Next Scottish parliamentary general election, 6 May 2021 - Most seats
SNP 1/8 Con 8/1 Lab 12/1 LD 33/1 Grn 200/1
(Shadsy)
Is it remotely conceivable that the SNP won’t have most seats? What would have to happen?
Independence.
Yepp.
Yeah that’s fair. It must be quite frustrating to be a Scot who desperately wants Independence but doesn’t actually agree with the SNP platform otherwise.
Not really. The SNP is simply a tool for the Scottish nation to lever ourselves to sovereignty. Once we have achieved our goal, we will discard the old tool. (Or at least catalogue and archive the redundant artefact.)
I will resign my membership upon independence and will thenceforth campaign vigorously against any SNP candidates. I am far from alone in that intention.
That sounds pretty arcane to me but then I'm not a Scot. Do we give them back the Labour Party as part of the WA?
Stephen Kinnock - a younger and brighter Hilary Benn type - would be a good choice imo.
He strikes me as a bit dim, tbh.
The next successful Labour leader will be someone who has - or is willing to - rejected Corbynism: the whole Manichaean, conspiratorial us and them view of the world, everything that’s wrong is down to a few wicked people view, the bullying, misogynistic, attacking those who disagree approach to debate, the hysterical overstating of how bad everything is, the refusal to understand ordinary people’s wishes, the failure to understand the need for economic competence. Someone who can focus on priorities, come up with workable plans and drop the narcissistic self-righteousness.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
Jesus, just been listening to whatever was on on R4. Barry Gardiner came across very well. Layla Moran is a f**king moron, pedalling exactly the sort of stuff that saw them get roundly mocked this election. Oh yes, she's a domestic abuser as well. Can't see what people see in her.
I’ve been very impressed by Barry Gardiner in this campaign, one of our best media performers. I’ve not heard any suggestion whatsoever of him being a leadership candidate though.
Sadly he ruled out standing, can't see many moderates who would want to put their head up above the parapet and spend the next 5 years having the Maomentum tendency taking potshots at them. Especially with little realistic prospect of a 2024 majority.
Labour will anoint a Corbynista and think that's solved that. It has no understanding of anything outside its bubble.
I hope NPEXMP now realises that rabid left wing policies cannot win in the UK. The electorate just will.not stand for it.. even if its dressed up in red roses...
Jesus, just been listening to whatever was on on R4. Barry Gardiner came across very well. Layla Moran is a f**king moron, pedalling exactly the sort of stuff that saw them get roundly mocked this election. Oh yes, she's a domestic abuser as well. Can't see what people see in her.
I’ve been very impressed by Barry Gardiner in this campaign, one of our best media performers. I’ve not heard any suggestion whatsoever of him being a leadership candidate though.
Sadly he ruled out standing, can't see many moderates who would want to put their head up above the parapet and spend the next 5 years having the Maomentum tendency taking potshots at them. Especially with little realistic prospect of a 2024 majority.
Labour will anoint a Corbynista and think that's solved that. It has no understanding of anything outside its bubble.
Stephen Kinnock - a younger and brighter Hilary Benn type - would be a good choice imo.
He strikes me as a bit dim, tbh.
The next successful Labour leader will be someone who has - or is willing to - rejected Corbynism: the whole Manichaean, conspiratorial us and them view of the world, everything that’s wrong is down to a few wicked people view, the bullying, misogynistic, attacking those who disagree approach to debate, the hysterical overstating of how bad everything is, the refusal to understand ordinary people’s wishes, the failure to understand the need for economic competence. Someone who can focus on priorities, come up with workable plans and drop the narcissistic self-righteousness.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
Did anyone else hear the king of mendacity Jim Murphy on the radio earlier today? First time I’ve heard his sinister voice in nearly five years. Lying through his teeth as usual: apparently nobody who voted SNP yesterday realised that the party stands for Scottish independence But true to form, he was hyping Irish reunification.
Anyhoo, is Skeletor planning a comeback? I suspect so. But it won’t be in East Renfrewshire. Labour came a poor third there, with 12% of the vote (-14). (Murphy got 51% of the vote there at GE2010.)
Stephen Kinnock - a younger and brighter Hilary Benn type - would be a good choice imo.
He strikes me as a bit dim, tbh.
The next successful Labour leader will be someone who has - or is willing to - rejected Corbynism: the whole Manichaean, conspiratorial us and them view of the world, everything that’s wrong is down to a few wicked people view, the bullying, misogynistic, attacking those who disagree approach to debate, the hysterical overstating of how bad everything is, the refusal to understand ordinary people’s wishes, the failure to understand the need for economic competence. Someone who can focus on priorities, come up with workable plans and drop the narcissistic self-righteousness.
