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A closer look at the local elections – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,700
edited April 21 in General
imageA closer look at the local elections – politicalbetting.com

The second of my threads on the forthcoming local elections looks at two southern coastal councils which should be the epitome of rock-solid Conservative territory but this year will be representative of that party’s current electoral strength or frailty.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,143
    ...
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,793
    Thanks @stodge, another 2 to watch out for.

    I note your final paragraph. Are Reform standing many candidates here?

    With the opposition parties in Fareham has there been some sort of tacit divviying up of seats between them, or are they up against each other?


  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,336
    Scott_xP said:

    ...

    Missed a trick. The computer should have been showing an Excel document.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,793
    ydoethur said:

    Scott_xP said:

    ...

    Missed a trick. The computer should have been showing an Excel document.
    I though this rather good:

    "Pleased to see you looking so well your majesty. We need to discuss your return to work."

    https://twitter.com/DachshundColin/status/1781428013143302190?t=zBFs-GDjuquklFmMyYtZ6Q&s=19
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,563
    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,727
    Foxy said:

    Thanks @stodge, another 2 to watch out for.

    I note your final paragraph. Are Reform standing many candidates here?

    With the opposition parties in Fareham has there been some sort of tacit divviying up of seats between them, or are they up against each other?


    I live in Fareham.
    There isn't really any way that the seats can be divvied up. There's only one seat, Fareham South, that Labour are in a significantly better position than the LibDems.
    See the 2022 results here https://moderngov.fareham.gov.uk/mgElectionAreaResults.aspx?ID=103&RPID=16621989
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,793

    Foxy said:

    Thanks @stodge, another 2 to watch out for.

    I note your final paragraph. Are Reform standing many candidates here?

    With the opposition parties in Fareham has there been some sort of tacit divviying up of seats between them, or are they up against each other?


    I live in Fareham.
    There isn't really any way that the seats can be divvied up. There's only one seat, Fareham South, that Labour are in a significantly better position than the LibDems.
    See the 2022 results here https://moderngov.fareham.gov.uk/mgElectionAreaResults.aspx?ID=103&RPID=16621989
    I was thinking more the council rather than Westminster elections, but point taken.
  • Options
    SandraMcSandraMc Posts: 603
    I live in the Havant Council area. There are a lot of sailors in my ward and sewage spills have been a huge concern. The Greens won a seat last time and are putting up three this. The few local election posters I have seen have been for the Greens.

    In a poll on the local Nextdoor social network, Reform came top beating the Conservatives but Nextdoor tends to attract the more opinionated types. It will be interesting to see if Reform achieve anything other than splitting the Conservative vote.
  • Options
    DougSealDougSeal Posts: 11,219
    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,549

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    Isn't that the paradox of the Deputy Prime Minister? The title makes it sound like they're next in line, but they often aren't in reality .See John Prescott, Nick Clegg, Oliver Dowden.

    Weren't there regular announcements during Blair's holidays that no, John Prescott wasn't running the country?
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,727
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Thanks @stodge, another 2 to watch out for.

    I note your final paragraph. Are Reform standing many candidates here?

    With the opposition parties in Fareham has there been some sort of tacit divviying up of seats between them, or are they up against each other?


    I live in Fareham.
    There isn't really any way that the seats can be divvied up. There's only one seat, Fareham South, that Labour are in a significantly better position than the LibDems.
    See the 2022 results here https://moderngov.fareham.gov.uk/mgElectionAreaResults.aspx?ID=103&RPID=16621989
    I was thinking more the council rather than Westminster elections, but point taken.
    Those are my musings on the Council.
    I've looked at the candidates now and can only see two council seats where Reform is standing, Stubbington and Hill Head. These are usually Tory vs LibDems fights, so they may help the LibDems here.
    https://www.fareham.gov.uk/pdf/about_the_council/elections/StatementofPersonsNominatedFBCMay24.pdf
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,563

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    Isn't that the paradox of the Deputy Prime Minister? The title makes it sound like they're next in line, but they often aren't in reality .See John Prescott, Nick Clegg, Oliver Dowden.

    Weren't there regular announcements during Blair's holidays that no, John Prescott wasn't running the country?
    There's a slight difference, if Sir Keir Starmer fell under a bus Rayner would automatically become acting leader and very likely PM until a new leadership election had concluded.
  • Options
    FishingFishing Posts: 4,561
    Foxy said:

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    You are not paranoid when people are really out to get you!

    Rayner is a bright spot in a sea of Labour grey suits, not just her dress sense, but also her outspokeness.

    Young made an interesting point about Meritocracy in this 2001 article about the phenomenon that he had named. One aspect of Meritocracy is that it denudes the working class of its brightest and best leaders. While such social mobility is good for those individuals, it leaves large sections of the population without leadership. He thinks this part of the reason for the decline of the truly working class politician. Rayner is an exception to this.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/jun/29/comment
    Rayner has the same position in Starmer's government as Prescott did in Blair's - a nasty, incompetent fool who should be kept as far away as possible from any important position, but is there as a sop to the Loony Left, and maybe so that Starmer can assuage the guilt he occasionally feels in betraying everything he once claimed to stand for.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,563
    edited April 21
    Donald Trump would be proud of this grift.

    Lib Dem’s turn to explain themselves : this appears to be a classic expenses scheme to funnel tax payer money back to political mates to provide MPs with “support services”

    All within the rules but will it pass the “smell test”


    https://twitter.com/nickdebois/status/1781931140615393754

    Lib Dem MP paid £120,000 to firm run by party officials

    Sarah Green, who represents Chesham & Amersham, claimed the money on expenses to cover services provided by Midas Training


    It is not clear from the expenses claims exactly what services the company provides the MP, but records show the payments began three months after she was elected. Since then Midas has been paid every month bar one and often numerous times a month.....

    ...The Midas Training headquarters are registered in Aylesbury. They are behind the nondescript shopfront of a small tax advisory firm at the side of a roundabout on a busy street. The logo above the door reads Taxassist Accountants and are also the registered headquarters of at least 25 other businesses, including an HR company, an immigration advisory firm and a diamond drilling business.

    Midas is a “brass plate” company — a firm lacking any meaningful connection with its place of incorporation and without any physical premises. While the opening hours on the door of Taxassist Accountants read 9am-5pm, nobody was at the premises and the lights were switched off at 10am last Friday.

    The managing director of Midas Training is Candy Piercy, who runs the company with her husband Michael. She is the vice-chairwoman of the Chesham & Amersham Lib Dems executive committee, and on the Lib Dems’ national website she is described as a “founder member” of the party.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lib-dem-mp-sarah-green-expenses-consultancy-company-jnxw3vd27
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,336

    Donald Trump would be proud of this grift.

    Lib Dem’s turn to explain themselves : this appears to be a classic expenses scheme to funnel tax payer money back to political mates to provide MPs with “support services”

    All within the rules but will it pass the “smell test”


    https://twitter.com/nickdebois/status/1781931140615393754

    Lib Dem MP paid £120,000 to firm run by party officials

    Sarah Green, who represents Chesham & Amersham, claimed the money on expenses to cover services provided by Midas Training


    It is not clear from the expenses claims exactly what services the company provides the MP, but records show the payments began three months after she was elected. Since then Midas has been paid every month bar one and often numerous times a month.....

