Just seen an update from Sky that Mandleson was appointed 'despite security concerns'
If so...Starmer is in real danger.
I can't bear the thought of Lammy being in charge even temporarily.
Lammy's an odd one. So obviously out of his depth in certain areas, yet can speak very eloquently about others. Though I'm unsure he actually has good answers, though.
I quite like him, in a different way to the way I quite liked Boris. They were both likeable, but unsuited for high office.
Just seen an update from Sky that Mandleson was appointed 'despite security concerns'
If so...Starmer is in real danger.
Oooft - yep, that would do it, if there’s a smoking gun.
There’s precedent for this.
Two officers from MI5 visited Downing Street in 2020 to brief Boris Johnson on the national security risks of giving Evgeny Lebedev a seat for life in the upper house of Parliament.
The then prime minister argued that the life peerage could go ahead because the MI5 officers’ security concerns were about Evgeny Lebedev’s father Alexander, a KGB-officer-turned-oligarch who has since been sanctioned by Canada and Ukraine for supporting Vladimir Putin’s war.
As the first case of a prime minister dismissing national security advice to make an appointment to the House of Lords, Evgeny Lebedev’s peerage has led to accusations of patronage, cronyism, and calls to reform the upper chamber. The case also represents Boris Johnson’s unserious approach to national security during his premiership, according to one of his former senior national security advisers in Downing Street.
Just seen an update from Sky that Mandleson was appointed 'despite security concerns'
If so...Starmer is in real danger.
Yes, that could well notch it up. Silly old Peter embarrassing himself and the government by displaying poor judgement through his dealings with a sex fiend is one thing. Knowingly putting a compromised individual into a position of vast responsibility is another level entirely.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
Jo Cox's sister, Kim Leadbeater, was elected to parliament so her presence will be a constant reminder.
Just seen an update from Sky that Mandleson was appointed 'despite security concerns'
If so...Starmer is in real danger.
Oooft - yep, that would do it, if there’s a smoking gun.
There’s precedent for this.
Two officers from MI5 visited Downing Street in 2020 to brief Boris Johnson on the national security risks of giving Evgeny Lebedev a seat for life in the upper house of Parliament.
The then prime minister argued that the life peerage could go ahead because the MI5 officers’ security concerns were about Evgeny Lebedev’s father Alexander, a KGB-officer-turned-oligarch who has since been sanctioned by Canada and Ukraine for supporting Vladimir Putin’s war.
As the first case of a prime minister dismissing national security advice to make an appointment to the House of Lords, Evgeny Lebedev’s peerage has led to accusations of patronage, cronyism, and calls to reform the upper chamber. The case also represents Boris Johnson’s unserious approach to national security during his premiership, according to one of his former senior national security advisers in Downing Street.
Just seen an update from Sky that Mandleson was appointed 'despite security concerns'
If so...Starmer is in real danger.
Oooft - yep, that would do it, if there’s a smoking gun.
There’s precedent for this.
Two officers from MI5 visited Downing Street in 2020 to brief Boris Johnson on the national security risks of giving Evgeny Lebedev a seat for life in the upper house of Parliament.
The then prime minister argued that the life peerage could go ahead because the MI5 officers’ security concerns were about Evgeny Lebedev’s father Alexander, a KGB-officer-turned-oligarch who has since been sanctioned by Canada and Ukraine for supporting Vladimir Putin’s war.
As the first case of a prime minister dismissing national security advice to make an appointment to the House of Lords, Evgeny Lebedev’s peerage has led to accusations of patronage, cronyism, and calls to reform the upper chamber. The case also represents Boris Johnson’s unserious approach to national security during his premiership, according to one of his former senior national security advisers in Downing Street.
Whatever you think about Mandelson and his sometimes poor judgement overall he is competent at the jobs he does, whether as Business or NI Secretary or in his most recent post as DC Ambassador. He is also ruthlessly effective as a campaigner, it was Mandelson who helped Kinnock bring back Labour from the abyss after their 1983 Foot led rout, it was Mandelson who played a key part in New Labour's landslide of 1997 and it was Mandelson who helped Brown narrow the gap in 2010 enough for a hung parliament, hence he never sacked him. Mandelson also worked behind the scenes on Starmer's 2024 win after the defeats of the Corbyn and Ed Miliband years.
He is gone for now but he may be back, as he has been before. Not as an elected politician or grand Ambassador, but as an effective behind the scenes man
Have you never had to sack someone who was supremely good at their job but cut corners and took risks which jeopardised everyone elses future employment?
At that very moment one asks them for their company car keys one's heart sinks because you know they would be the one that one could count on to hit their targets and yours.
I once went to the county court in Swansea to recover money owed from a guy called Jones. I had put my case before the Judge? and Jones put up little defence. The Judge awarded my company everything that I had requested. As I gathered my papers I noticed that my salesman had himself signed the sales documents on behalf of Jones but with the name Davies. I said nothing, but when I got back I sacked the lying f*****.