Not sure Labour need weeks to decipher the election result. It’s not rocket science , next time have a better leader with a credible manifesto.
I fear they’re going to go down the road of trying to tick the gender box and will foist either Angela Rayner or god forbid RLB onto the PLP .
I’m not interested in an ideologically pure Labour Leader , I want someone who can win elections .
As has been said a few times by you know who , better to have half a loaf then no loaf at all .
I wouldn’t bracket Rayner and RLB together. I do think the latter is a continuity Corbynite candidate, whereas Rayner does give me the impression of having a bit more adaptability.
Right now I’m feeling much like you, that first and foremost we need to get someone who can win (and I was very strongly pro-Corbyn back in 2015). But, in this changed political landscape, it’s so hard to judge who that would be. Brexit has changed everything.
When you were strongly pro Corbyn in 2015 you obviously were not thinking of who could win in an election.....
Yes. They are often bracketed together as they are pals - but Rayner is much more independent minded and more of a Corbynite of convenience than a true believer like McDonnell protege RLB. If Corbynistas are smart, they'll try and get RLB as chancellor on a joint ticket with Rayner, as after that defeat, putting forward a true believer on their own may even lose to a moderate and even if they won would probably blow up the party as the remnants of the PLP won't sit around waiting to be further humiliated this time. Rayner will be more pragmatic, but will at least offer them a continuation of some threads of policy and probably won't stymie their internal power with big party reforms.
Jesus, just been listening to whatever was on on R4. Barry Gardiner came across very well. Layla Moran is a f**king moron, pedalling exactly the sort of stuff that saw them get roundly mocked this election. Oh yes, she's a domestic abuser as well. Can't see what people see in her.
I’ve been very impressed by Barry Gardiner in this campaign, one of our best media performers. I’ve not heard any suggestion whatsoever of him being a leadership candidate though.
Sadly he ruled out standing, can't see many moderates who would want to put their head up above the parapet and spend the next 5 years having the Maomentum tendency taking potshots at them. Especially with little realistic prospect of a 2024 majority.
Labour will anoint a Corbynista and think that's solved that. It has no understanding of anything outside its bubble.
So, three terms for Boris then.
Maybe Boris, but it looks like anyone but Labour unless they get their skates on now.
Stephen Kinnock - a younger and brighter Hilary Benn type - would be a good choice imo.
He strikes me as a bit dim, tbh.
The next successful Labour leader will be someone who has - or is willing to - rejected Corbynism: the whole Manichaean, conspiratorial us and them view of the world, everything that’s wrong is down to a few wicked people view, the bullying, misogynistic, attacking those who disagree approach to debate, the hysterical overstating of how bad everything is, the refusal to understand ordinary people’s wishes, the failure to understand the need for economic competence. Someone who can focus on priorities, come up with workable plans and drop the narcissistic self-righteousness.
Not to mention the anti-semitism!
Of course. I included it in “Manichaean” and “conspiratorial”. It flourishes amongst generally stupid people who see the world in such simplistic terms. No wonder it has been called “the socialism of fools.”
I wouldn’t bracket Rayner and RLB together. I do think the latter is a continuity Corbynite candidate, whereas Rayner does give me the impression of having a bit more adaptability.
Right now I’m feeling much like you, that first and foremost we need to get someone who can win (and I was very strongly pro-Corbyn back in 2015). But, in this changed political landscape, it’s so hard to judge who that would be. Brexit has changed everything.
When you were strongly pro Corbyn in 2015 you obviously were not thinking of who could win in an election.....
I mainly wanted a Labour Party that stood for something! Back then they couldn’t even bring themselves to vote against benefit cuts, they were so timid. Scared of the right-wing press.
That’s certainly not the case, and the Corbyn era has also brought about a massive upsurge in membership and political engagement among younger people. And, a real electoral achievement in 2017.
Then, things went south which was the subject of my posts earlier on this evening. Now it’s time to move on.
Labour were heading for a shellacking in 2017 had it not been for May's atrocious campaign...
The Corbyn era has brought in a swathe of new members who have drunk at the alter of St Jezzziah in their posturing, and fucked over the party's electoral chances...
Quite frankly your post to want now an electable leader (ie one that can find some kind of credibility with the media and capital) after 5 years of this disastrous left wing experiment...I hope you have some sense of irony
I might be reading you wrong, in which case I apologise. But, it sounds to me that the leader you have in mind is basically Blair mk2. Someone quite content to do the bidding of the likes of the likes of Rupert Murdoch, and keep the City of London happy and not tax the billionaires more than they absolutely have to.