    ...The Midas Training headquarters are registered in Aylesbury. They are behind the nondescript shopfront of a small tax advisory firm at the side of a roundabout on a busy street. The logo above the door reads Taxassist Accountants and are also the registered headquarters of at least 25 other businesses, including an HR company, an immigration advisory firm and a diamond drilling business.

    Midas is a “brass plate” company — a firm lacking any meaningful connection with its place of incorporation and without any physical premises. While the opening hours on the door of Taxassist Accountants read 9am-5pm, nobody was at the premises and the lights were switched off at 10am last Friday.

    The managing director of Midas Training is Candy Piercy, who runs the company with her husband Michael. She is the vice-chairwoman of the Chesham & Amersham Lib Dems executive committee, and on the Lib Dems’ national website she is described as a “founder member” of the party.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/lib-dem-mp-sarah-green-expenses-consultancy-company-jnxw3vd27

    High speed 2 wealth?
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,753
    edited April 21
    Good morning. FPT:
    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,549

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Thanks @stodge, another 2 to watch out for.

    I note your final paragraph. Are Reform standing many candidates here?

    With the opposition parties in Fareham has there been some sort of tacit divviying up of seats between them, or are they up against each other?


    I live in Fareham.
    There isn't really any way that the seats can be divvied up. There's only one seat, Fareham South, that Labour are in a significantly better position than the LibDems.
    See the 2022 results here https://moderngov.fareham.gov.uk/mgElectionAreaResults.aspx?ID=103&RPID=16621989
    I was thinking more the council rather than Westminster elections, but point taken.
    Those are my musings on the Council.
    I've looked at the candidates now and can only see two council seats where Reform is standing, Stubbington and Hill Head. These are usually Tory vs LibDems fights, so they may help the LibDems here.
    https://www.fareham.gov.uk/pdf/about_the_council/elections/StatementofPersonsNominatedFBCMay24.pdf
    And those are the two wards in Gosport constituency. Kind of makes sense that Reform are weak where Suella is the MP. Though they are only standing in 1/14 Gosport Borough wards.

    To complete the set, Gosport might have had the potential to be a bit of good news for the blue team. They had new boundaries in 2022, and the Lib Dem majority depends on a couple of wards where they, slightly cutely, won the second seat. Two Conservatives faced 1 Lib and 1 Lab and lent Labour second votes saw the Lib Dem candidate home in second.

    Based on that, you might think that the Conservatives were placed to nab the seats back- they won both wards and they are the sort of places that really ought to have Conservative councillors. From a distance, I suspect incumbency and the dire national situation will see the yellow peril home.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    edited April 21
    ...
    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,534
    Fishing said:

    Foxy said:

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    You are not paranoid when people are really out to get you!

    Rayner is a bright spot in a sea of Labour grey suits, not just her dress sense, but also her outspokeness.

    Young made an interesting point about Meritocracy in this 2001 article about the phenomenon that he had named. One aspect of Meritocracy is that it denudes the working class of its brightest and best leaders. While such social mobility is good for those individuals, it leaves large sections of the population without leadership. He thinks this part of the reason for the decline of the truly working class politician. Rayner is an exception to this.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/jun/29/comment
    Rayner has the same position in Starmer's government as Prescott did in Blair's - a nasty, incompetent fool who should be kept as far away as possible from any important position, but is there as a sop to the Loony Left, and maybe so that Starmer can assuage the guilt he occasionally feels in betraying everything he once claimed to stand for.
    Angela Rayner has a deep streak of unpleasantness in her, witness her comments of "Tory Scum" which is a disgusting dehumanisation of one's political opponents that can, and does, incite abuse and violence.

    She's lost some weight, wears interesting clothes, has a difficult backstory and can dance well to Old Skool music but that doesn't give her a free pass for everything else, I'm afraid. Even if @Foxy does really fancy her.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    edited April 21

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    John Rentoul. Winter election he thinks. Hope not.

    https://x.com/johnrentoul/status/1781712926581080082?s=61
  • Options
    ChrisChris Posts: 11,138
    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once.

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right.
    I think he's going to be a bit stuck there as far as politicians are concerned.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    Chris said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once.

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right.
    I think he's going to be a bit stuck there as far as politicians are concerned.
    She’s going to be deputy PM, as he points out. She is no run of the mill backbencher.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    Fishing said:

    Foxy said:

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    You are not paranoid when people are really out to get you!

    Rayner is a bright spot in a sea of Labour grey suits, not just her dress sense, but also her outspokeness.

    Young made an interesting point about Meritocracy in this 2001 article about the phenomenon that he had named. One aspect of Meritocracy is that it denudes the working class of its brightest and best leaders. While such social mobility is good for those individuals, it leaves large sections of the population without leadership. He thinks this part of the reason for the decline of the truly working class politician. Rayner is an exception to this.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/jun/29/comment
    Rayner has the same position in Starmer's government as Prescott did in Blair's - a nasty, incompetent fool who should be kept as far away as possible from any important position, but is there as a sop to the Loony Left, and maybe so that Starmer can assuage the guilt he occasionally feels in betraying everything he once claimed to stand for.
    Angela Rayner has a deep streak of unpleasantness in her, witness her comments of "Tory Scum" which is a disgusting dehumanisation of one's political opponents that can, and does, incite abuse and violence.

    She's lost some weight, wears interesting clothes, has a difficult backstory and can dance well to Old Skool music but that doesn't give her a free pass for everything else, I'm afraid. Even if @Foxy does really fancy her.
    The middle class guy fancying the bit of rough from the council estate ?
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,416
    edited April 21
    TimS said:

    Good morning. FPT:


    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
    It's this a situation where freezing-degree-hours would be the relevant metric as to how much harm would be done?
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,893
    edited April 21
    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    At the level in question, any advice could well have been verbal. More than a decade ago. And HMRC regulations have clear rules on how long one need keep personal tax. Which is not that long.

    You sound like those Home Office bureaucrats demanding to see a full run of bank accounts back to the 1980s before they will believe someone actually lived in the UK.
  • Options
    logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,727

    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    Thanks @stodge, another 2 to watch out for.

    I note your final paragraph. Are Reform standing many candidates here?

    With the opposition parties in Fareham has there been some sort of tacit divviying up of seats between them, or are they up against each other?


    I live in Fareham.
    There isn't really any way that the seats can be divvied up. There's only one seat, Fareham South, that Labour are in a significantly better position than the LibDems.
    See the 2022 results here https://moderngov.fareham.gov.uk/mgElectionAreaResults.aspx?ID=103&RPID=16621989
    I was thinking more the council rather than Westminster elections, but point taken.
    Those are my musings on the Council.
    I've looked at the candidates now and can only see two council seats where Reform is standing, Stubbington and Hill Head. These are usually Tory vs LibDems fights, so they may help the LibDems here.
    https://www.fareham.gov.uk/pdf/about_the_council/elections/StatementofPersonsNominatedFBCMay24.pdf
    And those are the two wards in Gosport constituency. Kind of makes sense that Reform are weak where Suella is the MP. Though they are only standing in 1/14 Gosport Borough wards.

    To complete the set, Gosport might have had the potential to be a bit of good news for the blue team. They had new boundaries in 2022, and the Lib Dem majority depends on a couple of wards where they, slightly cutely, won the second seat. Two Conservatives faced 1 Lib and 1 Lab and lent Labour second votes saw the Lib Dem candidate home in second.

