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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Northern Ireland Westminster Election 2019 – Review And Insight
First and foremost, congratulations to all 18 winning candidates and commiserations to all the losing ones.
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First.0
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I love the idea that these MPs are actually going to achieve something for their areas. They obviously do politics differently in NI. Personally, I think that these MPs will once again return to obscurity after the DUPs moment in the sun in the last Parliament. They really should have worked harder to ensure that happy state continued for as long as possible.0
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And as was pointed out yesterday a U.K. PM with lots of poorer Northern constituencies and MPs isn’t going to be hosing better off Ulstermen with dosh....the number of Turkeys that voted for Christmas grows longer by the day...DavidL said:I love the idea that these MPs are actually going to achieve something for their areas. They obviously do politics differently in NI. Personally, I think that these MPs will once again return to obscurity after the DUPs moment in the sun in the last Parliament. They really should have worked harder to ensure that happy state continued for as long as possible.
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Christmas doesn’t come but once a year in NI, it comes every odd decade. I can’t help feeling that Arlene is going to pay a heavy price for her stupidity. Dodds already has and I won’t miss him much. I expect further legislation to bring NI into at least the 20th century if Stormont doesn’t get back to business. There is no reason to tolerate the DUPs intolerance now. Hopefully Ulster will benefit from the DUPs discomforture.CarlottaVance said:
And as was pointed out yesterday a U.K. PM with lots of poorer Northern constituencies and MPs isn’t going to be hosing better off Ulstermen with dosh....the number of Turkeys that voted for Christmas grows longer by the day...DavidL said:I love the idea that these MPs are actually going to achieve something for their areas. They obviously do politics differently in NI. Personally, I think that these MPs will once again return to obscurity after the DUPs moment in the sun in the last Parliament. They really should have worked harder to ensure that happy state continued for as long as possible.
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If they do install Corbyn Mk2 then they deserve destruction. But they won't get it.Floater said:
There was a Labour mp on talk radio earlier- he also said RLB would equal destruction of LabourHYUFD said:
A key consequence of Northern Ireland having a separate party political system to the rest of the country is, of course, that (except when NI MPs hold the balance of power in the Commons) there are no votes for the UK Government either to gain or lose in doing what it likes there. The main issue for Johnson is not getting bogged down in distracting local arguments - or having his handling of them used by his opponents in mainland Britain as a stick with which to attempt to beat him. In the latter respect, changing Northern Irish law on abortions and same sex marriage has already drawn most of the poison.DavidL said:
Christmas doesn’t come but once a year in NI, it comes every odd decade. I can’t help feeling that Arlene is going to pay a heavy price for her stupidity. Dodds already has and I won’t miss him much. I expect further legislation to bring NI into at least the 20th century if Stormont doesn’t get back to business. There is no reason to tolerate the DUPs intolerance now. Hopefully Ulster will benefit from the DUPs discomforture.CarlottaVance said:
And as was pointed out yesterday a U.K. PM with lots of poorer Northern constituencies and MPs isn’t going to be hosing better off Ulstermen with dosh....the number of Turkeys that voted for Christmas grows longer by the day...DavidL said:I love the idea that these MPs are actually going to achieve something for their areas. They obviously do politics differently in NI. Personally, I think that these MPs will once again return to obscurity after the DUPs moment in the sun in the last Parliament. They really should have worked harder to ensure that happy state continued for as long as possible.
Thus, there's a good argument to be made for taking more decisions over the heads of Northern Ireland's politicians, in the hope that removing as many contentious issues from play as possible will make it easier for them to agree to resume power-sharing. Item number one: the Irish Language Act.0 -
Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.0 -
FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)0 -
They’d rather die than do that.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.0 -
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/0 -
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.0 -
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.1 -
I’ve Betfair greened-up on Starmer now at 4s.
