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They trashed a Hard Brexit hoping for a Juche Brexit.IanB2 said:
They'd done enough damage by then that MV3 would have sunk even with them. Their failing is strategic, not tactical. They only speak to themselves and never imagined their trashing a soft Brexit hoping for a hard Brexit would rebound on their entire project.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is one of life's mysteries how the ERG, who have some clever lawyers, could not see the inevitable and take MV3 when it was on offer.kle4 said:I just cannot wrap my head around how people who have pushed things to the wire, knowing full well parliament was going to fight against No deal, can be so frothingly angry at the near inevitable consequences of their own actions like European elections. Do they think this is what May wanted? She begged them not to see this happen.
History will show how inept they were and they were the principal reason for the coming brexit failure
Astonishing, just astonishing0 -
If No Deal it could even be a TIG landslide, ironically the minor Leave parties will do best if there is No Brexit at all and the minor Remain parties will do best if it is ultra hard BrexitFoxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.0 -
If TM revokes she is toast and a new leaver PM will reinvoke A50, on a fresh GE mandateSean_F said:
No offence, but I don't think you understand Conservative voters._Anazina_ said:
I think if MayDay did indeed revoke, stand up and say, “well we tried our best, but whatever was put on the table, the Brexiteers refused to eat, in the end we had no choice but to send the little wankers to bed without any supper”, she’d race to 42% in the polls pretty quickly and most of the country would be relieved to hear the end of it, and get on with their lives.tottenhamWC said:
Whatever the outcome on Brexit, I think most normal people would be happy not to hear about it for a long time, so the chance of this outcome has to be pretty close to zero.IanB2 said:
Nonsense. Only a tiny minority of people are angry. Hence the derisory support for Farage's PR stunts and the low vote for UKIP in the by-election.DavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
Some are indeed pissed off by the ERG: others regard them as heroes. But, the vast majority want Brexit.0 -
Only a complete fool blames the ERG before the morons that voted May in and worse, kept her on for 1000 days. The whole herd of MPs should be fired.0
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ERG routed again0
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Even with Cameron leading the Tories they still didn't do particularly well in London.tottenhamWC said:
In London, especially, this view is also typically the view of many historic Conservative voters (hence the Tories current electoral popularity there)blueblue said:
I'm not "right wing pro-EU", I'm "right wing pro not destroying the Government, the economy, and letting in Corbyn". I don't give a damn about the EU itself apart from that.Sean_F said:
Looking at the Com Res poll, 24% of 32% is 8%, so it's fair to conclude that the right wing pro-EU position is niche, as argued on the previous thread.Drutt said:
blueblue is Fiona Hill and i claim my £5GIN1138 said:
That's 70% of your own voters sunshine.blueblue said:
Any Leavers who still believe that they won anything worth a damn are frankly beyond reason. .GIN1138 said:
Remainers possibly - I'm sure the losers would love to become the winners.blueblue said:
Failure to deliver Brexit will hurt the Tories? I'm a Tory, and I can tell you that if TM Revoked tomorrow and promised that we would never ever _ever_ hear the ******* word Brexit again, we'd be at 40%+ with the relief of a grateful nation.GIN1138 said:
May and the Tories will primarily get the blame though as she's the one who said over 100 times we'd leave the EU on 29th March. She's the one that said No Deal Is Better Than A Bad Deal (and that slogan has really struck home with leavers in the same way Take Back Control did)HYUFD said:Corbyn may also have a problem with Deal plus Customs Union, not just May
https://twitter.com/Andrew_ComRes/status/1115347591905120256?s=20
May is the one that made the Tories the Brexit Party in the 2017 election and made a point of saying we'd be out of SM and CU.
And that's before we get on to all the abuse the Tories and their media allies have been directing at Corbyn and are now trying to get him to save their bacon.
Just as the expenses scandal affected both parties but hit Labour disproportionately as the party of government so failure to deliver Brexit will obviously hit the Tories disproportionately...
Leavers would be less impressed at being winners becoming losers...
