politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Corbyn’s big speech – David Herdson’s take
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Remove the beam....Philip_Thompson said:
Where was the obsession with "mandate" when the government of the day ratified Lisbon without a manifesto despite their manifesto pledging the opposite?AlastairMeeks said:
There is not the slightest plausible evidence that the government is seeking a deal. Far from it: it is trashing the only deal that is currently available and making no steps to identify an alternative one.algarkirk said:
It may be there is no specific mandate for no deal, and other things too, but in this world there are politically inevitable things, and operations of law. There are also ways to negotiate, and the government is taking the only way in the circumstances to try to get a deal given that the commons has rejected the first route. If that leads to no deal then a lot of MPs will have some soul searching to do, (though they won't).AlastairMeeks said:
The way in which the referendum was fought is integral to what is politically permissible. Technically, the referendum was advisory only. In reality, ignoring it was a non-starter. Rightly, the government sought to implement the referendum and to do so in accordance with the way it was fought.david_herdson said:
Referendums don't given mandates to specific policies, not least because the people campaigning for them are not necessarily the ones implementing them.AlastairMeeks said:
There was a prospectus for the referendum, that prospectus has now been abandoned by its proponents. There is no mandate for no deal Brexit. It is completely inconsistent with the mandate sought.Currystardog said:
It is totally wrong, we had a referendum, Brexit won, democracy must be followed. It is Politicians playing silly games that has got us into this position, but whatever, democracy must be followed.
The options on the ballot paper were Remain and Leave, and Leave won. That gives a mandate for everything from EEA+CU+SM+Schengen+etc through to a Drawbridge Brexit. It should be for parliament to sort that one out.
In the same way as claiming that the referendum was advisory only, claiming a mandate for something that was angrily dismissed by proponents throughout the campaign (and for a long time afterwards) because it is technically consistent with the ballot paper is preposterous.
There is no mandate for no deal. And since there is no mandate for no deal, a new mandate is required if the government is to lead the country down that path.
How come the issue about "mandate" only occurs when its an issue that worries you?0 -
Why not? You're not avoiding your debts, you're choosing not to pay an additional tax.glw said:
Of course you can leg it to avoid your debts, but it's not really a great plan long term, and I don't think many people would leave to avoid paying a bit more tax.kyf_100 said:
If everyone in the UK who has a degree has to pay an additional tax, it's rather easy to avoid that tax by leaving the country.glw said:
I would introduce a graduate tax that deliberately collects more than the loans* do, I think a government could spin it as fairer and gain wide support for it.RobD said:Just call it a graduate tax and be done with it. I think you could also get away with a lower rate if it was always charged, rather than being a fixed amount to repay.
* Yes, I know it sort of is a tax anyway.
Most of the people I went to school / uni with are scattered all over the world now - from New York to Dubai to Shanghai. A grad tax of say 10% makes every foreign job look 10% more attractive.
Or we could just drag the country back to the 70s faster than you can say "brain drain".0 -
Mr. Borough, indeed, 'social credit' is alarming.
So many things are now mostly online or can be made that way. In real life, mobile phones can be tracked, and facial recognition software is only getting more advanced.0 -
Remember we joined the ERM when GBP = DM 2.95. Today it is DM 2.10rottenborough said:
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That 'Shrug' mentality shining right through.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
Those of us that have had the experience of bringing up children will know exactly how you feel. Yes, there is much to be said for letting them learn by experience, but not at the cost of letting them do themselves irretrievable harm.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
Blimey, Paul Krugman talking sense. Whatever next?rottenborough said:
"But the MMT people are just wrong in believing that the only question you need to ask about the budget deficit is whether it supplies the right amount of aggregate demand; financeability matters too, even with fiat money."david_herdson said:
Mayor Pete was quite good on the deficit these last couple of days. If he carries on like that he'll have no chance.rottenborough said:
It is called MMT - Modern Monetary Theory. If Corbyn wins then UK will be the testing laboratory for this new idea*, which basically involves printing money. US may follow if Dems win.david_herdson said:
The Johnson pledges are irresponsible enough, and not leaving without the disruption of No Deal would help, but it's an entire magic money forest Corbyn needs to pick to fund what he's promising.TheScreamingEagles said:David Herdson: There were *a lot* of very expensive pledges in his speech:
- Free university tuition
- Renationalisation of key industries
- "Ending austerity" i.e. major increases in day-to-day spending
How will this all be paid for?
Answer: It'll be paid from the same magic money tree that Johnson is funding his pledges from.
Plus there's the 'Brexit dividend'.
* Well, they say 'new' but I have a vague sense I've seen this one before.
But I fear you may be right. It's that long since Britain's had proper inflation that the threat of its return may well be wished away as scaremongering or at the least, downplayed far too far.
https://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/08/15/mmt-again/
I wonder why he didn't understand what is now his own argument when he was supporting Gordon Brown's insane position of around 2010. I remember reading an article by him when he said bumping up UK government spending was fine because Denmark had successfully done so - completely ignoring both the difference in deficit and the difference in debt between the two countries.