Trouble is I’m carrying £95 of bookie bets round my ankle for no-hopers, so i really need to be +£100 on Betfair to make a decent profit (except for RLB where I made a good £25 bet with bookies at 15).0 -
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.1 -
State primarysquareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/856434684896710656?s=20
Married 2007, 2 kids - so I guess they may be coming up to secondary education shortly...0 -
People are already raiding his bins. How long before they call him a Marxist?CarlottaVance said:
State primarysquareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/856434684896710656?s=200 -
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.0 -
that's 2.5 yrs ago..Jonathan said:
People are already raiding his bins. How long before they call him a Marxist?CarlottaVance said:
State primarysquareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/856434684896710656?s=200 -
I read it, what’s your point?CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.0 -
Attack dog . LOL. I just asked a simple question.Jonathan said:
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.0 -
You were straight in there on his kids, classy. Meanwhile the Telegraph are raiding his digital bins to create a thin story. And so it begins, as a Labour leader you either get a labelled a Marxist or a champagne socialist, sometimes both.squareroot2 said:
Attack dog . LOL. I just asked a simple question.Jonathan said:
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
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That Labour have a bigger problem than the Tories. It doesn't "afflict the right just as much".Jonathan said:
I read it, what’s your point?CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.0 -
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.1 -
Its perfectly reasonable to ask such questions about a prospective leader of the Labour party,, after all there are precedents for Labour politicians to say one thing and do another (Diane Abbott (cough) for one. It wasn't about his kids anyway it was about his political views about state schools and whether he sends his children to be educated privately.Jonathan said:
You were straight in there on his kids, classy. Meanwhile the Telegraph are raiding his digital bins to create a thin story. And so it begins,squareroot2 said:
Attack dog . LOL. I just asked a simple question.Jonathan said:
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
Of course its perfectly ok for the left to smear Boris about his private life ...1 -
At what point are the markets going to cotton on to the reality of a Johnson government? Where’s the money coming from?0
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0
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Clearly the Tories are self evidently in a stronger position. But that doesn’t alter the fact the Tories have spent the last few months condemning anyone who voted Labour. With some outriders making that point in very extreme terms.CarlottaVance said:
That Labour have a bigger problem than the Tories. It doesn't "afflict the right just as much".Jonathan said:
I read it, what’s your point?CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.0 -
0
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The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.0
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What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.0 -
Yep - and they’ll go to the local state schools. Why wouldn’t they? London schools are excellent. There’s no reason to go private.CarlottaVance said:
State primarysquareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/856434684896710656?s=20
Married 2007, 2 kids - so I guess they may be coming up to secondary education shortly...
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He's clearly one of the sharpest Labour front benchers - along with Thornberry - but what the Tories fear and what former Labour voters will vote for may be two entirely different things.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
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It’s why the country is going backwards fast. Being less disastrous is still disastrous.DavidL said:
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is common on the left simply to caricature the Tory party and its voters as either bigoted or deluded. Doing this absolves them from ever having to think carefully about what the Tories stand for, or why people vote for them. After a result like last week’s it might be wiser to experiment for a while by treating the Tory party as a rational organisation, and its voters as people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.1 -
People vote Conservative because they believe it will be best for themselves and their families. They don’t want an ideological Government that might threaten them.DavidL said:
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.
Terror of Corbyn was certainly a factor in driving millions of voters into the arms of the Tories last week.
Whether that holds fast or not next time is something we simply do not know.3 -
SouthamObserver said:
The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.1 -
Why is everyone assuming the next election will be in 2024? If the Tories are doing well it’s much more likely to be in 2023.rkrkrk said:What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.
0 -
Same applies to Labour voters.Casino_Royale said:
People vote Conservative because they believe it will be best for themselves and their families. They don’t want an ideological Government that might threaten themDavidL said:
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.
0 -
And at the point he becomes a personal liability, his party will happily throw him on the large pile of former leaders who became liabilities, and replace him with someone else. Theresa May, IDS, even Thatcher all outstayed their welcome and were unceremoniously dumped by the party.DavidL said:
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.