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Cash wrecking amendment fails 85 v 3920
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R
She would attract plenty of non-Tories. That’s my point.Sean_F said:
No offence, but I don't think you understand Conservative voters._Anazina_ said:
I think if MayDay did indeed revoke, stand up and say, “well we tried our best, but whatever was put on the table, the Brexiteers refused to eat, in the end we had no choice but to send the little wankers to bed without any supper”, she’d race to 42% in the polls pretty quickly and most of the country would be relieved to hear the end of it, and get on with their lives.tottenhamWC said:
Whatever the outcome on Brexit, I think most normal people would be happy not to hear about it for a long time, so the chance of this outcome has to be pretty close to zero.IanB2 said:
Nonsense. Only a tiny minority of people are angry. Hence the derisory support for Farage's PR stunts and the low vote for UKIP in the by-election.DavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
Some are indeed pissed off by the ERG: others regard them as heroes. But, the vast majority want Brexit.0 -
TM will not revokekjohnw said:
If TM revokes she is toast and a new leaver PM will reinvoke A50, on a fresh GE mandateSean_F said:
No offence, but I don't think you understand Conservative voters._Anazina_ said:
I think if MayDay did indeed revoke, stand up and say, “well we tried our best, but whatever was put on the table, the Brexiteers refused to eat, in the end we had no choice but to send the little wankers to bed without any supper”, she’d race to 42% in the polls pretty quickly and most of the country would be relieved to hear the end of it, and get on with their lives.tottenhamWC said:
Whatever the outcome on Brexit, I think most normal people would be happy not to hear about it for a long time, so the chance of this outcome has to be pretty close to zero.IanB2 said:
Nonsense. Only a tiny minority of people are angry. Hence the derisory support for Farage's PR stunts and the low vote for UKIP in the by-election.DavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
Some are indeed pissed off by the ERG: others regard them as heroes. But, the vast majority want Brexit.0 -
Given Leave is still at least 45% in the polls, ie identical to what Yes got in 2014, I would not be so confident if Brexit ultimately is reversed and we end up RemainingIanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.0 -
Lords amendment 5 to division. Amendment allows May 22 extension.0
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The idea that May would revoke is for the fairies.
Even if she were to find herself in a position that revocation was the only out she would resign before she would do that.
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True enough, and it's frustrating as they eventually came around to a course they clearly accept was the best option available, however mad they were about it, but equally that means they could have figured that out sooner and no postured so much. At least the holdouts genuinely believe what they are saying.Sean_F said:
Most of those who said that Remain was better than the WA were posturing.kle4 said:
I can understand it from any who believe the WA is worse even than remaining. Clearly, in the end, many in the ERG such as Rees-Mogg did not believe that. But I can understand those that do holding out.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is one of life's mysteries how the ERG, who have some clever lawyers, could not see the inevitable and take MV3 when it was on offer.kle4 said:I just cannot wrap my head around how people who have pushed things to the wire, knowing full well parliament was going to fight against No deal, can be so frothingly angry at the near inevitable consequences of their own actions like European elections. Do they think this is what May wanted? She begged them not to see this happen.
But to get so furious that we are going to very likely have European elections? Sorry, just not getting it. They knew damn well how much no deal would be resisted, and so they were bound to happen if they said no. Heck, some accepted that remain might happen, in which case the elections were definitely coming.
You see, it is totally not their fault that by voting with the opposition so many times that the UK will be participating in the EU elections. Nor is it their fault that on the off chance the government can agree a deal with the opposition to avoid those EU elections, that they will vote that down too.Scott_P said:I see the perpetually angry headbangers are driving themselves apoplectic tonight because they were too stupid to vote for leaving the EU when they had the chance...
It's poetic, in its own way.
ERG logic.0 -
Nah, the Zeitgeist has changed. Both UKIP and the Brexit Party are collapsed soufflés.HYUFD said:
If No Deal it could even be a TIG landslide, ironically the minor Leave parties will do best if there is No Brexit at all and the minor Remain parties will do best if it is ultra hard BrexitFoxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.0 -
She would not do it on her own, she would let the Commons do it for her then blame them when she does itCaptainBuzzkill said:The idea that May would revoke is for the fairies.
