On a more positive note, Ukranians have noticed that the Queen and First Lady were wearing blue and yellow dresses respectively to last night’s State dinner.
Covie @covie_93 If you see anyone not mourning the death of Robert Redford the way you would like them to please call their employer and get them fired!
The comedy writers for these late night shows have lost their way. Its not able coming up with good gags, its all about political point scoring.
Yes the president is a douche bag, but its not your job to every night hold him to account (that is what the news media is there for), it was supposed to be to write some funny gags that America could do a bit of escapism after a hard days work.
The straw that broke the camel’s back with Kimmel, making up his own untruths about a political assassination.
These shows all stopped being funny and a way to unwind a long time ago, and this was the excuse that the network affiliates needed to pull the plug.
As with Colbert before him, the show has been losing money for a long time, as going out to alienate half your audience does that.
The new South Park episode didn’t come out last night either, one suspects a hasty rewrite of much of the material didn’t happen in time.
LOL. You do realise how many 'untruths' your side were saying in the aftermath? And how differently Republicans who celebrated the deaths of Melissa Hortman and her husband? Utah senator Mike Lee is still in place, as an example.
This is nothing about jokes, or offence. It is about control of speech.
At the risk of feeding the troll, what exactly did Sen. Mike Lee say in the aftermath of the murder of Melissa Hortman?
The articles below reference a couple of posts: (I) saying that “this is what happens when Marxists don’t get their way” and another with a picture of the killer captioned “nightmare on waltz street”.
Ah okay thanks. So he was making comments about the murderer rather than the victim, which were called insensitive by friends of the victim, and which Sen. Lee took down after the friends spoke to him in person.
As opposed to this week, where people have been openly mocking the victim himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.
Show me any elected official, let alone a senator, who “openly mocking the victim [Kirk] himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.” I would be very surprised.
In the clip someone posted Kimmel barely said anything about Kirk but focused on Trump’s lack of empathy. It’s not very funny, but neither is it offensive.
The NY Post collated a list of inappropriate comments from elected officials on the day of the shooting, starting with Rep. Ilhan Omar and Gov. JB Pritzker.
It's not unreasonable to take issue with many of Charlie Kirk's positons, while deeply regretting his murder and hoping that the perpetrator is appropriately punished.
Just as you correctly noted that George Floyd was far from being as pure as driven snow.
I personally don’t understand anyone celebrating a murder, or inded saying anything more than it’s a horrible event and offering prayers and support to the family of the deceased.
There’s two American killings that have really made me wake up this year. The murder of Charlie Kirk is one, and the murder of Brian Thompson the other. No-one ever deserves to be assasinated in this way, and the reaction to these two killings in particular has been astonishing to witness.
Yes, but who has "celebrated a murder" over Charlie Kirk?
And highlighting Kirk's statements on the acceptability of gun violence, that empathy is a bad thing, that black people Muslims and women are inferior etc is just highlighting his teachings and illustrating who he was.
It’s the same group of people celebrating both murders, the online left, and the Charlie quotes you mention are all a long way out of context, deliberately so to try and paint him in a negative light - before his body is even cold.
He was a middle-of-the-road conservative Christian youth movement leader, who believed in marriage and didn’t believe in abortion.
I haven't seen people "celebrating both murders", certainly not on here, so why are you so agitated about him?
Social Media is full of trolls, so possibly there are some in the sewer of X, but why not take it up with them there?
Zuckerberg had a tough day at the office...two of the major demos he tired to show failed.
On the other hand, the new glasses look very cool.
You have to give him some respect for actually do the demos live. Far too often now its all canned demos to ensure no slip ups, but everybody knows they are faked. And Apple, the whole thing is pre-recorded at the Donut, no more in front of a real life audience which was a mark of a Steve Jobs announcement.
Are we now over the whole Google glass worries about privacy now in terms of people using the glasses to film etc?
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
The people who were crying out about the so-called cancel wars, including on here.
I think what is happening was extremely predictable and what some of us warned. The "other side" eventually gets the stick and is repeating the same approach, then the pendulum with swing back the other way and rinse and repeat.
It is why for instance I have had a very consistent line on people previous dodgy tweets. We should allow people to apologize for them and move on, unless it is a consistent pattern of behaviour. I don't care you twattered a dodgy thing 10 years ago when you were 20, particularly if we are now reinterpreting them through modern lens.
Do you think the cancellation of Kimmel is correct?
No. Not on the basis of a joke in poor taste. You can say they got it badly wrong here, but that doesn't mean you cancel them. An genuine apology would have been enough.
My point was that these shows have stopped being funny. Its not jokes, its political point scoring. And the audience are demonstrating that they think it too, with their feet. Nobody watches them anymore. So ultimately they will get cancelled because they cost a tonne of money to put on, the hosts are paid incredibly well and the revenue isn't coming in.
South Park are absolutely blasting Trump, but my god is this season funny. They also clearly had an episode in the can that probably is in very poor taste given what has gone on and so have pulled it.
South Park is often 'very poor taste'. What they may be afraid of is people using that to cancel them. Which might well make them *less* funny.
There is poor taste and there is poor taste. They love to go with the shock value, so in poor taste is e.g. showing an AI tiny penis of Trump. That's different from if they had made an episode for this week which by chance that showed a Charlie Kirk-esque figure getting murdered.
(Snip)
So you are making an assumption about what's going on.
We in the UK need to be *very* careful not to import this concept of control of speech from the USA. Sadly, from his comments in the USA recently, Farage quite likes it.
