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edited September 2015 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Is Hillary in trouble and can ‘The Donald’ last?

Whilst Clinton and Trump set the pace, a host of other candidates are waiting in the wings.  Polling expert Keiran Pedley runs the rule over the 2016 US Presidential hopefuls.

Read the full story here


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  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,457
    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?
  • Richard_Tyndall
    Richard_Tyndall Posts: 33,463
    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    Be fair, they do say that one of the great things about the US is that anyone can become president. Clinton and Trump (along with most of the rest of the candidates) are just proving the extremes of that statement.
  • Richard_Nabavi
    Richard_Nabavi Posts: 30,822
    edited September 2015
    Kieran's take on this pretty much matches mine: Yes, Hillary is in some trouble, but probably not enough to derail her (although that could change). No, The Donald is not going to be the GOP nominee, let alone President of the United States. It's pretty much par for the course for nutjobs to be amongst the leading contenders, if not the leading contender, at this stage. At the moment the sane (or at least sanish) vote is divided amongst 15 non-Trump candidates; as the field thins out the Trump voteshare will not increase - in fact it will diminish - and the non-Trump vote will coalesce around a small number of serious candidates.
  • Indigo
    Indigo Posts: 9,966
    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
  • SouthamObserver
    SouthamObserver Posts: 40,054
    Remember that when you vote for Jeremy Corbyn - for whatever reason you do - you are voting for the Hamas-approved candidate.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/11840793/jeremy-corbyn-hamas-praise-israel-palestine-conflict.html

    Feel proud.
  • SimonStClare
    SimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited September 2015
    'My instinct is that neither will end up as President'

    I hope you're correct Mr Pedley, what a sad pair of misfits these two would make as POTUS.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,457
    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
  • Tissue_Price
    Tissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    An excellent overview Kieran.

    But you've ducked the final decision: Democrats @ 8/11 or Republicans @ 5/4? I'd be leaning to the latter but there's not a lot in it.
  • Pulpstar
    Pulpstar Posts: 79,813
    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Excuse my ignorance but why would investors pay to listen to Bill Clinton ? Wouldn't they be better off heading to something like http://www.valueinvestorconference.com/ this ?
  • LucyJones
    LucyJones Posts: 651
    "The refugee crisis has taken a darker turn with the announcement that Bono and Bob Geldof are going to release a song about it.
    ...
    Bono and Sir Bob’s song will be recorded and released as soon as they can think of a rhyme for crisis that isn’t Isis."

    http://eveningharold.com/2015/09/04/dismay-as-bono-and-bob-geldof-announce-theyre-releasing-a-song-about-refugees/
  • watford30
    watford30 Posts: 3,474
    edited September 2015
    Pulpstar said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Excuse my ignorance but why would investors pay to listen to Bill Clinton ? Wouldn't they be better off heading to something like http://www.valueinvestorconference.com/ this ?
    Warren Buffett? Noooo. Save your money for a Gordon Brown speech.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,457
    Pulpstar said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Excuse my ignorance but why would investors pay to listen to Bill Clinton ?
    The cult of celebrity....
  • kle4
    kle4 Posts: 99,113
    Probably not fatally and No, seems a fair summary I guess.
  • Tim_B
    Tim_B Posts: 7,669
    Keiran Pedley -

    The ongoing scandal over her alleged use of private email servers to send classified information does not look like going away. Whether fair or not – several other Secretaries of State have used similar arrangements –

    You have fallen for one of the Hillary campaign's attack lines to try to minimize the damage from the email scandal.

    Indeed, several other Secretaries of State have sent a few emails from non-government accounts during their time in office, and all had also used government email accounts. BUT - nobody else - NOBODY -handled their government email exclusively from their own insecure private server located in their own home and did not have government email accounts at all.

    Also there is nothing 'alleged' about this. The FBI is in possession of the server. Hillary admitted its existence long ago.

    The latest wrinkle is that the low level State Dept techie who installed it and maintained it has let it be known that if called upon to testify he will take the fifth. It just gets worse.

    I suspect that looking at the polling tea leaves to determine her fate regarding the email 'effect' is pointless - she can probably struggle on and win the nomination.

    Her email danger is simple - if the FBI indict her, she's gone. If they don't, probably not.
  • SouthamObserver
    SouthamObserver Posts: 40,054
    edited September 2015
    Pulpstar said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Excuse my ignorance but why would investors pay to listen to Bill Clinton ? Wouldn't they be better off heading to something like http://www.valueinvestorconference.com/ this ?

