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A clear benefit of Tariff Liberation (sic) day. Trump becomes very unpopular – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 13,265
edited 6:36AM in General
A clear benefit of Tariff Liberation (sic) day. Trump becomes very unpopular – politicalbetting.com

It's bizarro world with Trump & tariffs. It's political insanity to keep trying something that 63% of Americans oppose with no sign of voters coming around.He's had a negative approval rating in every single poll since tariff Liberation Day in 2025. That's 482 days in a row. pic.twitter.com/h5rO21bjP4

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Comments

  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,899
    First!
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,899
    Trump was already unpopular. I doubt US voters understand tariffs sufficiently for that to be a significant reason, given the myriad of kore obvious and more egregious reasons why he is politically repellent.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 34,115
    Going forth and conking out.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 80,265

    🔞 Trump stormed to the top of the leaderboard on PornHub in the "Man fucks 8 billion people at once" category.



    https://x.com/SatoshiBitunix/status/1907789992715243797

    Impressive, given he only has one the size and shape of a button mushroom.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 129,921
    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    On a side note, we're now subject to greater tariffs than the EU.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,649

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Cui bono?

    Is that a dig at the number of former PMs or, for likely, Megan’s PR team trying to keep the story alive
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 59,621
    I said on the last thread that the new generic polling in the US is looking catastrophic for the GOP: https://x.com/PpollingNumbers/status/2080370259354112323

    The Democrats are pouring money into 4 Senate seats they think that they can swing: North Carolina, Ohio, Iowa (!!) and Alaska (!!!)

    On the other hand they seem to be struggling in Maine after their candidate stood down on a sex scandal and are tearing each other's eyes out in Michigan.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 13,649

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good morning, everyone.

    Some might say Harry should bugger off and pay for his own security. I'd be among them. Wanting to no longer have the duties of a royal while retaining the privileges is nonsense.
    He wants IPP status. That’s immensely valuable.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good to hear there’s some advantages to having had so many prime ministers in recent years.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 48,269
    edited 7:00AM

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    You’d think with all the endless screeching about the terrorist threat and security for high profile public figures that the world’s most famous Afghan veteran (sorry Al Carns) might get priority. Makes one think that some of that screeching might not be entirely sincere.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 64,143
    Sandpit said:

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good to hear there’s some advantages to having had so many prime ministers in recent years.
    Enough for each to get a ring from Sauron.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi blocks Grant Shapps from standing again as a Conservative parliamentary candidate

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/23/badenoch-blocks-shapps-from-standing-for-tories/

    He's been shown to be a liability. Good call.
    Is that right? Grant Shapps was very dependable in stepping in when other ministers bit the dust during the Johnson and Truss chaos, even being Home Sec for six days. A loyal middle of the road Conservative I would have thought.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 15,816

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    You’d think with all the endless screeching about the terrorist threat and security for high profile public figures that the world’s most famous Afghan veteran (sorry Al Carns) might get priority. Makes one think that some of that screeching might not be entirely sincere.
    There is definitely a faction who won't be happy until they are all killed.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 34,115
    edited 7:09AM
    A couple of links I ran across this morning:

    Regret from Elon Musk:
    Elon Musk has admitted he became too consumed by politics during his volatile alliance with Donald Trump and his brief appointment as the president’s financial axman, running the so-called “department of government efficiency” (Doge).
    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2026/jul/23/elon-musk-regret-trump-doge-ai

    Does Musk thinks it is feeling like 1888 (ish)?

    US Army Education in 1945 on "Fascism". They had a load of these, including "What about Britain?", and "What do we do with Japan?"

    "Army Talk Orientation Fact Sheet No 64: Fascism". Published 24 March 1945.
    Text:
    https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Army_Talk_Orientation_Fact_Sheet/Number_64
    Image:
    https://archive.org/details/ArmyTalkOrientationFactSheet64-Fascism/mode/2up

    If you want to read it, go to Wiki or print out, or get the PC to read it - it is quite substantial.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095
    MattW said:

    A couple of links I ran across this morning:

    Regret from Elon Musk:
    Elon Musk has admitted he became too consumed by politics during his volatile alliance with Donald Trump and his brief appointment as the president’s financial axman, running the so-called “department of government efficiency” (Doge).
    https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2026/jul/23/elon-musk-regret-trump-doge-ai

    US Army Education in 1945 on "Fascism". They had a load of these, including "What about Britain?", and "What do we do with Japan?"