Something that Labour completely failed to do, being seemingly far more interested in internal party machinations than presenting themselves as a convincing alternative government. Even now, they're talking up complete lightweights like R L-B as leader - how's she doing to convince a single Tory to vote for her?0 -
Really? I doubt they will go for another winter poll and will want at least four years.SouthamObserver said:
Why is everyone assuming the next election will be in 2024? If the Tories are doing well it’s much more likely to be in 2023.rkrkrk said:What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.0 -
The Tories have choices to make. You cannot simultaneously increase public spending, not raise taxes, disrupt the economy with a No Deal Brexit or Canada Minus FTA and balance the books. Something will have to give. My bet is on the book balancing. It will be interesting to see the extent to which the Conservatives that remain in the Johnson Tory party are prepared to let that go.DavidL said:
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:
Read on...Jonathan said:
This is not unique to the left. It is a feature of modern politics and afflicts the right just as much, who could not believe why anyone could vote for Labour under Corbyn.CarlottaVance said:Worth a read
https://twitter.com/guardian/status/1207550627334762496?s=21
The fullest significance of these facts lies in what it says about the reasoning of voters who made that journey. It is commonas people making reasoned decisions.
It may also follow that it is wrong to place too much weight on the idea that those who swung from Labour to Conservative have merely “lent” their votes to Boris Johnson. Brexit is certainly a top priority for these voters, and Johnson’s early reaction to his victory included a recognition that these votes were conditional. But these swing voters do not seem to be Brexit obsessives to the exclusion of all other issues. They also have some confidence in Johnson himself (at least in comparison to Corbyn) and they think the Tories would run the economy better.
If that is correct, then these newly won votes could prove to be on permanent loan, and any new Labour leader will have their work cut out to win them back. The Johnson government is focused on these voters. The Queen’s speech and the budget will be aimed at retaining them. Tony Blair predicted yesterday that, after Brexit, Johnson will try to define the Tories on the centre ground. Blair is probably right. Labour, meanwhile, will first have to regain the right to be heard and then have to set out its own measures to regain their trust. In this, precisely because they are the government, all the cards are in the Tories’ hand.
0 -
Did you hear him on R4 yesterday? I mean, really. Absolutely nowhere near the required standard. Absolutely nothing to fear.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
Of course he is reasonably intelligent and articulate. Labour could well do worse. But fear? He's not as smart as Ed Miliband, his time at the DPP was a flop, his maneuverings on Brexit really didn't help the country or his party, the more he said he had passion the more it sounded like something that he needed to say. His attempts to suck up to the Corbynistas were cringeworthy and probably poorly judged. He might do as an interim leader for some of this Parliament but I can't see him running a successful election campaign.
1 -
I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?1 -
I am convinced, David!!! :-DDavidL said:
Did you hear him on R4 yesterday? I mean, really. Absolutely nowhere near the required standard. Absolutely nothing to fear.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
Of course he is reasonably intelligent and articulate. Labour could well do worse. But fear? He's not as smart as Ed Miliband, his time at the DPP was a flop, his maneuverings on Brexit really didn't help the country or his party, the more he said he had passion the more it sounded like something that he needed to say. His attempts to suck up to the Corbynistas were cringeworthy and probably poorly judged. He might do as an interim leader for some of this Parliament but I can't see him running a successful election campaign.
0 -
Because the current law says the next election must take place on the first Thursday of May, 2024SouthamObserver said:
Why is everyone assuming the next election will be in 2024? If the Tories are doing well it’s much more likely to be in 2023.rkrkrk said:What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.0 -
The Fink has a good article in today’s Times where he notes the leadership election will be decided before any ‘period of reflection’ - a term most often used to lull your opponents into not getting their acts together.CarlottaVance said:FPT - interesting thread:
https://twitter.com/Samfr/status/1207381124189700096?s=201 -
Can you talk me through Boris Johnson’s glittering achievements and compelling back story before he became Tory leader?squareroot2 said:SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.
0 -
Truth hurts.Jonathan said:
You were straight in there on his kids, classy. Meanwhile the Telegraph are raiding his digital bins to create a thin story. And so it begins, as a Labour leader you either get a labelled a Marxist or a champagne socialist, sometimes both.squareroot2 said:
Attack dog . LOL. I just asked a simple question.Jonathan said:
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.0 -
People have mentioned PB Tories fearing Sir Keir. I don’t, as I want the Labour Party to be electable, to have a leader who could be a competent PM. I am not as confident as some that Boris will be able to win again next time and I don’t want to end up with a PM who thinks that the only reason they didn’t win last time was a biased media.