I might have indicated preparedness to compromise, but I am absolutely not in support of going back to that. It’s not even worth bothering to vote, never mind campaign, if all the parties have just the same ideas, for just a little bit of tinkering round the edges. I’d say I’m probably on the more pragmatic end of the ‘Corbyn supporter’ spectrum. Read into that what you will.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
Len mccluskey has told us that the next leader won't be a London Remainer.
Bet accordingly.
Frankly, McCluskey needs to get off the stage. He’s been part of the problem. Unlikely to be part of the solution.
I was quite surprised by some of his comments. Sounded remarkably Blue Labour. I agree with him that this is where we need to be, celebrating the values and culture of northern working class communities rather than sneering at them.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
Perhaps you’re not SeanT. Sean was never very keen on morality.
I think it would have been Burnley or Redcar if a video were available. I never expected either of those to go to the Tories.
One feature these seats have in common is that both have gone LibDem at a GE in recent years.
Which indicates that perhaps they're not as monolithically Labour as the 'Red Wall' angle suggests. And also that they're not averse to political change locally. There likely are/were Lab seats with smaller majorities that are nevertheless much harder to convert due to lower volatility.
Next Scottish parliamentary general election, 6 May 2021 - Most seats
SNP 1/8 Con 8/1 Lab 12/1 LD 33/1 Grn 200/1
(Shadsy)
Is it remotely conceivable that the SNP won’t have most seats? What would have to happen?
Independence.
Yepp.
Yeah that’s fair. It must be quite frustrating to be a Scot who desperately wants Independence but doesn’t actually agree with the SNP platform otherwise.
Not really. The SNP is simply a tool for the Scottish nation to lever ourselves to sovereignty. Once we have achieved our goal, we will discard the old tool. (Or at least catalogue and archive the redundant artefact.)
I will resign my membership upon independence and will thenceforth campaign vigorously against any SNP candidates. I am far from alone in that intention.
That sounds pretty arcane to me but then I'm not a Scot. Do we give them back the Labour Party as part of the WA?
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
I used to think that nothing would ever be as good again after Botham's Ashes, and I still do.
It feels a bit like we entered a wormhole in June 2017 and ended up here with the result we expected then. The intervening two and half years didn't really happen. (The only problem with that theory is that the Tory leader changed sex).
It feels a bit like we entered a wormhole in June 2017 and ended up here with the result we expected then. The intervening two and half years didn't really happen.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
With the exception of Swinson, that just shows how politically suicidal defecting is.
Sturgeon and Lucas were also big #peoplesvote supporters and speakers, did rather well.
Stephen Kinnock - a younger and brighter Hilary Benn type - would be a good choice imo.
He strikes me as a bit dim, tbh.
The next successful Labour leader will be someone who has - or is willing to - rejected Corbynism: the whole Manichaean, conspiratorial us and them view of the world, everything that’s wrong is down to a few wicked people view, the bullying, misogynistic, attacking those who disagree approach to debate, the hysterical overstating of how bad everything is, the refusal to understand ordinary people’s wishes, the failure to understand the need for economic competence. Someone who can focus on priorities, come up with workable plans and drop the narcissistic self-righteousness.
Not to mention the anti-semitism!
Of course. I included it in “Manichaean” and “conspiratorial”. It flourishes amongst generally stupid people who see the world in such simplistic terms. No wonder it has been called “the socialism of fools.”
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
In terms of Northern Ireland parties, I think it's onwards and upwards for The Alliance Party and SDLP can only grow their vote share. I think those DUP safe seats are no longer safe.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
In terms of Northern Ireland parties, I think it's onwards and upwards for The Alliance Party and SDLP can only grow their vote share. I think those DUP safe seats are no longer safe.
How do you rate the chances of Irish reunification within the next 10 years?
(Many thanks for your NI posts, especially your comprehensive, and objective, analysis early on in the campaign.)
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
Hurrah and double hurrah
I asked if there was a betting market on none of the defectors winning, but it was 'too complicated' to decide who to include apparently.
Next Scottish parliamentary general election, 6 May 2021 - Most seats
SNP 1/8 Con 8/1 Lab 12/1 LD 33/1 Grn 200/1
(Shadsy)
Is it remotely conceivable that the SNP won’t have most seats? What would have to happen?
Independence.
Yepp.
