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It’s a bold strategy. Let’s see if it pays off for Farage. – politicalbetting.com

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  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,416
    edited April 21
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    I think it will be as much about this...

    "At a time when more crime is being reported and recorded, less is being done. Charge rates have plummeted from 16 per cent in 2015 to 6 per cent today, and the fall is even more drastic for the most commonly reported crimes. Back in 2015, a quarter of public fear, alarm or distress reports — which includes threats, abuse or harassment, either verbal or physical — led to someone being charged; now it is a mere 3 per cent. Crime may be falling, but more of us than ever before are reporting it and getting nothing more than a reference number."

    You are a victim of crime, you tell your friends and family, nought gets done, the perception quickly the police have lost control. And it isn't actually without merit, many forms of "shitty" crime against individuals e.g. phone snacking, car theft, etc, now nothing will ever come of it.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,467
    edited April 21

    rcs1000 said:

    flanner2 said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Random Easter Monday thought.

    I’ve not had a classic head cold for at least 6 months, possibly longer, and very few people I know have either. Are we going through a common cold drought?

    People always say when “there’s a lot of it going round at the moment” but they never comment when there’s “not a lot of it going round”.

    I don't normally get them but have had 2 in the last six months. Got over one then a few weeks later got another.
    OK, hypothesis for the day not looking particularly robust so far.

    I’m currently at Britain’s poshest railway terminus. It’s a ridiculous place, as if built by a film studio for a costume drama (but with a Burger King and a Pret).

    There is an entire hut, occupying what used to be the tourist info booth, decorated in olde English wallpaper and dedicated to suckering rich tourists into visiting Bicester village. And station announcements in Mandarin and Arabic.
    St Pancras DOES NOT have a Burger King!
    Presumably, the OP is talking about Marylebone.
    Where the ONLY announcements in Arabic and Mandarin are for departures to Oxford via Bicester Village: most Marylebone departures go elsewhere.

    PS Who knows what the Mandarin is for Oxford and why?
    Marylebone is rubbish.

    Only 6 mainline platforms, none of which are electrified, and served by only one tube line.
    The two minute walk to Baker Street is clearly excessive for you.
    Trying to out-sad me again, RCS? It's only DIRECTLY served by the Bakerloo.

    Fun fact:

    Out of 612 stations in Greater London, only Marylebone, Wembley Stadium, Sudbury & Harrow Road, Sudbury Hill Harrow, and Northolt Park are served exclusively by diesel trains, with no electrified platforms.
    Northolt Park is a very interesting station!

    (It is just up the road to where I was born too, so there may be a bit of bias)

    It served though a great racecourse project in the 1930s.

    In the 1970s it was an almost uninhabited wilderness - you could barely get up the little access path to the west.

    Now, it's lost any mojo whatsoever - a very strange station.

    PS. Sunil I think the other day you said you were a wikipedia editor type. The entry for the station lacks any reference to the grand racecourse project - some of which is still evident.

    See https://northoltparkracecourse.wordpress.com/
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on

    I would argue that the increased diversity makes European cities more interesting. It is increasing inequality and austerity that is making the UK in particular less attractive.
    Yes, I hear that a lot from the good people of Malmo

    “All this diversity means our lives are more interesting”
    I've spent the weekend with familywho have just moved from London to Cumberland - one of the biggest benefits to doing so is 'feeling of safety, especially for women'. Even for the pretty well-off, London is an increasingly unattractive place to bring up a family.
    And yet women still vote left. They vote to make their cities less safe for women. It is mind boggling - tho beginning to change
    14 years of right wing government has seen huge cuts to police funding, numbers, physical resources.
    The first 5 years of it, the worst five years, they were aided and abetted by the Lib Dems

    Worth remembering

  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,085
    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    I hope the vile woman ends up in hell .
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,514
    Scott_xP said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Just to check I have the timeline right:

    Pope in good health meets with JD Vance.
    Pope dies.

    Actually, the full timeline is

    Pope declines to meet with JD Vance.

    Pope doesn't die.

    Pope in good health meets with JD Vance.

    Pope dies.
    JD Vance is a Bond villain, isn't he?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,514
    IanB2 said:

    Changing the subject.

    Heard my first cuckoo of the year yesterday (North York Moors). Told neighbour, who was visibly relieved. At least something's still working.

    Wonder, in my darker moments, how long before it becomes a folk memory in rural England. Like the sound of children playing in the yard of the village school.

    On a brighter note...

    Nowadays I only hear cuckoos when visiting Italy, and it always reminds me of hearing them in England when young.

    I have however heard a lot more woodpeckers this year in England than is usual?
    The woodpeckers started drumming weeks early this year.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    Oh, the disagreement about the facts which constitute reality is extraordinary.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,514
    nico67 said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    I hope the vile woman ends up in hell .
    Too good for her.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,146

    Scott_xP said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Just to check I have the timeline right:

    Pope in good health meets with JD Vance.
    Pope dies.

    Actually, the full timeline is

    Pope declines to meet with JD Vance.

    Pope doesn't die.

    Pope in good health meets with JD Vance.

