politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Day 3 in the Mail lfrom Lord A looks a bit tamer
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The actual voters aren't saying anything - at this point most of them haven't taken an interest yet, and won't for about 6 months.HYUFD said:
I prefer to look at what the actual voters are saying rather than the pundits. In 2008 McCain and Obama were second at this stage so hardly came from nowhere, in 2000 and 2012 George W Bush and Romney were ahead at this stage and became nomineeTim_B said:Guys - we are 14 months away from the election. Stop obsessing on polls. Track them by all means. You need to track news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on. Polls are merely snapshots.
Look at the 2008 election cycle and learn the lesson.0 -
Too much American politics for me
Goodnight all0 -
The pace of change where I live is unbelievable,it took 50 years in my area for the Asian community to be the dominant population.JEO said:Front page of the Express tomorrow:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CPiML18WUAAuHXW.jpg
In the past 4 to 5 years ,another mass migration of the Roma community to my area in a very short period of time,you can see the change with the large families that are coming.0 -
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html0 -
Sheanderthal @Sheanderthal 3m3 minutes ago
Germans chant 'Putin to Berlin, Merkel to Siberia!' at Dresden Rally in ... https://youtu.be/dszwLbsTMdY via @YouTube0 -
@MarqueeMark
First Gentleman.MarqueeMark said:Quick question that someone might be able to answer. When Bill Clinton was President, Hillary was First Lady. If Hillary becomes President - Bill becomes - what? First Husband? First Lord???
It may also be complicated by the fact that he was himself also a President. I have in mind that there is a convention that even ex-Presidents are still referred to as "Mr President". If so, that would be seriously weird - Mr President and Madam President.....0 -
"Fury" can't crash! Rule of Cool demands she survives to the last round!Tim_B said:
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html0 -
Lost sheep Carswell appears to be in a twitter spat with a UKIP ppc... on immigration... shocking0
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You tell me how to reduce "news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on" to a measurable statistic and I'll do it.Tim_B said:Guys - we are 14 months away from the election. Stop obsessing on polls. Track them by all means. You need to track news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on. Polls are merely snapshots.
Look at the 2008 election cycle and learn the lesson.0 -
Thats what they all say, the trends are pretty clear now, enough such that an early frontrunner like Walker has now dropped out. If some other candidate can manage to beat Trump in Iowa or New Hampshire then you are right, Trump may well not be nominee, if he wins both momentum will carry him over the lineTim_B said:
The actual voters aren't saying anything - at this point most of them haven't taken an interest yet, and won't for about 6 months.HYUFD said:
I prefer to look at what the actual voters are saying rather than the pundits. In 2008 McCain and Obama were second at this stage so hardly came from nowhere, in 2000 and 2012 George W Bush and Romney were ahead at this stage and became nomineeTim_B said:Guys - we are 14 months away from the election. Stop obsessing on polls. Track them by all means. You need to track news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on. Polls are merely snapshots.
Look at the 2008 election cycle and learn the lesson.0 -
Nobody 'deserves to survive'. Personally I doubt the nominee will be Fiorina - much more likely to be Rubio or Bush. That's just conjecture on my part based on the current situation, and that will probably change. But we don't know yet - it's like predicting the triple crown winners before any of the races have been run. This is a marathon and a crapshoot.viewcode said:
"Fury" can't crash! Rule of Cool demands she survives to the last round!Tim_B said:
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html
At this point anyone saying "based on the poll I predict X will be the nominee" is merely showing ignorance. None of us have any idea at this point who either nominee will be, although the Democratic one (taking into the account the FBI risk) is more likely.0 -
That's the whole point - you can't reduce it to a 'measurable statistic'. You need to invest the time to follow it all. Otherwise you have an incomplete picture.viewcode said:
You tell me how to reduce "news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on" to a measurable statistic and I'll do it.Tim_B said:Guys - we are 14 months away from the election. Stop obsessing on polls. Track them by all means. You need to track news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on. Polls are merely snapshots.
Look at the 2008 election cycle and learn the lesson.
On reflection, do you not think that comment was a little unwise?0 -
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.0 -
It must be true because Speedy says that he can hear voices in his head.Tim_B said:
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html0 -
Indeed - she's doing just fine before that....williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html0 -
He probably just has cheap Apple ear buds.....GeoffM said:
It must be true because Speedy says that he can hear voices in his head.Tim_B said:
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html
Of course nothing Apple sells is 'cheap', but quite a bit is not exceptionally good for the price.0 -
When is the presidential election?0
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Fauxcahontas might still run if Hillary goes wrong.rcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s0 -
Tuesday Nov 8, 2016SimonStClare said:When is the presidential election?
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The company have just dished out new iPhones for those of us with suitably shiny business cards. Not amused. I liked my Z10.Tim_B said:
He probably just has cheap Apple ear buds.....GeoffM said:
It must be true because Speedy says that he can hear voices in his head.Tim_B said:
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html
Of course nothing Apple makes is 'cheap', but quite a bit is not exceptionally good for the price.0 -
That’s over a year away.Tim_B said:
Tuesday Nov 8, 2016SimonStClare said:When is the presidential election?
0 -
It does appear a bit all over the place.antifrank said:The first bullet point is both hearsay and on its face highly implausible. If a quarter of what else has been unveiled is true, our Prime Minister would not want for suppliers.