Even if she were to find herself in a position that revocation was the only out she would resign before she would do that.0 -
If that happens we’ll have a pro Brexit govt soonHYUFD said:
Given Leave is still at least 45% in the polls, ie identical to what Yes got in 2014, I would not be so confident if Brexit ultimately is reversed and we end up RemainingIanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.0 -
It's human nature not to want to admit being wrong. Doesn't mean you are going to walk from Sunderland to London to complain about it. Or even bother to walk to the polling station to write BREXIT on your ballot paper.HYUFD said:
Given Leave is still at least 45% in the polls, ie identical to what Yes got in 2014, I would not be so confident if Brexit ultimately is reversed and we end up RemainingIanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.0 -
Ultimately May is toast akjohnw said:
If TM revokes she is toast and a new leaver PM will reinvoke A50, on a fresh GE mandateSean_F said:
No offence, but I don't think you understand Conservative voters._Anazina_ said:
I think if MayDay did indeed revoke, stand up and say, “well we tried our best, but whatever was put on the table, the Brexiteers refused to eat, in the end we had no choice but to send the little wankers to bed without any supper”, she’d race to 42% in the polls pretty quickly and most of the country would be relieved to hear the end of it, and get on with their lives.tottenhamWC said:
Whatever the outcome on Brexit, I think most normal people would be happy not to hear about it for a long time, so the chance of this outcome has to be pretty close to zero.IanB2 said:
Nonsense. Only a tiny minority of people are angry. Hence the derisory support for Farage's PR stunts and the low vote for UKIP in the by-election.DavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
Some are indeed pissed off by the ERG: others regard them as heroes. But, the vast majority want Brexit.
This from the guy who was pearl clutching about the use of the word loons the other day. Lol.TGOHF said:Looks like the ERG were correct to try and vote out May. Was just the wet remainy loons that wanted her to stay.
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Don't these 80-odd Tory nutters have nothing better to do than waste time on these pointless divisions?0
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She's toast anyway.kjohnw said:
If TM revokes she is toast and a new leaver PM will reinvoke A50, on a fresh GE mandateSean_F said:
No offence, but I don't think you understand Conservative voters._Anazina_ said:
I think if MayDay did indeed revoke, stand up and say, “well we tried our best, but whatever was put on the table, the Brexiteers refused to eat, in the end we had no choice but to send the little wankers to bed without any supper”, she’d race to 42% in the polls pretty quickly and most of the country would be relieved to hear the end of it, and get on with their lives.tottenhamWC said:
Whatever the outcome on Brexit, I think most normal people would be happy not to hear about it for a long time, so the chance of this outcome has to be pretty close to zero.IanB2 said:
Nonsense. Only a tiny minority of people are angry. Hence the derisory support for Farage's PR stunts and the low vote for UKIP in the by-election.DavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
Some are indeed pissed off by the ERG: others regard them as heroes. But, the vast majority want Brexit.0 -
I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got0
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She wouldn’t though._Anazina_ said:R
She would attract plenty of non-Tories. That’s my point.Sean_F said:
No offence, but I don't think you understand Conservative voters._Anazina_ said:
I think if MayDay did indeed revoke, stand up and say, “well we tried our best, but whatever was put on the table, the Brexiteers refused to eat, in the end we had no choice but to send the little wankers to bed without any supper”, she’d race to 42% in the polls pretty quickly and most of the country would be relieved to hear the end of it, and get on with their lives.tottenhamWC said:
Whatever the outcome on Brexit, I think most normal people would be happy not to hear about it for a long time, so the chance of this outcome has to be pretty close to zero.IanB2 said:
Nonsense. Only a tiny minority of people are angry. Hence the derisory support for Farage's PR stunts and the low vote for UKIP in the by-election.DavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
Some are indeed pissed off by the ERG: others regard them as heroes. But, the vast majority want Brexit.0 -
So why didn't the ERG challenge May ?TGOHF said:Only a complete fool blames the ERG before the morons that voted May in and worse, kept her on for 1000 days. The whole herd of MPs should be fired.
Allowing May to negotiate a deal and then having a tantrum is complete idiocy if you oppose the sort of deal May was negotiating.0 -
Conservative support has been stuck at around one third in London since 1994, although it's more efficiently distributed than it was in the mid nineties, now that residual support in seats like Streatham, Lewisham E and W, Brent Central, Hornsey & Wood Green, Croydon North, Mitcham & Morden has disappeared.AndyJS said:
Even with Cameron leading the Tories they still didn't do particularly well in London.tottenhamWC said:
In London, especially, this view is also typically the view of many historic Conservative voters (hence the Tories current electoral popularity there)blueblue said:
I'm not "right wing pro-EU", I'm "right wing pro not destroying the Government, the economy, and letting in Corbyn". I don't give a damn about the EU itself apart from that.Sean_F said:
Looking at the Com Res poll, 24% of 32% is 8%, so it's fair to conclude that the right wing pro-EU position is niche, as argued on the previous thread.Drutt said:
blueblue is Fiona Hill and i claim my £5GIN1138 said:
That's 70% of your own voters sunshine.blueblue said:
Any Leavers who still believe that they won anything worth a damn are frankly beyond reason. .GIN1138 said:
Remainers possibly - I'm sure the losers would love to become the winners.blueblue said:
Failure to deliver Brexit will hurt the Tories? I'm a Tory, and I can tell you that if TM Revoked tomorrow and promised that we would never ever _ever_ hear the ******* word Brexit again, we'd be at 40%+ with the relief of a grateful nation.GIN1138 said:
May and the Tories will primarily get the blame though as she's the one who said over 100 times we'd leave the EU on 29th March. She's the one that said No Deal Is Better Than A Bad Deal (and that slogan has really struck home with leavers in the same way Take Back Control did)HYUFD said:Corbyn may also have a problem with Deal plus Customs Union, not just May
https://twitter.com/Andrew_ComRes/status/1115347591905120256?s=20
May is the one that made the Tories the Brexit Party in the 2017 election and made a point of saying we'd be out of SM and CU.