Still, a sinner repenteth and all that.0 -
The obsession with mandates comes from the death cult Leavers, who insist that the country must be hurled from the EU without a deal on that basis. But since there is no mandate, the idea of inflicting lasting harm on the country requires rather more than a Prime Minister who the country did not vote for leading a government that does not have a majority imposing a policy that the electorate has never had the chance to pass judgement on.Philip_Thompson said:
Where was the obsession with "mandate" when the government of the day ratified Lisbon without a manifesto despite their manifesto pledging the opposite?AlastairMeeks said:
There is not the slightest plausible evidence that the government is seeking a deal. Far from it: it is trashing the only deal that is currently available and making no steps to identify an alternative one.
There is no mandate for no deal. And since there is no mandate for no deal, a new mandate is required if the government is to lead the country down that path.
How come the issue about "mandate" only occurs when its an issue that worries you?0 -
Here's the thing, it doesn't tend to get rewarded at the ballot box. Voters like their parties first and foremost to stick it to THEM.Peter_the_Punter said:
Good but worrying examples, Pulpstar. Neither May nor Clegg reaped much reward for putting the Country first.Pulpstar said:
I think May at the end genuinely was putting country before party. The 30 or so Labour backbenchers who (Who knows ?) support the deal should probably have compromised at that point (MV3). Clegg certainly put country above party when it came to the 2010-15 ministry. Johnson won't.justin124 said:
Labour must be following the splendid example given by Cameron and the Tory party. He called the Referendum for reasons of party advantage - no national interest there. This entire mess is down to him. Then Theresa May called the 2017 election for reasons of political gain - even though things did not go to plan.Pulpstar said:
Always party before country for Labour. Always.Currystardog said:
Yet politicians (mainly Labour) voted against the deal, how is that respecting the referendum result?
The Tory ranks are not full of David Herdsons and Richard Nabavis and Labour isn't full of Southam Observers right now.1 -
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:0 -
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:0 -
Mr. Surbiton, there's no modern day Deutschmark and the single currency is (from Germany's perspective) permanently weaker than it should be due to all those non-exporting powerhouses that are members. It's a very flawed comparison.0
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Boris Johnson claimed in the run up to the 2016 vote that a leave vote followed by a poor deal could be followed by a decision to stay. Politics home has a link to Johnsons quote. It should be used against Johnson now given No Deal...SirNorfolkPassmore said:
True for the 2016 referendum, but not as a general rule.david_herdson said:
Referendums don't given mandates to specific policies, not least because the people campaigning for them are not necessarily the ones implementing them.
It's perfectly possible - indeed fairly common - to have a fully drafted piece of legislation and ask simply whether or not to sign the secondary legislation saying "this comes into effect on 1st January".
That obviously wasn't possible for the 2016 referendum, because the EU simply weren't going to negotiate a deal to leave on the basis Britain might leave - it'd be an awful waste of time and set a terrible precedent.
A second referendum could (and perhaps should) have been baked in from the start ("if you vote Leave, we'll negotiate and then put the Leave deal to you in a second referendum"). But Cameron didn't expect to lose, and also would have felt that such an arrangement would make a Leave vote more likely (and I suspect it would as it would have reduced the fear factor). And, given it wasn't baked in, I can see why Leavers now see it as sneaky whereas they'd probably have accepted it at the time.0 -
No - they were not responsible for calling the Referendum in response to fear of UKIP.Big_G_NorthWales said:
I think 17.4 million people may well be more responsible.justin124 said:
Labour must be following the splendid example given by Cameron and the Tory party. He called the Referendum for reasons of party advantage - no national interest there. This entire mess is down to him. Then Theresa May called the 2017 election for reasons of political gain - even though things did not go to plan.Pulpstar said:
Always party before country for Labour. Always.Currystardog said:
Yet politicians (mainly Labour) voted against the deal, how is that respecting the referendum result?
They had a choice and chose to leave0 -
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:0 -
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
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You pay it Euros obviously. I really don't think you have a point.surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:0 -
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.0 -
+1 Boris is mandateless. I spent 15 mins yesterday writing to No.10 critising No Deal. BJ will never see my letter but if enough pissed off people write to No.10 the penny might drop that no deal is unacceptabe....AlastairMeeks said:
The obsession with mandates comes from the death cult Leavers, who insist that the country must be hurled from the EU without a deal on that basis. But since there is no mandate, the idea of inflicting lasting harm on the country requires rather more than a Prime Minister who the country did not vote for leading a government that does not have a majority imposing a policy that the electorate has never had the chance to pass judgement on.Philip_Thompson said:
Where was the obsession with "mandate" when the government of the day ratified Lisbon without a manifesto despite their manifesto pledging the opposite?AlastairMeeks said:
There is not the slightest plausible evidence that the government is seeking a deal. Far from it: it is trashing the only deal that is currently available and making no steps to identify an alternative one.
There is no mandate for no deal. And since there is no mandate for no deal, a new mandate is required if the government is to lead the country down that path.
How come the issue about "mandate" only occurs when its an issue that worries you?0 -
That is the realisation of the Brexiteer dream, lower UK economic growth whilst immigration is at record levels.surbiton19 said:0 -
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc0 -
Doesnt work because its missing the call back to a lost / stolen golden age that gives power to slogans like 'Take BACK control' and 'Make America Great AGAIN'. 'Take Control' and 'Make America Great' wouldn't have hooked the same mindset.rottenborough said:0 -
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A customs union?ralphmalph said:
If the WA gets approved, what are we implementing up to 31st Dec 2020?Icarus said:No deal means no implementation period. No implementation period means that there will be a hard border in Ireland. The UK and Irish governments have signed a binding treaty that there wont be a hard border.