Yeah that’s fair. It must be quite frustrating to be a Scot who desperately wants Independence but doesn’t actually agree with the SNP platform otherwise.
Not really. The SNP is simply a tool for the Scottish nation to lever ourselves to sovereignty. Once we have achieved our goal, we will discard the old tool. (Or at least catalogue and archive the redundant artefact.)
I will resign my membership upon independence and will thenceforth campaign vigorously against any SNP candidates. I am far from alone in that intention.
That sounds pretty arcane to me but then I'm not a Scot. Do we give them back the Labour Party as part of the WA?
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
With the exception of Swinson, that just shows how politically suicidal defecting is.
Sturgeon and Lucas were also big #peoplesvote supporters and speakers, did rather well.
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
I notice Dan Jarvis getting back in Barnsley Central. Wasn't he the future once?
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
Next Scottish parliamentary general election, 6 May 2021 - Most seats
SNP 1/8 Con 8/1 Lab 12/1 LD 33/1 Grn 200/1
(Shadsy)
Is it remotely conceivable that the SNP won’t have most seats? What would have to happen?
Independence.
Yepp.
Yeah that’s fair. It must be quite frustrating to be a Scot who desperately wants Independence but doesn’t actually agree with the SNP platform otherwise.
Not really. The SNP is simply a tool for the Scottish nation to lever ourselves to sovereignty. Once we have achieved our goal, we will discard the old tool. (Or at least catalogue and archive the redundant artefact.)
I will resign my membership upon independence and will thenceforth campaign vigorously against any SNP candidates. I am far from alone in that intention.
That sounds pretty arcane to me but then I'm not a Scot. Do we give them back the Labour Party as part of the WA?
As arcane as Brexit killing the Brexit Party.
I think it was suicide
We’ve finally found the common denominator between Jo Swinson, Nigel Farage and Jeremy Corbyn.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most is the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Sure you don't want to start worrying that 70 election courts might overrule the result?
Heh
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Caroline Flint was the only MP I could see as capable of winning back the North for Labour.
Agree about Flint, but not Swinson. That shrill speech she gave today was full of bitterness and self pity. Not a single ounce of contrition. Bit like Corbyn.
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
I wouldn’t bracket Rayner and RLB together. I do think the latter is a continuity Corbynite candidate, whereas Rayner does give me the impression of having a bit more adaptability.
Right now I’m feeling much like you, that first and foremost we need to get someone who can win (and I was very strongly pro-Corbyn back in 2015). But, in this changed political landscape, it’s so hard to judge who that would be. Brexit has changed everything.
When you were strongly pro Corbyn in 2015 you obviously were not thinking of who could win in an election.....
I mainly wanted a Labour Party that stood for something! Back then they couldn’t even bring themselves to vote against benefit cuts, they were so timid. Scared of the right-wing press.
That’s certainly not the case, and the Corbyn era has also brought about a massive upsurge in membership and political engagement among younger people. And, a real electoral achievement in 2017.
Then, things went south which was the subject of my posts earlier on this evening. Now it’s time to move on.
Labour were heading for a shellacking in 2017 had it not been for May's atrocious campaign...
The Corbyn era has brought in a swathe of new members who have drunk at the alter of St Jezzziah in their posturing, and fucked over the party's electoral chances...
Quite frankly your post to want now an electable leader (ie one that can find some kind of credibility with the media and capital) after 5 years of this disastrous left wing experiment...I hope you have some sense of irony
I might be reading you wrong, in which case I apologise. But, it sounds to me that the leader you have in mind is basically Blair mk2. Someone quite content to do the bidding of the likes of the likes of Rupert Murdoch, and keep the City of London happy and not tax the billionaires more than they absolutely have to.
I might have indicated preparedness to compromise, but I am absolutely not in support of going back to that. It’s not even worth bothering to vote, never mind campaign, if all the parties have just the same ideas, for just a little bit of tinkering round the edges. I’d say I’m probably on the more pragmatic end of the ‘Corbyn supporter’ spectrum. Read into that what you will.
Blair is the only Labour leader to win a decent majority in my lifetime, and I’m so old I did O-levels.
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
Lisa Nandy is quite impressive IMO.
Can you see her as a future PM though? No chance IMO. There is nobody on the Labour side who fits that description. Boris takes the mantle that Tony Blair did - he'll be the only game in town for many years.
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
Ian Murray is quite good, but as some wit said earlier, if he became Leader he’d have to actually mention the word “Labour” in his election literature
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Totally right.