Politicians and journalists and trial lawyers and those in PR lie or as they would put it 'spin' all the time, if you sacked all those who did you would have very few left
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
They also murdered Protestants for being Protestant.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
Just seen an update from Sky that Mandleson was appointed 'despite security concerns'
If so...Starmer is in real danger.
Oooft - yep, that would do it, if there’s a smoking gun.
There’s precedent for this.
Two officers from MI5 visited Downing Street in 2020 to brief Boris Johnson on the national security risks of giving Evgeny Lebedev a seat for life in the upper house of Parliament.
The then prime minister argued that the life peerage could go ahead because the MI5 officers’ security concerns were about Evgeny Lebedev’s father Alexander, a KGB-officer-turned-oligarch who has since been sanctioned by Canada and Ukraine for supporting Vladimir Putin’s war.
As the first case of a prime minister dismissing national security advice to make an appointment to the House of Lords, Evgeny Lebedev’s peerage has led to accusations of patronage, cronyism, and calls to reform the upper chamber. The case also represents Boris Johnson’s unserious approach to national security during his premiership, according to one of his former senior national security advisers in Downing Street.
Members of the House of Lords don't routinely have access to top secret intelligence.
Silly old MI5 then.
Don't get me wrong neither should have been appointed. But I'd argue the fact HM ambassador to the US will have access to the most sensitive intelligence we share with the US may be more of a concern than a Peer getting to sit in the Lords.
There have also been some very close calls: Thatcher, Major, Timms.
Not just Thatcher and Major, had the attacks succeeded then most of the cabinet at the time would have been wiped out.
It was a curious thing that Michael Heseltine missed both events, during the Brighton bombing Heseltine was in Rome for a NATO meeting and during the Downing Street attack he wasn’t there as he wasn’t a member of the war cabinet.
Fun fact, I’ve stood in the Downing Street garden where the IRA mortars landed, and a few feet further they would have wiped out the war cabinet, it would have taken out not just top echelons of the cabinet but top echelons of the British military and intelligence services.
Hence Cobra meetings now take place in a Whitehall basement
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
Didn’t @Cookie (I may have the poster wrong) who said that within a week of being given locked down iPads the children had jailbreaked them to play games
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
That reminds me. A reasonably simple but jargon-ridden guide to online security from an ex-Microsoft guy. It explains who can see what, and how some security measures just move the risk rather than eliminate it, and the role of DNS.
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
30% used to be "bedrock" for Tory / Labour, then 20% have been breached, now 15%.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
In today's context it's difficult to believe the LDs decided to contest the Eastbourne by-election.
ALL the parties contested the by election, including Miss Whiplash.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
Didn’t @Cookie (I may have the poster wrong) who said that within a week of being given locked down iPads the children had jailbreaked them to play games
That was me / my son. I've done a little 'research' and it wasn't jailbreaked per se; it was that the whitelist or blacklist of accessible sites had holes in it, and some sites are accessible that perhaps should not be. I *assume* it is a blacklist of 'bad' sites, rather than a whitelist. And news of non-blacklisted sites with interesting content spread rapidly.
Which is why whitelists can be better than blacklists.
As an aside, the term 'hacking' is used far too generously. if you get someone's password by asking them or looking in the desk drawer where it's written down, that isn't 'hacking'. It is social engineering.
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
30% used to be "bedrock" for Tory / Labour, then 20% have been breached, now 15%.
Labour and Conservative combine score of 34 is exactly Reforms of 34
Im shocked, shocked that just as with the Savile prosecution decision, the security concerns didn't cross Sir Keir Starmers desk. The arse cant tell you what he had for tea last night for ignoring what's on the table in front of him
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
30% used to be "bedrock" for Tory / Labour, then 20% have been breached, now 15%.
Labour and Conservative combine score of 34 is exactly Reforms of 34
How politics changes
And Mandelson story will not have registered yet
Its pretty much identical to a fortnight ago which was 34 18 15. Only Labour are on 18.51% in the tables rounding up
Sky reporting Security Services raised issues about Mandelson and No 10 overruled them
Considerable dismay in the Security Serviced about the blame game
This is quite some development
This is the kind of scandal that can quickly escalate and bring down a government. I see Burnham making some interesting noises this afternoon…
Turkeys don’t vote for Christmas . Labour MPs aren’t going to bring down their own government , at most it might force Starmer out but even that’s a stretch .
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
Labour unchanged after the week Starmer had isn't too bad for him.
The Tories down 2% in a poll taken yesterday after Kemi's supposedly brilliant PMQs is dreadful for her.
If the Tories aren't back up to 20-25% by this time next year and have dreadful local, Holyrood and Senedd results as well a VONC from Tory MPs is very likely which she probably loses to be replaced by Cleverly or Jenrick
TSE mentioned a while back that Yougov had begun to weight more heavily based on GE vote (not sure why) and that got lower RefUK scores.