    Because he knows a lot more about the way that governments function in the US and elsewhere than almost anyone else on earth, about how they interact with each other and other institutions, and can say in private much more than he would ever say in public.

  • Plato
    Plato Posts: 15,724
    :lol:
    LucyJones said:

    "The refugee crisis has taken a darker turn with the announcement that Bono and Bob Geldof are going to release a song about it.
    ...
    Bono and Sir Bob’s song will be recorded and released as soon as they can think of a rhyme for crisis that isn’t Isis."

    http://eveningharold.com/2015/09/04/dismay-as-bono-and-bob-geldof-announce-theyre-releasing-a-song-about-refugees/

  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    I am thinking of having my comps Corbyn proofed..four and a half years of spraying tea,coffee, wine, whisky and beer over them will be a disaster..
  • DavidL
    DavidL Posts: 55,867
    Tim_B said:

    Keiran Pedley -

    The ongoing scandal over her alleged use of private email servers to send classified information does not look like going away. Whether fair or not – several other Secretaries of State have used similar arrangements –

    You have fallen for one of the Hillary campaign's attack lines to try to minimize the damage from the email scandal.

    Indeed, several other Secretaries of State have sent a few emails from non-government accounts during their time in office, and all had also used government email accounts. BUT - nobody else - NOBODY -handled their government email exclusively from their own insecure private server located in their own home and did not have government email accounts at all.

    Also there is nothing 'alleged' about this. The FBI is in possession of the server. Hillary admitted its existence long ago.

    The latest wrinkle is that the low level State Dept techie who installed it and maintained it has let it be known that if called upon to testify he will take the fifth. It just gets worse.

    I suspect that looking at the polling tea leaves to determine her fate regarding the email 'effect' is pointless - she can probably struggle on and win the nomination.

    Her email danger is simple - if the FBI indict her, she's gone. If they don't, probably not.

    Just as well she has such a good friend in the Whitehouse and the FBI are in any event beyond reproach and invulnerable to political pressure then, eh?

    Maybe she is in trouble after all.
  • Tykejohnno
    Tykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    edited September 2015
    richardDodd said:

    I am thinking of having my comps Corbyn proofed..four and a half years of spraying tea,coffee, wine, whisky and beer over them will be a disaster..

    Mr dodd's,as someone who lives in Italy,with the immigration crisis hitting the country,how are the political parties doing there ?
  • Indigo
    Indigo Posts: 9,966
    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Hardly a fair comparison with Clinton being probably the most gifted American orator since JFK.
  • AndyJS
    AndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited September 2015
    Latest Clinton vs Trump poll (from Democratic-leaning pollster PPP):

    Clinton 46%
    Trump 44%

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/president/
  • john_zims
    john_zims Posts: 3,399
    @richardDodd

    'I am thinking of having my comps Corbyn proofed.'

    I'm looking forward to Corbyn's shadow cabinet of 'all the talents' Abbott,Skinner,McDonnell,Meacher,Edstone ,Chuka Weathercock etc should be excellent entertainment..
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,457
    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Hardly a fair comparison with Clinton being probably the most gifted American orator since JFK.
    Even George W. Bush reportedly made $15m in the first three years after leaving the White House....
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    edited September 2015
    TKJ..Much the same as everywhere else.. chaos.. various rumours that empty properties will be commandeered and filled up,some relatives have cancelled their trip to the States where they planned a 3 month vacation..that any hotel with empty rooms will be forced to take immigrants..and the coastal ,plus some mountain, resorts have been told that they will have to stay open during the winter to take overflow..other than that it is biz as usual.. chaotic.
    We do see bodies being taken from the sea on most nightly news programmes here..seems to be the norm and one immigrant has just raped a woman, killed her and then her husband..he arrived from Linya recently... whipped up the locals a bit...I imagine this shit stuff is on its way to you.
  • Pulpstar
    Pulpstar Posts: 79,813
    http://fortune.com/2015/06/11/politician-speaking-fees-speeches/

    “The speech is kind of secondary to … just being able to have a big name at your event,” Strate said. “It might get reported on some form of TV or cable news, which further adds to the prestige and the publicity of the event.”And even if it doesn’t end up on the evening news, almost every conference will put their speeches on YouTube, where there is always a chance it will go viral.