Now what?0 -
I don't think either of them ever put the country first, both did it for their own naked ambitions.Peter_the_Punter said:
Good but worrying examples, Pulpstar. Neither May nor Clegg reaped much reward for putting the Country first.Pulpstar said:
I think May at the end genuinely was putting country before party. The 30 or so Labour backbenchers who (Who knows ?) support the deal should probably have compromised at that point (MV3). Clegg certainly put country above party when it came to the 2010-15 ministry. Johnson won't.justin124 said:
Labour must be following the splendid example given by Cameron and the Tory party. He called the Referendum for reasons of party advantage - no national interest there. This entire mess is down to him. Then Theresa May called the 2017 election for reasons of political gain - even though things did not go to plan.Pulpstar said:
Always party before country for Labour. Always.Currystardog said:
Yet politicians (mainly Labour) voted against the deal, how is that respecting the referendum result?0 -
Boris Johnson lost control within the first few hours of becoming PM, when he said "the EU" could change the deal! Talk about clueless meeting hopless!rawzer said:
Doesnt work because its missing the call back to a lost / stolen golden age that gives power to slogans like 'Take BACK control' and 'Make America Great AGAIN'. 'Take Control' and 'Make America Great' wouldn't have hooked the same mindset.rottenborough said: 0 -
I see it's all going very well.Scott_P said:0 -
Well, he's out of the country. The snag is, it's only temporary.Gallowgate said:
I see it's all going very well.Scott_P said:1 -
Also may look very odd, when there is mass civil disorder over food rationing, med supply issues etc etc.rawzer said:
Doesnt work because its missing the call back to a lost / stolen golden age that gives power to slogans like 'Take BACK control' and 'Make America Great AGAIN'. 'Take Control' and 'Make America Great' wouldn't have hooked the same mindset.rottenborough said:0 -
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc0 -
Malcolm, since when did a conversation on economics involve anyone who had a clue what they were talking about?malcolmg said:
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc0 -
If anything the Euro slowed the DM's trajectory.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
When people looked at how to sanely separate the Euro a few years back the only approach that worked is for Germany to leave allow their currency to appreciate the 20% or so it needs to move for the rest of the Euro zone to cope...0 -
Oh shut up - so I misspelled Groat - Nice to see you take on the point again.malcolmg said:
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc0 -
On topic, that's a manifesto speech from Corbyn. Is he expecting an election, in which case he's expecting VONC but no VOC for anyone, or does he want CCHQ to think he's expecting an election?0
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If I were you I'd be worried about how my Footsie tracker looks in Scottish Groat Pounds.malcolmg said:
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc
But you don't seem to care.
Independence at any cost is the motto.0 -
The point being that the parallel is inexact. Doesn't matter which way it would have influenced it (although I agree it would almost certainly have been stronger than the EZ as a whole).eek said:
If anything the Euro slowed the DM's trajectory.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
When people looked at how to sanely separate the Euro a few years back the only approach that worked is for Germany to leave allow their currency to appreciate the 20% or so it needs to move for the rest of the Euro zone to cope...0 -
You do make me laugh Malcolmmalcolmg said:
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc0 -
Or does he want CCHQ to think that he wants them to think he's expecting an election?Drutt said:On topic, that's a manifesto speech from Corbyn. Is he expecting an election, in which case he's expecting VONC but no VOC for anyone, or does he want CCHQ to think he's expecting an election?
0 -
Surreal moment on Derbyshire radio:
'This bowler hasn't conceded a run in this spell, has he?'
'Yes he has, he was hit for two fours in his last over!'
'Oh yes, forgot about those.'
No wonder Gloucestershire's commentators are a joke round the circuit!0 -
We aren't and never will be in the Eurozone - the Danish Kroner has operated in very tight bands against whatever the Germans use for a hundred years but Danes won't swap it for EurosPulpstar said:
Blimey. Perhaps it is time to join the eurozone after all.kingbongo said:I remortgaged at 1% fixed for 30 years
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Out in the big wide world I just shrug and say you voted for it it’s not my problem and I’m not interested in discussing it any further.Peter_the_Punter said:
Those of us that have had the experience of bringing up children will know exactly how you feel. Yes, there is much to be said for letting them learn by experience, but not at the cost of letting them do themselves irretrievable harm.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
I don't think anyone is seriously considering a grad tax of 10%. I would have thought 1% was more the planned amount.kyf_100 said:
Why not? You're not avoiding your debts, you're choosing not to pay an additional tax.glw said:
Of course you can leg it to avoid your debts, but it's not really a great plan long term, and I don't think many people would leave to avoid paying a bit more tax.kyf_100 said:
If everyone in the UK who has a degree has to pay an additional tax, it's rather easy to avoid that tax by leaving the country.glw said:
I would introduce a graduate tax that deliberately collects more than the loans* do, I think a government could spin it as fairer and gain wide support for it.RobD said:Just call it a graduate tax and be done with it. I think you could also get away with a lower rate if it was always charged, rather than being a fixed amount to repay.
* Yes, I know it sort of is a tax anyway.
Most of the people I went to school / uni with are scattered all over the world now - from New York to Dubai to Shanghai. A grad tax of say 10% makes every foreign job look 10% more attractive.