0 -
I agree that deficit reduction/elimination is no longer going to be a priority. I think that we will see a lot more capex over the next few years, funded by fairly cheap borrowing. It will work for a while but the damage caused by the GFC was profound and we are much, much weaker than we were. If things turn bad I fear we will not be in a good place and will have less room for maneuver.SouthamObserver said:
The Tories have choices to make. You cannot simultaneously increase public spending, not raise taxes, disrupt the economy with a No Deal Brexit or Canada Minus FTA and balance the books. Something will have to give. My bet is on the book balancing. It will be interesting to see the extent to which the Conservatives that remain in the Johnson Tory party are prepared to let that go.DavidL said:
There is quite a lot of insight in that article. A lot of Tories have a much more sanguine, transactional relationship with politics. It is why they are quite happy to vote for Boris whilst recognising his many flaws. Being a Tory is not a moral crusade, it doesn't need a messiah, it allows you to accept that a lot of things will be done that are sub-optimal. It's just better than any of the alternatives. It seems to be catching on.CarlottaVance said:Jonathan said:CarlottaVance said:0 -
Actually it’s the other way around. Go back a week and there wasn’t any such reference on the page. Over recent days someone has been trying very hard to insert that he is allegedly a millionaire into the article. Sometimes multiple times. Such that the page now has partial protection against vandalism.CarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/0 -
First generation immigrant who made good?SouthamObserver said:
Can you talk me through Boris Johnson’s glittering achievements and compelling back story before he became Tory leader?squareroot2 said:SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.0 -
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.1 -
Yes, that is fair. Labour needs a leader that voters feel is instinctively on their side even if they do not agree with him/her on everything. Without that it is impossible to win. See Corbyn and Miliband. I don’t know, but Starmer does not look like a frighten the horses person to me. Beyond that, the extent of any Labour recovery is largely in the hands of Boris Johnson. If he delivers on his promises, he wins again. If he doesn’t, it will get a lot more interesting. Under a Starmer or Nandy or Cooper or Phillips, Labour will be in a position to capitalise. Under a Long Bailey, they will not.CarlottaVance said:
He's clearly one of the sharpest Labour front benchers - along with Thornberry - but what the Tories fear and what former Labour voters will vote for may be two entirely different things.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
0 -
I found their positioning with May just bewildering but they were not alone in that respect. Just really, really stupid.Alistair said:I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?0 -
It will be repealed.Sandpit said:
Because the current law says the next election must take place on the first Thursday of May, 2024SouthamObserver said:
Why is everyone assuming the next election will be in 2024? If the Tories are doing well it’s much more likely to be in 2023.rkrkrk said:What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.
0 -
They were fish in a small pond who ventured into a shark infested sea.Alistair said:I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?0 -
Threw Mays deal which was pretty much directly tailored for them back in her face. Quite right that Boris ran over them in a huge red busAlistair said:I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?0 -
Of course the other thing about Starmer is that everyone f**king hates lawyers.1
-
Of the currently touted names - maybe. Although I don’t really see it. I think if one looks beyond the Corbyn loyalists in the front page you would find people they would be far more worried about. Not just as individual personalities, but as people who are far more likely to view the world as it is, rather than as they would like it to be, will move beyond anti Tory sloganising as a primary vote winning tactic, and even more importantly will try to put in place back room staff and structures which are actually aimed at doing what is needed to win, rather than fighting internal battles.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
0 -
Labour have been smearing away throughout the GE. its a bit rich when reasonable questions are asked about a politicians views and then how they behave in practice.SouthamObserver said:
Can you talk me through Boris Johnson’s glittering achievements and compelling back story before he became Tory leader?squareroot2 said:SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.
1 -
Interesting, the 'millionaire' insertions have come from Dundee and Wood Green, to name but two. In fairness Starmer has been so-described in the UK press.IanB2 said:
Actually it’s the other way around. Go back a week and there wasn’t any such reference on the page. Over recent days someone has been trying very hard to insert that he is allegedly a millionaire into the article. Sometimes multiple times. Such that the page now has partial protection against vandalism.CarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/0 -
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
1 -
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.0 -
Yep, after May’s deal went it was the only place left for him to go.Pulpstar said:
Threw Mays deal which was pretty much directly tailored for them back in her face. Quite right that Boris ran over them in a huge red busAlistair said:I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?0 -
Their whole strategy about Brexit has been fundamentally misconceived. The idea that throwing all the pieces up in the air was something that a party whose raison d'etre was to preserve the union was bonkers.Alistair said:I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?
