Skip to content

John Healey aims a missile at Starmer & Reeves whilst Badenoch aims one at herself

SystemSystem Posts: 13,184
edited 1:25PM in General
John Healey aims a missile at Starmer & Reeves whilst Badenoch aims one at herself – politicalbetting.com

Sir Keir Starmer is expected to tell ministers they must resign if they back Andy Burnham in a future Labour leadership contest.?: https://t.co/djdROhcX6R pic.twitter.com/nljdkJOsjt

Read the full story here

«13

Comments

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    edited 1:29PM
    No Ministers by teatime?

    First.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,720
    edited 1:31PM
    2nd like SKS in a leadership contest of 2
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    edited 1:30PM
    If Starmer isn't already done for, Healey has just done for Starmer. Starmer is out of his depth and it's time to say goodbye.

    Nick Ferrari commenting on Shelagh Fogerty about how wonderful Kemi is, and eulogising at her calling out of Starmer over Healey. I wonder who Ferrari posts as on PB?

    🎶🎵Oh, Andy Burnham 🎵🎶

    And a bronze.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    bigjohnowls said:

    2nd like SKS in a leadership contest

    2nd out of two is probably a stretch for Starmer at the moment.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 10,797
    Burnham needs to return to parliament on a re-armament ticket.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 40,227
    "'A grave moment' for UK, says senior Labour MP and defence select committee chair

    Tan Dhesi is a Labour MP and chair of the defence select committee. He has branded today a "grave" moment for the country. Dhesi said: "John Healey has been a serious, committed and respected defence secretary, who has understood the scale of the threats facing the UK and the urgent need to strengthen our armed forces."

    https://news.sky.com/story/politics-latest-keir-starmer-peter-mandelson-files-defence-investment-kemi-badenoch-12593360
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Declaring she will not support a left wing government is honest but misquoting her, if she didn't say yes, is not

  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Declaring she will not support a left wing government is honest but misquoting her, if she didn't say yes, is not

    She has declared she will support a party for Government that many of her target audience considers to be fascists. Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Declaring she will not support a left wing government is honest but misquoting her, if she didn't say yes, is not

    She has declared she will support a party for Government that many of her target audience considers to be fascists. Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
    Strong ‘everyone i disagree with is Hitler’ vibe here
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    Taz said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Declaring she will not support a left wing government is honest but misquoting her, if she didn't say yes, is not

    She has declared she will support a party for Government that many of her target audience considers to be fascists. Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
    Strong ‘everyone i disagree with is Hitler’ vibe here
    No I am talking about Farage not Hitler, but if you feel the cap fits maybe he can wear it.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,964
    edited 1:46PM
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 32,633
    Another day another shambles.
    In fact several.
    I really don't know anymore.
  • glwglw Posts: 10,925
    edited 1:46PM
    I generally have a lot more time for Starmer than most people, bar noting that he is rubbish at politics, but on defence I do not understand what the hell is going on in Whitehall. We seem to be stood still when we have needed to get out skates on for years now. Ultimately this will mean that as usual we end up paying more for less. We have the skills and knowledge, the companies are right there willing and able to do the work, we even have the resources if only we could budget and plan well. That last bit is where it all goes wrong. People who know more than me think that the French get it right, that the DGA is the model to follow if we want more bang (literally) for our buck.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 60,472
    Stark_Dawning said:

    Burnham needs to return to parliament on a re-armament ticket.

    Maybe on a ticket of a Grandma's Army of WASPI women?

    They can get their money, but might be deployed to the Baltic....
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    dixiedean said:

    Another day another shambles.
    In fact several.
    I really don't know anymore.

    Even if Burnham loses to Rob the Plumber the game must be up for Starmer.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    dixiedean said:

    Another day another shambles.
    In fact several.
    I really don't know anymore.

    I yearn for the days when a government shambles involved pasties.

    #HalcyonDays
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    dixiedean said:

    Another day another shambles.
    In fact several.
    I really don't know anymore.

    I yearn for the days when a government shambles involved pasties.