    (Politico notes that in one speech to a bowling industry group, Bush let loose the earthshaking bon mot that “bowling is fun.”)

    Arf !
  • Tykejohnno
    Tykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    richardDodd said:

    TKJ..Much the same as everywhere else.. chaos.. various rumours that empty properties will be commandeered and filled up,some relatives have cancelled their trip to the States where they planned a 3 month vacation..that any hotel with empty rooms will be forced to take immigrants..and the coastal ,plus some mountain, resorts have been told that they will have to stay open during the winter to take overflow..other than that it is biz as usual.. chaotic.
    We do see bodies being taken from the sea on most nightly news programmes here..seems to be the norm and one immigrant has just raped a woman, killed her and then her husband..he arrived from Linya recently... whipped up the locals a bit...I imagine this shit stuff is on its way to you.

    Very comforting to know ;-)
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    TKJ..Heheh.. you did ask..
  • Tim_B
    Tim_B Posts: 7,669
    DavidL said:

    Tim_B said:

    Keiran Pedley -

    The ongoing scandal over her alleged use of private email servers to send classified information does not look like going away. Whether fair or not – several other Secretaries of State have used similar arrangements –

    You have fallen for one of the Hillary campaign's attack lines to try to minimize the damage from the email scandal.

    Indeed, several other Secretaries of State have sent a few emails from non-government accounts during their time in office, and all had also used government email accounts. BUT - nobody else - NOBODY -handled their government email exclusively from their own insecure private server located in their own home and did not have government email accounts at all.

    Also there is nothing 'alleged' about this. The FBI is in possession of the server. Hillary admitted its existence long ago.

    The latest wrinkle is that the low level State Dept techie who installed it and maintained it has let it be known that if called upon to testify he will take the fifth. It just gets worse.

    I suspect that looking at the polling tea leaves to determine her fate regarding the email 'effect' is pointless - she can probably struggle on and win the nomination.

    Her email danger is simple - if the FBI indict her, she's gone. If they don't, probably not.

    Just as well she has such a good friend in the Whitehouse and the FBI are in any event beyond reproach and invulnerable to political pressure then, eh?

    Maybe she is in trouble after all.
    That's why I've gone on and on about it.

    Otherwise than the effect on her polling numbers, the email scandal is mainly a potential problem.

    The monthly email dumps from State will continue until the last one on January 29 2016. The Iowa caucus is on February 1st, New Hampshire is on the 9th.

    The scandal reminds everyone of the Clinton's almost endless scandals, from White Water and the Rose law firm billing records, to the murky operations of the Clinton Foundation and the Clinton Global Initiative, which are financially opaque. Charity Navigator will not rate them.

    The FBI will not be rushed, and word is that the investigation is 'broadening'. Owing to the political aspects of this, they will move slow and deliberate.
  • Plato
    Plato Posts: 15,724
    https://twitter.com/PlatoSays/status/639799085642461184
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Good afternoon, everyone.

    Miss Plato, I'm mildly surprised Cooper hasn't suggested we do a migration swap, taking 120,000 Syrian refugees in return for sending them 1 Jeremy Corbyn.
  • Tykejohnno
    Tykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    richardDodd said:

    TKJ..Heheh.. you did ask..

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ..Heheh.. you did ask..

    I did ;-)
  • Tim_B
    Tim_B Posts: 7,669
    Cameron just said the UK will take 'thousands more' Syrian refugees
  • RodCrosby
    RodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    Billionaire bids to buy Italian refugee island
    http://www.thelocal.it/20150904/billionaire-bids-to-buy-italian-refugee-island
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    edited September 2015
    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    On topic: American politics isn't my specialty, but Clinton was seen as inevitable last time. Whilst she's not facing an Obama for the gig this time around, she's also 8 years older and the e-mail business won't help her. No idea if that's serious enough to scupper her prospects.

    If Corbyn wins and Trump gets the red nod, then this must be a year of lunacy.

    Just over a week to find out about the former.
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. B, I think the Sky ticker said 4,000, from refugee camps [presumably adjacent to the conflict].