Day 1 Cameron household awash with drugs
Day 2 Cameron attends parties awash with drugs
Day 3 Cameron can't find drugs0 -
I'm a statistician. So, no.Tim_B said:
That's the whole point - you can't reduce it to a 'measurable statistic'. You need to invest the time to follow it all. Otherwise you have an incomplete picture.viewcode said:
You tell me how to reduce "news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on" to a measurable statistic and I'll do it.Tim_B said:Guys - we are 14 months away from the election. Stop obsessing on polls. Track them by all means. You need to track news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on. Polls are merely snapshots.
Look at the 2008 election cycle and learn the lesson.
On reflection, do you not think that comment was a little unwise?0 -
I had Blackberry's for years and loved them. I still have my Blackberry Torch 9810. You can't beat their email.GeoffM said:
The company have just dished out new iPhones for those of us with suitably shiny business cards. Not amused. I liked my Z10.Tim_B said:
He probably just has cheap Apple ear buds.....GeoffM said:
It must be true because Speedy says that he can hear voices in his head.Tim_B said:
Fiorina is crashing?Speedy said:@HYUFD
Looking at the state of the GOP race I think it's Trump vs anti-Trump, but the anti-Trump crowd is divided, its looking around and are getting stuck in flavours of the month type candidates like the anti-Romney ones in 2012.
Walker rose and crashed, Carson rose and crashed, and now Fiorina rose and is crashing.
I'm hearing noises that the anti-Trumps will try Rubio next.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/politics/carly-fiorina-donald-trump-republican-2016-poll/index.html
Of course nothing Apple makes is 'cheap', but quite a bit is not exceptionally good for the price.
But I'm am android user now. Some great, some not so much. Everyone I know with an iPhone - not many - is going android next upgrade.0 -
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.0 -
In that case I forgive you and let's move on.viewcode said:
I'm a statistician. So, no.Tim_B said:
That's the whole point - you can't reduce it to a 'measurable statistic'. You need to invest the time to follow it all. Otherwise you have an incomplete picture.viewcode said:
You tell me how to reduce "news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on" to a measurable statistic and I'll do it.Tim_B said:Guys - we are 14 months away from the election. Stop obsessing on polls. Track them by all means. You need to track news stories, US network talking heads, trends, pundits and so on. Polls are merely snapshots.
Look at the 2008 election cycle and learn the lesson.
On reflection, do you not think that comment was a little unwise?0 -
I know - that's why I've been saying it's early days yet and things will change.SimonStClare said:
That’s over a year away.Tim_B said:
Tuesday Nov 8, 2016SimonStClare said:When is the presidential election?
0 -
viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
0 -
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_1610 -
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_1610 -
Then why not wait until things have changed appreciatively – say, next year perhaps?Tim_B said:
I know - that's why I've been saying it's early days yet and things will change.SimonStClare said:
That’s over a year away.Tim_B said:
Tuesday Nov 8, 2016SimonStClare said:When is the presidential election?
0 -
0
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I mentioned it a few times on here in the past days!viewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
0 -
Because you feel that's the way things look now, but things will probably change over time.SimonStClare said:
Then why not wait until things have changed appreciatively – say, next year perhaps?Tim_B said:
I know - that's why I've been saying it's early days yet and things will change.SimonStClare said:
That’s over a year away.Tim_B said:
Tuesday Nov 8, 2016SimonStClare said:When is the presidential election?
That's like saying you won't poll until a week before the election, in case things change. It's human nature to say "Right now it looks like X, but it will probably change over time." Rather than "It will probably change over time, so I won't say anything right now".
Where's the fun in that?0 -
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
0 -
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_1610 -
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it?0 -
Wrong movie - "Comrades, this is your Captain" is from Tom Clancy's The Hunt for Red OctoberTim_B said:
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it? 0 -
Come on - you've never hesitated to bastardize it beforeSunil_Prasannan said:
Wrong movie - "Comrades, this is your Captain" is from Tom Clancy's The Hunt for Red OctoberTim_B said:
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it? 0 -
You're right about Alien 3, nowhere near as good as the second film, Aliens from 1986Tim_B said:
Come on - you've never hesitated to bastardize it beforeSunil_Prasannan said:
Wrong movie - "Comrades, this is your Captain" is from Tom Clancy's The Hunt for Red OctoberTim_B said:
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it?
Sgt. Sunil: Alright, sweethearts, you're a team and there's nothin' to worry about. We come here, and we're gonna conquer, and we're gonna kick some, is that understood? That's what we're gonna do, sweethearts, we are going to go and get some. All right, people, on the ready line! Are ya lean?
PB Tories: Yeah!
Sgt. Sunil: Are ya mean?
PB Tories: Yeah!
Sgt. Sunil: WHAT ARE YOU?
PB Tories: Lean and mean!
Sgt. Sunil: WHAT ARE YOU? RobD! TSE! Get on the ready line, PB Tories, get some today! Get on the ready line! Move it out! Move it out, goddammit! Get hot! One, two, three, four! Get out, get out, get out! Move it out, move it out, move it out! Move it out, move it out, move it out! One, two, three, four, five, six, seven! Aaarrrrr, absolutely badasses! Let's pack 'em in! Get in there!