    "Army Talk Orientation Fact Sheet No 64: Fascism". Published 24 March 1945.
    Text:
    https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Army_Talk_Orientation_Fact_Sheet/Number_64
    Image:
    https://archive.org/details/ArmyTalkOrientationFactSheet64-Fascism/mode/2up

    Not my country or laws, but Musk should be regretting in jail.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 129,921
    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi blocks Grant Shapps from standing again as a Conservative parliamentary candidate

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/23/badenoch-blocks-shapps-from-standing-for-tories/

    He's been shown to be a liability. Good call.
    Is that right? Grant Shapps was very dependable in stepping in when other ministers bit the dust during the Johnson and Truss chaos, even being Home Sec for six days. A loyal middle of the road Conservative I would have thought.
    Sebastian Fox on the other hand.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,820
    Nigelb said:

    On a side note, we're now subject to greater tariffs than the EU.

    Lucky we have that special special relationship
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 46,820

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good morning, everyone.

    Some might say Harry should bugger off and pay for his own security. I'd be among them. Wanting to no longer have the duties of a royal while retaining the privileges is nonsense.
    The parasites should all be paying for it themselves, they grift enough out of the country every year to not even have it as a rounding error.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 48,269
    Dura_Ace said:

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    You’d think with all the endless screeching about the terrorist threat and security for high profile public figures that the world’s most famous Afghan veteran (sorry Al Carns) might get priority. Makes one think that some of that screeching might not be entirely sincere.
    There is definitely a faction who won't be happy until they are all killed.
    Yep.
    If such an attack could also take out Greta Thunberg, Lineker and that YouTube lefty economics guy at the same time, the church bells would ring out across Gammonland.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 129,921
    Dura_Ace said:

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    You’d think with all the endless screeching about the terrorist threat and security for high profile public figures that the world’s most famous Afghan veteran (sorry Al Carns) might get priority. Makes one think that some of that screeching might not be entirely sincere.
    There is definitely a faction who won't be happy until they are all killed.
    A bit like the IRA.

    Even in his 90s Roy Mason needed armed protection all because as Defence/Northern Ireland Secretary he gave the IRA an absolute hiding.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi blocks Grant Shapps from standing again as a Conservative parliamentary candidate

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/23/badenoch-blocks-shapps-from-standing-for-tories/

    He's been shown to be a liability. Good call.
    Is that right? Grant Shapps was very dependable in stepping in when other ministers bit the dust during the Johnson and Truss chaos, even being Home Sec for six days. A loyal middle of the road Conservative I would have thought.
    Sebastian Fox on the other hand.
    Getting four loyal middle of the road Conservatives for the price of one has to be a bargain?
  • StereodogStereodog Posts: 1,435

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    It depends entirely on your circumstances. With a disabled husband and a middling income I couldn't live with myself if I chose the second option and lost. 50 grand would make a big difference to our lives and I wouldn't risk not having it. We always have this conversation when we watch 1% Club.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 61,024
    DavidL said:

    I said on the last thread that the new generic polling in the US is looking catastrophic for the GOP: https://x.com/PpollingNumbers/status/2080370259354112323

    The Democrats are pouring money into 4 Senate seats they think that they can swing: North Carolina, Ohio, Iowa (!!) and Alaska (!!!)

    On the other hand they seem to be struggling in Maine after their candidate stood down on a sex scandal and are tearing each other's eyes out in Michigan.

    Popular candidate with a winning track record in Alaska. North Carolina always a key target. Iowa agriculture is suffering bigly from Trump. Ohio also falling out of love with Trump.

    Maine will come back to a handy Dem lead - the ICE+ shooting there has done for Collins.

    Michigan is fun, but returning to the more sensible Dem candidate.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 34,115
    edited 7:16AM

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good morning, everyone.

    Some might say Harry should bugger off and pay for his own security. I'd be among them. Wanting to no longer have the duties of a royal while retaining the privileges is nonsense.
    He wants IPP status. That’s immensely valuable.
    Ahem. Cough:

    IPP status primarily refers to either an Internationally Protected Person (an international law designation for high-level officials) or an Imprisonment for Public Protection.

    Prince William, the new "Man in the Iron Mask".