And that's before we get on to all the abuse the Tories and their media allies have been directing at Corbyn and are now trying to get him to save their bacon.
Just as the expenses scandal affected both parties but hit Labour disproportionately as the party of government so failure to deliver Brexit will obviously hit the Tories disproportionately...
Leavers would be less impressed at being winners becoming losers...
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Damn shame we don't have a like button._Anazina_ said:another_richard said:
Has he revealed why he didn't manage to work this out four months earlier ?nico67 said:Wow Daniel Kawczynski on LBC really turning on the ERG now . Blaming them if Brexit implodes .
Because he is a thick reactionary with the learning capacity of a comotose woodlouse?0 -
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Welcome, visitor from a parallel universe.kjohnw said:I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got
In reality things would have fallen apart much earlier.0 -
Because we held all the cards?kjohnw said:I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got
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Do the ERG have a sweepstake running?
Member who says the most outrageously stupid thing on live telly wins a hamper?0 -
That's a shame, I was thinking of supporting them.isam said:0 -
You think Boris is capable of detailed negotiations ?kjohnw said:I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got
And how would it be far better ?0 -
another_richard said:
So why didn't the ERG challenge May ?TGOHF said:Only a complete fool blames the ERG before the morons that voted May in and worse, kept her on for 1000 days. The whole herd of MPs should be fired.
Allowing May to negotiate a deal and then having a tantrum is complete idiocy if you oppose the sort of deal May was negotiating.
They did in December- when the wets voted for her to stay with Soubry and Allen..another_richard said:
So why didn't the ERG challenge May ?TGOHF said:Only a complete fool blames the ERG before the morons that voted May in and worse, kept her on for 1000 days. The whole herd of MPs should be fired.
Allowing May to negotiate a deal and then having a tantrum is complete idiocy if you oppose the sort of deal May was negotiating.0 -
Maybe you need to go back further. It’s Michael Howard’s fault for setting up the 2005 leadership contest so that Cameron would win, stopping David Davis from becoming PM and implementing his double referendum plan.kjohnw said:I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got
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Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.0 -
The ERG should be sectioned . They’re clearly becoming unhinged and are a danger to the country .0
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Another comatose woodlouse?Scott_P said:0 -
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.
0 -
I don't think that either the Conservatives or the Brexit supporters that you are acquainted with are typical.Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.0 -
I think most of them have been unhinged for years... Brexit has just given them some limelight.nico67 said:The ERG should be sectioned . They’re clearly becoming unhinged and are a danger to the country .
0 -
So two years too late.TGOHF said:another_richard said:
So why didn't the ERG challenge May ?TGOHF said:Only a complete fool blames the ERG before the morons that voted May in and worse, kept her on for 1000 days. The whole herd of MPs should be fired.
Allowing May to negotiate a deal and then having a tantrum is complete idiocy if you oppose the sort of deal May was negotiating.
They did in December- when the wets voted for her to stay with Soubry and Allen..another_richard said:
So why didn't the ERG challenge May ?TGOHF said:Only a complete fool blames the ERG before the morons that voted May in and worse, kept her on for 1000 days. The whole herd of MPs should be fired.
Allowing May to negotiate a deal and then having a tantrum is complete idiocy if you oppose the sort of deal May was negotiating.
By then the negotiation had been done and the Deal agreed with the EU.
What were the ERG going to do if they had got rid of May in December ?0 -
Just imagine if May had been ousted last December .
We’d be heading for a crash out no deal . Thank heavens the ERG are clueless morons and went for the confidence vote too soon.0 -
I’d imagine what they aren’t interested in - is donating, campaigning or voting for the Conservatives or Labour.Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
0 -
The extreme members indeednico67 said:The ERG should be sectioned . They’re clearly becoming unhinged and are a danger to the country .