0 -
Foxinsoxuk is a badass. I am pure as the driven snow.Sunil_Prasannan said:
You're right about Alien 3, nowhere near as good as the second film, Aliens from 1986Tim_B said:
Come on - you've never hesitated to bastardize it beforeSunil_Prasannan said:
Wrong movie - "Comrades, this is your Captain" is from Tom Clancy's The Hunt for Red OctoberTim_B said:
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it?
Sgt. Sunil: Alright, sweethearts, you're a team and there's nothin' to worry about. We come here, and we're gonna conquer, and we're gonna kick some, is that understood? That's what we're gonna do, sweethearts, we are going to go and get some. All right, people, on the ready line! Are ya lean?
PB Tories: Yeah!
Sgt. Sunil: Are ya mean?
PB Tories: Yeah!
Sgt. Sunil: WHAT ARE YOU?
PB Tories: Lean and mean!
Sgt. Sunil: WHAT ARE YOU? RobD! TSE! Get on the ready line, PB Tories, get some today! Get on the ready line! Move it out! Move it out, goddammit! Get hot! One, two, three, four! Get out, get out, get out! Move it out, move it out, move it out! Move it out, move it out, move it out! One, two, three, four, five, six, seven! Aaarrrrr, absolutely badasses! Let's pack 'em in! Get in there! 0 -
Birmingham New Street pics, taken Tuesday:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:ListFiles/Sunil060902&ilshowall=10 -
Sunil_Prasannan said:
You're right about Alien 3, nowhere near as good as the second film, Aliens from 1986Tim_B said:
Come on - you've never hesitated to bastardize it beforeSunil_Prasannan said:
Wrong movie - "Comrades, this is your Captain" is from Tom Clancy's The Hunt for Red OctoberTim_B said:
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it?
Sgt. Sunil: Alright, sweethearts, you're a team and there's nothin' to worry about. We come here, and we're gonna conquer, and we're gonna kick some, is that understood? That's what we're gonna do, sweethearts, we are going to go and get some. All right, people, on the ready line! Are ya lean?
PB Tories: Yeah!
Sgt. Sunil: Are ya mean?
PB Tories: Yeah!
Sgt. Sunil: WHAT ARE YOU?
PB Tories: Lean and mean!
Sgt. Sunil: WHAT ARE YOU? RobD! TSE! Get on the ready line, PB Tories, get some today! Get on the ready line! Move it out! Move it out, goddammit! Get hot! One, two, three, four! Get out, get out, get out! Move it out, move it out, move it out! Move it out, move it out, move it out! One, two, three, four, five, six, seven! Aaarrrrr, absolutely badasses! Let's pack 'em in! Get in there! 0 -
Must say,"lay off their largest constituency and listen to their chortling and tittering... while we conduct Austerity Debates" get me every timeSunil_Prasannan said:
Wrong movie - "Comrades, this is your Captain" is from Tom Clancy's The Hunt for Red OctoberTim_B said:
I'm a tad disappointed - I expected one of your "Tonight Comrades we....." speeches.Sunil_Prasannan said:
Ripley: "Then we're f*cked!"Tim_B said:
I'm trying to make a serious point and you keep mentioning crap scifi movies. I'm going to call Ripley right now, and hold my breath until you apologizeviewcode said:
You beat me to it!Sunil_Prasannan said:
Fiorina ("Fury") 161, the prison planet in Alien 3Tim_B said:viewcode said:
Fury! Fury! Fury! Fury!williamglenn said:
She had a very successful appearance on the Jimmy Fallon show last night and is only just breaking through to a mainstream audience. Don't bet against her.Speedy said:
I agree.HYUFD said:
Trump has more consistent leads in the 3 early states, Iowa, NH and SC than Hillary does. He has the money to carry him through and 3 months on he still holds his frontrunner status, a challenger needs to beat him in Iowa or NH to have a chance, if he wins both momentum will carry him to the nominationTim_B said:
It's probably not going to be Trump - tone of coverage and trends. There's a long way to go yet.HYUFD said:
Biden, no question, but at the moment it still looks like Trump v Clinton, all the polls this week have them leading the GOP and Democrat fields respectivelyrcs1000 said:
If Hillary does implode (what, 25% chance?) who gets it?Tim_B said:Hillary's email -
curiouser and murkier.
This just does not help her.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/sep/21/hillary-clinton-emails-fbi-refuses-cooperate-serve/
I can't see it being Saunders... s
In fact a national poll today showed Fiorina heading back down to mid-single digits.
What's this Fury, Fury, Fury shit?
If you like her it's Carly, Carly, Carly!
Otherwise silence is golden.
http://avp.wikia.com/wiki/Fiorina_"Fury"_161
That's it? 0 -
Watching a bit of coverage of the Lib Dem conference. The tribute to Charles Kennedy was introduced by a speech by Ian Wrigglesworth, who was an SDP MP from 1981 to 1987. I was very surprised to discover that he looks older than he was 28 years ago.0
-
The Lib Dems are having a conference? Well they kept that quiet.JohnLoony said:Watching a bit of coverage of the Lib Dem conference. The tribute to Charles Kennedy was introduced by a speech by Ian Wrigglesworth, who was an SDP MP from 1981 to 1987. I was very surprised to discover that he looks older than he was 28 years ago.