    Pope dies.
    JD Vance is a Bond villain, isn't he?
    If he is let’s hope he drops MTG out of a blimp over California over her view on the Pope’s death.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 51,095
    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on

    I would argue that the increased diversity makes European cities more interesting. It is increasing inequality and austerity that is making the UK in particular less attractive.
    Yes, I hear that a lot from the good people of Malmo

    “All this diversity means our lives are more interesting”
    I've spent the weekend with familywho have just moved from London to Cumberland - one of the biggest benefits to doing so is 'feeling of safety, especially for women'. Even for the pretty well-off, London is an increasingly unattractive place to bring up a family.
    And yet women still vote left. They vote to make their cities less safe for women. It is mind boggling - tho beginning to change
    14 years of right wing government has seen huge cuts to police funding, numbers, physical resources.
    The first 5 years of it, the worst five years, they were aided and abetted by the Lib Dems

    Worth remembering

    Ameliorated, is the truth of it.
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603
    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    Unlikely given Diego Maradona is dead
  • No_Offence_AlanNo_Offence_Alan Posts: 4,975
    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on

    I would argue that the increased diversity makes European cities more interesting. It is increasing inequality and austerity that is making the UK in particular less attractive.
    Yes, I hear that a lot from the good people of Malmo

    “All this diversity means our lives are more interesting”
    I've spent the weekend with familywho have just moved from London to Cumberland - one of the biggest benefits to doing so is 'feeling of safety, especially for women'. Even for the pretty well-off, London is an increasingly unattractive place to bring up a family.
    And yet women still vote left. They vote to make their cities less safe for women. It is mind boggling - tho beginning to change
    14 years of right wing government has seen huge cuts to police funding, numbers, physical resources.
    The first 5 years of it, the worst five years, they were aided and abetted by the Lib Dems

    Worth remembering

    What % of GDP is Labour allocating to overseas aid now?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,146
    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    Unlikely given Diego Maradona is dead
    And Trump, MTG, Vance and Hegseth aren’t.
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603
    edited April 21
    IanB2 said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on

    I would argue that the increased diversity makes European cities more interesting. It is increasing inequality and austerity that is making the UK in particular less attractive.
    Yes, I hear that a lot from the good people of Malmo

    “All this diversity means our lives are more interesting”
    I've spent the weekend with familywho have just moved from London to Cumberland - one of the biggest benefits to doing so is 'feeling of safety, especially for women'. Even for the pretty well-off, London is an increasingly unattractive place to bring up a family.
    And yet women still vote left. They vote to make their cities less safe for women. It is mind boggling - tho beginning to change
    14 years of right wing government has seen huge cuts to police funding, numbers, physical resources.
    The first 5 years of it, the worst five years, they were aided and abetted by the Lib Dems

    Worth remembering

    Ameliorated, is the truth of it.
    I love revisionism.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,467
    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    I've lived in London for most of my life since 1978. Haven't looked at the stats but I'd say it did use to be dirtier and more dangerous.
    Does the 1978 qualification suggest that you are in fact a vampire? What were you up to in the 15th century?

  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,104
    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603
    boulay said:

    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    Unlikely given Diego Maradona is dead
    And Trump, MTG, Vance and Hegseth aren’t.
    Clearly not, unless they’ve gone in the night and have yet to be discovered.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,789
    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,431
    What Europeans think of Americans and this predates Trump 2. Could be funnier but interesting.....

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V16RkvkX4kQ
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on

    I would argue that the increased diversity makes European cities more interesting. It is increasing inequality and austerity that is making the UK in particular less attractive.
    Yes, I hear that a lot from the good people of Malmo

    “All this diversity means our lives are more interesting”
    I've spent the weekend with familywho have just moved from London to Cumberland - one of the biggest benefits to doing so is 'feeling of safety, especially for women'. Even for the pretty well-off, London is an increasingly unattractive place to bring up a family.
    And yet women still vote left. They vote to make their cities less safe for women. It is mind boggling - tho beginning to change
    14 years of right wing government has seen huge cuts to police funding, numbers, physical resources.
    The first 5 years of it, the worst five years, they were aided and abetted by the Lib Dems

    Worth remembering

    What % of GDP is Labour allocating to overseas aid now?
    I wouldn’t know. Not something that I care a great deal about.

    You can try google to find out.
  • DM_AndyDM_Andy Posts: 1,198
    nico67 said:

    Given Pope Francis has appointed the majority that will decide the next Pope it’s more likely to be someone a bit more progressive like Tagle.

    The 2013 Conclave was 48 cardinals appointed by JPII, 67 by Benedict and they still elected a Pope more progressive than either.

    This would be completely left-field but I would like Timothy Radcliffe to be elected Pope, of course they would have to make him a Bishop first but non-Bishops have been elected before.

  • DopermeanDopermean Posts: 926
    Taz said:

    IanB2 said:

    Taz said:

    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Cookie said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on

    I would argue that the increased diversity makes European cities more interesting. It is increasing inequality and austerity that is making the UK in particular less attractive.
    Yes, I hear that a lot from the good people of Malmo

    “All this diversity means our lives are more interesting”
    I've spent the weekend with familywho have just moved from London to Cumberland - one of the biggest benefits to doing so is 'feeling of safety, especially for women'. Even for the pretty well-off, London is an increasingly unattractive place to bring up a family.
    And yet women still vote left. They vote to make their cities less safe for women. It is mind boggling - tho beginning to change
    14 years of right wing government has seen huge cuts to police funding, numbers, physical resources.
    The first 5 years of it, the worst five years, they were aided and abetted by the Lib Dems

    Worth remembering

    Ameliorated, is the truth of it.
    I love revisionism.
    The cuts to the court system have been some of the most damaging, self-defeating and utterly pointless in terms of the alleged saving.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,777
    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    I've lived in London for most of my life since 1978. Haven't looked at the stats but I'd say it did use to be dirtier and more dangerous.
    I lived in London throughout the 1980s. I reckon it was a bit edgier than now. The panics then were about a) mugging, and b) theft from, and sometimes of, cars, both of which were fairly common. Both of these have, I think, declined and, along with the decline in random fights between drunken lads, I suspect London is significantly safer now.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330
    Burnley promoted!
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,623
    Ugh, Dirty Leeds have been promoted to the Premier League.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330
    DM_Andy said:

    nico67 said:

    Given Pope Francis has appointed the majority that will decide the next Pope it’s more likely to be someone a bit more progressive like Tagle.