    #HalcyonDays
    This looks like end of days.
  • TazTaz Posts: 28,397
    Mexicanpete said:

    Taz said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Declaring she will not support a left wing government is honest but misquoting her, if she didn't say yes, is not

    She has declared she will support a party for Government that many of her target audience considers to be fascists. Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
    Strong ‘everyone i disagree with is Hitler’ vibe here
    No I am talking about Farage not Hitler, but if you feel the cap fits maybe he can wear it.
    lol

    No and your comment was about Reform not Farage specifically

    But I don’t obsess about him daily. 😀
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,470
    What did I say about PM Davey by the end of the year?

    And everyone laughed!
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    edited 1:51PM
    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    I would be fascinated to know who "liked" that post. So you are backing Badenoch backing Farage, n'est pas?
  • Brixian59Brixian59 Posts: 2,292
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    I suspect at the next GE people will say John who

    Meanwhile Kemi in Nigels suit pocket will adorn EVERY STREET CORNER in the UK

    The only way it won't is if the Tories do the sensible thing and ditch her quickly.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    Taz said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Taz said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Declaring she will not support a left wing government is honest but misquoting her, if she didn't say yes, is not

    She has declared she will support a party for Government that many of her target audience considers to be fascists. Talk about snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
    Strong ‘everyone i disagree with is Hitler’ vibe here
    No I am talking about Farage not Hitler, but if you feel the cap fits maybe he can wear it.
    lol

    No and your comment was about Reform not Farage specifically

    But I don’t obsess about him daily. 😀
    Same thing.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    I would be fascinated to know who "liked" that post. So you are backing Badenoch backing Farage, n'est pas?
    Kemi did not say she was backing Farage but that she would not support a left wing government

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,431
    edited 1:54PM
    Who will be new DefSec for three weeks between this afternoon and Andy Burnham's arrival in Downing Street?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    Who will be new DefSec for three weeks between this afternoon and Andy Burnham's arrival in Downing Street?

    Tonty Blair?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    I would be fascinated to know who "liked" that post. So you are backing Badenoch backing Farage, n'est pas?
    Kemi did not say she was backing Farage but that she would not support a left wing government

    The extrapolation is Cain's, but I can't read it any other way.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    I would be fascinated to know who "liked" that post. So you are backing Badenoch backing Farage, n'est pas?
    Kemi did not say she was backing Farage but that she would not support a left wing government

    The extrapolation is Cain's, but I can't read it any other way.
    Remove yes
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,815
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    He shouldn't be wasting missiles if we're really so stretched on military spending.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,964
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    She will not be leader if she has 51 seats
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 39,936
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Mexicanpete said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    I would be fascinated to know who "liked" that post. So you are backing Badenoch backing Farage, n'est pas?
    Kemi did not say she was backing Farage but that she would not support a left wing government

    The extrapolation is Cain's, but I can't read it any other way.
    Remove yes
    Don't think so.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,964
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    She will not be leader if she has 51 seats
    Ok how about 100 tory seats and 240 Reform seats..

    That's definitely in the vote Tory get Reform horror story area
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,880
    Oh dear, eagles has fallen for some bollocks on X:

    https://x.com/LoftusSteve/status/2065056435201872349

    Worth watching the video. Kemi says Reform are left wing (which is true!).
  • Jim_the_LurkerJim_the_Lurker Posts: 316
    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    I daresay this was already going to be one (if not the most significant) anti-Tory slogan. The Tories should know that and should know the risks of putting any meat on its bones - however tenuous. I would have expected the leader of the opposition to have a fairly well prepared answer to avoid that trap. I am not sure what she came up with today was a success.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, eagles has fallen for some bollocks on X:

    https://x.com/LoftusSteve/status/2065056435201872349

    Worth watching the video. Kemi says Reform are left wing (which is true!).

    Err Tim Shipman retweeted Lee Cain's tweet, so I am guessing he is happy with the interpretation.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 27,880
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, eagles has fallen for some bollocks on X:

    https://x.com/LoftusSteve/status/2065056435201872349

    Worth watching the video. Kemi says Reform are left wing (which is true!).

    Err Tim Shipman retweeted Lee Cain's tweet, so I am guessing he is happy with the interpretation.
    So fucking what?

    If Kemi had retweeted it, then you might have a point. But you don't.
  • PhilPhil Posts: 3,321
    The problem with Healey quitting over defence spending is that there’s no evidence that Burnham will be more willing to spend on the defence of the realm than Starmer was. Apparently Burnham is quite happy to promise to spend £billions on WASPI payments though.