I went to a Remainery Xmas lunch of journalists, painters, artists, etc, today
Early on, one woman confided in me (presuming that I agreed with her Remainerry outlook) that Boris won the vote because his voters, the poor white English, are "just stupid". She sniggered at me, looking for agreement.
I told her to fuck off (in terms) and go and talk to someone else.
These people are detestable snobs. They need to be defeated time and again. They need to be expelled from politics.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
The big impact that hasn't been talked about is the massacre of the People's Voters. Grieve, Berger, Soubry, Gyimah, Swinson, Umunna, Wollaston, Lee, Gauke. Every prominent figure associated with that campaign was wiped out.
I cannot see any current Labour MP beating Boris at the next election. Not by a long chalk. And this talk of Jess Phillips being leadership material makes me chuckle. She would crash Labour to sub 100 seats. Starmer is a personality free zone with the charisma of a toilet roll. RLB is Corbyn with 2 'X' chromosomes. Dawn Butler would sink like a lead balloon outside of London.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
Next Scottish parliamentary general election, 6 May 2021 - Most seats
SNP 1/8 Con 8/1 Lab 12/1 LD 33/1 Grn 200/1
(Shadsy)
Is it remotely conceivable that the SNP won’t have most seats? What would have to happen?
Independence.
Yepp.
Yeah that’s fair. It must be quite frustrating to be a Scot who desperately wants Independence but doesn’t actually agree with the SNP platform otherwise.
Not really. The SNP is simply a tool for the Scottish nation to lever ourselves to sovereignty. Once we have achieved our goal, we will discard the old tool. (Or at least catalogue and archive the redundant artefact.)
I will resign my membership upon independence and will thenceforth campaign vigorously against any SNP candidates. I am far from alone in that intention.
That sounds pretty arcane to me but then I'm not a Scot. Do we give them back the Labour Party as part of the WA?
As arcane as Brexit killing the Brexit Party.
I think it was suicide
We’ve finally found the common denominator between Jo Swinson, Nigel Farage and Jeremy Corbyn.
With Jo and Jeremy it was accidental so not technically suicide, with Nigel? He is saying it was wittingly performed and he does still live to fight another day if he chooses. I think that's just about right, so I disagree: no common denominator.
Sure you don't want to start worrying that 70 election courts might overrule the result?
Heh
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Caroline Flint was the only MP I could see as capable of winning back the North for Labour.
Agree about Flint, but not Swinson. That shrill speech she gave today was full of bitterness and self pity. Not a single ounce of contrition. Bit like Corbyn.
Her life's work had just collapsed, have some compassion. For all her faults she genuinely believes in what she advocates. There is little place for raw honesty in modern politics.
Sure you don't want to start worrying that 70 election courts might overrule the result?
Heh
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Caroline Flint was the only MP I could see as capable of winning back the North for Labour.
Agree about Flint, but not Swinson. That shrill speech she gave today was full of bitterness and self pity. Not a single ounce of contrition. Bit like Corbyn.
Her life's work had just collapsed, have some compassion. For all her faults she genuinely believes in what she advocates. There is little place for raw honesty in modern politics.
Swinson must be devastated. You have to feel for her.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most is the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
I don't know how you manage to keep a straight face. I'm assuming you do, for the craic.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Totally right.
I went to a Remainery Xmas lunch of journalists, painters, artists, etc, today
Early on, one woman confided in me (presuming that I agreed with her Remainerry outlook) that Boris won the vote because his voters, the poor white English, are "just stupid". She sniggered at me, looking for agreement.
I told her to fuck off (in terms) and go and talk to someone else.
These people are detestable snobs. They need to be defeated time and again. They need to be expelled from politics.
My missus' family are mainly Labour (her sister is a Corbynista), I remember how they abused her when she mentioned voting Tory. Yes, her own family abused her. It took me all my willpower and strength not to do something stupid I was so disgusted.
Not heard a fucking peep from any of them recently, and my missus made me promise not to goad them, so I won't. But boy I would fucking LOVE to.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most is the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Working class idiots and billionaires are strange bedfellows.
Sure you don't want to start worrying that 70 election courts might overrule the result?
Heh
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Caroline Flint was the only MP I could see as capable of winning back the North for Labour.
Agree about Flint, but not Swinson. That shrill speech she gave today was full of bitterness and self pity. Not a single ounce of contrition. Bit like Corbyn.
Swinson’s interminable whining speech earlier today was a great illustration for why she bombed. Absolutely zero self-awareness. Being bitter and resentful is not a good look for losers.
A SLab spokeswoman (missed the name) was on a similar path on the radio in the middle of the night: she sounded absolutely dreadful. Bursting with pure hatred and spite for her opponents.