0 -
Can we now assume that Boris Johnson is the source of all of the stuff in this book?0
-
If it's proved to be him (which I doubt it is, or it would be proved if it was), then he can wave his leadership ambitions bye-bye.tlg86 said:Can we now assume that Boris Johnson is the source of all of the stuff in this book?
0 -
I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?0 -
Boris Johnson's communication skills and political common-touch may be admired, but is there anyone out there who trusts him?JosiasJessop said:
If it's proved to be him (which I doubt it is, or it would be proved if it was), then he can wave his leadership ambitions bye-bye.tlg86 said:Can we now assume that Boris Johnson is the source of all of the stuff in this book?
0 -
Quite. No idea if Boris is involved or not but surely he accepts his leadership ambitions are finished, people can't take him seriously.Casino_Royale said:
Boris Johnson's communication skills and political common-touch may be admired, but is there anyone out there who trusts him?JosiasJessop said:
If it's proved to be him (which I doubt it is, or it would be proved if it was), then he can wave his leadership ambitions bye-bye.tlg86 said:Can we now assume that Boris Johnson is the source of all of the stuff in this book?
0 -
I'm hardly an expert on this, being more or less in the same position as you are. But I've hung around with lots of people who've taken drugs, especially during my youth in London. There was a massive societal aspect to it that reminded me of smokers at school: it was easier to fit in with the 'in' crowd if you did as they did. At school, smoking (although there was a significant problem with steroid abuse); at university it was harder drugs.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
After that, I guess addiction of whatever level kicks in. Once they're at that stage, they'll find any excuse for taking them. "It helps with my depression," or "everyone does it."
The last one in particular annoys me. Not everyone does it, and not by a long chalk. I haven't seen anyone take illegal drugs since university. I guess that unlike the PM I don't get invited to that sort of party any more. 0 -
There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter. I think one of the worst things Brown did was reversing the reclassification of cannabis, just when at least it looked like the bizarre and damaging puritan policy regarding natural substances that just happen to modulate neurotransmitters might finally be slowly heading in the right direction.0
-
I used to think like that, but over the last couple of decades I have seen enough of my old schoolfriends and some of Fox jr's friends squander their lives and talents through drug use. A bit of casual experimentation when young is one thing, but regular use blights lives.JWisemann said:There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter. I think one of the worst things Brown did was reversing the reclassification of cannabis, just when at least it looked like the bizarre and damaging puritan policy regarding natural substances that just happen to modulate neurotransmitters might finally be slowly heading in the right direction.
0 -
People abuse alcohol too.0
-
Comres this week had Boris with higher favourables and a higher net rating than Osborne, May, Corbyn, Watson, Umunna, Farron, Sturgeon and even Cameron. He is the most popular politician in the countryblackburn63 said:
Quite. No idea if Boris is involved or not but surely he accepts his leadership ambitions are finished, people can't take him seriously.Casino_Royale said:
Boris Johnson's communication skills and political common-touch may be admired, but is there anyone out there who trusts him?JosiasJessop said:
If it's proved to be him (which I doubt it is, or it would be proved if it was), then he can wave his leadership ambitions bye-bye.tlg86 said:Can we now assume that Boris Johnson is the source of all of the stuff in this book?
0 -
I'm afraid there is.JWisemann said:There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter.
0 -
What is it then? Other than the artificial distinction of illegality or cultural norms.0
-
Worst I've ever seen are people who sniffed glue. Jeez - it fries their brains and leaves them a half-wit, maybe a quarter-wit actually. Permanently.
I assume that it's not really done anymore - but crikey at the time.Casino_Royale said:
I'm afraid there is.JWisemann said:There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter.
0 -
The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.0
-
My personal experience is the same as yours. My observation is that some people have addictive personalities. This shows by obsessions about TV shows, sports teams or substance abuse. I see it as something of an arc. This personality trait makes it very difficult for those who have it to resist addiction to any particular thing at a particular time.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
If a particular drug becomes their obsession of the moment they will make that the centre of their lives until their obsession moves on. I think we miss a trick by focussing on the addictiveness of particular substances. This is not, in my opinion, really the point. Those who are lucky enough not to have this personality trait may feel temporary discomfort if they withdraw from a substance but this is a temporary thing which a sense of perspective easily deals with.
What we need to focus on is the personality trait itself. That suggests treatments such as cognitive therapy are the way forward. The idea that you "treat" someone with, say, a heroin addiction by giving them an alternative drug like methadone is borderline crazy and has killed far too many people.0 -
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
0 -
Thanks JJ. I've noticed a decline in the number of my friends that smoke (down from c.20% 10 years ago to negligible ones and twos now) but I know more who still recreationally smoke pot at weekends on social occasions together - can't say I've ever seen the appeal myself. It's certainly quite excluding when they do do it, and I can see how that'd make some feel that you should do what's necessary to be included. I just go into another room or garden and talk to someone else.JosiasJessop said:
I'm hardly an expert on this, being more or less in the same position as you are. But I've hung around with lots of people who've taken drugs, especially during my youth in London. There was a massive societal aspect to it that reminded me of smokers at school: it was easier to fit in with the 'in' crowd if you did as they did. At school, smoking (although there was a significant problem with steroid abuse); at university it was harder drugs.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
After that, I guess addiction of whatever level kicks in. Once they're at that stage, they'll find any excuse for taking them. "It helps with my depression," or "everyone does it."