Or we could just drag the country back to the 70s faster than you can say "brain drain".0 -
Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.0 -
Denmark is de facto in the Eurozone.kingbongo said:
We aren't and never will be in the Eurozone - the Danish Kroner has operated in very tight bands against whatever the Germans use for a hundred years but Danes won't swap it for EurosPulpstar said:
Blimey. Perhaps it is time to join the eurozone after all.kingbongo said:I remortgaged at 1% fixed for 30 years
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Vestager as next Commission President and Denmark to join the Euro would be a good accumulator.kingbongo said:
We aren't and never will be in the Eurozone - the Danish Kroner has operated in very tight bands against whatever the Germans use for a hundred years but Danes won't swap it for EurosPulpstar said:
Blimey. Perhaps it is time to join the eurozone after all.kingbongo said:I remortgaged at 1% fixed for 30 years
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I remember a radio football commentary years ago: "Whichever team is going to win this match has to score at least one goal." Such insight would find a place on PB.ydoethur said:Surreal moment on Derbyshire radio:
'This bowler hasn't conceded a run in this spell, has he?'
'Yes he has, he was hit for two fours in his last over!'
'Oh yes, forgot about those.'
No wonder Gloucestershire's commentators are a joke round the circuit!1 -
It is 9% at present, when over the treshold income as I recall.rcs1000 said:
I don't think anyone is seriously considering a grad tax of 10%. I would have thought 1% was more the planned amount.kyf_100 said:
Why not? You're not avoiding your debts, you're choosing not to pay an additional tax.glw said:
Of course you can leg it to avoid your debts, but it's not really a great plan long term, and I don't think many people would leave to avoid paying a bit more tax.kyf_100 said:
If everyone in the UK who has a degree has to pay an additional tax, it's rather easy to avoid that tax by leaving the country.glw said:
I would introduce a graduate tax that deliberately collects more than the loans* do, I think a government could spin it as fairer and gain wide support for it.RobD said:Just call it a graduate tax and be done with it. I think you could also get away with a lower rate if it was always charged, rather than being a fixed amount to repay.
* Yes, I know it sort of is a tax anyway.
Most of the people I went to school / uni with are scattered all over the world now - from New York to Dubai to Shanghai. A grad tax of say 10% makes every foreign job look 10% more attractive.
Or we could just drag the country back to the 70s faster than you can say "brain drain".0 -
Those innocent days before we all signed up to Sky Sports F1 eh?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Speaking of which-
Wolves 3.1
Man Utd 2.58
Draw 3.35
Is it just me or is the value with Man U???0 -
Early days.Gallowgate said:
I see it's all going very well.Scott_P said:0 -
Sounds like a school sports day.Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Ours was ruled unconstitutional for breaching the Eighth Amendment, but unfortunately the Supreme Court of the US has no jurisdiction in Staffordshire.0 -
I think Man U lost the last 2 visits to Molyneux.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Those innocent days before we all signed up to Sky Sports F1 eh?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Speaking of which-
Wolves 3.1
Man Utd 2.58
Draw 3.35
Is it just me or is the value with Man U???0 -
If your thesis about groat pounds is what I imagine it is, your point is back to front; Malc's dollar earning, gbp priced tracker will buy enough groats to buy the Outer Hebrides outright, with enough over for a turnip supper and a Uber home.JBriskinindyref2 said:
If I were you I'd be worried about how my Footsie tracker looks in Scottish Groat Pounds.malcolmg said:
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc
But you don't seem to care.
Independence at any cost is the motto.
0 -
Yes but it's 9% capped. Much more sensible would be 0.5% on basic rate tax and 1% on higher.Foxy said:
It is 9% at present, when over the treshold income as I recall.rcs1000 said:
I don't think anyone is seriously considering a grad tax of 10%. I would have thought 1% was more the planned amount.kyf_100 said:
Why not? You're not avoiding your debts, you're choosing not to pay an additional tax.glw said:
Of course you can leg it to avoid your debts, but it's not really a great plan long term, and I don't think many people would leave to avoid paying a bit more tax.kyf_100 said:
If everyone in the UK who has a degree has to pay an additional tax, it's rather easy to avoid that tax by leaving the country.glw said:
I would introduce a graduate tax that deliberately collects more than the loans* do, I think a government could spin it as fairer and gain wide support for it.RobD said:Just call it a graduate tax and be done with it. I think you could also get away with a lower rate if it was always charged, rather than being a fixed amount to repay.
* Yes, I know it sort of is a tax anyway.
Most of the people I went to school / uni with are scattered all over the world now - from New York to Dubai to Shanghai. A grad tax of say 10% makes every foreign job look 10% more attractive.
Or we could just drag the country back to the 70s faster than you can say "brain drain".0 -
I'd be happy to pay the 1% as it's a service I've used, but I'd also want to be exempt from paying tax to fund primary/secondary schools as I have no kids and went to a fee paying school, and health as I have private insurance.rcs1000 said:
I don't think anyone is seriously considering a grad tax of 10%. I would have thought 1% was more the planned amount.kyf_100 said:
Why not? You're not avoiding your debts, you're choosing not to pay an additional tax.glw said:
Of course you can leg it to avoid your debts, but it's not really a great plan long term, and I don't think many people would leave to avoid paying a bit more tax.kyf_100 said:
If everyone in the UK who has a degree has to pay an additional tax, it's rather easy to avoid that tax by leaving the country.glw said:
I would introduce a graduate tax that deliberately collects more than the loans* do, I think a government could spin it as fairer and gain wide support for it.RobD said:Just call it a graduate tax and be done with it. I think you could also get away with a lower rate if it was always charged, rather than being a fixed amount to repay.