0 -
I thought you'd told us previously you didn't know any Conservatives or Leavers ?Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.0 -
It's a variant on the argument we used to get pre-2016, that no one cared about the EU. It transpired that they did. You are passionately pro EU so why assume that your opponents care any less deeply?IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
I think Boris would have won a majority, and that would have made things much easier in general. But I'm not convinced that anything better would have been negotiated.kjohnw said:I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got
0 -
"Theresa May is facing demands from her own MPs to stand down immediately after senior backbenchers told her she is now “the problem”.
A delegation of executives from the 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers met Mrs May in Downing Street on Monday and said the mood among party supporters had turned against her over the weekend.
Mrs May sat in stony silence and refused to discuss her future as the MPs made clear the “damage” she is causing the party, sources said.
The meeting will draw comparisons with the final days of Margaret Thatcher's reign when she was visited by "the men in grey suits" and prevailed upon to resign for the good of the party..."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/theresa-may-told-problem-backbenchers-urge-go-good-party/0 -
The pitiful Vote to Leave march suggests what fire and fight remains is isolated in an ever dwindling group.IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
As he doesn’t even seem capable of filling in the register of members’ interests, I am not as confident as you appear to be about that.kjohnw said:I blame Michael Gove for knifing Boris in the back after the referendum . Had he not done so brexit would have been wrapped up by now and it would have been a far better deal than she got
Or are you suggesting he’d have ballsed it up in double quick time, and we’d already have revoked ?
0 -
They got so used to being indulged by successive Tory leaders that they thought all they had to do was snap their fingers and a hard Brexit would be theirs. Having pushed the Tories to adopt what had previously been seen as impossible positions, namely a referendum on the EU and then an A50 notice without any prior preparation, they assumed the Brexit of their dreams would follow. But they have found that the EU is rather less willing to indulge their self-important posturing than David Cameron and Theresa May.IanB2 said:
They'd done enough damage by then that MV3 would have sunk even with them. Their failing is strategic, not tactical. They only speak to themselves and never imagined their trashing a soft Brexit hoping for a hard Brexit would rebound on their entire project.Big_G_NorthWales said:
It is one of life's mysteries how the ERG, who have some clever lawyers, could not see the inevitable and take MV3 when it was on offer.kle4 said:I just cannot wrap my head around how people who have pushed things to the wire, knowing full well parliament was going to fight against No deal, can be so frothingly angry at the near inevitable consequences of their own actions like European elections. Do they think this is what May wanted? She begged them not to see this happen.
History will show how inept they were and they were the principal reason for the coming brexit failure
Astonishing, just astonishing0 -
I don't think that is true. I don't think as many are enraged as some think, but if everyone else just wanted this to end it would end, but the most likely outcome is extending it for the rest of the year. Yes, driven by MPs, but that's because they do not fear dragging it out for as long as it needs to be, because various sides think they can win if they do that. And the public are more ok with that than they might admit I think.IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
She won't go whilst Javid and Hunt are still at Foreign Sec and Home (Obviously it is looking unlikely that Phil will resign over BrexitGIN1138 said:"Theresa May is facing demands from her own MPs to stand down immediately after senior backbenchers told her she is now “the problem”.
A delegation of executives from the 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers met Mrs May in Downing Street on Monday and said the mood among party supporters had turned against her over the weekend.
Mrs May sat in stony silence and refused to discuss her future as the MPs made clear the “damage” she is causing the party, sources said.
The meeting will draw comparisons with the final days of Margaret Thatcher's reign when she was visited by "the men in grey suits" and prevailed upon to resign for the good of the party..."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/theresa-may-told-problem-backbenchers-urge-go-good-party/ ) 0 -
Considering that May has already offered to resign I don't see what the threat is.GIN1138 said:"Theresa May is facing demands from her own MPs to stand down immediately after senior backbenchers told her she is now “the problem”.
A delegation of executives from the 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers met Mrs May in Downing Street on Monday and said the mood among party supporters had turned against her over the weekend.
Mrs May sat in stony silence and refused to discuss her future as the MPs made clear the “damage” she is causing the party, sources said.
The meeting will draw comparisons with the final days of Margaret Thatcher's reign when she was visited by "the men in grey suits" and prevailed upon to resign for the good of the party..."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/theresa-may-told-problem-backbenchers-urge-go-good-party/0 -
TM to backbenchers: "I wish to read the following considered statement in reply:"GIN1138 said:"Theresa May is facing demands from her own MPs to stand down immediately after senior backbenchers told her she is now “the problem”.