The last one in particular annoys me. Not everyone does it, and not by a long chalk. I haven't seen anyone take illegal drugs since university. I guess that unlike the PM I don't get invited to that sort of party any more.
None I know do anything 'harder' to my knowledge, but what do I know?0 -
Ah, but SO, if we weren't interfering in the free market by regulating emissions, VW wouldn't have had to fake the tests! It's all the fault of the nanny state.0
-
DavidL - do you drink? If so, is it because you have an addictive personality?
Drinkers can enjoy a glass of red every few days and probably add a net positive to their lives, or down a litre of vodka a day and set their livers, brains and kidneys (and lives) to self-destruct. The same is true with a lot of other, currently illegal, drugs.0 -
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?0 -
Being as solvents are actively and immediately toxic to your system, unlike, say, cannabis, psychedelics and so on, which are all actually a lot less poisonous than alcohol, and indeed have been shown to cause positive effects in some instances and doses, I don't think it's really a fair comparison.Plato_Says said:Worst I've ever seen are people who sniffed glue. Jeez - it fries their brains and leaves them a half-wit, maybe a quarter-wit actually. Permanently.
I assume that it's not really done anymore - but crikey at the time.Casino_Royale said:
I'm afraid there is.JWisemann said:There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter.
0 -
Yes, down with the Nanny state, bring back smog.JWisemann said:Ah, but SO, if we weren't interfering in the free market by regulating emissions, VW wouldn't have had to fake the tests! It's all the fault of the nanny state.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_Air_Act_19560 -
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?0 -
Yes, it does blight lives. Perhaps if we took the Professor Nutt view of realistically and accurately classifying drugs, things might be better, but he was sacked by Blunkett. Not the first time academics have been trashed for opposing the Home Office line.foxinsoxuk said:
I used to think like that, but over the last couple of decades I have seen enough of my old schoolfriends and some of Fox jr's friends squander their lives and talents through drug use. A bit of casual experimentation when young is one thing, but regular use blights lives.JWisemann said:There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter. I think one of the worst things Brown did was reversing the reclassification of cannabis, just when at least it looked like the bizarre and damaging puritan policy regarding natural substances that just happen to modulate neurotransmitters might finally be slowly heading in the right direction.
0 -
I see the first Syrians are arriving in the UK. Its about time they were put in a wealthy low immigration area. If we stick them in Bradford or similar places we should not be surprised when they do not integrate.0
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Yes I drink but I am not addicted to it. So I can stop (I did for a month earlier this year) without any particular discomfort. Those with addictive personalities, in contrast, can't stop and destroy their lives with a poison that the body can tolerate in moderate doses but not in large ones.JWisemann said:DavidL - do you drink? If so, is it because you have an addictive personality?
Drinkers can enjoy a glass of red every few days and probably add a net positive to their lives, or down a litre of vodka a day and set their livers, brains and kidneys (and lives) to self-destruct. The same is true with a lot of other, currently illegal, drugs.
I think we are in agreement that the distinction between legal and illegal substances is meaningless and frankly irrational. We are putting far too many of our resources into the wrong areas treating the wrong problem.0 -
But if wealth creators couldn't externalise costs onto the rest of society, they couldn't get filthy rich and we'd be living in communist Russia. Or something.logical_song said:
Yes, down with the Nanny state, bring back smog.JWisemann said:Ah, but SO, if we weren't interfering in the free market by regulating emissions, VW wouldn't have had to fake the tests! It's all the fault of the nanny state.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clean_Air_Act_1956
0 -
There's the WH Smith's story too.JWisemann said:Ah, but SO, if we weren't interfering in the free market by regulating emissions, VW wouldn't have had to fake the tests! It's all the fault of the nanny state.
0 -
Most of us drink but if alcohol was invented today it would never be legalised. Drugs ruin lives but they don't respect class, as Stephen Fry says the problem occurs when you can't afford them. I know people who's lives have been ruined along with their nearest and dearest, it's easy to be pious about drugs. I'd treat users and jail dealers for life.0
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Thanks David - all good points. I'd actually be interested in hearing SeanT's views on this: he's been there and got the t-shirt.DavidL said:
My personal experience is the same as yours. My observation is that some people have addictive personalities. This shows by obsessions about TV shows, sports teams or substance abuse. I see it as something of an arc. This personality trait makes it very difficult for those who have it to resist addiction to any particular thing at a particular time.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
If a particular drug becomes their obsession of the moment they will make that the centre of their lives until their obsession moves on. I think we miss a trick by focussing on the addictiveness of particular substances. This is not, in my opinion, really the point. Those who are lucky enough not to have this personality trait may feel temporary discomfort if they withdraw from a substance but this is a temporary thing which a sense of perspective easily deals with.
What we need to focus on is the personality trait itself. That suggests treatments such as cognitive therapy are the way forward. The idea that you "treat" someone with, say, a heroin addiction by giving them an alternative drug like methadone is borderline crazy and has killed far too many people.0 -
You could just as easily say: "yesterday's headlines about Addenbrookes is a great warning against the fetishisation of the public sector and the NHS".SouthamObserver said:The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.
