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Well it sounds like having made corbyn first impression to the masses be refusing to sing the national anthem, the Shadow chancellor is introducing the great unwashed to his greatest quotes collection. Genius.0
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Probably because DPM was Clegg while First Secretary of State was Hague. Cameron probably viewed the First Secretary as his "real" deputy.kle4 said:
I totally agree - he is Cameron's deputy, and in effect may as well be Deputy PM (except he is more powerful than most such people who held the position), hence why I said it is a trivial distinction, but legally he is not 'The Deputy PM', that post is currently vacant (as it notes here https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/deputy-prime-ministers-office) even though he is the guy who deputises for Cameron. I enjoy such minor distinctions. Why didn't he also make Osborne the actual deputy PM?Philip_Thompson said:
He's First Secretary of State which is virtually deputy PM.kle4 said:The first, yes, the second, no. It is indeed a trivial distinction, but it is still the case he is not the deputy PM in name, even if he is in deed. I do take the overall point about Osborne, an though I still question if he will be accepted further by the public, he's managed better on that score than I'd have thought he would if he's even considered a frontrunner for being Cameron's successor, so I cannot rule it out.
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Master Strategy innitScrapheap_as_was said:Well it sounds like having made corbyn first impression to the masses be refusing to sing the national anthem, the Shadow chancellor is introducing the great unwashed to his greatest quotes collection. Genius.
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How many of the immigrants do you suppose are actually refugees? How many safe countries have they traversed to get inside Schengen?Sean_F said:
I'm not sympathetic to the idea that claiming to be a refugee gives you an international passport to settle in the country of your choice on whatever terms suit you.JEO said:
I linked an article from the Swedish media where migrants refused to get off the bus in a small town because they insisted on living in a big city with lots of amenities. The entitlement is strong. And when they're not let in they start shouting "Allah akhbar" at the police forces of the Christian countries they demand to be able to access.Casino_Royale said:Bloody hell - just look at this. It's clear that a very large number of these men (and they are mainly men) feel a sense of entitlement to walk into Germany unhindered, and are angry these border countries are putting obstacles in their way.
Serbia, Croatia and Hungary should hold Merkel responsible for this - and send her the bill:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/34278213/migrant-crisis-in-pictures-whats-happening-on-the-hungarian-border
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-342831520 -
Is it me or has McDonnell spoke for about 10* the time of Liz Truss ?0
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@IsabelHardman: DUP's Nigel Dodds responds to John McDonnell's #bbcqt apology http://t.co/aHX0vDXxku0
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Not just you. What would do you expect from the Bolshevik Broadcasting CorporationPulpstar said:Is it me or has McDonnell spoke for about 10* the time of Liz Truss ?
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The most consistent number I have seen is about 30% of new arrivals to the EU border are Syrian refugees. The rest are Afghan, Pakistani, Balkan and Somalian. VertReggieCide said:
How many of the immigrants do you suppose are actually refugees? How many safe countries have they traversed to get inside Schengen?Sean_F said:
I'm not sympathetic to the idea that claiming to be a refugee gives you an international passport to settle in the country of your choice on whatever terms suit you.JEO said:
I linked an article from the Swedish media where migrants refused to get off the bus in a small town because they insisted on living in a big city with lots of amenities. The entitlement is strong. And when they're not let in they start shouting "Allah akhbar" at the police forces of the Christian countries they demand to be able to access.Casino_Royale said:Bloody hell - just look at this. It's clear that a very large number of these men (and they are mainly men) feel a sense of entitlement to walk into Germany unhindered, and are angry these border countries are putting obstacles in their way.
Serbia, Croatia and Hungary should hold Merkel responsible for this - and send her the bill:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/34278213/migrant-crisis-in-pictures-whats-happening-on-the-hungarian-border
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-342831520 -
Doesn't sound enough to comment - suggest you STFU.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.0 -
Young black lad asks a politician why they should vote for them, and she has a poor answer. Pathetic.0
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If he stopped shaving and wearing a tie, and shagged Abbot (a sacrifice too far perhaps but it would show commitment) he'd truly be home and hosed.flightpath01 said:
Osborne's the Govt Nr 2; the deputy PM. He's the Chancellor. He's the right age. He's effective. He's become accepted by the public. He's got the trust of the current PM. Assuming he's successful then he's probably going to be the next Tory leader.Casino_Royale said:
Yes.TheScreamingEagles said:
I reckon that's why it has to be Osborne to replace Dave.Casino_Royale said:
Osborne must be very clever: he has both you and me convinced.TheScreamingEagles said:
I've said it too, I think the Tories should stick on the centre/one-nation ground that they currently occupy.Casino_Royale said:
I don't want the election of Corbyn to tack the Conservative Party to the Left.TheScreamingEagles said:@tnewtondunn: EXCL: Senior Tories have begun talks with depressed Labour MPs to try to persuade them to defect;
http://www.sunnation.co.uk/depressed-labour-mps-in-talks-to-defect-to-the-tories …
I think JEO put it very well the other day: the Conservatives should stay where they are, and pursue the manifesto and principles they believe in.