How would such a weighting affect the Tories? Would it depress or flatter their score? I would have thought it would flatter their score, as they were on 24% now they're on 15%, but could it actually depress it, because a lot of their natural voters (who may have come back) stayed at home last time?
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
What an utterly stupid post. Bringing political partisanship into the disgusting murders of two MPs because of their political allegiance is ludicrous.
I know the Amess family are frustrated with both this and the previous Government but "Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten" is a depressing and untrue comment. I haven't forgotten either and I can tell you where I was when I heard the news about each of them.
It is not untrue. *You* may not have forgotten, but the media seem far more keen to mention Cox more than Amess.
Which is a shame, as the reasons for their murders says a lot about some political extremes, and we are better off if we remember both in connection with each other.
What we are seeing is political allegiance - Cox was Labour and female. Amess was Tory and male. And before you complain, remember how Corbyn invited two IRA members to parliament soon after the Brighton bombings.
I'd also give a mention to Andrew Pennington, who died when Nigel Jones was attacked.
Why would you believe I would support bringing IRA terrorists into Parliament any more than you would agree to Boris Johnson installing the son of an alleged KGB officer into the HoL?
Sky reporting Security Services raised issues about Mandelson and No 10 overruled them
Considerable dismay in the Security Serviced about the blame game
This is quite some development
This is the kind of scandal that can quickly escalate and bring down a government. I see Burnham making some interesting noises this afternoon…
Turkeys don’t vote for Christmas . Labour MPs aren’t going to bring down their own government , at most it might force Starmer out but even that’s a stretch .
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
Labour unchanged after the week Starmer had isn't too bad for him.
The Tories down 2% in a poll taken yesterday after Kemi's supposedly brilliant PMQs is dreadful for her.
If the Tories aren't back up to 20-25% by this time next year and have dreadful local, Holyrood and Senedd results as well a VONC from Tory MPs is very likely which she probably loses to be replaced by Cleverly or Jenrick
Far too early to assume this week's fallout is priced in
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
Did anyone here (of the right age) *not* hack their school computers?
Well, we have no network suitable for hacking at school. we had an Acorn Econet (**), but security was a rather null topic back then. I did 'hack' a computer game - a flight simulator - to remove copy protection though. (*)
(*) Interdictor 2; and the protection was a simple select a colour from the manual. Something that was easy to bypass with a little ARM disassembly and knowledge.
(**) A fairly advanced networking system for the early 80s.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
What an utterly stupid post. Bringing political partisanship into the disgusting murders of two MPs because of their political allegiance is ludicrous.
I know the Amess family are frustrated with both this and the previous Government but "Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten" is a depressing and untrue comment. I haven't forgotten either and I can tell you where I was when I heard the news about each of them.
It is not untrue. *You* may not have forgotten, but the media seem far more keen to mention Cox more than Amess.
Which is a shame, as the reasons for their murders says a lot about some political extremes, and we are better off if we remember both in connection with each other.
What we are seeing is political allegiance - Cox was Labour and female. Amess was Tory and male. And before you complain, remember how Corbyn invited two IRA members to parliament soon after the Brighton bombings.
I'd also give a mention to Andrew Pennington, who died when Nigel Jones was attacked.
Why would you believe I would support bringing IRA terrorists into Parliament any more than you would agree to Boris Johnson installing the son of an alleged KGB officer into the HoL?
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes or major frauds with others then GCHQ and the intelligence services will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs.
Spotty teenagers hacking their school are also far more likely to slip up and by process of elimination, consulting parents as to when their children were online at home, checking who logged in to school systems at what time etc, the ICO and school can id them VPN or no VPN
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
You define what your opinion of a Christian is, but this Christian is a long way away from your right wing views
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
Didn’t @Cookie (I may have the poster wrong) who said that within a week of being given locked down iPads the children had jailbreaked them to play games
That was me / my son. I've done a little 'research' and it wasn't jailbreaked per se; it was that the whitelist or blacklist of accessible sites had holes in it, and some sites are accessible that perhaps should not be. I *assume* it is a blacklist of 'bad' sites, rather than a whitelist. And news of non-blacklisted sites with interesting content spread rapidly.
Which is why whitelists can be better than blacklists.
As an aside, the term 'hacking' is used far too generously. if you get someone's password by asking them or looking in the desk drawer where it's written down, that isn't 'hacking'. It is social engineering.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
In today's context it's difficult to believe the LDs decided to contest the Eastbourne by-election.
Enfield Southgate was also contested by all parties in 1984 following the MP's killing in the Brighton bombing.
Personally, I think parties sitting out Batley & Spen and Southend West was entirely wrong and the precedent should be ditched.
The idea that the fact the seat might change hands between the mainstream parties at a by-election would encourage murders being carried out by people who are totally outside that mainstream seems ludicrous. A small tribute to a democratic politician who is tragically killed in the course of their duties is that democracy goes on regardless.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
If you are doing dodgy stuff on the internet and using a VPN provider that doesn't have independently verified procedures for no logs you are a moron. That is also quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself on the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Christ doesn't say he is also God and Messiah, clearly you are reading the wrong Bible to me!