    Based on that, you might think that the Conservatives were placed to nab the seats back- they won both wards and they are the sort of places that really ought to have Conservative councillors. From a distance, I suspect incumbency and the dire national situation will see the yellow peril home.
    Yes, I'd forgotten that the LibDems took control of Gosport council in 2022.
    LD 16
    C 10
    L 2
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,894
    Interesting thread thanks for that.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    edited April 21
    ...
    Taz said:

    Fishing said:

    Foxy said:

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    You are not paranoid when people are really out to get you!

    Rayner is a bright spot in a sea of Labour grey suits, not just her dress sense, but also her outspokeness.

    Young made an interesting point about Meritocracy in this 2001 article about the phenomenon that he had named. One aspect of Meritocracy is that it denudes the working class of its brightest and best leaders. While such social mobility is good for those individuals, it leaves large sections of the population without leadership. He thinks this part of the reason for the decline of the truly working class politician. Rayner is an exception to this.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/jun/29/comment
    Rayner has the same position in Starmer's government as Prescott did in Blair's - a nasty, incompetent fool who should be kept as far away as possible from any important position, but is there as a sop to the Loony Left, and maybe so that Starmer can assuage the guilt he occasionally feels in betraying everything he once claimed to stand for.
    Angela Rayner has a deep streak of unpleasantness in her, witness her comments of "Tory Scum" which is a disgusting dehumanisation of one's political opponents that can, and does, incite abuse and violence.

    She's lost some weight, wears interesting clothes, has a difficult backstory and can dance well to Old Skool music but that doesn't give her a free pass for everything else, I'm afraid. Even if @Foxy does really fancy her.
    The middle class guy fancying the bit of rough from the council estate ?
    A personally offensive to a fellow poster, post that was better left unposted. Same goes for Casino's last statement in the post you were foolishly responding too.

    I don't particularly like Rayner, but this whole saga strikes me as bullying. The most absurd moments have been James Daly being unable to explain what he was complaining to the police about.
  • Options
    StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 7,082
    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    All of the evidence is circumstantial.

    But it all suggests that she was primarily living at her husband’s house (a shared primary residence would also be the normal state of affairs)

    She’s not provided one piece of evidence to prove otherwise apart from her statement.

    I’m increasingly suspecting that she lives with her husband and declared the other property as her primary residence to claim the benefit of the CGT relief.

    I doubt there will be clear documentary evidence one way or the other, but it doesn’t look good for her.

  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,700
    edited April 21
    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    Is this Ebert person who I think it is. i.e., a character out of Dilbert, alongside Ratbert, Dogbert and Catbert? From a Brit perspective, one wonders whether Dilbert has a cousin from Yorkshire.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dilbert_characters

    Or is this an epoch defining thinker, journalist or academic of whom I should have heard?
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,336
    MattW said:

    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    Is this Ebert person who I think it is. i.e., a character out of Dilbert, alongside Ratbert, Dogbert and Catbert?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dilbert_characters

    Or is this an epoch defining thinker, journalist or academic of whom I should have heard?
    I was thinking it sounded unusually colloquial for Friedrich Ebert.
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,800
    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
  • Options
    DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 598
    edited April 21
    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html


  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
    Michelle Donelan settling her libel liability with tax payers cash seems more egregious. But then she's a nice girl.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    She needs to tell us what nomination she made when she got married about her house for tax purposes.

    Easy peasy.

    We don't even care what her husband said or pocketed upon sale of his house.

    We just want to know what she said - or didn't say - to HMRC.

    Is the issue.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,700
    ydoethur said:

    MattW said:

    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    Is this Ebert person who I think it is. i.e., a character out of Dilbert, alongside Ratbert, Dogbert and Catbert?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dilbert_characters

    Or is this an epoch defining thinker, journalist or academic of whom I should have heard?
    I was thinking it sounded unusually colloquial for Friedrich Ebert.
    Googling, I wonder about Roger Ebert.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    Carnyx said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    At the level in question, any advice could well have been verbal. More than a decade ago. And HMRC regulations have clear rules on how long one need keep personal tax. Which is not that long.

    You sound like those Home Office bureaucrats demanding to see a full run of bank accounts back to the 1980s before they will believe someone actually lived in the UK.
    I’ve always worked in the private sector. She has said she has had advice I cannot see why she cannot publish it, as a public figure.

    If the advice was verbal why not say that. She has offered to publish comditionally.
  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062
    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    She is very like Two Jags, ham up the poor working class lass who lived in a cardboard box , while stuffing her bankbook.
    Yet to hear anything remotely useful or helpful from her. Just another one out for herself.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    edited April 21

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
    Of course she isn’t. It’s a stupid demand for two reasons. Firstly neither of them are under suspicion of anything and secondly it is totally disproportionate.

    Actually there’s a third reason, it fails to draw a line under the matter it just helps perpetuate it.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    malcolmg said:

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    She is very like Two Jags, ham up the poor working class lass who lived in a cardboard box , while stuffing her bankbook.
    Yet to hear anything remotely useful or helpful from her. Just another one out for herself.
    I am so relieved that after your flirtation with the SNP you are back in the Tory fold. Well done!
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,474
    edited April 21
    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C
  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,390
    Carnyx said:

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    What I can never understand is why the Tories keep ignoring the fact that she has a family whose needs are likely to underlie this whole saga - adaptation of the second house, and so on. Which the media can't cover, for very good ethical reasons. Very, very conveniently for the Tories.

    Tories always whine when their families become part of the story. Now they're exploiting the rule.
    The tories are still smarting from her "scum" comments, and their client media papers are doing their bidding at the moment. It keeps the tory hands clean, until Daly makes a tw*t of himself on tv.
  • Options
    DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 598
    ydoethur said:

    MattW said:

    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    Is this Ebert person who I think it is. i.e., a character out of Dilbert, alongside Ratbert, Dogbert and Catbert?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dilbert_characters

    Or is this an epoch defining thinker, journalist or academic of whom I should have heard?
    I was thinking it sounded unusually colloquial for Friedrich Ebert.
    "I hate the revolution like sin" was hardly hoity-toity or bureaucratic as expressions go.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    All of the evidence is circumstantial.

    But it all suggests that she was primarily living at her husband’s house (a shared primary residence would also be the normal state of affairs)

    She’s not provided one piece of evidence to prove otherwise apart from her statement.

    I’m increasingly suspecting that she lives with her husband and declared the other property as her primary residence to claim the benefit of the CGT relief.

    I doubt there will be clear documentary evidence one way or the other, but it doesn’t look good for her.

    I agree but as I have said previously if she’s a victim of anything it is probably our complex tax regime.


  • Options
    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,062

    malcolmg said:

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    She is very like Two Jags, ham up the poor working class lass who lived in a cardboard box , while stuffing her bankbook.
    Yet to hear anything remotely useful or helpful from her. Just another one out for herself.
    I am so relieved that after your flirtation with the SNP you are back in the Tory fold. Well done!
    God knows what gave you that opinion Pete, I am very against the blue and red London Tories. Two cheeks of the same arse in my mind.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    TOPPING said:

    She needs to tell us what nomination she made when she got married about her house for tax purposes.

    Easy peasy.

    We don't even care what her husband said or pocketed upon sale of his house.

    We just want to know what she said - or didn't say - to HMRC.

    Is the issue.

    If the police and HMRC request that information fair enough, but she has no requirement to furnish you, Laura Kuenssberg or the Daily Mail with that kind of detail.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,889
    Morning all :)

    Thanks for the kind words on the new thread.

    Fareham and Havant aren't normally political battlegrounds or bellweather areas but the plight of the Conservative Party has brought them into play.