There are Scottish Tories who seem to think that Boris Johnson won't sell them out if it's expedient for him to do so. Hope springs eternal, it seems.0 -
Err. He was Mayor of London for 8 years and was instrumental in winning the referendum. Apart from that, yes, just like Starmer.SouthamObserver said:
Can you talk me through Boris Johnson’s glittering achievements and compelling back story before he became Tory leader?squareroot2 said:SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.
I mean, come on.1 -
Lisa Nandy is the only one of the potential candidates who is at least thinking about the problem. Unlike the rest of them, she's thinking about what, not who.Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.1 -
I reckon the economy to go downhill pretty quickly (after an initial six months to a year when a lot of pent up investment might be released. He will go long.SouthamObserver said:
It will be repealed.Sandpit said:
Because the current law says the next election must take place on the first Thursday of May, 2024SouthamObserver said:
Why is everyone assuming the next election will be in 2024? If the Tories are doing well it’s much more likely to be in 2023.rkrkrk said:What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.
Johnson has no concept of money and is already splashing it about without the remotest indication of where it’s going to come from. Has anyone come up with any credible ideas yet? And there’s no law that says the markets always give a Tory PM the benefit of the doubt. Javid has his work cut out, and there’s little sign of him trying to reign Johnson in.0 -
Being a millionaire is not nearly as difficult as it used to be, particularly when house prices in London and the value of pension pots is taken into account.CarlottaVance said:
Interesting, the 'millionaire' insertions have come from Dundee and Wood Green, to name but two. In fairness Starmer has been so-described in the UK press.IanB2 said:
Actually it’s the other way around. Go back a week and there wasn’t any such reference on the page. Over recent days someone has been trying very hard to insert that he is allegedly a millionaire into the article. Sometimes multiple times. Such that the page now has partial protection against vandalism.CarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/0 -
Fake news.Slackbladder said:Of course the other thing about Starmer is that everyone f**king hates lawyers.
The country’s most electorally successful leader of recent times was a lawyer.0 -
Who do you think might have the strength of character, to do to the Momentum types today what Kinnock did to the Militant types back in the 1980s?Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.0 -
"You were straight in there on his kids, classy."Jonathan said:
You were straight in there on his kids, classy. Meanwhile the Telegraph are raiding his digital bins to create a thin story. And so it begins, as a Labour leader you either get a labelled a Marxist or a champagne socialist, sometimes both.squareroot2 said:
Attack dog . LOL. I just asked a simple question.Jonathan said:
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
Implying square root is going in on Starmers kids has deliberately nasty undertones, really poor show. Asking which kind of school his kids go to is beyond legitimate
1 -
For the Labour leadership, would welcome any insights on how unions are likely to go...
Even in 2016, it seems Owen Smith got plenty of union support with unions such as GMB and USDAW backing him. The latter two are large enough to get a candidate over the 5% threshold.
You'd imagine that any unions who were anti-Corbyn then, are likely to be anti-Corbynite this time...
The worry for me as a member is that this system may reduce my choice quite a lot. Since we have AV, finest voting system known to humanity, we can afford to have more candidates on the ballot!0 -
Worth a read. The myth of the Red Wall. It’s actually a bit better for Labour, but also a lot worse ...
https://thecritic.co.uk/the-myth-of-the-red-wall/1 -
Let's hope so. FTPA can be added to the Dangerous Dogs Act and Firearms (Amendment) Act, as laws designed for a specific situation that ended up full of unintended consequences.SouthamObserver said:
It will be repealed.Sandpit said:
Because the current law says the next election must take place on the first Thursday of May, 2024SouthamObserver said:
Why is everyone assuming the next election will be in 2024? If the Tories are doing well it’s much more likely to be in 2023.rkrkrk said:What odds do we reckon on whoever Labour choose in March actually fighting the next election in 2024?
I know the media like to big this up, but in all honesty I think Labour can afford to make the wrong choice provided they are prepared to change if it isn't working out.