    The 2013 Conclave was 48 cardinals appointed by JPII, 67 by Benedict and they still elected a Pope more progressive than either.

    This would be completely left-field but I would like Timothy Radcliffe to be elected Pope, of course they would have to make him a Bishop first but non-Bishops have been elected before.

    The guy from White Lotus? That would be quite a redemption arc.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,722
    Ratters said:

    As someone who actually lives and works in London proper (a different part for each) with a wife and young children to provide broader perspective, I can say I think London remains brilliant and there has been no increase in the fear of crime or other issues as compared to 10 or 20 years ago. If anything, the areas I would say it's got better.

    Now I only spend 50 weeks of the year here and speak to friends and colleagues from across London daily, so my experience is nothing on travel journalists who spend five or ten weeks in Camden and the rest on twitter, but just to provide some alternative viewpoints.

    Oh, what do they know of England, that only England know
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,301

    nico67 said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    I hope the vile woman ends up in hell .
    Too good for her.
    Otoh her entry into hell would make it considerably worse. Tough on the other sinners of course.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,483
    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump repeatedly threatening to take control of interest rates might be touching the markets ever so slightly.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,789
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,483
    Tesla down 7%.


    LOL

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330
    edited April 21

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    I'm not talking about now. I'm talking about your claims about the caste system in India.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 24,246

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    I think it will be as much about this...

    "At a time when more crime is being reported and recorded, less is being done. Charge rates have plummeted from 16 per cent in 2015 to 6 per cent today, and the fall is even more drastic for the most commonly reported crimes. Back in 2015, a quarter of public fear, alarm or distress reports — which includes threats, abuse or harassment, either verbal or physical — led to someone being charged; now it is a mere 3 per cent. Crime may be falling, but more of us than ever before are reporting it and getting nothing more than a reference number."

    You are a victim of crime, you tell your friends and family, nought gets done, the perception quickly the police have lost control. And it isn't actually without merit, many forms of "shitty" crime against individuals e.g. phone snacking, car theft, etc, now nothing will ever come of it.
    People didnt generally report getting in a punch up in the local boozer over a spilt pint to the police in the 80s or 90s either. Things are better now. Social media makes them feel worse.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,336
    Ha.

    The Getty snapper who took this will be on his way to El Salvador before the day's out.


    https://bsky.app/profile/generalboles.bsky.social/post/3lndiphmluk2i

  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,294
    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump undermining the independence of the Fed.
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,922

    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump repeatedly threatening to take control of interest rates might be touching the markets ever so slightly.
    The mind boggles as to what he'd do.

    Monday: 4%
    Tuesday: 2%
    Wednesday: 19%
    Thursday: -3%
    Friday: Double the Chinese rate
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,789
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    I'm not talking about now. I'm talking about your claims about the caste system in India.
    You're disputing that it has its basis in it being a multiethnic polity?
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump repeatedly threatening to take control of interest rates might be touching the markets ever so slightly.
    Yes, I know. That’s not an economic metric which would indicate the state of the US economy.

    The statement was about the markets AND the US economy. Hence my question. He’d be better off saying the markets, rather than just the Dow, were not having a good day.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,777

    Ugh, Dirty Leeds have been promoted to the Premier League.

    You meant to say, I'm sure: "Glory, glory Leeds United have been restored to their rightful place in the top division, and the celebrations start now".
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 6,269
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    flanner2 said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Random Easter Monday thought.

    I’ve not had a classic head cold for at least 6 months, possibly longer, and very few people I know have either. Are we going through a common cold drought?

    People always say when “there’s a lot of it going round at the moment” but they never comment when there’s “not a lot of it going round”.

    I don't normally get them but have had 2 in the last six months. Got over one then a few weeks later got another.
    OK, hypothesis for the day not looking particularly robust so far.

    I’m currently at Britain’s poshest railway terminus. It’s a ridiculous place, as if built by a film studio for a costume drama (but with a Burger King and a Pret).

    There is an entire hut, occupying what used to be the tourist info booth, decorated in olde English wallpaper and dedicated to suckering rich tourists into visiting Bicester village. And station announcements in Mandarin and Arabic.
    St Pancras DOES NOT have a Burger King!
    Presumably, the OP is talking about Marylebone.
    Where the ONLY announcements in Arabic and Mandarin are for departures to Oxford via Bicester Village: most Marylebone departures go elsewhere.

    PS Who knows what the Mandarin is for Oxford and why?
    Marylebone is rubbish.

    Only 6 mainline platforms, none of which are electrified, and served by only one tube line.
    It’s posh though. The poshest.
    Don't be ridiculous!

    Ever been to St Pancras?

    St Pancras has a Hamley's, a Carluccio's, a Searcy's, and a Fortnum & Mason.
    St Pancras is way too big and garish to be posh. It’s a Westfield idea of posh. And it has that awful statue.
    Marylebone has a Burger King, FFS!

    And Sir John Betjeman's statue is NOT awful!

    Not Betjeman, the giant snogging lovers under the pink Tracy Emin banner.
    Yep, you've never been to St Pancras. The supposed lovers are not snogging, they're actually looking at their mobiles instead of each other.
    I travel through the shithole regularly. The last time I had to go to the desultory domestic platform at the end that takes you to the glamour spots of the East Midlands.
    See, you can catch the Eurostar to Paris, Amsterdam et al. from St Pancras, but you can't from Marylebone.
    Though on Marylebone High St there is a brilliantly quirky bookshop with the books arranged by geography Daunts is one of my favourite places in London.