    What may save the Conservatives, however, in Havant, is the paucity of opposition candidates. The Conservatives have a full slate, the Greens and the LDs get halfway there so the anti-Conservative vote will have to be very efficient to inflict serious damage on the Tories.

    That may also impact on Borough-wide vote shares and perhaps inflate or exaggerate the Conservative numbers. Let's say you have a Ward with three Conservative Councillors - there are three Conservative candidates, an LD, a Labour and a Green.

    The result could be as follows (though this never happens)

    LD 500
    Labour 500
    Green 500
    Con 1 475, Con 2 475, Con 3 475

    Now that means 3 losses for the Conservatives in seat terms but in terms of votes the Conservatives have 1425, Labour 500, LDs 500 and Greens 500 thus in terms of votes cast, the Conservatives are well ahead.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 39,893
    Taz said:

    Carnyx said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    At the level in question, any advice could well have been verbal. More than a decade ago. And HMRC regulations have clear rules on how long one need keep personal tax. Which is not that long.

    You sound like those Home Office bureaucrats demanding to see a full run of bank accounts back to the 1980s before they will believe someone actually lived in the UK.
    I’ve always worked in the private sector. She has said she has had advice I cannot see why she cannot publish it, as a public figure.

    If the advice was verbal why not say that. She has offered to publish comditionally.
    Doesn't change the fact that you are demanding records that *do not need to exist* at this date for that purpose.

    We don't all use accountants and solicitors for our personal matters.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,700
    edited April 21
    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    edited April 21
    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, Malcolm's Conservatism and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    ...

    Taz said:

    Fishing said:

    Foxy said:

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    You are not paranoid when people are really out to get you!

    Rayner is a bright spot in a sea of Labour grey suits, not just her dress sense, but also her outspokeness.

    Young made an interesting point about Meritocracy in this 2001 article about the phenomenon that he had named. One aspect of Meritocracy is that it denudes the working class of its brightest and best leaders. While such social mobility is good for those individuals, it leaves large sections of the population without leadership. He thinks this part of the reason for the decline of the truly working class politician. Rayner is an exception to this.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/jun/29/comment
    Rayner has the same position in Starmer's government as Prescott did in Blair's - a nasty, incompetent fool who should be kept as far away as possible from any important position, but is there as a sop to the Loony Left, and maybe so that Starmer can assuage the guilt he occasionally feels in betraying everything he once claimed to stand for.
    Angela Rayner has a deep streak of unpleasantness in her, witness her comments of "Tory Scum" which is a disgusting dehumanisation of one's political opponents that can, and does, incite abuse and violence.

    She's lost some weight, wears interesting clothes, has a difficult backstory and can dance well to Old Skool music but that doesn't give her a free pass for everything else, I'm afraid. Even if @Foxy does really fancy her.
    The middle class guy fancying the bit of rough from the council estate ?
    A personally offensive to a fellow poster, post that was better left unposted. Same goes for Casino's last statement in the post you were foolishly responding too.

    I don't particularly like Rayner, but this whole saga strikes me as bullying. The most absurd moments have been James Daly being unable to explain what he was complaining to the police about.
    Scrutiny is not bullying. She regularly makes those sort of demands from the Tories. Why shouldn’t she be subject to scrutiny.

    Daly came over as a complete clown in that exchange. In 12 months time he’ll be an ex MP.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,336
    Donkeys said:

    ydoethur said:

    MattW said:

    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    Is this Ebert person who I think it is. i.e., a character out of Dilbert, alongside Ratbert, Dogbert and Catbert?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dilbert_characters

    Or is this an epoch defining thinker, journalist or academic of whom I should have heard?
    I was thinking it sounded unusually colloquial for Friedrich Ebert.
    "I hate the revolution like sin" was hardly hoity-toity or bureaucratic as expressions go.
    It was Hitler who was big on barrels though.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_Hall_Putsch
  • Options
    sbjme19sbjme19 Posts: 137

    TOPPING said:

    She needs to tell us what nomination she made when she got married about her house for tax purposes.

    Easy peasy.

    We don't even care what her husband said or pocketed upon sale of his house.

    We just want to know what she said - or didn't say - to HMRC.

    Is the issue.

    If the police and HMRC request that information fair enough, but she has no requirement to furnish you, Laura Kuenssberg or the Daily Mail with that kind of detail.
    Don't worry literary genius Ashcroft wrote a book about her and she's got those geniuses of the Tory party no-seat Holden and smallest majority Daly after her....
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,416
    TOPPING said:

    She needs to tell us what nomination she made when she got married about her house for tax purposes.

    Easy peasy.

    We don't even care what her husband said or pocketed upon sale of his house.

    We just want to know what she said - or didn't say - to HMRC.

    Is the issue.

    I think we know what she said and we know why she won't say what she said.

    She would have made the PPR declaration to HMRC. A perfectly legal bit of tax avoidance. But if she says so, she's then guilty of the greatest crime in British politics... Hypocrisy.

    Since what she did was legal, and not unusual in the circumstances, it's very hard to force her to go into the detail. So we're left to see whether a sustained campaign of innuendo will cause any damage.

    The campaign of innuendo does look particularly ridiculous in the circumstances of regular stories about new transgressions by Tory MPs that are on a completely different scale. But since when was it news that the newspapers were partisan?
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,408
    The Sunday Rawnsley, brought to you on a warm and sunny Ligurian morning:

    In their wildest dreams, [the Rayner] affair would culminate with the humiliating and shamefaced downfall of Labour’s deputy leader, but I don’t meet many Tories who really expect to get that result. They calculate that the relentless onslaught against Ms Rayner by the Conservative party…will not be a wasted effort even if they don’t get her bang to rights and with no choice but to quit.

    Under their breath, some shadow ministers wearily mutter their exasperation that so much of their time is being spent batting away the accusations against the deputy leader. It is eating up energy that Labour wanted to be spending on the May local government elections and the national contest that is only a bit further down the track. [But] Rather than putting distance between himself and his deputy, Sir Keir has put his own authority and credibility on the line with the steadfastness and increasing pugnacity with which he has stood up for her. [And] It is working to the advantage of Ms Rayner that there’s a whiff of misogyny and snobbery to some of the attacks on her.

    Another thing the Conservatives might ask themselves is whether their prospects are going to be enhanced by making the conduct of politicians the primary electoral battlefield. Voters are realistic enough not to expect a Labour government to be a congregation of saints, but they already look at the Tories as a cesspit of sinners. It seems rather unlikely to help Tory hopes of limiting their losses at the election if the outcome turns on the question of which of the parties is the sleaziest.

    … should the Greater Manchester police conclude that they were right the first time when they said they could find no grounds for investigating Ms Rayner, that would amplify the charge that the Tories have wasted police resources in pursuit of a desperate and nasty attempt to deflect from their own failings and unpopularity by unjustly targeting a senior opposition politician. Then this affair would not be about her. It would be about the character, judgment and motives of the Conservative party and its leader.



  • Options
    DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 598
    edited April 21
    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in their heads with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    He used to be Aleister Crowley's mother [*], or maybe that was someone else.

    * Joke only makes sense in a non-rhotic accent.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,474

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    I was actually thinking about poor @TimS

    He posted last night that his vineyard in Dorset was down to 0.9C or something like that, and that his entire annual harvest was likely to get wiped out, due to this insane Europe-wide cold

    🙏 for @TimS and any other growers/farmers battling these conditions
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    ...
    Taz said:



    ...