When a sensible Labour leader is (eventually) elected, they will have that much further to travel to meet them to regain power. So, if they want to reshape the British political landscape, it's in the Conservatives interests to pull the middle-ground as close to the Right as possible.
It is so successful that they can win a majority with UKIP polling 13%
I read a manifesto promising big tax income and inheritance tax cuts, protection of defence spending, immigration controls, EU renegotiation, a reform of human rights law, a repeal of the fox hunting ban, a neo-thatcherite extension of the right to buy, and English votes for English laws.
It got my vote.
I should also add that Ed gave me the heebie jeebies.
The inevitable corollary of a tory victory at the election was Osborne becoming the next tory leader. Thats because it, the victory, had proved him right.0 -
A scot complaining about English food - hilarious. You'll be complaining about English dentists next.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.0 -
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:
Not everyone can join the Conservatives. They will always be constrained to be a certain degree of right-wing by their donors, in the same way that Labour will always be constrained to be a certain degree of left-wing by their donors (a constraint that is not currently binding). If you believe that the financial sector or industrialists or top professionals should be taxed more, the Conservatives are not for you.John_M said:
Honestly Anne, I think you'd have more leverage if you joined the Conservatives and tried to steer them leftwards. As currently constituted, the Labour party is almost certain to elect left wing successors to Corbyn.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
Other commentators have already pointed it out - the Tories should be sprawling all over the centre ground and killing soft left supporters with kindness.
The counter argument is that without an effective and credible opposition, there will be a tendency for the administration to drift right, and I think that will be counter-productive in the medium term.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.0 -
Jesus Christ was a refugee to Egypt ?! o_O
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Indeed, but as this poll makes clear if you were for Trump pre debate you were likely still for Trump after, but Fiorina has made up some further ground on himTim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.0 -
I think your first paragraph rather undermines the thrust of your secondSpeedy said:
Well I'm socially conservative and economically on the centre left, I'm the worst fit for the conservative party. Corbyn is less sh*t than the other candidates however I still don't rate him high, in fact he's very good at defying expectations but for the worst, unfortunately all the other prospective candidates are worse than him at every level.MaxPB said:
It has led to today's situation where we have a broadly centrist Tory party, a strong chance of leaving the EU altogether and Labour in complete disarray being unable to come up with a non-New Labour answer to the Tories parking themselves in the centre.Casino_Royale said:
In the early 00s the progressive consensus - including the BBC - was very strongly in favour of the Euro. At one time, around 2001-2003*, I had a real concern the debate was slipping through eurosceptic fingers; I felt very much on the fringe.JEO said:The 'centre ground' is not a fixed place but a movable destination depending on where thenpolitical parties are currently and have been in recent history. You get to move it by winning elections with a position away from the centre. The more right wing the Tory party is when it wins in 2020 the further right the centre ground will shift.
For us to ever join is now totally unthinkable.
*It was also the high water mark of mass immigration, EU integration (more broadly) and multiculturalist zealotry. A truly deeply depressing time to be a Conservative.
I'm simply sticking with Labour because the Tory attacks are so ridiculous they insult my intelligence.0 -
Nothing wrong with English dentists.Tim_B said:
A scot complaining about English food - hilarious. You'll be complaining about English dentists next.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.
People try to float on lilos all the way from Turkish holiday resorts to use them.0 -
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above
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e) all of the above - and a laughing stockTheScreamingEagles said:
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above0 -
Con holds in Richmondshire and Bourn0
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How did you get two votes? And weren't you the prescient one, fantastic.Speedy said:
Well the devil has many faces but shares the same policies and attitude. I supported the Tories and the LD's in 1997 because I knew that Blair was a very bad apple.MyBurningEars said:
Well according to the Tory attack ad, it was meant to be Peter Mandelson wasn't it? (From the New Labour, New Danger era. I'm sure everyone here knows the one I mean. Can't find it on Youtube unfortunately?)Speedy said:
The Tory party boss.TheScreamingEagles said:By the way I hope you all know who Mephistopheles is.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/484738.stm0 -
''The European policy argument embodies the many problems now facing the Labour party. It will be the first of many, some of them surely much bloodier. Corbyn is in many ways a living and breathing embodiment of an argument put forward by the political scientist Henry Drucker in 1979. Drucker argued that Labour is a party animated more by a sense of collective ethos than by a commitment to a political programme. It is therefore more comfortable as a party of opposition, sustained by a sense of betrayal, than as a party of government. That’s why Corbyn won and this week’s events bear Drucker out. But that conclusion offers little consolation for Labour’s stunned social democrats, whose tradition is now in the deepest jeopardy.''DanSmith said:
Corbyn backtracking to New Labour policy positions is going to kill him that's for sure.Pulpstar said:Salmond has no worry about Corbyn in Scotland from the looks of this QT.