    Starmer is probably the best PM out of the available candidates with, unfortunately, the worst political instincts out of all of them.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, eagles has fallen for some bollocks on X:

    https://x.com/LoftusSteve/status/2065056435201872349

    Worth watching the video. Kemi says Reform are left wing (which is true!).

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and she did not say yes or even suggested any pacts

    I think a correction is needed in fairness

  • PhilPhil Posts: 3,321
    Phil said:

    The problem with Healey quitting over defence spending is that there’s no evidence that Burnham will be more willing to spend on the defence of the realm than Starmer was. Apparently Burnham is quite happy to promise to spend £billions on WASPI payments though.

    Starmer is probably the best PM out of the available candidates with, unfortunately, the worst political instincts out of all of them.

    Oh wait, Burnham has done a reverse ferret on WASPI inside of 24 hours: https://x.com/LOS_Fisher/status/2065038235965825321

    Someone has had a little word by the looks of things.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    tlg86 said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    tlg86 said:

    Oh dear, eagles has fallen for some bollocks on X:

    https://x.com/LoftusSteve/status/2065056435201872349

    Worth watching the video. Kemi says Reform are left wing (which is true!).

    Err Tim Shipman retweeted Lee Cain's tweet, so I am guessing he is happy with the interpretation.
    So fucking what?

    If Kemi had retweeted it, then you might have a point. But you don't.
    He's the interviewer.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,958
    https://x.com/hoffman_noa/status/2065070141004452214

    EXCL: The Green party is considering a new policy to ban circumcision, The Spectator can reveal.
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 10,797
    prh47bridge said:

    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    The transcript:

    Tim Shipman: Now look, you know you don’t want to do a deal, but if the choice is between propping up a reform government and facing either a retread of this Labour government or one accompanied by some Greens and some SNP, do you rule out ever entering into an arrangement after the election.

    Kemi Badenoch MP: This country cannot have another left-wing government. This is the most left- wing parliament we have ever had. But I’m afraid that reform has quite a lot of left-wing ideas as well. They want more benefits. They want nationalisation. They want the big state. They just want to be in charge of it.

    Tim Shipman: So that sounds to me like you would do some kind of confidence in supply or an issue-by-issue support for things that you believe to be conservative, if that were the situation.

    Kemi Badenoch MP: I don’t know what the makeup of the next parliament will be. I am working for a conservative majority because that’s the only way that I think that we can get things done.

    Taking "This country cannot have another left-wing government" in isolation and using that to say Badenoch would put Farage in No.10 seems like an extreme interpretation to me, especially since she follows it up by describing Reform as left wing. The Spectator's take on it is that "Badenoch eventually said ‘no, no, no, no, no’ to every possible arrangement".
    Yes, that's as unequivocal as a politician could possibly get: Kemi will not support the Marxists of Reform and Labour, who want to return us to the bad old days of Wilson and Sunny Jim. Kemi is starting to look like Thatcher's heir, which, in an era when the Right is crowded out by those repudiating the Thatcher and Reagan legacies, might not be a bad revivalist position to take.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 22,934
    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    But Badenoch and all robust-but-not-fash Conservatives have a choice.

    Stop the left by backing Farage, or stop Farage by backing the left.

    Unless the polls move a lot, that's the choice. It may not be a pleasant choice, but that's the price of not being consistently in the top two.

    Choose wisely.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    edited 2:15PM
    Phil said:

    The problem with Healey quitting over defence spending is that there’s no evidence that Burnham will be more willing to spend on the defence of the realm than Starmer was. Apparently Burnham is quite happy to promise to spend £billions on WASPI payments though.

    Starmer is probably the best PM out of the available candidates with, unfortunately, the worst political instincts out of all of them.