A friend of mine worked at the DTI when Mandelson was Sec of State and Blair was PM. He was extremely highly regarded. Very able, and unfailingly courteous. Made a point of getting to know the staff. I suspect this reputation for actually being able to run a department explains why he has been able to bounce back so often - the senior civil servants rate him. And, of course, a brilliant political operator. So the senior pols rate him too. Even Brown, after the TB/GB fall outs. Achilles heel has always been the company he keeps - the mortgage provider, the passport supplicant, and the socialite/fixer.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly and worryingly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
TSE mentioned a while back that Yougov had begun to weight more heavily based on GE vote (not sure why) and that got lower RefUK scores.
How would such a weighting affect the Tories? Would it depress or flatter their score? I would have thought it would flatter their score, as they were on 24% now they're on 15%, but could it actually depress it, because a lot of their natural voters (who may have come back) stayed at home last time?
It would depress the Tory share of the vote slightly, as a chunk of their 2019 vote sat out the 2024 election.
Reform are picking up habitual non voters (people who didn’t vote in 2024, 2019, and further back).
The more you haven’t voted in elections the more you get down weighted.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Sorry, but you really don't understand internet tech.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Christ doesn't say he is also God and Messiah, clearly you are reading the wrong Bible to me!
You treat your faith as a religion
My late father in law used to say
'Religion degrades a man, Christianity uplifts a man'
Wise words from a wonderful Christian Scottish Fisherman who was awarded the BEM for services to the fishing industry by the late King George V but never forgot how humble he was
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
In today's context it's difficult to believe the LDs decided to contest the Eastbourne by-election.
Enfield Southgate was also contested by all parties in 1984 following the MP's killing in the Brighton bombing.
Personally, I think parties sitting out Batley & Spen and Southend West was entirely wrong and the precedent should be ditched.
The idea that the fact the seat might change hands between the mainstream parties at a by-election would encourage murders being carried out by people who are totally outside that mainstream seems ludicrous. A small tribute to a democratic politician who is tragically killed in the course of their duties is that democracy goes on regardless.
Er, no. By-elections can be destabilising for the government concerned. Could conceivably be a motivation. The by-election caused by Ian Gow's murder was pretty damaging for Mrs T's Govt at the time - IRA won't have minded that one bit.
No10 say the security vetting process is all done at a department level - with no No10 involvement.
Hmmm.
I think a certain celebrity might be brought up in PMQs next week.
As I said down thread, this is all been setup for some random low level person to be chucked under the bus amid claims of poor vetting procedures something something the Tories.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly and worryingly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Absolutely
Hm. I really don't know. It's very hard to get into the heads of people who lived 2000 years ago, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that many of them really, really cared about religion - in a nuts and bots sense - in a way we can't really relate to today. It was really important. Really, really important. 21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible. And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
Labour unchanged after the week Starmer had isn't too bad for him.
The Tories down 2% in a poll taken yesterday after Kemi's supposedly brilliant PMQs is dreadful for her.
If the Tories aren't back up to 20-25% by this time next year and have dreadful local, Holyrood and Senedd results as well a VONC from Tory MPs is very likely which she probably loses to be replaced by Cleverly or Jenrick
Amazing that you describe 19% for Labour as not too bad.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
What an utterly stupid post. Bringing political partisanship into the disgusting murders of two MPs because of their political allegiance is ludicrous.
I know the Amess family are frustrated with both this and the previous Government but "Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten" is a depressing and untrue comment. I haven't forgotten either and I can tell you where I was when I heard the news about each of them.
It is not untrue. *You* may not have forgotten, but the media seem far more keen to mention Cox more than Amess.
Which is a shame, as the reasons for their murders says a lot about some political extremes, and we are better off if we remember both in connection with each other.
What we are seeing is political allegiance - Cox was Labour and female. Amess was Tory and male. And before you complain, remember how Corbyn invited two IRA members to parliament soon after the Brighton bombings.
I'd also give a mention to Andrew Pennington, who died when Nigel Jones was attacked.
Andy was a good man. A friend of my family, as was Nigel. Nigel was himself quite badly injured and at the court case he had a heart attack which may have been triggered by PTSD, It was a horrible event and I certainly do remember where I was when I learned of it.
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
Labour unchanged after the week Starmer had isn't too bad for him.
The Tories down 2% in a poll taken yesterday after Kemi's supposedly brilliant PMQs is dreadful for her.
If the Tories aren't back up to 20-25% by this time next year and have dreadful local, Holyrood and Senedd results as well a VONC from Tory MPs is very likely which she probably loses to be replaced by Cleverly or Jenrick
Amazing that you describe 19% for Labour as not too bad.