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/sep/17/jeremy-corbyn-europe-labour-trouble-unions0 -
IIRC, it's one of the more coherent theories of where he was for the 30 years of his life that the bible completely fails to account for.Pulpstar said:Jesus Christ was a refugee to Egypt ?! o_O
Salmond is a bit of a religious nutter but usually privately. Hopefully the audience ridiculing gasp will keep it that way. Religion has no place in public life (as Tim Farron will no doubt discover).0 -
I know it's called McDonalds, but it's not scottish. Try some other restaurants.MaxPB said:
Drink San Pellegrino. Food in Scotland is all fried, beige and bland. Shit.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.
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I must admit I was sitting here thinking 'I am sure the good Friday agreement was not in 2003'... How is he getting away with it?
Here is his explanation in 2003
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2003/jun/03/northernireland.labour0 -
Nobody is talking about Carson today, and Trump's coverage has turned negative. Take the two of them together, they are over 50%. Until that unwinds we won't know what the hell is going on.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but as this poll makes clear if you were for Trump pre debate you were likely still for Trump after, but Fiorina has made up some further ground on himTim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.0 -
"Is it safe?"GeoffM said:
Nothing wrong with English dentists.Tim_B said:
A scot complaining about English food - hilarious. You'll be complaining about English dentists next.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.
People try to float on lilos all the way from Turkish holiday resorts to use them.0 -
On the tinnies againDair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.0 -
Shouldn't the correct response now be "who's Mark Reckless"?TheScreamingEagles said:
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above0 -
From a practical PoV, our geography is certainly the best for controlling immigration of pretty much all the countries in Eruope.
We have no land border with any other states (bar the chunnel), and are surrounded by the somewhat choppier waters of the atlantic rather than the somewhat calmer med.0 -
D, and my £3 entryist cheque is in the post.TheScreamingEagles said:
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above0 -
I thought I hid it well but Mark Reckless losing was the result I enjoyed the most on election nightMarqueeMark said:
e) all of the above - and a laughing stockTheScreamingEagles said:
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above0 -
But they feel down in the mouth.GeoffM said:
Nothing wrong with English dentists.Tim_B said:
A scot complaining about English food - hilarious. You'll be complaining about English dentists next.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.
People try to float on lilos all the way from Turkish holiday resorts to use them.0 -
Scotland doesn't have any problems that England doesn't pay forMyBurningEars said:
Scotland's biggest problem is what to do when the hyperbole mines run out.Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
0 -
Are you sure about this? Where else can you get sausage that isn't sausage shaped, like Scotland?Eh_ehm_a_eh said:
I know it's called McDonalds, but it's not scottish. Try some other restaurants.MaxPB said:
Drink San Pellegrino. Food in Scotland is all fried, beige and bland. Shit.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.0 -
Really? Why have you never mentioned this before?TheScreamingEagles said:
I thought I hid it well but Mark Reckless losing was the result I enjoyed the most on election nightMarqueeMark said:
e) all of the above - and a laughing stockTheScreamingEagles said:
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above0 -
You haven't had enough spiritual indoctrination.Pulpstar said:Jesus Christ was a refugee to Egypt ?! o_O
Mathew 2
13 When they had gone, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream. “Get up,” he said, “take the child and his mother and escape to Egypt. Stay there until I tell you, for Herod is going to search for the child to kill him.”
14 So he got up, took the child and his mother during the night and left for Egypt,
15 where he stayed until the death of Herod. And so was fulfilled what the Lord had said through the prophet: “Out of Egypt I called my son.”0 -
Nice tory pretty boy. Get him signed up.0
-
We have an unpatrolled, open land border.Pulpstar said:From a practical PoV, our geography is certainly the best for controlling immigration of pretty much all the countries in Eruope.
We have no land border with any other states (bar the chunnel), and are surrounded by the somewhat choppier waters of the atlantic rather than the somewhat calmer med.0 -
If Jesus is Jewish how come he has a Spanish name?Dair said:
IIRC, it's one of the more coherent theories of where he was for the 30 years of his life that the bible completely fails to account for.Pulpstar said:Jesus Christ was a refugee to Egypt ?! o_O
Salmond is a bit of a religious nutter but usually privately. Hopefully the audience ridiculing gasp will keep it that way. Religion has no place in public life (as Tim Farron will no doubt discover).0 -
Salmond has renewable sauce...Scott_P said:
Salmond is a renewable source. As long as you feed (taxpayer funded) curry in one end, you get a continuous supply of light, sweet Hyperbole flowing freelyMyBurningEars said:Scotland's biggest problem is what to do when the hyperbole mines run out.