* Yes, I know it sort of is a tax anyway.
Most of the people I went to school / uni with are scattered all over the world now - from New York to Dubai to Shanghai. A grad tax of say 10% makes every foreign job look 10% more attractive.
Or we could just drag the country back to the 70s faster than you can say "brain drain".
I jest, but once you accept the "user pays" premise then why should some categories be taxed in this way and not others? Why should funding for secondary schools taken from general taxation when funding for universities is taken only from those who have used them?0 -
Hmmmm, and they forgot to replace their decent striker as well. Maybe just another vanilla match for me then.Foxy said:
I think Man U lost the last 2 visits to Molyneux.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Those innocent days before we all signed up to Sky Sports F1 eh?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Speaking of which-
Wolves 3.1
Man Utd 2.58
Draw 3.35
Is it just me or is the value with Man U???0 -
Anyone who leaves the UK and fails to pay their student loan back should not be allowed back until they have paid what they owe, they knew the terms when they took the loan and should honor the debt. It should never have been introduced and then ramped up but those who think their clever by defaulting on their debt should be more respectful of those that either haven’t or have no choice.rcs1000 said:
I don't think anyone is seriously considering a grad tax of 10%. I would have thought 1% was more the planned amount.kyf_100 said:
Why not? You're not avoiding your debts, you're choosing not to pay an additional tax.glw said:
Of course you can leg it to avoid your debts, but it's not really a great plan long term, and I don't think many people would leave to avoid paying a bit more tax.kyf_100 said:
If everyone in the UK who has a degree has to pay an additional tax, it's rather easy to avoid that tax by leaving the country.glw said:
I would introduce a graduate tax that deliberately collects more than the loans* do, I think a government could spin it as fairer and gain wide support for it.RobD said:Just call it a graduate tax and be done with it. I think you could also get away with a lower rate if it was always charged, rather than being a fixed amount to repay.
* Yes, I know it sort of is a tax anyway.
Most of the people I went to school / uni with are scattered all over the world now - from New York to Dubai to Shanghai. A grad tax of say 10% makes every foreign job look 10% more attractive.
Or we could just drag the country back to the 70s faster than you can say "brain drain".0 -
Fortunately for the Anti-separatist side I don't think Nicola and co have the intelligence to understand my thesis or they would have tried it last time.Ishmael_Z said:
If your thesis about groat pounds is what I imagine it is, your point is back to front; Malc's dollar earning, gbp priced tracker will buy enough groats to buy the Outer Hebrides outright, with enough over for a turnip supper and a Uber home.JBriskinindyref2 said:
If I were you I'd be worried about how my Footsie tracker looks in Scottish Groat Pounds.malcolmg said:
You are so thick you cannot even spell groat so should refrain from any discussions on economics and leave it to people who have a clue what they are talking about.JBriskinindyref2 said:
You could use future currencies though -surbiton19 said:
Really. So if you took a loan of DM 1m in 1998, you do not have to repay it ?JBriskinindyref2 said:
Given the DM doesn't exist anymore I think it's rather invalid of you to quote figures using it.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
I might get 30 000 SGP (Scottish Grote Pounds) PIP per month in the future.
A bit like the-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CFA_franc
But you don't seem to care.
Independence at any cost is the motto.0 -
Understandable, but a bit of a cop out, no?nichomar said:
Out in the big wide world I just shrug and say you voted for it it’s not my problem and I’m not interested in discussing it any further.Peter_the_Punter said:
Those of us that have had the experience of bringing up children will know exactly how you feel. Yes, there is much to be said for letting them learn by experience, but not at the cost of letting them do themselves irretrievable harm.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
We have 3 strikers up front. Thanks to Foxy's lot, we have the best defender in the country. Midfield ? Ok, there is a problem.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Hmmmm, and they forgot to replace their decent striker as well. Maybe just another vanilla match for me then.Foxy said:
I think Man U lost the last 2 visits to Molyneux.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Those innocent days before we all signed up to Sky Sports F1 eh?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Speaking of which-
Wolves 3.1
Man Utd 2.58
Draw 3.35
Is it just me or is the value with Man U???
0 -
Yes but it’s very similar to the issue that was raised yesterday that it’s gone beyond the bounds of reasonable debate. I fish in a limited pool, everyone knows my views and if asked I would obviously offer my opinion but it’s really at the point that people are either so desperate to be rid of it (and oddly would accept revoke as well as no deal just to finish it) it doesn’t even enter the day to day conversation. They would be horrified and would laugh at me if I said no deal is ‘only the end of the beginning.’ So I’ll wait and see how it plays out!Peter_the_Punter said:
Understandable, but a bit of a cop out, no?nichomar said:
Out in the big wide world I just shrug and say you voted for it it’s not my problem and I’m not interested in discussing it any further.Peter_the_Punter said:
Those of us that have had the experience of bringing up children will know exactly how you feel. Yes, there is much to be said for letting them learn by experience, but not at the cost of letting them do themselves irretrievable harm.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn are like a pair of painful hemeriods. A complete pain in the arse without ointment! Both are complete dipsticks who demean politics! What have we come too...0
-
They did well against Chelsea.surbiton19 said:
We have 3 strikers up front. Thanks to Foxy's lot, we have the best defender in the country. Midfield ? Ok, there is a problem.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Hmmmm, and they forgot to replace their decent striker as well. Maybe just another vanilla match for me then.Foxy said:
I think Man U lost the last 2 visits to Molyneux.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Those innocent days before we all signed up to Sky Sports F1 eh?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Speaking of which-
Wolves 3.1
Man Utd 2.58
Draw 3.35
Is it just me or is the value with Man U???