Unchanged and with a 12% Green vote and 12% LD vote of tactical votes in Labour held marginals to squeeze to keep out Reform yes after a poor week for Starmer certainly not too bad relative to Kemi
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Absolutely
Hm. I really don't know. It's very hard to get into the heads of people who lived 2000 years ago, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that many of them really, really cared about religion - in a nuts and bots sense - in a way we can't really relate to today. It was really important. Really, really important. 21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible. And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
On the subject of the Holy Trinity, that means Christianity didn't exist until the Council of Nicea, and excludes a fair few groups who would generally be accepted as Christians.
No10 say the security vetting process is all done at a department level - with no No10 involvement.
Hmmm.
I think a certain celebrity might be brought up in PMQs next week.
As I said down thread, this is all been setup for some random low level person to be chucked under the bus amid claims of poor vetting procedures something something the Tories.
I remember how the Tories blamed a poor civil servant at No 10 for their own bollocks. Though I forget her name.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly and worryingly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Number 10 fire fighting on the gentle ben stuff coming out this afternoon. They'll be out of puff once the mother load hits either tonight or in the Sundays
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Christ doesn't say he is also God and Messiah, clearly you are reading the wrong Bible to me!
And you utterly miss the point I was making.
Jesus - at least in my reading of the Bible - would care little about the stuff you mentioned. If you agreed with him, but treated people poorly, then he would not see you favourably. And if you disagreed with him, but treated people well, then he would see you favourably. It is the quality of people's souls and their consequent actions, not their beliefs, that matters.
The Good Samaritan and all that.
Whereas your view of 'Christianity' is embedded deeply within orthodoxy.
Changes from 3rd September [Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Sorry, but you really don't understand internet tech.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
Oh I do, you clearly have no problem with 5 to 13 year olds finding porn and violent sites when accessing the internet and it is very concerning
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly and worryingly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
What - you haven't a clue
Clearly more than you it seems
I have children and grandchildren and a son who is head of IT at a local school to call on
Your last paragraph could only be written by someone who has no practical knowledge of children's interaction with the Internet
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Absolutely
Hm. I really don't know. It's very hard to get into the heads of people who lived 2000 years ago, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that many of them really, really cared about religion - in a nuts and bots sense - in a way we can't really relate to today. It was really important. Really, really important. 21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible. And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
On the subject of the Holy Trinity, that means Christianity didn't exist until the Council of Nicea, and excludes a fair few groups who would generally be accepted as Christians.
Quite. Christianity is not the Roman and/or Orthodox churches, they just try and claim ownership of it. There are plenty of 'heresies' that are still Christian despite what the Roman Empires man in the Vatican proclaims
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Absolutely
Hm. I really don't know. It's very hard to get into the heads of people who lived 2000 years ago, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that many of them really, really cared about religion - in a nuts and bots sense - in a way we can't really relate to today. It was really important. Really, really important. 21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible. And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
On the subject of the Holy Trinity, that means Christianity didn't exist until the Council of Nicea, and excludes a fair few groups who would generally be accepted as Christians.
Another reason why, along with Saint Paul, why Christianity is Turkish.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Sorry, but you really don't understand internet tech.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
Oh I do, you clearly have no problem with 5 to 13 year olds finding porn and violent sites when accessing the internet and it is very concerning
You are so insulting
Everyone has problems with children accessing porn and violence, but what you fail to understand, and consistently, that young children have the knowledge from their peers and siblings to override age verification entirely without their parents knowledge
In a few years time you will experience the reality yourself
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly and worryingly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
What - you haven't a clue
Clearly more than you it seems
I have children and grandchildren and a son who is head of IT at a local school to call on
Your last paragraph could only be written by someone who has no practical knowledge of children's interaction with the Internet
I suggested upthread, Mr G, that he lives a sheltered, perhaps unworldly, life.
A friend of mine worked at the DTI when Mandelson was Sec of State and Blair was PM. He was extremely highly regarded. Very able, and unfailingly courteous. Made a point of getting to know the staff. I suspect this reputation for actually being able to run a department explains why he has been able to bounce back so often - the senior civil servants rate him. And, of course, a brilliant political operator. So the senior pols rate him too. Even Brown, after the TB/GB fall outs. Achilles heel has always been the company he keeps - the mortgage provider, the passport supplicant, and the socialite/fixer.
Perhaps your last line is why the senior civil servants rated him. Personally, I'd always take junior staff's view on someone over senior ones, who can be a little too close to the boss.
The fact is, politically, he is a disaster area, causing loads of political harm to his superiors. and always, somehow, seeming to come out of it better connected and more influential than before. And richer.
No10 say the security vetting process is all done at a department level - with no No10 involvement.
Hmmm.
I think a certain celebrity might be brought up in PMQs next week.
In that case, are they throwing Lammy under a bus? Poor bloke has only been Deputy PM for 6 days.
If they’re starting to turn on each other, that is showing that they are desperately concerned about this.