    I also finished my stag night in Marylebone Police Station. What japes!
    Last year in Spain walking the Camino, I got stopped by a Spaniard who recognised my Daunt Books shopping bag from his time in London
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 24,246

    Tesla down 7%.


    LOL

    If they fall another 70% they might just be worth a recovery buy, assuming they can get some new leadership.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,984
    edited April 21
    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 5,586
    IanB2 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Just to check I have the timeline right:

    Pope in good health meets with JD Vance.
    Pope dies.

    The Liz Truss magic touch?
    Do we know what Trump and Meloni were plotting last week?
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    Ugh, Dirty Leeds have been promoted to the Premier League.

    So once we have a play off winner we know the three teams that will be relegated next year from the premiership.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,623
    Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs chair Sen. Ron Johnson says that 9/11 was a "controlled demolition" and there has been a "cover up" of massive amounts of evidence, many "questions" need to be answered:

    https://x.com/IsaacDovere/status/1914374840615682380
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603
    Ratters said:

    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump undermining the independence of the Fed.
    Which is not an economic metric which would indicate the health of the US economy. Try reading the question before answering.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 54,172
    Leon said:

    Ratters said:

    As someone who actually lives and works in London proper (a different part for each) with a wife and young children to provide broader perspective, I can say I think London remains brilliant and there has been no increase in the fear of crime or other issues as compared to 10 or 20 years ago. If anything, the areas I would say it's got better.

    Now I only spend 50 weeks of the year here and speak to friends and colleagues from across London daily, so my experience is nothing on travel journalists who spend five or ten weeks in Camden and the rest on twitter, but just to provide some alternative viewpoints.

    Oh, what do they know of England, that only England know
    England?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,190
    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    Yes it was only a matter of time before someone went full Ian Paisley.
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    Tesla down 7%.


    LOL

    If they fall another 70% they might just be worth a recovery buy, assuming they can get some new leadership.
    Still up 58% in the last 12 months and 365% in the last 5 years.

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,335
    edited April 21
    HYUFD said:

    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    He's right, though. Millions killed in religious wars; women and minorities repressed; and countless people hurt by the strictures of a bunch of men who craved power over humanity.

    And doing some good does not erase wrongs: Jimmy Saville did raise some money for charity, but that does not condone any of the other evil he did okay.

    And your very wording: that it needs to be destroyed at all costs - is telling. What 'costs' would you go to 'defeat' the word-salad of things you evidently hate?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,416
    edited April 21

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    I think it will be as much about this...

    "At a time when more crime is being reported and recorded, less is being done. Charge rates have plummeted from 16 per cent in 2015 to 6 per cent today, and the fall is even more drastic for the most commonly reported crimes. Back in 2015, a quarter of public fear, alarm or distress reports — which includes threats, abuse or harassment, either verbal or physical — led to someone being charged; now it is a mere 3 per cent. Crime may be falling, but more of us than ever before are reporting it and getting nothing more than a reference number."

    You are a victim of crime, you tell your friends and family, nought gets done, the perception quickly the police have lost control. And it isn't actually without merit, many forms of "shitty" crime against individuals e.g. phone snacking, car theft, etc, now nothing will ever come of it.
    People didnt generally report getting in a punch up in the local boozer over a spilt pint to the police in the 80s or 90s either. Things are better now. Social media makes them feel worse.
    I don't think it is (just) social media. The stats show the police are now incredibly poor at solving these low level crimes and also given up on lots of things like tagging. Particularly those real lived experiences of being a victim of crime and just being told here is a crime number and that it is, leads to very negative reporting among friends and family not just I saw it on tw@tter.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 45,335
    I wonder if anyone on Craggy Island will be using insider knowledge on the workings of the church to make a bet using the money that is just resting in his bank account?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,627
    .
    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    Plonker.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,623
    Taz said:

    Ratters said:

    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump undermining the independence of the Fed.
    Which is not an economic metric which would indicate the health of the US economy. Try reading the question before answering.
    At work and in the wider industry independence of central banks (as well as a strong and independent judiciary) are metrics which determine economic investment decisions.

    I pointed out last week all the signs were pointing downwards when it comes to sentiment.

    The next trigger point is when the economic stats are blatantly manipulated to show Trump in a good light.

    Not in front of my work machines now but earlier I saw the dollar cratering against all major currencies.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,190
    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    Not much of a Protestant are you?

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,627

    Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs chair Sen. Ron Johnson says that 9/11 was a "controlled demolition" and there has been a "cover up" of massive amounts of evidence, many "questions" need to be answered:

    https://x.com/IsaacDovere/status/1914374840615682380

    MAGA have been overdosing on the crazy powder this weekend.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 54,172

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    They were talking about such things in medieval times, in England. The villeins were villainously demanding ever more money. And running off to towns to get jobs that weren't properly tied to the land. The wretches.

    See all the attempts at wage fixing, sumptuary laws to prevent the lower orders assuming the expensive ways of their betters....
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    HYUFD said:

    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    He's right, though. Millions killed in religious wars; women and minorities repressed; and countless people hurt by the strictures of a bunch of men who craved power over humanity.

    And doing some good does not erase wrongs: Jimmy Saville did raise some money for charity, but that does not condone any of the other evil he did okay.

    And your very wording: that it needs to be destroyed at all costs - is telling. What 'costs' would you go to 'defeat' the word-salad of things you evidently hate?
    Isn’t the theory Savile did all the philanthropy to make up for his noncing ?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,512
    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 51,190
    Taz said:

    Tesla down 7%.


    LOL

    If they fall another 70% they might just be worth a recovery buy, assuming they can get some new leadership.
    Still up 58% in the last 12 months and 365% in the last 5 years.