In some ways, that's the more important issue at stake. We've no way of knowing who will be most effective against Boris. But whoever wins should commit to resigning if they aren't cutting through.0 -
There was little mention of the red wall before 2019. Curious that.SouthamObserver said:Worth a read. The myth of the Red Wall. It’s actually a bit better for Labour, but also a lot worse ...
https://thecritic.co.uk/the-myth-of-the-red-wall/0 -
...who everyone now f**king hates....TheScreamingEagles said:
Fake news.Slackbladder said:Of course the other thing about Starmer is that everyone f**king hates lawyers.
The country’s most electorally successful leader of recent times was a lawyer.0 -
They suffered the consequences, and IMHO these have only just started, of knowing what they did not want, and not knowing what they did. They have greatly increased the chance of a united Ireland.DavidL said:
I found their positioning with May just bewildering but they were not alone in that respect. Just really, really stupid.Alistair said:I continue to be utterly perplexed by what the DUP's goals and strategy was during the Brexit negotiation and votes.
Did they... Did they actually believe Boris when he said no PM would ever put a border down the Irish Sea?
Where they that thick?
Could I thank the Green Machine for a fascinating analysis, which is far too rare my side of the water.
1 -
Given Starmer is/was part of Corbyn's shadow cabinet, it will be reasonable to ask him for his views on a number of areas such as private schools. He needs to be clear about what he thinks and, where there are differences with Corbyn, why he thought it better to stay in the shadow cabinet.isam said:
"You were straight in there on his kids, classy."Jonathan said:
You were straight in there on his kids, classy. Meanwhile the Telegraph are raiding his digital bins to create a thin story. And so it begins, as a Labour leader you either get a labelled a Marxist or a champagne socialist, sometimes both.squareroot2 said:
Attack dog . LOL. I just asked a simple question.Jonathan said:
The Tory attack dogs.are on the hunt this morning.squareroot2 said:
ThanksCarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
Does he send his kids to the local comp one wonders. Amazing how the left enjoy wealth but try to airbrush it out.
Implying square root is going in on Starmers kids has deliberately nasty undertones, really poor show. Asking which kind of school his kids go to is beyond legitimate0 -
Kinnock did what the majority of the party elected him to do. That’s why he succeeded. Labour is in a far worse position in 2019. No potential leader wanting to change things can say so before being elected. No-one wins any election by telling voters they are wrong.Sandpit said:
Who do you think might have the strength of character, to do to the Momentum types today what Kinnock did to the Militant types back in the 1980s?Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.
1 -
Quite a lot of whistling in the dark going on. My expectation is that the FTPA will be repealed; it's got, as part of the original Act, to be re-examined next year anyway. I suspect that the worry is that we won't go back to the situation before; when the election HAD to be held no later than 5 years after it's predecessor and will be left in the gift of the PM, although I really can't see that getting through even this Parliament.
What I wonder about is what happens when Boris presents his...... what was it 30+ pages Bill about withdrawal ...... and says 'Right, you've got two Parliamentary days to debate it'.0 -
Indeed so.Fysics_Teacher said:
Being a millionaire is not nearly as difficult as it used to be, particularly when house prices in London and the value of pension pots is taken into account.CarlottaVance said:
Interesting, the 'millionaire' insertions have come from Dundee and Wood Green, to name but two. In fairness Starmer has been so-described in the UK press.IanB2 said:
Actually it’s the other way around. Go back a week and there wasn’t any such reference on the page. Over recent days someone has been trying very hard to insert that he is allegedly a millionaire into the article. Sometimes multiple times. Such that the page now has partial protection against vandalism.CarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
But to anyone who doesn't live in London or have a massive pension pot - 90% of the country - it's still a clear indication that he is one of 'them' rather than one of 'us'.0 -
In 1983 Kinnock was elected as the continuity left wing candidate.SouthamObserver said:
Kinnock did what the majority of the party elected him to do. That’s why he succeeded. Labour is in a far worse position in 2019. No potential leader wanting to change things can say so before being elected. No-one wins any election by telling voters they are wrong.Sandpit said:
Who do you think might have the strength of character, to do to the Momentum types today what Kinnock did to the Militant types back in the 1980s?Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.0 -
I just don’t see beating Ken Livingstone as a major achievement.GideonWise said:
Err. He was Mayor of London for 8 years and was instrumental in winning the referendum. Apart from that, yes, just like Starmer.SouthamObserver said:
Can you talk me through Boris Johnson’s glittering achievements and compelling back story before he became Tory leader?squareroot2 said:SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.