0 -
Well someone once complained to Mike that I hated UKIPGeoffM said:
Really? Why have you never mentioned this before?TheScreamingEagles said:
I thought I hid it well but Mark Reckless losing was the result I enjoyed the most on election nightMarqueeMark said:
e) all of the above - and a laughing stockTheScreamingEagles said:
We're very inclusive. There's a simple quiz to passGeoffM said:
I'd like to apply, but I'm not sure you'd accept me.TheScreamingEagles said:
May I introduce you to the Fiscally Dry Social Liberal Not Obsessed by the Gays or EU New Conservative Party that Scrapheap, RobD and I have formed?John_M said:
That's a fair point, but I'm invoking the POWER OF ANECDOTE to argue that many right thinking right-of-centre people (e.g. yours truly) are fiscally dry but socially sopping wet. I want sound finances and a strong economy while prioritising care for the sick, disabled and the mentally ill (and by prioritising, I mean over pensioners - or at least the wealthy ones).EPG said:John_M said:
the medium term.AnneJGP said:Can't imagine that Mr Corbyn's recent election to Labour leader will have any impact on local elections, at least not yet.
However, it's certainly had a remarkable impact on me. I've done something today I couldn't have begun to envisage only a week ago: taken out a subscription to D Telegraph (online).
Labour-Uncut & Labourlist have been my websites of choice (after PB!) for some years now. But I'm sick of seeing long-term loyal Labour members, whom I know to be quite a long way to the left of my own views, being dubbed Tories & told to get out.
Demonstrably, the present Labour party wouldn't touch a mild-left-wing person like me with a barge-pole; they'd be insulted by a vote as impure as mine.
"Owes more to Methodism than Marxism"? Not this lot. I'm not much of a one for ill-wishing anyone or any organisation; but (sorry, @NickPalmer) I hope this lot crash & burn. They don't know what they're throwing down the drain.
I would imagine that would be palatable across the a wide range of the political spectrum.
1) Is Mark Reckless a) Pig b) Dog c) Traitor d) all of the above0 -
We'll have had all the economically viable supplies by thenTim_B said:
or until the price of oil increases significantly.MyBurningEars said:
Scotland's biggest problem is what to do when the hyperbole mines run out.Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
0 -
Christ, is this Tim Stanley guy an intentional parody?0
-
Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.0 -
He's a former Labour parliamentary candidateDanny565 said:Christ, is this Tim Stanley guy an intentional parody?
0 -
I meant a parody of that general pretentious, up-himself political SPAD (of any party).TheScreamingEagles said:
He's a former Labour parliamentary candidateDanny565 said:Christ, is this Tim Stanley guy an intentional parody?
0 -
It is not always thus with curry, or was your description a perverse simileScott_P said:
Salmond is a renewable source. As long as you feed (taxpayer funded) curry in one end, you get a continuous supply of light, sweet Hyperbole flowing freelyMyBurningEars said:Scotland's biggest problem is what to do when the hyperbole mines run out.
0 -
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.0 -
Mcdonnell is doing a sterling job in building trust up in him.... #he not Gordon saved the world0
-
I don't think they sell the ginger wigs. They're available on the Scottish NHS to those unfortunates born without said blessing and unable to face up to the stigma..watford30 said:
Dear old Dair, bumping his gums.Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
How's Scotland getting on in the great Arc of Prosperity?
Meanwhile Brent Crude hovers at $49.32 You're going to have to sell a lot of shortbread and ginger wigs to make up the loss.0 -
It's getting worse for FIFA. Secretary General Jerome Valcke has been suspended for selling World Cup tickets at 3 times face value.0
-
There were too many, for me the top ten results were : -TheScreamingEagles said:
I thought I hid it well but Mark Reckless losing was the result I enjoyed the most on election night
1. Margaret Curran
2. Anas Sarwar
3. Jim Murphy
4. Douglas Alexander
5. Charles Kennedy
6. Jo Swinson
7. Michael Moore / John Lamont
8. Ed Balls
9. Mark Reckless
10. Willie Bain
Honorable mentions Sandra Osborne, Ian Davidson, Tom Harris0 -
I don't mean a disaster in terms of performance (performance wise he's OK and is helped by such an extraordinarily left wing audience) but things that are far more fundamental than performance.notme said:
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.
Just him being asked why he wanted to assassinate Mrs Thatcher or why he was praising IRA murderers, kills him.
The way he explains these faux pas destroy's his credibility because he doesn't look professional and it sounds like he has appalling judgement.
Would anybody seriously trust the countries finances with someone who has such terrible judgment? Voters can join the dots and this guy is a disaster (but then so too is Corbyn himself).
0 -
Just heard Question Time. What a surprisingly attractive sounding politician John McDonnell is.