    The Tower of London awaits ...
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 13,092

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 17,849

    Dura_Ace said:

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    You’d think with all the endless screeching about the terrorist threat and security for high profile public figures that the world’s most famous Afghan veteran (sorry Al Carns) might get priority. Makes one think that some of that screeching might not be entirely sincere.
    There is definitely a faction who won't be happy until they are all killed.
    Yep.
    If such an attack could also take out Greta Thunberg, Lineker and that YouTube lefty economics guy at the same time, the church bells would ring out across Gammonland.
    You're surely not suggesting the online right are uniquely celebratory of those at the other end of the political spectrum being killed? You'll remember the celebration by some of the online left at Ann Widdecombe's murder?
  • TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 2,175
    Not my thought, I saw it over on reddit but someone has noted that the market has stopped believing his weekly bullshit about Iran and market movements are harder and harder to manipulate now (especially as reality is getting closer and closer and the US strategic reserve closer and closer to its minimum).

    So instead do this! Put tariffs on, take tariffs off! Markets will move that way and the boys can go back to making loads of money.

    What's the betting the tariffs are removed on Monday (at least partially)?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 129,921

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good morning, everyone.

    Some might say Harry should bugger off and pay for his own security. I'd be among them. Wanting to no longer have the duties of a royal while retaining the privileges is nonsense.
    It’s not so much paying for it.

    All the money in the world doesn’t get you permission for your bodyguards to carry guns on the streets of the UK.

    The key thing with this job is getting intelligence about who is trying to kill you.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    edited 7:24AM
    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    I’d bring my wife with me for the same challenge, and we could share a 25% chance of missing the million (and a 25% chance of getting two!).

    In the US, a number of lotteries offer the choice of either a lump sum or a monthly payment for life. The monthly payment almost always works out better, but most take the lump sum and spend it frivolously.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 64,143

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    Good morning, everyone.

    Some might say Harry should bugger off and pay for his own security. I'd be among them. Wanting to no longer have the duties of a royal while retaining the privileges is nonsense.
    It’s not so much paying for it.

    All the money in the world doesn’t get you permission for your bodyguards to carry guns on the streets of the UK.

    The key thing with this job is getting intelligence about who is trying to kill you.
    My sympathy remains other than with the millionaire celebrity wanting special treatment. Let him stay in America.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 61,024
    Wildberries appear to be the most combustible things known to man.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    edited 7:26AM

    Wildberries appear to be the most combustible things known to man.

    St Petersburg can’t decide whether or not they’ve elected a new Pope.

    The WildBerries warehouse says no, but the naval base says yes.

    https://x.com/tymeninebrat/status/2080491897412354096
  • CiceroCicero Posts: 4,541
    Trump... Ye Gods!

    OK, America you can have Trump or the Western Alliance.

    If the midterms are not an unprecedented disaster for the Republicans, with the GOP losing virtually everything and Trump being put in a box for the rest of his term, then the consequences for "American Global Leadership" should be fatal. Every day this absurdist theatre of the stupid alienates allies and comforts the biggest bastards on the planet.

    Now the Western Allies will indeed rearm- but to face the American threat as much as the Russian or the Chinese. I hope the inept, corrupt fools in the "administration" get that sudden sinking feeling that Wil E. Coyote gets, just as he falls the thousands of feet to the canyon floor below.

    As for Musk... jail is too good for him. The rest of the tech bros should have their near monopolies taken away from them too.

    The last "gilded age" ended in the anti trust laws. I see no reason why this trashy tinsel age should not end in much the same manner. If the US will not do it itself, then the EU and China should force the issue. Enough is enough.

    As for the American war on Iran... The ICJ should at least consider investigating the possible war crimes. The US may not give a fig about it, but it is part an parcel of the modus operandi of the criminal regime in Washington, and at least there should be a moral protest against this brutal stupidity.

    The United States has lost its moral authority, it should begin to lose actual authority too.

    Any, have a nice day everyone.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 13,092
    edited 7:30AM

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 129,921

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Not betting but in Deal or No Deal you’d often see people accept £80,000 even though they still had the £250,000.

    Quite a few people would say the £80,000 would pay off their mortgage and that would make them financially secure for life.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
  • maxhmaxh Posts: 2,123

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Bear in mind a huge number of the population have no savings - under £100. Offer folk a certain £50k versus a maybe/maybe not million, they will take a life-changing sum in their bank account. Surprised it is as low as 73%.
    Plus there is good evidence that our counting instincts are logarithmic: so £1 million 'feels' like about double £100,000 to most of us, especially when we're clicking through a Yougov poll at speed.

    Ask someone the question where the £1m is replaced by £200k and the answers make a bit more sense.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    maxh said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Bear in mind a huge number of the population have no savings - under £100. Offer folk a certain £50k versus a maybe/maybe not million, they will take a life-changing sum in their bank account. Surprised it is as low as 73%.
    Plus there is good evidence that our counting instincts are logarithmic: so £1 million 'feels' like about double £100,000 to most of us, especially when we're clicking through a Yougov poll at speed.