Whatever I do at least I won't be Kebab Shop Guy0 -
Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?0 -
You know, the EUR did not come out of nowhere. One EUR = ECU. The ECU was created on 13 March 1979 when it replaced the European Unit Account. Both changes were at parity, i.e 1 EUA = 1 ECU = 1 EUR.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
As 1st January 1999 approached the divergence of interest rates in all prospective EUR currencies narrowed and the rate of each legacy currency was fixed forever at the close of play on the 31st December 1998.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Currency_Unit
0 -
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?0 -
Keywords - Legacy currency.surbiton19 said:
You know, the EUR did not come out of nowhere. One EUR = ECU. The ECU was created on 13 March 1979 when it replaced the European Unit Account. Both changes were at parity, i.e 1 EUA = 1 ECU = 1 EUR.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
As 1st January 1999 approached the divergence of interest rates in all prospective EUR currencies narrowed and the rate of each legacy currency was fixed forever at the close of play on the 31st December 1998.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Currency_Unit
DM doesn't exist anymore - you can quote pre 99 stuff in them but it makes no sense to quote current prices in them.
Scottish Groat Pounds on the other hand...0 -
I'm not sensing that keeping control is a prime characteristic of Britain Trump's 'key tribes', though no harm in asking I suppose.rottenborough said:0 -
Trouble with student loans is that it effectively means students are paying 40% tax even on the basic rate (20% IT + 11% NI + 9% SL) , and 51% (40% IT + 2% NI + 9% SL) on the higher rate. You earn anything above £25k you pay big time. Usually for the rest of your career.
With housing and transport costs as high as they are that makes it very difficult to get on.2 -
IIRC the Pound was a part of the ECU basket, so (indirectly) pounds became Euros.surbiton19 said:
You know, the EUR did not come out of nowhere. One EUR = ECU. The ECU was created on 13 March 1979 when it replaced the European Unit Account. Both changes were at parity, i.e 1 EUA = 1 ECU = 1 EUR.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
As 1st January 1999 approached the divergence of interest rates in all prospective EUR currencies narrowed and the rate of each legacy currency was fixed forever at the close of play on the 31st December 1998.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Currency_Unit0 -
Rubbish. There are very good treatments available these days for haemorrhoids.The_Taxman said:Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn are like a pair of painful hemeriods. A complete pain in the arse without ointment! Both are complete dipsticks who demean politics! What have we come too...
0 -
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?0 -
Holy shit - the draws at 8 - what's gone wrong there? Have my (so far losing tactics) gone mainstream or something?????JBriskinindyref2 said:
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?0 -
Although an ectomy would actually solve a lot of problemsPeter_the_Punter said:
Rubbish. There are very good treatments available these days for haemorrhoids.The_Taxman said:Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn are like a pair of painful hemeriods. A complete pain in the arse without ointment! Both are complete dipsticks who demean politics! What have we come too...
0 -
Perhaps other people have also checked the weather forecast!JBriskinindyref2 said:
Holy shit - the draws at 8 - what's gone wrong there? Have my (so far losing tactics) gone mainstream or something?????JBriskinindyref2 said:
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?0 -
Superb trolling.rcs1000 said:
IIRC the Pound was a part of the ECU basket, so (indirectly) pounds became Euros.surbiton19 said:
You know, the EUR did not come out of nowhere. One EUR = ECU. The ECU was created on 13 March 1979 when it replaced the European Unit Account. Both changes were at parity, i.e 1 EUA = 1 ECU = 1 EUR.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
As 1st January 1999 approached the divergence of interest rates in all prospective EUR currencies narrowed and the rate of each legacy currency was fixed forever at the close of play on the 31st December 1998.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Currency_Unit-1 -
0
-
Last time was my first lay - I thought it was always roughly 3/1.SandyRentool said:
Perhaps other people have also checked the weather forecast!JBriskinindyref2 said:
Holy shit - the draws at 8 - what's gone wrong there? Have my (so far losing tactics) gone mainstream or something?????JBriskinindyref2 said:
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?
I'm tempted by Australia at 2.860 -
Had the same thought. Went yesterday. Good day's cricket. Little between the two sides, so back the outsider? Won't be a draw. Bowling much better than the batting, and few Tests are drawn unless the weather intervenes.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Last time was my first lay - I always thought it was roughly 3/1.SandyRentool said:
Perhaps other people have also checked the weather forecast!JBriskinindyref2 said:
Holy shit - the draws at 8 - what's gone wrong there? Have my (so far losing tactics) gone mainstream or something?????JBriskinindyref2 said:
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?