    Taz said:

    Fishing said:

    Foxy said:

    There's an in depth article about Angela Rayner, the bits in bold are huge red flags for me and soon she could be a heartbeat away from being PM with her finger on the Trident button.

    Beyond the brash exterior is a vulnerable and anxious woman. She is an insomniac — she endures the long, sleepless hours by listening to audiobooks about serial killers — and trusts very few people beyond her tight inner circle; she has panic buttons installed in her house and was convinced during the Corbyn years that she was being spied upon.

    and

    Like Boris Johnson, whom in some ways she resembles, Rayner is a source of endless fascination and speculation. There is no one quite like her at Westminster. She is gossiped about, condescended, traduced but never ignored. Like Johnson, she has undoubted star quality. She is both self-glamorising and self-mythologising.


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-rayner-is-a-wounded-lioness-but-shes-still-an-asset-for-labour-v7wwf7cs5

    You are not paranoid when people are really out to get you!

    Rayner is a bright spot in a sea of Labour grey suits, not just her dress sense, but also her outspokeness.

    Young made an interesting point about Meritocracy in this 2001 article about the phenomenon that he had named. One aspect of Meritocracy is that it denudes the working class of its brightest and best leaders. While such social mobility is good for those individuals, it leaves large sections of the population without leadership. He thinks this part of the reason for the decline of the truly working class politician. Rayner is an exception to this.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2001/jun/29/comment
    Rayner has the same position in Starmer's government as Prescott did in Blair's - a nasty, incompetent fool who should be kept as far away as possible from any important position, but is there as a sop to the Loony Left, and maybe so that Starmer can assuage the guilt he occasionally feels in betraying everything he once claimed to stand for.
    Angela Rayner has a deep streak of unpleasantness in her, witness her comments of "Tory Scum" which is a disgusting dehumanisation of one's political opponents that can, and does, incite abuse and violence.

    She's lost some weight, wears interesting clothes, has a difficult backstory and can dance well to Old Skool music but that doesn't give her a free pass for everything else, I'm afraid. Even if @Foxy does really fancy her.
    The middle class guy fancying the bit of rough from the council estate ?
    A personally offensive to a fellow poster, post that was better left unposted. Same goes for Casino's last statement in the post you were foolishly responding too.

    I don't particularly like Rayner, but this whole saga strikes me as bullying. The most absurd moments have been James Daly being unable to explain what he was complaining to the police about.
    Scrutiny is not bullying. She regularly makes those sort of demands from the Tories. Why shouldn’t she be subject to scrutiny.

    Daly came over as a complete clown in that exchange. In 12 months time he’ll be an ex MP.
    But it's not scrutiny, it's a smear campaign.

    Now she may be a wrong 'un, but the level of scrutiny generates infinitely more column inches than the Conservative Party covering up the Mark Menzies chaos or the public purse stumping up 40 grand for Michelle Donelan 's indiscretion.

    One way or the other, it's bollocks, and this same bollocks has hijacked Stodge's excellent thread.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,416
    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    Was down to 2.2C overnight here. Large changes in temperature over a day are common in spring. The colder sea allows temperatures to fall to low levels overnight, but the strong sunlight - we're only a fortnight or so away from the cross-quarter day, the midpoint between equinox and solstice - warms things up dramatically during the day.

    The next two days should see highs of ~18C in Ireland. I could tell you where the best chefs work in the area too.
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 7,800
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
    Of course she isn’t. It’s a stupid demand for two reasons. Firstly neither of them are under suspicion of anything and secondly it is totally disproportionate.

    Actually there’s a third reason, it fails to draw a line under the matter it just helps perpetuate it.
    Both Sunak and Hunt have initially sought not to say anything about their personal tax affairs, before caving and doing so: https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-hunt-deny-tax-penalty_uk_63d3a38be4b01e92886a1cf2 ; https://news.sky.com/video/chancellor-jeremy-hunt-dismisses-question-on-his-personal-tax-affairs-12796487

    There have been a lot of questions raised about Sunak’s wife’s tax: https://www.itv.com/news/2022-04-07/sunak-faces-very-serious-questions-over-wifes-non-dom-status-and-tax-affairs
  • Options
    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,016
    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,416

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, Malcolm's Conservatism and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    The Ravens haven't abandoned the Tower - there are still Englishmen who like to discuss the weather.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,753

    TimS said:

    Good morning. FPT:


    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
    It's this a situation where freezing-degree-hours would be the relevant metric as to how much harm would be done?
    Up to a point. The longer it freezes the worse. I had sub-zero for about 2 hours last night, which isn’t too bad.

    But once it hits really cold temperatures, say -3C and below, the duration of cold is less important. It just kills everything and the vine has to start again from secondary buds.

  • Options
    DonkeysDonkeys Posts: 598
    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    It's so often former rather than current politicians, judges, and diplomats who say things or sign letters that are undesirably off-message as far as supporters of Israel are concerned.

    Poor old Roly-Poly. You have to remember that someone in his job will have cooperated for years with the Community Security Trust.

    With a stepping up of the genocide in the offing, there is a powerful push to ban pro-Palestinian demonstrations in London. Rowley is certainly toast. While Matt W is having his deranged singsong we can ask who else will fall. Sunak is going to have to say something, probably by tomorrow.

  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308
    edited April 21
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    I was actually thinking about poor @TimS

    He posted last night that his vineyard in Dorset was down to 0.9C or something like that, and that his entire annual harvest was likely to get wiped out, due to this insane Europe-wide cold

    🙏 for @TimS and any other growers/farmers battling these conditions
    You were thinking **** me it's cold, where can I get a cockle-warming brandy at this time of the morning in Paris?
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 9,753
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    I was actually thinking about poor @TimS

    He posted last night that his vineyard in Dorset was down to 0.9C or something like that, and that his entire annual harvest was likely to get wiped out, due to this insane Europe-wide cold

    🙏 for @TimS and any other growers/farmers battling these conditions
    -0.8C last night. Probably marginal and patchy damage with that. But worse to come next week.

    My vines are in Kent. Worst hit next week will be Wessex and Marches vineyards and orchards. And most of France which will be getting -4, -5C or worse.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
    Of course she isn’t. It’s a stupid demand for two reasons. Firstly neither of them are under suspicion of anything and secondly it is totally disproportionate.

    Actually there’s a third reason, it fails to draw a line under the matter it just helps perpetuate it.
    Both Sunak and Hunt have initially sought not to say anything about their personal tax affairs, before caving and doing so: https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-hunt-deny-tax-penalty_uk_63d3a38be4b01e92886a1cf2 ; https://news.sky.com/video/chancellor-jeremy-hunt-dismisses-question-on-his-personal-tax-affairs-12796487

    There have been a lot of questions raised about Sunak’s wife’s tax: https://www.itv.com/news/2022-04-07/sunak-faces-very-serious-questions-over-wifes-non-dom-status-and-tax-affairs
    Sunak’s wife is not Sunak. Attacking Sunak through his wife is pretty shitty. She’s not a politician and there is no hint of any wrong doing on the PMs part. His wife is just rich.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,474

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, Malcolm's Conservatism and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    The Ravens haven't abandoned the Tower - there are still Englishmen who like to discuss the weather.
    I can confirm the French are also keen to talk about it. The Parisians are staring at the sky with incomprehension, as they wrap themselves with scarves and coats. Honestly it’s like a partly sunny but bracing day in late February. The sun looks ok but the wind blasts down the boulevard, so 6C feels colder if you’re not in the sun



    I hope we get good news from @TimS

    That must be so sad, to see a year of work wiped out by one night of frost ☹️
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,841

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    There are two or three parts. The "openly Jewish" bit was disgraceful and ignorant and it needs to be clear to every officer that is unnacceptable. The threatening arrest was unnecessary.