    Ask someone the question where the £1m is replaced by £200k and the answers make a bit more sense.
    Yes it’s probably why there are multiples more £100k premium bond prizes than the mere 2 for £1million. I wonder if lottery and NS and I employ behaviour experts to set prizes?
  • eekeek Posts: 34,734
    edited 7:39AM
    maxh said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Bear in mind a huge number of the population have no savings - under £100. Offer folk a certain £50k versus a maybe/maybe not million, they will take a life-changing sum in their bank account. Surprised it is as low as 73%.
    Plus there is good evidence that our counting instincts are logarithmic: so £1 million 'feels' like about double £100,000 to most of us, especially when we're clicking through a Yougov poll at speed.

    Ask someone the question where the £1m is replaced by £200k and the answers make a bit more sense.
    I don't think it's that, I think if you offer £1m or £50,000 many people wouldn't trust that it's a real 50/50 bet.

    Make it £250,000 and the 50/50 odds sound more plausible.

    Also if you look at it via Deal / No Deal. If the options are 1p / £80,000 / £250,000

    that £80,000 is a great deal compared to 1p...
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 13,092

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,899
    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi blocks Grant Shapps from standing again as a Conservative parliamentary candidate

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/23/badenoch-blocks-shapps-from-standing-for-tories/

    He's been shown to be a liability. Good call.
    Is that right? Grant Shapps was very dependable in stepping in when other ministers bit the dust during the Johnson and Truss chaos, even being Home Sec for six days. A loyal middle of the road Conservative I would have thought.
    But the Tories won't find a way back until voters have forgotten about the years of failure and grift; taking back those who were directly involved simply reminds voters how useless they all were.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015

    Now I wonder what my answer would be, for guaranteed £50k versus 50% £1m.

    I'd probably ask one of the rich chaps here to give me £50k, on the understanding I'd give them £150k back if I got the million.

    Yes re-insure . This is what most companies do if they own the opportunity but not in the league to transact it
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 55,899
    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    More specifically, it's avoiding the feeling you'd have if you chose the gamble and came away with nothing at all, that is motivating the statistically sub-optimal choice.
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,575
    Sandpit said:

    Wildberries appear to be the most combustible things known to man.

    St Petersburg can’t decide whether or not they’ve elected a new Pope.

    The WildBerries warehouse says no, but the naval base says yes.

    https://x.com/tymeninebrat/status/2080491897412354096
    Very digitally altered image that one. Would like to see the original.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    edited 7:41AM
    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    I’d bring my wife with me for the same challenge, and we could share a 25% chance of missing the million (and a 25% chance of getting two!).

    Or a syndicate of ten friends...

    There's no 'right' or 'wrong' answer about the choices when offered free money - but as several PBers have set out, most people tend to prioritise external factors over just the odds.

    Which is one of the things which helps make betting profitable.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095
    IanB2 said:

    FF43 said:

    HYUFD said:

    Kemi blocks Grant Shapps from standing again as a Conservative parliamentary candidate

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2026/07/23/badenoch-blocks-shapps-from-standing-for-tories/

    He's been shown to be a liability. Good call.
    Is that right? Grant Shapps was very dependable in stepping in when other ministers bit the dust during the Johnson and Truss chaos, even being Home Sec for six days. A loyal middle of the road Conservative I would have thought.
    But the Tories won't find a way back until voters have forgotten about the years of failure and grift; taking back those who were directly involved simply reminds voters how useless they all were.
    I suppose that's it. They are being pretty selective about which failures and grifters they keep or reject however, including Badenoch herself.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,909
    IanB2 said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    More specifically, it's avoiding the feeling you'd have if you chose the gamble and came away with nothing at all, that is motivating the statistically sub-optimal choice.
    Yes. The decisive factor is not the size of the win, it's the size of the stake. Suppose I had a genuinely sound tip that the proper odds on a 20/1 horse was even money. Would I stake £50K on that chance? No. Once analysed the circumstances of this offer are the same.

  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    So there must be an equilibrium where non probability issues balance out in gambling . As you say the lottery is at one end where people make a bad probability decision because they want hope and excitement and the other end is where people make a bad probability decision because they want certainty of a significant amount of.