Well, the Conservatives’ wholly undeserved success was dismal last night and the triumphalism of their supporters tonight is still less edifying. Enjoy your moment. Meanwhile, the country is going up shit creek.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most is the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Working class idiots and billionaires are strange bedfellows.
Somewhere on the newly elected Lab back bench there is a young Blair.
Well, the Conservatives’ wholly undeserved success was dismal last night and the triumphalism of their supporters tonight is still less edifying. Enjoy your moment. Meanwhile, the country is going up shit creek.
Yeah, the surge in the pound and the FTSE 250 shows we are heading for disaster...
Has anyone seen the Horse Battery guy? I hope he's bearing up okay. (Not being sarcastic).
He was here in the morning thread, talking about joining Labour so he can help shift it back to the centre left.
I like him, he's thoughtful and presents views from the other side in a non-confrontational way.
Compare and contrast that to the person I've been friends with for a decade posting on social media "IF YOU ARE A TORY" (yes in caps) "F*** OFF AND UNFRIEND ME NOW YOU ****" last night.
The post below that in my feed was from another friend who didn't understand why Corbyn had lost when they had seen "literally no-one" post anything in support of the Conservatives. The mind truly boggles.
I reckon it's about 1983 right now. Which means it's at least another decade before a Blair figure emerges. Who knows. Could even be CHB! Let's face it, the Labour Party could easily do a lot worse.
Labour were heading for a shellacking in 2017 had it not been for May's atrocious campaign...
The Corbyn era has brought in a swathe of new members who have drunk at the alter of St Jezzziah in their posturing, and fucked over the party's electoral chances...
Quite frankly your post to want now an electable leader (ie one that can find some kind of credibility with the media and capital) after 5 years of this disastrous left wing experiment...I hope you have some sense of irony
I might be reading you wrong, in which case I apologise. But, it sounds to me that the leader you have in mind is basically Blair mk2. Someone quite content to do the bidding of the likes of the likes of Rupert Murdoch, and keep the City of London happy and not tax the billionaires more than they absolutely have to.
I might have indicated preparedness to compromise, but I am absolutely not in support of going back to that. It’s not even worth bothering to vote, never mind campaign, if all the parties have just the same ideas, for just a little bit of tinkering round the edges. I’d say I’m probably on the more pragmatic end of the ‘Corbyn supporter’ spectrum. Read into that what you will.
Blair is the only Labour leader to win a decent majority in my lifetime, and I’m so old I did O-levels.
It’s as though it’s a football match, and what matters is *winning* and beating the other lot.
I’m not saying Blair didn’t do any good, but that government didn’t change the country for the better. The richest 1% continued pulling away from the rest, and terrible policies like PFI and AtoS assessments were pursued.
Sure you don't want to start worrying that 70 election courts might overrule the result?
Heh
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Caroline Flint was the only MP I could see as capable of winning back the North for Labour.
Agree about Flint, but not Swinson. That shrill speech she gave today was full of bitterness and self pity. Not a single ounce of contrition. Bit like Corbyn.
Her life's work had just collapsed, have some compassion. For all her faults she genuinely believes in what she advocates. There is little place for raw honesty in modern politics.
Swinson must be devastated. You have to feel for her.
A string of bad calls. Somebody with more experience wouldn't have made them. Vince should have stepped down after 2017 and allowed someone else to take over - Swinson would not have been a candidate.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness, no election victory has ever delighted me more.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
What I am enjoying most the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Totally right.
I went to a Remainery Xmas lunch of journalists, painters, artists, etc, today
Early on, one woman confided in me (presuming that I agreed with her Remainerry outlook) that Boris won the vote because his voters, the poor white English, are "just stupid". She sniggered at me, looking for agreement.
I told her to fuck off (in terms) and go and talk to someone else.
These people are detestable snobs. They need to be defeated time and again. They need to be expelled from politics.
My missus' family are mainly Labour (her sister is a Corbynista), I remember how they abused her when she mentioned voting Tory. Yes, her own family abused her. It took me all my willpower and strength not to do something stupid I was so disgusted.
Not heard a fucking peep from any of them recently, and my missus made me promise not to goad them, so I won't. But boy I would fucking LOVE to.
How could you wed a Tory? Jesus...having to wake up every morning and stare into the face of a fucking Tory...like Groundhog Day, but more evil
Well, the Conservatives’ wholly undeserved success was dismal last night and the triumphalism of their supporters tonight is still less edifying. Enjoy your moment. Meanwhile, the country is going up shit creek.