Given South Park has been going for 27 seasons, there is quite a fair bit of evidence on how they act. They did episodes showing the Prophet Muhammad and also taken big swipes at all the religious figures. I don't think they self censor because they worry too much about if they might get cancelled or who they might upset.
A bit like Carr or Ricky Gervias, they aren't getting kicked off telly and they have more money than god. They got $1.5 billion to make 50 episodes. They don't do it for the money any more.
Thus, for them to pull an episode, I have to conclude they wrote one that will be really really insensitive given the recent events.
I think that's a wild assumption, given what's happening over in America.
I really don't. I see no evidence to believe South Park creators would suddenly get into self censorship over worries about people wanting to "cancel" them. They never have before.
There's never been this environment before.
If you are willing to go and make tv episodes that will offend huge numbers of Muslims and not exactly unknown for that to turn to something much worse than some angry letter writing, then I don't think you give a crap about what Trump or the current environment might be from a purely "will this get me in trouble".
No Muslims had the capability to force them off the air. Trump and the Republicans do, and have been wielding that power.
I think you are really overplaying this. Some people who didn't worry about the possibility of radical Islamist nutters coming at them, are worried about Trump might try and get their little show off kicked off cable tv. Come on.
But lets imagine Trump got one of the most popular tv shows shit canned.
They have their own website to show these shows, they could put them on YouTube. They have made stupid money, their show is cheap to make, they do all the voices, they regularly make episodes in a single work week, they don't need celebs on the show like the Late nights, they can't be "cancelled". And they have just spent the past month going harder than ever on Trump. Last time, its was they used an existing character to poke fun at him, this time its direct Trump is in the show.
That rather assumes that Youtube cannot be coerced, and won't give in.
A Home Office-backed charity is providing migrants with a step-by-step guide that could help them thwart Sir Keir Starmer’s “one in, one out” migrant deal with France.
Current government website guidelines state that “welfare services” must provide migrants held in removal centres with a “notebook” produced by Bail for Immigration Detainees (BiD), a charity that provides legal advice to people in detention.
The Telegraph can reveal that BiD, which has received more than £400,000 in Comic Relief donations and which benefits from charitable tax relief, has produced a detailed method that could help migrants to beat the Prime Minister’s flagship policy. The guide includes “template” letters migrants can use and suggestions for how to use legal and human rights arguments to fight deportation.
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
The people who were crying out about the so-called cancel wars, including on here.
I think what is happening was extremely predictable and what some of us warned. The "other side" eventually gets the stick and is repeating the same approach, then the pendulum with swing back the other way and rinse and repeat.
It is why for instance I have had a very consistent line on people previous dodgy tweets. We should allow people to apologize for them and move on, unless it is a consistent pattern of behaviour. I don't care you twattered a dodgy thing 10 years ago when you were 20, particularly if we are now reinterpreting them through modern lens.
Do you think the cancellation of Kimmel is correct?
No. Not on the basis of a joke in poor taste. You can say they got it badly wrong here, but that doesn't mean you cancel them. An genuine apology would have been enough.
My point was that these shows have stopped being funny. Its not jokes, its political point scoring. And the audience are demonstrating that they think it too, with their feet. Nobody watches them anymore. So ultimately they will get cancelled because they cost a tonne of money to put on, the hosts are paid incredibly well and the revenue isn't coming in.
South Park are absolutely blasting Trump, but my god is this season funny. They also clearly had an episode in the can that probably is in very poor taste given what has gone on and so have pulled it.
South Park is often 'very poor taste'. What they may be afraid of is people using that to cancel them. Which might well make them *less* funny.
There is poor taste and there is poor taste. They love to go with the shock value, so in poor taste is e.g. showing an AI tiny penis of Trump. That's different from if they had made an episode for this week which by chance that showed a Charlie Kirk-esque figure getting murdered.
(Snip)
So you are making an assumption about what's going on.
We in the UK need to be *very* careful not to import this concept of control of speech from the USA. Sadly, from his comments in the USA recently, Farage quite likes it.
Given South Park has been going for 27 seasons, there is quite a fair bit of evidence on how they act. They did episodes showing the Prophet Muhammad and also taken big swipes at all the religious figures. I don't think they self censor because they worry too much about if they might get cancelled or who they might upset.
A bit like Carr or Ricky Gervias, they aren't getting kicked off telly and they have more money than god. They got $1.5 billion to make 50 episodes. They don't do it for the money any more.
Thus, for them to pull an episode, I have to conclude they wrote one that will be really really insensitive given the recent events.
I think that's a wild assumption, given what's happening over in America.
I really don't. I see no evidence to believe South Park creators would suddenly get into self censorship over worries about people wanting to "cancel" them. They never have before.
There's never been this environment before.
If you are willing to go and make tv episodes that will offend huge numbers of Muslims and not exactly unknown for that to turn to something much worse than some angry letter writing, then I don't think you give a crap about what Trump or the current environment might be from a purely "will this get me in trouble".
No Muslims had the capability to force them off the air. Trump and the Republicans do, and have been wielding that power.
I think you are really overplaying this. Some people who didn't worry about the possibility of radical Islamist nutters coming at them, are worried about Trump might try and get their little show off kicked off cable tv. Come on.
But lets imagine Trump got one of the most popular tv shows shit canned.