    Is the middle around the betting of sums to win sums where the stake and potential reward are slightly meaningful ( if I bet tenner on this and it wins I can have a meal out etc) ? Ie where probability and value betting rule ?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689

    Sandpit said:

    Wildberries appear to be the most combustible things known to man.

    St Petersburg can’t decide whether or not they’ve elected a new Pope.

    The WildBerries warehouse says no, but the naval base says yes.

    https://x.com/tymeninebrat/status/2080491897412354096
    Very digitally altered image that one. Would like to see the original.
    Have videos of both fires: https://x.com/tendar/status/2080476579629588947
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Not betting but in Deal or No Deal you’d often see people accept £80,000 even though they still had the £250,000.

    Quite a few people would say the £80,000 would pay off their mortgage and that would make them financially secure for life.
    Which is a rational decision. They have achieved their objective.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 64,143
    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    You’ll need it though ! The coffee!
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 48,269
    Cookie said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Prince Harry’s security review delayed as nine former PMs need protection

    The Duke of Sussex was promised a risk assessment last year, but was still waiting in June as officials struggled to cope with record dem


    The Duke of Sussex is being forced to wait for a decision about his security arrangements in Britain while officials grapple with protecting an unprecedented nine former prime ministers at once, The Times has learnt.

    Prince Harry was told he would be granted a risk management board at the end of last year to reassess whether he should receive automatic police protection every time he visits the UK.

    The review was due to be carried out in March by the Royal and VIP Executive Committee (Ravec), an independent body overseen by the Home Office that decides which public figures should be given armed protection and at what level. However, it had still not taken place by the end of June.


    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/royal-family/article/prince-harry-security-uk-visit-prime-ministers-wlbgksg5r

    You’d think with all the endless screeching about the terrorist threat and security for high profile public figures that the world’s most famous Afghan veteran (sorry Al Carns) might get priority. Makes one think that some of that screeching might not be entirely sincere.
    There is definitely a faction who won't be happy until they are all killed.
    Yep.
    If such an attack could also take out Greta Thunberg, Lineker and that YouTube lefty economics guy at the same time, the church bells would ring out across Gammonland.
    You're surely not suggesting the online right are uniquely celebratory of those at the other end of the political spectrum being killed? You'll remember the celebration by some of the online left at Ann Widdecombe's murder?
    Arseholes are everywhere.
    I do find it mystifying why some righties (who would no doubt call themselves moderates) feel such animus towards certain people. The same people loved punting Harry doing his bit at Bastion and only a few short years ago they were frotting themselves stupid(er) over H&M's wedding, hailing a new age of multicultural royalty. I happened to be in Berlin that weekend but even there I could feel the hot blast of The Firm's pr doing its thing.
    A fickle lot, royalists.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    edited 7:52AM

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    So there must be an equilibrium where non probability issues balance out in gambling . As you say the lottery is at one end where people make a bad probability decision because they want hope and excitement and the other end is where people make a bad probability decision because they want certainty of a significant amount of.

    Is the middle around the betting of sums to win sums where the stake and potential reward are slightly meaningful ( if I bet tenner on this and it wins I can have a meal out etc) ? Ie where probability and value betting rule ?
    As someone suggested earlier, if the choice was £50m vs a chance of £1bn then the sensible thing for most people is to take the cash, because it’s still totally life-changing, generational wealth. So it’s all about personal circumstances.

    Personally I don’t see one year’s salary or thereabouts as a life-changing amount of money, but I would definitely see the million as such. Hell, I could bank the million and make £50k a year on the interest, or put it in the S&P and make an average of £70-£80k over time. Sure £50k would be useful, but wouldn’t really change my life.

    Other people would definitely see the £50k as life-changing though, if it lets them pay off a mortgage or take a nice holiday they’ve not had in years…
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 13,092

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    So there must be an equilibrium where non probability issues balance out in gambling . As you say the lottery is at one end where people make a bad probability decision because they want hope and excitement and the other end is where people make a bad probability decision because they want certainty of a significant amount of.

    Is the middle around the betting of sums to win sums where the stake and potential reward are slightly meaningful ( if I bet tenner on this and it wins I can have a meal out etc) ? Ie where probability and value betting rule ?
    Well each of us have what is known as a 'utility function' in game theory. We pretty much all undervalue pennies and overvalue millions. So we're happy to risk small sums for crazily bad chances of winning big sums.