I'm tempted by Australia at 2.860 -
Just thought - have you priced in the lack of Steve Smith? Cus I forgot to Kebab Shop Guy-esquePeter_the_Punter said:
Had the same thought. Went yesterday. Good day's cricket. Little between the two sides, so back the outsider? Won't be a draw. Bowling much better than the batting, and few Tests are drawn unless the weather intervenes.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Last time was my first lay - I always thought it was roughly 3/1.SandyRentool said:
Perhaps other people have also checked the weather forecast!JBriskinindyref2 said:
Holy shit - the draws at 8 - what's gone wrong there? Have my (so far losing tactics) gone mainstream or something?????JBriskinindyref2 said:
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?
I'm tempted by Australia at 2.860 -
I mostly disagree with David's take on Corbyn.
Firstly that Corbyn is attacking the Conservative Party that he would like it to be and not what it it is. Johnson's coterie and the Brexiteer prime movers are rampant disaster capitalists, who have adopted an anti austerity veneer to appeal to Brexit Party nativists. Corbyn's attack will work if people disbelieve the veneer is genuine. At the same time Johnson et al are not in a good place to attack Corbyn on wasting tax payers money.
I don't agree Corbyn is particularly divisive, unless attacking bankers and polluters counts as divisive.
Corbyn implies he is in favour of a sensible Brexit. Whether that's what people want, or is even possible, is maybe unclear.
1 -
-
I expect he will play and be ok, but even if that's wrong, the teams are still well matched.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Just thought - have you priced in the lack of Steve Smith? Cus I forgot to Kebab Shop Guy-esquePeter_the_Punter said:
Had the same thought. Went yesterday. Good day's cricket. Little between the two sides, so back the outsider? Won't be a draw. Bowling much better than the batting, and few Tests are drawn unless the weather intervenes.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Last time was my first lay - I always thought it was roughly 3/1.SandyRentool said:
Perhaps other people have also checked the weather forecast!JBriskinindyref2 said:
Holy shit - the draws at 8 - what's gone wrong there? Have my (so far losing tactics) gone mainstream or something?????JBriskinindyref2 said:
Thanks - I'll get that lay done then.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?
I'm tempted by Australia at 2.86
Toss could be important. We need one of our Yorkshire posters to confirm (Morris Dancer) but I think winning the toss and batting first is a big advantage at Headingley.0 -
I was at my wits end and then - last resort - I tried Buddhism.Peter_the_Punter said:Rubbish. There are very good treatments available these days for haemorrhoids.
It worked but I can't be 100% sure they weren't on their way out in any case.0 -
Politician admits they were wrong:
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/08/19/elizabeth-warren-apologizes-native-american-event-1468119
Somehow, I don’t think Trump’s ‘Pocahontas’ slur is going to have any resonance this time round.0 -
No, I think people are tiring of him.Nigelb said:Politician admits they were wrong:
https://www.politico.com/story/2019/08/19/elizabeth-warren-apologizes-native-american-event-1468119
Somehow, I don’t think Trump’s ‘Pocahontas’ slur is going to have any resonance this time round.0 -
-
Having watched Soyuncu for two games, I think we got £80 million for our 3rd best defender...surbiton19 said:
We have 3 strikers up front. Thanks to Foxy's lot, we have the best defender in the country. Midfield ? Ok, there is a problem.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Hmmmm, and they forgot to replace their decent striker as well. Maybe just another vanilla match for me then.Foxy said:
I think Man U lost the last 2 visits to Molyneux.JBriskinindyref2 said:
Those innocent days before we all signed up to Sky Sports F1 eh?Morris_Dancer said:Mr. Doethur, still sounds inferior to a few years ago when the radio coverage of live F1 was interrupted for synchronised diving.
The surreal, unwitting comedy of it was such that I wasn't even mad. It was hilarious.
Synchronised diving. On the radio.
Silence. Splash. Applause. Repeat.
Speaking of which-
Wolves 3.1
Man Utd 2.58
Draw 3.35
Is it just me or is the value with Man U???
Those haemorrhoids are not gone, merely waiting to be reincarnated...kinabalu said:
I was at my wits end and then - last resort - I tried Buddhism.Peter_the_Punter said:Rubbish. There are very good treatments available these days for haemorrhoids.
It worked but I can't be 100% sure they weren't on their way out in any case.0 -
At no point has Corbyn articulated what his Brexit would look like.FF43 said:Corbyn implies he is in favour of a sensible Brexit. Whether that's what people want, or is even possible, is maybe unclear.
We know from Starmer that there is nothing in the existing WA that he would seek to change.
So the only reason to vote against it was naked politicking - not principle, not having a clear idea as to his own alternative.
Corbyn has zero clue as to what his 'sensible' Brexit might look like or how he would achieve it.
But keep clinging to your false hopes if you must. The reality is that Corbyn has nothing to offer here
1 -
Far from the most important sporting event this week in Yorkshire. Of much more interest is the York Ebor Festival starting on Wednesday.SandyRentool said:
On the dry side of the Pennines. Set fair for all 5 days.JBriskinindyref2 said:Did anyone watch Countryfile last night for the 7 day forecast?