    If we are to take refugees, that's the way to do it. Encouraging illegal immigration through potentially fatal sea crossings, as per Merkel, is not.
  • Danny565
    Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    It strikes me that there's some similarities between Hillary and Ed Miliband. They're both so dull and have so little distinctive about them either personally or politically, that even relatively minor embarrassments or scandals really attach themselves to them because they essentially fill the vacuum left by having so little positive definition about themselves. I bet if it was Obama who'd wanted to keep his emails private, it wouldn't be anywhere near as big a deal.
  • Tim_B
    Tim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited September 2015
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. B, I think the Sky ticker said 4,000, from refugee camps [presumably adjacent to the conflict].

    If we are to take refugees, that's the way to do it. Encouraging illegal immigration through potentially fatal sea crossings, as per Merkel, is not.

    Did the ticker say they're wearing morning coats? ;)

    He's still talking...
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    MD.. Clinton blew her trust with America when she lied about Benghazi.
  • Tykejohnno
    Tykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    If you listened to radio 5 more immigration propaganda with the emotional blackmail stories,it would make you angry,no impartiality in the Syrian refugees crisis at all.
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    TKJ Then thank heaven we do not have a Miliband in No 10.
  • watford30
    watford30 Posts: 3,474
    edited September 2015
    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    An outbreak of logic.

    Does he drink tea from a Labour 'Controls on Immigration' pledge mug?
  • AndyJS
    AndyJS Posts: 29,395
    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
  • RodCrosby
    RodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    Corbyn narrowly ahead in poll of Labour councillors in marginal seats...
    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/elections/2015/09/what-does-our-latest-poll-mean-labour-leadership-race
    http://ww2.anglia.ac.uk/ruskin/en/home/microsites/labour_history_research/useful_links.Maincontent.0003.file.tmp/LHRU September 2015 polling.pdf
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Watford 30.. I worked with Austin as a reporter.. not overly bright..
  • No_Offence_Alan
    No_Offence_Alan Posts: 5,118
    If not ever previously holding office is not a barrier to being President, then the Democrats should co-opt Jon Stewart as their candidate.
  • SimonStClare
    SimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    Well it’s an opinion I guess – and no doubt will be greeted with silence from the outrage bus.
  • Sean_F
    Sean_F Posts: 39,132
    AndyJS said:

    Latest Clinton vs Trump poll (from Democratic-leaning pollster PPP):

    Clinton 46%
    Trump 44%

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/president/

    That's a damning verdict on Clinton.

    AN Other would be leading Trump 2 - 1.
  • Tim_B
    Tim_B Posts: 7,669
    richardDodd said:

    MD.. Clinton blew her trust with America when she lied about Benghazi.

    It was long before that Richard - Rose law firm billing....

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/arkansas/docs/recs.html

    Whitewater.....

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/whitewater/timeline.htm
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,457
    Danny565 said:

    It strikes me that there's some similarities between Hillary and Ed Miliband. They're both so dull and have so little distinctive about them either personally or politically, that even relatively minor embarrassments or scandals really attach themselves to them because they essentially fill the vacuum left by having so little positive definition about themselves. I bet if it was Obama who'd wanted to keep his emails private, it wouldn't be anywhere near as big a deal.

    I remember hearing Hillary reading her autobiography on the radio. God, she made her life sound dull....
  • Pulpstar
    Pulpstar Posts: 79,813
    Anyone offering odds on a reality TV series being made about "Bob's refugees" ?
  • flightpath01
    flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    richardDodd said:

    I am thinking of having my comps Corbyn proofed..four and a half years of spraying tea,coffee, wine, whisky and beer over them will be a disaster..

    http://www.kensington.com/ce/ca/4489/8589664370/keyboard-for-life#.Vemn8SgViko
    Alternatively you can simply eat your keyboard
    http://www.slashgear.com/keyboard-waffle-iron-tops-kickstarter-goal-just-in-time-for-christmas-27360862/
  • Plato
    Plato Posts: 15,724
    He's on a roll https://twitter.com/PlatoSays/status/639800064735637506
    SimonStClare said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    Well it’s an opinion I guess – and no doubt will be greeted with silence from the outrage bus.
  • Tykejohnno
    Tykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    richardDodd said:

    TKJ Then thank heaven we do not have a Miliband in No 10.

    Give them hell when you get back there ;-) don't you have to pretend your all things Miliband at the beeb.