    So a long way further to fall...
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,330

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    I'm not talking about now. I'm talking about your claims about the caste system in India.
    You're disputing that it has its basis in it being a multiethnic polity?
    I'm disputing "It was a unified state thousands of years ago". The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,777
    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    I always thought IanB2 was a nice liberal chap with a dog, so am surprised to learn that he's a woke leftie secular atheist who must be defeated before he destroys western civilisation.
    God knows what you'd make of a proper leftie socialist like me.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,416
    edited April 21

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    With secret service detail protecting her....

    In my experience, there is a section of American society are still seem to like to carry a lot of cash on them. e.g. Tiffanys sells a range of high end money clips. I always find it very odd.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,085
    edited April 21
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    Yes it was only a matter of time before someone went full Ian Paisley.
    Foxy said:

    Nigelb said:

    MAGA already at it online: demanding a pro-Trump pope.

    Today there were major shifts in global leaderships.

    Evil is being defeated by the hand of God.

    https://x.com/mtgreenee/status/1914329322376356347
    Yes it was only a matter of time before someone went full Ian Paisley.
    I just can’t put into words my loathing of this woman .
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,526
    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    Not much of a Protestant are you?

    That's an odd line of attack.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,789

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    They were talking about such things in medieval times, in England. The villeins were villainously demanding ever more money. And running off to towns to get jobs that weren't properly tied to the land. The wretches.

    See all the attempts at wage fixing, sumptuary laws to prevent the lower orders assuming the expensive ways of their betters....
    It was the great achievement of the modern liberal state to achieve a degree of social homogeneity that transcended such attitudes. This is now being thrown away in a mad rush to promote diversity.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,984
    Foxy said:

    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    Not much of a Protestant are you?

    It is a Catholic but Reformed church. In the culture wars we are united against a common enemy, the militant atheist secular woke left
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 5,085

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    Another who deserves to rot in hell .
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 54,172

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    I think it will be as much about this...

    "At a time when more crime is being reported and recorded, less is being done. Charge rates have plummeted from 16 per cent in 2015 to 6 per cent today, and the fall is even more drastic for the most commonly reported crimes. Back in 2015, a quarter of public fear, alarm or distress reports — which includes threats, abuse or harassment, either verbal or physical — led to someone being charged; now it is a mere 3 per cent. Crime may be falling, but more of us than ever before are reporting it and getting nothing more than a reference number."

    You are a victim of crime, you tell your friends and family, nought gets done, the perception quickly the police have lost control. And it isn't actually without merit, many forms of "shitty" crime against individuals e.g. phone snacking, car theft, etc, now nothing will ever come of it.
    People didnt generally report getting in a punch up in the local boozer over a spilt pint to the police in the 80s or 90s either. Things are better now. Social media makes them feel worse.
    The other thing is publicly expressed attitudes like this -

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/blue-note-jazz-soho-st-martins-hotel-licensing-met-police-b1210679.html

    "Officers... said jazz fans “leaving the venue late at night” may become a target for illegal taxis who “prey on vulnerable, intoxicated lone females”, as well being targeted for mobile phone snatches."

    The Met works quite hard to give the impression that they represent the Legally Challenged Community more than the Law Abiding Community.

  • boulayboulay Posts: 6,146

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    Can’t wait for the day she meets an angry XL Bully down a dark alleyway and finds her gun was in the handbag that was pinched.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,984

    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    I always thought IanB2 was a nice liberal chap with a dog, so am surprised to learn that he's a woke leftie secular atheist who must be defeated before he destroys western civilisation.
    God knows what you'd make of a proper leftie socialist like me.
    I would prefer a Catholic socialist like John McDonnell to either of you
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,467

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    flanner2 said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Random Easter Monday thought.

    I’ve not had a classic head cold for at least 6 months, possibly longer, and very few people I know have either. Are we going through a common cold drought?

    People always say when “there’s a lot of it going round at the moment” but they never comment when there’s “not a lot of it going round”.

    I don't normally get them but have had 2 in the last six months. Got over one then a few weeks later got another.
    OK, hypothesis for the day not looking particularly robust so far.

    I’m currently at Britain’s poshest railway terminus. It’s a ridiculous place, as if built by a film studio for a costume drama (but with a Burger King and a Pret).

    There is an entire hut, occupying what used to be the tourist info booth, decorated in olde English wallpaper and dedicated to suckering rich tourists into visiting Bicester village. And station announcements in Mandarin and Arabic.
    St Pancras DOES NOT have a Burger King!
    Presumably, the OP is talking about Marylebone.
    Where the ONLY announcements in Arabic and Mandarin are for departures to Oxford via Bicester Village: most Marylebone departures go elsewhere.

    PS Who knows what the Mandarin is for Oxford and why?
    Marylebone is rubbish.

    Only 6 mainline platforms, none of which are electrified, and served by only one tube line.
    It’s posh though. The poshest.
    Don't be ridiculous!

    Ever been to St Pancras?

    St Pancras has a Hamley's, a Carluccio's, a Searcy's, and a Fortnum & Mason.
    St Pancras is way too big and garish to be posh. It’s a Westfield idea of posh. And it has that awful statue.
    Marylebone has a Burger King, FFS!

    And Sir John Betjeman's statue is NOT awful!

    Not Betjeman, the giant snogging lovers under the pink Tracy Emin banner.
    Yep, you've never been to St Pancras. The supposed lovers are not snogging, they're actually looking at their mobiles instead of each other.
    I travel through the shithole regularly. The last time I had to go to the desultory domestic platform at the end that takes you to the glamour spots of the East Midlands.
    See, you can catch the Eurostar to Paris, Amsterdam et al. from St Pancras, but you can't from Marylebone.
    Though on Marylebone High St there is a brilliantly quirky bookshop with the books arranged by geography Daunts is one of my favourite places in London.