I know we got used to the whiff of scandal under Johnson, but this was supposed to be the sober, responsible government. This is now looking very serious for them.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Absolutely
Hm. I really don't know. It's very hard to get into the heads of people who lived 2000 years ago, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that many of them really, really cared about religion - in a nuts and bots sense - in a way we can't really relate to today. It was really important. Really, really important. 21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible. And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
On the subject of the Holy Trinity, that means Christianity didn't exist until the Council of Nicea, and excludes a fair few groups who would generally be accepted as Christians.
Another reason why, along with Saint Paul, why Christianity is Turkish.
Technically Greek. There were no Turks in Anatolia back rhen.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Sorry, but you really don't understand internet tech.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
Oh I do, you clearly have no problem with 5 to 13 year olds finding porn and violent sites when accessing the internet and it is very concerning
In case it's of any interest, the domain name maddonkeysanctuary.org is still available.
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Sorry, but you really don't understand internet tech.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
Oh I do, you clearly have no problem with 5 to 13 year olds finding porn and violent sites when accessing the internet and it is very concerning
You are so insulting
Everyone has problems with children accessing porn and violence, but what you fail to understand, and consistently, that young children have the knowledge from their peers and siblings to override age verification entirely without their parents knowledge
In a few years time you will experience the reality yourself
If they are teenagers maybe, if they are pre pubescant children just occasionally surfing the internet for sites suitable for children who occasionally they likely have neither the knowledge to access the VPN nor the inclination to access porn sites and images and nor should they have to see them pop up when searching
The Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) has issued a warning about what it calls the "worrying trend" of students hacking their own school and college IT systems for fun or as part of dares.
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
If an illegal activity was committed using a VPN, the police can trace the users via a warrant to id them from the ISP and then the VPN provider
LOL...you really don't understand VPNs do you. Most paid reputable ones operate no log, RAM cache, IP mixing. Pc Plod is absolutely shit out of luck. Most of those caught doing really dodgy stuff have required a) intelligence services and b) they let something slip unrelated to VPN usage. GCHQ did have a zero day for OpenVPN, but it was closed and they won't burn something like that on some spotty teenager hacking their school.
No, some operate no log as you say not all and as you say intelligence services can be brought in to track cookies and browser fingerprints can be used as well.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes with others then GCHQ will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs
That is quite an escalation from spotty teenager hacks own school, which is the original conversation.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself ok the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
No, I do understand it, if you are using VPNs to commit serious crimes then VPN provider logs or not GCHQ will likely eventually catch you.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Sorry, but you really don't understand internet tech.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
Oh I do, you clearly have no problem with 5 to 13 year olds finding porn and violent sites when accessing the internet and it is very concerning
You're wrong about this HYUFD. It's trivial to get round it. The OSA is no more effective in achieving its aim than HIPs were in achieving theirs. It comes from 'something must be done' 'this is something' 'then we must do this'.
every time there's political violence discourse i think about how jo cox was assassinated in broad daylight by a fascist who shouted "britain first" as he shot her, and now nine years later her party is dedicating every moment in power to placating the ideology of her murderer
One of the saddest things in modern UK politics is the way Jo Cox has been elevated, whilst David Amess has been relatively forgotten. Both murdered by political/religious extremists.
People pick whichever one matches their prejudices, and elevate that while minimizing the other.
I try to remember both, and also Gow. I could go back further, but they're really beyond my political time.
You’re of a similar age to me and in our lifetimes six MPs have been murdered, one by a far right extremist, one by a Muslim terrorist, and four by Christian terrorists.
I’d add Cllr Andrew Pennington who was murdered trying to stop a mentally ill murdering an MP.
Since when were the IRA Christian terrorists?
They said their objectives was to free Catholics who were being persecuted.
Their main objective was to 'free' Northern Ireland and Ulster from British rule and create a United Ireland ie nationalism not religion, they also targeted Northern Irish and British Protestants who are and were as Christian as Catholics
Depends on your definition of 'Christian'. I've known NI Protestants who objected to the description of Roman Catholics as Christian. And Catholics who've argued the same about Evangelical Protestants. To be fair, not recently; things have moved on a lot during my lifetime.
They believe in the Trinity and Christ as Messiah, so are all Christian. They just differ on transubstantiation, the authority of the Pope and sometimes Bishops too and whether they prefer low church bible based and simple music or high church communion and choral based worship
I don't want to sound unkind, but you do seem to live a sheltered life sometimes.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
No, I just defined what a Christian is
I might humbly suggest that Christ himself would care little about the stuff you mention, and care rather more about the way we treat each other.
Absolutely
Hm. I really don't know. It's very hard to get into the heads of people who lived 2000 years ago, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say that many of them really, really cared about religion - in a nuts and bots sense - in a way we can't really relate to today. It was really important. Really, really important. 21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible. And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
On the subject of the Holy Trinity, that means Christianity didn't exist until the Council of Nicea, and excludes a fair few groups who would generally be accepted as Christians.
Another reason why, along with Saint Paul, why Christianity is Turkish.
Technically Greek. There were no Turks in Anatolia back rhen.