    However not allowing him to walk directly through the march is a fairly standard part of policing. Happens every week at football matches, would happen today if protestors want to walk through the marathon course.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    I’d agree but you can see the mindset of the police here. The initial reply of the met. This tweet. The arrest of an Iranian man holding a sign saying ‘Hamas are terrorists’.

  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,308

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, Malcolm's Conservatism and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    The Ravens haven't abandoned the Tower - there are still Englishmen who like to discuss the weather.
    There are also Englishmen in Paris who like to discuss themselves and their current circumstance. Should that stop, the ravens will have left the Tower.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,474
    TimS said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    I was actually thinking about poor @TimS

    He posted last night that his vineyard in Dorset was down to 0.9C or something like that, and that his entire annual harvest was likely to get wiped out, due to this insane Europe-wide cold

    🙏 for @TimS and any other growers/farmers battling these conditions
    -0.8C last night. Probably marginal and patchy damage with that. But worse to come next week.

    My vines are in Kent. Worst hit next week will be Wessex and Marches vineyards and orchards. And most of France which will be getting -4, -5C or worse.
    Thanks for the update. Fingers x’d

    I can attest to the outrageous cold in France
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    Was down to 2.2C overnight here. Large changes in temperature over a day are common in spring. The colder sea allows temperatures to fall to low levels overnight, but the strong sunlight - we're only a fortnight or so away from the cross-quarter day, the midpoint between equinox and solstice - warms things up dramatically during the day.

    The next two days should see highs of ~18C in Ireland. I could tell you where the best chefs work in the area too.
    I have an insulated garage and am hoping to start brewing again imminently but temperature drops that low overnight would probably see my garage down to below 14 degrees. Hopefully it will start to warm up now.
  • Options
    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,016

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    There are two or three parts. The "openly Jewish" bit was disgraceful and ignorant and it needs to be clear to every officer that is unnacceptable. The threatening arrest was unnecessary.

    However not allowing him to walk directly through the march is a fairly standard part of policing. Happens every week at football matches, would happen today if protestors want to walk through the marathon course.
    Why do we tolerate football if that is the level of innate violence?

    In this case, I don't think the Jewish gentleman was proposing to disrupt the demo, just walk past it.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,889
    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Good morning. FPT:


    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
    It's this a situation where freezing-degree-hours would be the relevant metric as to how much harm would be done?
    Up to a point. The longer it freezes the worse. I had sub-zero for about 2 hours last night, which isn’t too bad.

    But once it hits really cold temperatures, say -3C and below, the duration of cold is less important. It just kills everything and the vine has to start again from secondary buds.

    I appreciate your concern and glancing at the early morning weather models, we are in for a chilly few days with air frosts in rural and sheltered areas every night - Wednesday into Thursday looks perhaps the coldest. The models are showing air temperatures no worse than -1C but you and I both know if you are in a frost hollow under clear skies the dawn temperature could be much lower.

    Air frost wll be limited, ground frost will be more widespread.
  • Options
    stodgestodge Posts: 12,889

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    There are two or three parts. The "openly Jewish" bit was disgraceful and ignorant and it needs to be clear to every officer that is unnacceptable. The threatening arrest was unnecessary.

    However not allowing him to walk directly through the march is a fairly standard part of policing. Happens every week at football matches, would happen today if protestors want to walk through the marathon course.
    Broadly agree - irrespective of what you think is your "right" to walk the King's Highway unimpeded in all circumstances, the Police have a greater responsibility to maintain public order and if that inconveniences you, so be it. I do agree the opening comment was unacceptable but I wouldn't expect to be allowed to cross a road in the middle of a demonstration or a major event.

    Rights are not absolute - they come with obligations and responsibilities. Sometimes those seeking to assert those rights forget the second bit. We need I think to re-orient the debate away from the rights of the individual to the societal obligations and responsibilities of the individual.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,691
    Good morning. I have just completed my ballot papers.

    After filling in my date of birth and signature in blue ink I then noticed that on one of the multitude sets of instructions it says to use black ink. Hopefully not grounds to reject my votes.

    I noticed that for the council election I had the option of a Local Conservative. Ironically, he does not live in our ward.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,700
    edited April 21
    Thank-you for the header.

    Can you update me on what Fareham is like?

    I think (and I may be getting it muddled with Wareham) it was the back-of-beyond place where I went to a friend's baptism-by-immersion one summer whilst on placement from University. Remarkable experience in a traditional *very* hands-down gospel hall (roughly old-style Keswick Tradition for those who know such distinctions). It was like a 1950s church hall where your grandma would attend beetle drives, and when the chairs were moved there were a couple of trapdoors with a baptism pool underneath. I stayed with a lovely couple who had 3 year old triplets, who they transported around in a beat-up 15 year old Volvo Estate.

    I recall it was a hell of a long way from Nottingham (never mind Bradford) in a Mk1 VW Polo, and felt isolated like a filming location for The Wicker Man, had it been set in England. Were chip shops and pubs frowned upon?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,474
    stodge said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Good morning. FPT:


    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
    It's this a situation where freezing-degree-hours would be the relevant metric as to how much harm would be done?
    Up to a point. The longer it freezes the worse. I had sub-zero for about 2 hours last night, which isn’t too bad.

    But once it hits really cold temperatures, say -3C and below, the duration of cold is less important. It just kills everything and the vine has to start again from secondary buds.

    I appreciate your concern and glancing at the early morning weather models, we are in for a chilly few days with air frosts in rural and sheltered areas every night - Wednesday into Thursday looks perhaps the coldest. The models are showing air temperatures no worse than -1C but you and I both know if you are in a frost hollow under clear skies the dawn temperature could be much lower.

    Air frost wll be limited, ground frost will be more widespread.
    April is the cruellest month for several reasons; this is one

    If you do get some sun on your face it’s actually hot and you regret your massive winter coat (here in Paris anyway). Because we are way past the equinox and the sun now has the strength of the sun in August. But if it clouds over or you step into shadow the wind sends it back to mid February

    Purgatorial is, I think, the mot juste
  • Options
    noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 20,841

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    There are two or three parts. The "openly Jewish" bit was disgraceful and ignorant and it needs to be clear to every officer that is unnacceptable. The threatening arrest was unnecessary.

    However not allowing him to walk directly through the march is a fairly standard part of policing. Happens every week at football matches, would happen today if protestors want to walk through the marathon course.
    Why do we tolerate football if that is the level of innate violence?

    In this case, I don't think the Jewish gentleman was proposing to disrupt the demo, just walk past it.
    We don't tolerate football, we love it. It is 0.4% of our GDP, one of more important industries for balance of payments, and part of our culture and identity. We have made it safer by far better policing, which does include keeping fans separate at time, only highest risk games, it is not the norm but not particularly unusual either.

    From the clip I've seen it looked like he wanted to go through the barricades into the march rather than walk alongside it. Could be wrong, wasn't completely clear.
  • Options
    StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 14,549
    stodge said:

    Morning all :)

    Thanks for the kind words on the new thread.