I'm not sure what your point is: there are plenty of cases of fraud, bad practice and waste in the public sector. Fetishisation off any organisation can allow them that organisation to take advantage, as Apple Fandom shows all too well.0 -
Tomorrow - Day 4
David Cameron once stole my rice pudding at lunch when I was at Eton*
He once said he didn't like national treasure, Stephen Fry and confused which was Ant and which was Dec*
He missed 2 lectures on a monday whilst at Uni after a wild party the night before left him hungover*
*so a bloke told me when I was waiting for my bus so just reporting that.
I can't wait for this blockbuster to continue.
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One of the things that has come out of this for me is that there is a much, much bigger trade off between "clean" engine technology and performance than I had appreciated. So the requirements to meet ecological standards mean our cars use more fuel less efficiently to go slower than would otherwise be the case.JWisemann said:Ah, but SO, if we weren't interfering in the free market by regulating emissions, VW wouldn't have had to fake the tests! It's all the fault of the nanny state.
I am not saying that is a bad thing, we clearly need to control pollution, particularly in our cities but the differences being disclosed when the VWs are running "dirty" are much bigger than I had appreciated.0 -
If those people didn't want to pay more for things they shouldn't have got sick.
Used correctly, sensibly, moderately and safely, alcohol and many other drugs (obviously not all) can enrich life. There's a reason they are pretty much ubiquitous in human societies going back time immemorial.blackburn63 said:Most of us drink but if alcohol was invented today it would never be legalised. Drugs ruin lives but they don't respect class, as Stephen Fry says the problem occurs when you can't afford them. I know people who's lives have been ruined along with their nearest and dearest, it's easy to be pious about drugs. I'd treat users and jail dealers for life.
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Not sure No 1 selling authors (has he mentioned that, I may have missed it) are encouraged to talk about such things.Casino_Royale said:
Thanks David - all good points. I'd actually be interested in hearing SeanT's views on this: he's been there and got the t-shirt.DavidL said:
My personal experience is the same as yours. My observation is that some people have addictive personalities. This shows by obsessions about TV shows, sports teams or substance abuse. I see it as something of an arc. This personality trait makes it very difficult for those who have it to resist addiction to any particular thing at a particular time.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
If a particular drug becomes their obsession of the moment they will make that the centre of their lives until their obsession moves on. I think we miss a trick by focussing on the addictiveness of particular substances. This is not, in my opinion, really the point. Those who are lucky enough not to have this personality trait may feel temporary discomfort if they withdraw from a substance but this is a temporary thing which a sense of perspective easily deals with.
What we need to focus on is the personality trait itself. That suggests treatments such as cognitive therapy are the way forward. The idea that you "treat" someone with, say, a heroin addiction by giving them an alternative drug like methadone is borderline crazy and has killed far too many people.0 -
Surely drink generally requires more volume to have a greater effect? I can stop at a shot of whisky, or a glass of wine, rather than drink the entire bottle. It's harder to take a quarter of an E, or inject just a little heroin.JWisemann said:
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?0 -
We need to get out of the instinctive and incorrect opinion that banning a drug reduces its usage. The experiences of other countries shows that is not the case.foxinsoxuk said:
I used to think like that, but over the last couple of decades I have seen enough of my old schoolfriends and some of Fox jr's friends squander their lives and talents through drug use. A bit of casual experimentation when young is one thing, but regular use blights lives.JWisemann said:There's no fundamental material difference between 'all that crap' and drink, though, is there? Or, say, coffee for that matter. I think one of the worst things Brown did was reversing the reclassification of cannabis, just when at least it looked like the bizarre and damaging puritan policy regarding natural substances that just happen to modulate neurotransmitters might finally be slowly heading in the right direction.
I would also like to reduce the number of people in jail for low level drug offences so we could put violent offenders away for a lot longer.
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The point is that most of us on the left are arguing for a mixed economy that takes the best of private and public, those on the right are the fundamentalists arguing that the uncontrolled free market is the answer to everything.JosiasJessop said:
You could just as easily say: "yesterday's headlines about Addenbrookes is a great warning against the fetishisation of the public sector and the NHS".SouthamObserver said:The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.
I'm not sure what your point is: there are plenty of cases of fraud, bad practice and waste in the public sector. Fetishisation off any organisation can allow them that organisation to take advantage, as Apple Fandom shows all too well.
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Plenty of people do say it about public services. It's much less common to hear it about the private sector. Instead, you have people like Nigel Farage saying that we can sort out the NHS by putting a businessman in charge of it. But as is clear, the private sector does not have close to all the answers. When we seek to outsource public services we need to be very careful indeed about the oversight and the incentives. And we also need to ensure that we do not water down general regulatory oversight. That is all.JosiasJessop said:
You could just as easily say: "yesterday's headlines about Addenbrookes is a great warning against the fetishisation of the public sector and the NHS".SouthamObserver said:The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.
I'm not sure what your point is: there are plenty of cases of fraud, bad practice and waste in the public sector. Fetishisation off any organisation can allow them that organisation to take advantage, as Apple Fandom shows all too well.
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Alcohol has higher social harm due to its legalisation and widespread use. But Heroin, Crack cocaine and meths all carry higher risk of mortality and psychosis for the user.JWisemann said:
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
And, Heroin, in particular, is very addictive.0 -
If you drink pure alcohol you can get in trouble pretty quickly, as someone who has drunk 75% rum I can attest to this.JosiasJessop said:
Surely drink generally requires more volume to have a greater effect? I can stop at a shot of whisky, or a glass of wine, rather than drink the entire bottle. It's harder to take a quarter of an E, or inject just a little heroin.JWisemann said:
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
Conversely, it's quite easy to do low doses of other drugs too, if that is your desire.0 -
The Mail headlines now are starting to look a little overkill it has to be said.