    Some people may have rather different profiles - if you need a life saving operation then you may be prepared to risk big sums at poor odds to finance the otherwise unaffordable operation for example. But most people will have the usual profile, with what counts as small/big being shifted up or down relative to their actual wealth.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    McDonald’s now do fancy coffee in many locations, for around half the price of Starbucks or Costa fancy coffee.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.
  • maxhmaxh Posts: 2,123
    edited 8:00AM
    algarkirk said:

    IanB2 said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    More specifically, it's avoiding the feeling you'd have if you chose the gamble and came away with nothing at all, that is motivating the statistically sub-optimal choice.
    Yes. The decisive factor is not the size of the win, it's the size of the stake. Suppose I had a genuinely sound tip that the proper odds on a 20/1 horse was even money. Would I stake £50K on that chance? No. Once analysed the circumstances of this offer are the same.

    Almost, but not quite because of loss aversion.

    ETA my analogy was nonsense!
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    McDonald’s now do fancy coffee in many locations, for around half the price of Starbucks or Costa fancy coffee.
    As a frequent user of trains and hence take away coffee I can vouch that Macdonalds and Greggs do the best and cheapest coffee . Costa - the cups just leak as well which is messy on a train
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    McDonald’s now do fancy coffee in many locations, for around half the price of Starbucks or Costa fancy coffee.
    That I could do.
    I'd want something stronger than coffee to visit IKEA.
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,635
    algarkirk said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Not betting but in Deal or No Deal you’d often see people accept £80,000 even though they still had the £250,000.

    Quite a few people would say the £80,000 would pay off their mortgage and that would make them financially secure for life.
    I think I would take the £50K, the reasons being non financial. For me betting is only a pastime with no seriousness about riches. The moment chance taking is about winning and losing serious money its attraction changes. The formula becomes: If I take the risk there is a 50% chance of losing £50K. Only people who would stake £50K would certainly take the chance. That's not many.

    Sister in Law says her group won't bet on the Euromillions until it gets over £100mn. Less than that is not worth the bother!
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 64,143
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    Price of a family breakfast is very good value.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,909
    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,603
    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    edited 8:06AM
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    McDonald’s now do fancy coffee in many locations, for around half the price of Starbucks or Costa fancy coffee.
    That I could do.
    I'd want something stronger than coffee to visit IKEA.
    In my part of the world, the IKEA is in a large mall with the Hard Rock Café at the other end.

    If my wife wants to go to IKEA on Saturday, the deal is that I drive there and she drives back, I don’t have to walk around IKEA but will buy lunch and help with the loading.

    If you go into the HRC at midday on a Saturday, you’ll see another dozen or so single men sitting at the bar, all with exactly the same idea. One by one over the next couple of hours they’ll meet their wives for lunch!
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    Price of a family breakfast is very good value.
    The word family is ominous
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095
    .
    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    Which raises the interesting possibility, which we have touched in the past couple of days, that Labour not the Conservatives might benefit from a Reform collapse as widely assumed, not least by the Conservatives themselves. ie it goes back to a 2024 situation. A complete collapse probably does benefit the Conservatives; a partial collapse may benefit Labour.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 20,095
    edited 8:10AM
    .
    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    Which raises the interesting possibility, which we have touched on in the past couple of days, that Labour might benefit from a Reform collapse, and not the Conservatives as widely assumed, including by the Conservatives themselves. ie we go back to a 2024 situation. A complete collapse probably does benefit the Conservatives; a partial collapse may benefit Labour.
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 6,015
    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    I suspect it was politically necessary to return Rayner to the cabinet.
    But she has show no evidence at all of capacity to deliver on housing.

    I wonder if there is planning to do stuff despite her ?
    Still insisting on trousering her severance pay as if it were a job in Tesco. I wish she could show some dignity in high office
  • BartholomewRobertsBartholomewRoberts Posts: 29,575
    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    Getting to 1.5 million in the 3 remaining years is not going to happen as Starmer has already wasted 2 years without implementing planning reform.

    Getting to over 300k a year by the end of Parliament is still possible and should be a realistic and SMART target.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,909
    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 81,380
    algarkirk said:

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


    Reform should not be losing places like Grays. This isn't great for Farage.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,909
    FF43 said:

    .

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    Which raises the interesting possibility, which we have touched in the past couple of days, that Labour not the Conservatives might benefit from a Reform collapse as widely assumed, not least by the Conservatives themselves. ie it goes back to a 2024 situation. A complete collapse probably does benefit the Conservatives; a partial collapse may benefit Labour.
    Agree. Labour have positioned themselves as a real alternative to Reform, with populist but not extreme approaches to migration and a new leader who understands communication with non anoraks and non Hampstead. The Tories have positioned themselves as Reformlite and said with great clarity that they want One Nationers to vote Labour or LD. Which they will unless and until the Tories put in a leader who understands what conservatism is, economic, fiscal and cultural.