My M-I-L was raised in that general area, and used to find Roman gold coins when digging in the garden. That was unnoteworthy at the time, and the coins were sold on. Sadly Turkey, which possibly has a much more varied and richer history than ours, used to care little for its archaeology - at least until recent times. A 'Time Team' style series set in Turkey might do wonders.
Mandelson, over the last few months, seems to have had an almost supernaturally good effect on the behaviour of Trump towards the UK - the praise Starmer has got relative to other leaders has seemed sometimes like witchcraft.
So, I join the likes of Isam in wondering whether Mandelson's appointment was not made despite his relationship with Epstein in common with Trump, but partly because of it.
That Trump did a double take when he turned up and was unsure whether to be more wary of "Putin's pee tape" or "Petey from the Pedo Ponderosa*"
Hopefully, whatever the UK knows, they still know, now any clever ruse in appointing Mandelson has come apart.
Starmer may still get the "what he knew when" heat that so dogged Johnson, but now Mandy is gone, I can't see it being terminal this time out.
*suggesting only any knowledge Trump might ever have had of previous Mandelson presence at an Epstein ranch / property
Comments
I quite like him, in a different way to the way I quite liked Boris. They were both likeable, but unsuited for high office.
Two officers from MI5 visited Downing Street in 2020 to brief Boris Johnson on the national security risks of giving Evgeny Lebedev a seat for life in the upper house of Parliament.
The then prime minister argued that the life peerage could go ahead because the MI5 officers’ security concerns were about Evgeny Lebedev’s father Alexander, a KGB-officer-turned-oligarch who has since been sanctioned by Canada and Ukraine for supporting Vladimir Putin’s war.
As the first case of a prime minister dismissing national security advice to make an appointment to the House of Lords, Evgeny Lebedev’s peerage has led to accusations of patronage, cronyism, and calls to reform the upper chamber. The case also represents Boris Johnson’s unserious approach to national security during his premiership, according to one of his former senior national security advisers in Downing Street.
https://www.tortoisemedia.com/2023/06/26/mi5-visited-downing-street-to-warn-boris-johnson-against-evgeny-lebedevs-peerage
There was always the chance the Epstein issue would surface and it just speaks to a lack of judgement by Starmer who seems utterly clueless .
It has told teachers that they are failing to understand and recognise what it calls the "insider threat" pupils pose.
It says more the majority of so-called "insider" cyber attacks and data breaches in education settings - meaning they have been carried out by someone with access to internal systems - originate with students.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c203pedz58go
But they will never work out VPNs and bypassing OSA.
Why did Starmer take the risk of appointing Peter Mandelson?
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjd1egrlj0mo
https://news.sky.com/story/no-10-appointed-mandelson-despite-security-concerns-sky-news-understands-13428814
If you are a criminal a VPN does not guarantee GCHQ and the police and security services won't identify and charge you.
Though you may be alright if a teenage boy just using one to access an adult porn site without age verification checks
Not least because all this coincides with polling like this (FPTP)
Find Out Now voting intention:
🟦 Reform UK: 34% (+2)
🔴 Labour: 19% (-)
🔵 Conservatives: 15% (-2)
🟠 Lib Dems: 12% (-1)
🟢 Greens: 12% (+1)
Changes from 3rd September
[Find Out Now, 10th September, N=2,717]
How long can Labour watch Reform stretch their lead? It’s like a long distance run where you realise the guy in front isn’t going to run out of puff, and if you don’t kick in now, you may lose the race in the first 2000m
O/T, but an e-book I contributed to is now on Amazon.
Although, to be fair, as I said things have moved on somewhat over the past fifty or sixty years.
Are YOU the Product? Your ISP Is Selling You Out — Fix This One DNS Setting Now!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxFd5xAN4cg
Which is why whitelists can be better than blacklists.
As an aside, the term 'hacking' is used far too generously. if you get someone's password by asking them or looking in the desk drawer where it's written down, that isn't 'hacking'. It is social engineering.
How politics changes
And Mandelson story will not have registered yet
The arse cant tell you what he had for tea last night for ignoring what's on the table in front of him
The Tories down 2% in a poll taken yesterday after Kemi's supposedly brilliant PMQs is dreadful for her.
If the Tories aren't back up to 20-25% by this time next year and have dreadful local, Holyrood and Senedd results as well a VONC from Tory MPs is very likely which she probably loses to be replaced by Cleverly or Jenrick
How would such a weighting affect the Tories? Would it depress or flatter their score? I would have thought it would flatter their score, as they were on 24% now they're on 15%, but could it actually depress it, because a lot of their natural voters (who may have come back) stayed at home last time?
(*) Interdictor 2; and the protection was a simple select a colour from the manual. Something that was easy to bypass with a little ARM disassembly and knowledge.
(**) A fairly advanced networking system for the early 80s.
And if you are accessing and running child porn sites, planning terrorist outrages and hate crimes or major frauds with others then GCHQ and the intelligence services will be brought in to find you even if your VPN provider has no logs.