    Burnham has already "clarified" his comment to make it clear there are no £billions on offer.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 59,958
    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 72,232
    edited 2:19PM
    Jim_the_Lurker said:

    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    I daresay this was already going to be one (if not the most significant) anti-Tory slogan. The Tories should know that and should know the risks of putting any meat on its bones - however tenuous. I would have expected the leader of the opposition to have a fairly well prepared answer to avoid that trap. I am not sure what she came up with today was a success.
    The interview is well worth listening to and not the out of context interpretation by Lee Cain

    https://x.com/LoftusSteve/status/2065056435201872349
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,815
    edited 2:20PM
    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    edited 2:19PM
    Police fire(d) plastic bullets in effort to contain race riots in Northern Ireland
    PSNI receive reinforcements from Great Britain amid further condemnation of violence
    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/jun/11/police-psni-plastic-bullets-race-riots-northern-ireland
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    It's over. Starmer and Reeves are finished. Mrs Starmer may as well start packing up the No 10 flat.

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Al Carns for Defence?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,470
    Stark_Dawning said:

    prh47bridge said:

    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    The transcript:

    Tim Shipman: Now look, you know you don’t want to do a deal, but if the choice is between propping up a reform government and facing either a retread of this Labour government or one accompanied by some Greens and some SNP, do you rule out ever entering into an arrangement after the election.

    Kemi Badenoch MP: This country cannot have another left-wing government. This is the most left- wing parliament we have ever had. But I’m afraid that reform has quite a lot of left-wing ideas as well. They want more benefits. They want nationalisation. They want the big state. They just want to be in charge of it.

    Tim Shipman: So that sounds to me like you would do some kind of confidence in supply or an issue-by-issue support for things that you believe to be conservative, if that were the situation.

    Kemi Badenoch MP: I don’t know what the makeup of the next parliament will be. I am working for a conservative majority because that’s the only way that I think that we can get things done.

    Taking "This country cannot have another left-wing government" in isolation and using that to say Badenoch would put Farage in No.10 seems like an extreme interpretation to me, especially since she follows it up by describing Reform as left wing. The Spectator's take on it is that "Badenoch eventually said ‘no, no, no, no, no’ to every possible arrangement".
    Yes, that's as unequivocal as a politician could possibly get: Kemi will not support the Marxists of Reform and Labour, who want to return us to the bad old days of Wilson and Sunny Jim. Kemi is starting to look like Thatcher's heir, which, in an era when the Right is crowded out by those repudiating the Thatcher and Reagan legacies, might not be a bad revivalist position to take.
    " the bad old days of Wilson and Sunny Jim"

    I must say I look back on the period 64-70 as rather a good time. Might be personal of course. And 74-77 wasn't bad until there were rows with the inions. And even then things were getting better in 79.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Benefits over bombs.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    kinabalu said:

    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.

    It will toast Reeves, too.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 4,861
    edited 2:24PM
    kinabalu said:

    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.

    I suppose there is also a vague, unlikely possibility that the defence investment plan is a load of old shite.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,470
    rottenborough said:

    It's over. Starmer and Reeves are finished. Mrs Starmer may as well start packing up the No 10 flat.

    That's Lady Starmer to you!
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 7,202
    To be honest the idea Badenoch wouldn’t support reform is for the birds. She obviously would.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 8,950
    rottenborough said:

    Al Carns for Defence?

    Hasn’t he already criticised it as well? Or did I imagine reading that?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    .
    solarflare said:

    kinabalu said:

    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.

    I suppose there is also a vague, unlikely possibility that the defence investment plan is a load of old shite.
    It was the defence review* that was a load of shite (arguably).

    There is no defence investment plan, which is why Healey resigned.

    *one year old already, and overdue at the time.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,331
    Nigelb said:

    kinabalu said:

    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.

    It will toast Reeves, too.
    Yes, there was some suggestion that Burnham was going to hang onto Reeves to curry favour with the bond market, but that surely becomes less likely now.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,149
    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    So the problem is the same as for everything else. More money is needed, but there isn't any, and the government have boxed themselves in by saying they won't raise taxes.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    OldKingCole said:

    rottenborough said:

    It's over. Starmer and Reeves are finished. Mrs Starmer may as well start packing up the No 10 flat.

    That's Lady Starmer to you!
    An understandable concern with titles, Your Majesty.
  • eekeek Posts: 33,964
    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    It's almost like promising not to increases taxes in the manifesto wasn't a good idea when a lot of government spending has been cut below long term minimal levels.
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 7,202
    And fundamentally that is the issue.

