a bit mechanical.
Remainers should be focussing on where the EU has been a force for good and where the UK has been an effective force for change within the EU. Numbers leave most of us number.0 -
Didn't he claim £3000 just last week?blackburn63 said:
Rose said this morning everybody is better off by £450 pa via the EU, I would love to see how he established this scaremongering figurerichardDodd said:The Stay team need to focus on the reasons for staying in.. not denigrate the ones who may consider leaving..enough of the nonsense Rose..the UK population need really good reasons from both teams.. and are completely peed off with the rumour mongers
0