By the sound of it he resonates with the audience too. I'd thought his appointment was a mistake now I don't believe it was0 -
The media is slamming CNN for their handling of last night's debate. They are calling it the Clown News Network. The format was not good.0
-
Capt underpants tweeted just now he'd fallen off his sofa... was that Mcdonnell?0
-
I think that's a very fair assessment. Liz Truss' politics are far more sensible but she was rather... uninspiring... this evening. Her answer to the black lad was piss poor. The answer could have been from the Labour Gov't 1997-2010. Was a good opportunity to talk about self reliance, aspiration, get a bit more ideological than she did - an opportunity missed.notme said:
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.0 -
I like the new politics of integrity and consistency as demonstrated by apologies and u turns! He had a menacing anger that will leak out often enough.notme said:
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.
Actually what impresses me most about the Corbynistas is that they have repeated Dubyas Iraq war strategy. They have taken the capital and deposed the ruler, but have only the vaguest ideas about what to do next. No preparation or planning for the aftermath. Theirs too will be a squandered victory followed by chaos.0 -
I think it might be the beginning of the end of more than free movementBig_G_NorthWales said:
Agreed but there is going to be a lot of bad blood and some very heated exchanges and just how in that environment can they achieve agreement. Most of the Countries in Europe will close their borders causing economic mayhem and the end of free movement.MaxPB said:
They will probably just ignore it and blame it all on Hungary, Croatia, Greece and the UK. We will cast as the ringleaders and be given most of the blame by the EU, I'm sure.Big_G_NorthWales said:
Can you imagine having a front row seat at next Wednesday's emergency EU Leader's summitMaxPB said:
It already has from what I have read and been told.Tykejohnno said:
Just wait until public opinion turns in Germany,the establishment will sh!t themselves.MaxPB said:A Hungarian friend of mine has cancelled his subscription to German cable because the German media portrayal of the refugee crisis paints Germany as the great humanitarian nation and everyone else as some kind of Nazi-alikes with the refugees in the same situation as Jews in 1936.
0 -
Tom Freeman @SnoozeInBrief
I just wish Corbyn had stayed an obscure backbencher for long enough to have the same success in the Middle East that McDonnell had in NI.0 -
Watching the video game Horizon - the Notts Uni chap clearly has no idea about being in a guild/clan...0
-
"Needs to concentrate more"TheScreamingEagles said:Watching QT for the first time in ages and I'm shocked how poor my political knowledge is, I never knew John McDonnell was so instrumental to the Northern Ireland peace process.
0 -
John McDonnell was quite remarkable on Question Time.
He spent 50 minutes building trust, being affable, showing contrition, sounding both plausible and likeable even admitting the great unspoken truth about politics, that sometimes politicians lie for the greater good.
Then he blows it. Spectacularly. With a stupid, obvious, glaring and unreconcilable lie about the reason behind Corbyn refusing to sing Allah Save The Queen.0 -
I think the lie on Corbyn singing the anthem helped expose the fact that the IRA crap was probably a lie too, given he used the exact same technique and tone of voice.SeanT said:McDonnell did quite well - given the baggage he was handling - until the very last bit when he blatantly lied about Corbyn being so "moved and distracted" by the WW2 memorial he just "forgot" to sing the national anthem.
That was a clear lie, he was called out on it, and the SCOTE looked decidedly shifty.
Will it move votes? No. Most people don't watch Question Time. They will simply see the BBC report which says the Shadow Chancellor had to apologise on air for comments supporting the IRA (the most read item on iBBC right now):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34285308
Sensible people will reel away. Corbyn loyalists will explain it away.
Labour are heading for a Michael Foot type defeat in 2020, minus the Scottish seats.
0 -
She sounded unwell to me. So hardly likely to be a blinding performance.Pulpstar said:
I think that's a very fair assessment. Liz Truss' politics are far more sensible but she was rather... uninspiring... this evening. Her answer to the black lad was piss poor. The answer could have been from the Labour Gov't 1997-2010. Was a good opportunity to talk about self reliance, aspiration, get a bit more ideological than she did - an opportunity missed.notme said:
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.0 -
Indeed, but the mainstream media have never been pro Trump, outside of occasionally Fox, Trump has the money and name recognition for it not to affect his core supportTim_B said:
Nobody is talking about Carson today, and Trump's coverage has turned negative. Take the two of them together, they are over 50%. Until that unwinds we won't know what the hell is going on.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but as this poll makes clear if you were for Trump pre debate you were likely still for Trump after, but Fiorina has made up some further ground on himTim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.0 -
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/18/sports/soccer/top-fifa-executive-jerome-valcke-placed-on-leave.html?_r=0Dair said:
Is the suspense for him selling them so cheap?Tim_B said:It's getting worse for FIFA. Secretary General Jerome Valcke has been suspended for selling World Cup tickets at 3 times face value.