    I also finished my stag night in Marylebone Police Station. What japes!
    Last year in Spain walking the Camino, I got stopped by a Spaniard who recognised my Daunt Books shopping bag from his time in London
    Daunt books is now part of Waterstones. I think the CEO of Waterstones is a Daunt in fact. The Marylebone HS shop has lost some charm in my view. Greater damage has been done by the group to what was Dillons in Bloomsbury. I don't know who owns Foyles now, but they've spread out and the charm of the Charing Cross Road branch has gone. Admittedly that charm used consist of saleswomen that regarded their books as far too good to be sold to the likes of me, and when you decided to purchase one you had to get a slip, take it and queue at the payments section and then return upstairs where they very reluctantly finally handed over the book you had bought.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,623

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    See, if she went cashless, she wouldn't have lost this money.
  • DougSealDougSeal Posts: 12,745
    Musk wants to leave politics because he’s tired of ‘attacks’ from the left, report says

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/elon-musk-donald-trump-doge-b2736753.html
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,777
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    I always thought IanB2 was a nice liberal chap with a dog, so am surprised to learn that he's a woke leftie secular atheist who must be defeated before he destroys western civilisation.
    God knows what you'd make of a proper leftie socialist like me.
    I would prefer a Catholic socialist like John McDonnell to either of you
    McDonnell for Pope!
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,984

    HYUFD said:

    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    He's right, though. Millions killed in religious wars; women and minorities repressed; and countless people hurt by the strictures of a bunch of men who craved power over humanity.

    And doing some good does not erase wrongs: Jimmy Saville did raise some money for charity, but that does not condone any of the other evil he did okay.

    And your very wording: that it needs to be destroyed at all costs - is telling. What 'costs' would you go to 'defeat' the word-salad of things you evidently hate?
    Religious wars were just as much products of political rivalry. Support for the traditional family and gender roles and protection of the unborn child is nothing to be ashamed of.

    And if you think the Catholics repressed women and minorities wait until militant Islam takes over
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    Nigelb said:

    This is my favourite Pope story from today.

    Pope Francis said during an interview one time that he fell asleep during prayer. The interviewer asked him whether that was allowed, and he said that fathers always love it when their children fall asleep in their arms...
    https://x.com/jarvis_best/status/1914302332503986181

    I liked this one too.

    there's a lot to admire about Pope Francis but I loved that, when he said he hoped that hell was empty, he had to rush and interject "this isn't dogma or anything" because I'm pretty sure he was speaking off the cuff from the heart and suddenly remembered oh crap, I'm the Pope

    https://x.com/PinstripeBungle/status/1914242938726383930
    Surely hell is a room with Radiohead playing and pineapple,pizza being served.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 24,246

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    With secret service detail protecting her....

    In my experience, there is a section of American society are still seem to like to carry a lot of cash on them. e.g. Tiffanys sells a range of high end money clips. I always find it very odd.
    Tipping!
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    See, if she went cashless, she wouldn't have lost this money.
    Maybe the anti cash brigade like Anabobazina has a point !
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 54,172
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimS said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    London, from my vantage point, hasn’t even been in relative decline let alone absolute decline. It’s thriving, rich, and a sought after destination for international capital. Compare that with its nadir in the 70s and 80s when outmigration took its population down by almost a third.

    The absolute decline is in left behind post-industrial regions. We all know that. And those regions are predominantly white or at most bi-cultural, because they are not attractive to incomers. So the idea that multiculturalism is bringing down the West is somewhat belied by the stats.
    It's an idea primarily fuelled by racism not economics.
    Neither is it based on real crime statistics. London was quite a dangerous place when I lived there in the Eighties.

    https://www.thetimes.com/uk/article/crime-justice-commission-uk-rates-rise-police-38g7w5gw8

    People gullible to believe Social Media are stoking the opposite perception.
    Kings Cross was brutally criminal in the 90s.

    The process by which it was er… cleaned up was pretty much ethnic cleansing, though
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,603
    For the 80% here who incessantly post obsessively about Trump, 9PM on C4 Thursday.

    Tune in for more.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 83,416
    edited April 21

    Has this been mentioned yet:

    DHS confirms Kristi Noem's bag with $3,000 in cash stolen from D.C. restaurant

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elthVI-WvnY

    The $3k was for unspecified 'gifts and dinners'.

    With secret service detail protecting her....

    In my experience, there is a section of American society are still seem to like to carry a lot of cash on them. e.g. Tiffanys sells a range of high end money clips. I always find it very odd.
    Tipping!
    That is definitely part of it. If you rich you will be tipping a huge amount every day e.g. you will only valet park your car wihereever you go.

    When Deepwater Horizon blew up I took a punt and booked to stay at an exclusive resort on the Gulf of Mexico America. I got an amazing deal on the suite that should have been $1000s per night for a few $100.

    What I didn't factor in was the amount I would be spending on tipping. Every time I went out in my car I had to tip $10 for the valet to get my car, then another $10 to park it when I came back, now I sure they expect $20-30 if not more. You couldn't self park. Then I had to pay to valet my car at the restaurant etc etc etc.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,650

    Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs chair Sen. Ron Johnson says that 9/11 was a "controlled demolition" and there has been a "cover up" of massive amounts of evidence, many "questions" need to be answered:

    https://x.com/IsaacDovere/status/1914374840615682380

    The conspiracy theorists can’t help themselves. It’s like a drug. One is never enough. Once you’ve bought into the first, maybe around Trump really winning in 2020, the slide to another and another seems to follow. We see it with people here on PB, but the conspiracy theorists have been promoted to senior positions of power in the US. This is what we’ll get if Reform UK come to power.
  • RattersRatters Posts: 1,294
    Taz said:

    Ratters said:

    Taz said:

    I see the Dow Jones and the US economy is doing wonderful today…

    What economic metrics have been released then?
    Trump undermining the independence of the Fed.
    Which is not an economic metric which would indicate the health of the US economy. Try reading the question before answering.
    Ask better questions then

    Economic metrics are currently irrelevant as there's a month + lag in data and the mist destructive economic policies have come out in the last weeks and days. The Fed attack is an example of this.