I mean, come on.
0 -
0
-
Good graphic. If you make paint some of the seats Labour lost to the Conservatives a different colour, it doesn't look so much like a 'red wall'SouthamObserver said:Worth a read. The myth of the Red Wall. It’s actually a bit better for Labour, but also a lot worse ...
https://thecritic.co.uk/the-myth-of-the-red-wall/
0 -
Anyhoo, I’ve watched The Rise Of Skywalker and I’m about to post a huge Star Wars spoiler.
2 -
Trouble at th'mill
https://twitter.com/jreynoldsMP/status/1207580398739501058?s=200 -
Worth going?TheScreamingEagles said:Anyhoo, I’ve watched The Rise Of Skywalker and I’m about to post a huge Star Wars spoiler.
0 -
The reviews have not been good. Is it worth watching?TheScreamingEagles said:Anyhoo, I’ve watched The Rise Of Skywalker and I’m about to post a huge Star Wars spoiler.
0 -
The Labour party have no money after the election - exactly how does Mr Reynolds think the labour party is going to get the money required to continue paying them?CarlottaVance said:Trouble at th'mill
https://twitter.com/jreynoldsMP/status/1207580398739501058?s=200 -
Any good? Off to see it tonight and the only thing I care about is will I be disappointed?TheScreamingEagles said:Anyhoo, I’ve watched The Rise Of Skywalker and I’m about to post a huge Star Wars spoiler.
0 -
I watched Knives Out last night with my partner which was brilliant and certainly has got better reviews than the final Star Wars instalment which seems to be worse than Last Jedi which I enjoyed.Jonathan said:
Worth going?TheScreamingEagles said:Anyhoo, I’ve watched The Rise Of Skywalker and I’m about to post a huge Star Wars spoiler.
I will still go though to wrap up the saga and while it will be OK ignore the hype, there are better movies out there at the moment0 -
What about David Cameron?SouthamObserver said:
I just don’t see beating Ken Livingstone as a major achievement.GideonWise said:
Err. He was Mayor of London for 8 years and was instrumental in winning the referendum. Apart from that, yes, just like Starmer.SouthamObserver said:
Can you talk me through Boris Johnson’s glittering achievements and compelling back story before he became Tory leader?squareroot2 said:SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
That's utter tosh too. The whole leadership of Labour is just a bit of entertainment which will be enjoyed immensely whist they politically stab each other in the back. Keir Starmer is a lightweight with little political backstory bar being given a sinecure of a seat in 2015. His backstory as DPP is hardly stellar.
I mean, come on.0 -
Indeed.Jonathan said:
In 1983 Kinnock was elected as the continuity left wing candidate.SouthamObserver said:
Kinnock did what the majority of the party elected him to do. That’s why he succeeded. Labour is in a far worse position in 2019. No potential leader wanting to change things can say so before being elected. No-one wins any election by telling voters they are wrong.Sandpit said:
Who do you think might have the strength of character, to do to the Momentum types today what Kinnock did to the Militant types back in the 1980s?Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.
0 -
The major question of this election therefore, is do the membership understand that the proposition of today's Labour party is the problem, or do they think it was Corbyn personally and the evil Tory media?SouthamObserver said:
Kinnock did what the majority of the party elected him to do. That’s why he succeeded. Labour is in a far worse position in 2019. No potential leader wanting to change things can say so before being elected. No-one wins any election by telling voters they are wrong.Sandpit said:
Who do you think might have the strength of character, to do to the Momentum types today what Kinnock did to the Militant types back in the 1980s?Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.
If they decide it's one more heave under someone who's not Corbyn, then we get someone like R L-B, and if they decide that they need to tack towards the more centrist floating votes then they go for someone like Starmer.0 -
So Trump impeached by the Democrat House of Representatives as expected, the Republican controlled Senate though still likely to vote against conviction0
-
Probably not at most cinemas - which from Friday will mainly be showing Star Wars or Cats on most screens.HYUFD said:
I watched Knives Out last night with my partner which was brilliant and certainly has got better reviews than the final Star Wars instalment which seems to be worse than Last Jedi which I enjoyed.Jonathan said:
Worth going?TheScreamingEagles said:Anyhoo, I’ve watched The Rise Of Skywalker and I’m about to post a huge Star Wars spoiler.