    Didn't the guardian water treatment work on you ;-)
  • watford30
    watford30 Posts: 3,474
    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    That was obvious to anyone listening to the Today programme this morning.
  • DecrepitJohnL
    DecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Assuming you are right about the BBC's position, it might still be neutral, at least for some definitions of neutrality. The government thinks we should take more refugees. Where is neutral between that and opposition parties who think we should take even more?
  • MattW
    MattW Posts: 28,302
    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Rather think expecting consistency from BBC is a little optimistic.

    The Beeboids are unfit to have a 40% market share of news imo.
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    AndyJS As massive numbers of refugees will inevitably have an adverse impact on the lives and well being of the people of the UK then it could be argued that the BBC is being bigoted and racist towards the British people.. the ones who actually pay their wages..
  • notme
    notme Posts: 3,293
    Tykejohnno said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    If you listened to radio 5 more immigration propaganda with the emotional blackmail stories,it would make you angry,no impartiality in the Syrian refugees crisis at all.
    Yes, the repeatedly mocked Cameron's talks of many thousands getting refugee status in the UK, from UN camps, but then lauded Sturgeon's announcement that she welcomes a 1,000.

    It's now one of those situations on social media in which it is not possible to have an alternative view. You just have to keep your head down.

    We are all shy tories now.
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. L, neutrality comes from a broadcaster not having its own policy position.
  • TOPPING
    TOPPING Posts: 44,060
    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Indigo said:

    MarqueeMark said:

    Why does the biggest job in the world get such low-grade applicants?

    $400,000 per year plus having to put all your investments on ice probably makes it quite unattractive to the top tier
    Er...maybe. It comes with some great perks if you can outlive the job:

    "Over seven frenetic days, Bill Clinton addressed corporate executives in Switzerland and Denmark, an investors’ group in Sweden and a cluster of business and political leaders in Austria. The former president wrapped up his European trip in the triumphant Spanish Hall at Prague Castle, where he shared his thoughts on energy to a Czech business summit.

    His pay: $1.4 million."

    http://tinyurl.com/qamhjb9
    Hardly a fair comparison with Clinton being probably the most gifted American orator since JFK.
    Tony Blair and Bill Clinton...what an extraordinary era
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    TKJ.. I work for the drama dept..last worked in BBC news in the late 60s
  • Casino_Royale
    Casino_Royale Posts: 63,687
    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Well, not quite. They want to have at least one of those 'bigots' to provide 'balance' on any panel discussion they have about immigration.

    Hence their confusion when they encounter someone like Dan Hannan.
  • Casino_Royale
    Casino_Royale Posts: 63,687
    watford30 said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    An outbreak of logic.

    Does he drink tea from a Labour 'Controls on Immigration' pledge mug?
    An outbreak of illiteracy. Does he know how to use a keyboard?
  • logical_song
    logical_song Posts: 10,082
    richardDodd said:

    AndyJS As massive numbers of refugees will inevitably have an adverse impact on the lives and well being of the people of the UK then it could be argued that the BBC is being bigoted and racist towards the British people.. the ones who actually pay their wages..

    Don't get carried away, they're reporting the news.
  • Casino_Royale
    Casino_Royale Posts: 63,687
    Plato said:

    He's on a roll https://twitter.com/PlatoSays/status/639800064735637506

    SimonStClare said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    Well it’s an opinion I guess – and no doubt will be greeted with silence from the outrage bus.
    It's a view.
  • MarqueeMark
    MarqueeMark Posts: 55,457
    Pulpstar said:

    Anyone offering odds on a reality TV series being made about "Bob's refugees" ?

    How many could they get in the Big Brother house?
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Logical Song They are a a long way from anything remotely reporting the news..John Craven used to do a better job.
  • Casino_Royale
    Casino_Royale Posts: 63,687
    Sean_F said:

    AndyJS said:

    Latest Clinton vs Trump poll (from Democratic-leaning pollster PPP):

    Clinton 46%
    Trump 44%

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/president/

    That's a damning verdict on Clinton.