    I’d be up for voting for Badenoch but not if it means Reform get to come into government. Then I will probably not vote assuming Labour have ruined everything.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,149
    Stark_Dawning said:

    prh47bridge said:

    eek said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    eek said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    Of course on a day when John Healey fires a missile at Starmer and Reeves, Kemi is supposed to have done the same to herself

    To be honest I did not see her interview, and if she said the country cannot afford another left wing government she is spot on

    Lee Cain is anti Kemi and I would be interested if she did say 'yes' or not

    Anyway today is about the defence of the UK and survival of Starmer - Reeves

    Her intervention has betting implications, if you cannot see that I cannot help you.

    Vote Tory get Farage won't help the Tories recover.
    Vote Tory get Farage is going to be on every Lib Dem / Labour / Green leaflet in every constituency that currently has a Tory MP, and it's going to cost them a lot of votes

    Now if Reform end up back on 10% that isn't going to be the case but if Reform are sat at 20%+ of the vote that message is going to cost the Tories the vote of anyone who is anti-Reform.
    Your last paragraph is key because Kemi expects to be ahead of Reform by the next GE

    As far as I understand she was asked the question and said she would not support a left wing government but did not say yes

    The problem is Kemi is certainly not thick and is gaining support through honest and direct interventions and there is no other viable conservative leader or indeed a vacancy
    Did you read what Kemi actually said

    If Reform has 275 seats and the Tories have 51 seats she would put Farage in power.

    No matter how you wish to interpret it - if Reform are sitting on anything beyond about 15% of the vote vote Tory get Reform is going to work as a anti Tory slogan..
    The transcript:

    Tim Shipman: Now look, you know you don’t want to do a deal, but if the choice is between propping up a reform government and facing either a retread of this Labour government or one accompanied by some Greens and some SNP, do you rule out ever entering into an arrangement after the election.

    Kemi Badenoch MP: This country cannot have another left-wing government. This is the most left- wing parliament we have ever had. But I’m afraid that reform has quite a lot of left-wing ideas as well. They want more benefits. They want nationalisation. They want the big state. They just want to be in charge of it.

    Tim Shipman: So that sounds to me like you would do some kind of confidence in supply or an issue-by-issue support for things that you believe to be conservative, if that were the situation.

    Kemi Badenoch MP: I don’t know what the makeup of the next parliament will be. I am working for a conservative majority because that’s the only way that I think that we can get things done.

    Taking "This country cannot have another left-wing government" in isolation and using that to say Badenoch would put Farage in No.10 seems like an extreme interpretation to me, especially since she follows it up by describing Reform as left wing. The Spectator's take on it is that "Badenoch eventually said ‘no, no, no, no, no’ to every possible arrangement".
    Yes, that's as unequivocal as a politician could possibly get: Kemi will not support the Marxists of Reform and Labour, who want to return us to the bad old days of Wilson and Sunny Jim. Kemi is starting to look like Thatcher's heir, which, in an era when the Right is crowded out by those repudiating the Thatcher and Reagan legacies, might not be a bad revivalist position to take.
    So basically Badenoch is saying, vote for us and given a choice between Reform and Labour, we'll have another election. I wonder how that would work out second time around?
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 24,331
    PJH said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    So the problem is the same as for everything else. More money is needed, but there isn't any, and the government have boxed themselves in by saying they won't raise taxes.
    Well, the government did find more money to fund a u-turn on the winter fuel payment and on disability benefits.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,720
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    And fundamentally that is the issue.

    I’d be up for voting for Badenoch but not if it means Reform get to come into government. Then I will probably not vote assuming Labour have ruined everything.

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    And fundamentally that is the issue.

    I’d be up for voting for Badenoch but not if it means Reform get to come into government. Then I will probably not vote assuming Labour have ruined everything.

    Thought you were a Labour Member?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,431
    Nigelb said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    "In effect" the Treasury is prioritising the triple lock over the nation's defence.

    See how that works ?
    We may be missing the political significance here. The minister who refused to accept any cuts to pay for defence is Ed Miliband, widely touted as next Chancellor, and the Treasury source does not mention energy subsidies, CCS or Net Zero.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 37,470
    Nigelb said:

    OldKingCole said:

    rottenborough said:

    It's over. Starmer and Reeves are finished. Mrs Starmer may as well start packing up the No 10 flat.