Yeah, the surge in the pound and the FTSE 250 shows we are heading for disaster...
Leavers have spent the time since the referendum earnestly arguing how good a low pound is for the economy. Make your minds up.
Well, the Conservatives’ wholly undeserved success was dismal last night and the triumphalism of their supporters tonight is still less edifying. Enjoy your moment. Meanwhile, the country is going up shit creek.
Im sure it will last longer than a day, but bemoaning a party's supporters being triumphant literally one day after a landslide win for that party is just plain stupid. The country is on a very tricky precipice and I think they cannot handle it well, but whinging about triumphalism within 24 hrs of the win? Pathetic. I think one day of celebration can be bared before we get on a high horse.
Well, the Conservatives’ wholly undeserved success was dismal last night and the triumphalism of their supporters tonight is still less edifying. Enjoy your moment. Meanwhile, the country is going up shit creek.
Well, the Conservatives’ wholly undeserved success was dismal last night and the triumphalism of their supporters tonight is still less edifying. Enjoy your moment. Meanwhile, the country is going up shit creek.
We won, you didn't.
It's SO satisfying
That warm feeling you have is from having pissed yourself.
If only the great SeanT were still here you could challenge him to a drinking contest. He was a truly legendary drinker, but I feel he has nothing on you.
In all seriousness,
What I am enjoying most the reaction from my friends.
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
Totally right.
I went to a Remainery Xmas lunch of journalists, painters, artists, etc, today
Early on, one woman confided in me (presuming that I agreed with her Remainerry outlook) that Boris won the vote because his voters, the poor white English, are "just stupid". She sniggered at me, looking for agreement.
I told her to fuck off (in terms) and go and talk to someone else.
These people are detestable snobs. They need to be defeated time and again. They need to be expelled from politics.
My missus' family are mainly Labour (her sister is a Corbynista), I remember how they abused her when she mentioned voting Tory. Yes, her own family abused her. It took me all my willpower and strength not to do something stupid I was so disgusted.
Not heard a fucking peep from any of them recently, and my missus made me promise not to goad them, so I won't. But boy I would fucking LOVE to.
How could you wed a Tory? Jesus...having to wake up every morning and stare into the face of a fucking Tory...like Groundhog Day, but more evil
Clem Attlee married a Tory. They seemed very happy together.
Sure you don't want to start worrying that 70 election courts might overrule the result?
Heh
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
Caroline Flint was the only MP I could see as capable of winning back the North for Labour.
Agree about Flint, but not Swinson. That shrill speech she gave today was full of bitterness and self pity. Not a single ounce of contrition. Bit like Corbyn.
Swinson’s interminable whining speech earlier today was a great illustration for why she bombed. Absolutely zero self-awareness. Being bitter and resentful is not a good look for losers.
A SLab spokeswoman (missed the name) was on a similar path on the radio in the middle of the night: she sounded absolutely dreadful. Bursting with pure hatred and spite for her opponents.
Couldn't agree more. I thought her speech today was puerile, embittered, incredibly selfish, and somewhat deluded. She has done her level best to undo a democratic mandate then has the brass neck to describe herself off as a liberal and a democrat - which she is clearly neither. A richly deserved humiliation IMO.
Comments
https://twitter.com/JenWilliamsMEN/status/1205573267026849794
The next successful Labour leader will be someone who has - or is willing to - rejected Corbynism: the whole Manichaean, conspiratorial us and them view of the world, everything that’s wrong is down to a few wicked people view, the bullying, misogynistic, attacking those who disagree approach to debate, the hysterical overstating of how bad everything is, the refusal to understand ordinary people’s wishes, the failure to understand the need for economic competence. Someone who can focus on priorities, come up with workable plans and drop the narcissistic self-righteousness.
All other Labourites need to be like him, and LEARN. Until they do, they are TOSTADA
I had vague ideas of doing something like this for Chris Williamson after last election, but Corbyn survived.
In one go: we got Brexit finally sorted, we delivered five years of good Tory government, and, most of all, we utterly wiped out a vile, evil, anti-Semitic, neo-Marxist opposition
It is GLORIOUS. Morally right and emotionally climactic. This is the political version of Flintoff's Ashes: politics will never be this good again.
But, just once in my life, it WAS this good.
Anyhoo, is Skeletor planning a comeback? I suspect so. But it won’t be in East Renfrewshire. Labour came a poor third there, with 12% of the vote (-14). (Murphy got 51% of the vote there at GE2010.)
Watch yer back Richard!