    Markets will trade off economic data once it's relevant again.
  • maxhmaxh Posts: 1,581
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:



    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    I always thought IanB2 was a nice liberal chap with a dog, so am surprised to learn that he's a woke leftie secular atheist who must be defeated before he destroys western civilisation.
    God knows what you'd make of a proper leftie socialist like me.
    I would prefer a Catholic socialist like John McDonnell to either of you
    Skipping back a few comments HY, is this not an odd defence of the Catholic church?

    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church.

    My reading of this is that the Catholic church historically accrued such power that it could delimit acceptable cultural expression (art), institute forms of slavery (to build cathedrals) and stymie free expression (at universities).

    (Apologies for the Vance-like crassness of the timing of my comment for anyone mourning the Pope).
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 62,248

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    They were talking about such things in medieval times, in England. The villeins were villainously demanding ever more money. And running off to towns to get jobs that weren't properly tied to the land. The wretches.

    See all the attempts at wage fixing, sumptuary laws to prevent the lower orders assuming the expensive ways of their betters....
    It was the great achievement of the modern liberal state to achieve a degree of social homogeneity that transcended such attitudes. This is now being thrown away in a mad rush to promote diversity.
    You can't say anything other than you want to celebrate diversity if you want to have a career. To do otherwise is to risk being labelled a racist.

    Whilst some who don't like it undoubtedly are, and it was originally well-intended - to promote tolerance and the variety other people can bring - it's become dogmatic and totally unchecked, which is now causing social fragmentation and atomisation.

    The risk is that countries end up no longer hanging together at all - because there has to be some level of uniformity as well as diversity, otherwise there is no identity.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 54,172
    Taz said:

    Nigelb said:

    This is my favourite Pope story from today.

    Pope Francis said during an interview one time that he fell asleep during prayer. The interviewer asked him whether that was allowed, and he said that fathers always love it when their children fall asleep in their arms...
    https://x.com/jarvis_best/status/1914302332503986181

    I liked this one too.

    there's a lot to admire about Pope Francis but I loved that, when he said he hoped that hell was empty, he had to rush and interject "this isn't dogma or anything" because I'm pretty sure he was speaking off the cuff from the heart and suddenly remembered oh crap, I'm the Pope

    https://x.com/PinstripeBungle/status/1914242938726383930
    Surely hell is a room with Radiohead playing and pineapple,pizza being served.
    That's the PB Hell. You also get to spend eternity with all the worst people called Piers (Morgan, Corbyn), the computer allows you to only read Con Home comments and write in Python.

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,623
    DougSeal said:

    Musk wants to leave politics because he’s tired of ‘attacks’ from the left, report says

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/elon-musk-donald-trump-doge-b2736753.html

    What a snowflake.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,650

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    They were talking about such things in medieval times, in England. The villeins were villainously demanding ever more money. And running off to towns to get jobs that weren't properly tied to the land. The wretches.

    See all the attempts at wage fixing, sumptuary laws to prevent the lower orders assuming the expensive ways of their betters....
    It was the great achievement of the modern liberal state to achieve a degree of social homogeneity that transcended such attitudes. This is now being thrown away in a mad rush to promote diversity.
    I think it’s being thrown away in a mad rush to promote MAGA and imitators.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,627
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    The main thing I’ve noticed about Paris since I first visited 25 years ago is that ordinary people (and the kinds of services that support them), have been squeezed out of the inner arrondisements.

    Like most global cities, it has steadily become a pastiche of itself.

    This is my takeaway: I don't think countries like France or the UK are broken, but they are becoming increasingly difficult for an ordinary person to live a pleasant live within.

    A family of four don't get much change out of £100 now for a trip to a destination for a day out. And a takeaway? Probably £50.

    So many people can't begin to afford that.
    Western Europe is in steep relative decline. Of course it is declining from a very high place - surely the nicest place to live these last decades - nonetheless: declining

    The combo of mass migration, Islamification, globalisation, multiculturalism, etc etc, has been catastrophic for so many cities, from Sweden to Britain to Germany, and on to France and Italy

    The fact I feel far safer in the large cities of Central Asia than I do in similar cities in Western Europe is tragic. Also, less litter and graffiti, and so on
    The relative decline of rich countries is inevitable and healthy. It's about other places catching up. About wealth and power (globally) being more fairly distributed. If Western Europe had pulled up the drawbridge, rejected immigration, multiculturalism, globalisation, all those things that make you shudder, the decline would likely have been steeper.
    If relative decline is healthy, and would have been faster if we had rejected immigration, multiculturalism and globalisation, then shouldn't you be in favour of rejecting them so that we get to a more equitable global distribution faster instead of cheating by stealing talented people from the rest of the world?
    Purely on economics, arguably yes. But I'm also a fan of breaking the correlation between nation states and specific ethnicities and religions etc. That's more important imo. That's the way to a big beautiful peaceful world. Utopian? Yes, but it should be the direction of travel. Elon Musk has his dreams of colonising space. I have this one. Neither of us will live to see it realised but that's not the point.
    We have a case study of what such a world would look like in the Indian subcontinent. There, national boundaries have been eliminated, but at the cost of a stifling caste system.