  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    Pulpstar said:

    algarkirk said:

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


    Reform should not be losing places like Grays. This isn't great for Farage.
    Wait and see what happens if he loses the by-election to the bin.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    edited 8:19AM
    Shouqiao Wang @Qiaoqiao2001
    I solved 6 open Erdős problems in 5 days, using
    @OpenAI GPT-5.6 Sol.

    I have a math background, but the Codex workflow I used does not require deep mathematical knowledge.

    Here’s exactly how I approached it, including my prompts 🧵

    https://x.com/Qiaoqiao2001/status/2080003441821163958
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,549
    a
    Pulpstar said:

    algarkirk said:

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


    Reform should not be losing places like Grays. This isn't great for Farage.
    🌹 LAB: 30.2% (+3.8)
    ➡️ RFM: 28.1% (-5.1)
    🌍 GRN: 27.5% (-1.9)
    🌳 CON: 14.1% (+3.1)

    It looks like the Burnsiah Bounce at work. Unless local effects such as candidates are behind it. So worth watching the aggregate of the locals, going forward.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 91,111
    Sandpit said:

    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    She had 18 months in charge of housing before, with no initiatives, no inducements, no legislation, no planning reform - and then had to resign after she fcuked up her own housing arrangements.

    How’s about identifying a few square miles of government-owned land that can be released for development, working with industry and mortgage lenders to set up 50-year warranties on prefabricated houses, relaxing planning consent for small individual plots under 1 acre and 3,000sqft BUA, and streamlining the process for major infrastructure projects based on Hybrid Bills through Parliament.

    All of the above ideas COST NO MONEY.
    No government money.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 17,909

    Sandpit said:

    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Well it pays to be a gambler if you understand these issues. If you don't you're heading for trouble.

    Betting too much in even very attractive circumstances is a good route to poverty.

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kelly_criterion)

    Yes of course . Miss a good gambling theory talk on here !
    I think it applies to insurance as well .
    The National Lottery works on the reverse basis. People are happy to buy a ticket with (at a guess) a value of 50p for a pound. They really don't mind the small loss, but the 1 in a million chance of life changing wealth is something they value more highly than the actual financial value of that chance.
    Yes, the National Lottery is terrible value for money, paying only 50% back in prizes (vs 80% on that fruit machine in the pub, and 90%+ on most casino games).

    But it’s the tiny chance of a million or more that keeps people playing.
    Tiny chance but also low cost. If you have a coffee in the IKEA restaurant rather than a chain you're probably saving that much.
    That would mean braving IKEA.
    Something I've now managed to avoid for about a decade now.
    McDonald’s now do fancy coffee in many locations, for around half the price of Starbucks or Costa fancy coffee.
    As a frequent user of trains and hence take away coffee I can vouch that Macdonalds and Greggs do the best and cheapest coffee . Costa - the cups just leak as well which is messy on a train
    The coffee van at Carlisle station is up with the best for price, quality and friendly service.

  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 5,602
    Sandpit said:

    Pulpstar said:

    algarkirk said:

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


    Reform should not be losing places like Grays. This isn't great for Farage.
    Wait and see what happens if he loses the by-election to the bin.
    ...when...
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 62,689
    edited 8:24AM
    Nigelb said:

    Sandpit said:

    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    She had 18 months in charge of housing before, with no initiatives, no inducements, no legislation, no planning reform - and then had to resign after she fcuked up her own housing arrangements.

    How’s about identifying a few square miles of government-owned land that can be released for development, working with industry and mortgage lenders to set up 50-year warranties on prefabricated houses, relaxing planning consent for small individual plots under 1 acre and 3,000sqft BUA, and streamlining the process for major infrastructure projects based on Hybrid Bills through Parliament.

    All of the above ideas COST NO MONEY.
    No government money.
    No government money, and positively incentivising private money to get into the sector.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 64,549
    Sandpit said:

    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    She had 18 months in charge of housing before, with no initiatives, no inducements, no legislation, no planning reform - and then had to resign after she fcuked up her own housing arrangements.

    How’s about identifying a few square miles of government-owned land that can be released for development, working with industry and mortgage lenders to set up 50-year warranties on prefabricated houses, relaxing planning consent for small individual plots under 1 acre and 3,000sqft BUA, and streamlining the process for major infrastructure projects based on Hybrid Bills through Parliament.