They have their own website to show these shows, they could put them on YouTube. They have made stupid money, their show is cheap to make, they do all the voices, they regularly make episodes in a single work week, they don't need celebs on the show like the Late nights, they can't be "cancelled". And they have just spent the past month going harder than ever on Trump. Last time, its was they used an existing character to poke fun at him, this time its direct Trump is in the show.
The world has always been divided between those who are more scared of their government having too much power, and those who are scared about it having too little.
I am very much in the former group. The govenment* terrifies me far more than any Islamist nutter.
* Any government really
The absence of government is more terrifying still. Consider Syria's recent history.
The comedy writers for these late night shows have lost their way. Its not able coming up with good gags, its all about political point scoring.
Yes the president is a douche bag, but its not your job to every night hold him to account (that is what the news media is there for), it was supposed to be to write some funny gags that America could do a bit of escapism after a hard days work.
The straw that broke the camel’s back with Kimmel, making up his own untruths about a political assassination.
These shows all stopped being funny and a way to unwind a long time ago, and this was the excuse that the network affiliates needed to pull the plug.
As with Colbert before him, the show has been losing money for a long time, as going out to alienate half your audience does that.
The new South Park episode didn’t come out last night either, one suspects a hasty rewrite of much of the material didn’t happen in time.
LOL. You do realise how many 'untruths' your side were saying in the aftermath? And how differently Republicans who celebrated the deaths of Melissa Hortman and her husband? Utah senator Mike Lee is still in place, as an example.
This is nothing about jokes, or offence. It is about control of speech.
At the risk of feeding the troll, what exactly did Sen. Mike Lee say in the aftermath of the murder of Melissa Hortman?
The articles below reference a couple of posts: (I) saying that “this is what happens when Marxists don’t get their way” and another with a picture of the killer captioned “nightmare on waltz street”.
Ah okay thanks. So he was making comments about the murderer rather than the victim, which were called insensitive by friends of the victim, and which Sen. Lee took down after the friends spoke to him in person.
As opposed to this week, where people have been openly mocking the victim himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.
Show me any elected official, let alone a senator, who “openly mocking the victim [Kirk] himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.” I would be very surprised.
In the clip someone posted Kimmel barely said anything about Kirk but focused on Trump’s lack of empathy. It’s not very funny, but neither is it offensive.
The NY Post collated a list of inappropriate comments from elected officials on the day of the shooting, starting with Rep. Ilhan Omar and Gov. JB Pritzker.
It's not unreasonable to take issue with many of Charlie Kirk's positons, while deeply regretting his murder and hoping that the perpetrator is appropriately punished.
Just as you correctly noted that George Floyd was far from being as pure as driven snow.
I personally don’t understand anyone celebrating a murder, or inded saying anything more than it’s a horrible event and offering prayers and support to the family of the deceased.
There’s two American killings that have really made me wake up this year. The murder of Charlie Kirk is one, and the murder of Brian Thompson the other. No-one ever deserves to be assasinated in this way, and the reaction to these two killings in particular has been astonishing to witness.
Yes, but who has "celebrated a murder" over Charlie Kirk?
And highlighting Kirk's statements on the acceptability of gun violence, that empathy is a bad thing, that black people Muslims and women are inferior etc is just highlighting his teachings and illustrating who he was.
It’s the same group of people celebrating both murders, the online left, and the Charlie quotes you mention are all a long way out of context, deliberately so to try and paint him in a negative light - before his body is even cold.
He was a middle-of-the-road conservative Christian youth movement leader, who believed in marriage and didn’t believe in abortion.
Outside of the USA - I wouldn't call anti-abortion in all cases middle of the road Christian.
Not even in the USA. 25% of US Evangelicals support abortion in all/most instances:
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
The people who were crying out about the so-called cancel wars, including on here.
I think what is happening was extremely predictable and what some of us warned. The "other side" eventually gets the stick and is repeating the same approach, then the pendulum with swing back the other way and rinse and repeat.
It is why for instance I have had a very consistent line on people previous dodgy tweets. We should allow people to apologize for them and move on, unless it is a consistent pattern of behaviour. I don't care you twattered a dodgy thing 10 years ago when you were 20, particularly if we are now reinterpreting them through modern lens.
Do you think the cancellation of Kimmel is correct?
No. Not on the basis of a joke in poor taste. You can say they got it badly wrong here, but that doesn't mean you cancel them. An genuine apology would have been enough.
My point was that these shows have stopped being funny. Its not jokes, its political point scoring. And the audience are demonstrating that they think it too, with their feet. Nobody watches them anymore. So ultimately they will get cancelled because they cost a tonne of money to put on, the hosts are paid incredibly well and the revenue isn't coming in.
South Park are absolutely blasting Trump, but my god is this season funny. They also clearly had an episode in the can that probably is in very poor taste given what has gone on and so have pulled it.
South Park is often 'very poor taste'. What they may be afraid of is people using that to cancel them. Which might well make them *less* funny.
There is poor taste and there is poor taste. They love to go with the shock value, so in poor taste is e.g. showing an AI tiny penis of Trump. That's different from if they had made an episode for this week which by chance that showed a Charlie Kirk-esque figure getting murdered.
(Snip)
So you are making an assumption about what's going on.
We in the UK need to be *very* careful not to import this concept of control of speech from the USA. Sadly, from his comments in the USA recently, Farage quite likes it.
Given South Park has been going for 27 seasons, there is quite a fair bit of evidence on how they act. They did episodes showing the Prophet Muhammad and also taken big swipes at all the religious figures. I don't think they self censor because they worry too much about if they might get cancelled or who they might upset.