    That's Lady Starmer to you!
    An understandable concern with titles, Your Majesty.
    And me a republican. Tsk tsk.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 8,950
    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    I’m shocked, shocked, that the Treasury would use the trigger sectors of Schools and Hospitals to fight back with rather than say, welfare.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,815
    solarflare said:

    kinabalu said:

    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.

    I suppose there is also a vague, unlikely possibility that the defence investment plan is a load of old shite.
    It would be brave indeed to rule that out.
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 7,202
    bigjohnowls said:

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    And fundamentally that is the issue.

    I’d be up for voting for Badenoch but not if it means Reform get to come into government. Then I will probably not vote assuming Labour have ruined everything.

    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    And fundamentally that is the issue.

    I’d be up for voting for Badenoch but not if it means Reform get to come into government. Then I will probably not vote assuming Labour have ruined everything.

    Thought you were a Labour Member?
    And? I’ve voted Lib Dem whilst being a member. What I do in the polling booth is my business.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,149
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    And fundamentally that is the issue.

    I’d be up for voting for Badenoch but not if it means Reform get to come into government. Then I will probably not vote assuming Labour have ruined everything.

    Yor first sentence my position too, and a very real one given that my MP is Andrew Rosindell. I will vote regardless, though a vote for Labour here will be as futile as for anyone else.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    OldKingCole said:

    Nigelb said:

    OldKingCole said:

    rottenborough said:

    It's over. Starmer and Reeves are finished. Mrs Starmer may as well start packing up the No 10 flat.

    That's Lady Starmer to you!
    An understandable concern with titles, Your Majesty.
    And me a republican. Tsk tsk.
    All the best people are.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,720
    Stark_Dawning said:

    Burnham needs to return to parliament on a re-armament ticket.

    He doesnt

    He won't
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 32,364
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    OldKingCole said:

    Nigelb said:

    OldKingCole said:

    rottenborough said:

    It's over. Starmer and Reeves are finished. Mrs Starmer may as well start packing up the No 10 flat.

    That's Lady Starmer to you!
    An understandable concern with titles, Your Majesty.
    And me a republican. Tsk tsk.
    All the best people are.
    Absolutely. It's 2026 - we should have no place for people being given significant jobs because their ancestors shagged the right Germans
  • BatteryCorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorse Posts: 7,202
    https://x.com/los_fisher/status/2065038235965825321

    Lol
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Paul Mason
    @paulmasonnews

    5/ Beyond the politics this is the UK governance system failing. I'm told Starmer wanted more - so why couldn't he get it?

    https://x.com/paulmasonnews/status/2065047262472896976



    Take a wild guess Paul.
  • PJHPJH Posts: 1,149
    LostPassword said:

    PJH said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    So the problem is the same as for everything else. More money is needed, but there isn't any, and the government have boxed themselves in by saying they won't raise taxes.
    Well, the government did find more money to fund a u-turn on the winter fuel payment and on disability benefits.
    They did, but there wasn't any money really, so now other things (more worthwhile things, I would argue) are even harder to fund than they would have been.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 50,815
    Nigelb said:

    kinabalu said:

    All very grave and big beasty from Healey but I don't attach much political significance to this resignation. Starmer was toast anyway. Can toast be toasted? Not really. There'll be a new Burnham led government by summer's end. Since this is known SKS has no political authority within the cabinet or with MPs or the party. Therefore a well-regarded, prime-of-career minister in a high profile spending dept who has lost a battle with the Treasury for more £££ might as well resign, have a moment, detach from the old regime and stake a claim to be a big part of the new one. That's my take on what's happened here. It's not that this finishes Starmer. It's more that Starmer being finished has triggered this.

    It will toast Reeves, too.
    You'd have thought so. Although the Rexit market on betfair implies she's only half done atm and could still pop out.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    Nigelb said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    "In effect" the Treasury is prioritising the triple lock over the nation's defence.

    See how that works ?
    We may be missing the political significance here. The minister who refused to accept any cuts to pay for defence is Ed Miliband, widely touted as next Chancellor, and the Treasury source does not mention energy subsidies, CCS or Net Zero.
    Interesting.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    One thing is certain; if there's no more money, we will need ... another defence review.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    Nigelb said:

    One thing is certain; if there's no more money, we will need ... another defence review.