    AN Other would be leading Trump 2 - 1.
    I'm not sure what I understand less: seagulling, or why nearly half the American electorate would be willing to vote for Donald Trump.
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    Nice to see that Ashworth managed to find the R for refugees at the last minute.

    https://twitter.com/JonAshworth/status/639797505740394497/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
  • TOPPING
    TOPPING Posts: 44,060
    Casino_Royale said:

    Plato said:

    He's on a roll https://twitter.com/PlatoSays/status/639800064735637506

    SimonStClare said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    https://twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    Well it’s an opinion I guess – and no doubt will be greeted with silence from the outrage bus.
    It's a view.
    lazy immigrants not coming over here stealing our jobs..
  • AndyJS
    AndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited September 2015
    DecrepitJohnL said:

    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Assuming you are right about the BBC's position, it might still be neutral, at least for some definitions of neutrality. The government thinks we should take more refugees. Where is neutral between that and opposition parties who think we should take even more?
    The BBC shouldn't be advancing a position, they should just be reporting the facts. If you watch BBC news footage from the 1980s or 1990s you can see that this is how they used to do it. Even on issues where 99% of people could be expected to agree with a particular position, they still reported on it neutrally nonetheless.
  • SimonStClare
    SimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited September 2015
    Casino_Royale said:

    watford30 said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    An outbreak of illiteracy. Does he know how to use a keyboard?
    Blimey, Austin Mitchell dares to think 'outside the box’ and all you see is his poor typing skills.
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Dr Spyn The future of the UK..Sad innit..
  • flightpath01
    flightpath01 Posts: 4,903
    SimonStClare said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Austin Mitchell doing his bit for Labour.

    twitter.com/AVMitchell2010/status/639800054459572224?lang=en

    Well it’s an opinion I guess – and no doubt will be greeted with silence from the outrage bus.
    Just post modern irony fuelled by a liquid lunch.
  • Tykejohnno
    Tykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    dr_spyn said:

    Nice to see that Ashworth managed to find the R for refugees at the last minute.

    https://twitter.com/JonAshworth/status/639797505740394497/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

    Wonder how many football ground's we will be seeing this at,at the weekend ?
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    TKJ Rotherham and Rochdale
  • watford30
    watford30 Posts: 3,474
    Tykejohnno said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Nice to see that Ashworth managed to find the R for refugees at the last minute.

    https://twitter.com/JonAshworth/status/639797505740394497/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

    Wonder how many football ground's we will be seeing this at,at the weekend ?
    Ladies in full Hijab? Not many.
  • Pulpstar
    Pulpstar Posts: 79,813
    TKJ - Clearly the new ice bucket challenge.
  • Plato
    Plato Posts: 15,724
    https://twitter.com/PlatoSays/status/639747029019807744
  • AnneJGP
    AnneJGP Posts: 3,743
    AndyJS said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Assuming you are right about the BBC's position, it might still be neutral, at least for some definitions of neutrality. The government thinks we should take more refugees. Where is neutral between that and opposition parties who think we should take even more?
    The BBC shouldn't be advancing a position, they should just be reporting the facts. If you watch BBC news footage from the 1980s or 1990s you can see that this is how they used to do it. Even on issues where 99% of people could be expected to agree with a particular position, they still reported on it neutrally nonetheless.
    It would be worth the BBC looking to the future - tomorrow's world. For centuries the 'first world' has had massively more than its fair share of the earth's resources. I doubt if this Great Migration will cease until our standards of living have been levelled down to the point where they're fairly equitable with the rest of the planet.

    The real question therefore is: what can/should we aim to retain of our civilisation, given that we cannot hang on to the massive wealth differential? And how can we do it?
  • dr_spyn
    dr_spyn Posts: 11,312
    I gather that the Mayor of Bristol has gallantly offered space for some refugees in his own home.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-34150371

    Which politician will be next to have an open doors policy?
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Looks like Ed Miliband's house in Doncaster could be empty for the forseeable.

    Could get 20 or so in there.
  • Eastwinger
    Eastwinger Posts: 356
    In that photo Clinton's nose seems to be getting longer.

    I wonder why that is.
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    TGOHF..20 ..Is it a two bedder....
  • watford30
    watford30 Posts: 3,474
    TGOHF said:

    Looks like Ed Miliband's house in Doncaster could be empty for the forseeable.

    Could get 20 or so in there.

    Perhaps he could subdivide that massive house in Dartmouth Park. Shouldn't be too tricky, with so many kitchens already in place.
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    watford30 said:

    TGOHF said:

    Looks like Ed Miliband's house in Doncaster could be empty for the forseeable.

    Could get 20 or so in there.