A bit like Carr or Ricky Gervias, they aren't getting kicked off telly and they have more money than god. They got $1.5 billion to make 50 episodes. They don't do it for the money any more.
Thus, for them to pull an episode, I have to conclude they wrote one that will be really really insensitive given the recent events.
I think that's a wild assumption, given what's happening over in America.
I really don't. I see no evidence to believe South Park creators would suddenly get into self censorship over worries about people wanting to "cancel" them. They never have before.
There's never been this environment before.
If you are willing to go and make tv episodes that will offend huge numbers of Muslims and not exactly unknown for that to turn to something much worse than some angry letter writing, then I don't think you give a crap about what Trump or the current environment might be from a purely "will this get me in trouble".
No Muslims had the capability to force them off the air. Trump and the Republicans do, and have been wielding that power.
I think you are really overplaying this. Some people who didn't worry about the possibility of radical Islamist nutters coming at them, are worried about Trump might try and get their little show off kicked off cable tv. Come on.
But lets imagine Trump got one of the most popular tv shows shit canned.
They have their own website to show these shows, they could put them on YouTube. They have made stupid money, their show is cheap to make, they do all the voices, they regularly make episodes in a single work week, they don't need celebs on the show like the Late nights, they can't be "cancelled". And they have just spent the past month going harder than ever on Trump. Last time, its was they used an existing character to poke fun at him, this time its direct Trump is in the show.
That rather assumes that Youtube cannot be coerced, and won't give in.
Why not?
Well even those who got cancelled from YouTube who were big found other ways of providing their content. There are alternatives to YouTube. I think even the likes of Alex Jones is still streaming out his nonsense?
Blanket imported US talking points from the early hours to now on this edition of PB. We might as well just apply for 51st state status now.
Nothing happening there is remotely surprising. There’s a wannabe dictatorship forming in a foreign country and they’re doing what wannabe dictatorships do.
Covie @covie_93 If you see anyone not mourning the death of Robert Redford the way you would like them to please call their employer and get them fired!
He seems to look very different in his much later films, due, I think to a blepheroplasty. Which just never looks good - ever. Poor Michael Aspel was also a victim.
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
The people who were crying out about the so-called cancel wars, including on here.
I think what is happening was extremely predictable and what some of us warned. The "other side" eventually gets the stick and is repeating the same approach, then the pendulum with swing back the other way and rinse and repeat.
It is why for instance I have had a very consistent line on people previous dodgy tweets. We should allow people to apologize for them and move on, unless it is a consistent pattern of behaviour. I don't care you twattered a dodgy thing 10 years ago when you were 20, particularly if we are now reinterpreting them through modern lens.
Do you think the cancellation of Kimmel is correct?
No. Not on the basis of a joke in poor taste. You can say they got it badly wrong here, but that doesn't mean you cancel them. An genuine apology would have been enough.
My point was that these shows have stopped being funny. Its not jokes, its political point scoring. And the audience are demonstrating that they think it too, with their feet. Nobody watches them anymore. So ultimately they will get cancelled because they cost a tonne of money to put on, the hosts are paid incredibly well and the revenue isn't coming in.
South Park are absolutely blasting Trump, but my god is this season funny. They also clearly had an episode in the can that probably is in very poor taste given what has gone on and so have pulled it.
South Park is often 'very poor taste'. What they may be afraid of is people using that to cancel them. Which might well make them *less* funny.
There is poor taste and there is poor taste. They love to go with the shock value, so in poor taste is e.g. showing an AI tiny penis of Trump. That's different from if they had made an episode for this week which by chance that showed a Charlie Kirk-esque figure getting murdered.
(Snip)
So you are making an assumption about what's going on.
We in the UK need to be *very* careful not to import this concept of control of speech from the USA. Sadly, from his comments in the USA recently, Farage quite likes it.
Given South Park has been going for 27 seasons, there is quite a fair bit of evidence on how they act. They did episodes showing the Prophet Muhammad and also taken big swipes at all the religious figures. I don't think they self censor because they worry too much about if they might get cancelled or who they might upset.
A bit like Carr or Ricky Gervias, they aren't getting kicked off telly and they have more money than god. They got $1.5 billion to make 50 episodes. They don't do it for the money any more.
Thus, for them to pull an episode, I have to conclude they wrote one that will be really really insensitive given the recent events.
That's bizarre logic - "this show has no history of self-censorship, therefore this must be self-censorship".
They made an episode where Cartman tries to become a "Master Debater" in the style of Charlie Kirk. It was a coincidence and they pulled it out of respect. The BBC would do the same thing in that context.
Not necessarily respect, though that may have come into it. Taking the piss out of Kirk, shortly after he's been murdered, would rather destroy any satirical point anyway.
Zuckerberg had a tough day at the office...two of the major demos he tired to show failed.
On the other hand, the new glasses look very cool.
You have to give him some respect for actually do the demos live. Far too often now its all canned demos to ensure no slip ups, but everybody knows they are faked. And Apple, the whole thing is pre-recorded at the Donut, no more in front of a real life audience which was a mark of a Steve Jobs announcement.
Are we now over the whole Google glass worries about privacy now in terms of people using the glasses to film etc?
No but the 3rd time it's implemented people forget about the initial uproar...
Covie @covie_93 If you see anyone not mourning the death of Robert Redford the way you would like them to please call their employer and get them fired!
He seems to look very different in his much later films, due, I think to a blepheroplasty. Which just never looks good - ever. Poor Michael Aspel was also a victim.