A delegation of executives from the 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers met Mrs May in Downing Street on Monday and said the mood among party supporters had turned against her over the weekend.
Mrs May sat in stony silence and refused to discuss her future as the MPs made clear the “damage” she is causing the party, sources said.
The meeting will draw comparisons with the final days of Margaret Thatcher's reign when she was visited by "the men in grey suits" and prevailed upon to resign for the good of the party..."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/theresa-may-told-problem-backbenchers-urge-go-good-party/
'Vote for my plan or go **** yourselves'.
"End of statement. Good day, gentlemen".
0 -
She already discussed her future with them. She's made clear she won't be there for any longer than is necessary to see Brexit occur. Given Tory backbenchers prevented Brexit, they are in no position to complain she is still there.GIN1138 said:"Theresa May is facing demands from her own MPs to stand down immediately after senior backbenchers told her she is now “the problem”.
A delegation of executives from the 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers met Mrs May in Downing Street on Monday and said the mood among party supporters had turned against her over the weekend.
Mrs May sat in stony silence and refused to discuss her future as the MPs made clear the “damage” she is causing the party, sources said.
The meeting will draw comparisons with the final days of Margaret Thatcher's reign when she was visited by "the men in grey suits" and prevailed upon to resign for the good of the party..."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/theresa-may-told-problem-backbenchers-urge-go-good-party/0 -
Has May got a downer on Javid and Hunt ?Pulpstar said:
She won't go whilst Javid and Hunt are still at Foreign Sec and Home (Obviously it is looking unlikely that Phil will resign over BrexitGIN1138 said:"Theresa May is facing demands from her own MPs to stand down immediately after senior backbenchers told her she is now “the problem”.
A delegation of executives from the 1922 Committee of Tory backbenchers met Mrs May in Downing Street on Monday and said the mood among party supporters had turned against her over the weekend.
Mrs May sat in stony silence and refused to discuss her future as the MPs made clear the “damage” she is causing the party, sources said.
The meeting will draw comparisons with the final days of Margaret Thatcher's reign when she was visited by "the men in grey suits" and prevailed upon to resign for the good of the party..."
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/04/08/theresa-may-told-problem-backbenchers-urge-go-good-party/ )0 -
The Economist:
The radicalisation of Remainers - Europhiles may shape British politics for years to come
https://amp.economist.com/britain/2019/04/06/the-radicalisation-of-remainers?__twitter_impression=true
0 -
All they had to do was vote for it...another_richard said:Considering that May has already offered to resign I don't see what the threat is.
0 -
Suggests that leavers have better things to do than virtue signal. Like work or spend time with their families._Anazina_ said:
The pitiful Vote to Leave march suggests what fire and fight remains is isolated in an ever dwindling group.IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.
Remained loons wearing EU flags and travelling to London to ponce around posting on Facebook that they are supporting a protectionist cartel are the pitiful ones. Get a life you sad sacks.-1 -
Isn't calling something the "real" mainstream a bit like when you stick "Democratic" in your country's name, i.e. anything but?Scott_P said:0 -
More like an ox bow lake.Scott_P said:0 -
The value of the Lords has been highlighted today .
The Cooper Letwin Bill although laudable in its aspirations was flawed . The Lords have done as much as they can to rectify that with their amendments .0 -
"Delay in the No Lobby"... Are the ERG staging a naked protest?0
-
And with UKIP GE 2015Sean_F said:
It's a variant on the argument we used to get pre-2016, that no one cared about the EU. It transpired that they did. You are passionately pro EU so why assume that your opponents care any less deeply?IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.
Echo chamber dwellers who think the votes of lawyers, opinion poll panels and MPs count treble.0 -
Amendment 5 carried 390 v 810
-
Anecdotally a number of friends who were previously in the "let's get on with it" group are now paid up members of the "let's drop the whole idea" party._Anazina_ said:
The pitiful Vote to Leave march suggests what fire and fight remains is isolated in an ever dwindling group.IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
Except with the real ghostbusters.solarflare said:
Isn't calling something the "real" mainstream a bit like when you stick "Democratic" in your country's name, i.e. anything but?Scott_P said:
And in fairness they probably are maintstream among many Tory members.0 -
That argument falls down because why then was the march arranged in the first place? The whole point was to signal virtue.TGOHF said:
Suggests that leavers have better things to do than virtue signal. Like work or spend time with their families._Anazina_ said:
The pitiful Vote to Leave march suggests what fire and fight remains is isolated in an ever dwindling group.IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
They're mildly Eurosceptic and mildly socially conservative. I quite like the mildness, as opposed to the extremes you find in other parties.isam said:0 -
Point of Order from Cooper now the Bill is agreed.