    There's no reason to think that pushing for the same at a global level wouldn't lead to a similar outcome, and plenty of evidence that it is already tending in that direction, with increasing talk of some jobs not being suitable for British people.
    Ummm: doesn't the caste system on the subcontinent long predate the current national borders?
    That doesn't negate the argument. It was a unified state thousands of years ago containing many different peoples.
    The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    The evidence that it's happening now is very strong. You didn't hear people prior to mass immigration talking about there being jobs that British people won't do - "Who will serve my coffee if we don't have immigrants?"
    I'm not talking about now. I'm talking about your claims about the caste system in India.
    You're disputing that it has its basis in it being a multiethnic polity?
    I'm disputing "It was a unified state thousands of years ago". The evidence for that is - at best - mixed.
    Large parts of the subcontinent were kind of unified - and then weren't, and then were again - several times over the last five thousand years.
    DNA evidence suggests that a rigidly stratified caste system came about much later.

    As with all ancient and pre-history, what the limited evidence shows is much disputed.

    William's comments, as they often do, say far more about his beliefs than anything to do with objective fact.
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 13,650
    Omnium said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    flanner2 said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Random Easter Monday thought.

    I’ve not had a classic head cold for at least 6 months, possibly longer, and very few people I know have either. Are we going through a common cold drought?

    People always say when “there’s a lot of it going round at the moment” but they never comment when there’s “not a lot of it going round”.

    I don't normally get them but have had 2 in the last six months. Got over one then a few weeks later got another.
    OK, hypothesis for the day not looking particularly robust so far.

    I’m currently at Britain’s poshest railway terminus. It’s a ridiculous place, as if built by a film studio for a costume drama (but with a Burger King and a Pret).

    There is an entire hut, occupying what used to be the tourist info booth, decorated in olde English wallpaper and dedicated to suckering rich tourists into visiting Bicester village. And station announcements in Mandarin and Arabic.
    St Pancras DOES NOT have a Burger King!
    Presumably, the OP is talking about Marylebone.
    Where the ONLY announcements in Arabic and Mandarin are for departures to Oxford via Bicester Village: most Marylebone departures go elsewhere.

    PS Who knows what the Mandarin is for Oxford and why?
    Marylebone is rubbish.

    Only 6 mainline platforms, none of which are electrified, and served by only one tube line.
    It’s posh though. The poshest.
    Don't be ridiculous!

    Ever been to St Pancras?

    St Pancras has a Hamley's, a Carluccio's, a Searcy's, and a Fortnum & Mason.
    St Pancras is way too big and garish to be posh. It’s a Westfield idea of posh. And it has that awful statue.
    Marylebone has a Burger King, FFS!

    And Sir John Betjeman's statue is NOT awful!

    Not Betjeman, the giant snogging lovers under the pink Tracy Emin banner.
    Yep, you've never been to St Pancras. The supposed lovers are not snogging, they're actually looking at their mobiles instead of each other.
    I travel through the shithole regularly. The last time I had to go to the desultory domestic platform at the end that takes you to the glamour spots of the East Midlands.
    See, you can catch the Eurostar to Paris, Amsterdam et al. from St Pancras, but you can't from Marylebone.
    Though on Marylebone High St there is a brilliantly quirky bookshop with the books arranged by geography Daunts is one of my favourite places in London.

    I also finished my stag night in Marylebone Police Station. What japes!
    Last year in Spain walking the Camino, I got stopped by a Spaniard who recognised my Daunt Books shopping bag from his time in London
    Daunt books is now part of Waterstones. I think the CEO of Waterstones is a Daunt in fact. The Marylebone HS shop has lost some charm in my view. Greater damage has been done by the group to what was Dillons in Bloomsbury. I don't know who owns Foyles now, but they've spread out and the charm of the Charing Cross Road branch has gone. Admittedly that charm used consist of saleswomen that regarded their books as far too good to be sold to the likes of me, and when you decided to purchase one you had to get a slip, take it and queue at the payments section and then return upstairs where they very reluctantly finally handed over the book you had bought.
    That’s if you even managed to find the book you wanted. History books would be shelved by author, rather than period, but then you’d probably find poetry books shelved by period or alphabetically by the name of the poet’s muse.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,627
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    IanB2 said:

    Watching Albanese and Macron eulogising the Pope, Starmer's evil, heretical, godless silence is deafening!

    For those who commiserate, my heart goes out to them on the death of the Pope.
    As an individual human, just perhaps.

    But there’s no institution on the planet that has inflicted more war and death and misery and abuse upon humanity than the Catholic Church.
    Much of our greatest art, our oldest cathedrals, many ancient universities, schools and hospitals have their origins in the Catholic Church. As do charities, orphanages, food banks, homeless shelters etc.

    Your comment is symptomatic of why militant woke leftist secular atheists must be defeated at all costs or western civilisation will be destroyed. You hate our culture, our heritage, the traditional family you name it
    He's right, though. Millions killed in religious wars; women and minorities repressed; and countless people hurt by the strictures of a bunch of men who craved power over humanity.

    And doing some good does not erase wrongs: Jimmy Saville did raise some money for charity, but that does not condone any of the other evil he did okay.

    And your very wording: that it needs to be destroyed at all costs - is telling. What 'costs' would you go to 'defeat' the word-salad of things you evidently hate?
    Religious wars were just as much products of political rivalry. Support for the traditional family and gender roles and protection of the unborn child is nothing to be ashamed of.

    And if you think the Catholics repressed women and minorities wait until militant Islam takes over
    You're indulging in dystopian fantasy.
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