    Fareham and Havant aren't normally political battlegrounds or bellweather areas but the plight of the Conservative Party has brought them into play.

    What may save the Conservatives, however, in Havant, is the paucity of opposition candidates. The Conservatives have a full slate, the Greens and the LDs get halfway there so the anti-Conservative vote will have to be very efficient to inflict serious damage on the Tories.

    That may also impact on Borough-wide vote shares and perhaps inflate or exaggerate the Conservative numbers. Let's say you have a Ward with three Conservative Councillors - there are three Conservative candidates, an LD, a Labour and a Green.

    The result could be as follows (though this never happens)

    LD 500
    Labour 500
    Green 500
    Con 1 475, Con 2 475, Con 3 475

    Now that means 3 losses for the Conservatives in seat terms but in terms of votes the Conservatives have 1425, Labour 500, LDs 500 and Greens 500 thus in terms of votes cast, the Conservatives are well ahead.

    Depending on how intentional it is, scenarios a bit like yours aren't uncommon. There were a couple in Gosport 2022 (though Labour didn't benefit), and didn't Councillor Palmer have a three-way arrangement with a satisfying conclusion?

    The question in Havant is whether the missing candidates are a plan to channel tactical votes or a sign of party weakness. Anyone got the local gen?
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,779
    DougSeal said:

    FPT

    I see the Heil have come up with some more "evidence" in Raynergate. By "sign the document" they mean "witness Rayner's signature" on her TR1. Which anyone can do. Mine last one was witnessed by the receptionist at my firm, the one before that by my parents' next door neighbour. So this "new evidence" is that Rayner asked a neighbour of her husband (who has already given a statement to the police) to witness a transfer deed. What the f**k does that prove? Why didn't she get someone nearer her main house, they ask? Because she was at her husband's house when she needed the TR1 witnessed, maybe?

    In fact, paraphrase Ebert, this information doesn't scrape the bottom of the barrel. It isn't the bottom of the barrel. It isn't below the bottom of the barrel. It doesn't deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence with barrels."

    They're so pathetically desperate to make this a story, and sensitive that it isn't, that they put a box in to rebut the "Labour supporting" Guardian's suggestion that it isn't.

    The irony is if Rayner did actually claim her previous house as her main residence, as she was perfectly entitled to do, and which the Mail is getting so outraged about, she definitely wouldn't have to pay any tax on it.
  • Options
    Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,390
    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
    Of course she isn’t. It’s a stupid demand for two reasons. Firstly neither of them are under suspicion of anything and secondly it is totally disproportionate.

    Actually there’s a third reason, it fails to draw a line under the matter it just helps perpetuate it.
    Both Sunak and Hunt have initially sought not to say anything about their personal tax affairs, before caving and doing so: https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-hunt-deny-tax-penalty_uk_63d3a38be4b01e92886a1cf2 ; https://news.sky.com/video/chancellor-jeremy-hunt-dismisses-question-on-his-personal-tax-affairs-12796487

    There have been a lot of questions raised about Sunak’s wife’s tax: https://www.itv.com/news/2022-04-07/sunak-faces-very-serious-questions-over-wifes-non-dom-status-and-tax-affairs
    Sunak’s wife is not Sunak. Attacking Sunak through his wife is pretty shitty. She’s not a politician and there is no hint of any wrong doing on the PMs part. His wife is just rich.
    Do you not think there could be a conflict of interest here?

    I'm not sure a politician who for example was married to a state school teacher could become Education Secretary?
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,700

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    There are two or three parts. The "openly Jewish" bit was disgraceful and ignorant and it needs to be clear to every officer that is unnacceptable. The threatening arrest was unnecessary.

    However not allowing him to walk directly through the march is a fairly standard part of policing. Happens every week at football matches, would happen today if protestors want to walk through the marathon course.
    Why do we tolerate football if that is the level of innate violence?

    In this case, I don't think the Jewish gentleman was proposing to disrupt the demo, just walk past it.
    We don't tolerate football, we love it. It is 0.4% of our GDP, one of more important industries for balance of payments, and part of our culture and identity. We have made it safer by far better policing, which does include keeping fans separate at time, only highest risk games, it is not the norm but not particularly unusual either.

    From the clip I've seen it looked like he wanted to go through the barricades into the march rather than walk alongside it. Could be wrong, wasn't completely clear.
    I'm not sure it is particularly peaceful.

    Reading advice to visiting overseas tourists recently, it seemed very much in a lot of places to be 'do not wear an away shirt in a home enclosure, or you may have to visit the hospital' - with hints that such behaviour is accepted especially in places with older football grounds.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,950
    I knew it was you @Stodge in the first few paragraphs. A grace to the site as always. Thank you.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294
    stodge said:

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    There are two or three parts. The "openly Jewish" bit was disgraceful and ignorant and it needs to be clear to every officer that is unnacceptable. The threatening arrest was unnecessary.

    However not allowing him to walk directly through the march is a fairly standard part of policing. Happens every week at football matches, would happen today if protestors want to walk through the marathon course.
    Broadly agree - irrespective of what you think is your "right" to walk the King's Highway unimpeded in all circumstances, the Police have a greater responsibility to maintain public order and if that inconveniences you, so be it. I do agree the opening comment was unacceptable but I wouldn't expect to be allowed to cross a road in the middle of a demonstration or a major event.

    Rights are not absolute - they come with obligations and responsibilities. Sometimes those seeking to assert those rights forget the second bit. We need I think to re-orient the debate away from the rights of the individual to the societal obligations and responsibilities of the individual.
    But, as has been said, he did not want to walk through the March.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,563
    Nico Rosberg is a better co-commentator than Martin Brundle and I love Martin.

    Fact.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,294

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    ...

    Taz said:

    I struggle to get the deification of Rayner. I don’t think Fishing’s characterisation is fair but she strikes me as quite ordinary as a politician. Labour has some quality on its front bench. She’s not up there. I’d love to know just why people rate her so highly and what she has done in terms of policy to achieve this level of devotion.

    As she’s working class she seems to attract admiration, in parts, from middle class commentators, mostly male, and seemingly as a way of burnishing their pro working class credentials and all of this while labour increasingly selects fewer and fewer working class candidates and more and more white collar former SPAD/London Councillor/charity/Quangocrats/Lawyer types. The party is being purged of the working class.

    It’s all a bit ‘how can I hate women, my mother was one’, ‘I’ve got black friends, I’m not racist’ from the commentariat who seem to think challenging her is picking in her.

    It is fair to ask questions of her, her shiftiness and evasiveness over it the whole issue has dragged it out. Sure the Tories are bad but let’s not give the other parties a free pass.

    https://x.com/rcolvile/status/1781594270287224952?s=61

    The language used, for example "shiftiness" demonstrates Colville's agenda. If he didn't want to impress upon the reader that Rayner is a "wrong 'un" he would have used, maybe, obfuscation instead?
    Shiftiness is my word and I have said it about her response to this more than once. Her response to scrutiny is she doesn’t like it. Yet she is happy to dish it out. She’s getting back some of what she’s dished out. She could close this down very quickly by publishing the advice she was given. So why not. Instead she makes stupid demands for the PM and Chancellor to publish 15 years of tax records

    Colville is saying honesty matters and he’s right. He’s not saying she’s a wrong un or a right un.
    Why is it a stupid demand? The Conservatives are making a huge fuss based on not much about what would, if true, be a small amount of tax unpaid. There have been questions raised about senior Conservatives’ taxes and they didn’t publish details. It seems hypocritical and Rayner is calling out the hypocrisy.
    Of course she isn’t. It’s a stupid demand for two reasons. Firstly neither of them are under suspicion of anything and secondly it is totally disproportionate.