0 -
How very kind. I wasn't aware that the Scots drank water other than to make the Scotch go further.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.0 -
It was the most transparent lie I have seen since Blair's last appearance on telly. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss...Pauly said:
I think the lie on Corbyn singing the anthem helped expose the fact that the IRA crap was probably a lie too, given he used the exact same technique and tone of voice.SeanT said:McDonnell did quite well - given the baggage he was handling - until the very last bit when he blatantly lied about Corbyn being so "moved and distracted" by the WW2 memorial he just "forgot" to sing the national anthem.
That was a clear lie, he was called out on it, and the SCOTE looked decidedly shifty.
Will it move votes? No. Most people don't watch Question Time. They will simply see the BBC report which says the Shadow Chancellor had to apologise on air for comments supporting the IRA (the most read item on iBBC right now):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34285308
Sensible people will reel away. Corbyn loyalists will explain it away.
Labour are heading for a Michael Foot type defeat in 2020, minus the Scottish seats.0 -
You're clearly not watching the US news channels. They all give him lots of air time. He's ratings gold. It'll be interesting to see if that changes.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but the mainstream media have never been pro Trump, outside of occasionally Fox, Trump has the money and name recognition for it not to affect his core supportTim_B said:
Nobody is talking about Carson today, and Trump's coverage has turned negative. Take the two of them together, they are over 50%. Until that unwinds we won't know what the hell is going on.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but as this poll makes clear if you were for Trump pre debate you were likely still for Trump after, but Fiorina has made up some further ground on himTim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.
What we don't know is if his support is wide or deep.0 -
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-34281810
"Edinburgh Council warns of 2,000 job cuts"
I wonder if SNP are planning to use their new powers to stop this evil tory imposed austerity!!!
They've avoided raising council tax for years and now it will really bite.
The cynic in me really doubts it.
EDIT: Unison said councillors appeared to be considering privatisation of facilities management. Oh, that will go down well.0 -
Taking a net effect, that puts Fiorina as the clear winner at +29, and Rubio second at +14, with no-one else significantly positive. Biggest loser is Paul at -30, and Kasich at -8.Tim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.
Trump at +4 is third, but that for him is a big loss.0 -
Well he leads virtually every poll for the GOP nomination so of course they have to give him news coverage, but that does not mean most of the commentators comment on him favourablyTim_B said:
You're clearly not watching the US news channels. They all give him lots of air time. He's ratings gold. It'll be interesting to see if that changes.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but the mainstream media have never been pro Trump, outside of occasionally Fox, Trump has the money and name recognition for it not to affect his core supportTim_B said:
Nobody is talking about Carson today, and Trump's coverage has turned negative. Take the two of them together, they are over 50%. Until that unwinds we won't know what the hell is going on.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but as this poll makes clear if you were for Trump pre debate you were likely still for Trump after, but Fiorina has made up some further ground on himTim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.0 -
It wasn't just the transparency of the lie, it was the utter stupidity of it.foxinsoxuk said:
It was the most transparent lie I have seen since Blair's last appearance on telly. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss...Pauly said:
I think the lie on Corbyn singing the anthem helped expose the fact that the IRA crap was probably a lie too, given he used the exact same technique and tone of voice.SeanT said:McDonnell did quite well - given the baggage he was handling - until the very last bit when he blatantly lied about Corbyn being so "moved and distracted" by the WW2 memorial he just "forgot" to sing the national anthem.
That was a clear lie, he was called out on it, and the SCOTE looked decidedly shifty.
Will it move votes? No. Most people don't watch Question Time. They will simply see the BBC report which says the Shadow Chancellor had to apologise on air for comments supporting the IRA (the most read item on iBBC right now):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34285308
Sensible people will reel away. Corbyn loyalists will explain it away.
Labour are heading for a Michael Foot type defeat in 2020, minus the Scottish seats.
He could have easily made a point about the national anthem being hard for a democrat to sing while admitting there's deeper issues and that Jezza is thinking hard about them (basically the Salmond point). But he didn't, he went and made up a stupid, obvious and destructive lie.
He had the audience eating out his hand and then completely blew it.0 -
I have a totally unscientific and unsubstantiated point of view - even Heidi won't go there - that Trump peaked last night, and it's downhill for him from here.MTimT said:
Taking a net effect, that puts Fiorina as the clear winner at +29, and Rubio second at +14, with no-one else significantly positive. Biggest loser is Paul at -30, and Kasich at -8.Tim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.