Less is more with cosmetic surgery. A bit like wigs, you dont notice a good one.
Rather like tattoos, people do get addicted and tend to over do it.
The comedy writers for these late night shows have lost their way. Its not able coming up with good gags, its all about political point scoring.
Yes the president is a douche bag, but its not your job to every night hold him to account (that is what the news media is there for), it was supposed to be to write some funny gags that America could do a bit of escapism after a hard days work.
The straw that broke the camel’s back with Kimmel, making up his own untruths about a political assassination.
These shows all stopped being funny and a way to unwind a long time ago, and this was the excuse that the network affiliates needed to pull the plug.
As with Colbert before him, the show has been losing money for a long time, as going out to alienate half your audience does that.
The new South Park episode didn’t come out last night either, one suspects a hasty rewrite of much of the material didn’t happen in time.
LOL. You do realise how many 'untruths' your side were saying in the aftermath? And how differently Republicans who celebrated the deaths of Melissa Hortman and her husband? Utah senator Mike Lee is still in place, as an example.
This is nothing about jokes, or offence. It is about control of speech.
At the risk of feeding the troll, what exactly did Sen. Mike Lee say in the aftermath of the murder of Melissa Hortman?
The articles below reference a couple of posts: (I) saying that “this is what happens when Marxists don’t get their way” and another with a picture of the killer captioned “nightmare on waltz street”.
Ah okay thanks. So he was making comments about the murderer rather than the victim, which were called insensitive by friends of the victim, and which Sen. Lee took down after the friends spoke to him in person.
As opposed to this week, where people have been openly mocking the victim himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.
Show me any elected official, let alone a senator, who “openly mocking the victim [Kirk] himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.” I would be very surprised.
In the clip someone posted Kimmel barely said anything about Kirk but focused on Trump’s lack of empathy. It’s not very funny, but neither is it offensive.
The NY Post collated a list of inappropriate comments from elected officials on the day of the shooting, starting with Rep. Ilhan Omar and Gov. JB Pritzker.
It's not unreasonable to take issue with many of Charlie Kirk's positons, while deeply regretting his murder and hoping that the perpetrator is appropriately punished.
Just as you correctly noted that George Floyd was far from being as pure as driven snow.
I personally don’t understand anyone celebrating a murder, or inded saying anything more than it’s a horrible event and offering prayers and support to the family of the deceased.
There’s two American killings that have really made me wake up this year. The murder of Charlie Kirk is one, and the murder of Brian Thompson the other. No-one ever deserves to be assasinated in this way, and the reaction to these two killings in particular has been astonishing to witness.
Yes, but who has "celebrated a murder" over Charlie Kirk?
And highlighting Kirk's statements on the acceptability of gun violence, that empathy is a bad thing, that black people Muslims and women are inferior etc is just highlighting his teachings and illustrating who he was.
There was an interesting James o'Brien (not my normal listening) one on LBC last week where he was talking about the reactions to his reading out some things that Charlie Kirk said to help understand what CK meant, and he got blowback from all sides.
The comedy writers for these late night shows have lost their way. Its not able coming up with good gags, its all about political point scoring.
Yes the president is a douche bag, but its not your job to every night hold him to account (that is what the news media is there for), it was supposed to be to write some funny gags that America could do a bit of escapism after a hard days work.
The straw that broke the camel’s back with Kimmel, making up his own untruths about a political assassination.
These shows all stopped being funny and a way to unwind a long time ago, and this was the excuse that the network affiliates needed to pull the plug.
As with Colbert before him, the show has been losing money for a long time, as going out to alienate half your audience does that.
The new South Park episode didn’t come out last night either, one suspects a hasty rewrite of much of the material didn’t happen in time.
LOL. You do realise how many 'untruths' your side were saying in the aftermath? And how differently Republicans who celebrated the deaths of Melissa Hortman and her husband? Utah senator Mike Lee is still in place, as an example.
This is nothing about jokes, or offence. It is about control of speech.
At the risk of feeding the troll, what exactly did Sen. Mike Lee say in the aftermath of the murder of Melissa Hortman?
The articles below reference a couple of posts: (I) saying that “this is what happens when Marxists don’t get their way” and another with a picture of the killer captioned “nightmare on waltz street”.
Ah okay thanks. So he was making comments about the murderer rather than the victim, which were called insensitive by friends of the victim, and which Sen. Lee took down after the friends spoke to him in person.
As opposed to this week, where people have been openly mocking the victim himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.
Show me any elected official, let alone a senator, who “openly mocking the victim [Kirk] himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.” I would be very surprised.
In the clip someone posted Kimmel barely said anything about Kirk but focused on Trump’s lack of empathy. It’s not very funny, but neither is it offensive.
The NY Post collated a list of inappropriate comments from elected officials on the day of the shooting, starting with Rep. Ilhan Omar and Gov. JB Pritzker.
It's not unreasonable to take issue with many of Charlie Kirk's positons, while deeply regretting his murder and hoping that the perpetrator is appropriately punished.
Just as you correctly noted that George Floyd was far from being as pure as driven snow.
I personally don’t understand anyone celebrating a murder, or inded saying anything more than it’s a horrible event and offering prayers and support to the family of the deceased.
There’s two American killings that have really made me wake up this year. The murder of Charlie Kirk is one, and the murder of Brian Thompson the other. No-one ever deserves to be assasinated in this way, and the reaction to these two killings in particular has been astonishing to witness.