I might have indicated preparedness to compromise, but I am absolutely not in support of going back to that. It’s not even worth bothering to vote, never mind campaign, if all the parties have just the same ideas, for just a little bit of tinkering round the edges. I’d say I’m probably on the more pragmatic end of the ‘Corbyn supporter’ spectrum. Read into that what you will.
Hehehehehehehehe
If I had to select downsides to this election, the defeats of Caroline Flint and Jo Swinson would be in there.
Two good women, the second was unlucky, the first, Flint, was absolutely undeserving. They are a loss.
But on the whole...
Hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe
One feature these seats have in common is that both have gone LibDem at a GE in recent years.
Which indicates that perhaps they're not as monolithically Labour as the 'Red Wall' angle suggests. And also that they're not averse to political change locally. There likely are/were Lab seats with smaller majorities that are nevertheless much harder to convert due to lower volatility.
Sturgeon and Lucas were also big #peoplesvote supporters and speakers, did rather well.
Can anyone honestly and genuinely point at a Labour MP and say 'yup, there's a potential future PM'?
Actually, the most impressive Labour MP I have seen post catastrophe was Wes Streeting - but we all know he would never get the votes.
Labour are stuck with the membership they have forever. They're screwed, and they know it.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50766203
(Many thanks for your NI posts, especially your comprehensive, and objective, analysis early on in the campaign.)
I asked if there was a betting market on none of the defectors winning, but it was 'too complicated' to decide who to include apparently.
Wonder what the price would've been on that lot?
I'm quiet in real life. I keep my politics to myself. It's sort of like your wedding tackle. You just don't get it out at family gatherings or wave it round in the pub.
So people talk to me. And they assume I'm one of them. I just listen silently and nod.
And they tell me how they're devastated. How they didn't see it coming. How the Tories are all evil and everyone who votes for them is evil too.
They are shell shocked.
They just don't see it. They blame the working class. "Idiots". They blame the media. "Billionaires". They never stop for a moment's introspection to wonder why they lost.
It is utter derangement and it makes me feel as if they will double down in 2024. The lack of self awareness is extraordinary. I think it may be a very long time before a Blair figure emerges. A very long time indeed.
https://twitter.com/khaliistan_1984/status/1205465776943255553
Fuck the fucking lot of the fuckers.
The only person who can defeat him is himself.
“The exit poll was so shocking, Prince Andrew stopped sweating again.”
I went to a Remainery Xmas lunch of journalists, painters, artists, etc, today
Early on, one woman confided in me (presuming that I agreed with her Remainerry outlook) that Boris won the vote because his voters, the poor white English, are "just stupid". She sniggered at me, looking for agreement.
I told her to fuck off (in terms) and go and talk to someone else.
These people are detestable snobs. They need to be defeated time and again. They need to be expelled from politics.
https://twitter.com/khaliistan_1984/status/1205247744488681472
After a long period of mourning, perhaps they will read 'The Unfinished Revolution' and realise we have been here before.
Not heard a fucking peep from any of them recently, and my missus made me promise not to goad them, so I won't. But boy I would fucking LOVE to.
A SLab spokeswoman (missed the name) was on a similar path on the radio in the middle of the night: she sounded absolutely dreadful. Bursting with pure hatred and spite for her opponents.
I note that a number of new partisan posters disappeared at 2200 last night.
Or maybe elected in 2024.
I like him, he's thoughtful and presents views from the other side in a non-confrontational way.
Compare and contrast that to the person I've been friends with for a decade posting on social media "IF YOU ARE A TORY" (yes in caps) "F*** OFF AND UNFRIEND ME NOW YOU ****" last night.
The post below that in my feed was from another friend who didn't understand why Corbyn had lost when they had seen "literally no-one" post anything in support of the Conservatives. The mind truly boggles.
I reckon it's about 1983 right now. Which means it's at least another decade before a Blair figure emerges. Who knows. Could even be CHB! Let's face it, the Labour Party could easily do a lot worse.
I’m not saying Blair didn’t do any good, but that government didn’t change the country for the better. The richest 1% continued pulling away from the rest, and terrible policies like PFI and AtoS assessments were pursued.
And then there was Iraq.
Losing her seat was always a real concern.
How could you wed a Tory? Jesus...having to wake up every morning and stare into the face of a fucking Tory...like Groundhog Day, but more evil
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2019-50770830
It's SO satisfying
What a total and utter disaster he has been for Labour.
I hope all those Lab activists who voted twice can live with themselves.
'No one has ever had a fantasy about being tied to a bed and sexually ravished by someone dressed as a liberal'