    If the UK were a company I'd be speaking to my creditors at looking at restructuring our debts/asking for a payment holiday/freezing our interest.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452

    Matthew
    @MatthewTorbitt
    ·
    2h
    As someone has pointed out to me, you’re unlikely to get a more favourable background to cut welfare and the triple lock than funding defence to keep the country safe.

    https://x.com/MatthewTorbitt/status/2065038596483031152
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 89,842
    And of course, if we were still EU members, we could take out an EU defence loan on a 2% coupon.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Nigelb said:

    One thing is certain; if there's no more money, we will need ... another defence review.

    If the UK were a company I'd be speaking to my creditors at looking at restructuring our debts/asking for a payment holiday/freezing our interest.
    We have a hell of a lot of quite short term gilt debt compared to other countries iirc - so aren't we in effect doing that already?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 36,431
    Phil said:

    Phil said:

    The problem with Healey quitting over defence spending is that there’s no evidence that Burnham will be more willing to spend on the defence of the realm than Starmer was. Apparently Burnham is quite happy to promise to spend £billions on WASPI payments though.

    Starmer is probably the best PM out of the available candidates with, unfortunately, the worst political instincts out of all of them.

    Oh wait, Burnham has done a reverse ferret on WASPI inside of 24 hours: https://x.com/LOS_Fisher/status/2065038235965825321

    Someone has had a little word by the looks of things.
    The tweet you linked says:-

    NEW: Burnham *rules out* awarding financial compensation to Waspi women demanding billions of pounds, following an angry backlash within Labour

    Greater Manchester mayor has instead floated the idea of offering early access to cheaper travel schemes as recompense
    https://x.com/LOS_Fisher/status/2065038235965825321

    How old does Burnham think the Waspi women are, or how young that early access to cheap travel is still a consideration? Clue: women born in the 1950s are now old enough for the state pension.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Nigelb said:

    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    Nigelb said:

    williamglenn said:

    https://x.com/pippacrerar/status/2065064675256025363

    Treasury source suggests that John Healey was, in effect, asking for cuts to schools and hospitals to pay for extra uplift in defence spending.

    "The chancellor will always do what is right and needed to keep this country safe, you can see that from her actions - a record uplift in defence spending at the spending review, and then working alongside the PM deliver billions more to fund the DIP".

    "In effect" the Treasury is prioritising the triple lock over the nation's defence.

    See how that works ?
    We may be missing the political significance here. The minister who refused to accept any cuts to pay for defence is Ed Miliband, widely touted as next Chancellor, and the Treasury source does not mention energy subsidies, CCS or Net Zero.
    Interesting.
    Why did Starmer accept that from Miliband? He's lost Defence minister which seems to me far worse than losing your energy minister.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 23,720
    edited 2:47PM
    BatteryCorrectHorse said:

    https://x.com/los_fisher/status/2065038235965825321

    Lol

    Should WASPI not be renamed WFSPI as it is for State Pension Inequality in favour of women

    Personally as Women have a life expectancy of 3.9 years more than men I would argue men should be awarded State Pension at 65 and women at 68.9

    I am thinking of starting a lobby group MASPI is likely to be its name
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 128,683
    rottenborough said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Nigelb said:

    One thing is certain; if there's no more money, we will need ... another defence review.

    If the UK were a company I'd be speaking to my creditors at looking at restructuring our debts/asking for a payment holiday/freezing our interest.
    We have a hell of a lot of quite short term gilt debt compared to other countries iirc - so aren't we in effect doing that already?
    Yes, but I am saying look we need a year or two of no interest or capital payments.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 72,452
    Sunday papers are going to be fun as Labour tear lumps off each other in briefing war.
  • carnforthcarnforth Posts: 9,285
    rottenborough said:


    Matthew
    @MatthewTorbitt
    ·
    2h
    As someone has pointed out to me, you’re unlikely to get a more favourable background to cut welfare and the triple lock than funding defence to keep the country safe.

    https://x.com/MatthewTorbitt/status/2065038596483031152

    They chopped foreign aid in half for defence and no one gave a shit. Welfare would be harder (the PLP) and triple lock harder (the public) but it could be done.
Sign In or Register to comment.

© Vanilla Keystone Theme 2026