Clearly the pig thing was embarassing and should start to push Cameron towards a door which he's already walking out of sometime, but this is starting to look an awful lot like a lot of tittle-tattle now.0 -
Strawman. Very very few people on the right say that.JWisemann said:
The point is that most of us on the left are arguing for a mixed economy that takes the best of private and public, those on the right are the fundamentalists arguing that the uncontrolled free market is the answer to everything.JosiasJessop said:
You could just as easily say: "yesterday's headlines about Addenbrookes is a great warning against the fetishisation of the public sector and the NHS".SouthamObserver said:The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.
I'm not sure what your point is: there are plenty of cases of fraud, bad practice and waste in the public sector. Fetishisation off any organisation can allow them that organisation to take advantage, as Apple Fandom shows all too well.0 -
Correct. I had a friend 30 years who became an addict, from a good family he was able to "sort himself out" with enormous help and support, he talks of how close he was to death. Another of chap my acquaintance, who's family had finally washed their hands of him after years of misery was found dead in a public toilet. The Priory Clinic is not full of dustmen and tens of checkout workers.JWisemann said:If those people didn't want to pay more for things they shouldn't have got sick.
Used correctly, sensibly, moderately and safely, alcohol and many other drugs (obviously not all) can enrich life. There's a reason they are pretty much ubiquitous in human societies going back time immemorial.blackburn63 said:Most of us drink but if alcohol was invented today it would never be legalised. Drugs ruin lives but they don't respect class, as Stephen Fry says the problem occurs when you can't afford them. I know people who's lives have been ruined along with their nearest and dearest, it's easy to be pious about drugs. I'd treat users and jail dealers for life.
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A lot of media folk have come out the other side of excessive drugs use - Mr T, Toby Young, James Dellingpole and many more. They write about it well and engagingly. In a funny kind of way it seems glamorous. But most of all it comes across as survivable. If you are young, foolish and impressionable, what is not to like?Casino_Royale said:
Thanks David - all good points. I'd actually be interested in hearing SeanT's views on this: he's been there and got the t-shirt.DavidL said:
My personal experience is the same as yours. My observation is that some people have addictive personalities. This shows by obsessions about TV shows, sports teams or substance abuse. I see it as something of an arc. This personality trait makes it very difficult for those who have it to resist addiction to any particular thing at a particular time.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
If a particular drug becomes their obsession of the moment they will make that the centre of their lives until their obsession moves on. I think we miss a trick by focussing on the addictiveness of particular substances. This is not, in my opinion, really the point. Those who are lucky enough not to have this personality trait may feel temporary discomfort if they withdraw from a substance but this is a temporary thing which a sense of perspective easily deals with.
What we need to focus on is the personality trait itself. That suggests treatments such as cognitive therapy are the way forward. The idea that you "treat" someone with, say, a heroin addiction by giving them an alternative drug like methadone is borderline crazy and has killed far too many people.
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Yes, I wouldn't recommend any of the above, and have never fancied trying any of them despite having being able to in my party days - because I was educated enough to know what they can do to you and felt comfortable and confident in myself not to want to self-destruct. Plenty of other illegal drugs are less harmful in absolute terms than alcohol, though.Casino_Royale said:
Alcohol has higher social harm due to its legalisation and widespread use. But Heroin, Crack cocaine and meths all carry higher risk of mortality and psychosis for the user.JWisemann said:
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
And, Heroin, in particular, is very addictive.
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Isn't it considered a pre-requisite for a high profil(ish) media job these days ?SouthamObserver said:
A lot of media folk have come out the other side of excessive drugs use - Mr T, Toby Young, James Dellingpole and many more. They write about it well and engagingly. In a funny kind of way it seems glamorous. But most of all it comes across as survivable. If you are young, foolish and impressionable, what is not to like?Casino_Royale said:
Thanks David - all good points. I'd actually be interested in hearing SeanT's views on this: he's been there and got the t-shirt.DavidL said:
My personal experience is the same as yours. My observation is that some people have addictive personalities. This shows by obsessions about TV shows, sports teams or substance abuse. I see it as something of an arc. This personality trait makes it very difficult for those who have it to resist addiction to any particular thing at a particular time.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
If a particular drug becomes their obsession of the moment they will make that the centre of their lives until their obsession moves on. I think we miss a trick by focussing on the addictiveness of particular substances. This is not, in my opinion, really the point. Those who are lucky enough not to have this personality trait may feel temporary discomfort if they withdraw from a substance but this is a temporary thing which a sense of perspective easily deals with.
What we need to focus on is the personality trait itself. That suggests treatments such as cognitive therapy are the way forward. The idea that you "treat" someone with, say, a heroin addiction by giving them an alternative drug like methadone is borderline crazy and has killed far too many people.0 -
I have had doctors tell me that no one has ever died of heroin withdrawal. I am not sure I believe this because people who have been neglecting themselves can generate other complications such as seizures which might be fatal but as a general proposition it is probably correct.Casino_Royale said:
Alcohol has higher social harm due to its legalisation and widespread use. But Heroin, Crack cocaine and meths all carry higher risk of mortality and psychosis for the user.JWisemann said:
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
And, Heroin, in particular, is very addictive.