Yes, but who has "celebrated a murder" over Charlie Kirk?
And highlighting Kirk's statements on the acceptability of gun violence, that empathy is a bad thing, that black people Muslims and women are inferior etc is just highlighting his teachings and illustrating who he was.
It’s the same group of people celebrating both murders, the online left, and the Charlie quotes you mention are all a long way out of context, deliberately so to try and paint him in a negative light - before his body is even cold.
He was a middle-of-the-road conservative Christian youth movement leader, who believed in marriage and didn’t believe in abortion.
It's the George W Bush quote again:
"Too often, we judge other groups by their worst examples, while judging ourselves by our best intentions."
A poor president who looks massively better in retrospect. As do most of the ones who preceded Trump.
Zuckerberg had a tough day at the office...two of the major demos he tired to show failed.
On the other hand, the new glasses look very cool.
You have to give him some respect for actually do the demos live. Far too often now its all canned demos to ensure no slip ups, but everybody knows they are faked. And Apple, the whole thing is pre-recorded at the Donut, no more in front of a real life audience which was a mark of a Steve Jobs announcement.
Are we now over the whole Google glass worries about privacy now in terms of people using the glasses to film etc?
No but the 3rd time it's implemented people forget about the initial uproar...
Is that the strategy for UK government with ID cards...85th time is a charm.
A Home Office-backed charity is providing migrants with a step-by-step guide that could help them thwart Sir Keir Starmer’s “one in, one out” migrant deal with France.
Current government website guidelines state that “welfare services” must provide migrants held in removal centres with a “notebook” produced by Bail for Immigration Detainees (BiD), a charity that provides legal advice to people in detention.
The Telegraph can reveal that BiD, which has received more than £400,000 in Comic Relief donations and which benefits from charitable tax relief, has produced a detailed method that could help migrants to beat the Prime Minister’s flagship policy. The guide includes “template” letters migrants can use and suggestions for how to use legal and human rights arguments to fight deportation.
I'm shocked to learn that a charity benefits from charitable tax relief.
I can’t count the number of times I’ve been stopped by collectors for BiD in the street.
Oh wait, it’s never! Who the fuck are these ‘charities’?!
I’ve never been huckled by a chugger on behalf of the UK’s largest charity, the Nuffield Trust, nevertheless..
There are loads of charities that are much larger than Nuffield by assets. The income stats are distorted because it has an operating business with about £1bn of revenues but much lower cash flow contribution
The comedy writers for these late night shows have lost their way. Its not able coming up with good gags, its all about political point scoring.
Yes the president is a douche bag, but its not your job to every night hold him to account (that is what the news media is there for), it was supposed to be to write some funny gags that America could do a bit of escapism after a hard days work.
The straw that broke the camel’s back with Kimmel, making up his own untruths about a political assassination.
These shows all stopped being funny and a way to unwind a long time ago, and this was the excuse that the network affiliates needed to pull the plug.
As with Colbert before him, the show has been losing money for a long time, as going out to alienate half your audience does that.
The new South Park episode didn’t come out last night either, one suspects a hasty rewrite of much of the material didn’t happen in time.
LOL. You do realise how many 'untruths' your side were saying in the aftermath? And how differently Republicans who celebrated the deaths of Melissa Hortman and her husband? Utah senator Mike Lee is still in place, as an example.
This is nothing about jokes, or offence. It is about control of speech.
At the risk of feeding the troll, what exactly did Sen. Mike Lee say in the aftermath of the murder of Melissa Hortman?
The articles below reference a couple of posts: (I) saying that “this is what happens when Marxists don’t get their way” and another with a picture of the killer captioned “nightmare on waltz street”.
Ah okay thanks. So he was making comments about the murderer rather than the victim, which were called insensitive by friends of the victim, and which Sen. Lee took down after the friends spoke to him in person.
As opposed to this week, where people have been openly mocking the victim himself, saying he deserved it and compiling lists of who should be the next victims.
Does Kimmel go after Kirk? In the clip I saw, he's going after the reaction, rather than the victim.
Blanket imported US talking points from the early hours to now on this edition of PB. We might as well just apply for 51st state status now.
Nothing happening there is remotely surprising. There’s a wannabe dictatorship forming in a foreign country and they’re doing what wannabe dictatorships do.
We have our own challenges to focus on.
Such as having to deal with a rogue US President, or assessing the merits of otherwise of a massive US investment into the UK ? 😏
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
Those people who are defending Lucy Connelly. I understand that Starmer is expected to take a beating from Trump today based on an interview I heard with the top dog at Republicans Abroad, Greg Something-or-other saying something like "the imprisonment of Lucy Connolly for her opinions run contrary to the First Amendment, something that we Americans take as sacrosanct, in fact if we hadn't had the First Amendment we wouldn't have had the Second, Third, Fourth..."*
*My precis, but I kid you not, that is more-or-less what he said.
Connolly.
It looks like I hedged my bets and referred to her both as "Connelly" and "Connolly". Perhaps if I had stuck with Queen of all our hearts I would have been in safer ground.
How you choose to view her is up to you.
You seem somewhat obsessed with her.
I used her to illustrate the inconsistency between those American commentators who are happy to see Kimmel cancelled and fete Connolly for the deprivation of her freedom of speech to incite violent disorder.
Anyway I have taken up far too much of your time already so I'd better just f*** off.
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
The people who were crying out about the so-called cancel wars, including on here.