Trump at +4 is third, but that for him is a big loss.0 -
To have been so influential and key to the peace process presumably McDonnell was hand in glove with Blair and his advisors. Who knew?SeanT said:
Yep. I saw that too. The faint and bogus stutter, the aw-shucks body language, the measured vowels with hints of emotion. It worked with the IRA thing, kind of, simply because the charge is so grave everyone felt pretty awkward and rather wanted to believe him, it looked ludicrous with the anthem explanation.Pauly said:
I think the lie on Corbyn singing the anthem helped expose the fact that the IRA crap was probably a lie too, given he used the exact same technique and tone of voice.SeanT said:McDonnell did quite well - given the baggage he was handling - until the very last bit when he blatantly lied about Corbyn being so "moved and distracted" by the WW2 memorial he just "forgot" to sing the national anthem.
That was a clear lie, he was called out on it, and the SCOTE looked decidedly shifty.
Will it move votes? No. Most people don't watch Question Time. They will simply see the BBC report which says the Shadow Chancellor had to apologise on air for comments supporting the IRA (the most read item on iBBC right now):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34285308
Sensible people will reel away. Corbyn loyalists will explain it away.
Labour are heading for a Michael Foot type defeat in 2020, minus the Scottish seats.
McDonnell is a lying c*nt and a very nasty piece of work.0 -
Just watching QT from recording it earlier. Toksvig seems to be far to the left of anyone. Is she on to make McDonnell and Salmond seem centre ground?0
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After 8 years of council tax freeze, the services from local government in Scotland are... identical to what they were 8 years ago (actually there is a good argument they are a lot better). The Council Tax freeze is excellent politics and has worked well, Scottish Local Government has never been so efficient.Pauly said:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-34281810
"Edinburgh Council warns of 2,000 job cuts"
I wonder if SNP are planning to use their new powers to stop this evil tory imposed austerity!!!
They've avoided raising council tax for years and now it will really bite.
The cynic in me really doubts it.
EDIT: Unison said councillors appeared to be considering privatisation of facilities management. Oh, that will go down well.
Undoubtedly there are more savings to come. Well done Edinburgh council - sack those loafers.0 -
USA: Fiorina is now at 4th place on betfair at 11. I do hope some PBers took my tip at 164/1 back in Feb.0
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I thought he was dead?SeanT said:@StephenNolan 10m10 minutes ago
Ian Paisley just told me on @bbc5live John McDonnell was given ultimatum by his senior lab colleagues 2apologise or he would be kicked out0 -
foxinsoxuk said:
I like the new politics of integrity and consistency as demonstrated by apologies and u turns! He had a menacing anger that will leak out often enough.notme said:
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.
Actually what impresses me most about the Corbynistas is that they have repeated Dubyas Iraq war strategy. They have taken the capital and deposed the ruler, but have only the vaguest ideas about what to do next. No preparation or planning for the aftermath. Theirs too will be a squandered victory followed by chaos.
Interesting take on Corbyn from an impersonator:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p032r7vq0 -
Who would that be? Only Mr Corbyn is senior to SCotE, isn't he?SeanT said:@StephenNolan 10m10 minutes ago
Ian Paisley just told me on @bbc5live John McDonnell was given ultimatum by his senior lab colleagues 2apologise or he would be kicked out0 -
Actually Red Ed did far better in England & Wales than Foot did in '83.SeanT said:McDonnell did quite well - given the baggage he was handling - until the very last bit when he blatantly lied about Corbyn being so "moved and distracted" by the WW2 memorial he just "forgot" to sing the national anthem.
That was a clear lie, he was called out on it, and the SCOTE looked decidedly shifty.
Will it move votes? No. Most people don't watch Question Time. They will simply see the BBC report which says the Shadow Chancellor had to apologise on air for comments supporting the IRA (the most read item on iBBC right now):
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34285308
Sensible people will reel away. Corbyn loyalists will explain it away.
Labour are heading for a Michael Foot type defeat in 2020, minus the Scottish seats.
Consider:
Foot's Scottish seats 41
Foot's E & W seats 168
Ed's Scottish seats... um, 1
but
Ed's E & W seats 2310 -
AS it doesn't have a skin it is able to absorb more fat from the deep frying. The shape is immaterial in this processTim_B said:
Are you sure about this? Where else can you get sausage that isn't sausage shaped, like Scotland?Eh_ehm_a_eh said:
I know it's called McDonalds, but it's not scottish. Try some other restaurants.MaxPB said:
Drink San Pellegrino. Food in Scotland is all fried, beige and bland. Shit.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.0 -
The problem with your premise is that the corollary doesn't work - they don't do the same with Hillary.HYUFD said:
Well he leads virtually every poll for the GOP nomination so of course they have to give him news coverage, but that does not mean most of the commentators comment on him favourablyTim_B said:
You're clearly not watching the US news channels. They all give him lots of air time. He's ratings gold. It'll be interesting to see if that changes.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but the mainstream media have never been pro Trump, outside of occasionally Fox, Trump has the money and name recognition for it not to affect his core supportTim_B said:
Nobody is talking about Carson today, and Trump's coverage has turned negative. Take the two of them together, they are over 50%. Until that unwinds we won't know what the hell is going on.HYUFD said:
Indeed, but as this poll makes clear if you were for Trump pre debate you were likely still for Trump after, but Fiorina has made up some further ground on himTim_B said:
The talking heads of Fox News and CNN (who are STILL camped out at the Reagan Library for the fourth day) have proclaimed Fiorina and somewhat behind, Rubio, as debate winners.HYUFD said:Gravis poll, Fiorina won debate
Fiorina – 33%
Trump – 21%
Rubio – 16%
Carson – 8%
Cruz – 5%
Christie – 4%
Bush – 4%
Kasich – 3%
Paul – 2%
Walker – 2%
Huckabee – 2%
And now, the losers:
Paul – 32%
Trump – 17%
Kasich – 11%
Bush – 9%
Huckabee – 8%
Walker – 6%
Carson – 5%
Fiorina – 4%
Christie – 4%
Cruz – 3%
Rubio – 2%
http://www.scribd.com/doc/281579691/One-America-News-Gravis-Marketing-Post-Debate
That was also the instant post-debate assessment on both networks.