Formality of Royal assent the only remaining hurdle.
Benn asks whether assent will be given tonight. Speaker hopes so, says steps are in train.
In which case motion under the Act will be taken tomorrow.0 -
Some of the callers aren't happy - "It should be simple. It was simple when we went over during the war."nico67 said:Wow Daniel Kawczynski on LBC really turning on the ERG now . Blaming them if Brexit implodes .
0 -
I suggest you source a variety of grapes that is easier on the palate.TGOHF said:
Suggests that leavers have better things to do than virtue signal. Like work or spend time with their families._Anazina_ said:
The pitiful Vote to Leave march suggests what fire and fight remains is isolated in an ever dwindling group.IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.
Remained loons wearing EU flags and travelling to London to ponce around posting on Facebook that they are supporting a protectionist cartel are the pitiful ones. Get a life you sad sacks.0 -
Yep I remember all those posts from Mike and his 'No one gives a Monkey's' comments. Turns out they did after all.Sean_F said:
It's a variant on the argument we used to get pre-2016, that no one cared about the EU. It transpired that they did. You are passionately pro EU so why assume that your opponents care any less deeply?IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
Well, it's certainly replete with pond life and scum.another_richard said:
More like an ox bow lake.Scott_P said:0 -
Oh dear ! Time for an emergency sterilization programme to stop these nutjobs from further polluting the UK gene pool.williamglenn said:
Some of the callers aren't happy - "It should be simple. It was simple when we went over during the war."nico67 said:Wow Daniel Kawczynski on LBC really turning on the ERG now . Blaming them if Brexit implodes .
0 -
UKIP won 16% in 2004. Nobody cares about the EUisam said:
And with UKIP GE 2015Sean_F said:
It's a variant on th?IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave votedy.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.
Echo chamber dwellers who think the votes of lawyers, opinion poll panels and MPs count treble.
They won 16% in 2009. They've peaked, nobody cares about the EU.
They won 28% in 2014. it was a protest vote about immigration. 66% of the votes went to parties that support EU membership.
Polling shifted heavily in favour of Remain in 2014/15. If there was a referendum, it would be a shoe in for Remain.
And throughout that time, eurosceptic organisations were shambolic, riven with infighting, and usually got one man and his dog to their demonstrations. But, somehow, they struck a chord with the public.0 -
..0
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It’s incredible that after all the polling disasters of this decade, people still buy into the media and political bubble noise that fuels, and is fuelled by, themRichard_Tyndall said:
Yep I remember all those posts from Mike and his 'No one gives a Monkey's' comments. Turns out they did after all.Sean_F said:
It's a variant on the argument we used to get pre-2016, that no one cared about the EU. It transpired that they did. You are passionately pro EU so why assume that your opponents care any less deeply?IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave voters whatever happens? The ones I know seem totally demoralised or have forgotten the whole business already.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.0 -
Aren’t you a Remainer? Why would you then vote for a pro Leave party? Odd, but up to you.AndyJS said:
They're mildly Eurosceptic and mildly socially conservative. I quite like the mildness, as opposed to the extremes you find in other parties.isam said:0 -
Speaker suggesting even if Royal Assent is given tomorrow it may still be possible to take a motion tomorrow. But expects someone will wake her Maj. up tonight to secure her autograph.0
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Lmao . Very funny !IanB2 said:
The age of most of them suggests you will be too late.nico67 said:
Oh dear ! Time for an emergency sterilization programme to stop these nutjobs from further polluting the UK gene pool.williamglenn said:
Some of the callers aren't happy - "It should be simple. It was simple when we went over during the war."nico67 said:Wow Daniel Kawczynski on LBC really turning on the ERG now . Blaming them if Brexit implodes .
0 -
Combined they are on 12% already ie already back to UKIP 2015 levels, if Brexit was revoked and the Tories did not elect a hard Brexiteer as leader by the next general election they would certainly be contendersFoxy said:
Nah, the Zeitgeist has changed. Both UKIP and the Brexit Party are collapsed soufflés.HYUFD said:
If No Deal it could even be a TIG landslide, ironically the minor Leave parties will do best if there is No Brexit at all and the minor Remain parties will do best if it is ultra hard BrexitFoxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:
If the Commons votes to revoke Art 50 on Thursday or Friday it is not impossible the Brexit Party could do an SNP 2015 at the next GE and Farage could become PM under FPTP. Remember about 2/3 of constituencies voted Leave in 2016DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.0 -
About the last piece of drama Brexit hasn't had is HM the Q keeling over before royal assent is given.....IanB2 said:Point of Order from Cooper now the Bill is agreed.