I think what is happening was extremely predictable and what some of us warned. The "other side" eventually gets the stick and is repeating the same approach, then the pendulum with swing back the other way and rinse and repeat.
It is why for instance I have had a very consistent line on people previous dodgy tweets. We should allow people to apologize for them and move on, unless it is a consistent pattern of behaviour. I don't care you twattered a dodgy thing 10 years ago when you were 20, particularly if we are now reinterpreting them through modern lens.
Do you think the cancellation of Kimmel is correct?
No. Not on the basis of a joke in poor taste. You can say they got it badly wrong here, but that doesn't mean you cancel them. An genuine apology would have been enough.
My point was that these shows have stopped being funny. Its not jokes, its political point scoring. And the audience are demonstrating that they think it too, with their feet. Nobody watches them anymore. So ultimately they will get cancelled because they cost a tonne of money to put on, the hosts are paid incredibly well and the revenue isn't coming in.
South Park are absolutely blasting Trump, but my god is this season funny. They also clearly had an episode in the can that probably is in very poor taste given what has gone on and so have pulled it.
South Park is often 'very poor taste'. What they may be afraid of is people using that to cancel them. Which might well make them *less* funny.
There is poor taste and there is poor taste. They love to go with the shock value, so in poor taste is e.g. showing an AI tiny penis of Trump or Trump in bed with the devil. That's different from if they had made an episode for this week which by chance that showed a Charlie Kirk-esque figure getting murdered.
As for being cancelled, in general I doubt they worry about that. a) they are still funny and b) very popular and c) a huge contract with the tv company. It is how Jimmy Carr can keep getting "cancelled" and coming back. It when you stop being funny and your popularity goes (or isn't that great), then the industry is very quick to distant themselves.
The first rule of comedy is that it has to be funny. The more “edgy” the comedy, and the more controversial the subject matter, the funnier it needs to be.
(Snip)
If the first rule of comedy is "it has to be funny", then the second has to be "You cannot amuse everyone."
Just because you don't find something funny, doesn't mean other people do not. And humour can also be used to tell grander truths - which is often where 'edginess' comes into it, if done well.
Fuck me, it’s Ted Bovis no less.
‘The first rule of comedy, Spike’
I'm unsure why you're saying that to me, considering I was responding to someone else who said "The first rule of comedy is..."
Cancel culture good when it’s being done by people we agree with, bad when it isn’t.
Perhaps those bleating now should have opposed it when people were being cancelled for views they don’t like, such as the tedious gender wars.
Can’t grumble when the other side pops up and does the same. You enabled it in the first place.
This is true. I don't support cancelling Jimmy Kimmel, or anyone else, full stop. People who champion freedom of speech but are OK with cancelling people they disagree with are being hypocritical.
However, as you suggest, there is an equal and opposite hypocrisy in those objecting to the cancelling of Kimmel but who have denied or dismissed cancel culture previously.
People should also look at the process by which Communism was imposed in Eastern Europe post Second World War.
Nearly everywhere, it wasn’t overnight. Taxation, government contracts, nationalisation and control of raw materials was used to take over businesses piecemeal.
In the political sphere, newspapers were gradually forced to stop printing anything vaguely anti-communist. The writers and editors considered a problem were fired under government pressure.
It was trying to do this too fast, that was big force behind 1956 in Hungary.
It's good to see that all the criticism we saw of so-called 'cancel culture' were lies. It's perfectly fine to cancel voices and people if they're your political enemies...
Lies from whom?
The people who were crying out about the so-called cancel wars, including on here.
I think what is happening was extremely predictable and what some of us warned. The "other side" eventually gets the stick and is repeating the same approach, then the pendulum with swing back the other way and rinse and repeat.
It is why for instance I have had a very consistent line on people previous dodgy tweets. We should allow people to apologize for them and move on, unless it is a consistent pattern of behaviour. I don't care you twattered a dodgy thing 10 years ago when you were 20, particularly if we are now reinterpreting them through modern lens.
Do you think the cancellation of Kimmel is correct?
No. Not on the basis of a joke in poor taste. You can say they got it badly wrong here, but that doesn't mean you cancel them. An genuine apology would have been enough.
My point was that these shows have stopped being funny. Its not jokes, its political point scoring. And the audience are demonstrating that they think it too, with their feet. Nobody watches them anymore. So ultimately they will get cancelled because they cost a tonne of money to put on, the hosts are paid incredibly well and the revenue isn't coming in.
South Park are absolutely blasting Trump, but my god is this season funny. They also clearly had an episode in the can that probably is in very poor taste given what has gone on and so have pulled it.
South Park is often 'very poor taste'. What they may be afraid of is people using that to cancel them. Which might well make them *less* funny.
There is poor taste and there is poor taste. They love to go with the shock value, so in poor taste is e.g. showing an AI tiny penis of Trump. That's different from if they had made an episode for this week which by chance that showed a Charlie Kirk-esque figure getting murdered.
(Snip)
So you are making an assumption about what's going on.
We in the UK need to be *very* careful not to import this concept of control of speech from the USA. Sadly, from his comments in the USA recently, Farage quite likes it.
Given South Park has been going for 27 seasons, there is quite a fair bit of evidence on how they act. They did episodes showing the Prophet Muhammad and also taken big swipes at all the religious figures. I don't think they self censor because they worry too much about if they might get cancelled or who they might upset.
A bit like Carr or Ricky Gervias, they aren't getting kicked off telly and they have more money than god. They got $1.5 billion to make 50 episodes. They don't do it for the money any more.