    Perhaps he could subdivide that massive house in Dartmouth Park. Shouldn't be too tricky, with so many kitchens already in place.
    No he will need that home for his new job in some awful green quango

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3221864/Ed-Miliband-won-t-serve-Jeremy-Corbyn-expected-remain-backbenches-new-leader-chosen.html

    "Ed Miliband 'to quit frontline politics' and won't take a job whoever replaces him as Labour leader"
  • DecrepitJohnL
    DecrepitJohnL Posts: 13,300
    AndyJS said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Assuming you are right about the BBC's position, it might still be neutral, at least for some definitions of neutrality. The government thinks we should take more refugees. Where is neutral between that and opposition parties who think we should take even more?
    The BBC shouldn't be advancing a position, they should just be reporting the facts. If you watch BBC news footage from the 1980s or 1990s you can see that this is how they used to do it. Even on issues where 99% of people could be expected to agree with a particular position, they still reported on it neutrally nonetheless.
    Perhaps the problem is what is meant by "neutral" -- equidistant between government and opposition; attacked equally from right and left?
  • Richard_Tyndall
    Richard_Tyndall Posts: 33,463
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. B, I think the Sky ticker said 4,000, from refugee camps [presumably adjacent to the conflict].

    If we are to take refugees, that's the way to do it. Encouraging illegal immigration through potentially fatal sea crossings, as per Merkel, is not.

    Yep. If this is Cameron's plan then he should be very much praised for it. Like he said, heart and head needs to operate at the moment.
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Decrepit John.. Reporting the facts in a unbiased way was always considered to be the Neutral Position.. and insisted upon by most News Editors
  • Monksfield
    Monksfield Posts: 2,905
    edited September 2015
    Cameron moves from we're doing enough to we'll take thousands in hours as he reflects the message of the previous day's press.

    What an odious PR clown he is.
  • AndyJS
    AndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "The Great Migration is a sign of increasing wealth, not abject poverty" — Fraser Nelson:

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2015/09/increasing-wealth-is-the-cause-of-the-great-migration-not-a-cure-for-it/
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. Monksfield, certainly possible to disagree with his position, but it is at least coherent. Merkel's approach is stupid and dangerous.
  • Plato
    Plato Posts: 15,724
    https://twitter.com/PlatoSays/status/639811423758065668
  • TGOHF
    TGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Are there any circumstances you would support anything Mr Cameron does Monksfield ?

    Monksfield : “'I'm sure there are some but I can't think of them at the moment.”
  • Monksfield
    Monksfield Posts: 2,905
    Morris_Dancer said:

    Mr. Monksfield, certainly possible to disagree with his position, but it is at least coherent. Merkel's approach is stupid and dangerous.

    Has he got a position? If so, it's changed today by 45 degrees. If the focus turns to Calais again next week, he'll be back to building fences.
  • AndyJS
    AndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited September 2015
    DecrepitJohnL said:

    AndyJS said:

    DecrepitJohnL said:

    AndyJS said:

    richardDodd said:

    TKJ.. I will be back in London in a couple of weeks to work for the BBC and it will be interesting for me to see if there has been an attitude change from my last visit of a couple or so weeks ago ..I will be working with the same people and everyone was quite laid back about refugees at that point in time.

    The BBC have given up on the concept of neutral journalism IMO. Everything they're doing at the moment assumes that allowing large numbers of refugees into the country is the only civilised course of action and anyone who even mildly disagrees is basically a racist and a bigot who doesn't deserve to be heard for a second.
    Assuming you are right about the BBC's position, it might still be neutral, at least for some definitions of neutrality. The government thinks we should take more refugees. Where is neutral between that and opposition parties who think we should take even more?
    The BBC shouldn't be advancing a position, they should just be reporting the facts. If you watch BBC news footage from the 1980s or 1990s you can see that this is how they used to do it. Even on issues where 99% of people could be expected to agree with a particular position, they still reported on it neutrally nonetheless.
    Perhaps the problem is what is meant by "neutral" -- equidistant between government and opposition; attacked equally from right and left?
    Neutral means just reporting the facts without advancing an opinion. It used to be taken for granted by the BBC and other media that this was the way to do it. For example when 9/11 happened the BBC simply reported the facts: they didn't keep telling us how awful it was, because that was blindingly obvious. If it's obvious the vast majority of people agree with a position, you don't need to say so on the news.
  • richardDodd
    richardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Monksfield I certainly hope so .. or just close the hole..
  • Morris_Dancer
    Morris_Dancer Posts: 62,742
    Mr. Monksfield, those in Calais are not refugees. France isn't that bad.

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