    Actually there’s a third reason, it fails to draw a line under the matter it just helps perpetuate it.
    Both Sunak and Hunt have initially sought not to say anything about their personal tax affairs, before caving and doing so: https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-hunt-deny-tax-penalty_uk_63d3a38be4b01e92886a1cf2 ; https://news.sky.com/video/chancellor-jeremy-hunt-dismisses-question-on-his-personal-tax-affairs-12796487

    There have been a lot of questions raised about Sunak’s wife’s tax: https://www.itv.com/news/2022-04-07/sunak-faces-very-serious-questions-over-wifes-non-dom-status-and-tax-affairs
    Sunak’s wife is not Sunak. Attacking Sunak through his wife is pretty shitty. She’s not a politician and there is no hint of any wrong doing on the PMs part. His wife is just rich.
    Do you not think there could be a conflict of interest here?

    I'm not sure a politician who for example was married to a state school teacher could become Education Secretary?
    Possibly a conflict of interest and that should be a matter of public interest. Attack her tax status as she’s the PM’s wife is less so.
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,128
    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Good morning. FPT:


    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
    It's this a situation where freezing-degree-hours would be the relevant metric as to how much harm would be done?
    Up to a point. The longer it freezes the worse. I had sub-zero for about 2 hours last night, which isn’t too bad.

    But once it hits really cold temperatures, say -3C and below, the duration of cold is less important. It just kills everything and the vine has to start again from secondary buds.

    I appreciate your concern and glancing at the early morning weather models, we are in for a chilly few days with air frosts in rural and sheltered areas every night - Wednesday into Thursday looks perhaps the coldest. The models are showing air temperatures no worse than -1C but you and I both know if you are in a frost hollow under clear skies the dawn temperature could be much lower.

    Air frost wll be limited, ground frost will be more widespread.
    April is the cruellest month for several reasons; this is one

    If you do get some sun on your face it’s actually hot and you regret your massive winter coat (here in Paris anyway). Because we are way past the equinox and the sun now has the strength of the sun in August. But if it clouds over or you step into shadow the wind sends it back to mid February

    Purgatorial is, I think, the mot juste
    It depends on the source of the wind. The wind yesterday backed northerly, which is why it was so cold. Looks like it will remain northerly for a good few days too!
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,534
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    10am in Paris

    April 21

    6C

    ...and?

    We are having a nice conversation about the skulduggery surrounding Raynergate, and a potential Tory collapse in Hampshire.

    I think you may have posted in the wrong blog- again!
    I was actually thinking about poor @TimS

    He posted last night that his vineyard in Dorset was down to 0.9C or something like that, and that his entire annual harvest was likely to get wiped out, due to this insane Europe-wide cold

    🙏 for @TimS and any other growers/farmers battling these conditions
    Because the climate is getting fucked. And even though I think the UK will actually essentially fix its contribution by 2040-2045 that's still 20 years away and meanwhile you have psychopathic nationalist leaders like Modi crowing about hitting new heights of a billion tonnes a year of coal and lignite.

    The man will kill us all.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,534

    Taz said:

    MattW said:

    Donkeys said:

    It's past 8.30am and Mark Rowley is still in office. No way will he still be there by the end of tomorrow.

    The question is who he'll take with him. The push to ban anti-genocide demonstrations seems pretty damned serious.

    Is there a market on

    * next person to leave the cabinet?
    * Cleverly to leave the cabinet by [date]?
    * Sunak to leave office before the end of May?

    I stopped reading the following piece from the Lebedev press when I reached the word "experts", but it seems effort is still being put into Susan Hall's campaign, even at this late stage:

    https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/sadiq-khan-susan-hall-london-mayoral-election-poll-2024-closes-gap-b1152501.html

    I was left with the same question here - Mark Rowley who?

    But I see he is the boss of the Met, which is disappointing.

    I wanted him to be either the actor playing a libidinous Frenchman, or an actual libidinous Frenchman - which is at least all the recent Presidents, and probably all of them. Then I could apply some words for life, @TSE style, or following the actions of the Spectator elite in Paris, in their heads, with respect to girls with pearls.

    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    A frog he would a-wooing go,
    Whether his mother would let him or no.
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.

    So off he set with his opera hat,
    Heigh ho! says Rowley,
    So off he set with his opera hat,
    And on the road he met with a rat,
    With a rowley, powley, gammon, and spinach,
    Heigh ho! says Anthony Rowley.
    ...
    https://wordsforlife.org.uk/activities/frog-he-would-wooing-go/
    Former chair of the GMP federation defends the met and the anti semitic policing compacting it to soccer rivalry.

    https://x.com/leembroad/status/1781739104264167728?s=61
    In both cases I would expect the police to arrest those who kick off. A jew wearing a yarmulka should be able to walk through a crowd of Muslims, and a Man C supporter should be able to walk through a crowd of Man U fans
    It creates work for the police.

    One has to remember that like in most public services they want an easy life.
  • Options
    Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 7,574
    edited April 21
    The 'openly Jewish' comment was clearly a disgrace, although there is a suspicion that the gentleman concerned (the CEO of the Campaign Against Antisemitism) was seeking a police reaction to him crossing the road through the middle of the marchers.

    Meanwhile, young men in their droves continue to be stopped and searched by the Met for being 'openly black'.
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    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,416
    Leon said:

    stodge said:

    TimS said:

    TimS said:

    Good morning. FPT:


    carnforth said:

    TimS said:

    0.6C at the vineyard with 6 hours of cooling to come. Only a matter of time before it goes negative and wipes out this years harvest before it’s started.

    I take it vines in England aren't valuable enough for covering with protective ice or lighting little stoves as they do in France?
    On the contrary most of the larger vineyards here make substantial use of frost candles, fans and other equipment. But I’m a little mini vineyard of only a few thousand vines and don’t have the scale to afford that. Besides I live in London and the vines are in Kent. So I have to just let nature do its thing.

    Its thing last night was -0.8C. Cold enough for some damage.
    It's this a situation where freezing-degree-hours would be the relevant metric as to how much harm would be done?
    Up to a point. The longer it freezes the worse. I had sub-zero for about 2 hours last night, which isn’t too bad.

    But once it hits really cold temperatures, say -3C and below, the duration of cold is less important. It just kills everything and the vine has to start again from secondary buds.

    I appreciate your concern and glancing at the early morning weather models, we are in for a chilly few days with air frosts in rural and sheltered areas every night - Wednesday into Thursday looks perhaps the coldest. The models are showing air temperatures no worse than -1C but you and I both know if you are in a frost hollow under clear skies the dawn temperature could be much lower.

    Air frost wll be limited, ground frost will be more widespread.
    April is the cruellest month for several reasons; this is one

    If you do get some sun on your face it’s actually hot and you regret your massive winter coat (here in Paris anyway). Because we are way past the equinox and the sun now has the strength of the sun in August. But if it clouds over or you step into shadow the wind sends it back to mid February

    Purgatorial is, I think, the mot juste
    April is a true transition month.

    In the Central England Temperature record you can find days in every month November to March with a mean temperature below freezing, and in every month May to September a day with mean temperatures above 20C, but April and October are the transition months when neither of those things occur.
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