Coverage of Trump has been noticeably more negative today.0 -
Tony Blair more honest than McDonnel.0
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And you guys sure know how to take advantage of that don't you. More of you down here than up there.Dair said:
We have an unpatrolled, open land border.Pulpstar said:From a practical PoV, our geography is certainly the best for controlling immigration of pretty much all the countries in Eruope.
We have no land border with any other states (bar the chunnel), and are surrounded by the somewhat choppier waters of the atlantic rather than the somewhat calmer med.0 -
"Peace has cost you your strength! Victory has defeated you!"foxinsoxuk said:
I like the new politics of integrity and consistency as demonstrated by apologies and u turns! He had a menacing anger that will leak out often enough.notme said:
Actually, in the round he is a disaster, but he is disturbingly affable and self deprecating in a way. If you agree with his politics you will lap it up. He was quite smooth, but sensed a bit of anger behind the eyes.GIN1138 said:Watching Question Time on I-Player...
John Mcdonnell a disaster, IMO.
Actually what impresses me most about the Corbynistas is that they have repeated Dubyas Iraq war strategy. They have taken the capital and deposed the ruler, but have only the vaguest ideas about what to do next. No preparation or planning for the aftermath. Theirs too will be a squandered victory followed by chaos.0 -
Sky News showing armed vigilantes in southern Hungary, endorsed by local mayors, 'diverting' migrants back to where they came.
Friendly enough, for the moment...
http://www.dw.com/en/volunteers-and-vigilantes-watch-over-refugees-in-hungary/a-186778680 -
I am shocked I tell you. Shocked.ReggieCide said:
AS it doesn't have a skin it is able to absorb more fat from the deep frying. The shape is immaterial in this processTim_B said:
Are you sure about this? Where else can you get sausage that isn't sausage shaped, like Scotland?Eh_ehm_a_eh said:
I know it's called McDonalds, but it's not scottish. Try some other restaurants.MaxPB said:
Drink San Pellegrino. Food in Scotland is all fried, beige and bland. Shit.Dair said:
Many times and it is quite a nice place to visit, however the undrinkable water does take the shine of the experience. Food is a bit iffy too.TGOHF said:
Dair old chap - have you ever been to Engerland ?Dair said:
An England which has no distinct culture, no coherent sense of nationhood, no wealth, no industry, no resources and is on the brink of electrical and water shortages is hardly in a position of strength in the negotiation. England is weak, poor and backward looking.dellertronic said:The union is dead is when not if it ends... English politicians need to wake up and ensure the split is on English terms.
One thing is certain about the dissolution of the United Kingdom. It will not be on England's terms.
But the scenery is often lovely, London is quite fun and the pubs are good.
Wow - science in sausage shaping. Cool.0 -
Could be a load of Labour grandees saying they'd threaten to use the nuclear option and resign from the party en masse if Corbyn didn't sack him. Corbyn would probably have to comply in those circumstances or his leadership really would be in tatters.AnneJGP said:
Who would that be? Only Mr Corbyn is senior to SCotE, isn't he?SeanT said:@StephenNolan 10m10 minutes ago
Ian Paisley just told me on @bbc5live John McDonnell was given ultimatum by his senior lab colleagues 2apologise or he would be kicked out0 -
Blame Hadrian. Either the emperor or the paint.ReggieCide said:
And you guys sure know how to take advantage of that don't you. More of you down here than up there.Dair said:
We have an unpatrolled, open land border.Pulpstar said:From a practical PoV, our geography is certainly the best for controlling immigration of pretty much all the countries in Eruope.
We have no land border with any other states (bar the chunnel), and are surrounded by the somewhat choppier waters of the atlantic rather than the somewhat calmer med.0