Am I laying the draw again?0 -
Boris and Cummings have everything planned..Scott_P said:
Also its worth noting that while Boris believed he was so important everyone will come to London, Boris and co are so important that as well as visiting Berlin and Paris, a visit (or more likely a few visits) to Dublin is now on the agenda0 -
Except these are adults. If they want to hurl themselves of the Brexit cliff then I shall watch disinterestedly...Peter_the_Punter said:
Those of us that have had the experience of bringing up children will know exactly how you feel. Yes, there is much to be said for letting them learn by experience, but not at the cost of letting them do themselves irretrievable harm.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
Interesting tweet thread from a |Commons clerk. Showing that Patel and Johnson are all mindless soundbites indifferent to whether their actions are legal or not. https://twitter.com/woodstockjag/status/1163464481923588096?s=200
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I’m not trying to defend insulin pricing in the US which is obsceneMattW said:FPT:
Yes ... but. There is also a reason by human insulin is still available, apart from cost. Reactions can be unpredictable, which is why porcine insulin is still available too.Charles said:
I’d also point out that OTC insulin is * a different product *MattW said:
Worth noting that all insulins are not equivalent, as we see in this cautionary tale:
https://twitter.com/nypost/status/1158807466383159296?s=19
He was prescribed insulin analogue - synthetic - and chose to take something else.
There’s a reason why most insulin is synthetic.
The original piece linked stated that he changed at the suggestion of a Doctor:
"He began rationing his pricey prescription, before a doctor recommended taking ReliOn, an over-the-counter brand sold for $25 a vial at Walmart."
Very much agree with the comments on diabetes costs in USA. Syringes seem very expensive. too.
Dr Fox is right on the costs.
The insulin cost in the US is a number of times that paid by the Local Doctor here, based on the BNF numbers for the same product. Very rough estimate based on the last time I looked it up would be 5x plus more expensive in USA. Even the cheaper one is getting on for 2-3 times. Syringes are not dissimilar - I could buy them of Amazon at about a fifth of the price quoted (15p vs 1 dollar), should I not use a prescription.
I am just about to start picking up the tab for daily part time professional care for a parent, and it is a similar type of number.
The amended paragraph you cite above sounds like “I asked a mate down the pub who went to medical school” not “I got Avner prescription from my FP”0 -
Casino_Royale said:
Superb trolling.rcs1000 said:
IIRC the Pound was a part of the ECU basket, so (indirectly) pounds became Euros.surbiton19 said:
You know, the EUR did not come out of nowhere. One EUydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
I thought he was thinking Brexit was a good thing? Just like you!Casino_Royale said:
Superb trolling.rcs1000 said:
IIRC the Pound was a part of the ECU basket, so (indirectly) pounds became Euros.surbiton19 said:
You know, the EUR did not come out of nowhere. One EUR = ECU. The ECU was created on 13 March 1979 when it replaced the European Unit Account. Both changes were at parity, i.e 1 EUA = 1 ECU = 1 EUR.ydoethur said:
Assuming that the DM trajectory would have mirrored the Euro.surbiton19 said:
GBP = EUR 1.08. EUR = DM 1.95ydoethur said:
Really? I thought the DM ceased to exist in 1999-2002.surbiton19 said:
For all the dominance of the German economy in the Eurozone that seems a bold assumption.
As 1st January 1999 approached the divergence of interest rates in all prospective EUR currencies narrowed and the rate of each legacy currency was fixed forever at the close of play on the 31st December 1998.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Currency_Unit
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Good. Enjoy your Brexit.JBriskinindyref2 said:
That 'Shrug' mentality shining right through.Beibheirli_C said:
I have joined the "Shrug" Cult. These days I just shrug and say "Go on then... do it and see what happens" because, quite frankly, a lot of people only learn the hard way.Peter_the_Punter said:
It is extraordinary how the cultishness cuts across traditional ties. I really cannot think of any historic parallel since the Civil War, when brother fought against brother across the parliamentary divide.Beibheirli_C said:Peter_the_Punter said:
And they have been unable to deliver. So now what do you do?Currystardog said:So 86% of people voted for parties that said they would respect the referendum and ensure Brexit happened!
The default position is No Deal, but that has the support of less than half of the public, and MPs. It is also widely believed to be an extremely damging course of action for the country as a whole.
You wish to proceed? [Please don't mutter 'Will Of The People' , like some religious incantation. This is real life, with real consequences.]
Brexit is a secular religion and religious zealots never depend on reason. They follow dogma and show their piety via unwavering belief.
No one has ever answered me in even the slightest detail how putting up barriers to our major export market makes the UK richer, safer and better.
All I get is horsesh*t about how we can shiver in electric brownouts / blackouts but at least we will have our blue passports.
One complete fool on here even told me that "Yes - it may be a disaster, but at least we chose do to it"0 -
Corbyn is the second most divisive mainstream politician of our times. The first being McDonnell.FF43 said:I mostly disagree with David's take on Corbyn.
Firstly that Corbyn is attacking the Conservative Party that he would like it to be and not what it it is. Johnson's coterie and the Brexiteer prime movers are rampant disaster capitalists, who have adopted an anti austerity veneer to appeal to Brexit Party nativists. Corbyn's attack will work if people disbelieve the veneer is genuine. At the same time Johnson et al are not in a good place to attack Corbyn on wasting tax payers money.
I don't agree Corbyn is particularly divisive, unless attacking bankers and polluters counts as divisive.
Corbyn implies he is in favour of a sensible Brexit. Whether that's what people want, or is even possible, is maybe unclear.
What sort of frothing loon makes it over the line for you to feel they're divisive?
Admittedly your not alone. When you can wake up to the Today programme attempting to give a serious interview to Caroline Lucas then you know that coffee won't be the complete solution.1
This discussion has been closed.