So the problem remains with the user. He or she chooses not to tolerate temporary discomfort required to get clean ( I am not underestimating its unpleasantness but it is no more than a few days) because they are psychologically addicted and obsessed. That is what we have to treat.0 -
Then how do you account for Labour's current plans to renationalise the railways? The current railway setup is exactly what you say they want: a combination of private (the operators) and public (Network Rail). Yet we're told with very little evidence that renationalisation would somehow make a better railway.JWisemann said:
The point is that most of us on the left are arguing for a mixed economy that takes the best of private and public, those on the right are the fundamentalists arguing that the uncontrolled free market is the answer to everything.JosiasJessop said:
You could just as easily say: "yesterday's headlines about Addenbrookes is a great warning against the fetishisation of the public sector and the NHS".SouthamObserver said:The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.
I'm not sure what your point is: there are plenty of cases of fraud, bad practice and waste in the public sector. Fetishisation off any organisation can allow them that organisation to take advantage, as Apple Fandom shows all too well.
There are fundamentalists on both sides; it's just that Labour have fundamentalists as leader and shadow chancellor.0 -
We will know if the official spin line changes from Oakeshott is finished to Boris has an axe to grind; no-one takes him seriously; court jester.tlg86 said:Can we now assume that Boris Johnson is the source of all of the stuff in this book?
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I can't go down the local shop and buy pure drinking alcohol. (I think).JWisemann said:
If you drink pure alcohol you can get in trouble pretty quickly, as someone who has drunk 75% rum I can attest to this.JosiasJessop said:
Surely drink generally requires more volume to have a greater effect? I can stop at a shot of whisky, or a glass of wine, rather than drink the entire bottle. It's harder to take a quarter of an E, or inject just a little heroin.JWisemann said:
You still haven't explained what's different about alcohol. Surely the key, whatever your indulgences, is moderation.Casino_Royale said:
Not that I have but I can understand the appeal of a cigar a little more, actually.SouthamObserver said:
I used to love a ciggie, especially after a good meal. But as a pessimist I could not justify them so gave up seventeen years ago and have not had one since. I still have five or six cigars a year. With whisky, soft lights and good music they make the world's worries dissolve.Casino_Royale said:I don't understand some people, particularly the wealthy and high-profiled. I've managed to have a rich and fulfilling life - including getting through the far less fun stress-filled and dark parts - without ever touching a cigarette, or cannabis, let alone anything like cocaine or heroin.
And no, I'm not a square - I enjoy a drink - but I don't see the need to ingest all this crap into your body.
What possible benefit does it bring you?
Conversely, it's quite easy to do low doses of other drugs too, if that is your desire.0 -
I think the issue with any immigration assimilation is large families as you say, and 2nd generation problems of not being able to fit in.Tykejohnno said:
The pace of change where I live is unbelievable,it took 50 years in my area for the Asian community to be the dominant population.JEO said:Front page of the Express tomorrow:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CPiML18WUAAuHXW.jpg
In the past 4 to 5 years ,another mass migration of the Roma community to my area in a very short period of time,you can see the change with the large families that are coming.
The actions of young islamic men and their proclivities in Sweden whereby their religion's honourable standards of behaviour to women are forgotten are a microcosm of the problems Europe-wide where people are welcomed and choose to operate with their own laws in close communities instead of fitting in with those who had welcomed them.
I suspect in parts of England some people vote UKIP out of frustration as nothing seems to be being done about it, as subject matter is almost taboo.
It is not annoyance at Oz and Kiwis swamping Earls Court, it is cultural. Numbers is not the issue really.
I come back to UK every couple of years so get a snapshot each time and I was surprised that most service workers I met spoke English as a 2nd language. They were pleasant and welcoming. So there is good and bad with immigration. We need to see both sides.
I would postulate that if I was a second generation muslim called Mohammed sending my C.V. in for a job "all other things being equal" I would not hold out much faith of being top of the pile as preconceptions and misconceptions based on general assumptions would not help.
That generalisation, not helped by a rabid MSM which influences pubic opinion, will unfortunately lead to further problems as frustrated (competent) youths are given few opportunities.
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At the age of 75 and having worked in the media for most of that time I have yet to see anyone using drugs except for one well known director on a high profile drama series..he lasted ten days, got fired and disappeared from the industry....Seen a lot of drunks tho..at all levels..0
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The issue is oversight and incentive, not on type of organisation. Do we incentivise private sector companies to provide the minimum acceptable level of public service for the general good or the best possible? Too often in this country I fear it is the former rather than the latter. And even then the oversight is often too lax.Slackbladder said:
Strawman. Very very few people on the right say that.JWisemann said:
The point is that most of us on the left are arguing for a mixed economy that takes the best of private and public, those on the right are the fundamentalists arguing that the uncontrolled free market is the answer to everything.JosiasJessop said:
You could just as easily say: "yesterday's headlines about Addenbrookes is a great warning against the fetishisation of the public sector and the NHS".SouthamObserver said:The front page of the Times today is a great warning against the fetishisation of private enterprise.
I'm not sure what your point is: there are plenty of cases of fraud, bad practice and waste in the public sector. Fetishisation off any organisation can allow them that organisation to take advantage, as Apple Fandom shows all too well.
0