I will still go though to wrap up the saga and while it will be OK ignore the hype, there are better movies out there at the moment
And the reviews for Cats are not kind - the Telegraph review is worth reading for it's cattiness.1 -
He is not as rich as the Prime Minister and actually worked for everything he achieved. Working class aspiration and success are good things. It’s what Labour was established to enable. Sadly, too many in the party have forgotten that.Sandpit said:
Indeed so.Fysics_Teacher said:
Being a millionaire is not nearly as difficult as it used to be, particularly when house prices in London and the value of pension pots is taken into account.CarlottaVance said:
Interesting, the 'millionaire' insertions have come from Dundee and Wood Green, to name but two. In fairness Starmer has been so-described in the UK press.IanB2 said:
Actually it’s the other way around. Go back a week and there wasn’t any such reference on the page. Over recent days someone has been trying very hard to insert that he is allegedly a millionaire into the article. Sometimes multiple times. Such that the page now has partial protection against vandalism.CarlottaVance said:
Keir Starmer QC?squareroot2 said:FPT
Does anyone know how Keir Starmer became a multi millionaire (if indeed he is)
No, no idea (in fairness some of that may be in property assets).
Labour is accused of 'vile hypocrisy' for tax raid on buy-to-let landlords despite a quarter of their front bench owning second homes
Emily Thornberry owns three properties in her multimillion-pound portfolio
Keir Starmer owns a £1.75million house in London and a £600,000 Surrey home
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7465599/Labour-accused-hypocrisy-raid-landlords-despite-quarter-bench-owning-second-homes.html
And his Wiki entry has just been edited to remove "multi millionaire".
Carried out from an IP address in Northwest London:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/12/18/sir-keir-starmers-wikipedia-page-edited-ahead-expected-labour/
But to anyone who doesn't live in London or have a massive pension pot - 90% of the country - it's still a clear indication that he is one of 'them' rather than one of 'us'.
1 -
Given what's left of the labout party membership - it's one more heave and another when that flops.Sandpit said:
The major question of this election therefore, is do the membership understand that the proposition of today's Labour party is the problem, or do they think it was Corbyn personally and the evil Tory media?SouthamObserver said:
Kinnock did what the majority of the party elected him to do. That’s why he succeeded. Labour is in a far worse position in 2019. No potential leader wanting to change things can say so before being elected. No-one wins any election by telling voters they are wrong.Sandpit said:
Who do you think might have the strength of character, to do to the Momentum types today what Kinnock did to the Militant types back in the 1980s?Jonathan said:
Why Nandy? Can’t see it.SouthamObserver said:
I think Starmer has a chance, but he needs a big union to fully back him if he is to have a realistic shot because of the organisational boost it would bring. Long Bailey will have the Unite and Momentum machines fully behind her, so she must be favourite. My choice would be Nandy, just as it has been for the last three years. Sadly, though, I doubt she’ll make the contest.Sandpit said:
I think "fear" is pushing it somewhat, but he's the best of the bad bunch that is the Labour front bench.SouthamObserver said:The Tory attacks in Starmer show clearly he is the one they fear. It’s pretty transparent.
The electoral system used is going to make this a difficult market to work out (hands up who got the 100/1 on Corbyn as nominations closed in 2015?), it depends much more on factional voting, union and shad cab endorsements, than strength of character or argument.
I am looking for either a Kinnock or John Smith figure.
If they decide it's one more heave under someone who's not Corbyn, then we get someone like R L-B, and if they decide that they need to tack towards the more centrist floating votes then they go for someone like Starmer.1 -
Thanks to The Green Machine for a very interesting header. Politics in Northern Ireland seems finally shifting a bit, though perhaps the more interesting bit will he the next Stormont elections. Watching the news of the NI NHS last night, there really does need to be a government soon. The current state is intolerable.1
This discussion has been closed.