    All of the above ideas COST NO MONEY.
    The way to make it really work would be to, indeed, spend money.

    Borrow from the Victorians. Plan a small town. Put in the roads. Put in the sewers, the water, the leecy, the gas. Put in the schools and the GP surgery (make it one of the those large, combined practices). Put in pubs and shops. Put in the train station, if you can justify one.

    Fire up as many of those facilities as possible - the existing locals will probably want them.

    Sell the plots of land to different developers. One side of a street to each.
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,635
    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    I suspect it was politically necessary to return Rayner to the cabinet.
    But she has show no evidence at all of capacity to deliver on housing.

    I wonder if there is planning to do stuff despite her ?
    Timms has dual responsibilities - DWP and Housing. Given the amount spent on housing and the need for more social housing (funded by the DWP!) I suspect there is something there.
  • eekeek Posts: 34,734

    a

    Pulpstar said:

    algarkirk said:

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


    Reform should not be losing places like Grays. This isn't great for Farage.
    🌹 LAB: 30.2% (+3.8)
    ➡️ RFM: 28.1% (-5.1)
    🌍 GRN: 27.5% (-1.9)
    🌳 CON: 14.1% (+3.1)

    It looks like the Burnsiah Bounce at work. Unless local effects such as candidates are behind it. So worth watching the aggregate of the locals, going forward.
    Thurrock had 45 Reform councilors elected in May - it’s fully controlled by them as there are only 49 councilors in total.

    So your typical reform voter probably didn’t bother to vote as it’s not going to make any difference to what the council is going to do
  • MelonBMelonB Posts: 17,603
    edited 8:27AM
    algarkirk said:

    MelonB said:

    Did we already do the Thurrock local by-election results?

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080433731463217540?s=46

    https://x.com/electionmapsuk/status/2080434339737969132?s=46

    Labour gains from Reform. Quite surprising - it’s true Reform heartland - but also given the area isn’t that far from Clacton, quite interesting.

    It's interesting but Thurrock is not Clacton.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thurrock_(constituency)


    “Isn’t that far from Clacton”.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 23,958

    Omnium said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is why betting can be profitable.

    If you had a choice between instantly receiving £50,000 or a 50% chance to win £1m, which would you pick?

    £50,000: 73%
    50/50 chance of winning £1m: 21%

    https://x.com/YouGov/status/2080286628711391377

    Why?
    Actually this isn't as simple as it looks.

    Suppose the amounts were £50m or 50/50 chance of £1bn - for most people it makes sense to actually go for the certain but lesser value choice.
    Yes I understand . But passing why this would mean it pays to be a gambler per se ? Is there a real life example of this in betting ?
    Not betting but in Deal or No Deal you’d often see people accept £80,000 even though they still had the £250,000.

    Quite a few people would say the £80,000 would pay off their mortgage and that would make them financially secure for life.
    Arguably the show doesn't want those kind of people on it - less drama, more rational thinking. Many on here (not everyone, for sure) would think yeah, 50 grand is nice but it won't change my world, a million would so I'll gamble.

    Many people not on PB think I've never had 50 grand and I can definitely get it right now, I will thanks!
  • BattlebusBattlebus Posts: 3,635
    Battlebus said:

    Nigelb said:

    algarkirk said:

    Nigelb said:

    Very interesting article from Burnham in the Guardian.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jul/23/number-10-north-growth-uk-andy-burnham

    Not for any arguments it sets out (though FWIW I agree about the potential benefits of decentralisation), but for his evident confidence that he can move the dial.

    That's a pretty tough ask in the three years he has available.

    Rayner was doing the old familiar politics on home building numbers on R4 Today this morning. The interviewer, Rayner and the entire audience knew that the answer to the question about whether the government could attain its 1.5 million homes promise by 2029 was "No". But she would not say so, and managed also to blame the Tories and the nature of reality for the failure she would not accept was going to happen.

    I think Burnham's government has little to lose by speaking human and saying the truth about these things instead of being asked about them for the next three years while they evade the obvious.

    I suspect it was politically necessary to return Rayner to the cabinet.
    But she has show no evidence at all of capacity to deliver on housing.

    I wonder if there is planning to do stuff despite her ?
    Timms has dual responsibilities - DWP and Housing. Given the amount spent on housing and the need for more social housing (funded by the DWP!) I suspect there is something there.
    As an afterthought it will be worthwhile watching Kruger (Reform) speak on the subject as he appears to be lead on the DWP. Perhaps he will now comment on Housing too.
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