Spotty teenagers hacking their school are also far more likely to slip up and by process of elimination, consulting parents as to when their children were online at home, checking who logged in to school systems at what time etc, the ICO and school can id them VPN or no VPN
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/online-safety/protecting-children/enforcement-programme-to-protect-children-from-encountering-pornographic-content-through-the-use-of-age-assurance
Personally, I think parties sitting out Batley & Spen and Southend West was entirely wrong and the precedent should be ditched.
The idea that the fact the seat might change hands between the mainstream parties at a by-election would encourage murders being carried out by people who are totally outside that mainstream seems ludicrous. A small tribute to a democratic politician who is tragically killed in the course of their duties is that democracy goes on regardless.
Also you have repeated showed you don't understand this VPN and anonymising yourself on the internet, but you keep trying to make ridiculous points when somebody mentions OSA.
He was extremely highly regarded. Very able, and unfailingly courteous. Made a point of getting to know the staff.
I suspect this reputation for actually being able to run a department explains why he has been able to bounce back so often - the senior civil servants rate him. And, of course, a brilliant political operator. So the senior pols rate him too. Even Brown, after the TB/GB fall outs.
Achilles heel has always been the company he keeps - the mortgage provider, the passport supplicant, and the socialite/fixer.
OSA was brought in primarily to stop under 10s finding porn sites and violent sites by mistake, something clearly and worryingly you don't care about, not to stop spotty teens 13+ watching legal adult porn
Reform are picking up habitual non voters (people who didn’t vote in 2024, 2019, and further back).
The more you haven’t voted in elections the more you get down weighted.
Are we are back to you are Jimmy Savile.best mate stuff. It's a bad law, implemented badly.
@SamCoatesSky
This is No10's response to my story:
No10 say the security vetting process is all done at a department level - with no No10 involvement.
Hmmm.
I think a certain celebrity might be brought up in PMQs next week.
My late father in law used to say
'Religion degrades a man, Christianity uplifts a man'
Wise words from a wonderful Christian Scottish Fisherman who was awarded the BEM for services to the fishing industry by the late King George V but never forgot how humble he was
21st century humans have a habit of assuming Jesus was basically just a good bloke. And by 1st century standards he probably was. He probably did care about the way we treated each other. But 1st century people were very very different to us. Assuming any of them cared little about the theological nuts and bolts of their faith seems a stretch. Assuming one of the leading theological thinkers of the age didn't actually care that much about it seems, well, not really credible.
And to be brutally route 1 about it - and does HYUFD ever take any other approach? - yes, technically, he has defined what a Christian is. Being a Christian isn't about what we euphemistically term as 'Christian' - in the sense of caring a bit about other people - it's about believing in the Trinity. People of other religions and none can do the 'caring about people' stuff as well as Christians can; what really sets Christians apart is belief in Jesus as the literal son of God who also happens to BE God (I may be missing some of the theological niceties here; I am an outsider.)
I would love confession.
Every week I’d get the opportunity to
brag aboutconfess my sins, then say a hundred Hail Marys to be forgiven.Jesus - at least in my reading of the Bible - would care little about the stuff you mentioned. If you agreed with him, but treated people poorly, then he would not see you favourably. And if you disagreed with him, but treated people well, then he would see you favourably. It is the quality of people's souls and their consequent actions, not their beliefs, that matters.
The Good Samaritan and all that.
Whereas your view of 'Christianity' is embedded deeply within orthodoxy.
https://youtu.be/NBUEMV15oHk?si=zmJyOs2YRt5cbsqm
Your last paragraph could only be written by someone who has no practical knowledge of children's interaction with the Internet
Christianity is not the Roman and/or Orthodox churches, they just try and claim ownership of it. There are plenty of 'heresies' that are still Christian despite what the Roman Empires man in the Vatican proclaims
Everyone has problems with children accessing porn and violence, but what you fail to understand, and consistently, that young children have the knowledge from their peers and siblings to override age verification entirely without their parents knowledge
In a few years time you will experience the reality yourself
The fact is, politically, he is a disaster area, causing loads of political harm to his superiors. and always, somehow, seeming to come out of it better connected and more influential than before. And richer.
I know we got used to the whiff of scandal under Johnson, but this was supposed to be the sober, responsible government. This is now looking very serious for them.
She was also taught to fish using explosives...
So, I join the likes of Isam in wondering whether Mandelson's appointment was not made despite his relationship with Epstein in common with Trump, but partly because of it.
That Trump did a double take when he turned up and was unsure whether to be more wary of "Putin's pee tape" or "Petey from the Pedo Ponderosa*"
Hopefully, whatever the UK knows, they still know, now any clever ruse in appointing Mandelson has come apart.
Starmer may still get the "what he knew when" heat that so dogged Johnson, but now Mandy is gone, I can't see it being terminal this time out.
*suggesting only any knowledge Trump might ever have had of previous Mandelson presence at an Epstein ranch / property