Formality of Royal assent the only remaining hurdle.
Benn asks whether assent will be given tonight. Speaker hopes so, says steps are in train.
In which case motion under the Act will be taken tomorrow.0 -
Tories at 4/1! I'm not throwing my money down that black pit.TGOHF said:0 -
https://twitter.com/nicholaswatt/status/1115374648361926656GIN1138 said:
Weirdo remainer MPs now disturbing Her Majesty's sleep!IanB2 said:Speaker suggesting even if Royal Assent is given tomorrow it may still be possible to take a motion tomorrow. But expects someone will wake her Maj. up tonight to secure her autograph.
0 -
Tgohf
Saucer of milk for table five!
I didn’t attend it.TGOHF said:
You wouldn’t catch me dead on a March what a waste of a day - hope you enjoyed the million loser remain day out - bet it looked awesome on insta._Anazina_ said:
I suggest you source a variety of grapes that is easier on the palate.0 -
Christ, it doesn't bear thinking about. Blessings to the health of Her Majesty.MarqueeMark said:
About the last piece of drama Brexit hasn't had is HM the Q keeling over before royal assent is given.....IanB2 said:Point of Order from Cooper now the Bill is agreed.
Formality of Royal assent the only remaining hurdle.
Benn asks whether assent will be given tonight. Speaker hopes so, says steps are in train.
In which case motion under the Act will be taken tomorrow.0 -
Yes, amazing... and it’s happening again, right here on this thread tonight.Sean_F said:
UKIP won 16% in 2004. Nobody cares about the EUisam said:
And with UKIP GE 2015Sean_F said:
It's a variant on th?IanB2 said:
+1Recidivist said:
Is there much fight left in the leave votedy.Sean_F said:
I expect that if Brexit goes ahead, then Remain voters will be very fired up to vote, and if it is cancelled, Leave voters will be similarly fired up.Foxy said:
If you recall, the SNP surge was after losing Sindyref.IanB2 said:
Nah. The SNP achieved what Boris hoped to - a sympathy surge for a heroic near miss.HYUFD said:
Agreed for the Euro`s certainly maybe beyondisam said:
Look how the SNP cleaned up when they lost the Indy Ref... not Brexiting is surely similar enough to draw conclusions from that?HYUFD said:
Yes and Farage could get a majority conceivably on just 35 to 40% of the voteDavidL said:
You could be right. I don’t think that remainers or our remainer dominated media are close to understanding how angry people are getting about this. Do what you were f******* told.HYUFD said:DavidL said:There was what was probably a voodoo poll on aol today which had the Brexit party on 52% with the Tories at something like 13% and Labour on 9%.
People are really pissed off.
For the Euro's I meant
Actually winning the referendum and then having it demonstrated to the world that your success has reduced the country's politics to the abject and pitiful humiliation we are now living through is another matter entirely.
There won't be a big sympathy surge when this fiasco is put out of its misery.
Remain parties may get a similar landslide in the next GE.
Only the enthusiasts are enraged. Everyone else just wants this to end.
Echo chamber dwellers who think the votes of lawyers, opinion poll panels and MPs count treble.
They won 16% in 2009. They've peaked, nobody cares about the EU.
They won 28% in 2014. it was a protest vote about immigration. 66% of the votes went to parties that support EU membership.
Polling shifted heavily in favour of Remain in 2014/15. If there was a referendum, it would be a shoe in for Remain.
And throughout that time, eurosceptic organisations were shambolic, riven with infighting, and usually got one man and his dog to their demonstrations. But, somehow, they struck a chord with the public.0 -
Any idea when we might hear when Change UK's application for party status goes through? Nominations will be needed in double quick time.0
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@ydoethur might enjoy this story in a perverse fashion:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-47853438
Ofsted's head of research has complained on Twitter of being turned down in his application for "settled status" in the UK after Brexit.
Professor Daniel Muijs, a senior figure in England's education watchdog, has held posts in Southampton, Manchester, Newcastle and Warwick Universities.
Originally from Belgium, he has worked in the UK for more than 20 years.0
This discussion has been closed.