Thus, for them to pull an episode, I have to conclude they wrote one that will be really really insensitive given the recent events.
I think that's a wild assumption, given what's happening over in America.
I really don't. I see no evidence to believe South Park creators would suddenly get into self censorship over worries about people wanting to "cancel" them. They never have before.
There's never been this environment before.
If you are willing to go and make tv episodes that will offend huge numbers of Muslims and not exactly unknown for that to turn to something much worse than some angry letter writing, then I don't think you give a crap about what Trump or the current environment might be from a purely "will this get me in trouble".
No Muslims had the capability to force them off the air. Trump and the Republicans do, and have been wielding that power.
I think you are really overplaying this. Some people who didn't worry about the possibility of radical Islamist nutters coming at them, are worried about Trump might try and get their little show off kicked off cable tv. Come on.
But lets imagine Trump got one of the most popular tv shows shit canned.
They have their own website to show these shows, they could put them on YouTube. They have made stupid money, their show is cheap to make, they do all the voices, they regularly make episodes in a single work week, they don't need celebs on the show like the Late nights, they can't be "cancelled". And they have just spent the past month going harder than ever on Trump. Last time, its was they used an existing character to poke fun at him, this time its direct Trump is in the show.
The world has always been divided between those who are more scared of their government having too much power, and those who are scared about it having too little.
I am very much in the former group. The govenment* terrifies me far more than any Islamist nutter.
* Any government really
The absence of government is more terrifying still. Consider Syria's recent history.
Government. A dangerous servant. A terrible master.
A Home Office-backed charity is providing migrants with a step-by-step guide that could help them thwart Sir Keir Starmer’s “one in, one out” migrant deal with France.
Current government website guidelines state that “welfare services” must provide migrants held in removal centres with a “notebook” produced by Bail for Immigration Detainees (BiD), a charity that provides legal advice to people in detention.
The Telegraph can reveal that BiD, which has received more than £400,000 in Comic Relief donations and which benefits from charitable tax relief, has produced a detailed method that could help migrants to beat the Prime Minister’s flagship policy. The guide includes “template” letters migrants can use and suggestions for how to use legal and human rights arguments to fight deportation.
A Home Office-backed charity is providing migrants with a step-by-step guide that could help them thwart Sir Keir Starmer’s “one in, one out” migrant deal with France.
Current government website guidelines state that “welfare services” must provide migrants held in removal centres with a “notebook” produced by Bail for Immigration Detainees (BiD), a charity that provides legal advice to people in detention.
The Telegraph can reveal that BiD, which has received more than £400,000 in Comic Relief donations and which benefits from charitable tax relief, has produced a detailed method that could help migrants to beat the Prime Minister’s flagship policy. The guide includes “template” letters migrants can use and suggestions for how to use legal and human rights arguments to fight deportation.
A Home Office-backed charity is providing migrants with a step-by-step guide that could help them thwart Sir Keir Starmer’s “one in, one out” migrant deal with France.
Current government website guidelines state that “welfare services” must provide migrants held in removal centres with a “notebook” produced by Bail for Immigration Detainees (BiD), a charity that provides legal advice to people in detention.
The Telegraph can reveal that BiD, which has received more than £400,000 in Comic Relief donations and which benefits from charitable tax relief, has produced a detailed method that could help migrants to beat the Prime Minister’s flagship policy. The guide includes “template” letters migrants can use and suggestions for how to use legal and human rights arguments to fight deportation.
A Home Office-backed charity is providing migrants with a step-by-step guide that could help them thwart Sir Keir Starmer’s “one in, one out” migrant deal with France.
Current government website guidelines state that “welfare services” must provide migrants held in removal centres with a “notebook” produced by Bail for Immigration Detainees (BiD), a charity that provides legal advice to people in detention.
The Telegraph can reveal that BiD, which has received more than £400,000 in Comic Relief donations and which benefits from charitable tax relief, has produced a detailed method that could help migrants to beat the Prime Minister’s flagship policy. The guide includes “template” letters migrants can use and suggestions for how to use legal and human rights arguments to fight deportation.
Comments
On a related note..
Covie
@covie_93
If you see anyone not mourning the death of Robert Redford the way you would like them to please call their employer and get them fired!
Social Media is full of trolls, so possibly there are some in the sewer of X, but why not take it up with them there?
Are we now over the whole Google glass worries about privacy now in terms of people using the glasses to film etc?
Why not?
https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/fact-sheet/public-opinion-on-abortion/
Support is much higher in other denominations, for example 59% of US Catholics.
Blanket imported US talking points from the early hours to now on this edition of PB. We might as well just apply for 51st state status now.
Nothing happening there is remotely surprising. There’s a wannabe dictatorship forming in a foreign country and they’re doing what wannabe dictatorships do.
We have our own challenges to focus on.
Taking the piss out of Kirk, shortly after he's been murdered, would rather destroy any satirical point anyway.
Smart satirists don't sabotage themselves.
Rather like tattoos, people do get addicted and tend to over do it.
😏
NEW THREAD
Anyway I have taken up far too much of your time already so I'd better just f*** off.
Nearly everywhere, it wasn’t overnight. Taxation, government contracts, nationalisation and control of raw materials was used to take over businesses piecemeal.
In the political sphere, newspapers were gradually forced to stop printing anything vaguely anti-communist. The writers and editors considered a problem were fired under government pressure.
It was trying to do this too fast, that was big force behind 1956 in Hungary.